The campaign with Obama, setting up fake investigations of banking elite and making people feel revenge (even tho this might be the plan of the "elite"), will NEVER resolve our problems.
The system will always produce bankers and lobbyist who will always have their actions justified or excused from their own point of view. I repeat. The system produces those people!
Watch the Zeitgeist Movement witch promotes consciousness and acknowledgement of these problems, and provides real solutions.
MoveOrg does more harm then good. They just orient the people with false actions and revenge.
We, the people don't want anybody to pay, because there is no wane guilty. The system is set up in a way that anyone's actions are justified or excused from their own point of view. It's that simple.
Instead, why not start an awareness campaign which recognizes these facts, the psychology and the corruptibility of the human spirit, so we can transform this system in to a better one.
Move on are not the only progressives that are disgruntled with the President, check out the audience response to Maxine Waters in the video titled "Rep. Waters To Black Voters - 'Unleash Us' On President Obama". All the dissatisfaction with the President from all corners of the spectrum inevitably raises the question are there no men of good character who will challenge him for the Democratic nomination?
Davis, your haircut makes your head look fatter then ever. please grew it back it's hard to look at. You look like another fat, bald, ignorant, blabbering mental patient. which, come to think of it, you are.
Why in the world would we ever need to cut social security? There are DOZENS of government agencies that are completely pointless. WTF is "the dept of homeland security"? Doesn't the dept of defense cover that? Cutting SS is a scare tactic to trick MORONS into supporting higher taxes.
I saw some asshole with a bumper sticker that said "If you don't stand behind our troops, feel free to stand in front of them". It was right next to the "Don't mess with Texas" and "Fuck Obama" stickers. It's amusing that asshole doesn't realize that Obama is more of a war whore than the last two combined.
@RavenMad101 what's *amusing* is that you really think that...the war criminals at Cheney/ Bush/ Rumsfeld, Inc STARTED the illegal wars and murders you fucking brain dead, Raving Mad moron, pull yer head outta yer ass before spewing non-sense next time asshole...also
"ncftTV": I had been registered w/Moveon.org prior to Obama coming on the scene (prior to the '08 elections), & when they began sending me emails pushing me to vote for him, I actually fowarded one back to them telling them (in short) how I was SOOO DISAPPOINTED in the fact that they hadn't done substantial research on him, and canceled my subscription (to their emails)! Btw, you ROCK!!!
Yeah the US isn't run by the pres duh it's run by the wealthy corps it's a plutocracy not a democracy. sure the dems are a disappointment but obama is not worse than bush there is no way, as i said the pres isn't the real power but the US sunk lower during those bush yrs than ever before, in the US you have little choice dems who won't do and repugs who are actively rotten u tink it's better going with the rotten?+ no accountability for bush or any of his gang so don't expect accountability.
Notice that MoveOn didn't say they wouldn't vote for Obama, just not send any money on his campaign. Obama will get plenty of cash from bankers, corporations, health insurance companies, and Wall Street. He's not worried. Does either major party need the people any more to survive?
Who opposed healthcare for uninsured children? LOL I'm pretty sure that was a rider put into a bill denying healthcare for all others. I love how this game is played... The right puts in one philanthropic rider into a bill that simply advances the interests of big business and the top 1%'ers at the cost of health/income to the other 99% of us. That way they have a nice talking point when it get's turned down by the left, because they know righties only use T.P.s for their opinions anyway.
WHY NOT BUSH AND HIS ADMINISTRATION HAS MURDERED MORE HUMANITY AND KILLED AND BOMBED MORE MEN WOMEN AND CHILDREN THAN ANY OTHER PRESENT DAY PRESIDENT OF USA ..ANOTHER TEABAGGER SPREADING HATE FEAR AND LIES..THE ONLY THING YOU AND YOUR PARTY DOES
Many thought it, too many refused to believe it. Some figured that the first black president wouldn't sell out like a rapper hocking dish soap but sadly he was bought, paid for, and groomed long before.
I roflol when I see the same free-market fundamentalists attacking NAFTA, globalization, and free trade, while complaining about market and industry regulation. How is that de-regulation treating your 401k and home equity. Probably as good as the fishing off the coast of west Florida.
The way I see it, whoever wins next year, depending on if you like Obama or not, the dude is going to win. Let's face it, the Republicans have no ideas and all they want to say is Obama is a one term president. Why couldnt people vote for Hillary Clinton in 2008, so that the country could have Bill Clinton back into the White House? Instead, America took a choice by electing a freshman senator to become president, and oh btw, they wanted to see a black man become leader of the free world.
We have to make sure that barack obama is tried for his crimes against humanity. He has killed and bombed countless man, women and children. He must be tried.
@lagskater98 really, don't you think you should start with the war criminals at Bush/ Cheney/ Rumsfeld, Inc first, since they;re the ones who started the illegal wars and all...try thinking before you write all the stupid shit that appears in your mentally retarded brain ya fucking moron
@lagskater98 not before we try both bush and cheney, and rumsfeld, and wolfowitz, and rice, and all those nuttier-than-batshit neocons that my fellow soldiers into the mess that is "the war on (fake-ass) terror".
@ncftTV Hey Dennis glad your posting vids again. Thank god you mean people finally actually seeing that is no diffrence from the Dems and the Repubs. (I've been saying that since '96) Now if we could only challenge that anger into a meaningful movt we could move the 2 headed beast into extinction.
I never thought anyone could screw up as badly as bush but obviously I was very wrong on that assumption. Now with this new election coming up the only real choice would be for Ron Paul but I've noticed many stations must not even know of his existence much less that the man is the clear choice for Pres. When the chips fall a year from now you'll always know that it's the PRESS who chooses the President and NOT YOU! I'll vote for you D.T. no problem just legalize Cannabis please do that first.
It would be a dream if Barack and Which ever bum fuck Republican did not win the next election.
I don't want a weak democrat, who gives and gives to Republicans, I don't ever want a Delusional republican who thinks burdens are only for the poor and middle class.
If a fighter was elected for the left. That would make my day... honestly...
I would love it if Barack Obama would just step down... But the smug bastard thinks that he can win. He's a republican light. Who thinks we have no choice.
@deeabl0 bro we are all war criminals.... that's OUR money they are using to train people to kill and supply them with the weapons to do so ... and we all repeat the "support our troops" mantra like the good drone monkeys we are ... if bush and obama could somehow take the rap for our sins they would become self sacrificing heroes in a perverted way... but they can't blood is on all of our hands... but I can record videos for facebook on my iPhone 4G so who cares right? ;)
It's so sad when partisan allegiances clouds the issues so very much that individuals fail to see what very little difference there is between Republicans and Democrats...bring on the viable 3rd party options!
"CIA spy" Davis was giving nuclear bomb material to Al-Qaeda
Double murder-accused US official Raymond Davis has been found in possession of top-secret CIA documents pointing to the American Task Force 373 (TF373) providing Al-Qaeda terrorists with “nuclear fissile material” and “biological agents," including a nuclear "dirty bomb."
U.S. 4-star General Wesley Clark (Ret.), explains that the Bush Administration planned to take out 7 countries in 5 years: Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Iran (2007 up to 2012)
youtube. com/watch?v=bX7hMj2NKTc
youtube. com/watch?v=lpBAC9dPr-o
"Japan’s government, threatened with more HAARP attacks, pays 60 trillion yen to Feds"
LOL... you wish you were a celebrity, but in a way you are, you are a non producing attention whore that only survives because of the forced labor of others.
YOU ARE THE PROBLEM, AND YOUR BABBLE IS NOT THE SOLUTION!
i don't get why people like you are against the bipartisan party system? Would you rather have one party, that dictates everything you do with no others contradicting or questioning that party? O thats called the Nazi party and fascism. Dumbass, the bipartisan party system is what makes this country succeed better than others.
In Denmark we currently have 8 parties to choose from
so I would recon going to the voting booth in US must feel like choosing one dentist out of the two operating in your country where neither believes in pain reducing remedies and tends to find holes that really didn't exist in the first place or were artificially created by the other dentist.
No matter what it's gonna hurt like hell and cost you an eternity.
