To ARMINIANS -Romans 11:32 "for God has shut up all to unbelief, that he might have mercy on all".
To CALVINISTS -1 Timothy 4:10"for for this we both labour and are reproached, because we hope on the living God, who is Saviour of ALL MEN ESPECIALLY y of those believing."
DOUBTERS I Cor. 15:23-28"But every man in his own order:..For He must reign until He has put all enemies under His feet..last enemy...destroyed is DEATH... Son also Himself be subject unto Him..that God may be ALL IN ALL"
"Limited Atonement" hogwash! Guess sin doesn't matter, repentance, or remorse. Maybe its simply limited in that thru Grace we get away with it. So again, it doesn't matter. Guess (and I do that a lot) when the Lord cries because we care so little about sin we can keep doing it too. Guess, it doesn't matter that we knowingly continue to defile our Temples and others well-being because we have been Saved. Continued...
@greghar2003 Actually limited atonement is true. I couldn't accept this FACT like you but I had to accept it. For if Christ really died for everyone then preaching makes no sense since God won't judge them since Christ paid for their sins already. And who said God cries because we care so little about sin? Bible says he's furious at the wicked.
@TheFox251 I disagree for Christ DID die for everyone! However, it is only those who recognize this and reach out to Christ as their one and only Savior who can be saved. Christ WILL judge everyone, including those he Saves! But those Saved will not have to bare the "Lake of Fire". Mankind is in God's image, but it's the individual who must make the choice. Good or Evil? Once one Truly finds the Holy Spirit, sin will become disgusting and there will be remorse for doing so.
@greghar2003 Then Christ made salvation a POSSIBILITY and not a CERTAINTY. Did he also die for the unforgivable sin? Because if he didn't then that's not everyone. And the bible clearly says not everyone receives the Holy Spirit and that sinful man CANNOT come to God. And if you've watched this video I'm sure you got the part where even Jesus said he's not praying for everyone. Jesus even said NO ONE CAN come to me unless my Father draws him to me.
@TheFox251 Yes and No. But you're assumptions are not. For some, Salvation may be certain but for others it's not. Unforgivable sin, meaning what, idolatry? Yes, only if one repents. All men are sinful that is why we need Salvation. But finding the Holy Spirit helps us overcome those sinful ways. Are you above/beyond sin? No one is, but thru the Holy Spirit we do not want to, do less of it and have remorse for doing so. Yes, only thru Jesus may we enter Heaven,.
@greghar2003 Yes and no? That makes no sense. And if salvation is certain for some and not for everyone how can you say he died for everyone? By unforgivable sin I mean the sin the Pharisees committed that Jesus said would never be forgiven. There's a sin he never died for and that shows he didn't die for all sins. And the bible also says no man seeks God. God gives his Holy Spirit, he doesn't leave it out to be found since it's not available to everyone.
@TheFox251 True it's all about choices ours and Gods. Yes salvation is for everyone who makes that choice. But they have to truly commit themselves to it. Simply because someone says so and even believe they are, doesn't mean they are. The Pharisees already made their choice so why would God offer his Grace to them? I previously meant only those that are 'truly" saved are certain. However, only God "truly" knows who they are. One may think so, but until that time, we won't truly know.
@greghar2003 Then if salvation is for everyone that makes that choice then why does the bible go in favour by saying that it is therefore not up to man's effort or choice but God who has mercy. When God chose Jacob over Isaac neither had any choice in the matter. Heck neither existed to make a choice. And Jesus during his time one earth only chose some people and chose to reveal himself to some while leaving some others out in the cold. He's not obligated to save anyone even if they make choice
@TheFox251 God knows us better than we know ourselves and when God chose Jacob he had a choice but didn't say no. They were smart and good enough to know to chose yes. Same with Noah and whoever. If he came to you, you would have that choice. Why would Jesus reveal himself to everyone It's his choice who to show and what to say? Obviously, not all are worthy.. We should not talk as if we know God well enough to say what he is obligated or should do. He is Good and will do the right thing.
@greghar2003 The bible doesn't mention he had a choice. What it does mention was God superiority in the matter. The fact is no one is worthy, that is why God is not obligated to do anything for any of us. We are sinners only thing God owes us is hell. Fortunately he sent his Son so that some won't go there and they'll be with him forever. Paul didn't have much of a choice in his conversion. God blinded him and shocked him and God didn't ask him if he could. God is the boss and we're not.
@TheFox251 Of course they did. You are being near-sighted and are beginning to refuse common sense into your argument. We ALL have choices and so does God. We are made in God's image, not the devil's or as robots or puppets!!! Simply stated, what this is about is Good vs Evil. Which side do people chose? Hell is not for good but only evil which serves as punishment. People chose to be Good or evil and those who want God's Grace must chose to be good and find the Holy Spirit.
@greghar2003 Pharaoh had no choice when God decided to harden his heart and raise him up to show his glory. I just let God be God. And it isn't about good vs. evil, it' all about God's glory. God gets glory in both the salvation and condemnation of people. And we are made in his image which is now an image tainted by sin and rebellion. God is holy and completely above us. The bible says no one is good. When Adam sinned all died. We didn't have a choice in Adam's sin affecting us.
@TheFox251 Please keep in mind I only say this because I DO CARE!!! I'm sorry but you are brainwashed. I sense you don't fully understand the words and arguments you list. Likewise being this way, you've shown me you are not one with the Holy Spirit yet. This is going nowhere, almost like talking with an atheist and as I said, I do care. As I said before, "Please forgive me Lord because I am inept and wish I could do more. With all my Love and Devotion, if I only had more." God Bless!
