the retaliator then becomes the aggressor and then you have to be 10 times in return and repeat...thats how wars begin. We havent seen the midle east retaliate after 911, really makes you wonder.
The sooner Israel wipes out Hamas the better for everybody 3 times they have turned down peace deals in favor of war well Palestine or as it was formally known JUDEA, you reap what you sow. You voted Hamas in who murdered 3000 members of it's opposition throwing some from rooftops. You can vote them out. Until then suck it up because Israel has the right to defend itself. Well said CARONIHOMEBOY.
Israel has been killing Natives of the Palestine Region for over 60 years, & keeps inventing new ways to blame THE VICTIMS
The last massacre alone killed 1,400 un-armed civilians instantly who were trapped in locked borders. Over half were women and children. Another 5,500 more were left dying in agony of wounds
Israel's GENOCIDE has stopped their genetic offspring -kids who will never be
hitler a underachiver,israel has the right to defend itself ?
what about palestinian do they have any right at all?hamas only exsist cause israel occupation, zionist the true and only terorrist,they are the cancer of the world
The first scenes here look very much like Paliwood. Would you treat an injured like this? They even let him fall to the ground. And it looks very much as if they are not sure, where they should bring the wounded - or didn't they change the direction?
Hamas opened a pandora's box that will wish that you chose peace instead of provoking the the Israeli war machine.
In war the response of the retaliator must be 10 times to that of the aggressor.
Hamas must now learn the world no longer cares for its beliefs in hatred over peace as usual the majority suffer for the actions and decisions of the few.
Bring it on Israel and this time don't stop till you have finished the mission.
Every Muslim in the world should send future martyrs to Palestine. This is time for the THIRD INTIFADA. I myself and friends will travel to Egypt and get in from there. Please this is HOLY WAR (Jihad). Violence is what they want and it is something they will regret !
No kpiaseck, they still did a lot, the wall still stands strong and demolishing stil takes place and people still lose their lives, but like I said none of that will matter anymore cos' of whats happening there now, everyone will unfortunately soon lose care for the palestenian cause.
Rb-cont.I will give you an example.Have you heard about massacre of polish Jedwabne, inspired by Nazis and commited by 40 local Poles? The problem was,that considerable number of Jews from that region were helping to establish a Soviet regime,some of them worked in NKVD. For Poles,they were simply traitors. Now,does the fact that some of Jews were bastards,justify collective punishment,in one inch? No. And the same thing concerns Palestinians.
kpiaseck, hamas was voted in by the people. the terrorists hide behind their wives skirts in the most populated area in the world. the problem of the palestinian people are terrorists and other arab gov'ts who use them as political pawns.
are the pals victims? definitely. are the isrealis their victimizers? hell no!
Neocon, the first and foremost problem is your behaviour on this forum. Basing on the information that I live in country called Poland, your absurdal imagination transformed it into 'kpiaseck's fathers helped nazis round up your grand grandfather.' If you have such an ability to create virtual reality, I am really not surprised why your other views are so one-sided. Without basic rules of discussion, there is no discussion.
kpiaseck-the word steal in english means to take without permission, often in a surrepitious way. I am aware that much land was paid for but this is not the point. When the Zionists declared the exclusivist state for Jews only,it was then that palestinians were robbed of their rights to their land. Not this piece or that piece but the right to move back to where they or their ancestors were born.
1)if you lived in Europe,you'd know that nearly EVERY boundary would have to be changed,due to forced population transfers.But people don't do that,because it would lead to REAL disaster. 2)Israel is NOT exclusivist state for Jews! 1,5 mln Arabs and Druzes are full citizens,have parties,media,vote to knesset since 60 years,make business! Most Jewish kids learn Arabic at school,Arabic inscriptions are everywhere: in old town of Acre you will not find a hebrew street name: been there,seen that.
Jewish people purchased the land, often at inflated prices, and this does not refute your argument that they stole it?! they purchased it with 'permission' from Arab landlords, but this is not the point?!
The crime I am referring to is much larger than just the taking of land . By denying access to land Zionists have robbed Palestinians of the basic human rights that Israelis take for granted. Never mind the terror required to keep it going. The only solution to the problem is a one state solution based on equal rights for Jews and Arabs. A two state solution will inherently be unfair for obvious reasons..
Understand that if in'48 Pal. leadership threatened J's with evicting from homes,and AlHusseini advocated at Hitler ideas of genocide of Jews in ME, and the war started,it MUST have become a 'you or us' matter. It's great disaster,but Pal's pay price for decisions of their then-leadership. If you add uprooting of totally antizionistic Jews from the ME, now after these disasters,this chapter should be closed. J's should have their state fully respecting Arabs,and Pal's should have their state.
1. There was no recognized Palestinian people in 1948, nor was there a unique culture, heritage, national anthem, anything. 2. The Palestinans discovered their heritage in 1966 with Arafats PLO. 3. Palestinans were Jordanians, and Arafat was Egyptian
"Let us not ignore the truth among ourselves ... politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves... The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down, and in their view we want to take away from them their country."
-- David Ben Gurion, quoted on pp 91-2 of Chomsky's Fateful Triangle, which appears in Simha Flapan's "Zionism and the Palestinians pp 141-2 citing a 1938 speech
I feel you don't understand the context. It was the Arab revolt,where Arab mobs terrorized the J. population. What BenGurion meant,was a deep understanding the Pal.'s viewpoint. He said 'politically',not 'historically' or 'morally'. But in turn, you don't understand,that the antisemitism in Europe and holocaust gave J's no choice. Even with this,they were buying land, and not taking over.(cont)
(Diryassin-cont)Add to this the racist legislation for Iraqi Jews and others,and Iraqi prime minister As Said's talks with Jordan to transfer Jews,and theft of their property,and you'll see that everyone commited injustice. Even if you assumed zionists committed injustice, it cannot justify the Al Husseini's actions to advocate genocide of Jews in the Middle East at Hitler, and induce pogroms in Iraq and Egypt. (Al Husseini was the leader of Palestinians at that time)
Diryassin-cont. One-state solution. Now a honest question to you: how would you convince Jews who created the only democracy in that region, to be governed by people who don't know what 'democracy' means? Do you know,that between 48 and 67 Jews were forbidden by Jordanian state to pray at the Western Wall? Do you know,that Israel was the only country where AlJazeera had no problem with registering?The problem with PA is that they are trying hard to prove that they cannot rule even themselves...
Am I now authorized by His Majesty Neocon to remind Him about the shameful water disproportion problem? At least read the statistics at B'tselem -> see all topics -> water crisis. Think in such categories: water crisis in an obstacle in Israel's PR.
kpieseck, i told you already that we won't agree in regard to the water situation. the water goes first through isreali land. to tell a sovereign country what it could do with its own property is an attack on that very idea of sovereignty. if the pals would act civilly i'm sure that an agreement could be worked out. however,lobbing missiles at jews will not curry favor with isreal.
Neocon,you don't know or propagate absurds. The Mountain Aquifer lies primarly in the West Bank,the land of Palestinians,and surely not a territory of Israel. Mekorot pulls it out, but unjustly redistributes the majority to israeli settlers. These are facts.
Kpiaseck-That was wrong of Jordan and that was good of Israel to accept AlJazeera. You, my friend, are going to start with rb9009 on the one state plan. You are going to tell him that together Pals and Israelis can create institutions to govern themselves. That in USA people once thought incapable are now exercising leadership throughout the society. America is a stronger and better society because of it.
Aljazeera: in one place you say something about promotion of democracy like in America. Here you say that the registration of Aljazzera was 'wrong of Jordan'. Diryassin, let's be honest: by saying this you support antidemocratic move. I would NEVER agree live in a state that bars me from freedom of speech! 'Aljazzera was good of Israel'? Israel is democracy and it can live with criticism - this is the main reason.
Diryassin-'Pals and Isr's can create institutions to govern themselves'. One question. Have you ever been to the ME? I was there many times. Arabs and Jews have completely different visions of sticking to law,universal principles,order,corruption,use of arms and so on. There is not a single Arab country not discriminating its minority. Your picture of Pal's is complete utopia, and not reality. More,it can result in a barbaric war-this is very probable outcome of your vision,and you support it..
kpiaseck-Israel has the power,the land,the military etc. They can negotiate from a position of strength. If they allowed right of return pals would be overjoyed. Israel would have the moral high ground. There would be no grounds for further strife. How could it possibly lead to more war? That is what you already have!
No,Diryassin. Simply count the people. By inclusion of 4,5mln of Pal-s into this country,you will have at once the Pal. majority. As Isr. is democracy,the first election will turn the government into Pal-s. At once people will start the demographic race. Moreover,I was trying to debate with Pal-s on blogs. Quickly I understood,that nothing comes of it. Ppl whom I talk to,expressed deep hate. It is very sad,but Pal-s don't know what means democracy,adherence to law,secularity. Most want sharia.
(cont. ) I'll give you an example. You will find tens of isr. NGOs criticizing Isr's aggresiveness. They won't hesitate to demonstrate loudly for the sake of Pal-s. Now,try to find a single Pal. NGO demonstrating against intentional attacks on Israeli civilians. No way. I found no Pal. NGO informing on their website about crimes against Isr. civilians. Simply they cannot selfcritical. In many cases, Arabs inflate reaction: (cont)
(cont2) IDF's action in Jenin, with bodycount ratio 23 IDF: 30 militants: 23 civilians was a genocide in their narrative. Now compare it to the reaction for today's actions of Lebanon in Nahr alBared: the numbers are exactly the same,but they you con't hear that it is a genocide,actually you hear nothing from them. Arab states even support it. This and other things tells Jews,that there is a deeproted hate against them and that the 1-state solution is completely unstable,and dangerous for both.
kpiaseck- new to computer chat but interested in pal blogs-could you give me some adresses? Can't expect oppressed to create orgs for welfare of other. Busy with survival. Doesn't mean other orgs and individuals not against targeting civilians. Legislative bodies constucted so no group can dominate. No militias/civilians cant have weapons;borders are secure unlike if truly independent pal state. You said 60% in West Bank favor 2state-what about other 40%--Hamas no? W'ont work.
