RR Traffic Signal Preemption Malfunction at Echo Lake Road

[wisecrac99]

The bulbs likely aren't burnt out. More likely the load switch has a bad channel in it. That is the device that the controller uses to send power to the lights out on the street. The highway department responsible likely doesn't look very thoroughly at their equipment and no one has called in to complain. It is a very easy fix.

[MrCooltim45]

those bells sound weird

[Michael21700]

Just the green bulb was out or gonee.

[Headbanger142]

@Michael21700 The bottom bulb is meant to be a yellow warning light that goes on and off. But it never works around there.

[YankeePat94]

Does the light for Echo Lake stay red until the train clears?

[llokuta]

@YankeePat94 Yes

[rpmangin]

Drivers are NEVER supposed to stop on the tracks. If only drivers did not stop on railroad tracks, nobody would have to worry about railroad light "pre-empts." There are even signalized intersections in downtown Moline where no cars are allowed to stop between the railroad tracks and the roadway even though, in reality, there is room for one car.

[YankeePat94]

not to be a smart alec, but this is charlotteburg rd. echo lake rd doesn't begin until the light ahead.

[llokuta]

@YankeePat94 I know. However, if you look at the AAR information on the rely box for the crossing, it is labeled "Echo Lake Road". My guess is that Charlottesburg Road actually starts as soon as you cross over the tracks and get off the state property of the jug handle, and on to the private property of the Newark Watershed.

[YankeePat94]

@llokuta ok. There's a railroad crossing on Mountainview Boulevard (Route 202) in Wayne where on the relay box, it says Boonton Avenue.

[ss3kidgoku]

does the train usually come through this intersection at a fast speed??

[llokuta]

Track speed through here is 30 or 35 I think. Westbounds typically go slower through here because there is a long, steep, and curvy grade that westbounds must tackle before they get here. Eastbounds, on the other hand, are usually going at a nice speed because they are on level terrain at this point.

[decline2state]

Recently there was an accident at a similar intersection in Redwood City, Ca. The signal pre-emption was defeated by the presence of a fire truck, which changed the signal for the traffic trying to clear the track back to red. A car was thus stopped on the track, and the driver was killed.

[llokuta]

Interesting. I had heard that emergency vehicles were able to manipulate traffic signals but I didn't know how widely used that practice was. I'm surprised there was no safeguard in effect to defeat a pre-empt. Thanks for commenting.

[sloppyboots]

@llokuta I am a FF EMT and there is a special strobe light which is mounted on the apparatus. There is a special reciever which looks like a camera on the traffic signal system, The reciever senses the special strobe, changes all lights to red, except the approaching direction and gives the apparatus green to help move traffic. Not all intersections have this but it is becomming more prevalent Hope this helps

[Voyage400]

Traffic Signal preemption devices, also know as the 3M Opticom, uses a 14 hz encrypted strobe light to activate the preemption sequence. Older Opticoms don't use encryptions, and thus are easier to hack by making a fake preemption device using parts that can be found on any electronics store website.

[rpmangin]

@decline2state Huh? I always thought a railroad crossing preempt took precedence over an emergency vehicle preempt. At least, that's the way it should be, because, unlike a train, an emergency vehicle can at least stop quickly or swerve to avoid a collision. On the other hand, considering there was an emergency vehicle present, traffic may have ignored the green light anyway to let the fire truck go, because most of the time, emergency vehicles can just ignore traffic signals.

[robertgift]

@decline2state Idiot driver to stop on a track and then remain in the vehicle if a train arrived.

[DRfermasMs]

what railroad is this?

[llokuta]

This is the NYS&W railway in West Milford NJ. This is their "Southern Division" mainline. The line runs from North Bergen, NJ to Syracuse and Utica, NY.

[DRfermasMs]

thx

[Porow501]

ive never seen a traffic light with no green light like the ones on the crossing

[llokuta]

I've only seen this setup in one other location - at the exit of a firehouse where exiting trucks can give cross-traffic a red light so that they can exit to emergencies faster. Theoretically, the bottom yellow flashers just tell cars to slow down through the intersection, solid yellows mean prepare to stop, and red means to stop. Thanks for commenting!

