every time I look at the comments on boxing matches, there's always some dumbass trying to tell the boxer's life story, or make excuses for y a boxer lost a fight, or won a fight, whatever
I believe it was a walk over match after the main event.
As for Tyson skipping training well true but is that a sound way of thinking, if Tyson wanted his belts he would have trainened for them, Douglas wanted the belts and trained for it.....Boxing is not what ifs, or I wishes, Its about Win .lose or draw.....On Feb. 11 Douglas beat Tyson like a punk.
@vousallezvous No need to be sarcastic, it was on the undercard of the Mike Tyson vs Frank Bruno fight. It's still weird seeing the Hilton Hotel ballroom empty like this though.
my top 10 heavyweights of all time are 1. Rocky Marciano 2. Larry Holmes 3. Muhammed Ali 4. Mike Tyson 5. George Foreman 6. Joe Frazier 7. Jack Dempsey 8. Jack Johnson 9. Evander Holyfield 10. Lennox Lewis
@whitedeviltx U must BE Joking!! Or smoking!! Rocky Marciano No1??? Pleeeeeaaaaase!! RM wouldn't make my top 20, never mind Jack 'who did I ever fight' Dempsey. A young Sony Liston (one of ther most underrated Heavyweights in history) would easily make the Top 5, not even in yr top 10. Would like to know what u base your ratings on?? Ali #3 ??
@ManlnCognito Really we are arguing a mute point both guys were good fighters, Im a Tyson fan so I say he is the best hw ever your a Lewis guy and think he is the best. Now we have both made points that make niether of them look like the best everso i guess we can just agree to disagree, at least your not saying ali was the best ever
@whitedeviltx How can you criticise Lewis’s career record and rate Tyson's? “Tyson the best ever”?...LOL
Some facts for you. Tyson’s armature career was unremarkable. As heavyweight champ he only reined for 2 and half years and in that time never beat any great fighters in their prime. He was eventually annihilated by a second rate journeyman and never avenged that loss or any of his later losses.
@ManlnCognito Yeah of course his amatuer career was unremarkable the guy was knocking out pro fighters left and right by eighteen years old, and was the youngest champion ever he beat plenty of good fighters along the way, he also retired with one of the best knockout ratios ever despite fighting as a washed up fighter for five years give or take. By the way what great fighter did Lennox ever beat in his prime, nobody
@whitedeviltx He beat Holyfield who was better than Tyson
Tyson's record is made up of bums and sparring partners. I watched his career unfold in the eighties and he was criticised then for the poor quality of his opposition. Yes he was the youngest to win the title, but also the youngest to lose it at 23 and IN HIS PRIME to a bum.
Lennox Lewis would have destroyed Tyson at any time in his career
@ManlnCognito Lewis would have been EATEN ALIVE by a young Tyson '86- '89. Simple! Lewis always had problems with punchers, Tyson would have been way too quick for him, would resemble a Tyson-Bruno fight. (lol.Lennox laboured his way to an 8th round TKO against a totally over-the-hill, washed up Tyson. If Lennox was a real bad-man he would of crushed 'that' Tyson in 2 rounds!)
And to think that berbick beat up Ali badly, wow Ali was overrated I dont care if he was old that is as bad or worse than Tyson losing to Mcbride at the end of his caareer
LOL..Dempsey? Sorry but he was to small, no defence, crude and unskilled. Lewis along with virtually all modern heavyweights would annihilate Dempsey or any fighter of his generation.
Your opinion of Lewis seems to differ from that of Manny Stewart, Angelo Dundee and many other respected boxing experts. Lewis fought and beat all the best fighters of his generation; he avenged both his losses proving they were flukes. what more could have been asked of him.
@ManlnCognito Y'know, funny thing. You ask me for an opinion and you ask me to respond without insults. Yet when you respond back to me you talk to me like I don't know shit about boxing, in turn, insulting me. Why don't you fucking try practicing what you preach son? I NEVER said I didn't like Lewis. I wish he was still champ. At least we had someone we could call a legit champ instead of the shit we have today.
@ManlnCognito And if you think Dempsey would have been easily beaten by ANY of today's shit pile of heavyweights you're a fucking moron. ANY so called boxing expert you talk to would have Dempsey cleaning out the division. Dempsey was one of the greatest punchers in history. At 6' and 195lbs he could out punch guys like Lewis easily. That's not to say Lewis wasn't a good fighter. As far as I'm concerned, unless you know how to express an opinion without insulting me, this conversation is over.
Then you're easily insulted that's all I can say, had no idea you guys were so sensitive
Boxing has evolved since the days of Dempsey, Louis and Marciano.
Search them on YouTube. Dempsey to me looked like a some drunk fair ground boxer. Swinging widely and off balance...he'd be open to counters....there no way 6 ft 195 lb Dempsey could beat 6 ft. 5 230 lb Lewis.
@ManlnCognito Think what you want. I wouldn't have been insulted if you hadn't asked ME not to insult, then turn around and do so yourself. Kind of a prick move don't you think? Besides, I don't really care if you don't agree with me. YOU asked my opinion, I didn't ask yours. So think what you want. Those in the know know better. And Dempsey wasn't as easy to hit in his prime as you make him out to be. He practically invented the bob and weave and in his prime was a vicious savage in the ring.
@ManlnCognito No dumb ass. You insulted me by implying I didn't know anything about boxing, and wrongfully implying that I didn't like Lewis because I'm American, when infact I never said I didn't like Lewis. I simply stated I thought there were better heavyweights than himself. Too bad you're not smart enough to have a civil debate.
FRANk BRUNO ALMOST KNOCKED OUT LEWIS, RAHMAN KNOCKED OUT LEWIS, OLIVER MCCALL KNOCKED OUT LEWIS.
THE TYSON WHO FACED LEWIS WAS A GARBAGE, PRIME TYSON WOULD KO LEWIS, TUA IS SLOW. THE HEART OF LEWIS HELD UP HIM SOME TIMES, NOT HIS CHIN!! heart is not chin!! bye!!!
Frank Bruno was a known puncher who rocked a prime Tyson. and he never came close to stoppong Lewis. Both Lewis's losses were avenged in spectacular style.
The Lewis who faced Tyson was also past his best. He was 38, the same age Tyson was when he quite against that fat Irishman.
Buster Douglas beat Tyson in his prime, Lewis was twice times the fighter Douglas was. Lewis would have beat Tyson at anytime in his career.
Who did Tyson ever beat that was as good as Lewis?
the age is not important.tyson was not the same boxer mentally, like foreman against jimmy young, he was good physically, but mentally he was very bad, i tis very important.
and lennox had better past prime than tyson.
how hell can you say, lewis would destroy dempsey in 1 round?
you ara a blind fanatic, i am not fan of tyson, but i say the truth, i think mike tyson 86-88( team kevin rooney), would win lewis.
How do you know what state of mind Tyson was in before the Douglass fight? he weighed in at his normal fighting weight of 220. There was nothing to suggest that Tyson was in anything other than his peak fighting condition. Great fighters stay focussed, if Tyson couldn't do that then that marks him down as a fighter.
I can say Lewis would destroy Dempsey because Lewis was bigger and has superior boxing skills than Dempsey.
Boxing has evolved since the time of Jack Dempsey. I'm About the same size as Dempsey, 6ft.1 195 lbs...I've seen Lewis up close and got his autograph and compeered to me the guy was huge
@ManlnCognito Look, EVERYBODY that knows boxing knows the Tyson that Douglas beat was not the same. Even the Tyson that beat Frank Bruno wasn't the same. Rooney was out by then and Mike wasn't training. It was reported even back then that he was skipping out of training. And the head movement was gone even against Bruno in '89. Also gone was the combo punching. There is no way in hell Lewis would have beaten The same Tyson that beat Berbick in '86 or Tyrell Biggs. That's just a fact.
Again how can you possibly know that? If Tyson had beat guys who were as good or better than Lewis I could understand.
Even with Rooney in his corner Tyson struggled against some pretty limited fighters. Guys like Tilles, Mitch Green. James Smith and Josie Rabalta. In all those fights Tyson stopped moving his head, using his jab and combinations after the sixth round.
@ManlnCognito You are correct in those cases. (except Greene) Tyson beat Greene easily. After the Tillis fight where he was nervous about going 10 rounds he held back a little. In the Greene fight he showed a lot of maturity by sticking to the body and never losiong his cool.) Bonecrusher, he held the entire fight just looking to survive. Easy win for Tyson. I doubt Lewis would have done that. Either one of us would be speculating, but prime against prime I'm sticking with Mike.
You are entitled to your opinion but for me even in his prime Tyson was a different fighter after the sixth round. he had to take them out early. Lewis would not have folded early, and had the speed and power to take Tyson out.
Lewis and Tyson were both past their primes when they fought each other. but seriously, the fight wasn't even close. Tyson's people should have pulled Tyson out after the sixth round, the fight was that one sided.
