By your definition all religions are cults..... that a fact......all religions began as a religion: a system of religious or spiritual beliefs, especially an informal and transient belief system regarded by others as misguided, unorthodox, extremist, or false, and directed by a charismatic, authoritarian leader. that can be said for any or all of man's civil associations. These cult had ordered our societies since man began. Try being a Hindu in a Muslim society!
Your guy's questions may be overwhelming, but easily wiped off one by one, as I am human..if you would have any personal questions you'd like to ask, if you really believe they were cults, then do so please :-), I understand you have a problem with these people, but a cult? okay now you were really been away from the congregation a bit waaay to long to believe another man..
Are you sure you were raised while you were a kid who was clueless, became Atheistic around your young adult years, then after a while of forgetting what had been of what you were taught and being far from religion, you were easily convinced to carrel people away from there ministry with bias answers that take experienced students of the bible to crack? If you really were a Jehovah's witnesses, you should try coming back to the kingdom hall and see what you were really being told.
I STILL have to see a religious organization conduct themselves like these"cult members. Forgiveness, COMPASSION, treating everyone with love REGARDLESS....
That's all I ever see the people over at United Church of God doing. They were wonderful to me, a lesbian, even though homosexuality is "an abomination".Oh, they practice what they preach. That what you mean by "cult"?
Part of what they preach is"HEY, if you don't want to be here, please by all means LEAVE."
HWA got far too focused on Christ's second coming, yes, but most of Christianity ignores such. So, who's wrong here.
Also, WCG taught some people will have a chance for salvation in the GWTJ; most of Christianity says no one will be offered salvation here, look at Revelation 20.
So, cult--no--only those who were not converted in WCG would call it a cult. Too out of balance? Yes.
Cult? No.
The Catholic church is a cult, according to the Bible.
@Evan6288 HWA made more than just the mistake of focusing on the second coming. He falsely prophesied many times. Additionally he issued a "silence" over the church in efforts to prevent the spread of this knowledge. The issue of the GWTJ and their "second chance" theology seems more like an appeal to the sympathy of those in the church- for their friends and loved ones-- lacks scriptural basis and draws on poor inference techniques. Pseudo-Christian Cult? Yes
There are problems with Trinitarianism: Christians do not see God as one, John 10:30 because they have been taught to see God as 3; Jesus always talked of his relationship with the Father, never with the Holy Spirit.
However, "orthodox" Christianity is wrong on many points.
If you was smart, you'll see that what happened in the wcg was prophecy. there would come a falling away from the truth and the man of sin would be revealed. the son of perdition.thes. 2. one man would be taking out of the way so that the anti-christ would be revealed. HE WHO SIT IN THE TEMPLE OF GOD. it was a judas type betrayal. JOSEPH TKACH sit at the righthand of Mr. Armstrong. and after 3 years, just as prophacy said cut down the tree. get the free books - malichi's message/raising the ruin
LOL it is funny how people say the bible says without really knowing. Here is what the bible says: The Spirit itself bears witness with our spirit, that we are the CHILDREN OF GOD: And if children, then heirs; HEIRS OF GOD, and joint-heirs with Christ that we may be also glorified together. Rm 8:16-17 it does not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, WHEN he shall appear, we shall be LIKE him 1Jn 3:2 you are... a son; and if a son, then an INHERITOR OF GOD through Christ. Ga 4:7
By definition, calling it a cult makes no sense. Exactly what are the church's members "forced" to do? The PCG (which stems from the WCG) upholds the government of God. Like it or not, there are rules in this life. Nobody is forced to go to church and they can leave at any time. However, if they feel the need to corrupt the government they will be made to leave. There is nothing cultish about that whatsoever.
There are several definition of a cult. The way I was using the word was as follows: religion: a system of religious or spiritual beliefs, especially an informal and transient belief system regarded by others as misguided, unorthodox, extremist, or false, and directed by a charismatic, authoritarian leader.
As far as the comment about free will, yes anyone could leave, but with the threat of the lake of fire that was preached from the pulpit, is that a real choice for the people.
@RockyBalboa7777 Herbert Armstrong, Gerald Flurry & PCOG have as much to do w/ God & religion as prostitution & venereal disease have to do w/ love. Armstrong died in '84 a divorced, disgraced, exposed fraud who commited incest w/ his daughter Dorothy Mattson while blabbering about being chosen by God to prepare everyone for the second coming. He was chosen by Satan to prepare hypocrites for Hell. Court awarded his ex, less than half his age, half his $5 million estate. Thank God he's dead.
It never ceases to amaze how people just blatantly lie. Having one's reputation smeared, doesn't mean what is said about them is true. All of what you said is false. Literally, absolutely false. You flat out lied. It's disgusting, unwarranted and laughable. Can you speak to any particular points that were preached? Can you explain precisely how what he said is wrong? Can you prove anything at all??? Seriously, reading your post was like reading something in a tabloid publication.
@RockyBalboa7777 Sorry to burst your bubble. You'll be better off for it. The May 17, 1984 editition of the Tulsa World newspaper reported testimony from Herpies' divorce trial, as reported by the AP newswire service. When his having commited incest came up during the case, the court award his half Indian wife, Ramona, less than half his age, half his $5 milliion assets. Check out websites exitsupportnetwork, hwarmstrong and ukapologetic ( a dot net website). Good Luck.
@RockyBalboa7777 It's important to read more than just the splash pages. Buy a tabloid. Read it. Then read the May 17, 1984 edition of the Tulsa Worlds Newspaper, Associated Press coverage of testimony of HWA's divorce trial in which his incest was part of the proceedings. Which is the more reliable source? The propaganda from biased sources comes from Flurry and PCOG. Rockybalboa was an independent thinking fighter. You are a misled follower.
@RockyBalboa7777 Google: Exit and Support Network to find detailed explanations of exactly 'what he said is wrong.' I'd say predicting that the end of the age would occur in 1975 is a good example of Armstrong being wrong. Google: 1975 in Prophecy.
I spent 20 years in the church. Our church was a microcosm of other churches in the world today. We followed a belief system created by someone else and that became our reality. The Christian story has been repeated in 15 different religions throughout history. It is time we did our research into the truth, this is a great time of awakening.Herbert Armstrong believed in a story and convinced us to all to follow. Why did we go along with the program?