[Porow501]

I don't have any lights like that on the crossing by my dad's work. It just has a motion sensor on each side, the bell and the lights (the bell rings sound the whole time until the gates go up), and the gates, of course.

[Porow501]

nice video did a train ever come over that crossing when the signal was activated if it did how long did it take

[llokuta]

Yes a train did come but it took about 2 minutes to get there. East of this crossing there is a long, steep grade and approaching trains are usually "grinding up" the rail on approach. Since this is a motion activated crossing, it is common for it to activate extremely early on westbound movements. Thanks for commenting!

[Porow501]

Oh i see. The crossing nearby my dad's work dosen't activate that early. Thanks for the reply.

[guitarplayer3602]

i love traffic preemption. so interesting to me.

and ive never in my life seen a traffic light with no green lights lol. but from the looks of it, seems it would work fine.

[llokuta]

Me too! It seems that having it is the only way to get people to actually stop at crossings. It's amazing how people almost always obey, and never think twice about disregarding, traffic signals, YET they will disregard railroad crossing protection and drive into the path of a multi-hundred ton train! Thanks for commenting.

[guitarplayer3602]

yeah it currently uses the strobe system and i.r. stuff and whatnot, but i just read that they are going to start using r.f. signals instead, because of the whole like of sight issue with strobes. i guess they will start using g.p.s. and route planning, so that all of the lights emergency vehicles hit will be timed perfectly. technology is amazing...

[trainz675]

how long wer the lights activated?

[llokuta]

The signals activated 2 minutes + before the train arrived. This is a motion activated crossing, and the long steep grade to the east really "grinds up the rail" when the slow trains approach.

[Headbanger14]

Those signals are just a big waste. The road it's pointing at is abandoned. The only people I see go up there are cops.

[robertgift]

Looks like bottom lights are switched off.

Doubtful all three bulbs would be out.

System still works OK. Distant signal goes green to allow traffic to clear the crossing.

2 minutes before train?! That's bad. Encourages drivers to run the signal.

Thanks for your video.

[loophole3]

those are some FAST yellows. lol

[cjkline83]

Depends on the posted speed limit of the intersection. If its a 25 - 35 mph roadway, the time from when the RED RR lights kick in til the red final signal above illuminates is about 7 seconds. 4 seconds for the yellows. Even the next signal shares about the same amount of yellow time.

[KB1KOI]

where the bottom yellows flashing beforehand, but not recorded properly?

[llokuta]

No, the bottom yellows were not flashing. The old sequence when the light was installed was: bottom yellows would flash for a few seconds first, then the middle solid yellows would illuminate (and at this time, the track clearance green cycle on the other side of the crossing would kick in), then after a few seconds, the red light would be displayed until about 10 seconds after the train cleared.

[llokuta]

Since another programming problem was fixed with the signal about two years ago, the bottom set of yellow flashers seems to have been excluded completely from the cycle. Either that, or the bulbs are burnt out.

[soccerdude7330]

I bet the bulbs burnt out. They should change out those incandescents with new Dialight High-Flux LED's.

Anyway, nice video, and thats a cool signal setup there!

[nathanlovesCPRail]

Impossible, all three blubs couldn't have burn out. I will accept the face that the bottom set of yellow flashers seem to have been excluded completely from the cycle.

[BRYLON123456789]

What kind of bells?

[llokuta]

I'm thinking Safetran dual bells (one on each mast) but next time I'm in the area, I'll check for you. They sound pretty good, no?

[skyman2002]

Was there a Train approaching? Or was the signals going off for no Apparent reason? Thank you.

[llokuta]

Train was approaching, but the traffic signal integration portion is out of whack. This video was posted so my friends in the signal department can see exactly what is going on. Its hard to explain. Crossing activated 2 minutes before the train arrived.