The Pill Kills Babies

[nevashiva]

You saying I want to be able to have sex, and don't give a fuck about what sex actually does, is like someone stealing people's money and saying well dam it I need to be able to eat. Don't make a tragedy of your own needs at the expense of other people, even as tiny as a cell. And the retarded logic of "well zygotes naturally get screwed over 50% of the time anyways", thats like saying some people die anyways why can't I kill to prevent famine or some bs, what kind of retarded argument is this?

[nevashiva]

Why don't people who say fuck zygotes they ain't no babies, get there head of there asses abortion doesn't always give something out that looks like a baby, some people are even born with no functioning human abilities, or any kind of heavy malformation, you are saying if it doesn't have a face it is not a life?, if not then what are you saying. Why don't you just say I'll take my chances fuck zygotes or babies or anything as long i keep having sex the way I want, and not get babies. Be honest.

[grungefreak10]

It isn't easy to be an atheist who opposes abortion (specifically late-term.) But the pro-lifer's assertion that the single cell that is the zygote is a human, and that use of birth control pills, or the morning-after medication is akin to abortion of a late-term fetus is just ridiculous to the point of being offensive.

[Avensadora]

Human rights??? That is totally made up by a biased subject; humans. What about tree rights? No Species deserves more rights.

[Avensadora]

So what if a sperm and an egg die? They are simply the information required to make a fetus.

[TheMrgoku1985]

ROTFLMAO!

This guy is retarded.

[tam3580]

of course they had to have a man host this video....

[vs17panel]

IVF is very much something about which we protest. We believe, however, that the number of embryos lost is greater with abortion (and the pill) than IVF.

[xxxBakeneckoxxx]

Do you think I give a flying fuck whether or not it's expelling a fertilized ovum? A fertilized ovum is NOT a baby. The whole reason I take the pill is to avoid having a baby which my partner and I can't afford to even feed, given our current financial situation. If it weren't for the pill, we wouldn't be able to have a normal sexual relationship without worrying about bringing another life into the world that we can't take care of.

[ladyEulaelie]

@agalligani When an ovum becomes fertilized a woman is diagnosed with pregnancy. According to science, conception is the beginning of human life. The pill doesn't always prevent pregnancy but one of the result from taking the pill is a thinned uterus. While a women is pregnant, the environment of the womb will not allow implantation. Anything that terminates a pregnant is an abortifacient. So yes, the pill kills.

[ladyEulaelie]

@agalligani Going on what my ears and eyes don't ever catch, I imagine that the reason why you don't see much protest against ivf is because there is not much ever heard about it. That would be my guess.

[ladyEulaelie]

@agalligani Well yes, technically it would be an abortion. It's not a matter of my opinion. I can honestly say that I'm not as passionate as others about frozen embryos being tossed in dumpsters bc honestly, it's hard for me to identify with frozen embryos and I admit, it's a flaw of mine. But for me to say I see no moral obligation in creating a human and discarding them instead of keeping it's life cycle going would completely contradict the fact that I think ALL humans deserve human rights.

[ladyEulaelie]

@agalligani

[agalligani]

"Kills Babies"? Who's lying now? A fertilized ovum is not a baby. Any idiot can percieve that!

[ladyEulaelie]

Most of the women on here are hostile, bitter feminist. I'm for healthy, practical methods for women to continue intimacy w/ their spouses w/out possibility pregnancy. However, we need to address the fact that something is screwy about the pill & our healthy is in jeopardy. I have a life outside the bedroom; I understand some of you bitches don't, but there are other, natural forms of birth control that WON'T PUT YOU AT RISK FOR MULTIPLE - FORMS - OF - CANCER. Stop being stubborn & listen!!!

[HarHoll]

You got my attention- with your fancy hand gestures and wiggly eyebrow action.

[tooponygirl2009]

This is crap. I was on the pill for over 8 years and almost every month I took a pregnancy test just to be certain that I wasn't pregnant before going out to drink or party. The only time that I tested positive was when I intentionally got pregnant for my children (whom I'm glad that I waited to have.)

