@OoOosteven Justin, personally, is Side A. However, The Gay Christian Network is a place for people to work out all kinds of opinions. It's also a place for people who haven't worked out WHAT they think, yet.
Isn't faith a personal thing? Why should anyone - Christian or otherwise - judge a person's relationship with God? As long as you seek and follow what God puts on your heart, you can't go wrong. It's true that some people have done exactly that, and felt they had to turn from being gay. but there are also many who feel as though they are who they are.
I cannot thank you enough for putting this video up. I have been trying to decide my stance on gay's for a couple years now, and this video has clearly explained how it is not a sin. THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!!
I'm not a homosexual, but I absolutely believe that the modern interpretation of the word homosexual is in error. I'm an A. I think that people can be gay and christian and continue on in loving gay relationships.
I am looking forward to the day that MOST churches realize this. I support you guys. God bless you.
@lavendarfleur Thank You, that means alot to me, i've suffered heartbreak over this many times, cause the churches had me believe that god didn't love me.
I thoroughly enjoy your videos and I appreciate very much how you explain things in an objective and non condescending way. I was wondering if you could do a little section on something like Theology of the Body?
I have a quick question. Can I please get the Hebrew word that the King James based the word "abomination" off of, that you mentioned in 6:00 to 6:10? I need it.
Thank you so much for making this video. It just made me so much more confident in who i am. I really can't believe i started crying when you said "you are not an abomination and god loves you'. Thank you so much i really needed that boost.
I studied in a Catholic school and, as far as I know, the laws in the Leviticus were enforced so that the Jews could survive in the desserts under extreme conditions.
Bleeding animals to death to prevent diseases and preserve food, not to eat anything from sea but fish, because seafood is potentially toxic; not to keep extramarital relationships to prevent diseases, avoid relationships between two males (not between two women, however) to guarantee procreation...
@SpanishHunkyGuy I'm having problems to publish comments here. I'm really sorry.
My point yesterday was that the Leviticus can't be understood outside its context. Each text is a product of its time.
Not even with the Leviticus the Israelites survived. So, to a certain extent, we can make an effort to understand why they enforced those strict laws. I think it was a must due to their difficult situation at the time. But as some people pointed out, the Leviticus is obsolete today for Christians.
Jesus himself went against some of the laws in Leviticus, and the verse by Paul is poorly translated, not even using the greek term for homosexual but a made up on that starts with the greek word for male.
Christ and Paul went against Leviticus, which was originally nothing more than rules for priests. And the term Paul uses to "condemn" so called homosexuality is mistranslated, he doesn't use the term in greek for homosexuality, he uses the word arsenokoitai, arsen means man, most linguist agree the word (seemingly made up by Paul) means Male Rape. Rape! The things that has always been the forefront of condemnation in the bible, in Sodom it was the "rape" that was offensive and not at men.
@jjaszczesny Please inform me of this verse in Leviticus...I just finished reading it myself..and don't recall anything about eating the flesh of children....
Christ never said anything about homosexuality in the Gospels. Stating His advocacy of heterosexual marriage made Him an opponent of homosexuality might be assuming too much. Several states now recognize homosexual marriage. But does that neccessarily have to be a provision for God Himself to recognize it? There are churches performing informal marriages in states where gay marriage is not recognized. Will God not bless these unions for lake of STATE recognition?
youre right God loves everyone -Gay or straight. and yes, a lot of "aboninations" are no longer valid today. But is that to say the new testament isnt valid either? Jesus specifically talks about sex in marriage IN THE NEW TESTAMENT! how can people surpass the verses that are blantly obvious in the new testament that condemn sex outside the boundaries of marriage. Jesus goes so far as to say that if you look with someone with last in your eyes, youve already committed adultry in your heart.
Jesus does not talk about same sex marriage in the new testament. He was talking about DIVORCE and used an example (in this case the heterosexual marriage, the only one that existed at hat time) to show that he was against divorce.
@menaswen Ok, ya your right. But, lets just say two men that love each other and start living with each other, and decide to live their lives together, just like a marriage, how can that be wrong. Look, no sex out side that relationship, just two people in love, living life as a couple, how can God look at that and say, that is wrong. Everyone has a right to have a marriage like relationship, without having that little piece of paper, and it be right in the eyes of God.
I think you have the most complete answer. I agree with you. What you have said has reflected with my life. I understand Side A and Side B very well. Please research COURAGE APOSTOLATE. It is the catholic organization about this topic.
Christ also overturned Mosaic Law regarding divorce, and challenged the harsh penalties for activity on the Sabbath Day. So if one part of Mosaic Law is changed, then the rest is brought into question.
"Owe nothing to anyone, except to love one another; for the one who loves another has fulfilled the law. The commandments, You shall not commit adultery; you shall not kill; you shall not steal; you shall not covet, and whatever other commandment there may be, are summed up in this saying, 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' Love does no evil to the neighbor; hence, love is the fulfillment of the law." -Romans 13: 8-10
the sum of the law is to love God with all your heart which is to love your neighbor as yourself.. here lies the law.. it's not a matter of question, we all know the law. If one burns with desire it is better to marry (gay or straight) and who ever judges that better take a long hard look in the mirror....there will come a day when there is no gay or straight.. i am not gay and i believe this with all my heart or as Jung would say - "I know". I am married and it's wonderful and holy.. :-)
It makes perfect sense that Jesus's presence among us made the Old Testament food regulations invalid... but the punishment for eating unclean foods (eagles...lol) was minor. The punishment for homosexual activity was death. Can we be equally dismissive of homosexual activity as we are of unclean foods?
Very good video. I do hope it helps those that are struggling.
I do feel I need to make a point. Being a gay christian in and by itself is harmless. But we often wish to buy bibles, music, etc that support our faith. This seems to be counter productive to LGBT rights. To buy music made by christian artists is like a Jew donating money to "Jews for Hitler". It is illogical. We are at the crossroads of LGBT rights in America. We should not be fueling the enemy.
gdwatcher - You seem to be assuming that all Christians are anti-LGBT. Not even close. There are tons of supportive Christians out there! Don't let the unloving folks define Christianity for the rest of us. God loves us as we are.
