And because it is written down and says they are eye witnesses it MUST BE TRUE.
And since this is probably your source of income, we can TOTALLY BELIEVE EVERYTHING YOU INTERPRET from the book. People are waking up and seeing how ridiculous this priestcraft really is.
so if I write a book about second world war - only including stories I have heard from my father who heard it from my uncle who went to a russian KZ-camp, I would get an acurate description with even the tiniest facts correct and no exagerations
it goes a long way to explain all the inaccuracies in the bible i think
40 years later you get matthew who writes mostly about Jesus' ethics
80 years later in luke and the others the stories have grown and you get the stories about miracles
Read "MIsquoting Jesus" by Bart Ehrman (or watch the youtube videos). The early manuscripts were wildly variant and inaccurate. If you can find a reputable textual critic ( someone who is truly an expert in the field of ancient new testament manuscripts) who is also a fundamentalist christian, please give me their name. I would like to hear what they have to say.
Jesus didn't give us the bible,and he never denounced judaism. In fact, according to the story, he taught that he should question the temple and that everything we need to have a relationship with god is already in us. So no need for a bible or religion, the god of the universe doesn't have a "people" that would imply that not all is his creation.
the babel have soo many things that don't go toghether how God would have a child with a humain so he had already creat angel who are better than humain in every thing it's clear like sun but this some people are trying to hid sun with a fok ...!!
@786Nasrat, you don't remember what verse? Isn't a true Muslim supposed to memorize the entire Quran? It sounds like you're not dedicated to the Quran. Also when you make an argument in defense of the Quran, Back it up with chapters and verses. You say us Christians are making things up, but you don't show us one piece of evidence from the Quran. It sounds like you're the one making it up. There's a word for that...SELF RIGHTEOUS!
@underground0331 brother you need to undrestand that there is no such a thing as a true muslim..there is a strong believer and a weak believer..and no you are not sapose to memorise the whole quran..you can if you want to be it is not compulsary..yes i should give you the verse of quran when i make a quote but it doesnt mean i am making it up..anyways anything else you want to say brother
Jesus does claim to be God. In John 10:30-33 Jesus says "The Father and I are one." Immediately the Jews try to stone him saying he's blasphemous, also saying "you, a man make yourself God." Jesus never corrects them, He never says, "I didn't say I was God. Meaning his claim of The Father and I are one is the understanding of I am God. It's not I that's reading the bible out of context, it's you, if you're even reading it at all.
you are making this up urself..if this is what it is than why didnt jesus says himself i am god..do you now undrestand what i am trying to say..why didnt jesus in his own words say, god made me in his image or i am god or worship me, take me as your lord for i am your lord..why does he keep refering to his father..stop saying things out of your self and prove to me from your book, from his words..mircles were carried out by all the prophits pbu them, moses, david, solomon, noah etc.
@lizazoon see comments like these shows you are soo damn arrogant and there is no point in talking to you because if you can admit that they all performed miracle how the hel are you going to believ or admit anything else.. peace be with you my friend
i cant remember what verse it is in the quran where it says for some people even if you bring a dead person alive, they will stil not believe..and you sound like on of those ppl..prophet mohammad pbuh wasasked if you are a true prophit than show us a miracle, he split the moon in half,and when ppl saw that, they said it was a trick, now my friend there are plenty of miracles for those whoare looking for guidance and true path,bt for ppl like you, you need to wait and find out when you die,
@786Nasrat Hey, so let's try it. Bring someone back to life, split the moon.
What are you waiting for?
The reason people don't believe in miracles is just common sense. You wouldn't believe it if I claimed a miracle happened, now would you? Of course not. (well, I'm assuming here)
may allah guide you before your life is over as its more better if you find better life than living a life with no purpose..peace be with you my friend
you see once you believe that there he is trying to say worhsip him or take him as your lord than at one point in the bible jesuspbuh says i can not do anything without my fathers will..now if they are one why would he need to have his permision to do something..however if you just take jesus pbuh as just a messenger than everything the bible fits together, bt if you take him as a lord than contridections will take place just like the one i quoted..the rest is in your hand my friend..
Then Judah said to Onan, Go in to your brothers wife, and perform your duty as a brother-in-law to her, and raise up offspring for your brother. Onan knew that the offspring would not be his; so when he went in to his brothers wife, he wasted his seed on the ground in order not to give offspring to his brother
no1 says bible is false, no1 says jesus is not the christ..wat we saying is jesus is not god..it does not say in the bible jesus is god..jesus does not say in the bible im god worship me..why cant you undrestand one thing..if i wore god or i were to give message to ppl to worship me, i would introduce ma self and den perform miracles den i woudl say now worship me as i m the god..but jesus did not do that..instead he said im sent from father to glorofy him..now how can u ppl think he is his son
i am not trying to be pain in the back side or be rude here bt u sereasly need to wake up..read what you just wrote..they made man in their image..how can a man be image of god..it doesnt make sense..and stop saying things of your own..write that in context for me..dont just pick and choose..if you can find any where in the bible that JESUS pbuh himself says i am god and worship me..I'l convert to christianity right now..
i can give you an explanation of that without its context..you see if i were to read that i would believe that god and jesus pbuh are in same path and are working for the same goal therefore they are as one team..meaning you follow him you are following me..no where in that verse you can say he is saying if you worship him or take him for your lord your taking me as your lord..or whether you wroship him or me it is the same..how can you say that means like that..
i cant undrestand anything, i mean he confuses me,
in psychology, it is believed that eye witness testomoney is not accurate..
and i believ it is true in some ways...u c when two ppl sees the same incident, dey will give different testomony, try it f you dnt believe me..soo wudnt that make bible words of humans instead of god..
