History Channel WTC Towers Designed To Get Hit By Plane

[Clarrisani]

Fully loaded 707 at landing speed that had been lost in the fog. Fair enough, I say. I don't think anyone would have envisioned fully loaded 747 at over 500mph. No one inside of America, anyway. After all, they never envisioned an attack coming from within the country until 9/11.

[punxsutawneybarney]

@Clarrisani It wasn't a 747. It was a 767, a 2-engine plane not much bigger than a 707. A 707 with four engines had a lot more capacity to do damage to the core. In 1964 a study was done showing that the towers could absorb a hit from a 707 going 600 mph.

It's too bad Frank DeMartini's story is not more widely known. He was a true hero. FDNY Chief Ray Downey too, died when WTC1fell, even though he thought WTC2 had been blown up with explosives.

[SNIPERSTEVE420]

@Clarrisani really? then why was the military running drills about the exact attacks happening at the same time the "attacks' were happening. is that just coincidence? i think not.

[Clarrisani]

@SNIPERSTEVE420 The military was ALWAYS running drills. They weren't running drills on the exact scenario however. It's kind of like how schools always practice fire drills. It's for the "just in case", even though it may never happen. Hijacked planes had occurred in the past in America, but they never foresaw them being used as a weapon to fly into buildings. This is a post-9/11 reality.

[SNIPERSTEVE420]

@Clarrisani you apparently do not know about about the plot in the 1960s thought up by the joint chiefs, that they could use hijacked airliners and crash them into cities to blame on cuba to justify an invasion. you are not educated on this matter, thus unqualified to argue it. and the drill going on the exact same time of a plane hitting the pentagon. stop saying they never thought of it.

[Clarrisani]

@SNIPERSTEVE420 Oh, I know about it. I just know that the whole thing was thrown out as ridiculous. Also, as inhumane and un-American. And of COURSE the pentagon was a target. It was next to an airport and it was perceivable that a plane might run into difficulty and crash into the Pentagon at low speeds. It IS directly under a flight path, after all. Any building under a flight path is at risk of such an event occurring, as it has in the past on many occasions.

[punxsutawneybarney]

@Clarrisani It was thrown out by Kennedy's administration, but it got the endorsement of all the Joint Chiefs. It was un-American, but then, so were the Joint Chiefs.

[cjpureevil]

I say it withstood the impact. All the towers did was rocked back and forth while thousands of people escaped. My hearts out to everyone at or above the site of impact, and those who went in help

[sellbotvpmaster99]

someone already wanted to bomb the WTC in 1993

[jhi82]

and they also said the titanic was unsinkable!

[punxsutawneybarney]

jhi, NIST has not one piece of core steel showing heating sufficient to weaken it. Why did they scoop up all the steel wreckage and ship it off to Asia before the experts could examine it?

Frank Demartini stayed behind on the 88th floor to help people evacuate and he died.

[jhi82]

punxsutawneybarney quote:

NIST has not one piece of core steel showing heating sufficient to weaken it.

Do you even know how steel is made? Here is a clue Fire!!!!

[punxsutawneybarney]

Sure, I know how steel is made. You just toss some kerosene on a few office cubicles and set it on fire. :>)

Steel is made in blast furnaces with coke for fuel. Office fires burn at most at 1200 degrees F. Steel melts at 2700 degrees F.

[jhi82]

"at most" small buildings im talking a fully load jet and your 1200F is off by 1500F which would explain why it took close to 2 hours for the steel to fail. br0wn3rry,punxsutawneybarney has absolutely no argument.

[punxsutawneybarney]

jhi, flights 11 and 175 were not fully loaded. They only had 10,000 gallons of fuel on board. NIST says the jet fuel burned off in less than ten minutes.