I grew up in the WWC too. I'm like you in missing the social aspect. We had a common ground with each other that I have not seen anywhere else. It is crazy looking back on the claims that HWA made and thinking my Dad bought into this 100 percent. I don't regret it though because it taught me to study the bible, not to blindly follow what any man says and I had a lot of fun and made good friends. Enjoyed your video.
I grew up in the WWCG too from birth to 14 and my Mom did too from the time she was 7 and watching your video was like someone reached inside my head and just started saying what they saw there. *smiles* I know what it's like to find yourself looking back 15 years and almost missing parts of it. The confusion that sticks with you. The shame (almost??) that trails after you & the conditioning that hurts your life outside. Thank you for posting this cos I've never had the guts to myself. <3
wow.... I would love to talk with you... you have an understanding! cant you see that?????.... Jesus had a cult... I know by listening to you you KNOW Gods way.... hope to hear from you..... I can tell you KNOW... what you KNOW!
God is peace and love. Herbert W. Armstrong taught peace and love and how to live God's way of life. You are not wrong to disagree with the teachings of Herbert W. Armstrong. You are human. We are human. It is human nature to question and disagree. I admire Mr. Armstrong by he attempting to bring peace to this world that we live in and share with one another. This was the core teaching of the World Wide Church of God and Herbert W. Armstrong. Peace be with you and you all who read this.
I believe "cult" is a very strong word to describe the work of Herbert W. Armstrong. Mr. Armstrong's message was love. His main teachings were to love one another and be kind to each other. If you lived in an arab country, it is socially and morally acceptable to not eat pork. Here in America, if you belong to a church that teaches pork is an unclean animal and not to be eaten, we as Americans believe it to be a cultist church. A different religous view is not wrong,or cultist,but only different
I think it's helpful to turn this issue around from what THEY/CHURCH did and into what WE DID attending and participating. What made us stay (the adults? Security, friendship, faith, hope?We need to take responsibility for what we think and take action. How do we know what we believe is true? Are we taught to think critically at school, for example? It is helpful to turn our past experiences into personal empowerment. We are no longer victims.
I know where you're coming from...I also attended wcg for 19 years. Since I left, I have learned to question everything. We are fortunate to live in this time, with access to information that we can challenge ALL the false teachings from parents, teachers, churches, media, govt.etc that have been hoisted upon us. I also miss the social life, but have gained freedom!!!
Do you have an email account (I'm not a crazy person or a spammer type).... where I could send the very longass message I wrote, or even facebook or myspace?? I just wanted to send you more of a message than the 500 word restriction this allows, and I enjoyed listening to what you had to say and want to respond properly. :) And not a basher or anything like that.
Hi. I tried to write you a long note, and of course there's a restriction to 500 words. I think that sucks. :) Anyway, I would love to get the message I wrote to you. I am not exactly a computer savvy person, though. :) I'm going to try to get it piece by piece on here in the hope of encouraging you and responding to your video. thank you for sharing, too. :)
B: How are you mixing up politics and rambling about income tax with growing up in a cult?
C: I would never quit paying my taxes, although I think they is a lot of wasted tax dollars being spent on things I don't agree with, I do believe that you need taxes for things within a community.
Hi. I wrote you another note I am not sure if it published on here or not. I really have a heart to encourage people who have been a part of this group in the past. I grew up in this group and so on. You look to be pretty young, maybe a child while in your experiences in this group?
I was born in 1981 and was raised in this group. It was a false cult, just as you worded it.
I too grew up in the world Wide Church of God. I attend Ambassador College in Pasadena cali. I lost friend in the spit of the church I know what you are going though. I was a youth when my mum attended this church. Do you have an email if so I would love to chat and keep in touch with you. Thanks.
If you havent looked at the movie" CALLED TO BE FREE". check it out on here. Its really really good, so check it out. I spent my childhood as well as my teen and adulthood attending the worldwide church of god, and again I know what you have gone though.
Just Something Else Here Sacremento, i was asking a friend of mine if i could attend a bible study they do in their home, till i found out it was their church, and then they gave me some litterature to (Endure) and it turns out to be Armstrongism, and i was worried that the conditions that seam to be required, i am unsure about, until i cam e across you, i am just taking the next step in learning about the treachings of the bible, and im studying it on my own, then i here you Suggest That, Amen.
Wow, Am I Glad I Ran Into you Brother, My Name Is Chris, Im Living IN Ontario Canada, i really apreciate your share brother, i have recently, recovered from alcoholism and drug addiction as a result of the twelve stpes of A.A. and i have found a power greater than myself whom i choose to call God, and believe me i wasnt loking for him, he actually revieled himself to me, through a series of people places and things, recently he has called me closer,IM ready to be baptized into Jesus Christ
Oh no!!! I missed out on watching TV for one day a week, going to a few parties, and marrying someone who is not my current wife!!
Also, the fact that you claim the church would dis fellowship you for finding a member of a different race attractive is completely overblown and ridiculous.
The church also did not claim we would be GODS, but SPIRIT BEINGS. Additionally, you said you're not trying to offend anyone, but obviously you're trying to give the church a bad name, so yes you are bashing.
Every religion that I know of teaches of an after life which means immortality. Isn't that God like. Sounds like no matter what English word you use, it all means the same thing.
The church would dis fellow ship you if you had a romantic relationship with someone of a different race. You could not have a girl friend or wife of a different race. As far as parties, or T.V. the point is there should not have been a restriction on those things. Who knows what my life would be like, I could be a Doctor or I could be dead but no stupid Dogma should interfere with my fate.
No I am not, if I were still going to that letter of the law church, I would not have met my wife. I met here while serving my country, and she is Latino which I am sure is against the old WCG rules.
Also, saying that you can't explain your problems is probably true. So get help, you clearly need some. Restrictions are sometimes a good thing, and the Sabbath is for focusing on GOD, not T.V. or parties. That doesn't mean you can't have fun- cards are fine, talking is fine, being with your family is fine, but things that don't allow you to also focus on God are a preventable distraction.