Naturally what Josh McDowell says is designed to be confusing, using lots of words to say saying nothing. Its what one does when one has no facts to back assertion.
eye witness account means just that....they saw it happen so wheres the lie, or are you erroneously trying to say theres a time limit for an eye witness account to be valid
Your right He is our brother, i don't know why i see Him as my Master. About the violence in scripture, Jesus sounded a new era... God bless you my friend!
Jesus (according to your bible) called all of us brothers and sisters, but, gosh. If you want to deny his word, that's up to you.
However, notwithstanding, no person who wrote any of the many books of the bible ever knew Jesus.
It's that simple.
Even more simple is that Deuteronomy is not entirely written by Moses, nor coule it be a record of the CREATOR's words, as it extends violence as an answer, not love as was the command given us all, including folks not in any religious movement.
No. I am saying that nobody in the bible knew Jesus PERSONALLY.
This is an old argument, though, and most scholars will point that out.
First, you must decide if the bible is worth following to the letter.
If so, then to argue whether it is true or not is of no importance at all. Doing the word is al that matters.
If you decide that men wrote the bible, then all one has to do is walk away from the childish behavior of people that claim it to be the "word of god"....
Jesus is my Lord, King and Saviour not my brother. Jesus recited from scripture, He learned people in relation to the Old Testament that makes the Testament true. The Bible is written with men as instrument, the Holy Spirit as the Holy inspiration. God bless you!
Well the Bible didn't come from god from fax did it? Man made errors and one sided opinions and perspectives litter the book. And do you really believe there were no dinosaurs, the world was made in 7 days, a great flood covered the earth, a man lived 3 days in a fish, 6 billion people decended from 2 people and a snake talking to a rib woman doomed us all?
There could have been a man called Jesus, but he could have just been a man claiming to be some prophet, and his "disciples" wrote accounts of him being a prophet. If I claimed I was Jesus reincarnate and had 12 people following me around worshipping me, you wouldn't call me the son of god now would you?
BenAliGtor: The oldest NT manuscripts we have, have been dated from 60 to 150 AD. The oldest OT manuscripts we have (the Dead Sea scrolls, found in 1947, in a cave in Qumran) date as far back as 250 - 150 BC. What's interesting is that when compared with our present day copies, and it is a near perfect match, word for word.
A quantum leap exists from "the scriptures as originally God breathed are inerrant " to "the Bible is 100% accurate". The oldest complete NT manuscript dates to the Fourth Century, and the oldest complete OT manuscript dates to even later. Chains of custody and records of transcriptions back to the autographs can't be documented. Therefore, even if someone accepts a traditional standard of inspiration, one cannot conclude that the Bible we hold in our hands is "the inerrant word of God".
It's hard to prove that leprachauns don't exist. It's hard to prove there's no god. But it's easy to prove the Christian God doesn't exist. It is logically impossible that any being can have the following characteristics: 1- all-knowing 2- all-powerful 3- actively involved in human affairs 4- loving in nature. 1 and 2 and 3 are consistent. 1 and 3 and 4 can be consistent. But to see evil and choose not to stop it one cannot be loving. And when we add his eternal torture chamber... Nope.
For another point of view watch the three part series, "The Genius of Charles Darwin" hosted by world famous scientist Richard Dawkins. Also watch the seven part series, "The Voyage of Charles Darwin." Malcolm Stoddard who portrays Darwin is absoulutely brilliant. Don't forget. The 200th birthday of Charles Darwin is coming up in February, 2009. So we can look forward to seeing television specials dedicated to this truly great man!!!
By the way thank you Josh, (or who ever is in charge of this page) for allowing me to put an opposing viewpoint here. It's is good to here both sides of an argument even though you may not agree with one side. Some Christians pages don't allow anything other that what they agree with, and that is frustrating because you don't learn that way.
Thank you, Josh! I have given as gifts at least 1 copy of your "New Evidence Demands a Verdict," and can't seem to find the one I found to replace it. With my bad memory, I probably gave it away, too! Love those infallible truths!
I am sorry, but by no means is this confirmation of anything. You are speaking of people who supposedly saw things and people who wrote down the stories of people who knew people who saw things
I think you are missing the point here. A modern example would be aliens. If there is a book written about aliens, where people interview supposed eye-witnesses, it would still be shaky. Why? Not everyone agrees, differing accounts, not a lot of witnesses to singular events (meaning not a crowd seeing 1 alien encounter). However, this was widely spread witnesses, large multitudes saw miracles of Jesus; and if it couldn't be verified, the Jews would never have let them write the accounts.
Humans and time warp history. It is largely accepted from a historical standpoint that Jesus was the messiah a few hundred years after he lived, not during. The Jews not allowing people to write down accounts I think is historically innacurate on your part and doesn't reflect the thinking of the time. Not to mention being wrong on a subject never ever stopped people from writing about it. I am not saying I don't believe in Jesus because I am still constantly trying to figure out my beliefs.