@greghar2003 Oh trust me I'm not brainwashed. I simply put the bible over man's tradition. And I am not an atheist I'm a Christian saved and bought by Jesus. I had no part in my salvation, God did it all. If I'm saved it's because he chose me before I even existed and determined that his Son would die for me and others. Tradition makes big on man's free will while the bible doesn't. If you read it as it is you'll find it difficult to conclude that man's will is completely free.
Guess, the only difference between Good and Evil is that Good believes in Christ. Guess by now, I should learn to control my anxiety over the Lord's heart-felt weeping because we refuse to obey his laws due to being Saved and self-righteous. Guess, I'm an idiot and should not be so concerned about others lack of caring for themselves and others. Guess, I'll try not to comment on these matters anymore because others seem to get angry and not understand. Continued...
Please forgive me Lord because I am inept and wish I could do more. I love you Lord with all my heart, more than life itself. With all my Love and Devotion, if I only had more. If only I could not be such a disappointment in your eye, and maybe sometime, brighten your day as much you do mine. God Bless everyone!
Calvinists are not blasphemous heretics. I might not happen to agree with the "limited atonement" petal of the tulip, but I can't see a reason for calling those who do blasphemous and heretics. In answer to 88momart's question, the reason why there is a lot of venom directed at Calvinists is their arrogance. To say that you have a deeper walk with God than someone who disagrees with you is arrogant and holier than thou.
@Elizabeth1ification I'm sorry if I sounded offensive...I didn't mean to sound like;," since becoming reformed, my walk is "deeper than someone else's"...what I was saying, is that my relationship with God is deeper than it used to be. My appreciation for the sufficiency of Jesus' atonement has greatly increased, and has radically changed my life, since becoming convinced of the "reformed" position. Didn't mean to sound arrogant!!
It has been my observation, that those who adhere to and teach Reformed Theology, are more zealous and passionate towards God. Their understanding of His Sovereignty, affords them a deeper walk with Him, and an even greater appreciation for their salvation. And the Scriptures plainly teach that this position is absolutely Biblical. Why so much venom directed towards those who are willing to "let God be God"?
I've read John 6:37-44 many times, maybe you should read it once again. I know what verse 40 says. You should read what verse 44 says, " No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. "
And verse 65, " And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father. "
Of course everyone who believes has eternal life, but people pervert the word, "whosoever".
I used to be a whosoever guy, and used to teach the free will gospel, but when I stopped letting people tell me what the Bible teaches, and began to let the Holy Spirit teach me, I begin to see that we had been deceived. John 1 :12-13 clearly says that the new birth is not attained by the "free will of man". Romans 9 says the same thing. Even Israel was elected before the nation was ever born. Anyone who studies their Bible, and or the history of the church, can know the truth and be free.
LaneCh is spreading false doctrine in the body of Christ an causing harm and confusion. He thinks he is glorifying God with calvinism and preaching the truth, but he is slandering and misrepresenting the god of the bible. The god of calvinism is NOT the God of the bible. Calvinists try to twist all the clear verses of Scripture, that contridict their false doctrine, around and give them different meanings. Lane will have to answer to God one day. Please pray for him.
Do Arminians just come to these reformed videos and never listen to them?It doesn't seem they do because they constantly ask the same questions over and over that the video answers completely and with scripture.
@17:00 - Actually, God does seem to say, "whoever wants to, come and take my stuff!" Revelation 22:17, "The Spirit and the bride say, "Come." And let the one who hears say, "Come." And let the one who is thirsty come; let the one who wishes take the water of life without cost."
Limited Atonement? Why then did John the Baptist declare, "Behold, the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world"?
@retirebefore25guy "the world" means "Mankind", not any individual! You have to make a difference, because there are 2 kinds of children in this world. God's Children, and Satan's Children. Jesus says that. And He came to Regenerate God's Children.
@shanecruey the elect, who were bought by his blood, may deny Christ before they receive the Holy spirit and regenerated. Didn't even the apostle Peter deny knowing Jesus three times before the rooster crowed. Denying Christ does not necessarily mean that someone is lost.
doctrine of inability is plainly taught in Acts 8:22-23 "Repent of this wickedness and pray to the Lord. Perhaps he will forgive you for having such a thought in your heart. For I see that you are full of bitterness and captive to sin.” We are 'captives' and in 'bondage' to sin and yet Peter makes it clear that Simon had to repent. And Peter qualifies that 'if possible' God will forgive him, not saying ur definitely forgiven
Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God personally preplanned (hatched the idea of) the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
Your argument about the boss / employee relationship proves the OPPOSITE of your contention. Yes the boss is all-powerful in his place of work, yes, if you refuse to obey him you will be fired. So with God. God is all powerful - tells us all what to do, how to live & commands all men everywhere (Acts 2) to repent and believe in Jesus. If we ignore this command, we will 'get fired'. God is still in charge (as the boss is still in charge) but we fail to benefit any longer from association with him
@cornwallsteve If God knew who would be saved and who would be lost before time,then that means that God knew there would be a finite number of people born who wouldn't choose Him and who would go to Hell before He ever created them,right?So then God created people with no hope of Heaven,when He could have just not let them be born.,but He did allow their births for His purpose.God's will WILL always be done and God's will is to save some and let the others stay in their sin,to show His wrath.
@cornwallsteve Even if you hold to the Arminian view that God saw who would choose Him and He chose them based on that,it still doesn't change the fact that God made people for Hell with no hope of ever being saved.God will show ALL His attributes to His creation,Love,Mercy,Grace and Wrath.His ways are not our ways,but it seems that when He does things different than men,men reject Him and create a god in their own image,man hates the TRUE GOSPEL.