@ManlnCognito Lewis obviously had the better career. I like Lewis and wish he was still champ. But if you're going to base your opinion on "who did Mike beat that was as good as Lewis" you could EASILY reverse that question. Lewis NEVER beat anyone of the same caliber as Mike. Holyfield? VERY unimpressive in both fights. All I'm saying is you can't use Douglas as an example. Mike's mental state was shot by then and EVERYBODY knows that. Mike's prime was short but spectacular. Lewis, longevity
Lewis is one of the few fighters who can honestly say beat all the best fighters of their era...and avenged all his losses. When he retired there was no loose ends if you like to clear up.
Tyson's reign lasted just two and a half years and left to many question marks. fighters have to be judged on what they actually accomplished or didn't accomplish...not what might have happened if they had made different decisions
this poor guy is a blind fan of lewis, ali 66 would play with lewis, holmes would play with lewis, foreman 73 would ko lewis, prime tyson would ko lewis,
@consta4891 I think Lewis was OK too. But fact is he just didn't have a chin. And as quick and strong as Mike was in his prime, not to mention those combos, there's no way he wouldn't have gotten to Lewis' chin, even if it was later in the fight.
@consta4891 Dempsey? Forgetaboutit.... There's no way in hell Lewis could have stood the pressure of someone like Dempsey. People that say shit like "boxing has evolved since those days" fail to realize that boxing, in one form or another, has ALWAYS been around. It's widely believed in the boxing community that guys back then, 190, 200lbs, were stronger than today's heavyweights. There's not a heavyweight alive today that would beat a prime Dempsey...
@consta4891 Yeah, but don't say that out loud. I love Dempsey and what he did to Willard was impressive, considering nobody else even handled him that way. But Willard wasn't as good as Lewis. Willard won the title, took 1 easy defense, then tucked the belt under his arm and went home to Kansas where he sat on the crown for 3 years. But the way Dempsey took Willard out was nothing short of awesome. broke his jaw, knocked out teeth, broke his nose. Total destruction. Lewis couldn't handle that.
@consta4891 uuuuuuuuh, I don't see how that comment applies to anything I said. I never said anything about boxing not being dangerous. My last comment simply said Lennox Lewis was a better fighter than Jess Willard. So what could I have been wrong about and how did I imply boxing wasn't dangerous??? lolol.... I think you might have responded to the wrong person on this one...
@bandit9874 = bullshine chap. I suggest you reference on this site '' lewis iron jaw'' or similar. the shots this man took in his career and came back...jeez. if you had an open mind you would reavaluate your opinion.
@elainesman look son, don't get on hear and start insulting me just because you don't agree with me. And I ain't your fucking chap. If you don't agree, just say you don't agree. Don't start this shit about me having or not having an open mind. State your fucking point and move the fuck out. son
When you put conditioning into the equation, considering that the Manassa Mauler frequently got away with not being in the greatest shape and considering the effectiveness of Lewis' jab, what makes you think even that a great albeit small heavyweight like Dempsey would a chance of getting to Lewis with the way Lewis handled Tua?
@mowglee09 I think Tua had a rib injury and couldn't slip or move effectively. It also affected the rotation of his body so he didn't put punches together.
@bandit9874 Sure Tyson was past it when he fought Lewis. But lets get real, who did Tyson ever beat? You go on that the Tyson that beat Berbick and Biggs would have killed Lewis like they were great fighters. Biggs or Berbick can't be compared to Lewis. Lewis PLAYED with Tyson in 2002. He COULD have KO'd him in 2 or 3 rounds as Steward was screaming at him to do but Lewis wanted to punish him for biting him at the press conference. Lewis whupped him like he was his Daddy!
@bandit9874 Also Tyson fans want us to believe he was shot at 22 years of age. Sure he wasn't the same technically but he WAS in shape. Tyson's weight was always consistently between 218-221 pounds. He had no excess on him. Yes the head movement was gone and he didn't hit in combos as often but his performances got worse as the opposition got tougher. Tyson always struggled against a tall guy with decent power and wasn't afraid of him. That was the key: NO FEAR.
@bandit9874 Tyson wasn't great because of WHO he beat, it was HOW he beat them. He was exciting. Tyson needed to show SOMETHING against Lewis in order for me to say that when he was at his best he would have won. He showed NOTHING. Lets all get real though. Lewis AND Tyson were great. Tyson rulled in a weak era but we NEEDED him at the time to clear out the fat men and drug addicts and he did that in style. Lewis ruled in a tougher era and wasn't as exciting but we needed a unified champ again.
@lennoxmate I ain't getting into the whole payoff thing again. I've talked about that time and time again. Fact is prime against prime Tyson was a much better fighter. Mentally Tyson didn't have what it takes to remain on top, but Tyson in 87 or 88 would have stopped Lewis, no doubt. I'm done with this talk.
@bandit9874 You wont get into it? You're done with this talk? I've touched a nerve there! You talk words like FACT to back up your arguments. There is no fact, there is only speculation. The FACT here though is that Tyson paid Lewis Millions NOT to fight him and gave up his title to fight Seldon. Lewis had Don King keeping him out of the title picture and didn't want Lewis anywhere near Tyson. Tyson listened to King and was made to look bad. I will continue this conversation . . . I aint afraid!
@lennoxmate Hey smart guy, I've already had this discussion several times on this same video. How stupid is it to keep harping on the same shit over and over and over again? Boxing fans understand why Don King paid Lewis to step aside. Don King paid Lewis, Not Tyson. Tyson/Holyfield, which was the fight everyone really wanted at the time, not Lewis, was at hand, and for all intents and purposes King KNEW at that point in his career Lewis would beat Tyson. That would have ruined Holyfield/Tyson
@bandit9874 You can't rate Tyson as an all beating God with his resume and most certainly not over a career specialist like Lewis, Ali or Louis. Tyson had an average amateur career & yes the first few years of his career were amazing I'm a fan of Lewis & Tyson & was an awed 10 year old when he beat Berbick but a 3 year reign & an 8 month reign wont convince me of anything different. Tyson WAS great but when the opposition got tougher he faded away. Tillis with more belief could have beaten him.
@lennoxmate 2) Now what's being afraid got to do with anything? That's just fucking stupid. I just didn't feel like repeating the same fucking thing over and over to you just because you're too fucking lazy to read older comments I've made about the same fucking topic. Wasn't about Tyson being afraid. It was about him taking the right fight at the right time. EVERY big name fighter on the planet does that. Even Lewis. Prime against prime Tyson wipes the floor with Lewis. fact.
@bandit9874 The best fighters always take on the best fighters. Tyson had 7 years to get hold of Lewis when he came out of prison. Lewis was his number 1 contender. Tyson chose to avoid Lewis every chance he got and then when he needs a payday he agrees to it. Tyson obviously wasn't as confident about his chances v Lewis as you. Tyson AVOIDED Lewis and then when he lost you cry he was shot?! Who's fault is that? That is one fucking retarded comment. . . .
@bandit9874 Also for one last time, saying Fact at the end of your opinion doesn't make it true. Do you have a time machine? Have you watched a prime Lewis v Prime Tyson? We all have opinions on here and thats all. None of us are that important. In my opinioin Lewis beats Tyson due to quality of opposition and mental fortitude but I can't claim it as fact. So "smart guy" take your head out of your arse and stop talking like your Bert Sugar, cos' you aint. . . .FACT!
@bandit9874 Also remember that Tyson AND Bowe gave up their belts rather than face Lewis. Tyson DESTROYED Bruno in 96. Tyson could have took Lewis on then but gave up the title AND paid Lewis. Larry Merchant once pointed out that Lewis was responsible for the most shameful era in American Heavyweight history as Foreman, Bowe, Tyson, Moorer and Holyfield all found excuses not to fight him. When THAT many men avoid ONE fighter like that you have to ask WHY?
@whiteknight040879 I wouldn't go that far, but it should be noted when he was in his prime people were crazy about the man. It's easy to point to the poor performances once his career turned to a circus side show. But in his prime Mike was something special and who knows what he would have been capable of had he maintained his composure throughout his career.
quit making excuses .... tyson lost against buster.... holyfield knocked buster.... tyson lost to holyfield do your math tyson was great but not greater than the above
@TWO4EBERling It's because he was exposed by Douglas. Tyson's true mettle comes from the fact that he never once beat the count, except for the Lewis fight when he was almost on his knees, and Lewis knocked him out for good seconds later.
@TheBestBoxingGame My apologies. I forgot about that one. I know that he did get knocked down in that one and didn't get up, but I forgot about the knock down in the 6th round.
I'm starting to have random vague doubts about rooney's importance, at least with regard to Tyson's decline. Tyson did pretty well for a spell after he was gone. The truth is, once he was champ I don't think anyone could really control him, and he pretty much knew how to train. His real problem was women. Yes, he underestimated Douglas. But he skipped out of training to bang japanese chicks is what I heard, and he certainly had more women problems after that.