I think you may need some help but the WCG and or spin offs would not allow there members to seek professional help it was the work of the "devil". Restrictions can be good but I don't need dogma to tell me what is or is not. I don't believe in the Sabbath so you go ahead a play cards, I spend time with my family all the time so I don't need to set aside a special time. P.S. many people lost out on many jobs because of this crap, many lives would be better off having never come in contact W/HWA
You cant begin to understand what he has gone though; If you grew up in a church like WWCG You would indeed be just like use too. He is not looking for sympathy he is just letting people know what it was indeed like to grow up in a cult. We were indeed blessed to attend the WWCG, because now we can use that as a testamony to people today. things were not all bad, but There were family separtate by the split. SO no ones is looking for your pity.
Mr. Armstrong and the Worldwide Church of God MOST CERTAINLY DID teach that if you were one of the overcomers, you would become part of the GOD FAMILY and become GOD.
They stated it MANY times!
Sorry to say, but the Bible disagrees with this doctrine.
"1. a particular system of religious worship, esp. with reference to its rites and ceremonies. "
That could be any religion, so calling a church a cult isn't a bad thing if you go by that definition.
Anyways, if you mean it was a cult that people should be afraid of, you're (with all due respect) retarded. You said that growing up in the church left a thorn in your side. Um, why? Did they hurt you mentally? If so you are very mentally unstable and should seek psychiatric help.
I will put it to you this way, I am not afraid as far as I will be physically harmed, but I would never let my children attend anything that looks like the WCG as long as they are in my care. As far as hurting me mentally, since the human Psyche is so complex it would be impossible to explain in this forum what degree it mentally messed with my head. I am a functional Human being but "The Church" has left its pathetic mark on me no doubt.
I fail to see why anyone wishes to compare evolutionary theory to religions. The two have nothing in commone with one another. It is like comparing brain surgery to golf. How can you make a comparison?
Evolutionary theory is science. It is about how we and all other living things on this planet got to the stage we are at now. It can also predict (in some cases) where we are headed.
The reason the creationists fear science is that it threatens their belief in gods. And they are too,,,,,,,,
,,,ignorant to look at the facts. Facts just seem to get in the way of fairy tales and they have too much invested to give up the fairy tales.
I look at it this way. On an island somewhere, people worship big rocks. It doesn't hurt me in any way as long as it stays on that island. But as soon as it enters my society, it begins to threaten the health of my society. That is when I must speak up against the fairy tales and try to educate the ignorant.
"check out my video I grew up in a cult part three. I touched on that a little."
Actually that is the first video of yours I watched. Ended up here from a link on inmendham's channel. I subscribed in the first two minutes of listening to you.
I see from looking above at the thumbs down on my comment that we are pissing off the creationists again. LOL kinda fun to watch immature, ignorant and backwards people stumble around tryig to refute me. All they can do is throw mud.
Also, "society as a whole" is not always correct. Just because everyone is doing the same thing doesn't mean it's right.
EVERYONE believes that THEIR religion is the ABSOLUTE truth. Why even be part of a religion if you don't believe that it's right?
For those interested, the Living Church of God isn't some hell-spawn. They're not full of dictators. :p I grew up strong and happy in the religion, and it made me have a lot of values.
Hi there. While I don't think that your video has any real negative stands, I think it's ridiculous to say that you're not trying to 'bash anybody," when you outright call the church a cult. Perhaps one should get their definitions of words correct before they start spurting out their feelings. :p
With that said, what are you trying to do? Why even upload such a video? You're obviously -trying- to give the church a negative stand, even if you claim that you're not.
All churches are cults. You have been brain washed by your parents and your church. Religion is nothing more than witchcraft. Just more widely accepted, that's all...
I grew up in the church in KY and like you i often feel anger toward HWA and his idea`s and teachings,the lack of being able to find a desent job due to the whole saturday thing. I will never trust a socalled man of God again. I still believe in the all mighty God and that we are all saved by the grace of God and not just a few members old WWCG church. It was not all bad I guess, I met my wife in the church 22 years ago and God has blessed us with 3 great kids so all is well that ends well
I grew up in "the church" in Jackson TN.I have many fond memories and many that are not so fond!My best friends happen to be people that I grew up with in church (who else could understand my background?)and I think we all turned out ok, even though we have our scars.I married a man that I grew up with in church who happens to be of a different race.We never could understand why they thought that was wrong!The WWCG is great now that they have changed-you can even disagree and not be kicked out!
I also went to worldwide or "the church". I also grew up in New Orleans which I assume you did b/c of the saints paraphernalia. What is your first name? I was alot younger than you but my sister was closer to your age. I feel the same way about alot of the things you say, even about"thinking differently" about things and missing the social aspect.
What about Petra? Did WE miss the boat (or plane) to Petra? Were we all left behind? Or was it rapture (me thinks Blondie sang something about that). Herbie would be having a hellofagoodtime with all this shit that is going on now! I wonder what he'd be saying about Bill and Georgie dubbya? Or the NWO and EU? What are his followers saying now?
Yes we got left behind. "The Train done gone". They are in Petra, living on Spam and Kool aid, laughing at all of us for not heeding the words of HWA.
You must attend on the 7th day Sabbath. You must attend the Feasts. You must pay tithes. You must be subordinate to the church government from the top down. You must believe they are the only true church. You must marry within the church. You must agree/believe HWA (the Apostle). You must believe church propaganda (aka literature). You must be a member to enter God's kingdom and escape the tribulation and lake of fire. You must reject Catholic and Protestant tradition. YOU MUST SUBMIT! OBEY HWA!
Yes I started getting the magazine in the early eighties I think it was in eithy that I started reading it and hearing him on radio, but later on joind the church of garner ted and Ron Dart, they are very skillful at getting and keeping victims in the group through fear of losing your salvation just like all the rest, glad to hear back from you, there is life after religion hang in there man.
I used to meet with his sons church of god international, now I'm basically a universalist and believe the bible teaches God will save all mankind, I dont blame you about churches, I hope you'll check out the universalist belief there's some videos on my channel, your being honest thats great its shows god is working in you,thanks for sharing your story..
Hi I didnt know you attended the church of GOD I attended the living church of GOD but dont anymoe I found people bickering alot what is your view about the churches of GOD?
Ted & Herbert are dead and his false gospel is nearly all but gone, accept for a few hangers on. These preachers sold the soul of their followers to the devil and live to take their followers purses to the bank. They taught 2 or more gods, 2 lifetimes to be saved, murders, rapist and homocide bombers go free without punishment and you can wait until your next life to be saved. Does it get any stranger. Did I mention, they also taught you have to become Jewish to be Christian?
