Athens 2004 mens all around part 8

[Lemaite]

미국 정신병자들 많네

[diamondfrost3]

Paul Hamm won the gold medal fair in square and I felt bad for him being put in the middle of this contraversy. But all of that is ancient history now. I was sad when Paul left along with his brother but now I'm excited that he's coming back to make up for what he's lost. Man he's gonna be old but age is just a number right?

[BravesGurl1983]

Love Paul's head shake at 1:42 where he's like "no?!?" lol

[BonechipAK]

For anyone who still questions the true winner of this competition, please look at the top comment in part 5. That should clear any questions up.

[SuperNonhuman]

kim dae eun is first not paul hamm

[rgjt]

the main problem with olympic gymnastic judges (and I don't know if this goes for all olympic sports) but the judges have to be from countries that don't have strong gymnastic programs. Therefore, they come from smaller countries and may not have strong gymnastics backgrounds or be as well-versed in judging calls like judges from the USA, China, or Russia might.

[Quie8]

When a judging controversy like this causes a complete change in the code of points, it's my humble opinion that a second gold should have been rewarded. Like the figure skating judging controversy in salt lake '02. However, all of the judging controversy aside, it took away a possible golden moment for an athlete that may only come once in a life time. That moment every athlete dreams and strives for, that moment they spend their entire life training for. It's a shame but what's done is done.

[dannyradar]

@Quie8 i dont think so. i feel its the coaches duty to be aware of such things. just like in basketball. its the coaches job to watch whats going on and if he feels there was a wrong call, to tell the ref's and the refs will do a video replay or whatever. the coach should always be on the look out and taking note of all whats going on. the judging mistake was not just the judges mistake, it was also the coaches.

[Quie8]

@dannyradar You've got a good point, but in the end it was mostly the judges fault. Coaches should not be respoinsible for the incompetence of judges, they have their athletes to focus on. In sydney 2000 where the vault was set 5cm too low, many of the coaches didnt notice the change until it was too late. It's diff in gymnastics compared to basketball. Coaches have to focus on their athlete more so, gymnast have to be on point 100% b/c one little mistake can cost them, including their focus. :)

[jrabfalafel]

yay paul hamm!

[julitopp]

paul hamm you know you're not the winner

[guitarplayer85]

actually, he is.

[julitopp]

US money is all. and paul hamm knows he is not the winner.

[Underwood7476]

Korea losing brings warm feelings to my heart

[frostdiamond1]

I never get tired of watching this! :D I think I've watched it 5 times since I discovered it 1 1/2 ago! Haha! :D Paul Hamm is SUCH a great guy! I have a great respect for fighters (in some cases, they're more to be revered than winners), and that unending fight, that unwillingness to give up his dream, is what got him that gold medal! Bravo to him, and thanks to him and all the other competitors for a competition in '04 that was all chills and thrills! I remember the drama like it was yesterday!

[smooshiebear80]

Thanks for posting this! It's cool to see what happened from a perspective outside of the U.S. Nice to see an additional shot of Morgan and the rest of the family in the stands, too.

[VaveAma92]

That commentator sounds like she has soar throat. She needs some hot tea or something.

Whoo-hoo! Go Paul Ham!

[wc213]

Jesus Christ that commentator scared me when Hamm's score came up!

[ernest72]

What a fucken disgraced gymnastic judgement ever!

[shivastotravali]

Sorry, that was of course supposed to be a 9.837 for Hamm.

[ants2876]

I laughed at Paul's high bar score. So 3 straight Tkachev's is supposed to be spectacular gymnastics on mens high bar these days, woohoo. It is a crime the rules allow a routine like that to even have a 10 SV let alone get the top scores.

[WalkThePath87]

um, you can't really say "these days"...that was 5 years ago, the code has changed a lot

[shivastotravali]

I still don't understand why Yang Tae Young got a 9.475 for his HB routine. The commentator says it only had a start value of 9.8, but still. And why did Hamm get a 9.387? What was his start value? Was his routine that much more difficult with the one-handed rotations and the three releases? Any knowledgeable gymnasts out there?