[ForeignPedestrian]

Of course the pill kills babies. Anyone on the pill for a year has had at least one abortion. The pill also increases a woman's chance to develop breast and cervical cancer. If men truly loved the women in their lives they would beg them to not go on this carcinogenic. What man would stay on a steroid for the length of time women use it? They are not that easily manipulated. Women, save your own lives, and take back control of your bodies. Sex isn't everything.

[ForeignPedestrian]

Of course the pill kills babies. Anyone on the pill for a year has had at least one abortion. The pill also increases a woman's chance to develop breast and cervical cancer. If men truly loved the women in their lives they would beg them to not go on this carincogenic. What man would stay on a steroid for the length of time women use it? They are not that easily manipulated. Women, save your own lives, and take back control of your bodies. Sex isn't everything.

[ahiltz20]

Thank you for giving me another reason why I am happy to be a lesbian......to stay away from ignorant men like you.

[musiq50ul]

so they just want us to have babies out of wedlock instead of use the pill?

[gingerbreadcorpses]

Thank you for reaffirming why I am pro-choice.

[Kayleahful]

Did you know if a woman takes alittle too much Vitamin C (at the recommended level when pregnate) it causes an induced miscarrage.

Why not protest that too?...

[ladyEulaelie]

@Kayleahful

The goal is to make people aware that the pill is indeed, an abortifacient. I didn't know this. I would never willing take the pill, rosemary, or ingest a little too much vitamin C if I knew those agents could possibly result in an abortion. I'm for contraceptives, but I am personally against abortion and would never never never get one. I would probably have homicidal ideations towards my doctor and the manufacture of the pill I was taking, I'd be so disgusted w/ myself.

[Kayleahful]

@ladyEulaelie Well thats fine I respect your decision and all the more power to you. But the more you begin to look around and observe deeply there is so much around us that could cause a miscarage. Hormones in food, polution, constrinious activity, etc... Even a stair case

Just as a side note, It does say in Birth control lables that "Do not take if you are pregnate or planning to become pregnate as it may result in loss of pregnancy"

So it says right on the packet, or at least mine does.

[ladyEulaelie]

@Kayleahful

Theoretically, the pill works in 4 different ways to prevent pregnancy (conception). A woman may still have a diagnosed pregnancy b/c of the chances of failure of the pill preventing conception but the pill thins out the lining of the uterus preventing implantation. Anything that prevents conception is contraception. Prevention of implantation is not a form of contraception....it is an abortifacient. While I may want to prevent pregnancy (conception), I don't want an abortion.

[agalligani]

@ladyEulaelie - If an egg is fertilized in the lab and the technician refuses to jam it into some woman's uterus, is that an abortion? Some people believe so I suppose. So why aren't all the women so passionate about this issue willing to "save the lives" of all the frozen embryos for in vitro patients that wind up in the dumpster? Which leads to another question... why aren't these people protesting in vitro fertilization, which results in thousands of disguarded "babies" every year?

[leiapeison]

@Kayleahful i know of a woman who miscarried that way. good point. keep up the good work

[Kayleahful]

@leiapeison I also wanted to add that the supreme court case hes talking about was passed and legislated on the basis of PRIVACY. (As was Roe v Wade) If it was'nt for this case, birth control would be outlawed.

To be prolife is one thing, but to accomidate and justify MANDATORY BREEDING is disguesting!!!!

[Kayleahful]

@leiapeison *accommodate,

my bad :D

[belliebells]

So.

Birth Control = KILLS BABIES.

THIS is what you're going with now?

next they're going to say that CONDOMS ARE EVIL TOO.

[turtlelackie]

@belliebells condoms dont kill babies when they dont succeed in preventing the release of an egg.

[lambchopclmt]

by that logic, drinking coffee or smoking causes abortion, not miscarriage. -_- this video is ridiculous.