It's so weird to think that you grew up in a cult. I was rasied from the time I was born until I was 17 in the Worldwide Church of God. It's so amazing to see that what you grew up to believe was all wrong. I like you still haven't really gone to church since. It was so hard for me to make the transition from being in the church to not. I still to this day don't celebrate Christmas or any of that jazz. I am still searching for peace.
There are many that feel the same as you and I. I now have kids, that is the only reason I will participate in Christmas and thing of the sort. Keep searching for that peace. Try not to let that church dominate the rest of your life.
maybe i would realy like to think so but dunno, maybe thats a harsh view though lol. still there are loads of other groups out there and always someone worse off than yourself thats how i look at it anyway.
thanks for sharing i know how you feel i was raised in a very destructive group and only got out when i left my family as a teenager. thanks for sharing again
So glad to find you on here. My brother and I were raised with one parent in one out just like you. Cracked the family down the middle emotionally. We never attented a church, just got raised in the poisonous teachings, so didn't see any fun aspect.
Now I think maybe the reason you are clearer/natural/self-sustaining thinking for your age/generation may be the cult influence. I hate to put any praise on the cult, but at least you didn't grow up in the mainstream consumerism, advertising, capitalism track. It doesn't explain why you look so young though. :) Anne
LOL i never thoght of it that way, but I do think a little different then most of my friends. I have subscribed to you site, thankyou for the comments.
Hey, thanks for subscribing! You are fortunate to think the way you do. I am a little older than you and wish I had been raised a bit more _innocently_ I suppose during the 80s. It was a time of consumerism and beauty and capitalism to the max. Only recently have I come to see the world in a different way than materialism, wanting things, not truly seeing the world's problems. 80s was all about the "me, me' me" way of thinking.
I went to see if you had new videos since I hadn't seen any recently and realized I had not subscribed! No wonder I didn't see them, huh? lol I rectified that situation! :) Anne
There is a VRY interesting and humous (partly) novel about a man from a cult who is grown up and out of a cult. It's by Chuck Palahniuk and the title is Survivor..
Believe me, you are far from alone in your feelings. I was born into the "church" in 1964. I left in 1982 (wanted to go on Friday night dates), but it affects my life to this day. It has affected my relationship skills, feelings toward God and church, etc. Good for you for speaking your mind!
Thank you for the comment, Yes I remember felling bad in highschool for going to the friday night football games, I was in the band, my father (wasn't a member) was the Music director. I felt like a hypocrite.
I feel the same way,I debate on this to no end...it's a horrible feeling. I feel that I do not belong anywhere I go, I feel lonely and looking back it all looks like a bubble, have you ever felt like that? It is incredible the power this religion has on people.
Sorry I removed your other comment by accident. I have been on anxiety medicine for a couple of years after suffering a major anxiety attack. I have been living with this feeling of stress since I was a teenager. I just thought it was normal. I know it came from the feeling that I wasn't going to make it to the "Kingdom". I believe leaving is the correct decision , don't worry, life is still good.
Thank you for your comments. Yes they would kick you out if they found out that you were dating outside of your race. That was one of many rules that Armstrong enforced with an iron fist. You should check out the video born to be free, it is pretty interesting.
Wow. You are only the second person I've ever encountered who was a member of the Worldwide Church of God prior to the big change. I used to listen to Mr. Armstrong on the radio and TV when I was a kid and, from time to time, found stuff he said appealing. I'm long over it, but I still find it fascinating.
By your definition all religions are cults..... that a fact......all religions began as a religion: a system of religious or spiritual beliefs, especially an informal and transient belief system regarded by others as misguided, unorthodox, extremist, or false, and directed by a charismatic, authoritarian leader. that can be said for any or all of man's civil associations. These cult had ordered our societies since man began. Try being a Hindu in a Muslim society!
nuthurii 1 week ago
Hey, I hear nothing but static when I listen to this. I would like to hear your testimony though. God Bless
SpycyWonton 2 months ago
i grew up in a cult....boo woo boo woo, my mommy wont protect me. get a life, your a jack wad and need to lose some weight.
tommycog1 7 months ago
Your guy's questions may be overwhelming, but easily wiped off one by one, as I am human..if you would have any personal questions you'd like to ask, if you really believe they were cults, then do so please :-), I understand you have a problem with these people, but a cult? okay now you were really been away from the congregation a bit waaay to long to believe another man..
RendezvousEntity 1 year ago
Are you sure you were raised while you were a kid who was clueless, became Atheistic around your young adult years, then after a while of forgetting what had been of what you were taught and being far from religion, you were easily convinced to carrel people away from there ministry with bias answers that take experienced students of the bible to crack? If you really were a Jehovah's witnesses, you should try coming back to the kingdom hall and see what you were really being told.
RendezvousEntity 1 year ago
what happened to the audio?
mitts61 1 year ago
Adjust your attitude.
"A great many people think they are thinking when they are really rearranging their prejudices." ~ William James
mizgretchen 1 year ago
I STILL have to see a religious organization conduct themselves like these"cult members. Forgiveness, COMPASSION, treating everyone with love REGARDLESS....
That's all I ever see the people over at United Church of God doing. They were wonderful to me, a lesbian, even though homosexuality is "an abomination".Oh, they practice what they preach. That what you mean by "cult"?
Part of what they preach is"HEY, if you don't want to be here, please by all means LEAVE."
mizgretchen 1 year ago
You know, I grew up in the world wide church of god as well. and the united after it split.
mizgretchen 1 year ago
HWA got far too focused on Christ's second coming, yes, but most of Christianity ignores such. So, who's wrong here.
Also, WCG taught some people will have a chance for salvation in the GWTJ; most of Christianity says no one will be offered salvation here, look at Revelation 20.
So, cult--no--only those who were not converted in WCG would call it a cult. Too out of balance? Yes.
Cult? No.
The Catholic church is a cult, according to the Bible.
Evan6288 2 years ago
@Evan6288 HWA made more than just the mistake of focusing on the second coming. He falsely prophesied many times. Additionally he issued a "silence" over the church in efforts to prevent the spread of this knowledge. The issue of the GWTJ and their "second chance" theology seems more like an appeal to the sympathy of those in the church- for their friends and loved ones-- lacks scriptural basis and draws on poor inference techniques. Pseudo-Christian Cult? Yes
oldomer314 1 year ago
WCG was not a cult: here's why:
There are problems with Trinitarianism: Christians do not see God as one, John 10:30 because they have been taught to see God as 3; Jesus always talked of his relationship with the Father, never with the Holy Spirit.