Diryassin,for first 30 years of Isr presence they were NOT oppressed,but thy incredibly grew: the life expectancy grew from 48 ('67) to 70 ('90s),malaria eliminated,six Universities created(before-zero),newborn mortality 8%->2%,in 70s their economy was 4th growing worldwide. But despite this,they never demonstrated against terror. Never. If you want to taste their mentality,read reports on edume. org about how Palestinian Autonomy educates children at official schools. You will be shocked:(cont)
(cont)they are not taught of coexistence,but to praise jihad in read text,poems,grammar texts. Jews' historical linkage to these land not mentioned at all! Holocaust not mentioned,peace talks with Isr not mentioned,Isr-state not mentioned,though PA officially recognized this. See the exploitation of children on pmw. org. il or memritv. org: pseudo-disney dolls teach LITTLE CHILDREN about struggle for world islam's domination,usage of AK-47,suggest to shoot.All this at Hamas'TV(a governing party)
(cont2)This story is very,very complicated and no side is saint. But the B&W picture of good Pal's and bad Isr's is simply untrue. You should read narratives from both sides,from moderate representatives,and you'll see it. Pal. blogs,you can start fromgaza. blogspot. com. or almanarasquare. blogspot. com. But I also propose you Martin Gilbert "Routledge atlas on Ar-Isr conflict" partly accessible on print. google. com - lots of factography. Cheers!
Aha,I don't understand why you think 'borders are secure unlike if truly independent pal state'. Every country with which Israel signed peace,had never problems on the border with Israel. Moreover,Isr withdrew from Lebanon(2000) and Gaza(2005),but the answer was more rockets...
Erm... More rockets weren't a reply to them withdrawing that wouldn't make sense, more rockets were in retaliation to them still attacking gaza and west bank. Summer 2006 IDF went in and did some bad things to the people of Gaza. But I guess none of that matters now since both Hamas and Fatah are fighting each other... A digrace and a sign of the day of the judgement.
No, chapelle. When israeli settlers abandoned Gaza in Sep 05, there were no IDF actions there. There was nothing to retaliate to. At that time the politic establishment of Palestinians should reply to this withdrawal by calling to peace negotiations. They did nothing. Soon later first qassams were launched...
No one would have proposed that African Americans be given Missisissippi and Alabama and claim that would solve the problem. InUSA, there is still racism but people have learned to live together in peace. And that was after 400 years of slavery and institutionalized segregation. It is possible. Only when the attitudes of those in power change can the problem be solved.That's how it happened in US and SAfrica and that is how it will have to appen in the future nation of Israel/Palestine.
poor analogy I'm afraid. African Americans are not native to this continent, Natives are. In Canada the natives maintain their unique culture on reserves, and still they don't blow up pizzerias and coffee shops
aww...its really pathetic you can't make your point without first name calling...anyway would you care to expand on your theory...that isreali arabs have the most freedom of any arab group in the middle east? what about the almost 4 million Palestinians living in Gaza and the West Bank? Tell me about their freedom? Show me what you know.
ianatto, people who choose terror as a means of politics do not deserve to have freedom. yes, electing hamas as your gov't qualifies you as a terrorist state. what should isreal do as rockets rain down on sdorot from gaza. the exact place where the jews left to give the pals a chance to show the world they are capable of governing in peace. the arabs never miss a chance to miss a chance!
This is genocide plain and simple! Isreal wants to erase palestine and its people...slowly...systematically...and brutaly...Isreal is bullying Palestine and when palestinians fight back they are met with retaliatory violence. Isreal's government is sick and so are the governments that support them!
ianotto, youre clearly just a liberal kook. there are more than one million isreali arabs living in isreal. they vote and have members in the knesset. thats more freedom then any other arab in the middle east has.
please respond to my new comment...i'm always interested in learning and it really sounds like you know alot about freedom and the lives of Palestinians.
i would love to expand on the fact (not theory) that isreali arabs have more freedom then any other group in the middle east. can egyptians vote for their leaders? what about saudi arabians? maybe jordanians? possibly the people of the uae? non of these people have a say in their gov't but isreali arabs do. there is complete freedom of religion in isreal. try to set up a synogogue in saudi arabia.
Ianotto,can you explain me the meaning of a 'genocide' word? Since II intifada, Btselem counted 1800 civil Palestinian deaths and 1000 civil deaths done by palesinian terrorists (700 Jews + 300 Pal's). What more exactly does this 'genocide' mean taking into account comparision of those numbers? Thank you.
kpieseck, why don't you answer some of the questions i asked you? what would you do as the protector of isreali citizens and terrorists were trying to kill your people.
I DON'T WANT TO HEAR ABOUT THE WATER! WHAT WOULD YOU DO. DON'T DODGE THE QUESTION.
this is how dictionary dot com defines genocide: the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national, racial, political, or cultural group. Your number or proportion killed definition is entirely fictitious, kpiaseck
Wrong,Rb.About 50% Palestinians agree to two-state solution.What you both do,is equating Palestinians with terrorists,and THIS is amoral,blind and childish.Nobody has right to minimize the water allowance to a civil population below the humane minimum,or introduce such appaling differences.
wrong? Palestinians did not vote for Hamas? Even an independent Palestinian pollster queried gazans and the west bank(ers?), and found 80% supported armed resistance.
Today's surveys show that Fatah is the leading force,so it cannot be so high. And again,depriving the population of humane dozes of water,is inhumane,and serves against interests of Israel. Do you want more boycotts of Israel among the western world? Think about it
kpiaseck, about 85% of pals say that suicide bombs against women and children in isreal is legitimate. not only that but they voted in hamas as its gov't. where do you get this number of 50%? and why aren't they stopping their murderous brothers from daily attacks on isreal?!
Neocon, try Pspcr surveys and you will find out that:"63% would support a Palestinian recognition of Israel as a state for the Jewish people after a peace agreement is reached and a Palestinian state is established." from 30 sep 2006
Kpiaseck quote: "Pspcr surveys and you will find out that:"63% would support a Palestinian recognition of Israel.." So where did you get your 50% statistic kpiaseck??
it is not 50. It is 63% at that time - so even more. Alright, I must really go now.Best regards. Btw. check Btselem data for water to see that I don't deceive you.
kpiaseck quote: "Wrong,Rb.About 50% Palestinians agree to two-state solution.What you both do,is equating Palestinians with terrorists,and THIS is amoral,blind and childish" Care to explain??
Of course I can. The characteristics of every nationalist is the readiness to equate sins of some radical group to the whole population. You did this more than once,Neocon-I don't even comment him. The fact is that some 60% of Palestinians agree to 2-state solution. Are they terrorists? No. Does the activity of terrorists cancel the Israel's obligation to give normal doses of water to the population? No.
kpiaseck, this number of 60% is a complete fallacy. btw, you started out saying it was 50% of the pals who are peace loving. but for arguments sake i'll agree to your silly number. if there are 4,000,000 pals and 40% are blood thirsty murderers that means that 1,600,000 are terrorists sympathizers. how do you suppose isreal deal with this problem. of course innocent people will be killed. but that is what the terrorists want.
You originally stated 50% of Palestinians want a 2 state solution, than you said 63%, now you are saying 60%. Are you fabricating statistics kpiaseck?
Rb9009, are you okay? I am not paid for remembering the results of polls until the 2nd digit at random request. Check pcpsr. org/ andsurvey/ polls/ 2006/ p21e1. html
kpiaseck,The PSPCR poll reveals several things. First, the support for armed attacks against Israeli targets by the Palestinian population is widespread, though it is important to emphasize that there is a distinction between support for armed attacks expressed in a public opinion poll at a particular point in time and participation in, or active support for, such attacks.
con't: Second, a majority of the Palestinian population believes that armed attacks against Israeli civilians have helped to achieve Palestinian rights in a way that negotiations could not have achieved.
guess where i got this kpieseck. thats righT PSPCR'S own website. you have some explaining to do mister!
Neocon, this conflict claimed lifes of thousands Palestinians. They must pass thru chessboard of checkpoints,and the behaviour of soldiers is often rude there. Often apart of justified house demolitions,there are unjustified ones,for which they don't even receive recompensation. They see one-sided attitude of Israeli administration between settlers and Palestinians. You should distinguish between the political conscience and caution of a highly educated man,and conscience of just plain people.
Neocon-armed attacks. Yes,they are inconsistent,and often fed with contradictory arguments of their propaganda. But because of the fact that despite this huge propaganda,and often harmful and unjust moves of Israel on the territories,still 63% of them agrees to the 2-state solution,you are not allowed to name them using dehumanized terms.
the arabs are guilty of accusing israel of doing exactly what they do. they murder innocent people and then say isreal is killing innocent people. this is self defense. we are not going to agree whose right and whose wrong, but, if its legitimate to attack isreal , then its legit to attack pals. its a 2 way street.
you just hate it because isreal is great at defending herself, at a great cost to palestinian life.
Life is a test......for every killing, for every inch of land stolen from palesitians inshaallah (god willing) answers will come to israelie jews. I wonder if this was the trick of British who created Israel state on Palestinian land.
Of course,some half of 700000 Palestinian refugees were uprooted,and this was evil.But Arab representatives openly called to uproot Jews and rejected any negotiations on intl.forum.
Sorry,I didn't see your 1st post.I said:BEFORE 48 they did bought their land,often from Arabs,for high prices.Moreover most of land was post-ottoman state land:nobody's.Since before there was no Palestinian state there,this land could be shared among Arabs and Jews.