I probably will end up not voting.. I refuse to give my vote to some one who enables psychopaths while maintaining an admin no better than the previous one.. I doubt there will be any other decent options.
Obama being nearly as awful as Bush was a wakeup call for most people I know.
I didn't have anyone to vote for in the last Presidential election, so I didn't vote. I won't have anyone to vote for this time around unless there is a third party or Dem challenger. We have to make this happen or this country will die.
Shaved head = kickass non-partisan anarchist (the coolest, most controversial word I thought of). Either side, politicians are the gate-keepers of the Haves.
I just read a Huffington Post article where the author made the case that everything that people disliked W. for, then hoped those would be changed.
Barrack from that same list has not changed a damn thing. So fine if your going to vote for him if you think your group wins, but don't you dare think your doing it for saving lives, for freedom, not giving money to his masters.
Instead his solution was becoming "blue republicans" and throw your support...to Ron Paul...FROM THE HUFFINGTON POST
@StuffedAnimalAdvisor Ron Paul...the guy who will remove all regulations? The guy that will remove all worker protections? The guy that would kill healthcare and social security? That insane bag a douche?
@MrGreeneggsnham You're an idiot if you think worker protection laws are violence
I guess anything restraining the power of a corporate giant to ruin your life is violence against the poor poor underpowered underdog billionaires /roll eyes
I guess laws that say a boss can't sexually harrass you are just big government taking away your freedom to sexually exploit your employees
The south lost the civil war, I know you people are still butthurt from the loss, but get over it
Uh huh, the rich should have freedumb with no strings attached or laws that they're told to follow, nope, we can trust the BPs/Masseys/Exxons to continue to regulate themselves
Our laissez faire "regulators" have shown us how wonderfully benevolent our masters are when they aren't told to uphold safety standards
Closing down the BP rig massey mines, and exxon facilities would just be big brother stomping on the poor rich peoples throat, the environments a small sacrifice for their freedumb
@dffykvn America doesn't have laissez-faire. America has a federal code that comprises of over 1,000,000 pages of text. You don't even know what reality is. How many more pages of regulation until the U.S. is a utopia? 50,000? 60,000? 500,000?
@MrGreeneggsnham As for "statism is dead" maybe I missed the gulags, labor camps and death camps the last time I went to sweden
I'm sure the netherlands are hell on earth to idiots like you...you know a place where a mixed economy works
Or germany, which has the union workers RUNNING THEIR CORPORATIONS (Danger will robinson! Danger! commoonists ar gunna gitcha!) ...you know that failed state germany...which is bankrolling the EU
@dffykvn Socialism is the justification for public slavery.
I don't see how the least socialist country bailing out the more socialist countries is somehow a justification for the initation of force or even statism.
Statism is dead as a philosphy means there is no philosophical justification for statism. I never made the claim that gulags existed in Sweeden. Not sure the point of bringing it up?
@dffykvn The assumption is not that easy to disprove because one could move the "target" just enough to be painful. Just one example: does the trobriand on the Trobiand Island (yes, these guys near New Guinea that exchange Yam and Kula...) have a free market capitalist, a socialist system or just a traditional system that defy a bit the classical standard definition?
@therrydicule Germany: a country people are familiar with
Trobiand: Were they the guys that Gandalf and Aslan went to to help the children meet up with the hobbits en route to mordor? Or were they Doctor Who aliens?
@dffykvn Well, I took an example I am familiar with ;) The trobient are a population of 12,000 natives living on many small island, in a traditional matrilineal society, with an "economy" based on horticultural and fishing with a system of trade using yams and kula-ring as a form of currency, limited by strong religious rules including a believe in sorcery. Where does it fit in the modern debate on capitalism vs socialism? No where, I guess.
@therrydicule The only response that I can come up with is, "Ok?"
I just think that was slightly less of a non sequitor than brining up the mating habits of south western barnswallows carrying coconuts (I'm pretty sure I got that KOTHG line right)
@dffykvn I understand the "ok?", I would even understand the "wtf dude?". My point was more that it is not that easy, in real life, to say if one particular economy is being socialist or capitalism... They could be some element similar to one economic theory, even many... But, really, it's more of a "tailor fit" situation than a "one size fit all" when it came to the description of a particular economic system, or what it should be.
@dffykvn The chainsaw is to be used when thing get really desperate, like in the 70's or the 30's... That's not the case in USA, today. O.k, they are going in a way where it might get desperate in 30 years from now, but there is some time to avoid that. There is only a few thing I would use radical cutting like the military, the war on drugs, some subsidies in energy, homeland security... This ain't the cold war anymore, that cash could be used to build road or to educated people...
@MrGreeneggsnham Understand reality? The guy talking about regulations like they matter?
Why would regulations matter when laissez faire ideologues are allowed to staff regulatory positions with other laissez faire ideologues to make sure none of its unenforced
The people who cheer the loudest for free markets are the billionaires who make bank off of the dopes that have the misguided belief that a free-er market with less govt intervention is freedon for anyone other than the wealthy
@dffykvn Name a "laissez faire ideologue" that holds a regulatory position. Name one.
The people who cheer the loudest for free markets work for think tanks like the mises instutute and CATO institute.
Large corporations typically lobby for more regulations to create barriers to entry and prevent free market competition. You get to be large and influental then use the state to keep small business from competing.
@dffykvn Who the fuck is Gramm? Lindsey GRAHAM? If you think Lindsey Graham is an example of a "laissez faire ideologue" then you really don't understand the term.
Enron comitted fraud which has been illegal since the country was founded. Fraud is just a form of theft.
Virginia isn't laissez faire either. You don't understand the term.
Business are not allowed to regulate themselves. The government regulates everything, except the internet. Which works fine.
He also inserted a key provision into the 2000 Commodity Futures Modernization Act that exempted over-the-counter derivatives like credit-default swaps from regulation by the Commodity Futures Trading Commission
Credit default swaps...you know...those little things that blew up the fucking economy? Man, thank god Phill took our eyes off of that ball!
@dffykvn It was loans going bad that blew up the economy not futures markets.
Glass Steagal is only needed because of Federal deposit insurance which should have never been created in the first place. You don't want people taking huge risks with government insured accounts because the risk takers take all the upside and taxpayers take the downside.
At the root of the problem is fractional reserve banking which creates unsustainable credit booms.
@MrGreeneggsnham Oh and for Virginia, I guess you don't know anything about the coal industry
They have "regulations" but they're toothless and they never shut a death trap down
Hundreds of violations? Methane vents blowing good air out and keeping the methane in? Sure why not, no safety precautions in place? Thats cool, who cares about a few dead workers
How about that exxon pipe that recently blew, the locals took exxons word and never forced regulations on them and now theyre boned
@dffykvn They do have safety restrictions in place. Coal mines are dangerous reguardless. If you don't want to be exposed to risks to your life at work then don't work at a coal mine, or on a boat catching crab in frozen ocean water, or harvesting lumber and don't join the military because you might get shot or blown up by an IED. People choose to work at hese places and they know the risks. You can't prevent mines from collasping by banning it.
@MrGreeneggsnham What do you think the methane vents are for then? Decorations? No, they're meant to reduce the chance of an explosion by taking the methane out and bringing good air in
Masseys vents were going in the wrong direction and keeping the methane IN
So class what happened next
Did you guess explosion that killed a bunch of workers? You are correct!
So class what would have happened if he fixed the fucking vents?
I'm sorry but I'm done, you're being willfully ignorant
@MrGreeneggsnham Are you retarded? I'm not saying this to be insulting, but you're either retarded or you have a serious problem with reading comprehension
The accident happened because there WAS a regulation, Massey REFUSED TO FOLLOW THE REGULATION
Instead of the government doing it's job and using "big governments boot to bend the market over the knee and beat it into submission" like the government should have done, it went all laissez faire and refused to enforce the regulation
@dffykvn Actually it's you that's retarded. Whomever installed the vents put them in the wrong way. People don't install vents backwards on purpose. They made a mistake. People don't want oil spills to occur either. They lose piles of money on oil spills.