However, "orthodox" Christianity is wrong on many points.
Evan6288 2 years ago
yadda yadda blah blah yes it was ...
jackieimperfect20 2 years ago
sounds like you recorded this on the wing of an aeroplane buddy. senseless - I suppose like your cult experience.
sonlight13 2 years ago
???????????????????????????
IslandBlacktail 2 years ago
If you was smart, you'll see that what happened in the wcg was prophecy. there would come a falling away from the truth and the man of sin would be revealed. the son of perdition.thes. 2. one man would be taking out of the way so that the anti-christ would be revealed. HE WHO SIT IN THE TEMPLE OF GOD. it was a judas type betrayal. JOSEPH TKACH sit at the righthand of Mr. Armstrong. and after 3 years, just as prophacy said cut down the tree. get the free books - malichi's message/raising the ruin
ahawk62 2 years ago
LOL it is funny how people say the bible says without really knowing. Here is what the bible says: The Spirit itself bears witness with our spirit, that we are the CHILDREN OF GOD: And if children, then heirs; HEIRS OF GOD, and joint-heirs with Christ that we may be also glorified together. Rm 8:16-17 it does not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, WHEN he shall appear, we shall be LIKE him 1Jn 3:2 you are... a son; and if a son, then an INHERITOR OF GOD through Christ. Ga 4:7
just1ina144k 3 years ago
By definition, calling it a cult makes no sense. Exactly what are the church's members "forced" to do? The PCG (which stems from the WCG) upholds the government of God. Like it or not, there are rules in this life. Nobody is forced to go to church and they can leave at any time. However, if they feel the need to corrupt the government they will be made to leave. There is nothing cultish about that whatsoever.
RockyBalboa7777 3 years ago
There are several definition of a cult. The way I was using the word was as follows: religion: a system of religious or spiritual beliefs, especially an informal and transient belief system regarded by others as misguided, unorthodox, extremist, or false, and directed by a charismatic, authoritarian leader.
As far as the comment about free will, yes anyone could leave, but with the threat of the lake of fire that was preached from the pulpit, is that a real choice for the people.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
@RockyBalboa7777 Herbert Armstrong, Gerald Flurry & PCOG have as much to do w/ God & religion as prostitution & venereal disease have to do w/ love. Armstrong died in '84 a divorced, disgraced, exposed fraud who commited incest w/ his daughter Dorothy Mattson while blabbering about being chosen by God to prepare everyone for the second coming. He was chosen by Satan to prepare hypocrites for Hell. Court awarded his ex, less than half his age, half his $5 million estate. Thank God he's dead.
Tyrone8465 11 months ago
@Tyrone8465
It never ceases to amaze how people just blatantly lie. Having one's reputation smeared, doesn't mean what is said about them is true. All of what you said is false. Literally, absolutely false. You flat out lied. It's disgusting, unwarranted and laughable. Can you speak to any particular points that were preached? Can you explain precisely how what he said is wrong? Can you prove anything at all??? Seriously, reading your post was like reading something in a tabloid publication.
RockyBalboa7777 11 months ago
@RockyBalboa7777 Sorry to burst your bubble. You'll be better off for it. The May 17, 1984 editition of the Tulsa World newspaper reported testimony from Herpies' divorce trial, as reported by the AP newswire service. When his having commited incest came up during the case, the court award his half Indian wife, Ramona, less than half his age, half his $5 milliion assets. Check out websites exitsupportnetwork, hwarmstrong and ukapologetic ( a dot net website). Good Luck.
Tyrone8465 11 months ago
@Tyrone8465
I'm sorry you feel that way and even more sorry that so many have been deceived by propaganda from biased sources.
RockyBalboa7777 11 months ago
@RockyBalboa7777 It's important to read more than just the splash pages. Buy a tabloid. Read it. Then read the May 17, 1984 edition of the Tulsa Worlds Newspaper, Associated Press coverage of testimony of HWA's divorce trial in which his incest was part of the proceedings. Which is the more reliable source? The propaganda from biased sources comes from Flurry and PCOG. Rockybalboa was an independent thinking fighter. You are a misled follower.
Tyrone8465 11 months ago
@RockyBalboa7777 Google: Exit and Support Network to find detailed explanations of exactly 'what he said is wrong.' I'd say predicting that the end of the age would occur in 1975 is a good example of Armstrong being wrong. Google: 1975 in Prophecy.
greggb777 7 months ago
I spent 20 years in the church. Our church was a microcosm of other churches in the world today. We followed a belief system created by someone else and that became our reality. The Christian story has been repeated in 15 different religions throughout history. It is time we did our research into the truth, this is a great time of awakening.Herbert Armstrong believed in a story and convinced us to all to follow. Why did we go along with the program?
26christa 3 years ago
I grew up in the WWC too. I'm like you in missing the social aspect. We had a common ground with each other that I have not seen anywhere else. It is crazy looking back on the claims that HWA made and thinking my Dad bought into this 100 percent. I don't regret it though because it taught me to study the bible, not to blindly follow what any man says and I had a lot of fun and made good friends. Enjoyed your video.
SilverStar40 3 years ago
Your the only one of all these comments that actually made sence
YAHRAZ777 2 years ago
I grew up in the WWCG too from birth to 14 and my Mom did too from the time she was 7 and watching your video was like someone reached inside my head and just started saying what they saw there. *smiles* I know what it's like to find yourself looking back 15 years and almost missing parts of it. The confusion that sticks with you. The shame (almost??) that trails after you & the conditioning that hurts your life outside. Thank you for posting this cos I've never had the guts to myself. <3
skiastrix 3 years ago
U.C.G in the house!
chodaLS1 3 years ago
Hey!!
Happy Sabbath! :-)
777Jesusismynumber1 3 years ago
wow.... I would love to talk with you... you have an understanding! cant you see that?????.... Jesus had a cult... I know by listening to you you KNOW Gods way.... hope to hear from you..... I can tell you KNOW... what you KNOW!
montbo 3 years ago
What the heck...wait, I couldn't hear anything...it was all fuzzy...that's strange...