DirYassin,you must decide whom you write,because you sent it not to Israeli.Unfortunately,terrorist militants inflict the same loss to the Palestinians,as Israelis.But this,I guess you don't realize.I guess your 'peace' means future ethnic cleansing of Jews.I hope I am wrong.
Finally in the late 90's this path of terror turned against them:Israel imposed sanctions, started collective punishment,built a wall.But I simply understand this:nobody will accept years of terror.
(cont-Brent)4)they could negotiate their statehood in 2000/1 with success.They failed all this.The israeli occupation started with great improvement of all their conditions,but they decided to abide by terror.
Because,first there was no state of Palestine,and this land was to be shared.Jews arrived there mainly legally,and always bought the land(before 48).That means,Palestinians and Jews had BOTH right to selfdetermination.I am against settlers,and for the Palestinian state,but under conditions that they will recognize their neighbour.
At some point ,your terror brtheren in Israel will have to realize that there will be no peace based on terror,expropriation and denial of a peoples basic human rights. Stop the illegal settlements ,dismantle the Israeli terror machine and let the people of Palestine live in peace as they did before your Zionists brought death and destruction to the region.
lol, you have a Hamas ideology diryassin, and therefore a terrorist in the making if not one now. Israeli Jews have a right to self determination just like any other on this planet. The palestinians can't live in peace on their own, blaming Jews will simply delay your evolution.
rb9009---- who are "Israeli" Jews? Are they the settlers who came from Europe or the ones that come from America? These settler/terrorists claim a right to colonize Palestine but the Palestinians they stole the land from have no right to return to their homeland? Once again, stealing another peoples land is fascism-thats what the Nazis did,or tried to do. They did not get away with it and neither will you.
by stealing you must mean purchased, and by Nazis you must mean Hamas/Hizbollah. Your denial of Israel and its peoples long history in the region will only cause you more grief.
Diryassin,you continue to distribute lies.All the land bought by Jews before 48 was legal,and most of land od Palestine belonged to a state,not to Arabs.You forgot to add to your list hundreds of thousands Jews expelled by Arab states,eg.totally anti-zionist Iraqi Jews,kicked off with property theft.Many European Jews were escaping from a slaughter,a thing you don't understand.
(cont).But if you lived in Europe,like I do,you would quickly understand,that Jews were 'put under wall',and their escape to ancient motherland was the only way to survive as a nation.What really happened was a bloody mutual population transfer,but now halas-you both Nations should find some way to manage living in Palestine,and stop this bloodshed.
But their fate was perfectly at their choosing,e.g.during 2000/01 talk.If they really wanted to have the statehood based on Green Line,they would have it now.But their leadership preferred to play with intifada II.Their business...
If one nation denies another's right to selfdetermination,as it continuously was before 48,denies mediations in frame of UN + starts war intending at ethnic cleansing of Jews,this nation must account for the consequences.
As last week Hamas started this shooting,they take full responsibility before Palestinians for consequences it inflicts.These terrorists openly deny existence of its neighbour,claim that negotiations are pointless,and openly call for terror.If so,they should be jailed at least
Deiryassin,you lie.All the land acquired by Jews before 48 was BOUGHT,often from Arabs.Deir Yassin was a despicable massacre,but right after there was Arab massacre of Gush Etzion,when even more people were killed.Arab mobs were constantly shooting at convoys with food for Jewish inhabitants of Jerusalem.Yes,there is apartheid in Israel-but there is the same apartheid towards Jews in the West Bank,and countries like Syria and so on.
kpiaseck- when the Zionists used terror and the palestinians fled their homes, that land was bought? Terrorists/settlers in the west Bank have the full force of the Zionist Terror State behind them-isn't it easy to forget the violence those 3900 tanks and 360 fighteraircraft inflict in the continuing theft of Palestinian land? Your biggest lie is that Zionists had a right to create an exclusivist state for settler Jews from wherever in the world they might come from. There is no such right.
actually kpiaseck, apartheid existed in S.Africa with well defined bantustans. Nothing like that exists in Israel, Israeli Arabs choose to live in Israel, and Arabic is a second language. there is no apartheid in Israel.
No,Rb9009.There is no apartheid in Israel proper,but there is the apartheid between israeli settlers and Palestinians in the West Bank,which is evil.The problem is,that there is another apartheid,often unnoticed:if you e.g. drive into Gaza with Israeli ID numbers,you can be shot down.Palestinians want apartheid too,and maybe this mutual apartheid is just the lesser evil...
when these Israelis leave their settlements they are subject to stonings and lynchings, what do you call that? Israel is simply protecting its civilians and not segregating on the basis of race.
Apartheid is in different treatment of Israeli settlers and Palestinians in the West Bank,particularily in water distribution,which is simply unhuman.Also treatment of Jewish racists from Hebron compared to treatment of Arab terrorists.I support existence Israel,but not this what she does on territories.
kpiaseck, i'm very happy you claim to support isreals existence. unfortunately hamas and all the other terrorist groups in the west bank and gaza do not. what isreal does is called self defense. the more the pals attack the isrealis the more pals will be killed.
ISREAL HAS A MORAL OBLIGATION TO PROTECT HER CITIZENS! THE MORE ISREAL IS PROVOKED THE MORE THE PALS WILL PAY. RAINING DOWN ROCKETS ON SDOROT HAS KILED 2 JEWS AND MORE THAN 50 PALESTINIANS. KEEP IT UP MORE WILL DIE!
I am afraid we talk about two different things.What happens since last week,is selfdefence.If Hamas calls for elimination of Israel,it deserves elimination itself.But many things happening in territories are just pure apartheid,or racism.And this Israel,the only democracy there,should eliminate now.
THERE CANNOT BE APARTHEID WHEN THE PEOPLE WHO ARE ACCUSED OF BEING THE CAUSE OF APARTHEID, ARE REALLY VICTIMS OF RELENTLESS TERRORIST ATTACKS.
THE PALESTINIANS HAVE SHOWED TIME AND AGAIN THEY CANNOT BE TRUSTED TO MAKE PEACE WiTH ISREAL. THE JEWS MOVE FROM GAZA AND ARE NOW STRUCK BY ROCKETS FROM THE VERY PLACE THEY LEFT. pals are blood thirsty animals by a very large extent.
Interesting kpiaseck. On one side you claim apartheid only exists among the settlements and not Israel proper but then form all your arguments of apartheid against Israel (proper). Your conflation of issues does not help anyones understanding.
Rb9009 you don't understand that Israeli state has under the intl.law OBLIGATIONS in respect with Territories.The water distribution crisis happens in the West Bank,but the distributor is Mekorot,an Israeli company.What is your problem in understanding this?Pal's obtain 20% of water per person of what Settlers obtain.And this is simply racism.
the Palestinians also have an obligation under intl. law to halt terrorism, which they have not. Instead, they voted for a terrorist militia to head their goverment whose mandate relies exclusively on destroying Israel and it's Jewish inhabitants.
i think that kpiaseck has his heart in the right place. he just does not understand what it is like to have your people killed on a daily basis because of relentless terrorist attacks, by blood thirsty sadistic murderers.
No,Rb9009,you simply conceal facts under carpet...Palestinians voted for Hamas not against Israel,but against corruption of Fatah.And water discrimination has nothing to do with it.
Hamas will participate in the dialogue to salvage the [national unity government] Mecca Agreement between Fatah and Hamas, Taha said. "We support any effort to consolidate the Palestinian internal front. We must be united in confronting the only enemy we have: Israel."
Rb-on Taha. Okay,what's new? Hamas is a terrorist organization. But do we want to see racist Israel? I do not. Water supply has nothing to do with Hamas. It has to do with most basic things among homo sapiens.
wrong again Kpiaseck. by your logic the allies should never have bombed civilian infrastructures the nazis were using to support their war machine. defunct logic I'm afraid
No,Rb. The characteristics of this conflict is far more different from the WW II. And yes, bombing of the civilian infrastructure should avoided at utmost extent,this is the lesson from WW II. Nobody has right to do with water what Israel does: extract it from West Bank,the land of Palestinians,but gives them only minimal doses. Why actually not carpet bomb the whole Palestinian population,can you explain me?
why not carpet bomb the whole Palestinian population? because that would *target* the people, not the leadership, who are representative of the people.
Rb-Bingo! That is exactly why, although terrorists ave to be targeted (and there must be some collateral damage from it), the whold population should not be intentionally targeted. At this point, unjust redistribution of water is a kind of intentional targetting a whole population. This only brings more shahids and has no sense. Ok,I must go. See you.
IMO, the Palestinians people bear a large responsibility for their situation, and therefore should bear the consequences of their anti-Israel actions. Israeli people simply wish to buy ice cream without fear of annihilation.
kpiaseck, we are not going to agree on the water situation. as we both know the water does not know political boundaries. the water is needed by isreal for their needs and the pals for their needs. however, this water flows through isreal before it goes to the west bank. isreal is aloud to do with its property what she wants to do. to say differently is to take away the sovereignty of isreal as a country.
kpieseck,you do not give your enemies water at a great economic cost to your country. if the pals were peaceful i am sure that there could be some mutual agreement. unfortunately peace is the farthest thing from most of their minds. you reap what you sow. killing jews will not make you any friends in isreal.
and Israel still grants them water rights, and even travel privelages (under special request) despite the the general anti-Israel Palestinian public opinion. foment war and you become subject to its ugly consequences
Fully agree.But Jews should not equalize their level to terrorists,in other areas than the direct threat like war.Moreover,exactly things like unequal,inhuman distribution of water,or indifference towards racists in Hebron,only increases hate among Palestinians,this time righteously,and serves against Israel's interest...
Hamas has sworn to destroy all of Israel, from the sea to the river. Plus, the Palestinians voted for Hamas and their platform. Increases hate among Palestinians? It seems Israelis are damned if they do, and damned if they don't.
kpiaseck, the pals have declared war long ago on the isrealis. when fighting a war you fight to take away the ability of your enemy to make war against you. this has clearly not happened. the pals are trying every day to murder isrealis. your definition of apartheid is wrong. the pals are the aggressors. it is amoral to treat your tormentors with respect.