@CBALLEN God is not responsible for the sin and loss of those people, they are. Calvinists do a neat 'double book-keeping entry' to shift the blame from God onto the lost ones, whilst maintaining his sovereignty, as ordainer of all outcomes - You can't have it both ways. Calvinism effectively accuses God of sin, if he is the author / designer of all eventuality. Biblical Christianity lays the blame for sin at the foot of the perpetrator, so God, being sinless, is not responsible for their loss.
@cornwallsteve But if it was God's will that everyone go to Heaven,then why just not let those who will be born with no hope of salvation,not be born?Because if they were never born then they would never go to Hell.Again,since God made people who He knew, had no hope of Heaven,why would Jesus die for them?That would be illogical of God saying there was hope for them and that Jesus died for them when,when there's not and He really didn't.
God is not a puppet master with his hand inside a glove puppet called Satan.
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Just read this call of God to his people, and let it inform your understanding of his generous, loving heart towards men even in their rebellion..
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"As I live, says the Lord GOD, I have NO PLEASURE in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn, turn from your evil ways; for why will you die, O house of Israel?" Ez 33:11
@cornwallsteve And we were once counted with the wicked,true, and just because He has no pleasure in the death of the wicked is irrelevant,but the difference between the unregenerate sheep and the goats is,once the sheep Hear the Effectual call of God,we come,they won't ever come.
@CBALLEN according to this theory, that God has created a universe then ordained every tiny detail that ever happens, even to controlling the will of men, why did he bother with this whole 1st creation. If what you suggest is true, he could have gone straight to the eternal state, no need for men to be tested, as God, you claim, creates the outcome anyway. This is plain nonsense. Read the Bible story, and you see time and time again, God appealing to men to repent, asking them to choose him.
@CBALLEN It matters hugely that God states he has no pleasure in the death of the wicked. Calvinism claims that it gives God maximum glory to create these men in order to damn them - this claim that God's highest glory doesn't give him pleasure? Are we expected to believe this contradiction? No. God and the angels rejoice when a sinner repents! why, if he made them do it - this is a no-brainer. You claim God's emotions are that fickle - like a child play-acting with toys?!
@cornwallsteve Still,God created men who will go to Hell without any hope of Heaven.even before their birth.So you, like me, can only witness to people,not that God loves them all and wants them all to be saved,we can only witness to the world to repent and believe in the gospel,call upon the name of the Lord and be saved,because all that do this will be saved.As far as Angels rejoicing,this too is true,because Angels are just like humans as far as not knowing who God's elect are.
@CBALLEN I have a question for you. If a 'saved Christian' loses their way for a few days, and commits a major sin (such as adultery), do you believe that God has ordained that this event take place? If so, did he organise and plan for this saint to enact this? Did God cause this to take place? Presumably you think so, as you believe God in his sovereignty ordained every event and eventuality? So you must reckon that God is responsible, or co-responsible for sin?
@cornwallsteve I believe that God had to have ordained it,or it would not have happened,but I also believe Romans 8:28.Just like when some preachers say that God caused these earth quakes, hurricanes,tornadoes,ect, and all the newscasters and even people who call themselves Christians say that it wasn't God,and put those who said it down,when God absolutely He did.Amos 3:6 Is a trumpet blown in a city, and the people are not afraid? Does disaster come to a city, unless the LORD has done it?
Steve do you not realize that The RCC was SYNERGISTIC AND THAT WAS THE REASON FOR THE REFORMATION?Martin Luther risked his life to separate from their doctrine,that's what it mostly was about,The Pope claiming rule over all Christians and Catholicism teaching that man had to cooperate with God before God could save a person.That's why Arminianism is just Catholicism without the frills.In America reformed belief was all there was at one time,then Jesuits infiltrated the protestant churches.
@cornwallsteve Jacob Arminius was trained by Jesuits to teach Molinism and cause problems for the reformers,it was Romes attempt to bring all protestant churches back under Romes umbrella and control.ALL Protestant Christian cults,Jws, Mormons,oneness Pentecostals ect are a product of Arminianism,with the exception of Universalism.Read up on the Jesuits and you will be shocked about where your beliefs came from,they are wicked men.This is where the saying all roads lead to Roman came from.
@CBALLEN Thanks for the history lesson (genuinely!) but I dont take my lead from ANY of them, I just ask God to teach me from the BIble. I wonder, if you think God caused the Christian to sin (as Driscoll claims several in his congregation are living in adultery etc) then why castigate them / encourage them to do anything about it, if only God does it? In fact, why offer any moral guidance to anybody if they are nothing to do with the outcomes of their lives. Why get out of bed in the morning?
@cornwallsteve Repentance is a dead work under law.Believing Jews were told to repent of going back to law.Repentance from dead works in context of Hebrews is don't return to works of law but serve in the Spirit of liberty.Christ is not pleased with constant repentance and moral works for believers.Christ is not a minister of sin Gal 2 16,17 Constant repentance going back not forward is the law of works
@polopowers1 Can you see the inherent contradiction in what you just wrote?: 1. Repentance is a dead work under law 2. Jews were told to REPENT of going back to the law 3. ie we are to repent of repenting.....?!?!? . NO! . The logic you present is self defeating. 1. If repentance is a dead work, then why does God 2. command us to repent of dead works, if repentance is a dead work . Can you provide a verse to show repentance IS dead works, not ESCAPE from dead works as I suggest.