[gaguy1967]

Steel was not scooped up and sent to Asia before experts could examine it. Youre a moron

[punxsutawneybarney]

Steel was scooped up and shipped to Asia before experts could examine it. Dr. Astaneh Asl complained to the House Science Committee that his investigations were being disrupted. The fact that NIST has no steel samples showing the heating damage they claim is proof that the steel was not adequately examined.

A 395,000 pound 767 is 15% heavier than a 336,000 pound 707.

[gaguy1967]

That is also BS. No steel was shipped off to Asia. I guess some East Asian country was also involved in 9-11 then? That is the problem with you Truthers. Your conspiracy involves far too many people to be credible.

. You should stop quoting from Truther Sites. That is your convoluded logic. You attempt to prove your Truther theories by quoting from Thruther sites.

Different 707s and 767s have vastly different gross weights. But Im sure your Truther website omits that fact.

[punxsutawneybarney]

gg neither you not NIST has any proof that the fires reached 2000 degrees. NIST has no core steel samples showing heating above 480 F.

Your claim that the steel was not shipped to asia is a lie. BBC news reports 12/28/02 in its article "Twin Towers steel set for US warship" that "more than 350,000 tons was sold for recycling in China, Malaysia, Korea and India."

767--395,000 pounds; 707--336,000 pounds. Like most defenders of the official 9/11 fairy tales, you make up your facts.

[gaguy1967]

No its you who make up your own facts. Youre not even aware that there are numerous versions of both the 707s and 767. That shows your sloppiness and laziness. 350,000 tons??? hahaha, The WTC had ONE BILLION tons of steel and concrete and youre unhinged over 350,000. That is nothing.

[punxsutawneybarney]

I am aware there are numerous versions of the 707 and the 767. Your claim that I'm not is an example of you making up your facts.  My figures come from the FEMA report, and refer to the B707 and the B767-200ER.

Another fact you make up is your billion tons of debris. Each tower weighed 500,000 tons. You're off by a factor of a thousand.

[gaguy1967]

Truthers like yourself think you are entitle to your own facts. The towers weighed more than 500,000 tons. But what is most amazing is your cowardice. If you think the govt did it, why dont you do something more than make postings on youtube? The govt is that evil and yet you do nothing. That would in Dante's world make you worse than those who committed 911. Fact is the fires reached 2000F, weakend the steel and brought the building down

[punxsutawneybarney]

gg, truthers don't have our own facts. We have the facts. My source for the 500,000 ton figure is Dr. Thomas Eagar of MIT, from a paper published in the JOM.

So tell me, Mr. anti-truther, where did you get your billion tons figure? You have no evidence that the fires reached 2000 degrees F. The available steel samples show that the core steel never got hotter than 480 F.

Your belief that all I do is post in YT is another made up fact. You don't know what I do. You're irrational.

[gaguy1967]

Your wrong about the temps in the building. Temps reached 2000F, not 480. Fires reach more than that in a house fire. Truthers do have their own facts and once more they cant even agree upon them. They just make them up as they go.

Irrational is thinking that GW Bush was smart enough to pull off 911.

[punxsutawneybarney]

You have no evidence of 2000 F temps.

Nobody says GW Bush was smart enough to pull off 9/11.

And in fact whoever did it DIDN'T pull it off. People are wise to it. 800 architects and engineers are demanding new investigations. Only 15% of Americans believe the official story, which makes you a kook.

Where did you get your billion tons figure? Did you pick it out of your nose?

[gaguy1967]

who attacked the WTC on 2/26/1993? Only 15% believe official story? Site your source loser. Tell me where 800 engineers are demanding new investigations. This is what I mean by saying Truthers think they are entitle to their own facts. They site as evidence other Truther sites or opinions.

You should start a movement to free KSM, obviously you think he is innocent. Your cowardice is amazing.

According to NIST temps in the WTC were 1900F, enough to weaken steel

[punxsutawneybarney]

The 15% comes from a angus-reid poll done for CBS/NYT in 10/06.

Google Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth.

NIST reverse-engineered their studies.