Yes but as he argues and explains there are factors that make The Bible 99.9% accurate over the time it has been written. So what needs to be shown isn't whether or not it's changed (it mostly hasn't) but whether or not it was accurate in the 1st place.
The apostles, who wrote within a few decades after Jesus died confirm him as the Messiah, whether it was popular or not is irrelevant. And if the apostles had written something wrong the Jews would have stopped them for religious reasons.
Actually from what I have been learning about simple passages and how there is so much more to them than the face value I am starting to have more faith that any problems I myself had with The Bible are probably out of my ignorance. For example: If you have faith the size of a mustard seed you can move a mountain. It sounds like Jesus using exaggeration to make a point (or we have little faith) but mountain is a Middle East metaphor for a problem. That little example hid a lot more.
Tricks and illusions that can be explained. Sure, I can't tell you how it's done, but I'm sure his peers and technical wizards can make educated guesses on it. If Jesus was just a master illusionist, why would David Blane not be able to figure out a way for him to do the trick? Those primitive people couldn't possibly do something we couldn't, so please do explain how he pulled that little stunt off.
Simple. People in the past were much dumber than today. They took rainbows, lightning and rain as "God's" emotions and sacrificed virgins. Switching six pots of water as wine when no one was looking would be pretty easy back then. Plus, they probably didn't even ask "how did you do that?" and simply said, "you must be the son of god!"
Of course.. people back then were all simple and stupid.. and I was more referring to the one about Jesus faking his own death and resurrection, since it's more important and all. Plus, let us not forget, lots of people obviously wanted him to die, so I doubt they would let that little detail of, hey that's not Jesus, slip past without questioning. Or that of, hey wait, he's still breathing, nice try Jesus.. *stab*
One thing to remember: if we were to discount the accounts which millions of people have accepted as true, then one might also find it necessary to throw out all history that uses written eyewitness accounts, including all references to the Roman Emperors, Napoleon, the Founding Fathers of the USA.
The difference between these figures and Jesus was the amount written on them. Also, by your logic shouldn't that mean i believe in mohammad, buddah, and Quetzalcoatel?
Bible has 25k+ preserved manuscripts--6k Greek, 10k Latin & 9k in other early languages. "Iliad" is 2nd w/ 643, Herodotus & Thucydides, where we get our world history only 8. Also, thousands of yrs the Bible has existed, how many people have tried to destroy it & it's still the #1 book sold in the world? Mohammed, Buddha, Confucianism, Marxism, and Darwin's evolution is based on theory or their teachings -- not observable data. We have to look at who was Jesus and what did he do.
Darwin's theory not based on observable data? what are you talking about? finding transitional fossils between species is not observable? there are many fossils showing the transition from fish to amphibians I'm sorry but I think that is called observable data weather you agree with evolution or not. creationist myths like to tell people that no one has ever found transitional fossils. according to a majority of paleontologists and biologist, that is not true because the fossils exist lol.
I'm sorry but there aren;t any transsitional fossills for proving that fish evolved to amphibians.Evolution is just a theory,it's not truth.Haven't 600 scientists signed a document in which they denounce and reject the theory of evolution of being true?
definition of a scientific theory "In science a theory is a testable model of the manner of interaction of a set of natural phenomena, capable of predicting future occurrences or observations of the same kind, and capable of being tested through experiment or otherwise verified through empirical observation. For the scientist, "theory" is not in any way an antonym of "fact". For example, it is a fact that an apple dropped on earth has been observed to fall towards the center of the planet."
(other reply goes first) that is how science uses the word. typically when the conman man uses the word, they really mean what science calls a hypothesis. which just means an idea or exploring a possibility. scientific theories are based on observable data and facts. gravity is a scientific theory. no one disputes if that is real lol. and Archaeopteryx is a good example of a transitional fossil. but really it is up to you if you don't want to believe in something that has been proven to exist.
The Archaeopteryx is not a a transsional fossil because it already has feathers(i've known about since i was 12)...again ...IT ALREADYA HAS FEATHERS,it's not proof that it changed ,there is not intermeddiate fossil ,we would have to have thousands of it!
ya that is the problem with creationist they take real evidence of the fossil and just say oh its not transitional even though science shows evidence that it is or like the Australopithecus is just an ape even though it has traits of humans and apes in the the bone and skeletal structure showing evidence of a transition. look all I'm saying is that there is observable data for the theory. much more that creationism which really has no scientific evidence for it. its just faith based.
and yes the archeopteryx has feathers, but it also has many traits of the deinonychosaurs a threropod dinosaur that did not fly. In fact the archeopteryx has more deinonychosaurs like traits than bird traits. jaws with sharp teeth, three fingers with claws, a long bony tail, hyperextensible second toes. these are some common traits among the fossils. there are hundreds of fossils that show transitions over time form one to another and then a fossil is found that shows a mix of both species.
There is other evidence of evolution, like viruses evolving over time to be resistant to anti viral drugs, just ask any HIV patient why they take up to 14 drugs a week. Also, there is no such thing as a document that rejects evolution, in fact, 99% of scientists base evolution on fact and those who don't are ridiculed out of the arena.