@polopowers1 2nd contradiction you offer (quote): "Christ is not pleased with constant repentance and moral works for believers.Christ is not a minister of sin". You undermine the truth of the gospel here. I agree Christ is not a minister of sin, and for this reason he wants his children to NOT SIN, which by definition, according to Christ and the Apostles, is precisely to remain in a place of 1. Repentance of sin/self, and 2. Righteous living - holiness - avoiding sin - doing the works of God
@polopowers1 2nd contradiction you offer (quote): "Christ is not pleased with constant repentance and moral works for believers.Christ is not a minister of sin". I agree Christ is not a minister of sin, for this reason he wants his children to NOT SIN. This by definition (according to Christ and the Apostles) is to remain in a place of 1. repentance, and 2. righteous living, holiness, NOT SINNING, doing the works of God. You appear to be undermining the very gospel of repentance and holy faith!
@cornwallsteve Brother,as I've said before ,man does exactly what His heart most desires ,but God ordains what He does,how all this works out,I couldn't tell you.Just like the men who killed Jesus,they did exactly what they wanted to do to Jesus,but God ordained the very men who did it,to be the ones to do it.Judas ,same thing.The Bible says that man plans what he will do,but it's God who directs his steps.God's ways are not our ways and I couldn't begin to tell you how He does it.
You claim that man does exactly what his heart most desires, making MAN 100% responsible for his actions.
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Then on the other hand you make God see 100% responsible for everything that ever happens.
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Can you not see this is impossibile - a conceptual deadlock forced by your insistence on Calvinistic dble predestination. God is NOT responsible for sin. It is contrary to his character. God IS SINLESS. God tempts no-one to sin.James 1:13
@CBALLEN Once again - you cant use the death of Christ to prop up this argument because God was in Christ self sacrificing. This is very different from the mass of sin in mankind. Christ laid down his own life - he said, "no man takes my life from me, but I lay it down and take it up again."
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"And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the [ra], that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not" (Jonah 3:10)
@CBALLEN Before signing off, please answer this one question - From what you have written, do you believe that when a man brutally rapes and murders an infant, God planned this event, and organised the lives of the perpetrator and the victim to this end, in order to glorify himself?
@cornwallsteve Your answer can be found in scripture,man makes his plans,but God directs his steps,just as He did in the death of His Son and Josephs kidnapping,being sold into slavery,being imprisoned and finally being made a powerful ruler.As Joseph said to his brothers,you intended it for evil,but GOD intended it for good to save many alive.He didn't say the evil you intended God USED FOR GOOD,He said it was God's intention that all happen just as it did.
@cornwallsteve Why won't you answer any of my question?Why did God allow people to be born with no hope of Heaven if His intention was to save everyone?
@CBALLEN OK - I'll answer you quick, but I need to know in the particular instance I describe.. (I believe that God made men with every hope of heaven, and provided them all with every opportunity, and will judge each according to their moral choices and response to his calling in their lives. Foreknowledge is not dictatorial design)
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To my question - Did God cause, by predetermination, the man to rape and kill the infant? Did this predetermination occur in order to most glorify himself?
@cornwallsteve God gets the glory in the end for ALL THINGS,since ALL HIS HOLY WILL WILL BE ACCOMPLISHED.Again,why do you think He let men be born just to Go to Hell?Why did He allow them to be born knowing they had no hope?
@CBALLEN Of all our conversation, I need you to please try to answer this question, as I have realised it is the nub of the debate between us. You think that God caused the wicked man to rape and murder the infant, and that this maximises his eternal glory. Am I correct?
@cornwallsteve I've answered it many times already are you not reading what I wrote?Man does the evil He wants to do in his own heart,but God directs that evil and even stops it at times,God controls the steering and the brakes of men.Joseph's brother originally wanted to kill Joseph,but God stopped them,so unless God has a purpose for something happening,it does NOT HAPPEN.Why He does things like He does is His secret and I do not know,but I know what the Bible says about it.
@CBALLEN (I'm not into the easy 'invite Jesus into your heart' type message at all. I Agree Jesus did not teach that. But what he did do, when anyone asked him what they had to do to be saved, is he told them what to do. He did not say ever, 'you can't do anything about it, you'll have to wait for God to save you if you're lucky!'
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So you do believe God makes men lie, steal, blaspheme, rape, murder, and harm infants. This is unbelievable. You actually think that God, who is love, does this?
@cornwallsteve You're getting very monotonous to talk to here,WHY DID GOD ALLOW PEOPLE TO BE BORN THAT HE KNEW HAD NO HOPE FOR HEAVEN IF HIS INTENT WAS TO SAVE EVERYONE?
"God allowed all people to be born with opportunity to seek him and find him.
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"God has made from one blood EVERY nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings, so that they should seek the Lord, IN THE HOPE that they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us" Acts 17
@cornwallsteve That still doesn't answer the question since those born without hope of Heaven didn't have an opportunity.No matter what happened,while they were alive on Earth they didn't have any hope.God let them be born to go to Hell.So how can you say that Jesus died for all when He couldn't help them and why do you say God wants all saved,when He knew they wouldn't be,that just makes no sense at all.please explain.
@CBALLEN [you just suggested I was not being Christian for avoiding answering a question.... pls see my qu. below.] In answer to yours (I do keep trying) ... The verse I shared clearly states that God made all men everywhere to reach out and seek him - he is not far from any of us, and God created all nations IN THE HOPE that they would seek him, You are standing against the simple beauty of this revealed truth by going to the extreme opposite end of the spectrum and refusing to see the balance.
@cornwallsteve No ,you're still not answering it,God knew the very people who would go to Hell by name,but He still allowed them to be born,so how could you say that Jesus died for these people to forgive their sin when He obviously didn't die for them.Jesus only died for believers,that's it.So if you say Jesus died in hopes of saving everyone,then that's ridiculous.