GCN I love you so much! I was mad driven with all these questions and then a few short videos just taken a huge burden off me. I can't tell you how many times I was driven to depression and even suicide. It's such a blessing to know that God loves me and that I don't have to go through all my life as a hypocrite pretending to be straight. Although, I'm still not dead on sure if God allows man on man sexual relationship (or does He even care with so many other things in the world)? Hum...
You are wrong when you say that gay sex is condemned in the Old Testament. Firstly there was no such conception of gay and straight at that time. It is wrong to assume the modern conception of gay and straight existed at that time. Second, Leviticus is absolutely not condemning gay sex. Leviticus 18:22 is speaking specifically about men lying together in pagan rituals for the purpose of idolatry. What is being condemned is the idolatry and not gay sex. To teach this is is not correct.
Read The Age of Reason by Thomas Paine. I have struggle to become a christian but it has never taken hold. Yet I am moral and a contributing member of society. Morals and law can be seen well before there was a bible. Goodluck to all religious and unreligious alike.
people who take a book that is a message of love and acceptance, and turn it around into a weapon of hate and intolerance, are the real abomination.
Saying gays can be christian as long as they don't live their lives as gay people, suppress who they love, don't talk about it, "don't practice the gay lifestyle"...doesn't count.
You can be gay and a christian, as long as you are celibate? What heterosexual would put up with an equivalent stricture. Straights, gotta stay a virgin! LOLOLOL
Iam a gay christian and practicing, the bible says that all sexuality is a( great sin)
most gay christians try to escape the truth in scripture but God has mercy and full of forgiveness to surpass our ungodly nature revealed in the garden of eden our sinful and Great sinful parents are adam and eve..all peoples must repent and believe the gospel to be fully saved and be holy in the sight of God and Man.
i think, act and felt trying to find pleasure in other things, now i found that pleasure and love and all i want to do now is worship him and love him with my heart, mind, soul and strength. He has show me his love and acceptance and has truely change EVERYTHING about me andcontinues too. I truely hope you can understand what im saying and god bless you all and you'll all be in my prayers
i am a christian who does believe that being gay is wrong, however i know GOD does not hates you. HE is madly in love and passionate with HIS creation (hence, YOU) and wants to show everyone HIS grace. I would never judge a gay person, cause being gay has nothing to do with your personality. If your in love and devoted to Christ you wouldn't want to sin and would try your best not to, every though everyone does sin. Before christ I hated the way
Most homosexual people I know are atheist because Christianity "claimed" that all were welcome and then established a set of extremely control freak-ish rules. I don't see anything wrong with it, but considering that for some reason the christian church hates it... I'll leave that to you.
Great to find this video and good to see a Gay mans perspective. I am not gay but I stopped being a Christian because of the anti Gay agenda that I experienced in the churches. Given me food for thought, thanks.
As a Christan and being fluent in Christianess (it's a joke, don't hate me it;s funny :D). He made a very good argument; but wither he is right or not is up to someone with more knowledge than I now posses
I am confused. At first, I thought it was wrong for me to be gay as a Christian. Then, after reading some online articles, I concluded it was okay. After further reading, however, I am now completely confused. I wish Jesus just blatantly told us "homosexual acts are sin, I forbid it" or "homosexual acts are not sin; go for it!". I'm sick of there being 2 sides to this issue. Why can't I just get a damn clear answer. Sigh.
You cannot always get a clear answer, Smettiuss, because there isn't always a clear answer. That's where faith comes in. Sometimes fatih enters in where there are things that are not seen or clearly seen and you simply have faith about them. Faith is the substance of things hoped for. The evidence of things not seen.
I know! I believe that God created gay people---those who have no desire for women.
I dont think its a sin but it is a sin to be promiscuous and sleep around. If youre in a living relationship where there is consensual sex then its fine.
However, i agree---if homosexuality was such an evil thing then God would have made it obvious that it was wrong all together!
David and Jonathan were in a gay relationship. 2 Samuel 1:26 says: "How I weep for you, my brother Jonathan! Oh, how much I loved you! And your love for me was deep, deeper than the love of women!"
Deeper than the love of women. So God doesn't condemn homosexuality and gay relationships.
I absolutely love your videos! I am surprised that you haven't been deemed a false prophet, even though you are reading things straight from the Holy Bible.
Great video...people need to understand that leviticus is a 3000 year old holiness code that doesn't apply to christian believers...jesus and paul both said it themselves,but some people think that gay sex isn't right.That is very ignorant thinking.sex is sex,and there are diffrent types of it.
Leviticus 18 and 20 are not legislating for ordinary human affairs. the authors of Leviticus are chiefly concerned with temple ritual. The practices forbidden in these chapters featured prominently in the idolatrous religions of the near east,, the people of Israel found extremely alluring: ritual bestiality (as practised in Egypt), child sacrifice, and the cultic use of menstrual blood in sorcery. The verses against sodomy (Leviticus 18:22; 20:13) forbid temple prostitution:
I suppose the command made sense in the context where ANY recreational sex was frowned upon. I mean gay sex isn't going to result in procreation, so it would be recreational . . .
. . . but we've since dropped our taboo on the issue. If you aren't conemning straight couples who are in monogomous relationships and having sex for any purpose other than procreation, you're being a hypocrite to accuse homosexuals thusly.
I just want to ask the question no one else will and be excused for it: is Justin completely hairless for a reason? Do we need to be praying for him to get better or is he just trying to shave seconds off his swim time?
I was taught in school that the main point of Christianity is just to be the best person that you can be. All the other rules were just there to guide people, back when they had other needs as a society (like maximum procreation) . This was the point Jesus tried to make over and over when he presented the one simple rule of life: "Do onto others, as you would have them do onto you".
I don't think being gay hurts anyone. Nor does it make you a bad person, so according to Jesus's logic its ok.
Also, I would like to point out that even IF gayness were a sin according to the parts of the bible that apply today, that doesn't mean God will hate you. I mean he loves murderers! So even if it was just totally wrong (which i don't think it has been since Jesus), God would still love you.