@tommygumport Rooney was vital to Tyson's success because he was the direct link to Dmato's teachings that made Tyson so effective. Rooney was also outspoken and he'd tell it like it was. If Mike Looked like shyt or needed to repeat a training exercise, Rooney wasn't afraid to yell at Mike and make him do it. It wasnt about Mike Tyson the bigger than life entity with Rooney. It was about keeping Cus' training methods instilled in Mike at any cost.
It's not a fact. You know why? Because you can't prove something subjective. It is merely your opinion. Its good to know Tyson nuthuggers are still out in full force. The guy never lost a fight according to people like you. 50 wins and six asterisks.
@cbaldwinjr Eight asterisks according to them. I've never seen so many excuses. It's simple: Tyson was a bully, and bullies always lose when they get exposed.
@bandit9874 Thats an opinion. Its never been proven. I think Lennox would have handled Tyson at any point. Lewis is the king of this era. Plain and simple
@ManlnCognito Larry Holmes was better tham Lennox, so was 35-0 Tony Tucker before he got on drugs, 31-0 MichealSpinks would have had a shot against lennox, and a prime Tyson would have made Lennox look much worse than Rahman, Mcall or klitchkow made him look lewis was slow had a glass jaw and hugged the whole fight, When Douglas beat Tyson he was in great shape and fought a great fight dnt believe me watch it lennox would have lost to him that night as well
@whitedeviltx First off Lennox Beat Tucker way more convincingly than Tyson did. Spinks? LOL no chance Spinks was just a Light Heavy. I’ll give you Holmes but Tyson? No way. Tyson has to be the most over rated fighter in history and Douglas was a bum. Lewis would have KO’d him in three.
You obviously dont know anything about boxing kid..lol
@ManlnCognito I honestly think Lennox was way overrated, he beat mostly washed up fighters Tony tucker was addicted to cocaine when he fought Lewis Tyson visibly wasnt the same anymore Rahman an Mccall were nobodys Spinks beat holmes twice and kod gerry cooney as a heavy so he must have been okwhat good young fighter did lennox ever beat
@whitedeviltx Lewis fought and beat every good fighter of his era. He beat Tyson when he was 38. Holyfield, Morrison, Tue, Bruno, Ray Mercer, Vitali Klitscho, McCall, Rahman, Ruddock.
A three time heavyweight Champ and Olympic gold medallist. Retired at the top and avenged both his losses. Lennox Lewis in top three heavyweights of all time
@ManlnCognito I think its funny you put vitali on the list he was dominating lennox and only lost because of a referee stoppage, mercer had a good chin but couldnt hurt anybody, Tua only had one good hand his left is and was garbage, the holyfield fights were suspect at best if you like hugging those were great, Rahman and Mccall were bums who else of note has either of them beat, bruno and ruddock were solid not great, the only impressive win of all theese in my mind is morrison
@whitedeviltx Tony Tucker was very talented but never performed as a pro really. There was the Douglas fight where he was unimpressive. Douglas was way ahead and then just quit., Tucker hurt Tyson early but injured his hand and showed no ambition after. Tucker could have been very good but never showed the fire as a pro. No chance against prime Lewis.
Holmes? Holmes, the 77-82 version would have had a very good chance of beating Lewis. In my opinion Lewis wins but its a tough one to call.
@whitedeviltx Lewis should easily beat Douglas really. Lewis was taller and bigger. Douglas was a little quicker but Lewis had a better jab, defence, technique, far superior punching power and WAY more heart. I struggle to see Douglas lasting more than 5 rounds v Lewis to be honest.
Is obvious that you are a warrior of the keyboard without social life, you live to answer, you think that if you say the last word you know on boxing, the people does not answer you because this is = to lose the time, you are a simpleton.
@ManlnCognito lol. So why are you erasing all your comments about fucking children? lol... Don't want the rest of the world to see you're just as sick as I am? lolol. Hey, we're becoming friends it seems. I think tonight I'm gonna fuck your old lady. I think it's time. I've been banging your kids long enough. It's time I give the old bitch a go at it. See you tonight chump...
@whitedeviltx I’ve just given you several but you not interested because you dont like Lewis. Who is your favourite Heavyweight? Holmes? Only beat an old Ali. Tyson? Never beat any great fighters in their prime and lost every real war he was in.
Lewis had everything, size, speed, power, Jab...one of the best heavyweights of all time
Douglas was a fighter who had a lot of potential but wasted it with laziness and gluttony.. but he got motivated when he needed it in Tokyo... and came out with $30M..
pourquoi la salle est si vide ?? deux aussi grand champion de la boxe !! trevor berbick met fin a la carriere de ali et douglas met tyson ko !! i don't understand !!! respect trevor and buster !!!
tyson destroyed average fighters and most were ex champs which is far from average. Only problem with tyson he was his own worst enemy, he surrounded himself with nobs which doesnt do you any favours. To be the best of all time means you have to be in shape even when your on a break. Look at holyfield and lewis, i love tyson, but most great fighters fade after being champ for more than 3 years whilst taking on all comers. Tyson was defo great.
wot a load of bollocks lad tyson kod tilman in a round and had no trouble with ribalta apart from him gettin up off each knockdown. D'amato wasnt even around when he fought tilman. Tyson is a legend get over it!
So if he was average then how does he get up there in your books? That is like saying that because Trevor Berbick beat Ali then he is better than him or that because McBride beat Tyson that he is better than him or that because Rahman beat Lewis then he is better....
Great fighters win great fights, Tyson never managed that. He lost every real war he found himself in.
Great fighters beat all the best fighters of their generation. Tyson never managed to do that either. He got annihilated in his prime by Buster Douglas. a loss he never avenged....in fact Tyson didn't avenge any of his losses.
Great fighters go out fighting, in his last two fights Tyson sat on his ass and quite.
@ManlnCognito Pfft Glass jawed Lewis in front of Foreman and Frazier? I don't remember Foreman or Frazier ever going down to one punch and staying down.
Foreman went down to Ali and stayed down, Foreman put Frazier down six times....but all that is irrelevant.
Lewis was an Olympic gold medallist and three time heavyweight champion. He fought and beat all the best fighters of his generation and avenged both his losses in devastating style.
@ManlnCognito Foreman didn't stay down he was up by 9 but could not continue from exhaustion. He wasn't lying down seeing stars because he got hit on the button. Devastating style? So Oliver McCall having an emotional breakdown in the ring and barely any punches thrown is a devestating revenge fight? What nonsense.
Tyson paid Lennox Lewis four million dollars to stand aside so he could face Bruce Seldon instead. Shows that Tyson wasn't as stupid as he looked. He knew he could never beat Lennox Lewis in a million years.
Tyson in his prime couldnt beat Buster Douglas, Lewis was twice the fighter Douglas was.
Tyson also ducked Lewis for years, he even paid Lewis four million dollars step aside money so he could fight Brice Seldon instead. That is a fact Tyson has admitted.
Who did Tyson ever beat that was as good as Lewis?
@ManlnCognito First off Tyson was not in his right state of mind throughout the whole training prior to his fight with Douglas. He didnt take the fight serious and his sparring partner floored him. Tyson was out partying, drinking and fuckn many woman. No excuses but alot of things was going wrong for him before this fight. Robin Givens divorce,Rape case, Don KIng, Cuss dieing. Watch the fight Mike didnt even look himself.Buster was down more than 10 seconds. Mike won that fight
@ManlnCognito uh, Tyson was going for the belt. Hard to blame him at the time. Business son. And you can't call the Tyson/Douglas fight a prime Tyson. Hell, even when he fought Bruno he was slipping. He had let Rooney go and much of the head movement that made him so elusive was already gone in the Bruno fight. Tyson wasn't Tyson the night he fought Douglas and you know it.
@ManlnCognito Well, to be honest, I think even Holyfield was better than Lewis. Lewis was in his prime when he faced Holyfield. Holyfield was past his. And many thought that Holyfield won their 2nd fight. I believe a prime Tyson would have beaten Lewis. A young Jack Dempsey would have put Lewis to sleep early as Lewis has a glass jaw and Dempsey was one of the hardest punchers ever. Joe Louis, 12 year title reign, need I say more? Foreman, though not the boxer Lewis was, would have gotten to him
Americans fight fans just don't like Lewis because he wasn't American...end of. Neither of his fights with Holyfield were even close he won both of then easily. His fight with Tyson was so one sided it should have been stopped after the sixth round. Any one who knows boxing cannot have anything other than respect for Lennox Lewis
I'm not a tyson nuthugger,I'm a realist and anyone who thinks that to beat the real tyson,these guys needed to face a damato trained tyson ,then we would see what would happen,not this one armed one punch bandit we saw after 1988.