[WalkThePath87]

well for Yang Tae Young, the step is obvioiusly .1, and the rest of the deduction was on his piroetting sequence, because on a lot of his skills he finished crooked or with a shoulder angle. Not to mention the bent arm giant out of the tkachev. .225 in deduction. Paul started from a 10 and was almost perfect. the only deduction I could really see was that he was short of handstand on the stalder. Paul had a high start value because he gets connection bonus by doing 3 tkachevs in a row

[jparkdzg]

yang tae young's starting value was a legit 10, but the scored it as a starting value of 9.9 and that is where all the controversy started.

[KingLloyd]

Look, Hamm did nothing wrong. As an athlete, you have to know what you need to do to win. Hamm did what he had to do. If the judges didn't mess up, who knows what would have happened. Maybe Hamm should have gotten an even higher score because he did a better routine. Its all up in thje air. Maybe they should have given out two golds or two silvers.

[markmansion]

Why did the Koreans look disappointed BEFORE they posted the score? It just seemed like they kind gave up after seeing Hamm's performance. I just find it weird because Hamm said he believed in his heart that he was the champ and then I see the Koreans acting like they thought he won even without the crappy judging.

[cherryinsung]

심판판정 아무리 개떡 같이 해도 뭐 결정돼면 다 끝나는거임 ㅋㅋㅋ ㅡㅡ 그냥 우리가 강대국 돼는길밖에 없음 ㅋㅋㅋㅋ 그러나저러나 여기에 미국 정신병자들 많네 밑에 일본놈이랑 ㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋ

[lflr4lnco]

I feel bad for Yang Tae-Young. If you think about it, his teammate Kim got 1 place higher than he was supposed to, just like Hamm.

However the real disappointment in this event was Yang Wei. If anyone deserved gold, it was him. And i cant believe they excluded Alexei Nemov's world class performance/intervention.

[CITR92]

no the person who deserved the gold got it you just can't accept that he's better

[MVPrelays]

the thing with nemov happened in the high bar event finals. i'm sure thats on yt someplace.

[markmansion]

I think they should all get gold because of all the judging controversies.

[tammy842]

He got his gold in '08.

[tammy842]

I meant Yang Wei. It would be exciting to see them compete against each other again.

[Mrs8Troy8Bloom]

go paul hamm!!!!!!!!!

[ksypc219]

i hate paul hamm.

[bluereedz]

Koreans were kind of sore losers, huh? They didn't look too happy, lol. And they didn't even know there were judging errors at the time.

[cherryinsung]

lol i'm sorry to say but they directly knew there was judging error LOL

[fishdude77]

@bluereedz i noticed that too, and i have to say it might be just me but a lot of international athletes dont seem to know about grace in defeat. for example when figure skater plushenko got silver in 2010 he was a SORE loser about it, and countless other times there have been athletes who refuse to accept defeat. i just think it takes away so much from the sport when an athlete does that. and if the situation were reversed do you think young wouldve given up a gold medal? i dont think so!

[dwhan8608]

I'm not speaking for Korea. Like I said in my previous posts, I don't even care who gets the gold. I just really didn't like lots of Americans saying "ZOMG! PAUL IS THE BEST!!!!" after seeing him falling like a douche at the vault. Obviously this is the thing of the past. I just wanted you people to understand that he messed it up but he was still lucky. Then some of you started to make things more technical...like this peachy guy...

[Takehashi09]

Why do you care so much if people are applauding Paul? Would you feel the same way if it was the other way around and would you admit the mistake like some of us have admitted already? I actually ask that to all who commented and feel Paul sucked.

I don't know if you've been watching the current Olympics but China's fallen a couple of times already but they've won gold. Why isn't it believable that you can come back to win the gold even with a fall like that?

[dwhan8608]

Because people aren't applauding Paul. You guys are justifying how a fall was fine and it wasn't controversial at all. Plus, I really didn't like your attitude of "Suck it up losers, because we won the gold."

I don't even watch Olympics. I started watching Soccer videos and somehow ended up here. I didn't even know who Paul was until I read the arguments going on about this guy's performance. I couldn't care less if China won the gold after falling.

[Takehashi09]

My attitude? I'm sorry if that's what you got from my comment but that isn't what I was trying to imply at all. I'm also disappointed that some of us need to make such comments. Losers? I never said that either. And as to justifying...like I said why is it not possible to come back from a fall like that? I'd hold this question even if people doubted Korea for making such a mistake.