The government has too many rules to enforce. They have over 1,000,000 pages of text to enforce. When you have millions of rules to enforce, enforcing all them become an impossibility. Of couse you still think there sin't enough regulations?
@MrGreeneggsnham Are you brain dead? The regulator SAW THE PROBLEM
He could have said, "I'm using my power to shut this mine down until all of these safety violations are fixed"
That would have saved the lives of the workers
"still aren't enough regulations"
No Derpy, I think there are good regulations that aren't being enforced (which you've spent the last few posts trying to make bullshit excuses for) and other good regulations that are being thrown away in deregulation bills
@dffykvn So now the arguement is you can't count on the regulators to do their jobs.
Well why even bother with them?
I actually don't think you can count on the government for anything. It's like thinking the mafia with voting is there to take care of you and protect you. This is a sort of Stockholm syndrome that statists have developed with their religous belief in the state to solve complex social problems with violence.
@dffykvn and just where are you going to find this army angels to enforce 1,000,000 pages of regulations without ever making a mistake and never being bought off by the industries they are designed to regulate?
@MrGr How about we start by not hiring retarded libertarians who promise not to do their jobs
Thats a start
Oh and heres another example
The socialist allende who ran chile before that evil capitalist pinochet had strict building codes written
During the recent chilean quake, those evil big gummint building codes that "oppressed dur murkhets" saved lives by making chilean buildings stronger and less likely to kill the occupants
Once again socialism saves lives and capitalism fails
@dffykvn It's wonderful how idiots insist on thinking in extremes like lib vs con, right vs left, capitalism vs socialism. How hard is it to fire a neuron or two and see that reality isn't black and white; to see that reality is inevitably a mix and balance of extremes and variations on the scale of extremes; to realize that it's not the tools or systems but the corrupt mindsets, behaviors, and practices that are the real problem?
Japan is "socialist", especially the markedly right wing American measure. Yet they managed to become the 2nd largest economy on Earth, dominate the auto, electronics, steel, and other markets... all while providing healthcare, transportation, universal quality education, and fair wages to their citizens. Capitalism, socialism, business, and government can all be used productively or destructively and they all have misgivings.
@TheWingflyer Thank you, my problem with people like green is that they don't have any sense of ****ing nuance
To them any intervention is EVIL BIG GUMMINT VIOLENCE!
To me their ideas are closer to a religion, government intervention for some reason is a horrible mortal sin that must not happen, everything has to be 100% free market or it's "violent coercive and evil"
They don't want any government intervention (no matter how beneficial) and their only argument is "that's a sin"
@dffykvn Exactly. For these folks, it's either religion or a sports team or both. They can't be bothered with, you know, thinking or looking at the facts.
@dffykvn Statism is a religion. The first governments were actually religious cults. King and Pharoahs claimed divine powers from god. In America statists have craved the faces of dead leaders into the side of mountains, the children are indoctrinated to support the state in government schools. They recite the pledge of allegiance every morning like lemmings. They are taught not to question authority nor the information they recieve from authority figures. I don't like your religion.
@dffykvn Wealth comes from increases in production not from redistribution. Increases in production come from capital investment. Modern farm equipment is more efficient than slave labor ergo America is the most well fed country in the history of the world.
Democracy is a cirlce jerk where everybody tries to live at the expense of everybody else.
@MrGreeneggsnham "wealth comes from an increase of production not from redistribution"
What do you call ceos writing their own golden parachutes saying that even if they tank the company they have to get paid MILLIONS for FAILING before the workers (who made them the money) or the shareholders (who own the fucking company) get paid
I guess capitalists love redistribution only if it's an upwards redistribution
@dffykvn You could kill the CEO of Wal Mart and redistribute his income to all the employees and it wouldn't make any difference. $19 million dollars to 1.8 million Wal Mart employees is $10.55 per year. Wow that would buy 2 value meals at McDonalds.
Just stop with the platitudes. It's not a valid arguement.
@dffykvn Well the government certainly doesn't deserve it instead and shareholders and bond holders lose their ass if a company goes bankrupt or loses a bunch of money. So I'm not sure how they will "get paid" as you put it.
Corporations are creations of the state. They wouldn't exist in a total market. Corporations were created by statists like yourself who advocate more regulations.
Did you at least learn that wealth comes from production not redistribution?
If the workers are making the business a record profit I consider a guy paying his workers a wage thats even below the living wage an upwards redistribution
@dffykvn No it doesn't depend who controls the redistribution. It depends on the amount of production. You want to grow the pie so there is more pie to go around. Cutting up the pie doesn't produce any more pies.
What is "a living wage"? How is this not just subjective?
@MrGreeneggsnham Look up the definition I only have 500 characters
Yes it does depend on who controls the distribution
If the boss makes a fortune, but his workers are making an income that puts them on or below the poverty line then that is an upwards redistribution of wealth
The workers who produce the product thats sold make the boss a fortune, but the fortune only benefits him
In the 50's the owner made 40 or so times the lowest paid worker, now it's 400- over a 1000xs the lowest
@dffykvn So you want to go back to 1950's laws? Abolish Medicare and Medicaid? Back the currency with gold? Abolish the department of energy? Abolish the department of education? Massive cuts to government spending? Yes that would work better than what they are doing now.
What is "a living wage"? How is this not just subjective?
@MrGreeneggsnham Do you have issues with reading comprehension? I'd like to keep insulting you but if you really do have a mental disability I'll stop Why am I asking? You seem to have an issue with reading comprehension
Medicare and caid had nothing to do with how much employees were paid, the taxes were much higher back then which meant the businesses would have a choice of either reinvesting the money in the business and the employees or paying a lot of taxes
It doesn't shrink your pay BEFORE you get the paycheck
Medicare and caid have nothing to do with ceo pay going up exponentially
Care and Caid have nothing to do with the topic we were discussing
Or maybe medicare and medicaid are why ceo pay is now 400 to a thousand times the lowest worker when it used to be 40 xs, why don't you enlighten us oh great wiseman /snark
@dffykvn You could kill the CEO of Wal Mart and redistribute his pay to all 1.8 million employees and it works out to $10.55 per YEAR. Why would $10.55 matter? You think 10 bucks a year is going to make any difference? The average person pays more in gasoline taxes in a year. Tabs for a car cost more. Income taxes are 100's of times higher.
You don't care about improving the lives of ordinary people. You just hate rich people. Fucking marxiod bullshit.
@MrGreeneggsnham The tax rate is the lowest it's been since either the 20's or 30's (can't remember which off of the top of my head) you factually challenged hack
@dffykvn There was no FICA, Social Security, payroll tax, medicare ect. in the 20's.
You get this information from marxiod bobble heads that think income tax is the only way the government raises revenue. Even today the income tax only accounts for 1/3rd of all federal revenue.
Also borrowing money is a deferred tax into the future, ergo since Reagan came into office they have added about 13 trillion dollars in deferred taxes.
@MrGreeneggsnham marxiod? The first time I thought it was a spelling error, but you've used it more than once...do you mean marx-IST? Or is this a new teapublican bullshit phrase?
Murderous institution....medicare and caid are murderous institutions? is that what they told you down there in the bunker?
During the 50's they existed, so they have nothing to do with the massive change in pay scale...the lower income tax on the top earners does though, nice attempt at deflection BTW
@dffykvn The governmment is a murderous institution. They kill thousands of people every year. There is a war going on. Did you forget? Your tax dollars go toward funding the war. Did you forget? Nice strawman high five.
HAHAHA everyone knows LBJ, Gerald Ford and Nixon expanded thosee programs well beyond their origional intent. They cost more than 10 times what they origionally thought and the taxes to fund them have also gone up dramatically.
It was a war started at the behest of the multinationals that want to expand their markets
I've been against them, being against a war is different from wanting to end the friggin government
Without a government the corporations would just hire mercenaries in the way that the dutch east indies company used to
A way of lowering the cost of the programs would be to reduce medical costs, our costs are unreasonably high because of the ridiculous private market, single payer fixes that
The Dutch East India Company was a government created monopoly. It's not even an example of a free market entity.
It's impossible to fund a war with no taxes. Statism makes war possible. Obama and Bush thank you for their support.