Listen. I agree Mike's best days were before the departure of Rooney. Unfortunately, Mike never faced any quality opponents with exception to a "washed up" Larry Holmes. It's well documented and even quietly admitted that the Tyson camped "ducked" George Foreman! The post prime Foreman would have overpowered the prime Tyson with no problems. As far as body work goes, Holyfield's great defense canceled out and discourage Mike's body attack. Ruddock? Was a "piss mop"! (Lewis, Morrison)LOL
I agree with your assessment to a point. Holmes 5 yrs later and older competed with a prime holyfield and 5 yrs earlier tyson totally dominated,chewed and spit out holmes quite easily I might say so myself.Holyfield looked like a struggler trying to beat holmes.Tyson won 10 rounds against Tucker who ko'd douglas 3 months earlier.This 87-88 tyson threw his shots differently,more instinctevely explosiver and ACCURATE ,then after 1988.I dont buy the holy defense,it was tysons lack of ability .
Come on. You know that styles make fights. I think Holmes had turned over a new leaf when fought Holyfield. He accepted the fact that he wasn't a young man anymore and modified his style to suit his heavier body weight.....I say what you want to hear: I think would probably have over powered Holyfield in 1988. I don't know if the 1988 Tyson would have beaten the 1996 version of Holyfield. Remember Holyfield wasn't completely "filled out" until 1996.
the night douglas beat tyson hed of beat lewis theres no dout he had it set to win and u cant take that 1nce som1s got that in there hed u see the holyfield fight he didnt care wat happened he wasnt even in shape
bullshit.Tyson embarrassed himself not taking douglas serious like he did when he fought at the damato camp.This douglas was a good big class B fighter but tyson should have ko'd him like he ko'd tony tubbs in 2 or so.Tubbs was no worse then douglas.Compare their careers.Aside from the sleeping tokyo tyson,douglas looked mediocre in most all his fights in his career and he got ko'd by Tony Tucker and he WAS in great shape for THAT fight also.
The same tyson that walked into tokyo to fight douglas would have lost to Tillis and Tucker the same night. Douglas was very motivated and in shape but tyson beat tyson.not douglas.Tyson didnt throw one jab in that fight and didnt punch out of one clinch in that fight. His skill was claearly diminished by over 70% of what he was from 86-88.DOuglas did fight a blueprint on how to fight a tyson style but not with a tyson fighting at less then 50% of what he did 2 yrs earlier.
i agree with u there asoon as tyson left rooney he turned to a washed up tyson id personaly say jus had the hard punch that he frew 1 a time but how i see it douglas punched loadz in every round and his chin showed good this night so i think hed out punch lewis easy and bruno nerly had lewis so douglas wood of id say
I think buster was one of the great and underated fighters in boxing history, he had no technical flaws, great jab, great streight right, great defensive skills, punched in combinations good head movement and a descent chin...i hate it when people say it was a fluke he beat tyson and that tyson wasnt mentally fit to fight at the time, douglases mother had just died weeks prior to the fight so he had it hard too but nobody considers that, he's just a better boxer than tyson and that sums it up.
but didnt tyson fire rooney a few years before that fight like 88 or so? and still tyson beat everyone up untill douglas. I think douglas just had the right style and motivation to beat tyson, plus he wasnt afraid to bring the fight to him and tyson usually falters under pressure.
I've seen better fights at the rec
dave5669 1 month ago
every time I look at the comments on boxing matches, there's always some dumbass trying to tell the boxer's life story, or make excuses for y a boxer lost a fight, or won a fight, whatever
DanBuster707 5 months ago
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thepotatovagina 5 months ago
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thepotatovagina 5 months ago
I believe it was a walk over match after the main event.
As for Tyson skipping training well true but is that a sound way of thinking, if Tyson wanted his belts he would have trainened for them, Douglas wanted the belts and trained for it.....Boxing is not what ifs, or I wishes, Its about Win .lose or draw.....On Feb. 11 Douglas beat Tyson like a punk.
TWO4EBERling 6 months ago
These guys sure knew how to fill the seats.
vousallezvous 7 months ago
@vousallezvous No need to be sarcastic, it was on the undercard of the Mike Tyson vs Frank Bruno fight. It's still weird seeing the Hilton Hotel ballroom empty like this though.
canibusnj 6 months ago
I wonder what these guys got paid for this. I'll guess $90,000 Douglas and $40,000 Berbick!
Panthera0nca 11 months ago
This is the man that beat the living shit out of the rapist
thepotatovagina 1 year ago
my top 10 heavyweights of all time are 1. Rocky Marciano 2. Larry Holmes 3. Muhammed Ali 4. Mike Tyson 5. George Foreman 6. Joe Frazier 7. Jack Dempsey 8. Jack Johnson 9. Evander Holyfield 10. Lennox Lewis
whitedeviltx 1 year ago
@whitedeviltx U must BE Joking!! Or smoking!! Rocky Marciano No1??? Pleeeeeaaaaase!! RM wouldn't make my top 20, never mind Jack 'who did I ever fight' Dempsey. A young Sony Liston (one of ther most underrated Heavyweights in history) would easily make the Top 5, not even in yr top 10. Would like to know what u base your ratings on?? Ali #3 ??
Platinummxi 11 months ago
My top five heavyweight of all time
1. Muhammad Ali
2. Larry Holmes
3. Lennox Lewis
4. George Foreman
5. Joe Frazier
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
Lennox was a grade b champion
whitedeviltx 1 year ago
@whitedeviltx If Lewis was a grade c, Tyson was a grade d
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito Really we are arguing a mute point both guys were good fighters, Im a Tyson fan so I say he is the best hw ever your a Lewis guy and think he is the best. Now we have both made points that make niether of them look like the best everso i guess we can just agree to disagree, at least your not saying ali was the best ever
whitedeviltx 1 year ago
@whitedeviltx How can you criticise Lewis’s career record and rate Tyson's? “Tyson the best ever”?...LOL
Some facts for you. Tyson’s armature career was unremarkable. As heavyweight champ he only reined for 2 and half years and in that time never beat any great fighters in their prime. He was eventually annihilated by a second rate journeyman and never avenged that loss or any of his later losses.
Every time Tyson was in areal fight he lost
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito Yeah of course his amatuer career was unremarkable the guy was knocking out pro fighters left and right by eighteen years old, and was the youngest champion ever he beat plenty of good fighters along the way, he also retired with one of the best knockout ratios ever despite fighting as a washed up fighter for five years give or take. By the way what great fighter did Lennox ever beat in his prime, nobody
whitedeviltx 1 year ago
@whitedeviltx He beat Holyfield who was better than Tyson
Tyson's record is made up of bums and sparring partners. I watched his career unfold in the eighties and he was criticised then for the poor quality of his opposition. Yes he was the youngest to win the title, but also the youngest to lose it at 23 and IN HIS PRIME to a bum.
Lennox Lewis would have destroyed Tyson at any time in his career
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito Lewis would have been EATEN ALIVE by a young Tyson '86- '89. Simple! Lewis always had problems with punchers, Tyson would have been way too quick for him, would resemble a Tyson-Bruno fight. (lol.Lennox laboured his way to an 8th round TKO against a totally over-the-hill, washed up Tyson. If Lennox was a real bad-man he would of crushed 'that' Tyson in 2 rounds!)
Platinummxi 11 months ago
@Platinummxi Who did Tyson beat from 86 – 89 to justify that comment?
Mike Tyson has to be the most over rated fighter in history...the guy lost every real war he was in.
Lewis would have killed Tyson at any time in his career
ManlnCognito 11 months ago
And to think that berbick beat up Ali badly, wow Ali was overrated I dont care if he was old that is as bad or worse than Tyson losing to Mcbride at the end of his caareer
whitedeviltx 1 year ago
@whitedeviltx tyson fought with a big injury vs mcbride and ali was ill he had parkinson.
vegetayy 1 year ago
stuppid boxe ,trevor
biroltapmaz1 1 year ago
how many broters mens
agusboca98 1 year ago
that just goes to show heavy weights are its the third round and their already tired
killa0129 1 year ago
This was probably a battle of Underachievers especially Buster Douglas
FRSFreeStateNow 1 year ago
man i cant believe how much of a crap boxer berbick really was!!
sauiai 1 year ago
@sauiai hw champion of the world
johnosandra 1 year ago
lulz yo.no one cares!
LILGENTZ2 1 year ago
Buster Douglas could've been a Champion and a long time Contender if he was more disciplined
ErikS1975FreeState 1 year ago
two great world champions at heavyweight in their time .jason louis-fernand.
TheMakeover2010 1 year ago
wow look at how empty that place is
psyfexxx0420 1 year ago
@psyfexxx0420 Empty because it was the undercard to Tyson vs Bruno 1....this was like the second fight of the night.
fkudf 1 year ago
TYSON took DOUGLAS lightly, & thats why he lost
nevawrong 1 year ago
@nevawrong and don't forget buster lost his mother not long before that fight, that gave him something extra
meathookd 1 year ago
I think Tony Tucker won this one.