I saw a documentary about sex and then they mention homosexual sex. They discovered a Jesus Version and a Hebrew Version. The Hebrew Version mentions Homosexuals while the Jesus Version says no such thing. However, people don't wan't to believe that, which doesn't suprise me at all.
this is why gay marriage is important because as gay people we are sinning by having sex outside of marriage. once it becomes legal then we are legally having sex and moral upstanding snob christians will have to accept it whether they like it or not. its the only thing standing in our way of being truly happy gay christian couples. the whole abomination thing and reprobate mind from the new testament are basically to each his own interpretation. all in all... GOD IS LOVE not hate.
Ultimately as long as u accept Jesus as ur lord and savior and believe that he is the son of God and died for ur sins, UR SAVED AND UR GOING TO HEAVEN!
This brings up some questions, like "If I accept Jesus, can I sin all I want and still go to heaven?" This type of question doesnt make any sense because if u really accepted Jesus, then u wouldnt want to sin! Get my point?!
So Christians try to live like Christ and please God, but can never accomplish it. So all we can do is our best!
mister halette20001... :) i disagree on the part where u say "if u really accepted Jesus, then u wouldnt want to sin!" because i believe that what u want to do, and what u stop ur self from doing are 2 different things. if u fully accept jesus like u say, ur saying that u would not want to lie, cheat, steal, as in it is ur own conduct not to do so? or that u wont want to lie, cheat, steal, because u would have no urge to do so, no matter the reason? and no such temptations would cross ur mind?
You still have urges, but you would want to do your best to please God. You are still human...I think the closer you get to God, the more you pursue him, the more you will be the creature that He wants you to be...the more pleasing to Him you will be.
"This brings up some questions, like "If I accept Jesus, can I sin all I want and still go to heaven?""
This assumes that being gay, or having gay sex, is a sin in the first place which most gay people, and may theologians, complete disagree with. If sex is done within a loving relationship blessed by the Church (and you are a Christian!) is it a Sin?
And what about the non-Christians out there? Should we be limited by what Christians believe to be sin, when deciding civil law? I think not.
Simply accepting Jesus into your heart or as your Lord and Savior isn't going to save you. That's the modern American Gospel that says all you have to do is check a box and your saved. Being saved is not some choice or verbal contract. God chooses whom he saves for he has mercy on whom he will have mercy and whom he hardens he will. You must be born again to go to Heaven and this is God's choice, not your own. If you do make a true choice for Jesus, it's because God chose you first!
1. U CAN be gay AND Christian! Being Christian is believing that Jesus died 4 our sins; not about sinning! Christians sin. So the logic that if u sin ur not Christian is crazy!
2. The Old Test IS BINDING anywhere the New Test does not contradict it. So the "other things" the Old Test condemns that we accept today was changed in the New Test; that is why we condone them! Its the difference between Judaism and Christianity.
3. The Bible is clear that gay sex is a sin! So we shouldnt do it!
On 2 do you eat shellfish, when you have your period are you unclean. If the New Testament did not contradict these things you would be doing all these things.
'Next the bibles opinions on gay sex dosen't matter because science and biology proves that gay sex and being gay is natural and is in every living species. Hell there are all female species that reproduce parthenogenically and are all lesbian.
About your first point you have to be careful with that statement-- because the Bible also says that not everyone that says Lord will make it into heaven. It says someo will talk about all of the things they did in Jesus Name looking to get in but they will hear depart from me you workers of iniquity I knew you not.....but you are right about it being forbidden in the word. It is as clear as night and day but yet we have such a fierce debate going on in this country.
I found this video very informative. I happen to be straight and recently a good friend of mine has come out of the closet... They have really been struggling with the idea that they are going to hell. I am going to pass this on to them.. maybe it will help. Thank you.
hey Im pagan has you can see on my user name but I do agree with what you said Unfortatly I was put through so much hell throw christen churches in my life and researching and lesion to the bible that I just have found paganism works for me but what you are saying is a good think and is how a true christen should think good video 5 stars
thank you for this video it was great me & my partner were raised catholic and when we relised we where gay we didnt think we could have a relationship with god. Now that we are older we understand that we can have a relationship with god. keep up the great work :O)
I appreciate the fact that you want to show impartiality. However, putting much credence on Leviticus is a fool's errand. The Bible cannot be interpreted literally. It is based on a legacy of fear, arrogance, condescendence, and ignorance that is, (for the most part), to blame for many of the moral disasters that have fallen upon Humankind through the centuries. Homosexuality is part of the human condition, a physiological trait that some are born with. It is far from being an abomination.
My take on this is that a man shall not lie with man as with a woman, reveals that God was NOT speaking to men in general, if so, He would simply say A man shall not lie with a man. full stop! But by including as with a woman raises the question, how else can 2 men lie?
In Lev. 20:13 God made it even clearer by saying if a man lie with man as HE lies with a woman. Therefore, God is speaking to a particular man who lies with both sexes. Gay men don't lie with women unless by societal pressure!
As a confirmed, unapologetic, unrepentant & proud gay man (born gay), I've never had any desire at all to "lay with a woman", therefore Lev 18:22 obviously cannot apply to me.
Also, I cannot change the fact that I was born gay. I can, however, change whether I'm a Christian or not. If the homophobic fundies give me and others like me enough crap about how we happened to be created by God (and He doesn't make mistakes, right?), then we're liable to turn Pagan, Muslim, Buddhist, etc.
Fornication is disgusting. I just can't take those claims from g0ys, heroichomosex groups of men being bisexual and thus allowed to cheat on men and women alike. Either you marry a woman or a transgay. This is what I think.
@Kumtekmeon You know what...I've ALWAYS interpreted that scripture just the way you did. I thought that I was the only person in this world who actually thought that. Thanks for reaffirming this for me! God Bless!
It's an OBAMA nation! Haha. It sounded like they were sayin that. Kidding aside though.. Great to hear from your perspective of things. I am born again and I was always curious as to how Christianity rolls with homosexuality. Not so much now. Good job.
Beautiful, loving, funny, thoughtful, creative, biblically sound -- I could go on. Thanks so much for your wonderful ministry, Justin. I praise the Lord that He has chosen such a powerful vehicle for His infinite love and grace.
aideenj - I briefly mentioned that part; I just didn't quote it due to time. There's a lot more to say about these passages than you can cover in one video. :)
The trick with the Bible, though is that there are so many interpretation. I thought up 3 alternate possible meanings to Leviticus before this video was into it's third minute.
1) Do not tell lies with a man the same way you tell lies with a woman. Or vice versa.