The private market is a corprotists market. It just need sto be deregulated and costs will come down. It's immoral to force poeple to buy something they don't want.
@MrGreeneggsnham Worker wages have remained stagnant or went down, ceo pay has skyrocketed
Oh wait, you're talking about the dollar amount without factoring in inflation
If you don't factor in inflation then yes pay has gone "up" but factoring in inflation worker wages have stagnated or went down while the boss pay skyrocketed
@MrGreeneggsnham Do you know why the wars were launched? Because a bunch of rich pricks wanted the wars to "open up markets" The businesses know that theres a lot of money to be made in a war, so they lobby for more war and more death
It's typical neo liberal bullshit where we bomb people into submission, open up their markets to the multinationals, privatize everything, loot their treasuries then make them slaves of the IMF and take away their right to self governance
@dffykvn You could "open up markets" by removing trade barriers. They put sanctions on Iraq. You were probally still playing with Pokemon cards then and missed that news tidbit. The Iraq war was about the statist agenda of goverment intervention overseas.
I know you really don't care about self governance because it involves actual freedom and your tax dollars fund the IMF too. It's just another failed creation of the progressive movement.
"statist agenda of government intervention overseas" I SAID THATS WHY THEY STARTED IT YOU DOLT!
They started the war so that they could bomb Iraqs cities into rubble, saddle them with a massive debt for endless reconstruction, privatize saddams oil wells for the oil companies, hand out billions to unaccountable contractors, use the debt as leverage to turn over more and more of iraqs public institutions to the multinationals and make them dependant on american, european corporations and IMF
@dffykvn Wars are started by governments. Governments get their power from statists who support the state just as preists get their power from followers of their church. George Bush and Barack Obama say thank you for your support.
As a government. Want more control, pass new bills, enslave everything? Just follow this simple diagram:
PROBLEM > REACTION > SOLUTION
1. Fist create the PROBLEM. This was set to evolve from a long time ago. (Financial and energy crisis);
2. Today we are in the stage of the REACTION of people, where the reaction is directed trough anger and revenge.
3. Next will come the SOLUTION and the candy (control, bills, new money, etc.)
Watch the documentaries of David Ike to understand better.
MAXIESONIC 1 month ago
The campaign with Obama, setting up fake investigations of banking elite and making people feel revenge (even tho this might be the plan of the "elite"), will NEVER resolve our problems.
The system will always produce bankers and lobbyist who will always have their actions justified or excused from their own point of view. I repeat. The system produces those people!
Watch the Zeitgeist Movement witch promotes consciousness and acknowledgement of these problems, and provides real solutions.
MAXIESONIC 1 month ago
MoveOrg does more harm then good. They just orient the people with false actions and revenge.
We, the people don't want anybody to pay, because there is no wane guilty. The system is set up in a way that anyone's actions are justified or excused from their own point of view. It's that simple.
Instead, why not start an awareness campaign which recognizes these facts, the psychology and the corruptibility of the human spirit, so we can transform this system in to a better one.
MAXIESONIC 1 month ago
my answer B
CAUSE IT'S THE TITLE
etocadet 6 months ago
Move on are not the only progressives that are disgruntled with the President, check out the audience response to Maxine Waters in the video titled "Rep. Waters To Black Voters - 'Unleash Us' On President Obama". All the dissatisfaction with the President from all corners of the spectrum inevitably raises the question are there no men of good character who will challenge him for the Democratic nomination?
Zyworski 6 months ago
Davis, your haircut makes your head look fatter then ever. please grew it back it's hard to look at. You look like another fat, bald, ignorant, blabbering mental patient. which, come to think of it, you are.
ysasover1948 6 months ago
Why in the world would we ever need to cut social security? There are DOZENS of government agencies that are completely pointless. WTF is "the dept of homeland security"? Doesn't the dept of defense cover that? Cutting SS is a scare tactic to trick MORONS into supporting higher taxes.
MrSafetymeeting 7 months ago
12*Minutes + 13*Months = ACTION & SOLUTIONS... N.O.W.
PeaceProfit 7 months ago
I saw some asshole with a bumper sticker that said "If you don't stand behind our troops, feel free to stand in front of them". It was right next to the "Don't mess with Texas" and "Fuck Obama" stickers. It's amusing that asshole doesn't realize that Obama is more of a war whore than the last two combined.
RavenMad101 7 months ago
@RavenMad101 what's *amusing* is that you really think that...the war criminals at Cheney/ Bush/ Rumsfeld, Inc STARTED the illegal wars and murders you fucking brain dead, Raving Mad moron, pull yer head outta yer ass before spewing non-sense next time asshole...also
oneirishpoet 6 months ago
did they call yet? keep that line free.
DrQandtheGang 7 months ago
"ncftTV": I had been registered w/Moveon.org prior to Obama coming on the scene (prior to the '08 elections), & when they began sending me emails pushing me to vote for him, I actually fowarded one back to them telling them (in short) how I was SOOO DISAPPOINTED in the fact that they hadn't done substantial research on him, and canceled my subscription (to their emails)! Btw, you ROCK!!!
igspal 7 months ago
George Soros funds MoveOn.org.
wetweasel56 7 months ago
Yeah the US isn't run by the pres duh it's run by the wealthy corps it's a plutocracy not a democracy. sure the dems are a disappointment but obama is not worse than bush there is no way, as i said the pres isn't the real power but the US sunk lower during those bush yrs than ever before, in the US you have little choice dems who won't do and repugs who are actively rotten u tink it's better going with the rotten?+ no accountability for bush or any of his gang so don't expect accountability.
scotty 7 months ago
Winged monkeys AND winged pigs?!?!?!
QTMarkus88 7 months ago
I'm guessing B
TheFunkyDomination 7 months ago
same old whining shit without solutions. as if people who watched your show weren't aware of the problems already.
duckinmypants 7 months ago
MoveOn will end up supporting Obama anyway.
LiberalJerseyman 7 months ago
Notice that MoveOn didn't say they wouldn't vote for Obama, just not send any money on his campaign. Obama will get plenty of cash from bankers, corporations, health insurance companies, and Wall Street. He's not worried. Does either major party need the people any more to survive?
voyzovrezon 7 months ago
Who opposed healthcare for uninsured children? LOL I'm pretty sure that was a rider put into a bill denying healthcare for all others. I love how this game is played... The right puts in one philanthropic rider into a bill that simply advances the interests of big business and the top 1%'ers at the cost of health/income to the other 99% of us. That way they have a nice talking point when it get's turned down by the left, because they know righties only use T.P.s for their opinions anyway.
nightmathzombieethan 7 months ago
it is good to gloat when a gloat is deserved...
7thDayAtheist 7 months ago
WHY NOT BUSH AND HIS ADMINISTRATION HAS MURDERED MORE HUMANITY AND KILLED AND BOMBED MORE MEN WOMEN AND CHILDREN THAN ANY OTHER PRESENT DAY PRESIDENT OF USA ..ANOTHER TEABAGGER SPREADING HATE FEAR AND LIES..THE ONLY THING YOU AND YOUR PARTY DOES
MsDaisy201 7 months ago
Many thought it, too many refused to believe it. Some figured that the first black president wouldn't sell out like a rapper hocking dish soap but sadly he was bought, paid for, and groomed long before.
I roflol when I see the same free-market fundamentalists attacking NAFTA, globalization, and free trade, while complaining about market and industry regulation. How is that de-regulation treating your 401k and home equity. Probably as good as the fishing off the coast of west Florida.
Mahoivlich 7 months ago
Dude, send em your resume.
Bocbo 7 months ago
The way I see it, whoever wins next year, depending on if you like Obama or not, the dude is going to win. Let's face it, the Republicans have no ideas and all they want to say is Obama is a one term president. Why couldnt people vote for Hillary Clinton in 2008, so that the country could have Bill Clinton back into the White House? Instead, America took a choice by electing a freshman senator to become president, and oh btw, they wanted to see a black man become leader of the free world.
uberkewl19 7 months ago
hope you didn't get cancer treatment
nottinmatterz2day 7 months ago
Pigs did fly. Or should I say Swine Flu? *rimshot*
v1de0gamr 7 months ago
Some of these comments are ridiculous. I could swear most of the comments here were made by 12 year olds.
radicalgarbage02 7 months ago
Sweet! love it ....
pmdillavou 7 months ago
We have to make sure that barack obama is tried for his crimes against humanity. He has killed and bombed countless man, women and children. He must be tried.
lagskater98 7 months ago 11
@lagskater98
How about if you´d tried George W. Bush and Dick Cheney first ?