@CBALLEN - But mate, IT'S NOT ME SAYING IT, it's the Bible. read the words, these are not my words... (I know God knows the future, but time is seriously real, outcomes not fixed.)
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"God has made from one blood EVERY nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings, so that they should seek the Lord, IN THE HOPE THAT THEY MIGHT grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from EACH ONE OF US" Acts 17.
@CBALLEN - God hopes people will turn to him - we are told this, so it must be true. He waits patiently, appealing to us. The lost only will have themselves to blame, carrying great regret that they could have chosen for God but didn't, and there's no way they would be able to say God fixed the outcome deliberately. They rejected his light, his calling, his sacrifice, his grace.
@CBALLEN - "The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance." 2 Peter 3:9
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"that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life."For God so LOVED THE WORLD that he gave his one and only Son, that WHOEVER believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him." John 3:15-17
@cornwallsteve 2 Peter is talking about the elect not everyone,you still won't take scripture seriously and continue to throw it out there without being honest.I''m not debating with you to try and make myself look good in any way,as Christians we should search for the truth,not just try and make our doctrine look good.Fact is,Arminianism is flawed Satanic Catholic doctrine put out by Catholics to try and bring back Protestants to the Catholic Church and under the Pope,you're almost there.
@CBALLEN In a nutshell, It's what happens in this lifetime that determines a person's eternal state, not what happened before they were born in pre-eternity. The things that were ordained in pre-eternity, were provision of salvation, and foreknowledge. What we do in this lifetime with what Jesus provided, is the determinant. That God foreknew this, did not make HIM the determinant of our being saved of lost. In his sovereignty he gave choice. This is why he rewards and punishes us after death.
@cornwallsteve That fact remains that God knew every person before time who would not be saved,yet He let let them be born to go to Hell,so no,time is fixed as far as God is concerned,unless you want to claim God is not all knowing as most Arminians have to do to hold on to their doctrine that there's hope for everyone.That's the only way you can remain consistent by claiming God is ignorant,for this very reason.
@cornwallsteve For the very reason that Jesus is not trying to save ALL men without exception,is the reason ALL does not mean ALL men without exception,but means Jews and Gentiles,Kings and rulers,slave and free ect. depending on the context.This is one reason among many,that Arminianism is as false a doctrine as JW,s, Mormonism,Oneness Pentecostalism.Can God save these people though?Yes He can even save Muslims,not because of their false religions but in spite of them.
@CBALLEN Thanks again for your thoughts. This is your problem. Because God foreknew what men and angels would choose & do, you claim that God is responsible for these events as he didn't have to go ahead with the plan. But if this were the case, he wouldn't foreknow the events, as the events would not be going to happen. (Im not saying he doesnt know the future, just that, if he decided not to go ahead, there wd be nothing to foreknow. This is a philosophical trap. But free choice explains it.
You still didn't answer the question.How come God allowed people to be born with no chance of salvation?Why not just let all the elect be born then no one would go to Hell?Does this mean God is evil?He could have stopped it.Just like the question you asked me,I think if God didn't want something to happen He could stop it,we have many examples of Him stopping man's sin.So if God doesn't stop man's sin,that means He has a plan that includes sin.And just like Jesus'death,He plans man's sin.
But please, you still need to address my central question. Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are ou suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
@cornwallsteve You have never answered anything other than God gives everyone a choice of coming or not,you say" He rewards our good works and punishes our disobedience, that doesn't change the FACT that GOD KNOWS WHO ARE AND WHO AREN'T HIS!!HE KNEW THIS BEFORE TIME.SO,WHY WOULD GOD BELIEVE EVERYONE MIGHT BELIEVE IN CHRIST AND HOLD OFF CHRIST'S RETURN FOR THESE PEOPLE WHO WON'T BE COMING,INSTEAD OF JUST THOSE WHO WILL BE COMING?2 PETER is definitely SPEAKING OF waiting for THE SHEEP,NOT GOATS!
@CBALLEN This also should cause you to understand that ALL PEOPLE doesn't mean ALL PEOPLE without exception.All just means JEWS and GENTILES.Again,why would Jesus die for everyone without exception,when God knows ,BY NAME who won't be saved?The Bible says that Jesus died for HIS PEOPLE ONLY!Once you understand this you will also understand how God's will WILL be done,that everyone who Jesus died for WILL BE SAVED and NONE WILL BE LOST! Please try to understand the true GOSPEL!
@cornwallsteve The only way that you can get around these truths I have given you,iS to become an open theists and claim that GOD is NOT ALL KNOWING.Many Arminians seen to be willing to COMPROMISE THE TRUTH OF THE GOSPEL and WHO GOD IS,to hold on to a BLASPHEMOUS FALSE GOSPEL that will send those that teach it to HELL as Paul clearly taught. This is very serious,anyone who claims God is weak and ignorant is SATANIC!!
@CBALLEN You take the biscuit. You think you are so right , but cannot even begin to answer my question. I have posted this question about 6 times now, and you consistently avoid it. I shall post it again for you above. Please let me know your thoughts, as this is the sticking point to seeing your point of view as biblical. I have tried to answer your question using scripture, and my own thoughts. Now please turn to expressing an answer to this honest question in the post above this..... thanks.
@CBALLEN Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc.
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Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment?