2) Do not sleep with a man and woman at the same time.
3) Do not lie with mankind the exact same way you would lie with womankind. Impossible anyway, since men don't have vaginas.
Justin, you forgot the bit where it says: 'I am the LORD your God. You must not do as they do in Egypt, where you used to live, and you must not do as they do in the land of Canaan, where I am bringing you. Do not follow their practices.' - I think that's really key for showing the temple rituals behind this prohibition!
One point that is not addresses on this subject is that these passages are specifically speaking to "Heterosexual" men commiting idolotry. Gay people were considered eunuchs or a third gender.
it is a reference to being involved in 'sins of the flesh'.. hence the word 'mankind'... God does NOT condemn one for being homosexual.. through the eyes of God, there is no gender.. the bible is so misinterpreted and was written by MAN, not God... BE YOURSELF...
Finally a new vid! Thanks! You answered a lot of question a had. Its great to not only be part of the GCN community, but to watch this amazings vids. I want a copy of the DVD.
Amen! Everyone deserves the freedom of speech, but if you hold up "God Hates Fags" signs, then I best be seeing you boycott Red Lobster as well!!!! Don't you agree?
Are you side A or side B?
OoOosteven 5 months ago
@OoOosteven Justin, personally, is Side A. However, The Gay Christian Network is a place for people to work out all kinds of opinions. It's also a place for people who haven't worked out WHAT they think, yet.
GayChristianNetwork 3 months ago
This is quite an interesting channel. I am not gay, but it is fantastic that this channel exists. Jesus welcomed EVERYONE
aggiefitz 5 months ago
some ppL don't know what abomination means ~
iAMjamieDbaby 6 months ago
Isn't faith a personal thing? Why should anyone - Christian or otherwise - judge a person's relationship with God? As long as you seek and follow what God puts on your heart, you can't go wrong. It's true that some people have done exactly that, and felt they had to turn from being gay. but there are also many who feel as though they are who they are.
so who's right..
BeauG92 7 months ago
i knew u would say that Leviticus talks about other things that we ALL do in the OLD TESTIMENT...lol ur a GREAT debator. wow!
Candygirl820 7 months ago
I cannot thank you enough for putting this video up. I have been trying to decide my stance on gay's for a couple years now, and this video has clearly explained how it is not a sin. THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!!
bonnieb118 7 months ago in playlist Gay Christian Answers
I'm not a homosexual, but I absolutely believe that the modern interpretation of the word homosexual is in error. I'm an A. I think that people can be gay and christian and continue on in loving gay relationships.
I am looking forward to the day that MOST churches realize this. I support you guys. God bless you.
lavendarfleur 9 months ago
@lavendarfleur Thank You, that means alot to me, i've suffered heartbreak over this many times, cause the churches had me believe that god didn't love me.
dana123xena 6 months ago
I really want to be in a gay relation ship but idk if I could because idk if god would want me to it's. Rlly hard and idk what to do
MrSTEVEN890 9 months ago
@MrSTEVEN890 God Loves aLL of his chiLdren, and aLL his chiLdren sin. The onLy sin we can't come back from is to not accept Christ into your heart.
iAMjamieDbaby 6 months ago
@MrSTEVEN890 If your gay, god made you that way :)
vict0r45454545 4 months ago
I find it interesting that there isn't a verse in the Bible that prohibits a woman having intimate congress with another woman.
Jakegothicsnake 10 months ago
so are you a A or a B
gingernutpreacher 11 months ago
Thanks for your spiritual insight.
griffontalons 1 year ago
"Does God hate eagles? Wait, the eagle is the mascot of the United States of America. DOES GOD HATE AMERICA?!"
Well, Fred Phelps certainly thinks so!
dstebbin 1 year ago
The only thing that is an abomination is how Americans are treating homosexuals nowadays.
QBisbest 1 year ago
@QBisbest I agree
~lesbian Christian~
DaleSrRocked 1 year ago
@QBisbest amen! Yes this is so true!!
-Proud gay Christian-
wishiwashi7 6 months ago
OMG I LOVE TINY TOONS!
yoplaitdude1807 1 year ago
This was a very honest exploration of these particular passages.Thank you for this! Keep up the great work.
MChurchman 1 year ago
I thoroughly enjoy your videos and I appreciate very much how you explain things in an objective and non condescending way. I was wondering if you could do a little section on something like Theology of the Body?
guinny0pigg 1 year ago
I have a quick question. Can I please get the Hebrew word that the King James based the word "abomination" off of, that you mentioned in 6:00 to 6:10? I need it.
Solomonous 1 year ago
Thank you for this video.
MegaLWordFan 1 year ago
You, sir, are awesome. Ten million thumbs up for making this video. :)
gaelicwolf 1 year ago
thank you for helpingus to understand the bible!you are really a god's mesenger!
bethdominix 1 year ago
Thanks again for your logic, compassion and reason. If only the republican, conservative born-again bunch held your point of view.
coolspindrift 1 year ago
Thank you so much for making this video. It just made me so much more confident in who i am. I really can't believe i started crying when you said "you are not an abomination and god loves you'. Thank you so much i really needed that boost.
Gamory92 1 year ago
I studied in a Catholic school and, as far as I know, the laws in the Leviticus were enforced so that the Jews could survive in the desserts under extreme conditions.
Bleeding animals to death to prevent diseases and preserve food, not to eat anything from sea but fish, because seafood is potentially toxic; not to keep extramarital relationships to prevent diseases, avoid relationships between two males (not between two women, however) to guarantee procreation...
SpanishHunkyGuy 1 year ago
@SpanishHunkyGuy I'm having problems to publish comments here. I'm really sorry.
My point yesterday was that the Leviticus can't be understood outside its context. Each text is a product of its time.
Not even with the Leviticus the Israelites survived. So, to a certain extent, we can make an effort to understand why they enforced those strict laws. I think it was a must due to their difficult situation at the time. But as some people pointed out, the Leviticus is obsolete today for Christians.
SpanishHunkyGuy 1 year ago
but good video !
ljhanna777 1 year ago
Jesus himself went against some of the laws in Leviticus, and the verse by Paul is poorly translated, not even using the greek term for homosexual but a made up on that starts with the greek word for male.
You guys make me proud.