Neocon,the fact is that IDF killed more Palestinians than terrorists killed Israelis. The world does not have two colors,didn't you realize it? Excuse me,behaviour of settlers on the West Bank is also torment for Palestinians. And again,you conduct false generalizations,equating a terrorist with a Palestinian. Actually this is not different from what Diryassin does...
Rb-proportions. Okay,but so what? Killing terrorists is one thing,and 1800 Palestinian civilians killed since 2000 is another thing (1000 Jews). Sure that collateral damage everywhere happens,but don't say that Palestinians do not suffer.They also do.
I'm not sure whether I grasp you: what argument? The fact that there is something on our world like a colleral damage? There is sth like this,and so what? You first described Israelis as tormented by Palestinians. But you forgot to add that Palestinians are also tormented. Aren't they? They surely are...
arabs are surely tormented, tormented by arab leaders who need to keep them as victims and use them as pawns. if only isreal was around while your fathers were helping the nazis round up my great grand father. isreal will never let that happen again.
Neocon, 'while your fathers were helping the nazis round up my great grand father'..... there is no other comment from me than to tell you that my father is a Jewish holocaust survivor and we live in Warsaw. Face the mirror.....
kpieseck, you expect me to believe your father is a holocaust surviver? you can't be saying the things you say, and be as soft on terrorists like you are, if you know first handed the dangers of a murderous deadly ideology. i just think your lying!
Neocon,all I can say is: you have been fed with incredible hatred and bias. Your absurdal brain filter made me a terrorist supporter,although it is ME who proved Deiryassin lied. Your behavior here is a shame to an image of a civilized Jew. Your posts are and Deiryassin's are on the same level of a one-sided tabloid. You cast accusations and absurdal offences,and instead coming back to reflection,you escape by accusing me of lying... Think whatever you wish.
kpiaseck, you went from moderate to apologist for the terrorists. what happened? the reason why the isrealis kill so many pals is because the pals can't stop themselves from trying to kill jews. the arabs are their own worst enemies. in regard to the settlers, why don't you click on my name and watch "why the settlers act the way they do"
"you went from moderate to apologist for the terrorists" - Neocon,this is not even outrageous.This is just funny. You constantly fail to address the FACT of the inhumane disproportion of water supply and turn your debater to 'apologist for terrorist'. Neocon,are you okay?
Israel was founded on terrorism. Initial theft of land was achieved through despicable terror acts (Deir Yassin). Zionists continue to expropriate Palestinian land (3900 tanks & 360 fighter aircraft from US taxpayer). These settlements are illegal according to UN /Geneva treaties. These treaties grant a right to resist. Israel is morally illegitimate. No one has the right to drive people off their land through violence. One day, Apartheid Israel will be dismantled as it was in S. Africa.
Reverting to extremist actions has NEVER solved anything. Look at Americas war on terror, look at the endless violence in Israel and Palestine. Fundamentalism, whether its religious (Christian/Islamic/Jewish) or political will never solve anything.
bomb palestine as much as you like, but you will never defeat the strength and determination of the palestinian people.one ice cream of a rocket lands in isreal and ALL THE RESIDENTS RUN FOR THEIR LIFES!! run you zionists, run away from an eventual defeat inshallah!!
People need to wake up and realize Hamas was founded by the Israeli government. It is in the zionists' interest to keep Hamas and Fatah fighting each other because it they did not they could easily get rid of the state of Israel
Hamas and Fatah war with each other kill each other break ceasefire after ceasefire and then bomb Israel yeah that'll make it all better. Hamas has launched close to 150 bombs into Israel in the last week. What do you expect Israel to do when someone bombs them, send a thank you note.
racist nutcase?! absolutely nothing I said was racist Joan. Look up the definition of racist or go pick you children up from soccer practice, just leave the arguments to the people who can make them.
Al Jazeera does probably has the most unbiased reporting of any network out there. I am not a Palestinian projecting my biased opinions on you, I am a white Canadian who has learned that what you see is not always what you get. Think about it.
If you want to talk about justified attacks I suggest you think about who invaded Palestine and forced these people to live in poverty and oppression. I would strongly think about where you get your information as most Western broadcasting companies project a pro-Israel stance and you are not getting the whole story. cont.
You seem not to be bothered at all by the "rockets that serve as a sign of resistance" that are launched daily against civilians in the Israeli town of Sderot. So, as someone who values both Palestinian and Israeli lives, I can only ask you, does firing rockets at Israeli civilians ever, EVER make things better for the Palestinians?
Of course it doesn't, but what recourse do they have?? I am by no means justifying the rocket attacks. Those nations with clout in the international community ignore the plight of these people and justify the actions of Israel when they were the ones who started this conflict. Israel gets the economic and political backing of the most powerful nations, while Palestine gets relatively nothing.
what recourse than further ruining their lives? and then you don't justify the rocket attacks?! i think you're logic is inverted. palestinians started the conflict, yet again, and the Israelis have a duty to end it. Israel gets powerful backing because it is clearly right, while palestinians get nothing but the mess they've created.
Their lives are already ruined by living in the humiliating circumstances that they are forced to endure, and I can understand why the attacks happen but not have to agree with them. Responding to violence with more violence rarely leads to any solution, genocide is not a viable option. Right and wrong are objective, whereas it is obvious to see that Palestinians live in far worse conditions than the Israelis.
You would benefit from an introductory course in logic Brent, especially when discussing the plight of a people. By your logic, you can understand why the Palestinians would want their lives to move from bad to worse. Why???
the retaliator then becomes the aggressor and then you have to be 10 times in return and repeat...thats how wars begin. We havent seen the midle east retaliate after 911, really makes you wonder.
yellowashley 4 months ago
The sooner Israel wipes out Hamas the better for everybody 3 times they have turned down peace deals in favor of war well Palestine or as it was formally known JUDEA, you reap what you sow. You voted Hamas in who murdered 3000 members of it's opposition throwing some from rooftops. You can vote them out. Until then suck it up because Israel has the right to defend itself. Well said CARONIHOMEBOY.
Wurzelwidge 11 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
You must be another paid youtube liar
The truth shall overcome the many lies you tell.
Israel has been killing Natives of the Palestine Region for over 60 years, & keeps inventing new ways to blame THE VICTIMS
The last massacre alone killed 1,400 un-armed civilians instantly who were trapped in locked borders. Over half were women and children. Another 5,500 more were left dying in agony of wounds
Israel's GENOCIDE has stopped their genetic offspring -kids who will never be
-
4aaaaa4 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
arabs are the cancer of the world
arab nationalism = Nazism + Religion ( arabo_islamism )
The world is in danger without that Many People knows it !
The Notions of rights of the man do not pass with Arabic !
MAROKAIN2009 3 years ago
hitler a underachiver,israel has the right to defend itself ?
what about palestinian do they have any right at all?hamas only exsist cause israel occupation, zionist the true and only terorrist,they are the cancer of the world
TONIOAAAA 3 years ago 3
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Good job Israel, PLEASE DONT STOP it only makes the whole world safer. hopefully the US will help with the bombing
jamonit313 3 years ago
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Yeah,Israel ,Go get 'em!
watch?v=-xitDIXKU-I
Screw muhamad. XD
Omri103 3 years ago
go fuck a pig
moepimpin 3 years ago 4
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salam brothers & sisters
Help us to support Gaza by participating in our campaign:
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BerryColor 3 years ago 2
The first scenes here look very much like Paliwood. Would you treat an injured like this? They even let him fall to the ground. And it looks very much as if they are not sure, where they should bring the wounded - or didn't they change the direction?
AntonGorodezky 3 years ago
The only nigger that needs to die is you. You're the biggest nigger for even saying something like this.
lom1545 3 years ago
Hamas opened a pandora's box that will wish that you chose peace instead of provoking the the Israeli war machine.
In war the response of the retaliator must be 10 times to that of the aggressor.
Hamas must now learn the world no longer cares for its beliefs in hatred over peace as usual the majority suffer for the actions and decisions of the few.
Bring it on Israel and this time don't stop till you have finished the mission.
Brent Batson
Trinidad & Tobago.
CARONIHOMEBOY 3 years ago
"In war the response of the retaliator must be 10 times to that of the aggressor."
You know, you just unwittingly quoted Hitler there? He said the same in response to the british raid that provoked the blitz.
shackleton12 2 years ago 3
it is a war, civilians die, how normal is that.
U don't want to die, u leave the war zone, how simple is that?
macmiz 3 years ago
I LOVE ISRAEL! I LOVE ZIONISM! I LOVE ALL PEACE LOVING PALESTINIANS!
ds
Zuckdawg 3 years ago
Every Muslim in the world should send future martyrs to Palestine. This is time for the THIRD INTIFADA. I myself and friends will travel to Egypt and get in from there. Please this is HOLY WAR (Jihad). Violence is what they want and it is something they will regret !
Reqrezentin 3 years ago
May God gives the Palestinians strength in these tough years
danthg 4 years ago 3
No kpiaseck, they still did a lot, the wall still stands strong and demolishing stil takes place and people still lose their lives, but like I said none of that will matter anymore cos' of whats happening there now, everyone will unfortunately soon lose care for the palestenian cause.
chappelle87 4 years ago
GO Israel!
GeoffNI 4 years ago
Rb-cont.I will give you an example.Have you heard about massacre of polish Jedwabne, inspired by Nazis and commited by 40 local Poles? The problem was,that considerable number of Jews from that region were helping to establish a Soviet regime,some of them worked in NKVD. For Poles,they were simply traitors. Now,does the fact that some of Jews were bastards,justify collective punishment,in one inch? No. And the same thing concerns Palestinians.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpiaseck, hamas was voted in by the people. the terrorists hide behind their wives skirts in the most populated area in the world. the problem of the palestinian people are terrorists and other arab gov'ts who use them as political pawns.
are the pals victims? definitely. are the isrealis their victimizers? hell no!