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Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
@CBALLEN Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
@CBALLEN Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
@CBALLEN Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
@CBALLEN Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
@CBALLEN Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
@cornwallsteve But lets take your point of view man by free will depravity chose to rape children, God did not interfere. Which God is more loving, God of subjective interference, or God who ordained all for man to admit total powerlessness? Not semi powerlessness which says God is not totally powerful all the time.You seem like a reasonable person, Steve so I ask you which came first God's Spirit or His Virtues (holiness,truth,mercy,etc)? God was simultaneously Spirit Virtue Con't
@polopowers1 None of what I have written infers semi-powerlessness on the part of God!! On the contrary, it proves he can cope with all eventuality, and has the summary of all events. He will be glorified by proving that all darkness / sin was worthless and futile, and all that was of himself is true, just, love, right. Which is why the onus is on us to CHOOSE ARIGHT, and he has given us all and each everything we need to seek and find God. Please see the scripture above to summarise my position
@cornwallsteve God's self existing Life is perpetual Life. He cannot suspend His Nature.He said to Moses I Am That I AM. God is Life by Spirit and Virtue( mercy truth love etc.) If man has power autonomous or virtue of good independent of God, your saying billions of people with knowledge and power are free of God. This is impossible because than God is not all powerful always because free will entities have power not in His control.The same with any virtue you claim man has independent of God.
@polopowers1 Quite a convoluted proposition if I may say. But let me try... God in his sovereignty, had a decision to make. Whether or not to create. His virtue / love (always synonymous with his being) decided to create. So I do not question the moral ethic of his choice to do so. I must look to scripture to interpret the outcomes, contingent upon his love / justice (as God IS love). I observe that the sovereign grant of free will within restricted boundaries, sufficient for testing (cont)
@cornwallsteve God did not need to make a decision.But let us keep it simple can God suspend His virtues yes or no? God is not a God of forever neither is He infinite.This may surprise you, but God is perpetual in Nature which means He is always magnified in His virtues.Though He is immutable He is greater in proportion in living His self existing Life, as He lives.This is the Nature of self existence. God is not moral but like law He exceeds law by His perpetual Life .This not convoluted truth
@polopowers1 You are denying God's revelation of himself by these thoughts. They may be philosophically 'balanced' to your mind, but they fail on several levels. You claim God is not moral. God is the very definition of moral! God is righteous, in him is no unrighteousness, and he commands us to emulate him in this as closely as possible. God manifested fully in Christ, and Christ displayed the righteousness of God. God IS the God of eternity (which is the infinite forever).
@cornwallsteve when I say God made a decision, I mean, he acted in volition. He chose to enact creation. And your theories about the universe only being able to contain one will are true in the utimate state, but in 1st creation, God has held himself back - he exercises patience and longsuffering according to scripture, in order that, out of love, people will repent and enter eternal life. This is his highest intention in 1st creation. His ability to allow Satan / Sin to reign temporarily in...
@polopowers1 ... this world, prove that God is superior to all that is 'not-God' or sin. He will prove that every single whiff of rebellion against him, is of zero worth and effectiveness into eternity. God is sovereign, and can easily cope with 1st creation rebellion against his stated will - by sovereign grant of his highest purpose, to allow free will in his creation. You deny the very raison d'etre of 1st creation.
@cornwallsteve You cannot explain God until you understand His Nature.God is never in suspense or suspended to another will. God being near everyone of us does not mean man has power to reach out by some good within himself.And even if God were to help by His Spirit and Word man does not have any virtue within Himself to act in faith. All free will suspends God's Nature for a moment which is impossible.God never questions within Himself should I create or not create that is suspense
@cornwallsteve God is not a moral self righteousness.God never wanted law to be compared to His Nature The whole law is frustrated morality. Christ exceeds morals they never compare to fruit of the Spirit.The law is not equal to God being moral.God's Nature exceeds morality hence the death of Christ to satisfy. If God were moral the law would satisfy.Self righteous indignation is often the believers quest trying to satisfy God morally. It is impossible.Gos is perpetual virtue not morality.
@polopowers1 You say, if God were moral, the Law would satisfy. You miss the point. Nobody fulfilled the law, so the law was never satisfied. But Christ fulfilled the law in every respect, thus proving his virtue, EXACTLY BECAUSE he fulfilled the Law. It is a false dichotomy. God is righteous (let's not use the word moral). In him is no sin. If you dont agree with this, you have failed to understand the HOLY nature of God.
@polopowers1 cont. men's reciprocation to God, or opposition to God, was granted in first creation, balanced by 1. the culpability of each individual for their choices, judged by their deeds, whether righteous or wicked, and 2. the reparation of eternal reward / punishment, according to men's choices / actions. (the most important of which is repentance and belief in Christ! and HIS works) ie blessed are you who mourn now, for you shall be comforted. Woe to you who are rich, youve had ur reward.
@polopowers1 cont.. But all good is from God, and God is light, and him is no darkness. Darkness is by defn. absence of light. God can sovereignly override anything at will, but chooses not to. God can use Satan to his ends, but is never the source or cause of sin contrary to his righteousness. God is causative to the potential / existence of darkness by creating - ie separating light from dark. But his love / truth knows the outcome is infinitely better to create, than not to, despite the cost.
@cornwallsteve God created the tree of knowledge of good and evil not Satan.God called it good.Why because Gos is not moral equal to the law.He is perpetual virtue better than all law.God can creaate evil because it is not His innate virtue but a proposition of His Knowledge and knoledge is not evil by itself.God called evil knowledge good.Man is powerless having knowledge of evil and must do it.
@polopowers1 Indeed God did create the Tree of knowledge of Good and Evil. This was necessary in order to test the inclinations of each individual man, to facilitate the opportunity to be with God, or without God - ie if they would obey God (by turning from evil and obeying God, by turning to God's provision of salvation in repentance and faith) or disobey God (by living for self, flesh, world, sinful pleasures. Christ is the light that enlightens every man that comes into the world (John 1:9)..