Vincentsdream 1 year ago
Christ and Paul went against Leviticus, which was originally nothing more than rules for priests. And the term Paul uses to "condemn" so called homosexuality is mistranslated, he doesn't use the term in greek for homosexuality, he uses the word arsenokoitai, arsen means man, most linguist agree the word (seemingly made up by Paul) means Male Rape. Rape! The things that has always been the forefront of condemnation in the bible, in Sodom it was the "rape" that was offensive and not at men.
Vincentsdream 1 year ago
Yeah, Leviticus said homosexuality is an abomination, but he also said to eat the flesh of your children.
jjaszczesny 1 year ago
@jjaszczesny Please inform me of this verse in Leviticus...I just finished reading it myself..and don't recall anything about eating the flesh of children....
surgicalbassist 1 year ago
Christ never said anything about homosexuality in the Gospels. Stating His advocacy of heterosexual marriage made Him an opponent of homosexuality might be assuming too much. Several states now recognize homosexual marriage. But does that neccessarily have to be a provision for God Himself to recognize it? There are churches performing informal marriages in states where gay marriage is not recognized. Will God not bless these unions for lake of STATE recognition?
clay56 1 year ago
Sorry, "lack" of STATE recognition."
clay56 1 year ago
youre right God loves everyone -Gay or straight. and yes, a lot of "aboninations" are no longer valid today. But is that to say the new testament isnt valid either? Jesus specifically talks about sex in marriage IN THE NEW TESTAMENT! how can people surpass the verses that are blantly obvious in the new testament that condemn sex outside the boundaries of marriage. Jesus goes so far as to say that if you look with someone with last in your eyes, youve already committed adultry in your heart.
menaswen 1 year ago
We agree.
-Michael O
GayChristianNetwork 1 year ago
@menaswen maybe if gay people were allowed to get married we wouldn't have sex out of relationships.
jphilipgardner7 1 year ago
@menaswen
Jesus does not talk about same sex marriage in the new testament. He was talking about DIVORCE and used an example (in this case the heterosexual marriage, the only one that existed at hat time) to show that he was against divorce.
deedeeizasingaa4lyfe 1 year ago
@menaswen I agree. So what would be wrong with 2 gay men who are in a relationship and not having sex?
cvgsusfreak08 1 year ago
@menaswen Ok, ya your right. But, lets just say two men that love each other and start living with each other, and decide to live their lives together, just like a marriage, how can that be wrong. Look, no sex out side that relationship, just two people in love, living life as a couple, how can God look at that and say, that is wrong. Everyone has a right to have a marriage like relationship, without having that little piece of paper, and it be right in the eyes of God.
sinnersavedbychrist 1 year ago
@menaswen What verses are you talking about?
smurfboywv 6 months ago
im not gay, but ur ossum!!!!
Stewie2Space 1 year ago
Amazing video and amazing message. Thank you for being a light in the world.
jhensley1212 1 year ago
you're very informative. i've been searching for topics on homosexuality, and this is a well formed argument. good job.
BaldButWigged 1 year ago
I think you have the most complete answer. I agree with you. What you have said has reflected with my life. I understand Side A and Side B very well. Please research COURAGE APOSTOLATE. It is the catholic organization about this topic.
jhemone 1 year ago
U are way awesome
Panda13ification 1 year ago
Hey, EL!
The first part of the verse you provided could almost be considered an endorsement for homosexuality.
Good Quote!
clay56 1 year ago
Christ also overturned Mosaic Law regarding divorce, and challenged the harsh penalties for activity on the Sabbath Day. So if one part of Mosaic Law is changed, then the rest is brought into question.
clay56 2 years ago
@clay56
the bible gives answer to that:
"Owe nothing to anyone, except to love one another; for the one who loves another has fulfilled the law. The commandments, You shall not commit adultery; you shall not kill; you shall not steal; you shall not covet, and whatever other commandment there may be, are summed up in this saying, 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' Love does no evil to the neighbor; hence, love is the fulfillment of the law." -Romans 13: 8-10
ElusiveLovely 1 year ago
the sum of the law is to love God with all your heart which is to love your neighbor as yourself.. here lies the law.. it's not a matter of question, we all know the law. If one burns with desire it is better to marry (gay or straight) and who ever judges that better take a long hard look in the mirror....there will come a day when there is no gay or straight.. i am not gay and i believe this with all my heart or as Jung would say - "I know". I am married and it's wonderful and holy.. :-)
crimthann86 1 year ago
It makes perfect sense that Jesus's presence among us made the Old Testament food regulations invalid... but the punishment for eating unclean foods (eagles...lol) was minor. The punishment for homosexual activity was death. Can we be equally dismissive of homosexual activity as we are of unclean foods?
I'm confused... and worried...
mofroyo 2 years ago
Very good video. I do hope it helps those that are struggling.
I do feel I need to make a point. Being a gay christian in and by itself is harmless. But we often wish to buy bibles, music, etc that support our faith. This seems to be counter productive to LGBT rights. To buy music made by christian artists is like a Jew donating money to "Jews for Hitler". It is illogical. We are at the crossroads of LGBT rights in America. We should not be fueling the enemy.
gdwatcher 2 years ago
gdwatcher - You seem to be assuming that all Christians are anti-LGBT. Not even close. There are tons of supportive Christians out there! Don't let the unloving folks define Christianity for the rest of us. God loves us as we are.
GayChristianNetwork 1 year ago
@gdwatcher I love christian rock music, and disagree with that statement.
smurfboywv 3 months ago
iam athist iam i respect you so much for not damn ing someone in eternal hell instead yuo help so thank you
121oli 2 years ago
i love this video
ASKWIlliAMShOW 2 years ago
GCN I love you so much! I was mad driven with all these questions and then a few short videos just taken a huge burden off me. I can't tell you how many times I was driven to depression and even suicide. It's such a blessing to know that God loves me and that I don't have to go through all my life as a hypocrite pretending to be straight. Although, I'm still not dead on sure if God allows man on man sexual relationship (or does He even care with so many other things in the world)? Hum...