NKA23 7 months ago 5
@lagskater98 So did Bush. Wheres his war crimes trial?
uramoron2006 7 months ago 6
@lagskater98 really, don't you think you should start with the war criminals at Bush/ Cheney/ Rumsfeld, Inc first, since they;re the ones who started the illegal wars and all...try thinking before you write all the stupid shit that appears in your mentally retarded brain ya fucking moron
oneirishpoet 6 months ago
@oneirishpoet thank you well said!
RavenMad101 6 months ago
@lagskater98 not before we try both bush and cheney, and rumsfeld, and wolfowitz, and rice, and all those nuttier-than-batshit neocons that my fellow soldiers into the mess that is "the war on (fake-ass) terror".
bishop3687 6 months ago
@ncftTV Hey Dennis glad your posting vids again. Thank god you mean people finally actually seeing that is no diffrence from the Dems and the Repubs. (I've been saying that since '96) Now if we could only challenge that anger into a meaningful movt we could move the 2 headed beast into extinction.
sirmercutio99 7 months ago
I never thought anyone could screw up as badly as bush but obviously I was very wrong on that assumption. Now with this new election coming up the only real choice would be for Ron Paul but I've noticed many stations must not even know of his existence much less that the man is the clear choice for Pres. When the chips fall a year from now you'll always know that it's the PRESS who chooses the President and NOT YOU! I'll vote for you D.T. no problem just legalize Cannabis please do that first.
BabylonsKing 7 months ago
It would be a dream if Barack and Which ever bum fuck Republican did not win the next election.
I don't want a weak democrat, who gives and gives to Republicans, I don't ever want a Delusional republican who thinks burdens are only for the poor and middle class.
If a fighter was elected for the left. That would make my day... honestly...
I would love it if Barack Obama would just step down... But the smug bastard thinks that he can win. He's a republican light. Who thinks we have no choice.
mrx0066600 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Super obummer strikes again! Left/ right Paradigm. "It is not parties, it is not conservative/liberal, it is not right/left wing.
"It is poor against rich, it is global corporations against local industry, it is the Industrial Military complex against us!
topthickproducer 12 hours ago 12 "
Tis is a sign that We The People are Waking! Look out NWO were going to get you!
calrenman 7 months ago
Don't wait for them to call, just send them the script .
bthbxtr 7 months ago
I like the Green Party.
deliciousmorton 7 months ago
@deliciousmorton Oh you silly goose :)
DoctorKandosii 7 months ago
barack obama is a war criminal
deeabl0 7 months ago 13
@deeabl0 bro we are all war criminals.... that's OUR money they are using to train people to kill and supply them with the weapons to do so ... and we all repeat the "support our troops" mantra like the good drone monkeys we are ... if bush and obama could somehow take the rap for our sins they would become self sacrificing heroes in a perverted way... but they can't blood is on all of our hands... but I can record videos for facebook on my iPhone 4G so who cares right? ;)
MrLesWhite 7 months ago
It's so sad when partisan allegiances clouds the issues so very much that individuals fail to see what very little difference there is between Republicans and Democrats...bring on the viable 3rd party options!
Peace.
pr0t0typeB0Y 7 months ago
Tax churches... problem solved, with revenue to spare. >..>
ixamraxi 7 months ago
Opposable thumbs are overrated when you've got Ron paws.
substanti8 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
U.S. Invasion of Libya Set for October
infowars. com/u-s-invasion-of-libya-set-for-october/
youtube. com/watch?v=35ndI5Z0C2A
BREAKING NEWS: GADDAFI HAS THREATENED TO ATTACK EUROPE IF NATO DOESNT RETREAT
bbc.co. uk/news/world-africa-13997322
youtube. com/watch?v=i7hqcdWYRJk
No Fly Zone Over Fort Calhoun Nuclear Plant Due to “Hazards”
ncrenegade. com/editorial/no-fly-zone-over-fort-calhoun-nuclear-plant-due-to-hazards/
USFullOfLies 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
WEBSTER TARPLEY - PAKISTAN IS THE ROAD TO WW3 (1/6)
youtube. com/watch?v=qqKKGfeZucI
China Issues Ultimatum to United States
youtube. com/watch?v=dIpFapqOWoA
Congress Vote On Declaration Of World War 3
blog.alexanderhiggins. com/2011/05/15/congress-vote-declaration-world-war-3-endless-war-borders-clear-enemies-22785/
The site was recently got hacked.
Get yourself prepared.
USFullOfLies 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
WIKILEAKS: Al Qaeda to unleash 'nuclear hellstorm' if Osama killed...
news.ninemsn.com. au/world/8241119/capturing-bin-laden-would-unleash-hell
WWIII
USFullOfLies 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
"CIA spy" Davis was giving nuclear bomb material to Al-Qaeda
Double murder-accused US official Raymond Davis has been found in possession of top-secret CIA documents pointing to the American Task Force 373 (TF373) providing Al-Qaeda terrorists with “nuclear fissile material” and “biological agents," including a nuclear "dirty bomb."
in.news.yahoo. com/cia-spy-davis-giving-nuclear-bomb-material-al-20110219-224833-452.html
USFullOfLies 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
President Obama and Hillary Clinton pay blood money to Pakistan in adherence to Sharia law
youtube. com/watch?v=c5nuwS1UZyk
dailymail.co. uk/news/article-1366799/Raymond-Allen-Davis-Pakistan-riots-deal-US-pay-2-3m-free-CIA-agent.html
USFullOfLies 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
U.S. 4-star General Wesley Clark (Ret.), explains that the Bush Administration planned to take out 7 countries in 5 years: Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Iran (2007 up to 2012)
youtube. com/watch?v=bX7hMj2NKTc
youtube. com/watch?v=lpBAC9dPr-o
"Japan’s government, threatened with more HAARP attacks, pays 60 trillion yen to Feds"
eclinik.wordpress. com/vital-issues/ben-fulford/japan’s-government-threatened-with-more-haarp-attacks-pays-60-trillion-yen-to-feds/
USFullOfLies 7 months ago
the point of move on is to protect the people so i dont find this to be surprising at all and ha bisky upload
kazooga1234 7 months ago
Hey Dennis - would you consider talking about Ron Paul? I am conflicted and I would be curious to hear your thoughts,
moscowmasha 7 months ago
Obama sure turned out to be a pig with lipstick. Nice to see you Davis.
wasy35 7 months ago
Do-wha-poly? Really?
DrQandtheGang 7 months ago
Cut militarism then wean people of the fantasy of government being a Nanny State.
chewbaca1989 7 months ago
i'll say what i always say, it's the republicans fault.
uiluj13 7 months ago
LOL... you wish you were a celebrity, but in a way you are, you are a non producing attention whore that only survives because of the forced labor of others.
YOU ARE THE PROBLEM, AND YOUR BABBLE IS NOT THE SOLUTION!
bryphi77 7 months ago
I FAVORITED this video because YOU are so FUCKING SEXY! XOXOXO
metamorphicmuse 7 months ago
i don't get why people like you are against the bipartisan party system? Would you rather have one party, that dictates everything you do with no others contradicting or questioning that party? O thats called the Nazi party and fascism. Dumbass, the bipartisan party system is what makes this country succeed better than others.
capitandelfuego 7 months ago
George Soros. Sooooooooooooooooooooo rich
but seems like everyone likes him.
biozamadotcom 7 months ago
Love your mock-ad. XD
Dradeeus 7 months ago
Unionizing Walmarrt is the worst thing you yanks can do.
Well not the worse, but in an economic downturn you need MORE jobs and CHEAPER goods - not the other way around.
Unions will push up the cost of living, and reduce the number of jobs. Always have, always will.