NEOCON999 4 years ago
Neocon, the first and foremost problem is your behaviour on this forum. Basing on the information that I live in country called Poland, your absurdal imagination transformed it into 'kpiaseck's fathers helped nazis round up your grand grandfather.' If you have such an ability to create virtual reality, I am really not surprised why your other views are so one-sided. Without basic rules of discussion, there is no discussion.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpiaseck-the word steal in english means to take without permission, often in a surrepitious way. I am aware that much land was paid for but this is not the point. When the Zionists declared the exclusivist state for Jews only,it was then that palestinians were robbed of their rights to their land. Not this piece or that piece but the right to move back to where they or their ancestors were born.
diryassin 4 years ago
1)if you lived in Europe,you'd know that nearly EVERY boundary would have to be changed,due to forced population transfers.But people don't do that,because it would lead to REAL disaster. 2)Israel is NOT exclusivist state for Jews! 1,5 mln Arabs and Druzes are full citizens,have parties,media,vote to knesset since 60 years,make business! Most Jewish kids learn Arabic at school,Arabic inscriptions are everywhere: in old town of Acre you will not find a hebrew street name: been there,seen that.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
Jewish people purchased the land, often at inflated prices, and this does not refute your argument that they stole it?! they purchased it with 'permission' from Arab landlords, but this is not the point?!
rb9009 4 years ago
The crime I am referring to is much larger than just the taking of land . By denying access to land Zionists have robbed Palestinians of the basic human rights that Israelis take for granted. Never mind the terror required to keep it going. The only solution to the problem is a one state solution based on equal rights for Jews and Arabs. A two state solution will inherently be unfair for obvious reasons..
diryassin 4 years ago
and now legal land acquisition is not your point?! you know diryassin, you lose credibility when you continue to shift the topics
rb9009 4 years ago
Understand that if in'48 Pal. leadership threatened J's with evicting from homes,and AlHusseini advocated at Hitler ideas of genocide of Jews in ME, and the war started,it MUST have become a 'you or us' matter. It's great disaster,but Pal's pay price for decisions of their then-leadership. If you add uprooting of totally antizionistic Jews from the ME, now after these disasters,this chapter should be closed. J's should have their state fully respecting Arabs,and Pal's should have their state.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
1. There was no recognized Palestinian people in 1948, nor was there a unique culture, heritage, national anthem, anything. 2. The Palestinans discovered their heritage in 1966 with Arafats PLO. 3. Palestinans were Jordanians, and Arafat was Egyptian
rb9009 4 years ago
"Let us not ignore the truth among ourselves ... politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves... The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down, and in their view we want to take away from them their country."
-- David Ben Gurion, quoted on pp 91-2 of Chomsky's Fateful Triangle, which appears in Simha Flapan's "Zionism and the Palestinians pp 141-2 citing a 1938 speech
The comment speaks the truth.
diryassin 4 years ago
I feel you don't understand the context. It was the Arab revolt,where Arab mobs terrorized the J. population. What BenGurion meant,was a deep understanding the Pal.'s viewpoint. He said 'politically',not 'historically' or 'morally'. But in turn, you don't understand,that the antisemitism in Europe and holocaust gave J's no choice. Even with this,they were buying land, and not taking over.(cont)
kpiaseck 4 years ago
(Diryassin-cont)Add to this the racist legislation for Iraqi Jews and others,and Iraqi prime minister As Said's talks with Jordan to transfer Jews,and theft of their property,and you'll see that everyone commited injustice. Even if you assumed zionists committed injustice, it cannot justify the Al Husseini's actions to advocate genocide of Jews in the Middle East at Hitler, and induce pogroms in Iraq and Egypt. (Al Husseini was the leader of Palestinians at that time)
kpiaseck 4 years ago
Diryassin-cont. One-state solution. Now a honest question to you: how would you convince Jews who created the only democracy in that region, to be governed by people who don't know what 'democracy' means? Do you know,that between 48 and 67 Jews were forbidden by Jordanian state to pray at the Western Wall? Do you know,that Israel was the only country where AlJazeera had no problem with registering?The problem with PA is that they are trying hard to prove that they cannot rule even themselves...
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpieseck, i'm impressed.
NEOCON999 4 years ago
Am I now authorized by His Majesty Neocon to remind Him about the shameful water disproportion problem? At least read the statistics at B'tselem -> see all topics -> water crisis. Think in such categories: water crisis in an obstacle in Israel's PR.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpieseck, i told you already that we won't agree in regard to the water situation. the water goes first through isreali land. to tell a sovereign country what it could do with its own property is an attack on that very idea of sovereignty. if the pals would act civilly i'm sure that an agreement could be worked out. however,lobbing missiles at jews will not curry favor with isreal.
NEOCON999 4 years ago
Neocon,you don't know or propagate absurds. The Mountain Aquifer lies primarly in the West Bank,the land of Palestinians,and surely not a territory of Israel. Mekorot pulls it out, but unjustly redistributes the majority to israeli settlers. These are facts.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
Kpiaseck-That was wrong of Jordan and that was good of Israel to accept AlJazeera. You, my friend, are going to start with rb9009 on the one state plan. You are going to tell him that together Pals and Israelis can create institutions to govern themselves. That in USA people once thought incapable are now exercising leadership throughout the society. America is a stronger and better society because of it.
diryassin 4 years ago
well talk about putting the cart ahead of the horse
rb9009 4 years ago
Aljazeera: in one place you say something about promotion of democracy like in America. Here you say that the registration of Aljazzera was 'wrong of Jordan'. Diryassin, let's be honest: by saying this you support antidemocratic move. I would NEVER agree live in a state that bars me from freedom of speech! 'Aljazzera was good of Israel'? Israel is democracy and it can live with criticism - this is the main reason.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpiaseck-you misunderstood. I meant it was wrong of Jordan to restict Jews from Wall and that it was good of Israel to allow Aljazeera to operate.
diryassin 4 years ago
Diryassin-'Pals and Isr's can create institutions to govern themselves'. One question. Have you ever been to the ME? I was there many times. Arabs and Jews have completely different visions of sticking to law,universal principles,order,corruption,use of arms and so on. There is not a single Arab country not discriminating its minority. Your picture of Pal's is complete utopia, and not reality. More,it can result in a barbaric war-this is very probable outcome of your vision,and you support it..
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpiaseck-Israel has the power,the land,the military etc. They can negotiate from a position of strength. If they allowed right of return pals would be overjoyed. Israel would have the moral high ground. There would be no grounds for further strife. How could it possibly lead to more war? That is what you already have!
diryassin 4 years ago
No,Diryassin. Simply count the people. By inclusion of 4,5mln of Pal-s into this country,you will have at once the Pal. majority. As Isr. is democracy,the first election will turn the government into Pal-s. At once people will start the demographic race. Moreover,I was trying to debate with Pal-s on blogs. Quickly I understood,that nothing comes of it. Ppl whom I talk to,expressed deep hate. It is very sad,but Pal-s don't know what means democracy,adherence to law,secularity. Most want sharia.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
(cont. ) I'll give you an example. You will find tens of isr. NGOs criticizing Isr's aggresiveness. They won't hesitate to demonstrate loudly for the sake of Pal-s. Now,try to find a single Pal. NGO demonstrating against intentional attacks on Israeli civilians. No way. I found no Pal. NGO informing on their website about crimes against Isr. civilians. Simply they cannot selfcritical. In many cases, Arabs inflate reaction: (cont)
kpiaseck 4 years ago
(cont2) IDF's action in Jenin, with bodycount ratio 23 IDF: 30 militants: 23 civilians was a genocide in their narrative. Now compare it to the reaction for today's actions of Lebanon in Nahr alBared: the numbers are exactly the same,but they you con't hear that it is a genocide,actually you hear nothing from them. Arab states even support it. This and other things tells Jews,that there is a deeproted hate against them and that the 1-state solution is completely unstable,and dangerous for both.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpiaseck- new to computer chat but interested in pal blogs-could you give me some adresses? Can't expect oppressed to create orgs for welfare of other. Busy with survival. Doesn't mean other orgs and individuals not against targeting civilians. Legislative bodies constucted so no group can dominate. No militias/civilians cant have weapons;borders are secure unlike if truly independent pal state. You said 60% in West Bank favor 2state-what about other 40%--Hamas no? W'ont work.
diryassin 4 years ago
Diryassin,for first 30 years of Isr presence they were NOT oppressed,but thy incredibly grew: the life expectancy grew from 48 ('67) to 70 ('90s),malaria eliminated,six Universities created(before-zero),newborn mortality 8%->2%,in 70s their economy was 4th growing worldwide. But despite this,they never demonstrated against terror. Never. If you want to taste their mentality,read reports on edume. org about how Palestinian Autonomy educates children at official schools. You will be shocked:(cont)
kpiaseck 4 years ago
(cont)they are not taught of coexistence,but to praise jihad in read text,poems,grammar texts. Jews' historical linkage to these land not mentioned at all! Holocaust not mentioned,peace talks with Isr not mentioned,Isr-state not mentioned,though PA officially recognized this. See the exploitation of children on pmw. org. il or memritv. org: pseudo-disney dolls teach LITTLE CHILDREN about struggle for world islam's domination,usage of AK-47,suggest to shoot.All this at Hamas'TV(a governing party)
kpiaseck 4 years ago
(cont2)This story is very,very complicated and no side is saint. But the B&W picture of good Pal's and bad Isr's is simply untrue. You should read narratives from both sides,from moderate representatives,and you'll see it. Pal. blogs,you can start fromgaza. blogspot. com. or almanarasquare. blogspot. com. But I also propose you Martin Gilbert "Routledge atlas on Ar-Isr conflict" partly accessible on print. google. com - lots of factography. Cheers!