[067Gar]

This video , but not just this video . I luv how Catholics use all of science to state & prove their point . Yet when It doesn't support their beliefs , science is flawed .

May GOD strike me down if I am wrong .

,................Hmmm......

...hmmm..........hmm......

....Hey , guess what ?

Still here , ......imagine that .

I know , I 'll tell you just what Believers ( my name for people of (GOD) faith ) tell Atheist . You have the right to your beliefs , just keep it to yourself ...

[modomnoc1]

It's true what he is saying if you believe a human being is at the moment of conception? However, even catholics use birth control pills because people don't want 5 children or more. If one followed Catholic teaching most families would be at least have 5 children or above. Unfortunately most of us Catholics adapt catholic teaching to suit our economic needs and happiness. I don't wish to comment on the rights and wrongs of this video because the world changes and most people attempt to do good.

[LadySakure]

We can argue about this until the cows come home. There are pros and cons to every situation, abortion and pregnancy alike. The pill stemmed from women who kept having babies and kept having babies until their bodies were worn. There is no easy victory. You keep the baby, you ruined your life. You give the baby up, you're a selfish, horrible mother. You abort, you're a murderer. You take the pill, you kill. You practice safe sex, you're a whore. Ridiculus.

[miniaturerooms]

OMG LET'S MAKE SURE WOMEN NEVER HAVE CONTROL OVER THEIR OWN BODIES.

[KyanisSunweaver]

This video was all I needed to know to not take these people seriously.

[steptomyhomegirl]

thank you for this!!

[psykkodukk]

Do you enjoy lying? Is that fun for you?

[Clearie552]

lol killing sperms and eggs is not killing babies. Eggs and sperms are just cells that are part of your body. Do you think its immoral to scratch your arm because you are killing skin cells that are part of your body?

personally i think a embryo is a life once it has a brain. Before it has a brain, it is not capable of processing any data, feeling any pain, or having any opinions about its own existence.

[steptomyhomegirl]

@Clearie552 a sperm and an egg both contribute to the conception of a human baby. Sure they are cells or tissue, but these cells and tissue are the smallest functional units of LIVING things - without them, the babies wouldn't exist.

An embryo is already "a life" - it is just an unborn human being in regards to its development as a human.

[enewhuis]

@Clearie552 Life is not an object. Life is a process that started a long time ago and that parents transfer to their children. Any action that prevents the continuation of the process stops the process. And to stop the process of life is to kill.

[Clearie552]

@enewhuis So you should just stop eating then. Because onions and apples are living things that have the potential to keep growing.

[enewhuis]

@Clearie552 The discussion is human life, not plants. However temperance suggests that one not consume more apples and onions than one needs to stay alive. So you do have a good point.

[SeeProfileForDetails]

@enewhuis /watch?v=kUwnMX8ht3U

[CanadiaNecro1]

A fertilized egg is not a baby. Most of the time the zygote doesn't even implant and is shed naturally anyway. That's why you don't get pregnant every time you ovulate. The pill actually prevents you from ovulating in the first place so there is no egg to get fertilized. If you miss a couple pills consecutavely you might ovulate during that time, and then you could possibly get pregnant and you will sustain the pregancy even if you keep taking pills.

This video is pure fallacy and propaganda.

[LadyRuin2012]

@CanadiaNecro1 Of course it is--that's all they're good at. And you are right. About 40% of the time the egg doesn't attach.

[YourOasis97]

@CanadiaNecro1 No it's not a baby but it's still a life form that will take shape if there are no complications. Human life begins at fertilization/conception.

[louie88uayan]

read more, study more i think you are misinformed...

[mistymiss83]

I don't believe in using birth control pills, and neither does my husband! We're ready for as many children as God choose's to give us, and I think it's sad that so many women just have sex and don't have any responisbility or consience about it. They might think that their happy or fufilled, but that's just a feminist myth. I know that it's women like me who waited until marriage and don't prevent the gift of children who have REAL happiness.

