why is that pilot getting pissed off? i would love to be intercepted for the fun of it! (obviously i dont want to get intercepted for something wrong, but if theyre practicing intercepting, GREAT!)
great photo ops and extra free training for unusual situations :D
That's what idiot pilots like these get when they "enter" a hot MOA!!! one of those flights sounds like a King Air, and if so, a "professional flight crew?" Why would he fly into a hot MOA? He's an idiot! When you screw up a training sequence for fighters, you kind of piss them off, and they're gonna mess with you. Next time, do some flight planning and quit whining.
@pilot4321 they were talking to atc so idk who you're calling idiot. they were on an ifr flight plan and atc failed to notify them. and you call yourself a pilot?
@SuperMcfly12 Yes, I call myself a pilot. I have an ATP and CFII, and have flown intercept missions against real F-16's. You clearly don't have a clue what you are talking about! These planes were clearly VFR. Listen to the controller tell Learjet SS the MOA is hot and he's not talking to them. If they were IFR, ATC would never have routed through a hot MOA. Looking at the video one cannot tell whether or not the two planes were receiving VFR traffic advisories.
@pilot4321 good for you. do we care? no. now let me explain my pov in small words so you can understand. MOA's are not restricted areas. military pilots do not own that part of the airspace. now they were talking to a control center somewhere. if atc gave you a heading and altitude regardless of where you are, you'd be a little pissed if some hot shot 20 yr old came up and flexed his muscles. point being. is it smart to fly in MOA's? prolly not. but atc needs to be aware as well. happy flying
@SuperMcfly12 Let me speak plainly for you, since you obviously DO NOT understand aviation like you think. ATC doesn't give altitude and/or heading assignments for VFR advisories! For VFR flights ATC only "controls" aircraft in Class B, C, and D airspace. Reread your AIM a little better about MOA's and the warnings given why one should STAY OUT. This was ABQ Center, they knew the MOA was "hot" by their own words in this AT recording, and they did what was required of them.
@pilot4321 and you're 28. god i hate how people come on here and think they're so effin cool cuz they fly. so many people fly. get over yourselves. congrats but don't think everyone wants to blow you cuz you have a ppl
@SuperMcfly12 As a 20 year old flight instructor, I had U.S Navy fighters come along side of me in C-172's several times as they approached NAS Oceana. I was never scared, in fact I thought it was cool. Their training is top notch, I had no worries of a mid-air with them. The only mistake these F-16 pilots made was not turning off their Mode 3 (equivalent to Mode C) so that they wouldn't have set off the Learjet's TCAS. I'm a Beechjet PIC, and would have NEVER FLOWN THROUGH A HOT MOA!
@pilot4321 20 year old? lol my buddies 18 and is a cfii mei. my other friends 19 and flies crj700s for skywest. you're not that impressive. anyways, i thought they were ifr when i first heard it so you're right. vfr traffic needs to be aware. i just misunderstood. happy flying.
@SuperMcfly12 I was never trying to impress you, just making a point. Anyone can fly for a regional, I've flown for one too, it was a time building job to get a real flying job! I understand you thought they were IFR, but no, they were VFR. My point remains; if you fly into a hot MOA, don't get upset that military aircraft screw with you a little. These fighter pilots have enough to worry about in a training scenario (like learning how not to be killed in combat) to worry about idiots!
@pilot4321 dude. shut up. you never were a regional pilot. you're not even a cfi. you lied about your age and now you're making up fantasies. i told you i was wrong. fuck. get over it. move on. no one cares about your dumbass points. just pull your head out of your ass and leave me alone
@SuperMcfly12 You are an idiot. I didn't lie about my age, I'm 28, but been flying since i was 17. Earned my CFI at 20. I've flown for Pinnacle Airlines in a CL-65. I've been a captain on a Part 135 Beechjet too. Bottom line is I get offended when idiots like you make comments on here that you have obviously have no clue about!!!
@SuperMcfly12 Remember, its not ATC's job to keep you safe in a HOT MOA if you are VFR! They regularly advise VFR flights of HOT MOAs and suggest one stay out of it. Only in IFR operations does ATC have the responsibility to keep you clear of an MOA.
@SuperMcfly12 Either way, VFR traffic advisories are the lowest priority for ATC. And lastly, if you are a young pilot, you might want to look up MOA's and the hazards it creates when GA morons fly through them. If you fly through them, and screw up the training profile of a fighter flight, be prepared for them to mess with you. If you don't like fighters messing with you, then STAY OUT OF A HOT MOA, PERIOD!
As far as I am aware, TCAS advisories have to be complied with. HAVE TO, no "common sense," no "pilot discretion," none of it. MOA doesn't give any pilot, military or civil reprieve from their legal obligations. F-16 drivers aren't stupid, they know aircraft like that have TCAS and they know what the civil pilot is experiencing. The squadron was rules about civil aircraft interaction and 100% guaranteed the viper driver's actions were in direct violation of those.