[gaguy1967]

The poll says only 15% say the govt is tell the truth about what it knew about 911, not that it was not an inside job. This is a prefect example of how Truthers selectively use their own facts. The poll also says only 28% said the govt was mostly lying. I am not going to google anything. Telling me to google something is not an argument or a debating point.

[punxsutawneybarney]

You asked me where 800 engineers are demanding new investigations and I told you. Maybe if you'd learn to google you wouldn't have to make up your facts.

[gaguy1967]

I checks out this group and they have been discredited by other engineers. Also those demanding a new investigation will simply disbelieve the results if they dont like it

[punxsutawneybarney]

gagay, you accuse me of lying. I said that the poll showed that only 15% of Americans in 2006 believed the official story. That is in fact what the poll said. You have tried to argue against this fact by mischaracterizing in various ways what I said.

What engineers have discredited Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth?  Do any of them have names? Or are you making up your facts again? Members of the 9/11 Truth movement have many times tried to arrange debates. Your guys lack the guts.

[gaguy1967]

The answer to the poll doesnt have any conclusive meaning. It doesnt mean 85% are Truthers. The poll si actually too vague to draw any conclusions. For instance if someone though that Bill Clinton shut down Able Danger, they would answer with the 85%.

Most Engineers dont agree with Engineers for Truth. if they did there would be no reason for a group called Engineers for Truth, it would be redundant.

Most truthers are liars yes.

[punxsutawneybarney]

You keep twisting the facts. Only 15% in 2006 believed the official story. Now it's probably less. That makes you a fringey kook.

What is your evidence that most engineers disagree with architects and engineers for 9/11

truth?

I can only recall one, D. Allan Firmage , who wrote an objection to Dr. Steven Jones's hypotheses showing astounding ignorance of the official World Trade Center reports--citing a summary of a discredited early report. He hadn't even read the report!

[gaguy1967]

you want to post that poll then? Popular Mechanics did a good piece on 911 that totally debunks the Truthers. Truthers have been discredited at each turn. Some have moved on to become Birthers. Fact is temps reached 1900F..that is a fact. You can t deal with

Of course there are all sorts of degrees of Truthers. Do you believe a plane hit the WTC and Pentagon or was it a missile or a hologram? Was UA 93 shot down? Were calls actually made from UA 93?

[punxsutawneybarney]

You have no evidence that temperatures from office fifes reached 1900F. NIST has no core steel showing heating above 480 F.

I can't post links on Youtube. Google ... angus-reid 9/11... and you'll find the poll.

Popular Mechanics' article is silly. Google ... pm straw man 9/11 ... for an intelligent rebuttal.

[gaguy1967]

The NIST showed 1832F in the core of the WTC. Source: NIST report May 2006.

I saw the poll, I read it. It doesnt say that 85% if the popularion are Truthers. I am good at understanding polling results.

I am not going to google anything. Telling me to Google, isnt an intelligent argument. You refute PM

[punxsutawneybarney]

gg, expecting me to refute PM in 500 characters is ridiculous.

The NIST report was 10,000 pages, so you'll have to tell us where in it your 1832 F figure appears. Of course since the report was in 2005 and not 2006 I am quite confident that you're just making up your facts as you have many times before.

NIST has not one piece of core steel showing heating above 480 F.

[gaguy1967]

youre wrong. A fire in your fireplace gets over 480F. Youre a liar and a sick mentally unstable person. You couldnt refute PM in any amount of characters. You still didnt answer my questions about UA 93 and did planes hit the pentagon or WTC?

[punxsutawneybarney]

That's what the report says: no core steel samples above 480 F. The PM article is a collection of silly straw man arguments. The PM book is so full of half-truths and mischaracterizations and dishonesty I put it down after 75 pages.

[gaguy1967]

You put down PM cuz you couldnt handle the truth. I have the report here. it says steel was subject to temps of 1832 F.

You still didnt tel lme what you think of UA 93, AA 11 and AA 77. Where they real?