Wutangspam 1 year ago
Who the hell won this fight? Why put half a fight on YouTube you pinheads?
philandjoelle 1 year ago
@philandjoelle Berbick won
bcibibcibcpCB 1 year ago
@bcibibcibcpCB
Wtf douglas won?
403766 1 year ago
@philandjoelle
Douglas won.
403766 1 year ago
wheres the audience....
deonvan 1 year ago 10
@deonvan they went home to sleep
biroltapmaz1 1 year ago
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peroxidemonkey 1 year ago
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ManlnCognito 1 year ago
LOL..Dempsey? Sorry but he was to small, no defence, crude and unskilled. Lewis along with virtually all modern heavyweights would annihilate Dempsey or any fighter of his generation.
Your opinion of Lewis seems to differ from that of Manny Stewart, Angelo Dundee and many other respected boxing experts. Lewis fought and beat all the best fighters of his generation; he avenged both his losses proving they were flukes. what more could have been asked of him.
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito Y'know, funny thing. You ask me for an opinion and you ask me to respond without insults. Yet when you respond back to me you talk to me like I don't know shit about boxing, in turn, insulting me. Why don't you fucking try practicing what you preach son? I NEVER said I didn't like Lewis. I wish he was still champ. At least we had someone we could call a legit champ instead of the shit we have today.
bandit9874 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito And if you think Dempsey would have been easily beaten by ANY of today's shit pile of heavyweights you're a fucking moron. ANY so called boxing expert you talk to would have Dempsey cleaning out the division. Dempsey was one of the greatest punchers in history. At 6' and 195lbs he could out punch guys like Lewis easily. That's not to say Lewis wasn't a good fighter. As far as I'm concerned, unless you know how to express an opinion without insulting me, this conversation is over.
bandit9874 1 year ago
Then you're easily insulted that's all I can say, had no idea you guys were so sensitive
Boxing has evolved since the days of Dempsey, Louis and Marciano.
Search them on YouTube. Dempsey to me looked like a some drunk fair ground boxer. Swinging widely and off balance...he'd be open to counters....there no way 6 ft 195 lb Dempsey could beat 6 ft. 5 230 lb Lewis.
Lewis would put him to sleep inside of one round.
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito Think what you want. I wouldn't have been insulted if you hadn't asked ME not to insult, then turn around and do so yourself. Kind of a prick move don't you think? Besides, I don't really care if you don't agree with me. YOU asked my opinion, I didn't ask yours. So think what you want. Those in the know know better. And Dempsey wasn't as easy to hit in his prime as you make him out to be. He practically invented the bob and weave and in his prime was a vicious savage in the ring.
bandit9874 1 year ago
I insulted you by disagreeing with you? wow..dude you need to get out more.
Dempsey would have been able to cut it in today's cruiserweight division.
Now, I don't want to upset you any more...you're obviously one of those sensitive types. So I'll wish you all the best.
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito No dumb ass. You insulted me by implying I didn't know anything about boxing, and wrongfully implying that I didn't like Lewis because I'm American, when infact I never said I didn't like Lewis. I simply stated I thought there were better heavyweights than himself. Too bad you're not smart enough to have a civil debate.
bandit9874 1 year ago
@bandit9874
By saying Jack Dempsey could beat Lennox Lewis you yourself confirmed that you don't know anything about boxing.
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
jack dempsey might well knock out lewis, lennox had a glass chin, dempsey destroyed willard(a monster).
consta4891 1 year ago
i agree, i think dempsey might ko lewis, lewis had very bad chin.
consta4891 1 year ago
Lewis didnt have a glass chin you moron. His chin held up prety well against tyson, Tue and many other big punchers.
He'd have killed Demsey inside of one round
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
moron? you are the only moron here, nobody support you because you are the only ignorant who know shit on boxing.
consta4891 1 year ago
I know more about boxing than you ever will you little cretin.
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
you are only a buffoon who insult people who say to you the truth.
lennox lewis had a glass chin, and you knoW nothing on boxing.
FACTS!!
GOOD-BYE, I DO NOT WANT TO LOSE MY TIME WITH 1 USELESS .
consta4891 1 year ago
If Lewis had a glass chin then how come known punchers like Tyson and Tue couldn't put him down? How come in over 40 fights he only went down twice?
More FACTS for you there you dumb fucker
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
FRANk BRUNO ALMOST KNOCKED OUT LEWIS, RAHMAN KNOCKED OUT LEWIS, OLIVER MCCALL KNOCKED OUT LEWIS.
THE TYSON WHO FACED LEWIS WAS A GARBAGE, PRIME TYSON WOULD KO LEWIS, TUA IS SLOW. THE HEART OF LEWIS HELD UP HIM SOME TIMES, NOT HIS CHIN!! heart is not chin!! bye!!!
consta4891 1 year ago 3
Frank Bruno was a known puncher who rocked a prime Tyson. and he never came close to stoppong Lewis. Both Lewis's losses were avenged in spectacular style.
The Lewis who faced Tyson was also past his best. He was 38, the same age Tyson was when he quite against that fat Irishman.
Buster Douglas beat Tyson in his prime, Lewis was twice times the fighter Douglas was. Lewis would have beat Tyson at anytime in his career.
Who did Tyson ever beat that was as good as Lewis?
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
tyson in his prime? when fought douglas? lol
i am talking on his chin, not on the rematch , you are 1 stupid fanboy.
i am sorry but you are pathetic, you know shit on boxing haha.
consta4891 1 year ago
I see you couldn't answer a simple question like that. Prove me wrong, lets talk boxing and cut out the insults.
On what do you base your assertion that Tyson would have beat Lewis
Yes Tyson was in his prime when he fought Douglas, or are you saying Tyson was washed up at 23?
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
the age is not important.tyson was not the same boxer mentally, like foreman against jimmy young, he was good physically, but mentally he was very bad, i tis very important.
and lennox had better past prime than tyson.
how hell can you say, lewis would destroy dempsey in 1 round?
you ara a blind fanatic, i am not fan of tyson, but i say the truth, i think mike tyson 86-88( team kevin rooney), would win lewis.
consta4891 1 year ago
How do you know what state of mind Tyson was in before the Douglass fight? he weighed in at his normal fighting weight of 220. There was nothing to suggest that Tyson was in anything other than his peak fighting condition. Great fighters stay focussed, if Tyson couldn't do that then that marks him down as a fighter.
Tyson 86-88 who did he beat?
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
I can say Lewis would destroy Dempsey because Lewis was bigger and has superior boxing skills than Dempsey.
Boxing has evolved since the time of Jack Dempsey. I'm About the same size as Dempsey, 6ft.1 195 lbs...I've seen Lewis up close and got his autograph and compeered to me the guy was huge
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
This debate has not end , I do not agree with you in anything.
Regards
consta4891 1 year ago
The debate ends when one of us cannot come back with a reasoned response or offer any facts to back up their argument.
The debate has ended
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito Look, EVERYBODY that knows boxing knows the Tyson that Douglas beat was not the same. Even the Tyson that beat Frank Bruno wasn't the same. Rooney was out by then and Mike wasn't training. It was reported even back then that he was skipping out of training. And the head movement was gone even against Bruno in '89. Also gone was the combo punching. There is no way in hell Lewis would have beaten The same Tyson that beat Berbick in '86 or Tyrell Biggs. That's just a fact.
bandit9874 1 year ago 12
Again how can you possibly know that? If Tyson had beat guys who were as good or better than Lewis I could understand.
Even with Rooney in his corner Tyson struggled against some pretty limited fighters. Guys like Tilles, Mitch Green. James Smith and Josie Rabalta. In all those fights Tyson stopped moving his head, using his jab and combinations after the sixth round.
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito You are correct in those cases. (except Greene) Tyson beat Greene easily. After the Tillis fight where he was nervous about going 10 rounds he held back a little. In the Greene fight he showed a lot of maturity by sticking to the body and never losiong his cool.) Bonecrusher, he held the entire fight just looking to survive. Easy win for Tyson. I doubt Lewis would have done that. Either one of us would be speculating, but prime against prime I'm sticking with Mike.
bandit9874 1 year ago
You are entitled to your opinion but for me even in his prime Tyson was a different fighter after the sixth round. he had to take them out early. Lewis would not have folded early, and had the speed and power to take Tyson out.
Lewis and Tyson were both past their primes when they fought each other. but seriously, the fight wasn't even close. Tyson's people should have pulled Tyson out after the sixth round, the fight was that one sided.
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito Lewis obviously had the better career. I like Lewis and wish he was still champ. But if you're going to base your opinion on "who did Mike beat that was as good as Lewis" you could EASILY reverse that question. Lewis NEVER beat anyone of the same caliber as Mike. Holyfield? VERY unimpressive in both fights. All I'm saying is you can't use Douglas as an example. Mike's mental state was shot by then and EVERYBODY knows that. Mike's prime was short but spectacular. Lewis, longevity
bandit9874 1 year ago
Lewis is one of the few fighters who can honestly say beat all the best fighters of their era...and avenged all his losses. When he retired there was no loose ends if you like to clear up.