Listen to the audio - they had the F-16 visual. RA should have been ignored and disabled in this case. Instead of having a cry they should have appreciated the unique experience of seeing an F-16 up close while in the cruise.
F-16 its piece of crap i dont even want to see in a picture, dumbass he didnt have the moron f-16 til he was about 20 feet do you even know how TCAS works?
The way you state this you'd almost think you know what you're talking about, except for the fact that you haven't got a clue. We're required to respond to an RA whether or not the conflicting aircraft is in sight, it's a safety thing. Couple of reasons: Firstly how do you know what the other guy's gonna do, or whether or not he's even seen you? Secondly there's always the possibility that the aircraft you have in sight is in actual fact not the one causing the RA. Following the RA is REQUIRED.
How does a military aircraft go about intercepting and identifying a civilian transport if the crew respond to the spurious TCAS commands? Maybe you should review interception procedures or simply apply some common sense.
Ermmmm, I'm required to know the interception procedures for my JOB. Also, and let me say this again, we are REQUIRED to respond to RAs. Did you read that? REQUIRED. So, when I decide to apply some of your 'common sense' and end up (hopefully) explaining myself to the NTSB and the FAA I'll be sure to point them in your direction. Lastly, why would a TCAS alert be spurious if there was an RA in response to a converging aircraft?
Procedurally the interceptor should have Mode C disabled and the intercepted should be aware of the possibility of spurious TCAS commands if RA isn't disabled. Let's hope the MiG that intercepts you isn't squawking altitude or you may just get shot down. And, yes, there is still room for 'common sense' in the cockpit.
That would have been an incredibly stupid thing to do. Pilots are trained to respond instantly to TCAS RA to prevent another Uberlingen.
The pilot is well within his rights to file against the military pilot who's actions have endangered the civil guys aircraft.
Nevertheless,
"They had the F16 visual"
Who said the F16 had the civil aircraft visual? How would you like to try and outmanouver a fighter jet at the last minute when you realise you got it wrong
quandumphone... you don't know what you are talking about. Read the AIM regarding MOA's or ask a CFI.
princenathaniel.. you really believe the government wouldn't lie to you?? I really, really hope you are joking. You must have the same mentality as one of Hitlers brown coat Nazi's
The viper pilots should not have stayed with the GA aircraft. That part of this problem I agree with. Other than that, it is very possible to have a similar situation in an active MOA. Any CFI will tell you that.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
I wonder if these commercial pilots know that F16 pilot Lt Col Rick Gibney confessed to shooting down "United Airlines Flight 93" on 9/11/2001? PirateNews *org/ flight93 *html
@panictactics hahaha ur such a fail
tmacization 8 months ago
MOAs are perfectly legal to fly through...js.
evrolicious 9 months ago
why is that pilot getting pissed off? i would love to be intercepted for the fun of it! (obviously i dont want to get intercepted for something wrong, but if theyre practicing intercepting, GREAT!)
great photo ops and extra free training for unusual situations :D
abhiginimav 1 year ago
@abhiginimav
Sure... whatever you say.
HDaviator 6 months ago
Why do they call it a MOA?
howler67 1 year ago
@howler67 an MOA is a 'Military Operations Area"
cskog001 1 year ago
That's what idiot pilots like these get when they "enter" a hot MOA!!! one of those flights sounds like a King Air, and if so, a "professional flight crew?" Why would he fly into a hot MOA? He's an idiot! When you screw up a training sequence for fighters, you kind of piss them off, and they're gonna mess with you. Next time, do some flight planning and quit whining.
pilot4321 1 year ago
@pilot4321 they were talking to atc so idk who you're calling idiot. they were on an ifr flight plan and atc failed to notify them. and you call yourself a pilot?
SuperMcfly12 1 year ago
@SuperMcfly12 Yes, I call myself a pilot. I have an ATP and CFII, and have flown intercept missions against real F-16's. You clearly don't have a clue what you are talking about! These planes were clearly VFR. Listen to the controller tell Learjet SS the MOA is hot and he's not talking to them. If they were IFR, ATC would never have routed through a hot MOA. Looking at the video one cannot tell whether or not the two planes were receiving VFR traffic advisories.
pilot4321 1 year ago
@pilot4321 good for you. do we care? no. now let me explain my pov in small words so you can understand. MOA's are not restricted areas. military pilots do not own that part of the airspace. now they were talking to a control center somewhere. if atc gave you a heading and altitude regardless of where you are, you'd be a little pissed if some hot shot 20 yr old came up and flexed his muscles. point being. is it smart to fly in MOA's? prolly not. but atc needs to be aware as well. happy flying
SuperMcfly12 1 year ago
@SuperMcfly12 Let me speak plainly for you, since you obviously DO NOT understand aviation like you think. ATC doesn't give altitude and/or heading assignments for VFR advisories! For VFR flights ATC only "controls" aircraft in Class B, C, and D airspace. Reread your AIM a little better about MOA's and the warnings given why one should STAY OUT. This was ABQ Center, they knew the MOA was "hot" by their own words in this AT recording, and they did what was required of them.