[punxsutawneybarney]

I put down PM because it was bullshit.

Where does the report say the steel was subject to temps of 1832?

How do they know? Why don't they have steel samples to prove it?

[gaguy1967]

It is in PM. Also you didnt answer the following:

Who attacked the WTC on 2/26/1993?

Is KSM innocent?

Was UA 93 shot down

Did any planes hit the WTC

[punxsutawneybarney]

Why should I believe PM? The book is full of half-truths.

[gaguy1967]

well that would make them 100% more truthful than you.

ANSWER LOSER: Who bombed the WTC in 1993?

[punxsutawneybarney]

When did I lie?

You lied when you said the steel was not shipped to Asia and when you said the towers had a billion tons of steel in them.

I don't have to answer the questions of liars.

[gaguy1967]

I WIN!!!!!!

[punxsutawneybarney]

Alleges the liar.

[gaguy1967]

you dont want to answer my questions about:

who bombed the WTC in 1993

Did a plane hit the pentagon

Was UA 93 shot down

So I WIN....YOOHOOOOOOOO

[punxsutawneybarney]

Why should I?

It's all off topic. See the title of the video? "WTC Towers Designed To Get Hit By Plane"

It was designed for that, and the steel was heaped up and shipped to Asia before experts could examine it. That's important.

[gaguy1967]

the topic is : was 911 an inside job? You say yes, but cant answer my real simple questions...so.............I WIN!!!!!

[punxsutawneybarney]

I didn't say it was an inside job. Can't you read? The title of the video is "WTC Towers Designed To Get Hit By Plane"

[gaguy1967]

youve been arguing as a truther for the past 2 days

[punxsutawneybarney]

I didn't say it was an inside job. What's wrong with arguing as a truther? Sure beats arguing as a liar, like you.

[gaguy1967]

so there are truthers who think it WASNT an inside job????? One thing is certain is youre a nut job

[ianat841]

@punxsutawneybarney

Has wikipedia allowed you to start editing again or are you still banned for vandalizing Willie Rodriguez' page? Please let us know, Petgoat/Contrivance/Snug Bug/Brian Good.

[punxsutawneybarney]

@ianat841 Willie wants to pretend there's only one guy in the world who knows he's a liar. Did you notice that he has to go out of the country now to get a gig at all? Gee, he's a lot like Craig Ranke and Kevin Barrett and Jim Fetzer that way. See my video "The Wrong Man" for the skinny on Fat Willie R.

[punxsutawneybarney]

@punxsutawneybarney Frank DeMartini was a real hero. Willie Rodriguez's lies dishonor the true heroes. See my video "Willie R's 9/11 Hero Tale"

[ianat841]

@punxsutawneybarney

Nobody cares, Petgoat.

So tell me, have you ceased stalking Carol Brouillet?

[punxsutawneybarney]

@ianat841 Nobody cares that Frank DeMartini is a hero?

Tell me Ian, have you stopped beating your ex-wife's lesbian lover?

[ianat841]

@punxsutawneybarney

Never been married, Brian Good. Unfortunately, there's a whole bunch of documentation about your obsession with Carol Brouillet.

[punxsutawneybarney]

@ianat841  Never been married? I'll suppose that explains your obsession with Brian Good.

[ianat841]

@punxsutawneybarney

That's the best you can come up with, Brian? You're really losing it, aren't you.

Speaking of obsessions, have you stopped babbling about Willie Rodriguez everywhere you go? Kevin Barrett says you were in love with him and that's why you're stalking him.

[punxsutawneybarney]

@ianat841 Kevin Barrett's fantasy world gets goofier and goofier.

[ianat841]

@punxsutawneybarney

As opposed to your fantasy world in which the towers came down "essentially in free-fall"? Please, Petgoat, don't make me laugh.