[dwhan8608]

I would say the exact same thing to the Chinese if they were to justify their errors the way you guys did.

and of course I would admit Pual was freaking lucky even if I was an American...because I know how to make unbiased comments..unlike many of you people living downstairs.

[dwhan8608]

Well, I shouldn't have said that I'm different from people living downstairs...I was carried away because of frustration for how you're not understanding my point. This isn't even about winning the gold, don't you get it? Like I said below, the whole thing got technical when someone wanted to make things technical...

[Takehashi09]

I do understand you're point...it just bothered me with all those negative comments. I do agree with you that some of the comments backing up Paul did not need the "USA is best Koreans suck stop whining" attitude. Koreans didn't lose they got silver...I didn't know silver and bronze meant losing either. Apparently I still don't know much and I've lived in the US all my life. So no hard feelings?

[Takehashi09]

That was in the past and now Korea has another chance this August to prove to the world that they are the best. Same with all other countries. All we can hope for is no more errors, excellent performances, and good sportsmanship. Can't wait! ^^

[Takehashi09]

Ugh get over it please. Well I have to agree w/ peachy...unless you are a judge or participate in gymnastics, or know everything technical and how to score then I find dwhan's argument baseless. On the other hand I understand how awful it'd feel if Paul Hamm was in the position of Korea's gymnast. We'd probably feel the same way "we were robbed of gold". Basically there was an error and like someone else commented, Paul went out there and did his thing, period. Besides 08' olympics are coming up

[ROCK3RxCHiCK23]

this is awesome, btw. thanks! do you have the award ceremony part?

[ROCK3RxCHiCK23]

haha did that guy slap Paul's ass or something at 1:07? lol

[RobinHobbit]

That competition was SOOO close! I was so exicted for Paul!!! Way to go! I know it had to be hard for the Koreans, but they were amazing as well and taking silver AND bronze is nothing to sneeze at!

[amanduh327]

I think it's just arrogant to say anything malacious about Hamm's role in any of this; he went out and competed. Error or not, he won. If there WAS and error, IF, then that is not his fault in any way

[ghoststar]

u guys dont think the judging error wouldve made a difference? well then why the hell did the committee now change the scoring rules as a direct result of the error made on yang tae-young's score???? idiots. only on US broadcasts of the olympics did they say that the judging error didnt make a difference and paul hamm woulda won anyway. it DID make a difference and yang tae-young WAS robbed.

[frostdiamond1]

I just love to watch this AA! It's soooo inspiring! Paul was the rightful '04 champion. What his coach said to him at 2:45 is the reason he won: "never give up!" The Olympics is not only a battle of physical prowess but also mental strength; Paul had that even more than the Koreans. They were more consistent in this particular competition, but honestly we all know Paul was the better gymnast in reality. He was reigning world champion and the overwhelming favorite.

[frostdiamond1]

As to the judging discrepancy, that isn't really an argument as ANOTHER judging discrepancy would have negated that one. Kim Dae Eun had too many touches on P-bars. Scenario: the judges go back, re-evaluated his start value, and declare him Olympic champion. However, then upon finding this unseen error, THEY WOULD ALSO HAVE TO DEDUCT HIM FOR IT!!!!!! I heard during Athens this mistake would have cost him a medal entirely and Paul would still have won.

[frostdiamond1]

Upon hearing this, there is no reason why Kim Dae Eun should have won. He had the meet of his life and justly EARNED a silver. I can understand his disappointment, but golds aren't awarded simply because athletes are disappointed.

[frostdiamond1]

As to those anti-American fanatics who claim we've bought every medal we've ever earned, all I can say is wake up and smell the sunshine. Paul was our FIRST EVER MEN'S AA CHAMPION AND WE WON NO MEDALS AT ALL FOR GYMNASTICS IN SYDNEY!!!!!!!!

[frostdiamond1]

I always find it funny how the U.S. is continually accused of "paying off" everyone whenever we win, and no one wonders why we were unsuccessful in doing that when we lose. (Personally, I've always been curious where we get all this cash for bribing. We may be a very wealthy country, but considering all the medals our extremely talented men and women have won over the years, I doubt if even our bank book could fund all those wins.)

[dwhan8608]

Give the gold to Paul. I don't care who gets the gold anyway. Just know that the best thing you can say about this gold is to just shut up and take it. Paul completely fell at Vault and still got 9.137. Are you kidding me? It was an 8.9 AT BEST. I don't have to be anti-american to see through that...All you need is a proper brain.