99%of the scientist...oh really...what about the respected creationist scientist?Majority does not decide what's the truth.I believe in evo up to a certain point!
Well, the "respected creationist scientists" are extinct or have converted, virtually none remain, and those who do are rarely invited to any scientific debates. And if a majority believe in a theory, you can be pretty sure they have a wealth of evidence to back it up. And you cannot believe a theory "up to a point". A theory is a theory, you can't take gravity halfway, or electroflux theory.
Which, by your own admission kind of says something about the whole thing doesn't it.. if you even question it you are ridiculed and cast as an invalid. I'm sorry, I thought science was about questioning theories..
Could you qualify your words more specifically? "My own admission" "whole thing" " question it" And no, science is formulating theories, finding supporting evidence, and accepting it if the evidence is conclusive, or rejecting it if evidence shows otherwise. The bible is just stating a theory, but pretends to sleep when someone questions it, hoping that he'll give up and go away. And now people are smart enough not to go away...
"I thought science was about questioning theories."
Erm, not quite. Questionability merely states that something is open to challenge, or to be challenged. In science everything should be treated as tentative, but the only way you can counter a theory is through the process of Falsifiability. Therefore if a theory is false, then this could be demonstrated through experimentation and/or observation.
Ah, but thats true based on records and preservable media. We have greek pottery, roman artifacts, material evidence and more concerning those. The only evidence for the Bible is: the Bible. Also, an unbiased perspective is a big plus, any records written by non Christians would count as good evidence if proven reliable. Please, christians ask for much more proof concerning evolution than you have for the Bible.
And because it is written down and says they are eye witnesses it MUST BE TRUE.
And since this is probably your source of income, we can TOTALLY BELIEVE EVERYTHING YOU INTERPRET from the book. People are waking up and seeing how ridiculous this priestcraft really is.
rovingdesertfox 9 months ago
I hope the bible isnt true.
everyone i know will go to hell if its true.
wtf is the point of life?....are we here to play his sick fukn games?
play bad and you will be tortured....wow, great!
MAKER6450 10 months ago 2
so if I write a book about second world war - only including stories I have heard from my father who heard it from my uncle who went to a russian KZ-camp, I would get an acurate description with even the tiniest facts correct and no exagerations
it goes a long way to explain all the inaccuracies in the bible i think
40 years later you get matthew who writes mostly about Jesus' ethics
80 years later in luke and the others the stories have grown and you get the stories about miracles
henriktor 1 year ago
There are aproximatly 50 versions of the bible, which leads me to raise suspition about it.......it may have been fraud.
ZeckRichards 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Read "MIsquoting Jesus" by Bart Ehrman (or watch the youtube videos). The early manuscripts were wildly variant and inaccurate. If you can find a reputable textual critic ( someone who is truly an expert in the field of ancient new testament manuscripts) who is also a fundamentalist christian, please give me their name. I would like to hear what they have to say.
MrSteveSpears 1 year ago
wel i think d Bible was sent from God nd it ws authentic until changes wre made nd r continud to b made.
billupundit 1 year ago
Jesus didn't give us the bible,and he never denounced judaism. In fact, according to the story, he taught that he should question the temple and that everything we need to have a relationship with god is already in us. So no need for a bible or religion, the god of the universe doesn't have a "people" that would imply that not all is his creation.
romney27 1 year ago
There is no text in the Gospels which claims to be an eye-witness account. Care to suggest one?
HConstantine 1 year ago
the babel have soo many things that don't go toghether how God would have a child with a humain so he had already creat angel who are better than humain in every thing it's clear like sun but this some people are trying to hid sun with a fok ...!!
abdelhadi55 1 year ago
The Bible was written by the same people who thought the Earth was flat.
bookwormsrcool 1 year ago 5
@bookwormsrcool Actually the bible states that the world is a sphere...
zcaz23 1 year ago
@bookwormsrcool The bible teaches the earth is round
SAUNDERSacts2618 5 months ago
he's just another delusional schizo!
princesslmt 1 year ago
Eyewitness account my ass. The guy that wrote Genesis was he there in the beginning.
olh1152 1 year ago 2
That's not true. It's almost - likely all, hearsay. There are no verifiable eye witnesses. And there are no correlating public records.
Anyone who believes the bible knows little about it's actual origin, and likely doesn't care anyway.
Religion is a popular hobby, enjoy it with your friends, but don't substitute it for reality.
agroundhere 1 year ago
@786Nasrat, you don't remember what verse? Isn't a true Muslim supposed to memorize the entire Quran? It sounds like you're not dedicated to the Quran. Also when you make an argument in defense of the Quran, Back it up with chapters and verses. You say us Christians are making things up, but you don't show us one piece of evidence from the Quran. It sounds like you're the one making it up. There's a word for that...SELF RIGHTEOUS!
underground0331 1 year ago
@underground0331 brother you need to undrestand that there is no such a thing as a true muslim..there is a strong believer and a weak believer..and no you are not sapose to memorise the whole quran..you can if you want to be it is not compulsary..yes i should give you the verse of quran when i make a quote but it doesnt mean i am making it up..anyways anything else you want to say brother
786Nasrat 1 year ago
Jesus does claim to be God. In John 10:30-33 Jesus says "The Father and I are one." Immediately the Jews try to stone him saying he's blasphemous, also saying "you, a man make yourself God." Jesus never corrects them, He never says, "I didn't say I was God. Meaning his claim of The Father and I are one is the understanding of I am God. It's not I that's reading the bible out of context, it's you, if you're even reading it at all.
underground0331 1 year ago
you are making this up urself..if this is what it is than why didnt jesus says himself i am god..do you now undrestand what i am trying to say..why didnt jesus in his own words say, god made me in his image or i am god or worship me, take me as your lord for i am your lord..why does he keep refering to his father..stop saying things out of your self and prove to me from your book, from his words..mircles were carried out by all the prophits pbu them, moses, david, solomon, noah etc.