kpiaseck 4 years ago
Aha,I don't understand why you think 'borders are secure unlike if truly independent pal state'. Every country with which Israel signed peace,had never problems on the border with Israel. Moreover,Isr withdrew from Lebanon(2000) and Gaza(2005),but the answer was more rockets...
kpiaseck 4 years ago
Erm... More rockets weren't a reply to them withdrawing that wouldn't make sense, more rockets were in retaliation to them still attacking gaza and west bank. Summer 2006 IDF went in and did some bad things to the people of Gaza. But I guess none of that matters now since both Hamas and Fatah are fighting each other... A digrace and a sign of the day of the judgement.
chappelle87 4 years ago
No, chapelle. When israeli settlers abandoned Gaza in Sep 05, there were no IDF actions there. There was nothing to retaliate to. At that time the politic establishment of Palestinians should reply to this withdrawal by calling to peace negotiations. They did nothing. Soon later first qassams were launched...
kpiaseck 4 years ago
No one would have proposed that African Americans be given Missisissippi and Alabama and claim that would solve the problem. InUSA, there is still racism but people have learned to live together in peace. And that was after 400 years of slavery and institutionalized segregation. It is possible. Only when the attitudes of those in power change can the problem be solved.That's how it happened in US and SAfrica and that is how it will have to appen in the future nation of Israel/Palestine.
diryassin 4 years ago
poor analogy I'm afraid. African Americans are not native to this continent, Natives are. In Canada the natives maintain their unique culture on reserves, and still they don't blow up pizzerias and coffee shops
rb9009 4 years ago
aww...its really pathetic you can't make your point without first name calling...anyway would you care to expand on your theory...that isreali arabs have the most freedom of any arab group in the middle east? what about the almost 4 million Palestinians living in Gaza and the West Bank? Tell me about their freedom? Show me what you know.
ianotto 4 years ago
ianatto, people who choose terror as a means of politics do not deserve to have freedom. yes, electing hamas as your gov't qualifies you as a terrorist state. what should isreal do as rockets rain down on sdorot from gaza. the exact place where the jews left to give the pals a chance to show the world they are capable of governing in peace. the arabs never miss a chance to miss a chance!
NEOCON999 4 years ago
ianatto, why is it that when you call a liberal a liberal, you are always calling them names? it seems to me to be an accurate description.
NEOCON999 4 years ago
This is genocide plain and simple! Isreal wants to erase palestine and its people...slowly...systematically...and brutaly...Isreal is bullying Palestine and when palestinians fight back they are met with retaliatory violence. Isreal's government is sick and so are the governments that support them!
ianotto 4 years ago
ianotto, youre clearly just a liberal kook. there are more than one million isreali arabs living in isreal. they vote and have members in the knesset. thats more freedom then any other arab in the middle east has.
NEOCON999 4 years ago
please respond to my new comment...i'm always interested in learning and it really sounds like you know alot about freedom and the lives of Palestinians.
ianotto 4 years ago
i would love to expand on the fact (not theory) that isreali arabs have more freedom then any other group in the middle east. can egyptians vote for their leaders? what about saudi arabians? maybe jordanians? possibly the people of the uae? non of these people have a say in their gov't but isreali arabs do. there is complete freedom of religion in isreal. try to set up a synogogue in saudi arabia.
NEOCON999 4 years ago
Ianotto,can you explain me the meaning of a 'genocide' word? Since II intifada, Btselem counted 1800 civil Palestinian deaths and 1000 civil deaths done by palesinian terrorists (700 Jews + 300 Pal's). What more exactly does this 'genocide' mean taking into account comparision of those numbers? Thank you.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpieseck, why don't you answer some of the questions i asked you? what would you do as the protector of isreali citizens and terrorists were trying to kill your people.
I DON'T WANT TO HEAR ABOUT THE WATER! WHAT WOULD YOU DO. DON'T DODGE THE QUESTION.
NEOCON999 4 years ago
this is how dictionary dot com defines genocide: the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national, racial, political, or cultural group. Your number or proportion killed definition is entirely fictitious, kpiaseck
rb9009 4 years ago
Rb9009,I have impression that you completely did not understand my post. Read it once again and check whom it was directed to.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
no, no. i'm, impressed with you going to bat for isreal.
NEOCON999 4 years ago
Wrong,Rb.About 50% Palestinians agree to two-state solution.What you both do,is equating Palestinians with terrorists,and THIS is amoral,blind and childish.Nobody has right to minimize the water allowance to a civil population below the humane minimum,or introduce such appaling differences.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
wrong? Palestinians did not vote for Hamas? Even an independent Palestinian pollster queried gazans and the west bank(ers?), and found 80% supported armed resistance.
rb9009 4 years ago
Today's surveys show that Fatah is the leading force,so it cannot be so high. And again,depriving the population of humane dozes of water,is inhumane,and serves against interests of Israel. Do you want more boycotts of Israel among the western world? Think about it
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpiaseck, about 85% of pals say that suicide bombs against women and children in isreal is legitimate. not only that but they voted in hamas as its gov't. where do you get this number of 50%? and why aren't they stopping their murderous brothers from daily attacks on isreal?!
answer: most pals approve of killing jews.
neocon9999 4 years ago
Neocon, try Pspcr surveys and you will find out that:"63% would support a Palestinian recognition of Israel as a state for the Jewish people after a peace agreement is reached and a Palestinian state is established." from 30 sep 2006
kpiaseck 4 years ago
Kpiaseck quote: "Pspcr surveys and you will find out that:"63% would support a Palestinian recognition of Israel.." So where did you get your 50% statistic kpiaseck??
rb9009 4 years ago
it is not 50. It is 63% at that time - so even more. Alright, I must really go now.Best regards. Btw. check Btselem data for water to see that I don't deceive you.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpiaseck quote: "Wrong,Rb.About 50% Palestinians agree to two-state solution.What you both do,is equating Palestinians with terrorists,and THIS is amoral,blind and childish" Care to explain??
rb9009 4 years ago
Of course I can. The characteristics of every nationalist is the readiness to equate sins of some radical group to the whole population. You did this more than once,Neocon-I don't even comment him. The fact is that some 60% of Palestinians agree to 2-state solution. Are they terrorists? No. Does the activity of terrorists cancel the Israel's obligation to give normal doses of water to the population? No.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpiaseck, this number of 60% is a complete fallacy. btw, you started out saying it was 50% of the pals who are peace loving. but for arguments sake i'll agree to your silly number. if there are 4,000,000 pals and 40% are blood thirsty murderers that means that 1,600,000 are terrorists sympathizers. how do you suppose isreal deal with this problem. of course innocent people will be killed. but that is what the terrorists want.
NEOCON999 4 years ago
You originally stated 50% of Palestinians want a 2 state solution, than you said 63%, now you are saying 60%. Are you fabricating statistics kpiaseck?
rb9009 4 years ago
Rb9009, are you okay? I am not paid for remembering the results of polls until the 2nd digit at random request. Check pcpsr. org/ andsurvey/ polls/ 2006/ p21e1. html
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpiaseck,The PSPCR poll reveals several things. First, the support for armed attacks against Israeli targets by the Palestinian population is widespread, though it is important to emphasize that there is a distinction between support for armed attacks expressed in a public opinion poll at a particular point in time and participation in, or active support for, such attacks.
NEOCON999 4 years ago
con't: Second, a majority of the Palestinian population believes that armed attacks against Israeli civilians have helped to achieve Palestinian rights in a way that negotiations could not have achieved.
guess where i got this kpieseck. thats righT PSPCR'S own website. you have some explaining to do mister!
NEOCON999 4 years ago
Neocon, this conflict claimed lifes of thousands Palestinians. They must pass thru chessboard of checkpoints,and the behaviour of soldiers is often rude there. Often apart of justified house demolitions,there are unjustified ones,for which they don't even receive recompensation. They see one-sided attitude of Israeli administration between settlers and Palestinians. You should distinguish between the political conscience and caution of a highly educated man,and conscience of just plain people.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
Neocon-armed attacks. Yes,they are inconsistent,and often fed with contradictory arguments of their propaganda. But because of the fact that despite this huge propaganda,and often harmful and unjust moves of Israel on the territories,still 63% of them agrees to the 2-state solution,you are not allowed to name them using dehumanized terms.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
the arabs are guilty of accusing israel of doing exactly what they do. they murder innocent people and then say isreal is killing innocent people. this is self defense. we are not going to agree whose right and whose wrong, but, if its legitimate to attack isreal , then its legit to attack pals. its a 2 way street.
you just hate it because isreal is great at defending herself, at a great cost to palestinian life.
neocon9999 4 years ago
well put!
rb9009 4 years ago
Arafat turned this down in 2000:
97% of the territory of the West Bank plus Gaza, Arab neighborhoods of Jerusalem and the temple mount.
Chief Negotiator Dennis Ross blames the Palestinians for the breakdown of the talks.
President Clinton said Arafat made a "colossal historical blunder" in rejecting Israeli terms.
Saudi Prince Bandar said, "If Arafat does not accept what is available now, it won't be a tragedy, it will be a crime.
see unbiased mideastweb org
hmpierson 4 years ago
The Palestinians remind me of this old joke:
A man goes to the doctor, raises his arm in a contored manner, and says:
"Doctor, it hurts when I do this!"
So the doctor responds:
"Then don't do that!"
It hurts when the Israelis respond to Qassam rockets?