[MyrtleMessmer]

Actually, I LOVE these lunatics that think the pill is the moral equivalent of murder. They really alienate the mainstream from the prolife movement. Seriously.  When people find out that prolifers think the pill is the same as abortion, they sort of drift away. Deal with it, losers -- people are going to keep having sex and enjoying it, no matter how much you scream.

[YourHumanRights]

Not good for you and yours in the killing lobby that your own troops are defecting and ratting you out.

View the Blood Money Trailer on YouTube.. Nathanson and Jane Roe are being joined by many others now. Good luck keeping it all a secret..

(have you looked at the polls lately...?) Try Gallup for starters.. 2010 is gunna be real tough - and Jersey and Virginia are already going to be pro life in the mean time..

The UDHR lives.

[TheProf1988]

Prochoice arguments are not borne out of suppressing evidence and they are held on their merits.

Fundamentalism taking over america is not something to be happy about. but then again, if you cant field an intelligent argument why not just get the ignorant and bigoted majority to come to the rescue, eh?

[YourHumanRights]

answer the 7 questions that the prof could not then. I am a socialist and have mentioned nothing about religion. That's just you trying to change the subject.

Relate your support for ripping children from the womb to Geneva, Helsinki, and the UDHR.

[TheProf1988]

N one is mentioning religion. Youy don't have to be religious to be a fanatical fundamentalist fucktard.

[YourHumanRights]

I'll file "fucktard" along with your pleas to be civil. Again, I thought you were all done with me?????

Tell us how a woman grows a male prostate in her belly and that it is part of her body.

8th. question you can't and won't answer..

SHOW us all the evidence from peer reviewed medical journal meta analysis that proves that abortion does NOT cause preterm birth and thus birth defects later in life.

Compromised cervix and damaged uterus are myths??

[specil]

I want to punch this guy in the face. What a load of crap. Pro-lifers will try anything to restrict women's freedom.

[MyrtleMessmer]

J4N15, you rock! Save the potatoes!

[YourHumanRights]

It's incredible how easily some feeble minded people can be brainwashed by the media.

[J4N15]

I kill babies and there's nothing you can do about it.

[stoppuser]

J4N15, Admitting it is the first step.

[sundarveerappan]

Nice try....the video explains how IUDs work. We can argue whether that is abortion or not. But the pill PREVENTS ovulation. No fertilization happens. Please don't misuse science for your agenda.

[YourHumanRights]

Watch it again, dummy. The pills say right on the package that they have multiple modes of operation - including after conception. Medical science is never going to change to meet your cruel political agenda.

[sundarveerappan]

Nice...Typical. Playing the man and not the issue. Note, I never said I support any agenda. If used as indicated, the pill actually stops ovulation. Full Stop. This is an undisputable FACT. You can argue about abortion till you are blue in the face. That is not my point.

[YourHumanRights]

Life beginning at conception is a medical, scientific, and embryonic fact that you and the killing lobby cannot hide from. AT CONCEPTION, an entirely unique 46 chromosomes (only humans have this) and DNA are created. Identical twins can split 3 days later (so there are now no identical twins since the first few weeks of human development have been made to vanish ??)

Female steroids not only cause a host of cancers and other problems, they also work after BREAKTHROUGH OVULATION.

[J4N15]

You do realize that potatoes have 48 chromosomes (beating us), and every life form on earth has DNA? Go protest vegetarianism if your sole argument is how many chromosomes zygotes have.

[YourHumanRights]

Thanks for using the word LIFE in your post. It again points to the fundamental contradictions in your argument. From conception forward, YOU had an entirely unique double helix of DNA, and your 46 chromosomes were human and not a part of any other species. Your mother did not grow an extra head. That head was yours, and is yours. It's just a tragedy that you don't use it - and instead ensure that thousands more heads will be crushed and severed to facilitate other people's convenience.

[J4N15]

A fertilized egg does not contain a head.