786Nasrat 1 year ago
786Nasrat :..mircles were carried out by all the prophits pbu them, moses, david, solomon, noah
There are NO miracles: NONE.
lizazoon 1 year ago
@lizazoon see comments like these shows you are soo damn arrogant and there is no point in talking to you because if you can admit that they all performed miracle how the hel are you going to believ or admit anything else.. peace be with you my friend
786Nasrat 1 year ago
@786Nasrat : There ar NO miracles. There are phenomena not YET understood by science. Show my one amputee, who got his lost leg back. Thank you
lizazoon 1 year ago
i cant remember what verse it is in the quran where it says for some people even if you bring a dead person alive, they will stil not believe..and you sound like on of those ppl..prophet mohammad pbuh wasasked if you are a true prophit than show us a miracle, he split the moon in half,and when ppl saw that, they said it was a trick, now my friend there are plenty of miracles for those whoare looking for guidance and true path,bt for ppl like you, you need to wait and find out when you die,
786Nasrat 1 year ago
@786Nasrat Hey, so let's try it. Bring someone back to life, split the moon.
What are you waiting for?
The reason people don't believe in miracles is just common sense. You wouldn't believe it if I claimed a miracle happened, now would you? Of course not. (well, I'm assuming here)
Don't be so gullible.
agroundhere 1 year ago
may allah guide you before your life is over as its more better if you find better life than living a life with no purpose..peace be with you my friend
786Nasrat 1 year ago
you see once you believe that there he is trying to say worhsip him or take him as your lord than at one point in the bible jesuspbuh says i can not do anything without my fathers will..now if they are one why would he need to have his permision to do something..however if you just take jesus pbuh as just a messenger than everything the bible fits together, bt if you take him as a lord than contridections will take place just like the one i quoted..the rest is in your hand my friend..
786Nasrat 1 year ago
Genesis 38:8-10 NASB
Then Judah said to Onan, Go in to your brothers wife, and perform your duty as a brother-in-law to her, and raise up offspring for your brother. Onan knew that the offspring would not be his; so when he went in to his brothers wife, he wasted his seed on the ground in order not to give offspring to his brother
lizazoon 1 year ago
hay there's no America on the map!
BovrilKetchup 2 years ago
The Book of Mormon adds to the witness that the Bible is true and that Jesus is the Christ.
Gregvnielsen 2 years ago
no1 says bible is false, no1 says jesus is not the christ..wat we saying is jesus is not god..it does not say in the bible jesus is god..jesus does not say in the bible im god worship me..why cant you undrestand one thing..if i wore god or i were to give message to ppl to worship me, i would introduce ma self and den perform miracles den i woudl say now worship me as i m the god..but jesus did not do that..instead he said im sent from father to glorofy him..now how can u ppl think he is his son
786Nasrat 2 years ago
@786Nasrat John 1:1 In the beginning was the WORD, and the WORD was with God, and the WORD was GOD. Now read.
Gen 1:26 And God said, Let US make man in OUR image after OUR likeness.
You see the WORD is Jesus Christ. Jesus is God. They made man in there image.
73828 2 years ago
i am not trying to be pain in the back side or be rude here bt u sereasly need to wake up..read what you just wrote..they made man in their image..how can a man be image of god..it doesnt make sense..and stop saying things of your own..write that in context for me..dont just pick and choose..if you can find any where in the bible that JESUS pbuh himself says i am god and worship me..I'l convert to christianity right now..
786Nasrat 2 years ago
John 10:30 "I and the Father are one."
You say you're not a Christian, I just want to know what your explaination of this verse means.
According to me it says that the Father(God) and Jesus are one...the same...not seperated etc...
underground0331 1 year ago
@underground0331
i can give you an explanation of that without its context..you see if i were to read that i would believe that god and jesus pbuh are in same path and are working for the same goal therefore they are as one team..meaning you follow him you are following me..no where in that verse you can say he is saying if you worship him or take him for your lord your taking me as your lord..or whether you wroship him or me it is the same..how can you say that means like that..
786Nasrat 1 year ago
what the hell is this man saying?
i cant undrestand anything, i mean he confuses me,
in psychology, it is believed that eye witness testomoney is not accurate..
and i believ it is true in some ways...u c when two ppl sees the same incident, dey will give different testomony, try it f you dnt believe me..soo wudnt that make bible words of humans instead of god..
786Nasrat 2 years ago
Naturally what Josh McDowell says is designed to be confusing, using lots of words to say saying nothing. Its what one does when one has no facts to back assertion.