MrSteveka 2 years ago
You are wrong when you say that gay sex is condemned in the Old Testament. Firstly there was no such conception of gay and straight at that time. It is wrong to assume the modern conception of gay and straight existed at that time. Second, Leviticus is absolutely not condemning gay sex. Leviticus 18:22 is speaking specifically about men lying together in pagan rituals for the purpose of idolatry. What is being condemned is the idolatry and not gay sex. To teach this is is not correct.
PMCR1966 2 years ago
Read The Age of Reason by Thomas Paine. I have struggle to become a christian but it has never taken hold. Yet I am moral and a contributing member of society. Morals and law can be seen well before there was a bible. Goodluck to all religious and unreligious alike.
abcforcongress 2 years ago
i like tis video and like gay christians!!
Ecoind123 2 years ago
God says yes
Smetch 2 years ago
people who take a book that is a message of love and acceptance, and turn it around into a weapon of hate and intolerance, are the real abomination.
Saying gays can be christian as long as they don't live their lives as gay people, suppress who they love, don't talk about it, "don't practice the gay lifestyle"...doesn't count.
You can be gay and a christian, as long as you are celibate? What heterosexual would put up with an equivalent stricture. Straights, gotta stay a virgin! LOLOLOL
GretchenDawntreader 2 years ago
Iam a gay christian and practicing, the bible says that all sexuality is a( great sin)
most gay christians try to escape the truth in scripture but God has mercy and full of forgiveness to surpass our ungodly nature revealed in the garden of eden our sinful and Great sinful parents are adam and eve..all peoples must repent and believe the gospel to be fully saved and be holy in the sight of God and Man.
WaddeDarinDarin 2 years ago
i think, act and felt trying to find pleasure in other things, now i found that pleasure and love and all i want to do now is worship him and love him with my heart, mind, soul and strength. He has show me his love and acceptance and has truely change EVERYTHING about me andcontinues too. I truely hope you can understand what im saying and god bless you all and you'll all be in my prayers
annanibeth 2 years ago
i am a christian who does believe that being gay is wrong, however i know GOD does not hates you. HE is madly in love and passionate with HIS creation (hence, YOU) and wants to show everyone HIS grace. I would never judge a gay person, cause being gay has nothing to do with your personality. If your in love and devoted to Christ you wouldn't want to sin and would try your best not to, every though everyone does sin. Before christ I hated the way
annanibeth 2 years ago
Most homosexual people I know are atheist because Christianity "claimed" that all were welcome and then established a set of extremely control freak-ish rules. I don't see anything wrong with it, but considering that for some reason the christian church hates it... I'll leave that to you.
Tsiehtalol 2 years ago
Great to find this video and good to see a Gay mans perspective. I am not gay but I stopped being a Christian because of the anti Gay agenda that I experienced in the churches. Given me food for thought, thanks.
Paul
hartnell 2 years ago
I'll make my own prophecy here;
This work, by the Gay Christian Network, is going to challenge a lot of people's opinions and is for the overall betterment of humanity.
osummuso 2 years ago
As a Christan and being fluent in Christianess (it's a joke, don't hate me it;s funny :D). He made a very good argument; but wither he is right or not is up to someone with more knowledge than I now posses
kethSanders 2 years ago
I am confused. At first, I thought it was wrong for me to be gay as a Christian. Then, after reading some online articles, I concluded it was okay. After further reading, however, I am now completely confused. I wish Jesus just blatantly told us "homosexual acts are sin, I forbid it" or "homosexual acts are not sin; go for it!". I'm sick of there being 2 sides to this issue. Why can't I just get a damn clear answer. Sigh.
smettiuss 2 years ago
you don't even know how much I am relating to you right now. I know exactly what that feels like
kethSanders 2 years ago
You cannot always get a clear answer, Smettiuss, because there isn't always a clear answer. That's where faith comes in. Sometimes fatih enters in where there are things that are not seen or clearly seen and you simply have faith about them. Faith is the substance of things hoped for. The evidence of things not seen.
leecappella 2 years ago
I know! I believe that God created gay people---those who have no desire for women.
I dont think its a sin but it is a sin to be promiscuous and sleep around. If youre in a living relationship where there is consensual sex then its fine.
However, i agree---if homosexuality was such an evil thing then God would have made it obvious that it was wrong all together!
JacobAK1 2 years ago
What about the gay people who have no desire for men? And by who I'm refering to, I mean lesbians.
Jakegothicsnake 2 years ago
David and Jonathan were in a gay relationship. 2 Samuel 1:26 says: "How I weep for you, my brother Jonathan! Oh, how much I loved you! And your love for me was deep, deeper than the love of women!"
Deeper than the love of women. So God doesn't condemn homosexuality and gay relationships.
hardcorescreamokid68 2 years ago
What is a Gay Christian, I last time I check If you believe in Jesus and obey him you are just a Christian.
SaintJohn86 2 years ago
I absolutely love your videos! I am surprised that you haven't been deemed a false prophet, even though you are reading things straight from the Holy Bible.
WardenKellen 2 years ago
Great video...people need to understand that leviticus is a 3000 year old holiness code that doesn't apply to christian believers...jesus and paul both said it themselves,but some people think that gay sex isn't right.That is very ignorant thinking.sex is sex,and there are diffrent types of it.
TheOneofakind17 2 years ago
Leviticus 18 and 20 are not legislating for ordinary human affairs. the authors of Leviticus are chiefly concerned with temple ritual. The practices forbidden in these chapters featured prominently in the idolatrous religions of the near east,, the people of Israel found extremely alluring: ritual bestiality (as practised in Egypt), child sacrifice, and the cultic use of menstrual blood in sorcery. The verses against sodomy (Leviticus 18:22; 20:13) forbid temple prostitution:
JohanR888 2 years ago
Firstly these laws were priestly codes and holiness codes.
The word translated from abomination in hebrew is "toevah" which means ritually unclean.
JohanR888 2 years ago
I suppose the command made sense in the context where ANY recreational sex was frowned upon. I mean gay sex isn't going to result in procreation, so it would be recreational . . .
. . . but we've since dropped our taboo on the issue. If you aren't conemning straight couples who are in monogomous relationships and having sex for any purpose other than procreation, you're being a hypocrite to accuse homosexuals thusly.
SonicTheHedgedawg 2 years ago
I just want to ask the question no one else will and be excused for it: is Justin completely hairless for a reason? Do we need to be praying for him to get better or is he just trying to shave seconds off his swim time?