pilot4321 1 year ago
@pilot4321 and you're 28. god i hate how people come on here and think they're so effin cool cuz they fly. so many people fly. get over yourselves. congrats but don't think everyone wants to blow you cuz you have a ppl
SuperMcfly12 1 year ago
@SuperMcfly12 As a 20 year old flight instructor, I had U.S Navy fighters come along side of me in C-172's several times as they approached NAS Oceana. I was never scared, in fact I thought it was cool. Their training is top notch, I had no worries of a mid-air with them. The only mistake these F-16 pilots made was not turning off their Mode 3 (equivalent to Mode C) so that they wouldn't have set off the Learjet's TCAS. I'm a Beechjet PIC, and would have NEVER FLOWN THROUGH A HOT MOA!
pilot4321 1 year ago
@pilot4321 20 year old? lol my buddies 18 and is a cfii mei. my other friends 19 and flies crj700s for skywest. you're not that impressive. anyways, i thought they were ifr when i first heard it so you're right. vfr traffic needs to be aware. i just misunderstood. happy flying.
SuperMcfly12 1 year ago
@SuperMcfly12 I was never trying to impress you, just making a point. Anyone can fly for a regional, I've flown for one too, it was a time building job to get a real flying job! I understand you thought they were IFR, but no, they were VFR. My point remains; if you fly into a hot MOA, don't get upset that military aircraft screw with you a little. These fighter pilots have enough to worry about in a training scenario (like learning how not to be killed in combat) to worry about idiots!
pilot4321 1 year ago
@pilot4321 dude. shut up. you never were a regional pilot. you're not even a cfi. you lied about your age and now you're making up fantasies. i told you i was wrong. fuck. get over it. move on. no one cares about your dumbass points. just pull your head out of your ass and leave me alone
SuperMcfly12 1 year ago
@SuperMcfly12 You are an idiot. I didn't lie about my age, I'm 28, but been flying since i was 17. Earned my CFI at 20. I've flown for Pinnacle Airlines in a CL-65. I've been a captain on a Part 135 Beechjet too. Bottom line is I get offended when idiots like you make comments on here that you have obviously have no clue about!!!
pilot4321 1 year ago
@pilot4321 seriously. get over yourself and do us all a favor. STFU!!
SuperMcfly12 1 year ago
@SuperMcfly12 This is my last post to you. I must be dealing with a child!
pilot4321 1 year ago
@pilot4321 praise the lord
SuperMcfly12 1 year ago
@SuperMcfly12 Remember, its not ATC's job to keep you safe in a HOT MOA if you are VFR! They regularly advise VFR flights of HOT MOAs and suggest one stay out of it. Only in IFR operations does ATC have the responsibility to keep you clear of an MOA.
pilot4321 1 year ago
man you got worked up lol. i thought these were three different people.
SuperMcfly12 1 year ago
Comment removed
pilot4321 1 year ago
@SuperMcfly12 Either way, VFR traffic advisories are the lowest priority for ATC. And lastly, if you are a young pilot, you might want to look up MOA's and the hazards it creates when GA morons fly through them. If you fly through them, and screw up the training profile of a fighter flight, be prepared for them to mess with you. If you don't like fighters messing with you, then STAY OUT OF A HOT MOA, PERIOD!
pilot4321 1 year ago
Typical American air force COWBOYS...!!!
I hope he loses his wings !
sandsifter149 1 year ago
IF YOU CANT SPEAK BETTER ENGLISH, DONT FLY IN AMERICA.
aaron8862006 1 year ago
As far as I am aware, TCAS advisories have to be complied with. HAVE TO, no "common sense," no "pilot discretion," none of it. MOA doesn't give any pilot, military or civil reprieve from their legal obligations. F-16 drivers aren't stupid, they know aircraft like that have TCAS and they know what the civil pilot is experiencing. The squadron was rules about civil aircraft interaction and 100% guaranteed the viper driver's actions were in direct violation of those.
Frederf220 1 year ago
@Frederf220 F-16 "driver"?! The F-16 doesn't have a gear lever...
StealthB6 1 year ago
@StealthB6 That's what they're called.
Frederf220 1 year ago
10 feet? and save the complaining for when you land...
Grouse214 1 year ago
Why was the F-16 fucking with the two planes?
enigma800 1 year ago
@enigma800
Because some jackass waltzed into the equivalent of a shooting range.