TheNewRenaissance 2 years ago
what part of spoken english don't you understand, this mans explanation is as clear as day
sixpenny1 2 years ago
eye witness accounts!!! lie #1. the gospels were decades after it suppossedly happened.
tyrone9009 2 years ago
eye witness account means just that....they saw it happen so wheres the lie, or are you erroneously trying to say theres a time limit for an eye witness account to be valid
sixpenny1 2 years ago
You are simply wrong there are no eye witness accounts for any of this. The gospels where not written by any eye witnesses.
tyrone9009 2 years ago
@tyrone9009 prove that there weren't any eye witnesses. Were you there?
underground0331 1 year ago
There is no God!! I love watching this! Once you know the truth! Ignorance becomes clear!!
bananabread119 2 years ago
Your right He is our brother, i don't know why i see Him as my Master. About the violence in scripture, Jesus sounded a new era... God bless you my friend!
GodsRevelation 2 years ago
Jesus (according to your bible) called all of us brothers and sisters, but, gosh. If you want to deny his word, that's up to you.
However, notwithstanding, no person who wrote any of the many books of the bible ever knew Jesus.
It's that simple.
Even more simple is that Deuteronomy is not entirely written by Moses, nor coule it be a record of the CREATOR's words, as it extends violence as an answer, not love as was the command given us all, including folks not in any religious movement.
BonemanHA 2 years ago
incorrect. To the information we have today is that none of the writers of the new testament ever knew, or even met Jesus.
ArtThroughtheAges 2 years ago
Did Jesus choose His own diciples to tell the word of God? You are saying that Jesus is not true.
GodsRevelation 2 years ago
No. I am saying that nobody in the bible knew Jesus PERSONALLY.
This is an old argument, though, and most scholars will point that out.
First, you must decide if the bible is worth following to the letter.
If so, then to argue whether it is true or not is of no importance at all. Doing the word is al that matters.
If you decide that men wrote the bible, then all one has to do is walk away from the childish behavior of people that claim it to be the "word of god"....
Jesus was our brother
BonemanHA 2 years ago
Jesus is my Lord, King and Saviour not my brother. Jesus recited from scripture, He learned people in relation to the Old Testament that makes the Testament true. The Bible is written with men as instrument, the Holy Spirit as the Holy inspiration. God bless you!
GodsRevelation 2 years ago
Well the Bible didn't come from god from fax did it? Man made errors and one sided opinions and perspectives litter the book. And do you really believe there were no dinosaurs, the world was made in 7 days, a great flood covered the earth, a man lived 3 days in a fish, 6 billion people decended from 2 people and a snake talking to a rib woman doomed us all?
superaragon 2 years ago
There could have been a man called Jesus, but he could have just been a man claiming to be some prophet, and his "disciples" wrote accounts of him being a prophet. If I claimed I was Jesus reincarnate and had 12 people following me around worshipping me, you wouldn't call me the son of god now would you?
superaragon 2 years ago
BenAliGtor: The oldest NT manuscripts we have, have been dated from 60 to 150 AD. The oldest OT manuscripts we have (the Dead Sea scrolls, found in 1947, in a cave in Qumran) date as far back as 250 - 150 BC. What's interesting is that when compared with our present day copies, and it is a near perfect match, word for word.
pratt2181 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
You cant trust the bible AT ALL,
it was a bronze-age fireside book of myth to start with
and it has been degraded steadily ever since.
It is so vague, so internally inconsistent,
so filled with scientific and historical error
and so many contradictions
that it is totally worthless for any sort
of instruction or moral guidance.
Imaginefree69 3 years ago
you did even make pisc. of him 2000 year ago shame of you...
BAGREM 3 years ago
A quantum leap exists from "the scriptures as originally God breathed are inerrant " to "the Bible is 100% accurate". The oldest complete NT manuscript dates to the Fourth Century, and the oldest complete OT manuscript dates to even later. Chains of custody and records of transcriptions back to the autographs can't be documented. Therefore, even if someone accepts a traditional standard of inspiration, one cannot conclude that the Bible we hold in our hands is "the inerrant word of God".
BenAliGtor 3 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
shas1814 3 years ago
For another point of view watch the three part series, "The Genius of Charles Darwin" hosted by world famous scientist Richard Dawkins. Also watch the seven part series, "The Voyage of Charles Darwin." Malcolm Stoddard who portrays Darwin is absoulutely brilliant. Don't forget. The 200th birthday of Charles Darwin is coming up in February, 2009. So we can look forward to seeing television specials dedicated to this truly great man!!!
NECHAUII 3 years ago 2
test test test
NECHAUII 3 years ago
and how do you know thay didnt make the book up coz thay had know way of understanding it so thay had u think of sum think
isme16 3 years ago
Please do not post a comment if you can't spell 'they' and 'because.' Also, learn when to use know/no in a sentence...
shawndrogoff 3 years ago
By the way thank you Josh, (or who ever is in charge of this page) for allowing me to put an opposing viewpoint here. It's is good to here both sides of an argument even though you may not agree with one side. Some Christians pages don't allow anything other that what they agree with, and that is frustrating because you don't learn that way.
gokuhawks14 3 years ago 4
Thank you, Josh! I have given as gifts at least 1 copy of your "New Evidence Demands a Verdict," and can't seem to find the one I found to replace it. With my bad memory, I probably gave it away, too! Love those infallible truths!