[YourHumanRights]

I am a fertilized egg - and so are you. And we have been entirely unique humans with our entirely unique DNA since fertilization/conception. Everything from our eye color to sex to hair color was determined in our DNA code then. Not later. And if someone had killed us as embryos, we would not be having this discussion. Someone else would be. In your cruel world of killing lobby "logic," there is no such thing as identical twins - as that split happens just a few days after conception.

[J4N15]

You WERE a fertilized egg, jackass. You had the IQ of an ear of corn (doesn't seem like that's changed much, but that's besides the point), you had no relations, no feelings, and no thoughts. That's what I value in a life.

[stoppuser]

So you admit the boy or girl is a life. Good. We all started from that moment of creation and all human persons deserve that right to live outside the womb just like we did.

[TheProf1988]

A sperm and an ovum has a unique and complete human genome. It has metabolism and homeostasis.

Sperm and ova are as very much alive as you or I, so during menturation a life is lost, during ejaculation MILLIONS of lives are lost.

The only different between a gemete and a zygote is one genome. A zygote has two. There is no use in crying over spilt sperm, so in the same way we can abort with a clear conscience.

[TheProf1988]

Life begins during spermatogenesis and oogenesis. Are you seriously trying to suggest that sperm and ova are not alive?

Humans only have 23 chromosomes in the genome. We have 23 pairs, thats 2 genomes. DNA is created when the sperm and the egg are formed, not at conception.

[YourHumanRights]

hahaha - another quack comes around with his weird, Mengele "science."

YOU have 23 chromosomes from your father, and 23 from your mother. YOU have entirely unique DNA unlike the DNA of your parents sperm and egg.

DUH !

How come embryos are male or female? Male or female what?

How come they can test an embryo for genetics diseases passed on from the father as well as the mother?

must have been a mail order degree - but it's fun to make a fool of you anyway.

When did you become male?

[TheProf1988]

Don't associate me with nazis and don't insult my scientific understanding.

The DNA is sperm and ova are unique from their progenators. Recombination and mutation during meiosis ensure this. Every single one of my sperm has DNA that is unique from mine.

I have two genomes. thats 2 copies of all 23 chromosomes in the genome. Sperm and ova have only one genome.

[YourHumanRights]

Since you are deliberately violating several human rights accords that were specifically enacted to thwart the return of nazi medicine ever again (and failed) the shoe fits and you will wear it, Cinderella. You'd like to make them vanish, but you can't. Hitler and Mengele's embrace of abortion was the first in the modern western world.

You are showing your scientific "understanding" by pretending that the science of DNA is somehow now defunct. Good luck with that.

[TheProf1988]

You have just made the nazi analogy again after I warned you not to.

I am open to pro-life arguments but this is not one of them.

Calling me a nazi is not a logically coherant argument, and now I am not going to be persuaded by what you have to say.

People like you saboatge the pro-life argument. It could be presented in a much better way, but you have to go and fuck it up for yourself.

[YourHumanRights]

It will be necessary to open special institutions for abortions and doctors must be able to help out there in case there is any question of this being a breach of their professional ethics."

Adolph Hitler.

The show fits with regard to medical ethics, Cinderella..

[YourHumanRights]

"In view of the large families of the Slav native population, it could only suit us if girls and women there had as many abortions as possible. We are not interested in seeing the non-German population multiplyWe must use every means to instill in the population the idea that it is harmful to have several children, the expenses that they cause and the dangerous effect on woman's health

[MyrtleMessmer]

You've got to be kidding, Dude. It's CRUEL to let a fertilized egg drop out of your body? As opposed to the NON-cruelty of forcing women to have children they don't want? Something (maybe a flood of backed-up gametes) is twisting your thought process.

[YourHumanRights]

I'm not joking about human rights, even if you are against them. Speaking as one fertilized egg to another, we are able to have this conversation precisely because we did not "drop out" of our mother's body too early. We were nurtured, fed, and protected by our wonderful mothers instead. Anyone can become unwanted at any time. Ask George Tiller. Size and age are not a good way to determine how many human rights someone has. From conception, we are all - including us - entirely unique.