LgndryThndr 9 months ago
Comment removed
mascettaja02 2 years ago
lol no matter where you go you get crazy drivers
Texasman2186 2 years ago 2
Where's the pilot's common sense? Following the TCAS when he can see it's an F-16 intercepting him? Stupid.
panictactics 3 years ago
unless you got eyes behind your head and if you see that F-16 coming at you 600+ kts at you
N9602FL 2 years ago
Listen to the audio - they had the F-16 visual. RA should have been ignored and disabled in this case. Instead of having a cry they should have appreciated the unique experience of seeing an F-16 up close while in the cruise.
panictactics 2 years ago
F-16 its piece of crap i dont even want to see in a picture, dumbass he didnt have the moron f-16 til he was about 20 feet do you even know how TCAS works?
N9602FL 2 years ago
How old are you? 15?
panictactics 2 years ago
what the hell was that garbage you just said?
bunnyfoofoo83 2 years ago
The way you state this you'd almost think you know what you're talking about, except for the fact that you haven't got a clue. We're required to respond to an RA whether or not the conflicting aircraft is in sight, it's a safety thing. Couple of reasons: Firstly how do you know what the other guy's gonna do, or whether or not he's even seen you? Secondly there's always the possibility that the aircraft you have in sight is in actual fact not the one causing the RA. Following the RA is REQUIRED.
toastno6 2 years ago
How does a military aircraft go about intercepting and identifying a civilian transport if the crew respond to the spurious TCAS commands? Maybe you should review interception procedures or simply apply some common sense.
panictactics 2 years ago
Ermmmm, I'm required to know the interception procedures for my JOB. Also, and let me say this again, we are REQUIRED to respond to RAs. Did you read that? REQUIRED. So, when I decide to apply some of your 'common sense' and end up (hopefully) explaining myself to the NTSB and the FAA I'll be sure to point them in your direction. Lastly, why would a TCAS alert be spurious if there was an RA in response to a converging aircraft?
toastno6 2 years ago
Why would it be spurious? What a stupid question.
Procedurally the interceptor should have Mode C disabled and the intercepted should be aware of the possibility of spurious TCAS commands if RA isn't disabled. Let's hope the MiG that intercepts you isn't squawking altitude or you may just get shot down. And, yes, there is still room for 'common sense' in the cockpit.
panictactics 2 years ago
"The RA should have been ignored"
That would have been an incredibly stupid thing to do. Pilots are trained to respond instantly to TCAS RA to prevent another Uberlingen.
The pilot is well within his rights to file against the military pilot who's actions have endangered the civil guys aircraft.
Nevertheless,
"They had the F16 visual"
Who said the F16 had the civil aircraft visual? How would you like to try and outmanouver a fighter jet at the last minute when you realise you got it wrong
Arrows2100 2 years ago
Yawn.
panictactics 2 years ago
@panictactics Wow you are incredibly dumb and clueless in regards to aviation. Not much else to say to your responses.
JTS97Z28 1 year ago
quandumphone... you don't know what you are talking about. Read the AIM regarding MOA's or ask a CFI.
princenathaniel.. you really believe the government wouldn't lie to you?? I really, really hope you are joking. You must have the same mentality as one of Hitlers brown coat Nazi's
Patriot1962 3 years ago
The viper pilots should not have stayed with the GA aircraft. That part of this problem I agree with. Other than that, it is very possible to have a similar situation in an active MOA. Any CFI will tell you that.
quandumphone 2 years ago
Sounds like those aircraft chose to fly through an active MOA. This is exactly what can happen. Their complaint is going to go nowhere. Sorry.
quandumphone 3 years ago
were did the pilot get if PPL
NVAirport 3 years ago
That general aviation craft should have contacted the F-16 on 121.5 or 243.0 to find out what the heck that F-16 was doing to him.
denelson83 3 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
I'd probably do the same thing. Buzzing a Comm flight @ 180 lmao
BTW
Pull your head out your ass.
Do some research.
9-11 was an INSIDE JOB
Dubbydubdubs 3 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
I wonder if these commercial pilots know that F16 pilot Lt Col Rick Gibney confessed to shooting down "United Airlines Flight 93" on 9/11/2001? PirateNews *org/ flight93 *html
operationnorthwoodz 3 years ago
BULLShit
pOsTaLxL 3 years ago
That's complete bullshit! The government said that it crashed on it's own and they wouldn't lie to us!
princenathaniel 3 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Yeah, good luck with that ...
pimpmytafel 3 years ago
it wouldent ? ahah jesus christ
peterflightsim 3 years ago
take your conspiracy theoriest bullshit and get the fuck out of my country...fool
speedfiend74 3 years ago
Amen to that! If you disagree with anything this government does or says you are a stupid fuck who shouldn't be in this country!
princenathaniel 3 years ago
i bet you got "anal probed" by aliens when you where little
N9602FL 2 years ago 2