LindaSegal 3 years ago
yeah god told those ppl AND THERE STILL MISTAKES
straightofdahood 3 years ago
this is not mean but a statment but so have u as in the bible no one is good but god
Tedafire 3 years ago
No one was there so no one knows, it is a story like all the stories we write now no difference.
Let's see if your god will save you when the time comes...
My monies on (FAT CHANCE)
santron5 3 years ago
The bible defeats itself. Study it, you will see.
Philos2006 3 years ago
lolz, can you prove that :) Email me on my youtube page, i'll like to know your thoughts
bladezored 3 years ago
I am sorry, but by no means is this confirmation of anything. You are speaking of people who supposedly saw things and people who wrote down the stories of people who knew people who saw things
pacificguitarist 3 years ago
I think you are missing the point here. A modern example would be aliens. If there is a book written about aliens, where people interview supposed eye-witnesses, it would still be shaky. Why? Not everyone agrees, differing accounts, not a lot of witnesses to singular events (meaning not a crowd seeing 1 alien encounter). However, this was widely spread witnesses, large multitudes saw miracles of Jesus; and if it couldn't be verified, the Jews would never have let them write the accounts.
Sickopath333 3 years ago
Humans and time warp history. It is largely accepted from a historical standpoint that Jesus was the messiah a few hundred years after he lived, not during. The Jews not allowing people to write down accounts I think is historically innacurate on your part and doesn't reflect the thinking of the time. Not to mention being wrong on a subject never ever stopped people from writing about it. I am not saying I don't believe in Jesus because I am still constantly trying to figure out my beliefs.
pacificguitarist 3 years ago
Yes but as he argues and explains there are factors that make The Bible 99.9% accurate over the time it has been written. So what needs to be shown isn't whether or not it's changed (it mostly hasn't) but whether or not it was accurate in the 1st place.
The apostles, who wrote within a few decades after Jesus died confirm him as the Messiah, whether it was popular or not is irrelevant. And if the apostles had written something wrong the Jews would have stopped them for religious reasons.
Sickopath333 3 years ago
The bible can NEVER be the word of a loving god. If you still believe it to be god`s word after studying it, you have a mental problem.
Philos2006 3 years ago
Actually from what I have been learning about simple passages and how there is so much more to them than the face value I am starting to have more faith that any problems I myself had with The Bible are probably out of my ignorance. For example: If you have faith the size of a mustard seed you can move a mountain. It sounds like Jesus using exaggeration to make a point (or we have little faith) but mountain is a Middle East metaphor for a problem. That little example hid a lot more.
Sickopath333 3 years ago
David Blane performed before a crowd of millions. But no one actually thinks its real magic is it? Its just a trick, an illusion.
superaragon 2 years ago
Tricks and illusions that can be explained. Sure, I can't tell you how it's done, but I'm sure his peers and technical wizards can make educated guesses on it. If Jesus was just a master illusionist, why would David Blane not be able to figure out a way for him to do the trick? Those primitive people couldn't possibly do something we couldn't, so please do explain how he pulled that little stunt off.
Sickopath333 2 years ago
Simple. People in the past were much dumber than today. They took rainbows, lightning and rain as "God's" emotions and sacrificed virgins. Switching six pots of water as wine when no one was looking would be pretty easy back then. Plus, they probably didn't even ask "how did you do that?" and simply said, "you must be the son of god!"
superaragon 2 years ago
Of course.. people back then were all simple and stupid.. and I was more referring to the one about Jesus faking his own death and resurrection, since it's more important and all. Plus, let us not forget, lots of people obviously wanted him to die, so I doubt they would let that little detail of, hey that's not Jesus, slip past without questioning. Or that of, hey wait, he's still breathing, nice try Jesus.. *stab*
Sickopath333 2 years ago
One thing to remember: if we were to discount the accounts which millions of people have accepted as true, then one might also find it necessary to throw out all history that uses written eyewitness accounts, including all references to the Roman Emperors, Napoleon, the Founding Fathers of the USA.
Christina
Josh McDowell Ministry
JoshMcDowell 3 years ago
The difference between these figures and Jesus was the amount written on them. Also, by your logic shouldn't that mean i believe in mohammad, buddah, and Quetzalcoatel?
pacificguitarist 3 years ago
Bible has 25k+ preserved manuscripts--6k Greek, 10k Latin & 9k in other early languages. "Iliad" is 2nd w/ 643, Herodotus & Thucydides, where we get our world history only 8. Also, thousands of yrs the Bible has existed, how many people have tried to destroy it & it's still the #1 book sold in the world? Mohammed, Buddha, Confucianism, Marxism, and Darwin's evolution is based on theory or their teachings -- not observable data. We have to look at who was Jesus and what did he do.
JoshMcDowell 3 years ago
Darwin's theory not based on observable data? what are you talking about? finding transitional fossils between species is not observable? there are many fossils showing the transition from fish to amphibians I'm sorry but I think that is called observable data weather you agree with evolution or not. creationist myths like to tell people that no one has ever found transitional fossils. according to a majority of paleontologists and biologist, that is not true because the fossils exist lol.
gokuhawks14 3 years ago
I'm sorry but there aren;t any transsitional fossills for proving that fish evolved to amphibians.Evolution is just a theory,it's not truth.Haven't 600 scientists signed a document in which they denounce and reject the theory of evolution of being true?