Also, great videos! Keep up the top-notch work.
DalisYT 2 years ago
Thank you.
deek93 2 years ago
I was taught in school that the main point of Christianity is just to be the best person that you can be. All the other rules were just there to guide people, back when they had other needs as a society (like maximum procreation) . This was the point Jesus tried to make over and over when he presented the one simple rule of life: "Do onto others, as you would have them do onto you".
I don't think being gay hurts anyone. Nor does it make you a bad person, so according to Jesus's logic its ok.
shyama555 2 years ago
Also, I would like to point out that even IF gayness were a sin according to the parts of the bible that apply today, that doesn't mean God will hate you. I mean he loves murderers! So even if it was just totally wrong (which i don't think it has been since Jesus), God would still love you.
shyama555 2 years ago
I saw a documentary about sex and then they mention homosexual sex. They discovered a Jesus Version and a Hebrew Version. The Hebrew Version mentions Homosexuals while the Jesus Version says no such thing. However, people don't wan't to believe that, which doesn't suprise me at all.
oscardaone 2 years ago
Thank you SO much for making this video.....it made me alot happier with myself
solarlunarxiiiAMV 2 years ago
TYVM I need it said to me, i have always believed that God made every1, if he didnt want gay ppl he wouldnt of made them. God Bless you
LoaTsuno69 2 years ago
Great Video My family is also working really hard to make people understand that you can be gay and Christain and have family values
depfox 2 years ago
I love your videos. :]
You should make more. Maybe info and sermons? Not really sure.
and don't worry, I lie with stuffed animals too. haha.
NoiretteBlanc 2 years ago
this is why gay marriage is important because as gay people we are sinning by having sex outside of marriage. once it becomes legal then we are legally having sex and moral upstanding snob christians will have to accept it whether they like it or not. its the only thing standing in our way of being truly happy gay christian couples. the whole abomination thing and reprobate mind from the new testament are basically to each his own interpretation. all in all... GOD IS LOVE not hate.
plankboi 2 years ago
Ultimately as long as u accept Jesus as ur lord and savior and believe that he is the son of God and died for ur sins, UR SAVED AND UR GOING TO HEAVEN!
This brings up some questions, like "If I accept Jesus, can I sin all I want and still go to heaven?" This type of question doesnt make any sense because if u really accepted Jesus, then u wouldnt want to sin! Get my point?!
So Christians try to live like Christ and please God, but can never accomplish it. So all we can do is our best!
halette20001 2 years ago
mister halette20001... :) i disagree on the part where u say "if u really accepted Jesus, then u wouldnt want to sin!" because i believe that what u want to do, and what u stop ur self from doing are 2 different things. if u fully accept jesus like u say, ur saying that u would not want to lie, cheat, steal, as in it is ur own conduct not to do so? or that u wont want to lie, cheat, steal, because u would have no urge to do so, no matter the reason? and no such temptations would cross ur mind?
LanceDaPsycho 2 years ago
You still have urges, but you would want to do your best to please God. You are still human...I think the closer you get to God, the more you pursue him, the more you will be the creature that He wants you to be...the more pleasing to Him you will be.
bubsturtle 2 years ago
yes indeed!
sadguyfoundout1 2 years ago
"This brings up some questions, like "If I accept Jesus, can I sin all I want and still go to heaven?""
This assumes that being gay, or having gay sex, is a sin in the first place which most gay people, and may theologians, complete disagree with. If sex is done within a loving relationship blessed by the Church (and you are a Christian!) is it a Sin?
And what about the non-Christians out there? Should we be limited by what Christians believe to be sin, when deciding civil law? I think not.
toantom 2 years ago
Simply accepting Jesus into your heart or as your Lord and Savior isn't going to save you. That's the modern American Gospel that says all you have to do is check a box and your saved. Being saved is not some choice or verbal contract. God chooses whom he saves for he has mercy on whom he will have mercy and whom he hardens he will. You must be born again to go to Heaven and this is God's choice, not your own. If you do make a true choice for Jesus, it's because God chose you first!
SovereignShepherd 2 years ago
1. U CAN be gay AND Christian! Being Christian is believing that Jesus died 4 our sins; not about sinning! Christians sin. So the logic that if u sin ur not Christian is crazy!
2. The Old Test IS BINDING anywhere the New Test does not contradict it. So the "other things" the Old Test condemns that we accept today was changed in the New Test; that is why we condone them! Its the difference between Judaism and Christianity.
3. The Bible is clear that gay sex is a sin! So we shouldnt do it!
halette20001 2 years ago
On 2 do you eat shellfish, when you have your period are you unclean. If the New Testament did not contradict these things you would be doing all these things.
'Next the bibles opinions on gay sex dosen't matter because science and biology proves that gay sex and being gay is natural and is in every living species. Hell there are all female species that reproduce parthenogenically and are all lesbian.
0Sindel12 2 years ago
1 John 5:18 We know that anyone born of God does not continue to sin; the one who was born of God keeps him safe, and the evil one cannot harm him.
but you are right on the points you made (halette20001)
insaner169 2 years ago
@halette20001
About your first point you have to be careful with that statement-- because the Bible also says that not everyone that says Lord will make it into heaven. It says someo will talk about all of the things they did in Jesus Name looking to get in but they will hear depart from me you workers of iniquity I knew you not.....but you are right about it being forbidden in the word. It is as clear as night and day but yet we have such a fierce debate going on in this country.
jamel11234 2 years ago
Amen!
566791967 2 years ago
I found this video very informative. I happen to be straight and recently a good friend of mine has come out of the closet... They have really been struggling with the idea that they are going to hell. I am going to pass this on to them.. maybe it will help. Thank you.
Smartassawhip 2 years ago
God loves us all, and no Man has the right to tell anyone that God hates them.
Christan's can not even learn that God said , Judge not least you be Judged.