Btw, "montbo" "Jesus had a cult" what is that about? =/
777Jesusismynumber1 3 years ago
God is peace and love. Herbert W. Armstrong taught peace and love and how to live God's way of life. You are not wrong to disagree with the teachings of Herbert W. Armstrong. You are human. We are human. It is human nature to question and disagree. I admire Mr. Armstrong by he attempting to bring peace to this world that we live in and share with one another. This was the core teaching of the World Wide Church of God and Herbert W. Armstrong. Peace be with you and you all who read this.
davidgrounds 3 years ago
I believe "cult" is a very strong word to describe the work of Herbert W. Armstrong. Mr. Armstrong's message was love. His main teachings were to love one another and be kind to each other. If you lived in an arab country, it is socially and morally acceptable to not eat pork. Here in America, if you belong to a church that teaches pork is an unclean animal and not to be eaten, we as Americans believe it to be a cultist church. A different religous view is not wrong,or cultist,but only different
davidgrounds 3 years ago
I think it's helpful to turn this issue around from what THEY/CHURCH did and into what WE DID attending and participating. What made us stay (the adults? Security, friendship, faith, hope?We need to take responsibility for what we think and take action. How do we know what we believe is true? Are we taught to think critically at school, for example? It is helpful to turn our past experiences into personal empowerment. We are no longer victims.
26christa 3 years ago
I know where you're coming from...I also attended wcg for 19 years. Since I left, I have learned to question everything. We are fortunate to live in this time, with access to information that we can challenge ALL the false teachings from parents, teachers, churches, media, govt.etc that have been hoisted upon us. I also miss the social life, but have gained freedom!!!
26christa 3 years ago
Do you have an email account (I'm not a crazy person or a spammer type).... where I could send the very longass message I wrote, or even facebook or myspace?? I just wanted to send you more of a message than the 500 word restriction this allows, and I enjoyed listening to what you had to say and want to respond properly. :) And not a basher or anything like that.
TracieMaureen81 3 years ago
Hi. I tried to write you a long note, and of course there's a restriction to 500 words. I think that sucks. :) Anyway, I would love to get the message I wrote to you. I am not exactly a computer savvy person, though. :) I'm going to try to get it piece by piece on here in the hope of encouraging you and responding to your video. thank you for sharing, too. :)
TracieMaureen81 3 years ago
hahahahha your funny
Diamondsays1 3 years ago
Get a life dude and get over it!
I hate to think how bumbed out you will be when you find out you aren't really a free man! That you are living in a cult called freedom!
Stop paying your IRS income taxes and see how free you are!
Like I said get over it and get a life!
69jkwalker69 3 years ago
A: I am over it
B: How are you mixing up politics and rambling about income tax with growing up in a cult?
C: I would never quit paying my taxes, although I think they is a lot of wasted tax dollars being spent on things I don't agree with, I do believe that you need taxes for things within a community.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
Hi. I wrote you another note I am not sure if it published on here or not. I really have a heart to encourage people who have been a part of this group in the past. I grew up in this group and so on. You look to be pretty young, maybe a child while in your experiences in this group?
I was born in 1981 and was raised in this group. It was a false cult, just as you worded it.
TracieMaureen81 3 years ago
I too grew up in the world Wide Church of God. I attend Ambassador College in Pasadena cali. I lost friend in the spit of the church I know what you are going though. I was a youth when my mum attended this church. Do you have an email if so I would love to chat and keep in touch with you. Thanks.
sunshineunc 3 years ago
If you havent looked at the movie" CALLED TO BE FREE". check it out on here. Its really really good, so check it out. I spent my childhood as well as my teen and adulthood attending the worldwide church of god, and again I know what you have gone though.
sunshineunc 3 years ago
Just Something Else Here Sacremento, i was asking a friend of mine if i could attend a bible study they do in their home, till i found out it was their church, and then they gave me some litterature to (Endure) and it turns out to be Armstrongism, and i was worried that the conditions that seam to be required, i am unsure about, until i cam e across you, i am just taking the next step in learning about the treachings of the bible, and im studying it on my own, then i here you Suggest That, Amen.
godblesschriss 3 years ago
Wow, Am I Glad I Ran Into you Brother, My Name Is Chris, Im Living IN Ontario Canada, i really apreciate your share brother, i have recently, recovered from alcoholism and drug addiction as a result of the twelve stpes of A.A. and i have found a power greater than myself whom i choose to call God, and believe me i wasnt loking for him, he actually revieled himself to me, through a series of people places and things, recently he has called me closer,IM ready to be baptized into Jesus Christ
godblesschriss 3 years ago
Oh no!!! I missed out on watching TV for one day a week, going to a few parties, and marrying someone who is not my current wife!!
Also, the fact that you claim the church would dis fellowship you for finding a member of a different race attractive is completely overblown and ridiculous.
The church also did not claim we would be GODS, but SPIRIT BEINGS. Additionally, you said you're not trying to offend anyone, but obviously you're trying to give the church a bad name, so yes you are bashing.
KScribe2 3 years ago
With power like God, higher then the arc angels. If this offends you, then don't watch I grew up in a cult Part 3.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
Every religion that I know of teaches of an after life which means immortality. Isn't that God like. Sounds like no matter what English word you use, it all means the same thing.
Texasrulz66 3 years ago
The church would dis fellow ship you if you had a romantic relationship with someone of a different race. You could not have a girl friend or wife of a different race. As far as parties, or T.V. the point is there should not have been a restriction on those things. Who knows what my life would be like, I could be a Doctor or I could be dead but no stupid Dogma should interfere with my fate.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
So are you saying you are sorry that you married your wife? Maybe God was working in your favor in leading you to her.
KScribe2 3 years ago
No I am not, if I were still going to that letter of the law church, I would not have met my wife. I met here while serving my country, and she is Latino which I am sure is against the old WCG rules.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
Also, saying that you can't explain your problems is probably true. So get help, you clearly need some. Restrictions are sometimes a good thing, and the Sabbath is for focusing on GOD, not T.V. or parties. That doesn't mean you can't have fun- cards are fine, talking is fine, being with your family is fine, but things that don't allow you to also focus on God are a preventable distraction.