Then stop firing Qassam rockets!
hmpierson 4 years ago
Life is a test......for every killing, for every inch of land stolen from palesitians inshaallah (god willing) answers will come to israelie jews. I wonder if this was the trick of British who created Israel state on Palestinian land.
gollapalli 4 years ago
Of course,some half of 700000 Palestinian refugees were uprooted,and this was evil.But Arab representatives openly called to uproot Jews and rejected any negotiations on intl.forum.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
Sorry,I didn't see your 1st post.I said:BEFORE 48 they did bought their land,often from Arabs,for high prices.Moreover most of land was post-ottoman state land:nobody's.Since before there was no Palestinian state there,this land could be shared among Arabs and Jews.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
DirYassin,you must decide whom you write,because you sent it not to Israeli.Unfortunately,terrorist militants inflict the same loss to the Palestinians,as Israelis.But this,I guess you don't realize.I guess your 'peace' means future ethnic cleansing of Jews.I hope I am wrong.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
Finally in the late 90's this path of terror turned against them:Israel imposed sanctions, started collective punishment,built a wall.But I simply understand this:nobody will accept years of terror.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
why do you call it a wall when 97% is a chain-link fence?
rb9009 4 years ago
(cont-Brent)4)they could negotiate their statehood in 2000/1 with success.They failed all this.The israeli occupation started with great improvement of all their conditions,but they decided to abide by terror.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
true, but why should they accept any loss of territory? They would have been accepting Israeli terms, not their own.
brentblair55555 4 years ago
Because,first there was no state of Palestine,and this land was to be shared.Jews arrived there mainly legally,and always bought the land(before 48).That means,Palestinians and Jews had BOTH right to selfdetermination.I am against settlers,and for the Palestinian state,but under conditions that they will recognize their neighbour.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
At some point ,your terror brtheren in Israel will have to realize that there will be no peace based on terror,expropriation and denial of a peoples basic human rights. Stop the illegal settlements ,dismantle the Israeli terror machine and let the people of Palestine live in peace as they did before your Zionists brought death and destruction to the region.
diryassin 4 years ago
lol, you have a Hamas ideology diryassin, and therefore a terrorist in the making if not one now. Israeli Jews have a right to self determination just like any other on this planet. The palestinians can't live in peace on their own, blaming Jews will simply delay your evolution.
rb9009 4 years ago
think you've mist spelt Jews, i think its ZIONISTS you're refering to..TWO DIFFRENT IDEOLOGIES and THEORIES!!
OpenerUK 4 years ago
rb9009---- who are "Israeli" Jews? Are they the settlers who came from Europe or the ones that come from America? These settler/terrorists claim a right to colonize Palestine but the Palestinians they stole the land from have no right to return to their homeland? Once again, stealing another peoples land is fascism-thats what the Nazis did,or tried to do. They did not get away with it and neither will you.
diryassin 4 years ago
by stealing you must mean purchased, and by Nazis you must mean Hamas/Hizbollah. Your denial of Israel and its peoples long history in the region will only cause you more grief.
rb9009 4 years ago
Diryassin,you continue to distribute lies.All the land bought by Jews before 48 was legal,and most of land od Palestine belonged to a state,not to Arabs.You forgot to add to your list hundreds of thousands Jews expelled by Arab states,eg.totally anti-zionist Iraqi Jews,kicked off with property theft.Many European Jews were escaping from a slaughter,a thing you don't understand.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
(cont).But if you lived in Europe,like I do,you would quickly understand,that Jews were 'put under wall',and their escape to ancient motherland was the only way to survive as a nation.What really happened was a bloody mutual population transfer,but now halas-you both Nations should find some way to manage living in Palestine,and stop this bloodshed.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
But their fate was perfectly at their choosing,e.g.during 2000/01 talk.If they really wanted to have the statehood based on Green Line,they would have it now.But their leadership preferred to play with intifada II.Their business...
kpiaseck 4 years ago
If one nation denies another's right to selfdetermination,as it continuously was before 48,denies mediations in frame of UN + starts war intending at ethnic cleansing of Jews,this nation must account for the consequences.
As last week Hamas started this shooting,they take full responsibility before Palestinians for consequences it inflicts.These terrorists openly deny existence of its neighbour,claim that negotiations are pointless,and openly call for terror.If so,they should be jailed at least
kpiaseck 4 years ago
Deiryassin,you lie.All the land acquired by Jews before 48 was BOUGHT,often from Arabs.Deir Yassin was a despicable massacre,but right after there was Arab massacre of Gush Etzion,when even more people were killed.Arab mobs were constantly shooting at convoys with food for Jewish inhabitants of Jerusalem.Yes,there is apartheid in Israel-but there is the same apartheid towards Jews in the West Bank,and countries like Syria and so on.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpiaseck- when the Zionists used terror and the palestinians fled their homes, that land was bought? Terrorists/settlers in the west Bank have the full force of the Zionist Terror State behind them-isn't it easy to forget the violence those 3900 tanks and 360 fighteraircraft inflict in the continuing theft of Palestinian land? Your biggest lie is that Zionists had a right to create an exclusivist state for settler Jews from wherever in the world they might come from. There is no such right.
diryassin 4 years ago
actually kpiaseck, apartheid existed in S.Africa with well defined bantustans. Nothing like that exists in Israel, Israeli Arabs choose to live in Israel, and Arabic is a second language. there is no apartheid in Israel.
rb9009 4 years ago
No,Rb9009.There is no apartheid in Israel proper,but there is the apartheid between israeli settlers and Palestinians in the West Bank,which is evil.The problem is,that there is another apartheid,often unnoticed:if you e.g. drive into Gaza with Israeli ID numbers,you can be shot down.Palestinians want apartheid too,and maybe this mutual apartheid is just the lesser evil...
kpiaseck 4 years ago
when these Israelis leave their settlements they are subject to stonings and lynchings, what do you call that? Israel is simply protecting its civilians and not segregating on the basis of race.
rb9009 4 years ago
Apartheid is in different treatment of Israeli settlers and Palestinians in the West Bank,particularily in water distribution,which is simply unhuman.Also treatment of Jewish racists from Hebron compared to treatment of Arab terrorists.I support existence Israel,but not this what she does on territories.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpiaseck, i'm very happy you claim to support isreals existence. unfortunately hamas and all the other terrorist groups in the west bank and gaza do not. what isreal does is called self defense. the more the pals attack the isrealis the more pals will be killed.
ISREAL HAS A MORAL OBLIGATION TO PROTECT HER CITIZENS! THE MORE ISREAL IS PROVOKED THE MORE THE PALS WILL PAY. RAINING DOWN ROCKETS ON SDOROT HAS KILED 2 JEWS AND MORE THAN 50 PALESTINIANS. KEEP IT UP MORE WILL DIE!
neocon9999 4 years ago
I am afraid we talk about two different things.What happens since last week,is selfdefence.If Hamas calls for elimination of Israel,it deserves elimination itself.But many things happening in territories are just pure apartheid,or racism.And this Israel,the only democracy there,should eliminate now.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
THERE CANNOT BE APARTHEID WHEN THE PEOPLE WHO ARE ACCUSED OF BEING THE CAUSE OF APARTHEID, ARE REALLY VICTIMS OF RELENTLESS TERRORIST ATTACKS.
THE PALESTINIANS HAVE SHOWED TIME AND AGAIN THEY CANNOT BE TRUSTED TO MAKE PEACE WiTH ISREAL. THE JEWS MOVE FROM GAZA AND ARE NOW STRUCK BY ROCKETS FROM THE VERY PLACE THEY LEFT. pals are blood thirsty animals by a very large extent.
neocon9999 4 years ago
Excuse me, if you say 'pals are blood thirsty animals by a very large extent' I realize we have nothing to say to each other.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
Interesting kpiaseck. On one side you claim apartheid only exists among the settlements and not Israel proper but then form all your arguments of apartheid against Israel (proper). Your conflation of issues does not help anyones understanding.
rb9009 4 years ago
Rb9009 you don't understand that Israeli state has under the intl.law OBLIGATIONS in respect with Territories.The water distribution crisis happens in the West Bank,but the distributor is Mekorot,an Israeli company.What is your problem in understanding this?Pal's obtain 20% of water per person of what Settlers obtain.And this is simply racism.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
the Palestinians also have an obligation under intl. law to halt terrorism, which they have not. Instead, they voted for a terrorist militia to head their goverment whose mandate relies exclusively on destroying Israel and it's Jewish inhabitants.
rb9009 4 years ago
cont. you don't grant concessions of survival to your sworn enemies bent on your death. Again, your moral equivalence is wholly amoral.
rb9009 4 years ago
rb9009, very well said!
i think that kpiaseck has his heart in the right place. he just does not understand what it is like to have your people killed on a daily basis because of relentless terrorist attacks, by blood thirsty sadistic murderers.
neocon9999 4 years ago
I agree neocon. It is almost as though kpiaseck doesn't fully believe himself, or isn't willing to follow his logic to it's conclusion.
rb9009 4 years ago
No,Rb9009,you simply conceal facts under carpet...Palestinians voted for Hamas not against Israel,but against corruption of Fatah.And water discrimination has nothing to do with it.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
you vote for a party based on its platform. Fatah corruption is still a by-product of the Israeli occupation
rb9009 4 years ago
Hamas will participate in the dialogue to salvage the [national unity government] Mecca Agreement between Fatah and Hamas, Taha said. "We support any effort to consolidate the Palestinian internal front. We must be united in confronting the only enemy we have: Israel."
rb9009 4 years ago
Rb-on Taha. Okay,what's new? Hamas is a terrorist organization. But do we want to see racist Israel? I do not. Water supply has nothing to do with Hamas. It has to do with most basic things among homo sapiens.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
wrong again Kpiaseck. by your logic the allies should never have bombed civilian infrastructures the nazis were using to support their war machine. defunct logic I'm afraid
rb9009 4 years ago
No,Rb. The characteristics of this conflict is far more different from the WW II. And yes, bombing of the civilian infrastructure should avoided at utmost extent,this is the lesson from WW II. Nobody has right to do with water what Israel does: extract it from West Bank,the land of Palestinians,but gives them only minimal doses. Why actually not carpet bomb the whole Palestinian population,can you explain me?
kpiaseck 4 years ago
why not carpet bomb the whole Palestinian population? because that would *target* the people, not the leadership, who are representative of the people.
rb9009 4 years ago
Rb-Bingo! That is exactly why, although terrorists ave to be targeted (and there must be some collateral damage from it), the whold population should not be intentionally targeted. At this point, unjust redistribution of water is a kind of intentional targetting a whole population. This only brings more shahids and has no sense. Ok,I must go. See you.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
IMO, the Palestinians people bear a large responsibility for their situation, and therefore should bear the consequences of their anti-Israel actions. Israeli people simply wish to buy ice cream without fear of annihilation.
rb9009 4 years ago
kpiaseck, we are not going to agree on the water situation. as we both know the water does not know political boundaries. the water is needed by isreal for their needs and the pals for their needs. however, this water flows through isreal before it goes to the west bank. isreal is aloud to do with its property what she wants to do. to say differently is to take away the sovereignty of isreal as a country.