God Bless you for this video
spock8585 2 years ago
hey Im pagan has you can see on my user name but I do agree with what you said Unfortatly I was put through so much hell throw christen churches in my life and researching and lesion to the bible that I just have found paganism works for me but what you are saying is a good think and is how a true christen should think good video 5 stars
RainbowPagon1982 2 years ago
thank you for this video it was great me & my partner were raised catholic and when we relised we where gay we didnt think we could have a relationship with god. Now that we are older we understand that we can have a relationship with god. keep up the great work :O)
depfox 2 years ago
Right on friend! Hope you are doing well, (I am also peaceis), hug those beautiful children for me! J
phillipmarch22 2 years ago
I appreciate the fact that you want to show impartiality. However, putting much credence on Leviticus is a fool's errand. The Bible cannot be interpreted literally. It is based on a legacy of fear, arrogance, condescendence, and ignorance that is, (for the most part), to blame for many of the moral disasters that have fallen upon Humankind through the centuries. Homosexuality is part of the human condition, a physiological trait that some are born with. It is far from being an abomination.
armyveteran101st 2 years ago
My take on this is that a man shall not lie with man as with a woman, reveals that God was NOT speaking to men in general, if so, He would simply say A man shall not lie with a man. full stop! But by including as with a woman raises the question, how else can 2 men lie?
In Lev. 20:13 God made it even clearer by saying if a man lie with man as HE lies with a woman. Therefore, God is speaking to a particular man who lies with both sexes. Gay men don't lie with women unless by societal pressure!
Kumtekmeon 2 years ago
So then, Kumtekmeon, what does that say about those of us who are bisexual?
tenshinokuragari 2 years ago
I find your perspective very intriguing! I appreciate your thoughts :)
kriskahn21 2 years ago
Bingo!
As a confirmed, unapologetic, unrepentant & proud gay man (born gay), I've never had any desire at all to "lay with a woman", therefore Lev 18:22 obviously cannot apply to me.
Also, I cannot change the fact that I was born gay. I can, however, change whether I'm a Christian or not. If the homophobic fundies give me and others like me enough crap about how we happened to be created by God (and He doesn't make mistakes, right?), then we're liable to turn Pagan, Muslim, Buddhist, etc.
IamaKinsey06 2 years ago
WOW Kumtekmeon that is a really neat perspective. Sleeping with anyone would be sinful because you would be fornicating or committing adultery.
malicein1wonderland 2 years ago
Good point!
Fornication is disgusting. I just can't take those claims from g0ys, heroichomosex groups of men being bisexual and thus allowed to cheat on men and women alike. Either you marry a woman or a transgay. This is what I think.
ShahMashya 2 years ago
@Kumtekmeon You know what...I've ALWAYS interpreted that scripture just the way you did. I thought that I was the only person in this world who actually thought that. Thanks for reaffirming this for me! God Bless!
teehoward1 2 years ago
It's an OBAMA nation! Haha. It sounded like they were sayin that. Kidding aside though.. Great to hear from your perspective of things. I am born again and I was always curious as to how Christianity rolls with homosexuality. Not so much now. Good job.
woopdeedoo77 2 years ago
I liked this, nice work. Although, that line "let the Bible interpret itself," had Protestant written all over it :)
WorthThekingsRansom 2 years ago
There is nothing wrong with being protestant now is there? :P
joeyLJ 2 years ago
Did you get MY email... Or have I sent one?
ursusem 2 years ago
I wish everyone could see this video. Thanx Justin for giving Christians of all sides something to think about.
IntelligentT82 2 years ago
wow. great video. wonderful explanations of the arguments. And love the Princess Bride clip. It juxtaposed oh-so well with Jimmy Swaggert.
CalebWandering 2 years ago
I luvluvluv this video!!
Especially the stuffed animals.....
And Inigo Montoya.......
Toddhimself 2 years ago
Beautiful, loving, funny, thoughtful, creative, biblically sound -- I could go on. Thanks so much for your wonderful ministry, Justin. I praise the Lord that He has chosen such a powerful vehicle for His infinite love and grace.
jejunemoon 2 years ago
aideenj - I briefly mentioned that part; I just didn't quote it due to time. There's a lot more to say about these passages than you can cover in one video. :)
GayChristianNetwork 2 years ago
The trick with the Bible, though is that there are so many interpretation. I thought up 3 alternate possible meanings to Leviticus before this video was into it's third minute.
1) Do not tell lies with a man the same way you tell lies with a woman. Or vice versa.
2) Do not sleep with a man and woman at the same time.
3) Do not lie with mankind the exact same way you would lie with womankind. Impossible anyway, since men don't have vaginas.
Savior20061 2 years ago
Justin, you forgot the bit where it says: 'I am the LORD your God. You must not do as they do in Egypt, where you used to live, and you must not do as they do in the land of Canaan, where I am bringing you. Do not follow their practices.' - I think that's really key for showing the temple rituals behind this prohibition!
aideenj 2 years ago
One point that is not addresses on this subject is that these passages are specifically speaking to "Heterosexual" men commiting idolotry. Gay people were considered eunuchs or a third gender.
PMCR1966 2 years ago
lol "it clearly is clearly stated in the bible.." ahh good times. how can you argue with that?
nagchampafreak 2 years ago
Dude, I praise you for this video. My girlfriend and I have read it and we almost broke up because of that idiotic part.
MiyakoWuvesBerry 2 years ago
Great video.
itzyourcrayons 2 years ago
YESSSS A NEW VIDEO. I thought you guys totally stoppped D:
jasonvuboo 2 years ago
it is a reference to being involved in 'sins of the flesh'.. hence the word 'mankind'... God does NOT condemn one for being homosexual.. through the eyes of God, there is no gender.. the bible is so misinterpreted and was written by MAN, not God... BE YOURSELF...
tinaslynn 2 years ago
Finally a new vid! Thanks! You answered a lot of question a had. Its great to not only be part of the GCN community, but to watch this amazings vids. I want a copy of the DVD.
adiazrivera 2 years ago
excellent Justin!
canyonwlkr 2 years ago
Great video. Glad someone finally sat down and tangled with Leviticus.
NerdyMcCool 2 years ago
Amen! Everyone deserves the freedom of speech, but if you hold up "God Hates Fags" signs, then I best be seeing you boycott Red Lobster as well!!!! Don't you agree?
PeaceandHarmony3 2 years ago
Great videos! Continue with more of them!
FlyingThroughLife 2 years ago
2:24 haha "God hates eagles..." ^_^ thanks for this vid.....;) helpz a lot
SCREAMOguy413 2 years ago
Thanks for another great video <3
rmntcartst 2 years ago