KScribe2 3 years ago
I think you may need some help but the WCG and or spin offs would not allow there members to seek professional help it was the work of the "devil". Restrictions can be good but I don't need dogma to tell me what is or is not. I don't believe in the Sabbath so you go ahead a play cards, I spend time with my family all the time so I don't need to set aside a special time. P.S. many people lost out on many jobs because of this crap, many lives would be better off having never come in contact W/HWA
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
Also, your videos look like cries for attention.
I don't think anyone feels sorry for you! :)
KScribe2 3 years ago
You are a troll, with out a face and you hide behind the keyboard. I don't need your sympathy or attention.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
You cant begin to understand what he has gone though; If you grew up in a church like WWCG You would indeed be just like use too. He is not looking for sympathy he is just letting people know what it was indeed like to grow up in a cult. We were indeed blessed to attend the WWCG, because now we can use that as a testamony to people today. things were not all bad, but There were family separtate by the split. SO no ones is looking for your pity.
sunshineunc 3 years ago
KScribe2:
Mr. Armstrong and the Worldwide Church of God MOST CERTAINLY DID teach that if you were one of the overcomers, you would become part of the GOD FAMILY and become GOD.
They stated it MANY times!
Sorry to say, but the Bible disagrees with this doctrine.
gordon777777 3 years ago
cult:
"1. a particular system of religious worship, esp. with reference to its rites and ceremonies. "
That could be any religion, so calling a church a cult isn't a bad thing if you go by that definition.
Anyways, if you mean it was a cult that people should be afraid of, you're (with all due respect) retarded. You said that growing up in the church left a thorn in your side. Um, why? Did they hurt you mentally? If so you are very mentally unstable and should seek psychiatric help.
KScribe2 3 years ago
I will put it to you this way, I am not afraid as far as I will be physically harmed, but I would never let my children attend anything that looks like the WCG as long as they are in my care. As far as hurting me mentally, since the human Psyche is so complex it would be impossible to explain in this forum what degree it mentally messed with my head. I am a functional Human being but "The Church" has left its pathetic mark on me no doubt.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
I fail to see why anyone wishes to compare evolutionary theory to religions. The two have nothing in commone with one another. It is like comparing brain surgery to golf. How can you make a comparison?
Evolutionary theory is science. It is about how we and all other living things on this planet got to the stage we are at now. It can also predict (in some cases) where we are headed.
The reason the creationists fear science is that it threatens their belief in gods. And they are too,,,,,,,,
mobiltec 3 years ago
,,,ignorant to look at the facts. Facts just seem to get in the way of fairy tales and they have too much invested to give up the fairy tales.
I look at it this way. On an island somewhere, people worship big rocks. It doesn't hurt me in any way as long as it stays on that island. But as soon as it enters my society, it begins to threaten the health of my society. That is when I must speak up against the fairy tales and try to educate the ignorant.
The bible has no provable facts in it....
mobiltec 3 years ago
Well said man, check out my video I grew up in a cult part three. I touched on that a little.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
"check out my video I grew up in a cult part three. I touched on that a little."
Actually that is the first video of yours I watched. Ended up here from a link on inmendham's channel. I subscribed in the first two minutes of listening to you.
I see from looking above at the thumbs down on my comment that we are pissing off the creationists again. LOL kinda fun to watch immature, ignorant and backwards people stumble around tryig to refute me. All they can do is throw mud.
mobiltec 3 years ago
Also, "society as a whole" is not always correct. Just because everyone is doing the same thing doesn't mean it's right.
EVERYONE believes that THEIR religion is the ABSOLUTE truth. Why even be part of a religion if you don't believe that it's right?
For those interested, the Living Church of God isn't some hell-spawn. They're not full of dictators. :p I grew up strong and happy in the religion, and it made me have a lot of values.
darsonia22 3 years ago
Hi there. While I don't think that your video has any real negative stands, I think it's ridiculous to say that you're not trying to 'bash anybody," when you outright call the church a cult. Perhaps one should get their definitions of words correct before they start spurting out their feelings. :p
With that said, what are you trying to do? Why even upload such a video? You're obviously -trying- to give the church a negative stand, even if you claim that you're not.
darsonia22 3 years ago
"when you outright call the church a cult."
All churches are cults. You have been brain washed by your parents and your church. Religion is nothing more than witchcraft. Just more widely accepted, that's all...
mobiltec 3 years ago
I grew up in the church in KY and like you i often feel anger toward HWA and his idea`s and teachings,the lack of being able to find a desent job due to the whole saturday thing. I will never trust a socalled man of God again. I still believe in the all mighty God and that we are all saved by the grace of God and not just a few members old WWCG church. It was not all bad I guess, I met my wife in the church 22 years ago and God has blessed us with 3 great kids so all is well that ends well
briscojones 3 years ago
I grew up in "the church" in Jackson TN.I have many fond memories and many that are not so fond!My best friends happen to be people that I grew up with in church (who else could understand my background?)and I think we all turned out ok, even though we have our scars.I married a man that I grew up with in church who happens to be of a different race.We never could understand why they thought that was wrong!The WWCG is great now that they have changed-you can even disagree and not be kicked out!
cynarchie 3 years ago
My parents and sister now live in LaVergne. I am glad to read you came out no worse for wear. Thank you for your comment and support.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
Hello,
I also went to worldwide or "the church". I also grew up in New Orleans which I assume you did b/c of the saints paraphernalia. What is your first name? I was alot younger than you but my sister was closer to your age. I feel the same way about alot of the things you say, even about"thinking differently" about things and missing the social aspect.
Ryan
kingryan04 3 years ago
What about Petra? Did WE miss the boat (or plane) to Petra? Were we all left behind? Or was it rapture (me thinks Blondie sang something about that). Herbie would be having a hellofagoodtime with all this shit that is going on now! I wonder what he'd be saying about Bill and Georgie dubbya? Or the NWO and EU? What are his followers saying now?
Doinkblink 3 years ago
Yes we got left behind. "The Train done gone". They are in Petra, living on Spam and Kool aid, laughing at all of us for not heeding the words of HWA.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
You must attend on the 7th day Sabbath. You must attend the Feasts. You must pay tithes. You must be subordinate to the church government from the top down. You must believe they are the only true church. You must marry within the church. You must agree/believe HWA (the Apostle). You must believe church propaganda (aka literature). You must be a member to enter God's kingdom and escape the tribulation and lake of fire. You must reject Catholic and Protestant tradition. YOU MUST SUBMIT! OBEY HWA!