NEOCON999 4 years ago
kpieseck,you do not give your enemies water at a great economic cost to your country. if the pals were peaceful i am sure that there could be some mutual agreement. unfortunately peace is the farthest thing from most of their minds. you reap what you sow. killing jews will not make you any friends in isreal.
NEOCON999 4 years ago
and Israel still grants them water rights, and even travel privelages (under special request) despite the the general anti-Israel Palestinian public opinion. foment war and you become subject to its ugly consequences
rb9009 4 years ago
Fully agree.But Jews should not equalize their level to terrorists,in other areas than the direct threat like war.Moreover,exactly things like unequal,inhuman distribution of water,or indifference towards racists in Hebron,only increases hate among Palestinians,this time righteously,and serves against Israel's interest...
kpiaseck 4 years ago
Hamas has sworn to destroy all of Israel, from the sea to the river. Plus, the Palestinians voted for Hamas and their platform. Increases hate among Palestinians? It seems Israelis are damned if they do, and damned if they don't.
rb9009 4 years ago
kpiaseck, the pals have declared war long ago on the isrealis. when fighting a war you fight to take away the ability of your enemy to make war against you. this has clearly not happened. the pals are trying every day to murder isrealis. your definition of apartheid is wrong. the pals are the aggressors. it is amoral to treat your tormentors with respect.
neocon9999 4 years ago
Neocon,the fact is that IDF killed more Palestinians than terrorists killed Israelis. The world does not have two colors,didn't you realize it? Excuse me,behaviour of settlers on the West Bank is also torment for Palestinians. And again,you conduct false generalizations,equating a terrorist with a Palestinian. Actually this is not different from what Diryassin does...
kpiaseck 4 years ago
yes, but the proportion of terrorists killed by Israel far outweighs the number of civilians targeted and murdered by hamas.
rb9009 4 years ago
Rb-proportions. Okay,but so what? Killing terrorists is one thing,and 1800 Palestinian civilians killed since 2000 is another thing (1000 Jews). Sure that collateral damage everywhere happens,but don't say that Palestinians do not suffer.They also do.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
I thought you said you don't agree with rockets landing in urban centres *targeting* civilians. Are you now changing your argument?
rb9009 4 years ago
I'm not sure whether I grasp you: what argument? The fact that there is something on our world like a colleral damage? There is sth like this,and so what? You first described Israelis as tormented by Palestinians. But you forgot to add that Palestinians are also tormented. Aren't they? They surely are...
kpiaseck 4 years ago
arabs are surely tormented, tormented by arab leaders who need to keep them as victims and use them as pawns. if only isreal was around while your fathers were helping the nazis round up my great grand father. isreal will never let that happen again.
NEOCON999 4 years ago
Neocon, 'while your fathers were helping the nazis round up my great grand father'..... there is no other comment from me than to tell you that my father is a Jewish holocaust survivor and we live in Warsaw. Face the mirror.....
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpieseck, you expect me to believe your father is a holocaust surviver? you can't be saying the things you say, and be as soft on terrorists like you are, if you know first handed the dangers of a murderous deadly ideology. i just think your lying!
NEOCON999 4 years ago
Neocon,all I can say is: you have been fed with incredible hatred and bias. Your absurdal brain filter made me a terrorist supporter,although it is ME who proved Deiryassin lied. Your behavior here is a shame to an image of a civilized Jew. Your posts are and Deiryassin's are on the same level of a one-sided tabloid. You cast accusations and absurdal offences,and instead coming back to reflection,you escape by accusing me of lying... Think whatever you wish.
kpiaseck 4 years ago
kpiaseck, you went from moderate to apologist for the terrorists. what happened? the reason why the isrealis kill so many pals is because the pals can't stop themselves from trying to kill jews. the arabs are their own worst enemies. in regard to the settlers, why don't you click on my name and watch "why the settlers act the way they do"
NEOCON999 4 years ago
"you went from moderate to apologist for the terrorists" - Neocon,this is not even outrageous.This is just funny. You constantly fail to address the FACT of the inhumane disproportion of water supply and turn your debater to 'apologist for terrorist'. Neocon,are you okay?
kpiaseck 4 years ago
Israel was founded on terrorism. Initial theft of land was achieved through despicable terror acts (Deir Yassin). Zionists continue to expropriate Palestinian land (3900 tanks & 360 fighter aircraft from US taxpayer). These settlements are illegal according to UN /Geneva treaties. These treaties grant a right to resist. Israel is morally illegitimate. No one has the right to drive people off their land through violence. One day, Apartheid Israel will be dismantled as it was in S. Africa.
diryassin 4 years ago
Reverting to extremist actions has NEVER solved anything. Look at Americas war on terror, look at the endless violence in Israel and Palestine. Fundamentalism, whether its religious (Christian/Islamic/Jewish) or political will never solve anything.
brentblair55555 4 years ago
Your moral equivalence is amoral,and your non sequiturs are a waste of my time
rb9009 4 years ago
bomb palestine as much as you like, but you will never defeat the strength and determination of the palestinian people.one ice cream of a rocket lands in isreal and ALL THE RESIDENTS RUN FOR THEIR LIFES!! run you zionists, run away from an eventual defeat inshallah!!
OpenerUK 4 years ago
determination to destroy Israel and drive (kill) the residents (zionists) into the sea? the only thing you'll get is another 'poo-nami' inshallah.
Joanrudd, how's that search on racism going?
rb9009 4 years ago
People need to wake up and realize Hamas was founded by the Israeli government. It is in the zionists' interest to keep Hamas and Fatah fighting each other because it they did not they could easily get rid of the state of Israel
asianlion7 4 years ago
LOL, possibly one of the stupidest conspiracy theories I've ever heard, maybe the most.
rb9009 4 years ago
To 'non racist rb9009' please explain what you mean by 'palestinian emotive stupidity' and don't assume I have children.
joanrudd 4 years ago
more importantly, I think you need to explain your knee-jerk racist name calling
rb9009 4 years ago
rb9009 to label a race of people as emotive and stupid is racist.
joanrudd 4 years ago
Hamas and Fatah war with each other kill each other break ceasefire after ceasefire and then bomb Israel yeah that'll make it all better. Hamas has launched close to 150 bombs into Israel in the last week. What do you expect Israel to do when someone bombs them, send a thank you note.
Ender1zero1 4 years ago
This is the first time that I have watched Al jazeera. It didn't come to Canada.
michie05 4 years ago
well, look it up. I think you'll find mostly opinion/ editorials there, rarely any journalism.
rb9009 4 years ago
You need to calm down and base your arguments on facts not the rantings of a racist nutcase.
joanrudd 4 years ago
My comment was in respose to rb9009
joanrudd 4 years ago
racist nutcase?! absolutely nothing I said was racist Joan. Look up the definition of racist or go pick you children up from soccer practice, just leave the arguments to the people who can make them.
rb9009 4 years ago
oh so your sexist too.
brentblair55555 4 years ago
Al Jazeera does probably has the most unbiased reporting of any network out there. I am not a Palestinian projecting my biased opinions on you, I am a white Canadian who has learned that what you see is not always what you get. Think about it.
brentblair55555 4 years ago
you're a white canadian?? nobody said palestinian emotive stupidity was confined to palestine.
rb9009 4 years ago
If you want to talk about justified attacks I suggest you think about who invaded Palestine and forced these people to live in poverty and oppression. I would strongly think about where you get your information as most Western broadcasting companies project a pro-Israel stance and you are not getting the whole story. cont.
brentblair55555 4 years ago
invaded palestine? look up the tomb of the patriarchs and tell me where the palestinians were.
rb9009 4 years ago
You seem not to be bothered at all by the "rockets that serve as a sign of resistance" that are launched daily against civilians in the Israeli town of Sderot. So, as someone who values both Palestinian and Israeli lives, I can only ask you, does firing rockets at Israeli civilians ever, EVER make things better for the Palestinians?
gjfriend 4 years ago
Of course it doesn't, but what recourse do they have?? I am by no means justifying the rocket attacks. Those nations with clout in the international community ignore the plight of these people and justify the actions of Israel when they were the ones who started this conflict. Israel gets the economic and political backing of the most powerful nations, while Palestine gets relatively nothing.
brentblair55555 4 years ago
what recourse than further ruining their lives? and then you don't justify the rocket attacks?! i think you're logic is inverted. palestinians started the conflict, yet again, and the Israelis have a duty to end it. Israel gets powerful backing because it is clearly right, while palestinians get nothing but the mess they've created.
rb9009 4 years ago
Their lives are already ruined by living in the humiliating circumstances that they are forced to endure, and I can understand why the attacks happen but not have to agree with them. Responding to violence with more violence rarely leads to any solution, genocide is not a viable option. Right and wrong are objective, whereas it is obvious to see that Palestinians live in far worse conditions than the Israelis.
brentblair55555 4 years ago
You would benefit from an introductory course in logic Brent, especially when discussing the plight of a people. By your logic, you can understand why the Palestinians would want their lives to move from bad to worse. Why???
rb9009 4 years ago