@polopowers1 cont.. By definition, if God was going to create, he would have to create 'not-God' in juxtaposition to himself. This inherently meant that the potential for 'evil' 'sin' would be brought into being, as only God is perfect / immutable / sinless. So what you appear to be doing is 1. undermining the raison d'etre of 1st creation, to create moral beings with decision making powers (under the sovereign grant of God) who's main function in life is to 'choose this day who you will serve'
@polopowers1 cont.. and 2. You appear to be undermining the very definition of Sin, which is 'not-God'. We are told that anything that is not of faith is sin. God by definition cannot be faithless, so God cannot be the author of sin. If one creates freedom, one creates by definition freedom to err, but if the error is 1. commanded not to be done 2. provision for escape provided at the time 3. provision of grace after the event & restitution, then God is TOTALLY non-culpable for sin. He hates sin
@cornwallsteve conclusion: I agree that man can only sin aside from God, but there is one thing that God in his sovereign love has enabled man to do - any man - and that is to REPENT of sin and turn to God, who grants escape from sin, to whosoever calls on him. God has put eternity in the hearts of men, shown them his eternal power & Godhead (Romans 1) and enlightened them all (John 1:9). He then COMMANDS ALL MEN EVERYWHERE to repent. He is not double minded - he states his unequivocal will.
@cornwallsteve It is not antithetical to his sovereignty that men choose not to cooperate with God, as God has sovereignly ordained the facility that they may do this. This was in order that He and his saints are not saddled with Satan / Sin for eternity, as Satan / Sin are anathema to God. He would not want to share eternity with any being who prefers darkness to light, and there will only be light in the New Earth, no darkness. God in righteousness will not coexist with unrighteousness.
@polopowers1 (Acts 17- Paul to unbelievers) God, who made the world and everything in it.. gives to all life.. He has made from one blood every nation of men .. so that they should seek the Lord, IN THE HOPE that they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from EACH ONE OF US; for IN HIM WE LIVE and move and have our being, as also some of your own poets have said, ‘For we are also His offspring.’"
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God is close to all men, available to be sought and found despite their sin.
@cornwallsteve "The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance." 2 Peter 3:9
Surly you understand that since God knows who won't be saved,that Jesus' return in not predicated on God being patient toward people He knows will never come to Him.To believe differently would insinuate that God is fooling Himself.The "YOU" are people HE knows will come,they just haven't been born yet.
@CBALLEN this is astounding friend. I have answered your question over and over, but you are refusing to hear mine. But you tell me I'm not very Christian??. I wonder why this is? Let me try again. I agree with you God knows before time who will accept him and who would not. I believe very strongly that the Bible clearly repeats many times that God is waiting for all people to turn to him, gives them every opportunity. If they dont it is not HIS fault but theirs. Hence their punishment / reward.
@cornwallsteve Why would God wait for people to come to Him unless God is ignorant?He already knows who will and who won't come,so WHAT WOULD BE GOD'S REASON FOR WAITING FOR GOATS TO COME?You're still not answering, is God evil for letting people be born who He knows will just GO TO HELL?Yes or No and why?
@CBALLEN God is just. HE rewards those who obey him, and punishes those who flagrantly rebel. If God was the CAUSE of their sin and rejection of him, then he would be guilty himself! and the punishment would not be justly given to the sinner. But God IS just, and if you read the parable of the talents, you see that what men do with what God gives them, results in their punishment / reward. To suggest that God stacked the deck so men had no real choice is misrepresenting God's love / justice.
@CBALLEN But just because God knew what some sentient free moral agents would choose, which he knew would result in some going to a lost eternity, if he didnt go ahead, then the loss would be greater, as nobody would be in eternity with him. He chose in his infinite wisdom that the benefit outweighed the cost, and the explanation, is, that to maintain his perfect character of love and justice, he gave men liberty to choose or reject him. Those who rejected can only sin. Those who repent he saves
@CBALLEN I'm no where near Catholicism. Thanks for the warning though!.
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You still need to address my central question. Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are ou suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
@cornwallsteve It is God who causes us the be born again by changing our nature from a God hater to a God lover first,only then will we want our Lord Jesus.We didn't choose Him,He chose us.
1 Peter 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the
@CBALLEN So do you believe God makes men lie, steal, blaspheme, rape, murder, and harm infants. Do you actually think that God, who is love, does this?.. perpetrates gross and malevolent abominable sin?
@cornwallsteve Why didn't Jesus tell the Pharisees that He loved them all and that He wanted them all to be saved and to just ASK HIM INTO THEIR HEARTS instead of just telling them they didn't hear Him because they were not His sheep and could not escape Hell?Does this sound like the Jesus preached by most preachers who say that God loves everyone and is trying to save them but they just won't let Him?
@cornwallsteve Even the elect don't always come to Christ the first time they hear the gospel,that's why the Bible tells us that we can grieve the Holy Spirit,and that some plant and some water,but it's God who gives the increase,meaning that We all can hear the general call,and not come,but once the effectual call comes from God,(Jn 6:44)then the elect will come to Christ , be saved and kept until our GLORIFICATION!
@cornwallsteve I've had Aminian's ask me can I honestly tell people that God loves them and wants to save them?I said no.AND NEITHER DID THE DISCIPLES TELL THE LOST THIS,THEY PREACHED THAT JESUS DIED FOR SINNERS AND TO REPENT AND BELIEVE THE GOSPEL,THIS IS WHAT I DO,telling everyone that Jesus loves them and wants to save them is a man made gospel.How can we tell everyone that Jesus loves them and wants to save them all if some have no hope of salvation or Heaven?