Tyson's reign lasted just two and a half years and left to many question marks. fighters have to be judged on what they actually accomplished or didn't accomplish...not what might have happened if they had made different decisions
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito = nicely put amigo.. lewis's legacy WAAAY more than tyson's
elainesman 1 year ago
this poor guy is a blind fan of lewis, ali 66 would play with lewis, holmes would play with lewis, foreman 73 would ko lewis, prime tyson would ko lewis,
consta4891 1 year ago
@consta4891 I think Lewis was OK too. But fact is he just didn't have a chin. And as quick and strong as Mike was in his prime, not to mention those combos, there's no way he wouldn't have gotten to Lewis' chin, even if it was later in the fight.
bandit9874 1 year ago
i told him, lewis had bad chin, and dempsey might well ko lewis,
consta4891 1 year ago
@consta4891 Dempsey? Forgetaboutit.... There's no way in hell Lewis could have stood the pressure of someone like Dempsey. People that say shit like "boxing has evolved since those days" fail to realize that boxing, in one form or another, has ALWAYS been around. It's widely believed in the boxing community that guys back then, 190, 200lbs, were stronger than today's heavyweights. There's not a heavyweight alive today that would beat a prime Dempsey...
bandit9874 1 year ago
i think only prime ali, prime foreman,prime holmes and prime frazier (maybe tyson) would win dempsey. dempsey would give the hell to any boxer.
consta4891 1 year ago
he destroyed a monster like jess willard!!!
willard was like lewis in height and weight.
consta4891 1 year ago
@consta4891 Yeah, but don't say that out loud. I love Dempsey and what he did to Willard was impressive, considering nobody else even handled him that way. But Willard wasn't as good as Lewis. Willard won the title, took 1 easy defense, then tucked the belt under his arm and went home to Kansas where he sat on the crown for 3 years. But the way Dempsey took Willard out was nothing short of awesome. broke his jaw, knocked out teeth, broke his nose. Total destruction. Lewis couldn't handle that.
bandit9874 1 year ago
you are very wrong, when you are 185 pounds and your rival is 240 pounds it is ALWAYS DANGEROUS
consta4891 1 year ago
@consta4891 uuuuuuuuh, I don't see how that comment applies to anything I said. I never said anything about boxing not being dangerous. My last comment simply said Lennox Lewis was a better fighter than Jess Willard. So what could I have been wrong about and how did I imply boxing wasn't dangerous??? lolol.... I think you might have responded to the wrong person on this one...
bandit9874 1 year ago
@bandit9874 = bullshine chap. I suggest you reference on this site '' lewis iron jaw'' or similar. the shots this man took in his career and came back...jeez. if you had an open mind you would reavaluate your opinion.
elainesman 1 year ago
@elainesman look son, don't get on hear and start insulting me just because you don't agree with me. And I ain't your fucking chap. If you don't agree, just say you don't agree. Don't start this shit about me having or not having an open mind. State your fucking point and move the fuck out. son
bandit9874 1 year ago
When you put conditioning into the equation, considering that the Manassa Mauler frequently got away with not being in the greatest shape and considering the effectiveness of Lewis' jab, what makes you think even that a great albeit small heavyweight like Dempsey would a chance of getting to Lewis with the way Lewis handled Tua?
mowglee09 1 year ago
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consta4891 1 year ago
@mowglee09 I think Tua had a rib injury and couldn't slip or move effectively. It also affected the rotation of his body so he didn't put punches together.
capablemachine 1 year ago
@bandit9874 I think It would had been a much interesting fight...
lemmor6791civ 11 months ago
@bandit9874 Sure Tyson was past it when he fought Lewis. But lets get real, who did Tyson ever beat? You go on that the Tyson that beat Berbick and Biggs would have killed Lewis like they were great fighters. Biggs or Berbick can't be compared to Lewis. Lewis PLAYED with Tyson in 2002. He COULD have KO'd him in 2 or 3 rounds as Steward was screaming at him to do but Lewis wanted to punish him for biting him at the press conference. Lewis whupped him like he was his Daddy!
lennoxmate 11 months ago
@bandit9874 Also Tyson fans want us to believe he was shot at 22 years of age. Sure he wasn't the same technically but he WAS in shape. Tyson's weight was always consistently between 218-221 pounds. He had no excess on him. Yes the head movement was gone and he didn't hit in combos as often but his performances got worse as the opposition got tougher. Tyson always struggled against a tall guy with decent power and wasn't afraid of him. That was the key: NO FEAR.
lennoxmate 11 months ago
@bandit9874 Tyson wasn't great because of WHO he beat, it was HOW he beat them. He was exciting. Tyson needed to show SOMETHING against Lewis in order for me to say that when he was at his best he would have won. He showed NOTHING. Lets all get real though. Lewis AND Tyson were great. Tyson rulled in a weak era but we NEEDED him at the time to clear out the fat men and drug addicts and he did that in style. Lewis ruled in a tougher era and wasn't as exciting but we needed a unified champ again.
lennoxmate 11 months ago
@lennoxmate I ain't getting into the whole payoff thing again. I've talked about that time and time again. Fact is prime against prime Tyson was a much better fighter. Mentally Tyson didn't have what it takes to remain on top, but Tyson in 87 or 88 would have stopped Lewis, no doubt. I'm done with this talk.
bandit9874 11 months ago
@bandit9874 You wont get into it? You're done with this talk? I've touched a nerve there! You talk words like FACT to back up your arguments. There is no fact, there is only speculation. The FACT here though is that Tyson paid Lewis Millions NOT to fight him and gave up his title to fight Seldon. Lewis had Don King keeping him out of the title picture and didn't want Lewis anywhere near Tyson. Tyson listened to King and was made to look bad. I will continue this conversation . . . I aint afraid!
lennoxmate 11 months ago
@lennoxmate Hey smart guy, I've already had this discussion several times on this same video. How stupid is it to keep harping on the same shit over and over and over again? Boxing fans understand why Don King paid Lewis to step aside. Don King paid Lewis, Not Tyson. Tyson/Holyfield, which was the fight everyone really wanted at the time, not Lewis, was at hand, and for all intents and purposes King KNEW at that point in his career Lewis would beat Tyson. That would have ruined Holyfield/Tyson
bandit9874 10 months ago
@bandit9874 You can't rate Tyson as an all beating God with his resume and most certainly not over a career specialist like Lewis, Ali or Louis. Tyson had an average amateur career & yes the first few years of his career were amazing I'm a fan of Lewis & Tyson & was an awed 10 year old when he beat Berbick but a 3 year reign & an 8 month reign wont convince me of anything different. Tyson WAS great but when the opposition got tougher he faded away. Tillis with more belief could have beaten him.
lennoxmate 10 months ago
@lennoxmate 2) Now what's being afraid got to do with anything? That's just fucking stupid. I just didn't feel like repeating the same fucking thing over and over to you just because you're too fucking lazy to read older comments I've made about the same fucking topic. Wasn't about Tyson being afraid. It was about him taking the right fight at the right time. EVERY big name fighter on the planet does that. Even Lewis. Prime against prime Tyson wipes the floor with Lewis. fact.
bandit9874 10 months ago
@bandit9874 The best fighters always take on the best fighters. Tyson had 7 years to get hold of Lewis when he came out of prison. Lewis was his number 1 contender. Tyson chose to avoid Lewis every chance he got and then when he needs a payday he agrees to it. Tyson obviously wasn't as confident about his chances v Lewis as you. Tyson AVOIDED Lewis and then when he lost you cry he was shot?! Who's fault is that? That is one fucking retarded comment. . . .
lennoxmate 10 months ago
@bandit9874 Also for one last time, saying Fact at the end of your opinion doesn't make it true. Do you have a time machine? Have you watched a prime Lewis v Prime Tyson? We all have opinions on here and thats all. None of us are that important. In my opinioin Lewis beats Tyson due to quality of opposition and mental fortitude but I can't claim it as fact. So "smart guy" take your head out of your arse and stop talking like your Bert Sugar, cos' you aint. . . .FACT!
lennoxmate 10 months ago
@bandit9874 Also remember that Tyson AND Bowe gave up their belts rather than face Lewis. Tyson DESTROYED Bruno in 96. Tyson could have took Lewis on then but gave up the title AND paid Lewis. Larry Merchant once pointed out that Lewis was responsible for the most shameful era in American Heavyweight history as Foreman, Bowe, Tyson, Moorer and Holyfield all found excuses not to fight him. When THAT many men avoid ONE fighter like that you have to ask WHY?
lennoxmate 11 months ago 2
@bandit9874 For that fact, a prime Iron Mike would have beatin ANY BOXER in history.
whiteknight040879 8 months ago
@whiteknight040879 I wouldn't go that far, but it should be noted when he was in his prime people were crazy about the man. It's easy to point to the poor performances once his career turned to a circus side show. But in his prime Mike was something special and who knows what he would have been capable of had he maintained his composure throughout his career.
bandit9874 8 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@bandit9874 i would,,,, just my opinon.
whiteknight040879 8 months ago
@bandit9874
quit making excuses .... tyson lost against buster.... holyfield knocked buster.... tyson lost to holyfield do your math tyson was great but not greater than the above
blackoil911 7 months ago
@blackoil911 1.ALI 2.Tyson 3.Louis 4.Johnson 5.Forman 6.Lewis 7.Holmes 8.Holyfield 9.Frazier 10.Vit.Klitchko
MrKilluminati248 7 months ago
@blackoil911 who are you and why are you even getting involved? Great. You have an opinion. Good for you.
bandit9874 7 months ago
@bandit9874 Tyson was never the same after douglas............