LibertyDownUnder 7 months ago
In Denmark we currently have 8 parties to choose from
so I would recon going to the voting booth in US must feel like choosing one dentist out of the two operating in your country where neither believes in pain reducing remedies and tends to find holes that really didn't exist in the first place or were artificially created by the other dentist.
No matter what it's gonna hurt like hell and cost you an eternity.
jipersson 7 months ago
Man I wish there was a progressive Democrat running in the 2012 race.
WhatDeFrock 7 months ago
I probably will end up not voting.. I refuse to give my vote to some one who enables psychopaths while maintaining an admin no better than the previous one.. I doubt there will be any other decent options.
Obama being nearly as awful as Bush was a wakeup call for most people I know.
eternallord 7 months ago
I didn't have anyone to vote for in the last Presidential election, so I didn't vote. I won't have anyone to vote for this time around unless there is a third party or Dem challenger. We have to make this happen or this country will die.
Boomer1949 7 months ago
!!!!!!RON PAUL!!!!!!
WGraves1833 7 months ago
The ending was funny.
Gyohdon 7 months ago
Abolish the state.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
You've got my vote to do the video, man. Good luck.
TheMercilessEye 7 months ago
.did you shave your head in solidarity for your fellow homosexual brothers?
rtardbox 7 months ago
paul, paul, paul
Mastirshake 7 months ago
Shaved head = kickass non-partisan anarchist (the coolest, most controversial word I thought of). Either side, politicians are the gate-keepers of the Haves.
ScorpiusIncorruptus 7 months ago
put the link up of your challenge in the info bar here
marniespeaks 7 months ago
@marniespeaks I put the link to my 2008 video in the video description
ncftTV 7 months ago
@ncftTV thank you
will spread far and wide
marniespeaks 7 months ago
@ncftTV put a link to a socialist utopia with endless beer fountains here.
75egcg 7 months ago
All politicians are A-holes, it´s genetic!
BigAndTall666 7 months ago
Obama IS GOPlite, before they went batshit crazy. He has never been a real democrat, he just pretended to be one to beat Hillary in the primary.
tnichlsn 7 months ago
It is not parties, it is not conservative/liberal, it is not right/left wing.
It is poor against rich, it is global corporations against local industry, it is the Industrial Military complex against us!
topthickproducer 7 months ago 13
@topthickproducer - spot on! it's no right or left it's corporate vs everyone else
Dahgrostabphri 7 months ago
Way to go Moveon.org
JImmy4336 7 months ago
I just read a Huffington Post article where the author made the case that everything that people disliked W. for, then hoped those would be changed.
Barrack from that same list has not changed a damn thing. So fine if your going to vote for him if you think your group wins, but don't you dare think your doing it for saving lives, for freedom, not giving money to his masters.
Instead his solution was becoming "blue republicans" and throw your support...to Ron Paul...FROM THE HUFFINGTON POST
StuffedAnimalAdvisor 7 months ago
@StuffedAnimalAdvisor Ron Paul...the guy who will remove all regulations? The guy that will remove all worker protections? The guy that would kill healthcare and social security? That insane bag a douche?
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn He'll also bring the troops home, audit the FED, and won't use the federal government to dictate to the states and people what to do.
StuffedAnimalAdvisor 7 months ago
@dffykvn wait ron wants to do all that, he's got my vote
gonadcancervictim 7 months ago
@dffykvn Those who advocate state intervention advocate violence
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham You're an idiot if you think worker protection laws are violence
I guess anything restraining the power of a corporate giant to ruin your life is violence against the poor poor underpowered underdog billionaires /roll eyes
I guess laws that say a boss can't sexually harrass you are just big government taking away your freedom to sexually exploit your employees
The south lost the civil war, I know you people are still butthurt from the loss, but get over it
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn Government laws are not suggestions, they are opinions with a gun.
Corporations are created by government laws.
I don't see how the civil war is relevent. Somebody made a video about you on you tube called "Interview With a Zombie".
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
Uh huh, the rich should have freedumb with no strings attached or laws that they're told to follow, nope, we can trust the BPs/Masseys/Exxons to continue to regulate themselves
Our laissez faire "regulators" have shown us how wonderfully benevolent our masters are when they aren't told to uphold safety standards
Closing down the BP rig massey mines, and exxon facilities would just be big brother stomping on the poor rich peoples throat, the environments a small sacrifice for their freedumb
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn America doesn't have laissez-faire. America has a federal code that comprises of over 1,000,000 pages of text. You don't even know what reality is. How many more pages of regulation until the U.S. is a utopia? 50,000? 60,000? 500,000?
A laissez faire "regulator" is an oxymoron.
Statism is dead as a philosphy.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham No, our regulatory agencies hire people that promise not to regulate
They get their jobs by telling senators that they won't do their jobs, enforce regulations, issue fines or shut plants down
Our regulatory agencies are the only places on earth that hire people to sit on their thumbs
We let the corporations regulate themselves and what do we get for it? A destroyed coast, dead miners and polluted groundwater
Laissez faire fails again and again
dffykvn 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham As for "statism is dead" maybe I missed the gulags, labor camps and death camps the last time I went to sweden
I'm sure the netherlands are hell on earth to idiots like you...you know a place where a mixed economy works
Or germany, which has the union workers RUNNING THEIR CORPORATIONS (Danger will robinson! Danger! commoonists ar gunna gitcha!) ...you know that failed state germany...which is bankrolling the EU
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn Socialism is the justification for public slavery.
I don't see how the least socialist country bailing out the more socialist countries is somehow a justification for the initation of force or even statism.
Statism is dead as a philosphy means there is no philosophical justification for statism. I never made the claim that gulags existed in Sweeden. Not sure the point of bringing it up?
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham Because mixed economies have people who have a higher standard of living than us?
You can have societies that have equality both social and economic
That "the free market always works" is just an assumption thats easily disproven if you just look at other countries and how well they live?
You can have a prosperous society...hell you have a MORE proserous society with more people sharing the prosperity in a mixed economy.
The facts aren't on your side
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn The assumption is not that easy to disprove because one could move the "target" just enough to be painful. Just one example: does the trobriand on the Trobiand Island (yes, these guys near New Guinea that exchange Yam and Kula...) have a free market capitalist, a socialist system or just a traditional system that defy a bit the classical standard definition?
therrydicule 7 months ago
@therrydicule Germany: a country people are familiar with
Trobiand: Were they the guys that Gandalf and Aslan went to to help the children meet up with the hobbits en route to mordor? Or were they Doctor Who aliens?
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn Well, I took an example I am familiar with ;) The trobient are a population of 12,000 natives living on many small island, in a traditional matrilineal society, with an "economy" based on horticultural and fishing with a system of trade using yams and kula-ring as a form of currency, limited by strong religious rules including a believe in sorcery. Where does it fit in the modern debate on capitalism vs socialism? No where, I guess.
therrydicule 7 months ago
@therrydicule The only response that I can come up with is, "Ok?"
I just think that was slightly less of a non sequitor than brining up the mating habits of south western barnswallows carrying coconuts (I'm pretty sure I got that KOTHG line right)
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn I understand the "ok?", I would even understand the "wtf dude?". My point was more that it is not that easy, in real life, to say if one particular economy is being socialist or capitalism... They could be some element similar to one economic theory, even many... But, really, it's more of a "tailor fit" situation than a "one size fit all" when it came to the description of a particular economic system, or what it should be.
therrydicule 7 months ago
@therrydicule Thats the thing
Saying the only choice is a complete free market without any government and regulations isn't tailor made
Decisions on how to run an economy or country require a scalpel, these guys want to try a chain saw just because noone else was crazy enough to do it
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn The chainsaw is to be used when thing get really desperate, like in the 70's or the 30's... That's not the case in USA, today. O.k, they are going in a way where it might get desperate in 30 years from now, but there is some time to avoid that. There is only a few thing I would use radical cutting like the military, the war on drugs, some subsidies in energy, homeland security... This ain't the cold war anymore, that cash could be used to build road or to educated people...
therrydicule 7 months ago
@dffykvn America is a mixed economy. You still don't understand reality.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham Understand reality? The guy talking about regulations like they matter?