And I don't need Barrett to know that you have a deranged obsession with Rodriguez. All the gibberish you post here and all over the internet with all your different identities (Petgoat, Snug Bug, Contrivance, etc.) is enough for me.

[gaguy1967]

I forgot in one of the WTC documentaries the police helicopter reports the norht tower is leaning and buckling. It is from HBO's 9-11 in memoriam

[punxsutawneybarney]

gg, I didn't say anything about inside job. I said only 15% of the American people (in 2006) believe the official story, and that's what the poll showed.

Your statement is a perfect example of how liars like you mischaracterize others' statements in the service of the official lies.

[gaguy1967]

No your siting of the poll is how liars use statistics. Included in that 85% that dont believe the govt (if we are to believe polls, which themselves can be manipulated), would be people who dont buy Clinton's statements that he did everything he could to kill Bin Ladin. Anything can be included in that 85%.

[gaguy1967]

So what are you going to do about bringing the evil doers to justice? Just sit here and blog away. As I said, Truthers are cowards. They see evil and no nothing about it.

[br0wnb3rry]

they also said LETS GO TO WAR WITH IRAQ!

oh wait.... who did 911 now?

[pinipillo]

I am Italian, but my cousin was American and he died on September 11 2001 to 95 plan was a hot dog vendor called ALFONSO RIP

[ferdcr]

Isnt a 767 bigger than a 707?

[banjorol]

the fuselage of a 707 is only 3 ft smaller than a 767 and the WTC's were designed for multiple 707 impacts.

[screamosux]

it's a little bigger, but a 707 would have more kinetic force on impact.

- John Skilling, head structural engineer for the World Trade Center

I'm seriously about to give up on you because 1) you have no idea what you're talking about, 2) you don't bother reading, and 3) you won't think outside of what the government tells you.

If you read and comprehend what you're reading, you might learn something.

[screamosux]

Ignore my last comment if it showed up. One of my friends decided to screw around with my comp while I was away.

Anyways, what I wanted to type was: A 767 is a little bigger than a 707, but would have less kinetic force on impact than a 707.

911research.wtc7. net/wtc/analysis/design.html

[seahawks2043]

a little bigger?......try a lot bigger

[punxsutawneybarney]

Seahawk, a 767 is a little bigger than a 707. Also it has only two engines while the 707 has four, so it's likely the 707 would do more damage.

[seahawks2043]

cant even see my comment lol......but im guessing what ur stance is on 9/11 as we all have our own respectful opinion, the only way i c it as being a inside job is that our government knew it was gonna happen and let it go down, or knew but not who was involved,where,when ect. : )

[punxsutawneybarney]

Seahawk I didn't say anything about an inside job. I said the 707 has four engines and the 767 has two.

[gaguy1967]

No it wouldnt. # of engines has nothing to do with it. Speed x mass does. Also the WTC did withstand the impact, they fell due to the fires that weakened the steel

[punxsutawneybarney]

According to Dr. Thomas Eagar of MIT, the impact of the plane on the buildings was "like a bullet hitting a tree". Negligible.

NIST has not one piece of core steel showing heating above 480 degrees F, which is not enough to weaken it. There is thus no evidence for their theory that the fires weakened the steel other than the fact that the buildings fell down.

[gaguy1967]

That is BS. The fires reached 2000 degrees F.

[gaguy1967]

The 767-200 has a much higher gross weight than the 707-120

[Focoist911]

this is shit. You've cropped the next bit where he says he believes the buildings could withstand multiple impacts from jetliners.

Fuckhead. Go get another copy.

[BadCase]

Why dont you do it instead of coming here and talking trash shit for brains.

[deville69btk]

The 707 was belived to fly slow and not at full speed as the 767 did, and why is this clip cut just before he says that???

[deville69btk]

EDIT: i found the clip and he does not say anythin abot the speed just after but a bit later

[sellbotvpmaster99]

@Focoist911 its not his fault because the documentary is like that

[Lungyao1]

Inside Job!