TWO4EBERling 6 months ago
@TWO4EBERling It's because he was exposed by Douglas. Tyson's true mettle comes from the fact that he never once beat the count, except for the Lewis fight when he was almost on his knees, and Lewis knocked him out for good seconds later.
stevetheowl12 3 months ago
@stevetheowl12 Not true, Tyson was knocked down in the first Holyfield fight as well, and got back up.
TheBestBoxingGame 2 months ago
@TheBestBoxingGame My apologies. I forgot about that one. I know that he did get knocked down in that one and didn't get up, but I forgot about the knock down in the 6th round.
stevetheowl12 2 months ago
@bandit9874
I'm starting to have random vague doubts about rooney's importance, at least with regard to Tyson's decline. Tyson did pretty well for a spell after he was gone. The truth is, once he was champ I don't think anyone could really control him, and he pretty much knew how to train. His real problem was women. Yes, he underestimated Douglas. But he skipped out of training to bang japanese chicks is what I heard, and he certainly had more women problems after that.
tommygumport 6 months ago
@tommygumport Rooney was vital to Tyson's success because he was the direct link to Dmato's teachings that made Tyson so effective. Rooney was also outspoken and he'd tell it like it was. If Mike Looked like shyt or needed to repeat a training exercise, Rooney wasn't afraid to yell at Mike and make him do it. It wasnt about Mike Tyson the bigger than life entity with Rooney. It was about keeping Cus' training methods instilled in Mike at any cost.
CanvassBlack 4 months ago
@bandit9874 how is it a fact you retard......
shneew 4 months ago
@bandit9874
It's not a fact. You know why? Because you can't prove something subjective. It is merely your opinion. Its good to know Tyson nuthuggers are still out in full force. The guy never lost a fight according to people like you. 50 wins and six asterisks.
cbaldwinjr 4 months ago
@cbaldwinjr Eight asterisks according to them. I've never seen so many excuses. It's simple: Tyson was a bully, and bullies always lose when they get exposed.
stevetheowl12 3 months ago
@bandit9874 Thats an opinion. Its never been proven. I think Lennox would have handled Tyson at any point. Lewis is the king of this era. Plain and simple
ah93704 3 months ago
@ManlnCognito Larry Holmes was better tham Lennox, so was 35-0 Tony Tucker before he got on drugs, 31-0 MichealSpinks would have had a shot against lennox, and a prime Tyson would have made Lennox look much worse than Rahman, Mcall or klitchkow made him look lewis was slow had a glass jaw and hugged the whole fight, When Douglas beat Tyson he was in great shape and fought a great fight dnt believe me watch it lennox would have lost to him that night as well
whitedeviltx 1 year ago
@whitedeviltx First off Lennox Beat Tucker way more convincingly than Tyson did. Spinks? LOL no chance Spinks was just a Light Heavy. I’ll give you Holmes but Tyson? No way. Tyson has to be the most over rated fighter in history and Douglas was a bum. Lewis would have KO’d him in three.
You obviously dont know anything about boxing kid..lol
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito I honestly think Lennox was way overrated, he beat mostly washed up fighters Tony tucker was addicted to cocaine when he fought Lewis Tyson visibly wasnt the same anymore Rahman an Mccall were nobodys Spinks beat holmes twice and kod gerry cooney as a heavy so he must have been okwhat good young fighter did lennox ever beat
whitedeviltx 1 year ago
@whitedeviltx Lewis fought and beat every good fighter of his era. He beat Tyson when he was 38. Holyfield, Morrison, Tue, Bruno, Ray Mercer, Vitali Klitscho, McCall, Rahman, Ruddock.
A three time heavyweight Champ and Olympic gold medallist. Retired at the top and avenged both his losses. Lennox Lewis in top three heavyweights of all time
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito I think its funny you put vitali on the list he was dominating lennox and only lost because of a referee stoppage, mercer had a good chin but couldnt hurt anybody, Tua only had one good hand his left is and was garbage, the holyfield fights were suspect at best if you like hugging those were great, Rahman and Mccall were bums who else of note has either of them beat, bruno and ruddock were solid not great, the only impressive win of all theese in my mind is morrison
whitedeviltx 1 year ago
@whitedeviltx Tony Tucker was very talented but never performed as a pro really. There was the Douglas fight where he was unimpressive. Douglas was way ahead and then just quit., Tucker hurt Tyson early but injured his hand and showed no ambition after. Tucker could have been very good but never showed the fire as a pro. No chance against prime Lewis.
Holmes? Holmes, the 77-82 version would have had a very good chance of beating Lewis. In my opinion Lewis wins but its a tough one to call.
lennoxmate 10 months ago
@whitedeviltx Lewis should easily beat Douglas really. Lewis was taller and bigger. Douglas was a little quicker but Lewis had a better jab, defence, technique, far superior punching power and WAY more heart. I struggle to see Douglas lasting more than 5 rounds v Lewis to be honest.
lennoxmate 10 months ago
You know nothing about boxing
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
Is obvious that you are a warrior of the keyboard without social life, you live to answer, you think that if you say the last word you know on boxing, the people does not answer you because this is = to lose the time, you are a simpleton.
consta4891 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@ManlnCognito lol. So why are you erasing all your comments about fucking children? lol... Don't want the rest of the world to see you're just as sick as I am? lolol. Hey, we're becoming friends it seems. I think tonight I'm gonna fuck your old lady. I think it's time. I've been banging your kids long enough. It's time I give the old bitch a go at it. See you tonight chump...
bandit9874 1 year ago 4
@ManlnCognito Name one good fighter he beat who wasnt a bum on drugs or way past his prime
whitedeviltx 1 year ago
@whitedeviltx I’ve just given you several but you not interested because you dont like Lewis. Who is your favourite Heavyweight? Holmes? Only beat an old Ali. Tyson? Never beat any great fighters in their prime and lost every real war he was in.
Lewis had everything, size, speed, power, Jab...one of the best heavyweights of all time
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito funny you mention sparring partners, Mike Tysons used to have a sparring partner named Oliver mccall who knocked out Lennox
whitedeviltx 1 year ago
@whitedeviltx The same Oliver McCall that Lewis knocked out in the rematch proving the first fight a fluke.
Show me one of Tyson’s losses that he avenged
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
Douglas was a fighter who had a lot of potential but wasted it with laziness and gluttony.. but he got motivated when he needed it in Tokyo... and came out with $30M..
KamRooks 1 year ago
Ali thought Tyson was a good fight, Sugar Ray Leonard thought Tyson was a good fighter, that's all that needs to be said.
capablemachine 1 year ago
pourquoi la salle est si vide ?? deux aussi grand champion de la boxe !! trevor berbick met fin a la carriere de ali et douglas met tyson ko !! i don't understand !!! respect trevor and buster !!!
TheBrancardier 2 years ago
tyson destroyed average fighters and most were ex champs which is far from average. Only problem with tyson he was his own worst enemy, he surrounded himself with nobs which doesnt do you any favours. To be the best of all time means you have to be in shape even when your on a break. Look at holyfield and lewis, i love tyson, but most great fighters fade after being champ for more than 3 years whilst taking on all comers. Tyson was defo great.
mazbalboa 2 years ago
Tyson lost every real battle he was in and beat no great fighters in or out of his prime.
Tyson was good but not great
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
lmao look at all the empty seats
561buRnz407 2 years ago
was this fight in a barn at a county fair?
ezfla 2 years ago
Yet another Vegas snoozer--won by James "Buster" Douglas, by the bobo. 10 round UD.
lumpagogo 2 years ago
wot a load of bollocks lad tyson kod tilman in a round and had no trouble with ribalta apart from him gettin up off each knockdown. D'amato wasnt even around when he fought tilman. Tyson is a legend get over it!
liverpollfc72 2 years ago
Tyson was average at best
ManlnCognito 2 years ago
Don't talk siht you fool, Tyson was top ten of all time but just wasn't as good as guys like Ali and Holmes. No need to call him average.