Why would regulations matter when laissez faire ideologues are allowed to staff regulatory positions with other laissez faire ideologues to make sure none of its unenforced
The people who cheer the loudest for free markets are the billionaires who make bank off of the dopes that have the misguided belief that a free-er market with less govt intervention is freedon for anyone other than the wealthy
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn Name a "laissez faire ideologue" that holds a regulatory position. Name one.
The people who cheer the loudest for free markets work for think tanks like the mises instutute and CATO institute.
Large corporations typically lobby for more regulations to create barriers to entry and prevent free market competition. You get to be large and influental then use the state to keep small business from competing.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham How about that wonderful free marketeer Gramm?
The idiot that removed glass steagall saying it would lead to "financial innovation"
How well did that work out?
The energy market was "made free-er" and what happened? ENRON!
Virginia is Laissez Faire when it comes to mining they ignore all of the people masseys death traps murder
Businesses should be allowed to regulate themselves" lets massey have mines with hundreds of safety violations and excuses miner massacres
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn Who the fuck is Gramm? Lindsey GRAHAM? If you think Lindsey Graham is an example of a "laissez faire ideologue" then you really don't understand the term.
Enron comitted fraud which has been illegal since the country was founded. Fraud is just a form of theft.
Virginia isn't laissez faire either. You don't understand the term.
Business are not allowed to regulate themselves. The government regulates everything, except the internet. Which works fine.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham Gramm, PHIL GRAMM
The idiot who championed financial deregulation
He killed glass steagall
He also inserted a key provision into the 2000 Commodity Futures Modernization Act that exempted over-the-counter derivatives like credit-default swaps from regulation by the Commodity Futures Trading Commission
Credit default swaps...you know...those little things that blew up the fucking economy? Man, thank god Phill took our eyes off of that ball!
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn It was loans going bad that blew up the economy not futures markets.
Glass Steagal is only needed because of Federal deposit insurance which should have never been created in the first place. You don't want people taking huge risks with government insured accounts because the risk takers take all the upside and taxpayers take the downside.
At the root of the problem is fractional reserve banking which creates unsustainable credit booms.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham Oh and for Virginia, I guess you don't know anything about the coal industry
They have "regulations" but they're toothless and they never shut a death trap down
Hundreds of violations? Methane vents blowing good air out and keeping the methane in? Sure why not, no safety precautions in place? Thats cool, who cares about a few dead workers
How about that exxon pipe that recently blew, the locals took exxons word and never forced regulations on them and now theyre boned
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn They do have safety restrictions in place. Coal mines are dangerous reguardless. If you don't want to be exposed to risks to your life at work then don't work at a coal mine, or on a boat catching crab in frozen ocean water, or harvesting lumber and don't join the military because you might get shot or blown up by an IED. People choose to work at hese places and they know the risks. You can't prevent mines from collasping by banning it.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham You can tell massey to make sure his vents are pointing in the right direction
Maybe forcing them to actually FIX the HUNDREDS of safety violations or shutting the places down until they're fixed would be a good idea
Coal mining is dangerous...thats why there are safety regulations...they PREVENT accidents
when you have hundreds then the place is a death trap and it's more like you're actively trying to kill your employees
Look up massey mines and its abuses
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn Actually they don't prevent accidents. People die and are injured all the time mining.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham What do you think the methane vents are for then? Decorations? No, they're meant to reduce the chance of an explosion by taking the methane out and bringing good air in
Masseys vents were going in the wrong direction and keeping the methane IN
So class what happened next
Did you guess explosion that killed a bunch of workers? You are correct!
So class what would have happened if he fixed the fucking vents?
I'm sorry but I'm done, you're being willfully ignorant
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn I never said accidents won't happen. Regulations don't prevent anything. You just proved my point.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham Are you retarded? I'm not saying this to be insulting, but you're either retarded or you have a serious problem with reading comprehension
The accident happened because there WAS a regulation, Massey REFUSED TO FOLLOW THE REGULATION
Instead of the government doing it's job and using "big governments boot to bend the market over the knee and beat it into submission" like the government should have done, it went all laissez faire and refused to enforce the regulation
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn Actually it's you that's retarded. Whomever installed the vents put them in the wrong way. People don't install vents backwards on purpose. They made a mistake. People don't want oil spills to occur either. They lose piles of money on oil spills.
The government has too many rules to enforce. They have over 1,000,000 pages of text to enforce. When you have millions of rules to enforce, enforcing all them become an impossibility. Of couse you still think there sin't enough regulations?
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham Are you brain dead? The regulator SAW THE PROBLEM
He could have said, "I'm using my power to shut this mine down until all of these safety violations are fixed"
That would have saved the lives of the workers
"still aren't enough regulations"
No Derpy, I think there are good regulations that aren't being enforced (which you've spent the last few posts trying to make bullshit excuses for) and other good regulations that are being thrown away in deregulation bills
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn So now the arguement is you can't count on the regulators to do their jobs.
Well why even bother with them?
I actually don't think you can count on the government for anything. It's like thinking the mafia with voting is there to take care of you and protect you. This is a sort of Stockholm syndrome that statists have developed with their religous belief in the state to solve complex social problems with violence.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@dffykvn and just where are you going to find this army angels to enforce 1,000,000 pages of regulations without ever making a mistake and never being bought off by the industries they are designed to regulate?
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGr How about we start by not hiring retarded libertarians who promise not to do their jobs
Thats a start
Oh and heres another example
The socialist allende who ran chile before that evil capitalist pinochet had strict building codes written
During the recent chilean quake, those evil big gummint building codes that "oppressed dur murkhets" saved lives by making chilean buildings stronger and less likely to kill the occupants
Once again socialism saves lives and capitalism fails
dffykvn 7 months ago 5
@dffykvn It's wonderful how idiots insist on thinking in extremes like lib vs con, right vs left, capitalism vs socialism. How hard is it to fire a neuron or two and see that reality isn't black and white; to see that reality is inevitably a mix and balance of extremes and variations on the scale of extremes; to realize that it's not the tools or systems but the corrupt mindsets, behaviors, and practices that are the real problem?
TheWingflyer 7 months ago
Japan is "socialist", especially the markedly right wing American measure. Yet they managed to become the 2nd largest economy on Earth, dominate the auto, electronics, steel, and other markets... all while providing healthcare, transportation, universal quality education, and fair wages to their citizens. Capitalism, socialism, business, and government can all be used productively or destructively and they all have misgivings.
TheWingflyer 7 months ago
@TheWingflyer Thank you, my problem with people like green is that they don't have any sense of ****ing nuance
To them any intervention is EVIL BIG GUMMINT VIOLENCE!
To me their ideas are closer to a religion, government intervention for some reason is a horrible mortal sin that must not happen, everything has to be 100% free market or it's "violent coercive and evil"
They don't want any government intervention (no matter how beneficial) and their only argument is "that's a sin"
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn Exactly. For these folks, it's either religion or a sports team or both. They can't be bothered with, you know, thinking or looking at the facts.
TheWingflyer 7 months ago
@TheWingflyer I just found the most interesting thing I've ever read ww (w.h) ermes-pres (s.c) om/completin (g.h) tm
When you have time look it over
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn Statism is a religion. The first governments were actually religious cults. King and Pharoahs claimed divine powers from god. In America statists have craved the faces of dead leaders into the side of mountains, the children are indoctrinated to support the state in government schools. They recite the pledge of allegiance every morning like lemmings. They are taught not to question authority nor the information they recieve from authority figures. I don't like your religion.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham Ell oh ell
Yea sure, now why don't you try telling me how "the invisible hand of the market" isn't a deity of wealth
Fuck your calvinist bullshit
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn Wealth comes from increases in production not from redistribution. Increases in production come from capital investment. Modern farm equipment is more efficient than slave labor ergo America is the most well fed country in the history of the world.