[YourHumanRights]

"WHEREAS the child, by reason of his physical and mental immaturity, needs special safeguards and care, including appropriate legal protection, before as well as after birth"

U.N. Declaration of The Rights of the Child

as enshrined in the

Universal Declaration of Human Rights.

[TheProf1988]

You havn't refuted anything I posted.

Don't make the assumption that I am part of the pro-choice agenda, or that I am a liberal, or a feminist or unethical or any other label you might assume upon me.

I don't like the fact that abortions have to happen, but I am yet to see a logically coherant and scientifically credible argument that can accurately tell me why aborting a zygote is bad but killing gametes isn't.

[YourHumanRights]

Perhaps I'll add a few more questions to the ones you cannot and have not answered below..

An egg contains whose DNA, including family medical history, genetic defects, and so on?

A sperm cell contains whose DNA, including family medical history, genetic defects, and so on?

Does an embryo have the same DNA as sperm or egg?

Whose DNA is contained in the embryos cells?

[TheProf1988]

An ovum contains a unique, mutated and recombined version of its parent germinal epithelium. Ditto for sperm.

A zygote (and embryo) has a combination of the unique DNA found in both gemetes. I repeat: the only difference between an unfertilised ovum and a fertilised one is one genome.

Trying to suggest that the DNA becomes unique at the moment of conception is a fallacy. You should have asserted that the *combination* is unique.

[YourHumanRights]

yes, unique from the mother in the egg (not the father or anyone else)

and unique from the father in sperm (not anyone else)

And entirely unique in the new life as a combination of mother and father's genetic code. DNA never to be replicated even of there is mono zygotic twinning after conception

You tried to dance around the facts with scientific jargon you can google - but you answered at least one question. But you won't answer the rest.

But thanks for proving how easy this really is.

[TheProf1988]

You are trying to suggest that the sperms DNA is the fathers, that the ovums is the mothers and that the embryos is the embryos. This is a fallacy.

The sperm is a recombined version of the fathers, the egg is a recombined version of the mothers and the embryos is a combined version of both the mother *and* fathers.

The artifact you are relying on is one of misinterpretation of human subjective characterisation.

[TheProf1988]

Heres a bit of advice. You are a proponet of Pro-life, and as such, you are a representative of that label. You aren't selling your side of the argument well.

I am pro-choice by default, because I am not persuaded by any pro-life argument I have heard. I have a legitimate criticism of an aspect of your argument and you insult my intelligence and call me a fascist.

You have just lost one person who could have been persuaded by what you had to say. Think about this next time.

[YourHumanRights]

One more question to add to the majority of others you could not answer..

If as a zygote or embryo YOU were destroyed, expelled, aborted - where would you be now?

Would there be another YOU writing on You Tube born some years later?

[TheProf1988]

That is the third strike, YourHumanRights. You continue to wave the childish banner of pro-life proudly high. You have just lost one potential person who could have become a pro-lifer.

I don't like abortion anymore than you do, but your lack of ability to be reasonable has forced my hand.

and btw, you havn't understood why my posts about sperm and ova are relevant yet. Why don't you read them again and this time try to understand what the words mean.

I won't reply to you again.

[YourHumanRights]

What ever made this so called prof think that I wanted to be liked by him or believed anything he said. The bozo won't even dare touch the majority of questions asked of him - and can only avoid them instead. He also thought there was a law legalizing abortion and declaring the unborn as inhuman. The exact opposite is true, but facts have to be suppressed with jargon if you are to keep avoiding the science.

You don't reply to the simplest of questions, so just move on silly.

[TheProf1988]

I would assume as a pro-lifer you would wish to recruit people to your cause, yes? To convince them that abortion is wrong like you do?

You are a poor canidate to advertise your position. You are a zealot, a fanatic, a fundamentalist. You are never going to carry your message across to the other side with such vitriole.