Boxinglad123 2 years ago
In my opinion a fighter is as good as the fighters he beats.Tyson only ever beat average fighters. so in my opinion he was average
However, I would put him about sixth of the all time best heavyweights
ManlnCognito 2 years ago
So if he was average then how does he get up there in your books? That is like saying that because Trevor Berbick beat Ali then he is better than him or that because McBride beat Tyson that he is better than him or that because Rahman beat Lewis then he is better....
Boxinglad123 2 years ago
Great fighters win great fights, Tyson never managed that. He lost every real war he found himself in.
Great fighters beat all the best fighters of their generation. Tyson never managed to do that either. He got annihilated in his prime by Buster Douglas. a loss he never avenged....in fact Tyson didn't avenge any of his losses.
Great fighters go out fighting, in his last two fights Tyson sat on his ass and quite.
Need I go on?
ManlnCognito 2 years ago
I know what you are saying but then why do you rank him 6th?
Boxinglad123 2 years ago
I rank him sixth behind Ali, Holmes, Lewis, Foreman, Frazier. But to be honest I would struggle to call it between Tyson, Liston and Kitchko
I don't think other earlier heavyweights like Rocky Maciano or Joe Louise were big enough to compete with the bigger guys from Liston onwards
ManlnCognito 2 years ago
@ManlnCognito Pfft Glass jawed Lewis in front of Foreman and Frazier? I don't remember Foreman or Frazier ever going down to one punch and staying down.
capablemachine 1 year ago
Foreman went down to Ali and stayed down, Foreman put Frazier down six times....but all that is irrelevant.
Lewis was an Olympic gold medallist and three time heavyweight champion. He fought and beat all the best fighters of his generation and avenged both his losses in devastating style.
Lewis was second only to Ali.
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito Foreman didn't stay down he was up by 9 but could not continue from exhaustion. He wasn't lying down seeing stars because he got hit on the button. Devastating style? So Oliver McCall having an emotional breakdown in the ring and barely any punches thrown is a devestating revenge fight? What nonsense.
capablemachine 1 year ago
Good but not great.
Tyson paid Lennox Lewis four million dollars to stand aside so he could face Bruce Seldon instead. Shows that Tyson wasn't as stupid as he looked. He knew he could never beat Lennox Lewis in a million years.
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
ur crazy!! Tyson in his prime would of Kod Lewis and Lewis knows that as well.
Miggy617 1 year ago
@Miggy617
Tyson in his prime couldnt beat Buster Douglas, Lewis was twice the fighter Douglas was.
Tyson also ducked Lewis for years, he even paid Lewis four million dollars step aside money so he could fight Brice Seldon instead. That is a fact Tyson has admitted.
Who did Tyson ever beat that was as good as Lewis?
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito First off Tyson was not in his right state of mind throughout the whole training prior to his fight with Douglas. He didnt take the fight serious and his sparring partner floored him. Tyson was out partying, drinking and fuckn many woman. No excuses but alot of things was going wrong for him before this fight. Robin Givens divorce,Rape case, Don KIng, Cuss dieing. Watch the fight Mike didnt even look himself.Buster was down more than 10 seconds. Mike won that fight
Miggy617 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito uh, Tyson was going for the belt. Hard to blame him at the time. Business son. And you can't call the Tyson/Douglas fight a prime Tyson. Hell, even when he fought Bruno he was slipping. He had let Rooney go and much of the head movement that made him so elusive was already gone in the Bruno fight. Tyson wasn't Tyson the night he fought Douglas and you know it.
bandit9874 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito Lewis second only to Ali huh??? lol. That's funny. Lewis was good, but get real.
bandit9874 1 year ago
@bandit9874
Yes, that's my opinion.
Who do you think was better than Lennox and why? Try not just to result to insults, but explain why in a adult manner.
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
@ManlnCognito Well, to be honest, I think even Holyfield was better than Lewis. Lewis was in his prime when he faced Holyfield. Holyfield was past his. And many thought that Holyfield won their 2nd fight. I believe a prime Tyson would have beaten Lewis. A young Jack Dempsey would have put Lewis to sleep early as Lewis has a glass jaw and Dempsey was one of the hardest punchers ever. Joe Louis, 12 year title reign, need I say more? Foreman, though not the boxer Lewis was, would have gotten to him
bandit9874 1 year ago
Americans fight fans just don't like Lewis because he wasn't American...end of. Neither of his fights with Holyfield were even close he won both of then easily. His fight with Tyson was so one sided it should have been stopped after the sixth round. Any one who knows boxing cannot have anything other than respect for Lennox Lewis
ManlnCognito 1 year ago
I'm not a tyson nuthugger,I'm a realist and anyone who thinks that to beat the real tyson,these guys needed to face a damato trained tyson ,then we would see what would happen,not this one armed one punch bandit we saw after 1988.
fadethetrade 2 years ago
Listen. I agree Mike's best days were before the departure of Rooney. Unfortunately, Mike never faced any quality opponents with exception to a "washed up" Larry Holmes. It's well documented and even quietly admitted that the Tyson camped "ducked" George Foreman! The post prime Foreman would have overpowered the prime Tyson with no problems. As far as body work goes, Holyfield's great defense canceled out and discourage Mike's body attack. Ruddock? Was a "piss mop"! (Lewis, Morrison)LOL
MrScottydabody 2 years ago
I agree with your assessment to a point. Holmes 5 yrs later and older competed with a prime holyfield and 5 yrs earlier tyson totally dominated,chewed and spit out holmes quite easily I might say so myself.Holyfield looked like a struggler trying to beat holmes.Tyson won 10 rounds against Tucker who ko'd douglas 3 months earlier.This 87-88 tyson threw his shots differently,more instinctevely explosiver and ACCURATE ,then after 1988.I dont buy the holy defense,it was tysons lack of ability .
fadethetrade 2 years ago
Come on. You know that styles make fights. I think Holmes had turned over a new leaf when fought Holyfield. He accepted the fact that he wasn't a young man anymore and modified his style to suit his heavier body weight.....I say what you want to hear: I think would probably have over powered Holyfield in 1988. I don't know if the 1988 Tyson would have beaten the 1996 version of Holyfield. Remember Holyfield wasn't completely "filled out" until 1996.
MrScottydabody 2 years ago
@fadethetrade
A D'Amato trained Tyson struggled against Tillman and Rabalta. a D'Amato trained Tyson still was a one dimensional fighter with no plan b.
You are a Tyson nuthugger, I've had to enlighten you before
ManlnCognito 2 years ago
the night douglas beat tyson hed of beat lewis theres no dout he had it set to win and u cant take that 1nce som1s got that in there hed u see the holyfield fight he didnt care wat happened he wasnt even in shape
lee1990lee 2 years ago
bullshit.Tyson embarrassed himself not taking douglas serious like he did when he fought at the damato camp.This douglas was a good big class B fighter but tyson should have ko'd him like he ko'd tony tubbs in 2 or so.Tubbs was no worse then douglas.Compare their careers.Aside from the sleeping tokyo tyson,douglas looked mediocre in most all his fights in his career and he got ko'd by Tony Tucker and he WAS in great shape for THAT fight also.
fadethetrade 2 years ago
The same tyson that walked into tokyo to fight douglas would have lost to Tillis and Tucker the same night. Douglas was very motivated and in shape but tyson beat tyson.not douglas.Tyson didnt throw one jab in that fight and didnt punch out of one clinch in that fight. His skill was claearly diminished by over 70% of what he was from 86-88.DOuglas did fight a blueprint on how to fight a tyson style but not with a tyson fighting at less then 50% of what he did 2 yrs earlier.
fadethetrade 2 years ago
i agree with u there asoon as tyson left rooney he turned to a washed up tyson id personaly say jus had the hard punch that he frew 1 a time but how i see it douglas punched loadz in every round and his chin showed good this night so i think hed out punch lewis easy and bruno nerly had lewis so douglas wood of id say
lee1990lee 2 years ago
i think lewis vs douglas would look alot like.. lewis vs ruddock.
bhan27 2 years ago
when was this?
Paunasnalgas 2 years ago
I think buster was one of the great and underated fighters in boxing history, he had no technical flaws, great jab, great streight right, great defensive skills, punched in combinations good head movement and a descent chin...i hate it when people say it was a fluke he beat tyson and that tyson wasnt mentally fit to fight at the time, douglases mother had just died weeks prior to the fight so he had it hard too but nobody considers that, he's just a better boxer than tyson and that sums it up.
dirtyjew1974 2 years ago
wrong.douglas was in beast shape vs tyson.on the other side tyson was only doing half of the training he did with rooney.
vegetayy 2 years ago
but didnt tyson fire rooney a few years before that fight like 88 or so? and still tyson beat everyone up untill douglas. I think douglas just had the right style and motivation to beat tyson, plus he wasnt afraid to bring the fight to him and tyson usually falters under pressure.
dirtyjew1974 2 years ago