[AlexCorralMexico]

ha ha ha you are TOTALLY RIGHT

[dwhan8608]

lol...he got 9.837 on the part where he couldn't even land right...the greatest country in the world USA...we love you all..

[spaceball1one]

What the hell? He stuck the landing perfectly.

[dwhan8608]

Oh really? Go search Paul Hamm Vault on youtube and see if it was a nice landing as well..

[No1ZmeskalFan]

Doesnt matter about his vault. His other scores were good enough....quit whining!

[dwhan8608]

lol..who's telling who not to whine? I'm telling you americans not to whine stupid. I just told you to shut up and take the gold. Paul doesn't deserve 9.137 on vault but 8.9 at most. If he gets 8.9 on vault, his total score becomes 57.586 and he doesn't even get a medal. So like I said, you have nothing to argue. Gold was literally a gift for him. Just shut up and take the gold.

[peachy3214]

Do you even KNOW anything about gymnastics....are you a gymnast? Where are you getting 8.9 from? he deserved the score that he got, there already was an investigation and an INTERNATIONAL commitee found it to have been scored properly and fairly, a landing that doesnt stick, DOES NOT kill a routine, get your facts straight.

[dwhan8608]

Um...so I guess you must know so much about gymnastics so that you're saying completely failing at landing in vault doesn't mean anything? I know landing isn't everything in vault but not even being able to stand when you're landing is like....falling off from the rings...or tumbling down doing basic moves on floor..or something like that...and I know that doesn't deserve more than 9 points..

[peachy3214]

Also do not make generalizations about the american people, you are not american, you dont live among us, so thus you can not make such false and untrue statements about an entire nation. If you paid attention to our media or anything any american says, were are aware of our current economic situation, our idiot president, and the war that we ARE NOT WINNGING and didnt want to partake in The american people HATE the Iraq war Until your country is perfect which i assure canada is not, SHUT UP!

[dwhan8608]

Do note that I was replying to one of you Americans when I said such thing so don't think I was generalizing all of you. Apparently, the guy was generalizing yourselves already by claiming you're winning wars and shit, so why shouldn't I?

[peachy3214]

Yes the judges made a mistake ACTUALLY in his parallel bars routine (go to video) it shows that the judges erred by assigning a 9.9 start value. But it showed something else, too. In the course of his routine, Yang had four holds on the bar, when the rules allow for a maximum of three. The deduction for that mistake? Two-tenths of a point. He was never in contention for gold.You wanna talk about making it right, ok..give him back his tenth of a point, then take away two for his amature mistake.

[dwhan8608]

So what....you're saying this Yang guy loses one tenth overall of his points...which makes it 57.674...I was saying Paul deserves 8.9 at most in vault so that's already losing more than two tenth of his points anyway....and that makes Paul's overall points below 57.674...so what the hell are you trying to tell me here? Yang deserves the gold?

[betotupiniquim]

Now that everybody knows that Kim Dae Eun was robbed, they should transfer the gold medal to him!!! Why don't they do it???

[arcticmunkis]

the judges should have owned up to the mistakes they've made. if they "miscalculate" and deducted a tenth more, why does that consequence get transferred to the gymnasts? 1,2 for korea should have been the result for their consistent performance.

[gymnast08ia]

i heard that they miscalculated yang tae young PH start value by one tenth less, but also that somewhere else in the routine he made a mistake that he wasn't deducted for, so in the end paul would have won anyway

[teaatnight]

After the Olympics, the Korean Olympic Committee awarded Yang a symbolic gold medal, expressing their support. They also gave him the same $20,000 prize awarded to gold medalists. (wikipedia)

[teaatnight]

... the International Gymnastics Federation (FIG) suspended the judges responsible for the error.

[chessmann]

Yes, the Korean had too many touches on his parallel bar routine, so it wouldn't have changed a thing.

[heatherheatherkimkim]

stupid judges~~ i knew something was wrong with the scores~~ korea won but they miscalculated the scores. The judges said use still won because they found out after a few months~

[cdncwby]

Korea was the better team

[iosonoemilia]

Thank for posting these. I remember watching them and being very scared...(even though I had caught a glimpse on the website that Paul did win.) It was fun, wasnt' it? Thanks again. X'D