Democracy is a cirlce jerk where everybody tries to live at the expense of everybody else.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham "wealth comes from an increase of production not from redistribution"
What do you call ceos writing their own golden parachutes saying that even if they tank the company they have to get paid MILLIONS for FAILING before the workers (who made them the money) or the shareholders (who own the fucking company) get paid
I guess capitalists love redistribution only if it's an upwards redistribution
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn You could kill the CEO of Wal Mart and redistribute his income to all the employees and it wouldn't make any difference. $19 million dollars to 1.8 million Wal Mart employees is $10.55 per year. Wow that would buy 2 value meals at McDonalds.
Just stop with the platitudes. It's not a valid arguement.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham So a guy fucks up his business and gets fired...he DESERVES the golden parachute?
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn Well the government certainly doesn't deserve it instead and shareholders and bond holders lose their ass if a company goes bankrupt or loses a bunch of money. So I'm not sure how they will "get paid" as you put it.
Corporations are creations of the state. They wouldn't exist in a total market. Corporations were created by statists like yourself who advocate more regulations.
Did you at least learn that wealth comes from production not redistribution?
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham That depends on who controls the distribution
If the workers are making the business a record profit I consider a guy paying his workers a wage thats even below the living wage an upwards redistribution
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn No it doesn't depend who controls the redistribution. It depends on the amount of production. You want to grow the pie so there is more pie to go around. Cutting up the pie doesn't produce any more pies.
What is "a living wage"? How is this not just subjective?
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham Look up the definition I only have 500 characters
Yes it does depend on who controls the distribution
If the boss makes a fortune, but his workers are making an income that puts them on or below the poverty line then that is an upwards redistribution of wealth
The workers who produce the product thats sold make the boss a fortune, but the fortune only benefits him
In the 50's the owner made 40 or so times the lowest paid worker, now it's 400- over a 1000xs the lowest
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn So you want to go back to 1950's laws? Abolish Medicare and Medicaid? Back the currency with gold? Abolish the department of energy? Abolish the department of education? Massive cuts to government spending? Yes that would work better than what they are doing now.
What is "a living wage"? How is this not just subjective?
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham Do you have issues with reading comprehension? I'd like to keep insulting you but if you really do have a mental disability I'll stop Why am I asking? You seem to have an issue with reading comprehension
Medicare and caid had nothing to do with how much employees were paid, the taxes were much higher back then which meant the businesses would have a choice of either reinvesting the money in the business and the employees or paying a lot of taxes
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn" Medicare and caid had nothing to do with how much employees were paid"
What? It comes out your paycheck you fucktard. If you would get out of your moms basemant and find a fucking job you would know this.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham It comes out of your paycheck you fucktard
It doesn't shrink your pay BEFORE you get the paycheck
Medicare and caid have nothing to do with ceo pay going up exponentially
Care and Caid have nothing to do with the topic we were discussing
Or maybe medicare and medicaid are why ceo pay is now 400 to a thousand times the lowest worker when it used to be 40 xs, why don't you enlighten us oh great wiseman /snark
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn Taxes affect wages. Holy shit nobody is this stupid.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
Who cares what some CEO makes. It jack shit compared to what the government steals from people every year.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreenegg Are you kidding? Companies that make money should have a reasonable distribution of the profit
I'm not saying pay a ceo as much as a janitor, but 40 or 50xs the lowest paid sounds about right
When you're making hundreds or a thousand times more, then there's something wrong
But why am I debating a 'tard that doesn't even understand the simple concept of "workplace safety"
I might as well argue with a chimp, I'm sure a chimp would provide a more scintillating conversation
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn You could kill the CEO of Wal Mart and redistribute his pay to all 1.8 million employees and it works out to $10.55 per YEAR. Why would $10.55 matter? You think 10 bucks a year is going to make any difference? The average person pays more in gasoline taxes in a year. Tabs for a car cost more. Income taxes are 100's of times higher.
You don't care about improving the lives of ordinary people. You just hate rich people. Fucking marxiod bullshit.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham The tax rate is the lowest it's been since either the 20's or 30's (can't remember which off of the top of my head) you factually challenged hack
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn There was no FICA, Social Security, payroll tax, medicare ect. in the 20's.
You get this information from marxiod bobble heads that think income tax is the only way the government raises revenue. Even today the income tax only accounts for 1/3rd of all federal revenue.
Also borrowing money is a deferred tax into the future, ergo since Reagan came into office they have added about 13 trillion dollars in deferred taxes.
Why increase funds to a murderous institution?
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham marxiod? The first time I thought it was a spelling error, but you've used it more than once...do you mean marx-IST? Or is this a new teapublican bullshit phrase?
Murderous institution....medicare and caid are murderous institutions? is that what they told you down there in the bunker?
During the 50's they existed, so they have nothing to do with the massive change in pay scale...the lower income tax on the top earners does though, nice attempt at deflection BTW
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn The governmment is a murderous institution. They kill thousands of people every year. There is a war going on. Did you forget? Your tax dollars go toward funding the war. Did you forget? Nice strawman high five.
HAHAHA everyone knows LBJ, Gerald Ford and Nixon expanded thosee programs well beyond their origional intent. They cost more than 10 times what they origionally thought and the taxes to fund them have also gone up dramatically.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
It was a war started at the behest of the multinationals that want to expand their markets
I've been against them, being against a war is different from wanting to end the friggin government
Without a government the corporations would just hire mercenaries in the way that the dutch east indies company used to
A way of lowering the cost of the programs would be to reduce medical costs, our costs are unreasonably high because of the ridiculous private market, single payer fixes that
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn
The Dutch East India Company was a government created monopoly. It's not even an example of a free market entity.
It's impossible to fund a war with no taxes. Statism makes war possible. Obama and Bush thank you for their support.
The private market is a corprotists market. It just need sto be deregulated and costs will come down. It's immoral to force poeple to buy something they don't want.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham After taxes were lowered and more loopholes were put in place
That took away the incentives to reinvest in the business or give workers raises
Now they were free to give themselves larger and larger paychecks so the difference in pay between the lowest and the top became ridiculous
Worker pay has been stagnant or has gone down for DECADES while exec compensation has SKYROCKETED
The only laws that matter in this equation are tax cuts and "free trade" deals
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn "The only laws that matter in this equation are tax cuts and "free trade" deals"
That's absurd. They all matter.
Government spending has skyrocketed over the last several decades.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham And the revenue collected through tax has decreased because of the constant stream of tax cuts
You do know that reducing the revenue increases the debt
Sorry if thats too much your frail little mind
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn No they have both gone up other than breif drop offs during recessions. You don't even know what reality is.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham Worker wages have remained stagnant or went down, ceo pay has skyrocketed
Oh wait, you're talking about the dollar amount without factoring in inflation
If you don't factor in inflation then yes pay has gone "up" but factoring in inflation worker wages have stagnated or went down while the boss pay skyrocketed
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn Inflation is created by the government printing money to pay for all it's bull shit programs and warfare.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
@MrGreeneggsnham Do you know why the wars were launched? Because a bunch of rich pricks wanted the wars to "open up markets" The businesses know that theres a lot of money to be made in a war, so they lobby for more war and more death
It's typical neo liberal bullshit where we bomb people into submission, open up their markets to the multinationals, privatize everything, loot their treasuries then make them slaves of the IMF and take away their right to self governance
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn You could "open up markets" by removing trade barriers. They put sanctions on Iraq. You were probally still playing with Pokemon cards then and missed that news tidbit. The Iraq war was about the statist agenda of goverment intervention overseas.
I know you really don't care about self governance because it involves actual freedom and your tax dollars fund the IMF too. It's just another failed creation of the progressive movement.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago
"statist agenda of government intervention overseas" I SAID THATS WHY THEY STARTED IT YOU DOLT!
They started the war so that they could bomb Iraqs cities into rubble, saddle them with a massive debt for endless reconstruction, privatize saddams oil wells for the oil companies, hand out billions to unaccountable contractors, use the debt as leverage to turn over more and more of iraqs public institutions to the multinationals and make them dependant on american, european corporations and IMF
dffykvn 7 months ago
@dffykvn Wars are started by governments. Governments get their power from statists who support the state just as preists get their power from followers of their church. George Bush and Barack Obama say thank you for your support.
MrGreeneggsnham 7 months ago