I answered all of your questions. Maybe you should read my posts again.

[YourHumanRights]

LOL. This is so easy. I thought you were never going to respond to me again?! I never wanted a killing lobby apologist like you to like me. Call me whatever you want. I love it. I am defending human rights and you destroy them, UDHR, Geneva, Helsinki, and womens health as well as their children. You are an all purpose killer.

I'm just trying to get people educated to the science and the facts that you and yours are desperately trying to suppress. I'm doing quite well at that, actually.

[TheProf1988]

Shall I clarify the misunderstanding you have?

every sperm has unique DNA indipendant of its parent. Unique DNA is not a valid criterion for the purpose of the abortion issue.

and with regard to only surviving for one week, what has that to do with anything? A baby cannot survive more than one week on its own either.

You can never hope to gain a better understanding of the opposition if you are going to be childish and insult them. You would be thrown out of any debate on the subject.

[YourHumanRights]

Here's a list, copied for the third time, that the kill happy prof can't and won't answer:

When did you become male?

Do you have the same DNA as either your mother or father?

As your twin if you have one?

When was your hair and eye color and fingerprints determined?

If you were aborted as an embryo, where would you be now? Writing here?

If you had been, would there be another YOU walking the earth now exactly like you?

How many totally needless cases of cerebral palsy is abortion worth?

[TheProf1988]

I have already explained why all of your points are irrelevent to the abortion issue. I have DNA descended from my mother and father, of course, but SO DO THE GAMETES.

Don't insult people with cerebal palsy, my best friend has cerebal palsy. For one who claims the moral superiority you don't seem to care about other people.

[YourHumanRights]

I am insulting them by trying to make it less common?! Preterm birth and cerebral palsy have both INCREASED since 1973! Google "abortion preterm birth" and see for yourself in all the medical journals. How many needless cases is it worth for the convenience of abortion?? How many? Answer the question.

And, again, your dad's sperm had exactly ZERO of your mother's DNA - and her egg had exactly ZERO of his. AND yours was/is - at conception - is entirely unique as a SEPARATE HUMAN BEING.

[TheProf1988]

So what you are saying is that the *combination* of gametes is a human being, why hould I accept this?

A single cell does not resemble a human being to me, in fact it more closely resembles an ovum and ova are wasted all the time during mensturation.

I don't need any more conspiritorial BS from you. Abortion does not silence evidence and it has nothing to do with cerebal palsy. CP is due to oxidative stress at childbirth.

[YourHumanRights]

A sperm and an egg are designed to last about a week. The person created at conception, a new male or female human with unique DNA - is designed to last over 100 years. You can't hide from the facts. Three weeks later, that little girl or boy has a beating heart beating his or her own blood. A woman cannot spontaneously grow and extra head and heart and have 2 different blood types, fool.

You've got a lot of letters to write to the medical journals. Good luck with that! LOL.

[TheProf1988]

Sperm and ova are not designed. The baby cannot survive for more than one week either. If you are going to base your argument on sex determination then that is subjective and flawed. some sexual organisms don't have sexes (bizarrely). I am looking for an objective argument.

beating heart, yes, I agree that when the embryo has the rudiments of a heart and braon it should not be aborted with teh exception of dire medical need.

[TheProf1988]

I have an open mind, YourHumanRights. As a rationalist and a humanist I am always open to improving my position on social issues. In fact, most pro-choice people are open minded and will listen to a reasonable, balanced argument.

What they (and I) won't tolerate in a discussion is unfounded personal attacks. Do you not wonder why the majority of the western world views you as crazy brigade? Its because you act like children.

[YourHumanRights]

Killing is killing. Human rights are not negotiable. Pro life wasted many years being polite and allowing the killing lobby to suppress science and the after affects that women have suffered also. The internet has changed things. People can easily look up medical journals online now. The jig is up.

I am an abolitionist. And I'll take my kews from those who came before me 150 years ago. Not from you. People remember me. You will.