Valandil00 3 years ago
definition of a scientific theory "In science a theory is a testable model of the manner of interaction of a set of natural phenomena, capable of predicting future occurrences or observations of the same kind, and capable of being tested through experiment or otherwise verified through empirical observation. For the scientist, "theory" is not in any way an antonym of "fact". For example, it is a fact that an apple dropped on earth has been observed to fall towards the center of the planet."
gokuhawks14 3 years ago
(other reply goes first) that is how science uses the word. typically when the conman man uses the word, they really mean what science calls a hypothesis. which just means an idea or exploring a possibility. scientific theories are based on observable data and facts. gravity is a scientific theory. no one disputes if that is real lol. and Archaeopteryx is a good example of a transitional fossil. but really it is up to you if you don't want to believe in something that has been proven to exist.
gokuhawks14 3 years ago
The Archaeopteryx is not a a transsional fossil because it already has feathers(i've known about since i was 12)...again ...IT ALREADYA HAS FEATHERS,it's not proof that it changed ,there is not intermeddiate fossil ,we would have to have thousands of it!
Valandil00 3 years ago
ya that is the problem with creationist they take real evidence of the fossil and just say oh its not transitional even though science shows evidence that it is or like the Australopithecus is just an ape even though it has traits of humans and apes in the the bone and skeletal structure showing evidence of a transition. look all I'm saying is that there is observable data for the theory. much more that creationism which really has no scientific evidence for it. its just faith based.
gokuhawks14 3 years ago
and yes the archeopteryx has feathers, but it also has many traits of the deinonychosaurs a threropod dinosaur that did not fly. In fact the archeopteryx has more deinonychosaurs like traits than bird traits. jaws with sharp teeth, three fingers with claws, a long bony tail, hyperextensible second toes. these are some common traits among the fossils. there are hundreds of fossils that show transitions over time form one to another and then a fossil is found that shows a mix of both species.
gokuhawks14 3 years ago
You don't udnerstand...it's not a transssitional animal...it's ANOTHER ANIMAL!
Valandil00 3 years ago
There is other evidence of evolution, like viruses evolving over time to be resistant to anti viral drugs, just ask any HIV patient why they take up to 14 drugs a week. Also, there is no such thing as a document that rejects evolution, in fact, 99% of scientists base evolution on fact and those who don't are ridiculed out of the arena.
superaragon 2 years ago
99%of the scientist...oh really...what about the respected creationist scientist?Majority does not decide what's the truth.I believe in evo up to a certain point!
Valandil00 2 years ago
Well, the "respected creationist scientists" are extinct or have converted, virtually none remain, and those who do are rarely invited to any scientific debates. And if a majority believe in a theory, you can be pretty sure they have a wealth of evidence to back it up. And you cannot believe a theory "up to a point". A theory is a theory, you can't take gravity halfway, or electroflux theory.
superaragon 2 years ago
Which, by your own admission kind of says something about the whole thing doesn't it.. if you even question it you are ridiculed and cast as an invalid. I'm sorry, I thought science was about questioning theories..
Sickopath333 2 years ago
Could you qualify your words more specifically? "My own admission" "whole thing" " question it" And no, science is formulating theories, finding supporting evidence, and accepting it if the evidence is conclusive, or rejecting it if evidence shows otherwise. The bible is just stating a theory, but pretends to sleep when someone questions it, hoping that he'll give up and go away. And now people are smart enough not to go away...
superaragon 2 years ago
Sickopath333
"I thought science was about questioning theories."
Erm, not quite. Questionability merely states that something is open to challenge, or to be challenged. In science everything should be treated as tentative, but the only way you can counter a theory is through the process of Falsifiability. Therefore if a theory is false, then this could be demonstrated through experimentation and/or observation.
bettySwollox 2 years ago
@JoshMcDowell excellent response.
anewdayproductions 8 months ago
Okay, whats your beef with the bible? This is not an aggressive stance, I'm just curious on what you think.
Thanks!
WorldWar2ismylastnam 1 year ago
AMEN!!!
JoeyVoices 3 years ago
Ah, but thats true based on records and preservable media. We have greek pottery, roman artifacts, material evidence and more concerning those. The only evidence for the Bible is: the Bible. Also, an unbiased perspective is a big plus, any records written by non Christians would count as good evidence if proven reliable. Please, christians ask for much more proof concerning evolution than you have for the Bible.
superaragon 2 years ago
Mr McDowell,
From what book and chapter can I read that quote about Mark being the interpreter of Peter?
Glorthac 4 years ago
Anthony,
Josh says this in New Evidence That Demands A Verdict, Chapter 3 under "External Evidence Test for the Reliability of the New Testament".
He also refers to this in chapters 10, 30 and 36 of New Evidence.
I hope that this helps you.
Chris Sleath
Josh McDowell Ministry
JoshMcDowell 4 years ago
Eusebius was known as a liar and a forger. The Church admits that they do not know who wrote the Gospels.
ForBibletruth 4 years ago