Doinkblink 3 years ago
I attended the living church but was never taught that we would all be Gods.
huskey111 3 years ago
Yes I started getting the magazine in the early eighties I think it was in eithy that I started reading it and hearing him on radio, but later on joind the church of garner ted and Ron Dart, they are very skillful at getting and keeping victims in the group through fear of losing your salvation just like all the rest, glad to hear back from you, there is life after religion hang in there man.
jerryjam22 3 years ago
Find the church they hated most and you'll likely find the truth. Have you watched "called to be free" on youtube?
Polytuffus 3 years ago
Yes I have, it was interesting. A little strange seeing all those familiar faces.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
I used to meet with his sons church of god international, now I'm basically a universalist and believe the bible teaches God will save all mankind, I dont blame you about churches, I hope you'll check out the universalist belief there's some videos on my channel, your being honest thats great its shows god is working in you,thanks for sharing your story..
jerryjam22 3 years ago
Thanks for the comment, I will look at you vids.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
Hi I didnt know you attended the church of GOD I attended the living church of GOD but dont anymoe I found people bickering alot what is your view about the churches of GOD?
huskey111 3 years ago
I think they are just another false church just like all the others. Thank God I got out before they drove me nuts. To many rules and bosses.
jerryjam22 3 years ago
Ted & Herbert are dead and his false gospel is nearly all but gone, accept for a few hangers on. These preachers sold the soul of their followers to the devil and live to take their followers purses to the bank. They taught 2 or more gods, 2 lifetimes to be saved, murders, rapist and homocide bombers go free without punishment and you can wait until your next life to be saved. Does it get any stranger. Did I mention, they also taught you have to become Jewish to be Christian?
Polytuffus 3 years ago
You were a member as well? Looking back it is very odd that so many people were fooled, but hein sight is 20/20 as they say.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
What is a cult? One definition is any religion you don't belong to. Does a cult have 80,000 members and a couple million co-workers? Just asking.
Largo64 3 years ago
It's so weird to think that you grew up in a cult. I was rasied from the time I was born until I was 17 in the Worldwide Church of God. It's so amazing to see that what you grew up to believe was all wrong. I like you still haven't really gone to church since. It was so hard for me to make the transition from being in the church to not. I still to this day don't celebrate Christmas or any of that jazz. I am still searching for peace.
naomimrazo 3 years ago
There are many that feel the same as you and I. I now have kids, that is the only reason I will participate in Christmas and thing of the sort. Keep searching for that peace. Try not to let that church dominate the rest of your life.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
maybe i would realy like to think so but dunno, maybe thats a harsh view though lol. still there are loads of other groups out there and always someone worse off than yourself thats how i look at it anyway.
wupasscultkid 4 years ago
thanks for sharing i know how you feel i was raised in a very destructive group and only got out when i left my family as a teenager. thanks for sharing again
wupasscultkid 4 years ago
Thank you for the comment and view. It really is a shame but I am sure our parents were doing what they thought was best.
Sacramentosaint 4 years ago
So glad to find you on here. My brother and I were raised with one parent in one out just like you. Cracked the family down the middle emotionally. We never attented a church, just got raised in the poisonous teachings, so didn't see any fun aspect.
pos777 4 years ago
This is very interesting and you are very articulate, a pleasure to listen to, thanks for making this video. Anne
PositivelyPrimitive 4 years ago
Now I think maybe the reason you are clearer/natural/self-sustaining thinking for your age/generation may be the cult influence. I hate to put any praise on the cult, but at least you didn't grow up in the mainstream consumerism, advertising, capitalism track. It doesn't explain why you look so young though. :) Anne
PositivelyPrimitive 4 years ago
LOL i never thoght of it that way, but I do think a little different then most of my friends. I have subscribed to you site, thankyou for the comments.
Sacramentosaint 4 years ago
Hey, thanks for subscribing! You are fortunate to think the way you do. I am a little older than you and wish I had been raised a bit more _innocently_ I suppose during the 80s. It was a time of consumerism and beauty and capitalism to the max. Only recently have I come to see the world in a different way than materialism, wanting things, not truly seeing the world's problems. 80s was all about the "me, me' me" way of thinking.
PositivelyPrimitive 4 years ago
I went to see if you had new videos since I hadn't seen any recently and realized I had not subscribed! No wonder I didn't see them, huh? lol I rectified that situation! :) Anne
PositivelyPrimitive 4 years ago
There is a VRY interesting and humous (partly) novel about a man from a cult who is grown up and out of a cult. It's by Chuck Palahniuk and the title is Survivor..
PositivelyPrimitive 4 years ago
Believe me, you are far from alone in your feelings. I was born into the "church" in 1964. I left in 1982 (wanted to go on Friday night dates), but it affects my life to this day. It has affected my relationship skills, feelings toward God and church, etc. Good for you for speaking your mind!
ljw362001 4 years ago
Thank you for the comment, Yes I remember felling bad in highschool for going to the friday night football games, I was in the band, my father (wasn't a member) was the Music director. I felt like a hypocrite.
Sacramentosaint 4 years ago
I feel the same way,I debate on this to no end...it's a horrible feeling. I feel that I do not belong anywhere I go, I feel lonely and looking back it all looks like a bubble, have you ever felt like that? It is incredible the power this religion has on people.
nqrms 3 years ago
Sorry I removed your other comment by accident. I have been on anxiety medicine for a couple of years after suffering a major anxiety attack. I have been living with this feeling of stress since I was a teenager. I just thought it was normal. I know it came from the feeling that I wasn't going to make it to the "Kingdom". I believe leaving is the correct decision , don't worry, life is still good.
Sacramentosaint 3 years ago
Thank you for your comments. Yes they would kick you out if they found out that you were dating outside of your race. That was one of many rules that Armstrong enforced with an iron fist. You should check out the video born to be free, it is pretty interesting.
Sacramentosaint 4 years ago
Wow. You are only the second person I've ever encountered who was a member of the Worldwide Church of God prior to the big change. I used to listen to Mr. Armstrong on the radio and TV when I was a kid and, from time to time, found stuff he said appealing. I'm long over it, but I still find it fascinating.
ProfMTH 4 years ago
I had no idea they forbid interracial dating.
ProfMTH 4 years ago
yeah...and that hasn't changed. LCG highly discourages interracial dating.
nqrms 3 years ago