Against slavery? Don't own one and shut up!

[TheProf1988]

So why should it be OK to kill gametes? if killing is killing then shouldn't mensuration be murder too?

It is unreasonale to assume that a gamete should be classified as a human being in the same way that a zygote shouldn't. Once again, the only difference I can see between a gamete and a zygote is ONE GENOME.

[YourHumanRights]

duh, this is so simple. A sperm or egg is no different than cutting your fingernails. They have your DNA. The vast majority of them by natural deign are supposed to die. They are designed to die after a week or so.

But you expect people to think that an embryo who has a 110 years ahead of HIM or HER is exactly the same?!

Are you fucking serious? This is the best you can do? You got nothing else?

Tell us how a woman grows a male prostate in her belly and that it is part of her body.

[TheProf1988]

You aren't getting it. The sperm are descendant of the host organism, not part of him. Remember that they have unique DNA from the host and can exist indipendantly.

Also some organisms have a much longer haploid life than diploid life. I.e, thier gametes live for years and zygotes live for days. Again, I am looking for objectivity.

what about fruit flies, they only live for weeks. Again, age is not the issue with abortion. stop doing intellectual gymnastics.

[YourHumanRights]

humiliated on

1) the law

2) abortion's links to preterm birth and birth defects

3) DNA uniqueness and the facts of conception...

The so called prof has to start talking about fruit flies.

I pity this guy's students if indeed he is a prof.

[TheProf1988]

If you are still unable to read and comprehend my previous comments I shall clarify.

Why should I accept that a zygote with two genomes from two individuals has any more significance that one gamete from one individual?

both the sperm and the zygote are potential lives, yet millions of sperm die during every ejaculate. Both are also single cells.

why should I accept your position that zygote are sacred and sperm are not?

[YourHumanRights]

It's useless to ask more questions when he can't even answer the ones I've asked, so just for the record..

Sperm and egg are indeed alive (with only host DNA) , but will only remain so for a maximum of a week or so UNLESS one and the other merge. The new, unique human created at that point is designed to live a century or more - and has entirely unique DNA all HIS or HER own.

I guess the so called prof wants us to recapture every guy released from prison on DNA evidence now. It defines us.

[TheProf1988]

You can't quote the law in an attempt to make an argument. That's a logical fallacy called ''appeal to authority''. The fallacy is that you assume that the authority is exempt from criticism.

Lawmakers can be wrong just like you or I. But if you wish to continue to appeal to authority then should I quote the relevent law which permits abortion? Would that settle the argument? I think not. Find another avenue of argument.

[YourHumanRights]

The so-called prof. writes.."should I quote the relevent law which permits abortion?"

Please do. Please quote the law that makes abortion legal. By all means, please find it for us all. A law is a bill that passes a legislature. In this case, the United States Congress - and is signed by the president. That is what makes a law. Please show us the law (they are all named and numbered) and quote from it.

Calling your bluff once again !

(wow, this is easy!)

[TheProf1988]

You clearly have missed all of my counter arguments. Appeals to authority mean nothing to me, I stated that quoting the law is irrelevent for either side. Abortion is legal, yet you clearly believe it is wrong, so quoting the law gets you nowehere.

Again you mock my scientific understanding but fail to provide justification. refute my points, don't just claim that I don't understand DNA.

[flyingboy007]

its amazing what 3 mins on youtube can teach you.

[ushineon4me]

the public needs to know this!!

[clem9796]

Condoms are worse than AIDS..

Raising a child on the streets is worse than an IUD..

Please, please, rethink those thoughts.

[rayabe]

are you for real???

[leiapeison]

unfortunately they are real. scary aint it?

[rayabe]

Is this a satire or are you out of your mind?

[leiapeison]

im not with them. but they are a real organization and every year on the anniversary of griswold verses connecticut they protest in the street against hormonal contraceptives. it reallly is scary what is happening to this world.

[turtlelackie]

@rayabe this is real.