@CBALLEN "Then Jesus beholding him LOVED HIM, and said unto him, One thing you lack: go your way, sell whatever you have, and give to the poor, and you shall have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me. And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions." Mark 10:21
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Jesus loved this man, not hated him, but he failed to respond to the message and call of salvation.
@cornwallsteve God does not need to prove anything.Because God ordains changes nothing I act by faith not knowing what He has ordained.I'm in suspense He is not! It changes nothing of the proposition of faith except I try to accept God's will, while freewill proposition thinks by faith they can change it by faith and morals
@polopowers1 Noone says God needs to prove anything, but prove it he will - his righteous judgment will be seen by all to be 100% just, true, love, right.
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As for man reaching out to God, God ordained that he be not far from each of us in the hope (did you catch that - this is God's word!!!) IN THE HOPE that men might grope for him and find him. GOD HOPES!!!!
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Your problem is that you are redefinind repentance as a work, a righteous act. It's the opposite. ITs the END of man's works....
@polopowers1 repentance is PROOF POSITIVE that a man recognises his utter helplessness, and inability to save himself. THis is why repentance is the only thing a man can do that please God! The thing he requires of us - repentance of self works, self effort, self righteousness, and looking to God to provide the salvation, righteousness, and works.
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In turning this over, you stand against the only hope that man has, that he may repent, indeed is commnaded to repent and believe in GOD not self.
@cornwallsteve If I was to believe in repentance and works for God to work His salvation in me Steve. I would be relegating the effects of Christ to please God to what I can do. Christ died to please God's Nature, His Holy Character He did that between Himself and God.Christ did not please God with my repentance. He pleased God without it.Christ is totally effective to God without me.This is often forgotten. Christ is the satisfaction of God not Christ and my works or repentance to save me.cont
@polopowers1 Very clearly - repentance PROVES there is NO VIRTUE in man - and the act of repentance is mans recognition of that utter helplessness. You are parodying repentance as the opposite, which is greatly to your loss. How can I explain... every man born on the planet walks and talks and sleeps at night, before they are saved. Now all this is a gift from God - nothing of them, life is a gift from God. You would never advocate lying in a coffin because you refuse to contribute to Gods work!
@polopowers1 By repenting you are proving that you rely ONLY on the works of Christ, not your own. It is all of his merit, his persuasion within you, the sole satisfaction of God. So by repenting, you are indicating to God that this is your plea - nothing of myself, all of Christ. The trouble is, you are denying that God has made it possible for all men to repent, the very thing he commands of them. Does Christ enlighten every man that comes into the world, or not? it's not man's self but Christ
@cornwallsteve By grace are you saved though faith and that not of yourselves it is the gift of God not of works unless any man should boast.Repentance is God's gift to us it cannot be manufactured by man from within himself as if man had some virtue to offer
@polopowers1 cont... Hebrews 6:1 says: "not laying again the foundation of repentance FROM DEAD WORKS, and of faith toward God".
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This defines that repentance is the OPPOSITE of dead works - it is by definition refusing dead works, and placing one's faith in God, not oneself. I think you have the truth in reverse!
@cornwallsteve I am righteous, I am holy, these are positions Christ has given me. I don't achieve them. I accept my state in Christ and do good works out of gratitude, not to become more of anything I already am in Christ. Resting in Christ obedience repentance is not than my daily lifestyle this would undermine the effect of the Atonement as being pleasing to God
@polopowers1 - What place do you credit repentance then in the process of conversion and Christian life? If as you claim 1. repentance is a dead work, and cannot effect the conversion process, and 2. The Christian should not repent as this is an act of 'un-faith' IT seems you have not repented. The truth is that conversion is CONTINGENT upon repentance according to Christ and the Apostles. If you have not repented, in and of yourself, you are not born again. You are relying on a myth.
Luke 15: "I say unto you, that likewise joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repents".
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Acts 3:19: "Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out."
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What order are we shown here? 1. repent, 2. be converted, 3. your sins will be forgiven. the forgiveness of God follows your conversion which is contingent upon your repentance. And the agents of God, preach the gospel, instucting people to repent, believe, and be saved.
@polopowers1 I have not suggested that good works contribute to a person's salvation. Only repentance FROM dead works, which is not a work, as by definition it is repentance FROM dead works, and is indeed COMMANDED by God as a prerequisite to relationship with him, as it indicates reliance on God NOT self.
Wonderful teaching! I'm not a Calvinist, I heard about him, but never read anything about him or his teaching, nor St. Augustine.
But, I've come to know what you are teaching, most of it for the most part, a couple of scriptures grabbed my attention, because I did not take note of them.
But this proves what God's word states, But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teaches you of all things, and is truth.
If you regard the historical context. then you must conclude that the comparison of the TWO covenants, and the explanation of Christ sacrifice being better than the sacrifices in the old covenant was written for the benefit of the Jews...Is this book not called the epistle of PAUL to the HEBREWS? (KJV)
None the less, verse 26- receiving the knowledge of the truth, is not synonymous
with salvation. People hear the gospel, and have knowledge of it every day, that does not make them Christians.
FORGET BIBLE VERSES THAT ESTABLISH CONTEXT AND BELIEVE WHAT YOU SAY?!?!?!
Are you Kidding me? lol you really are a theological novice. Sorry if this seems a bit harsh, but you need to read a good book on biblical interpretation. "Knowing Scripture by R.C. Sproul is a good start...
verses 19 to 29 give u the context, they were saved by the covenant with Jesus and fell away its a simple as tht,.. Do you know where calvinism originated? Augustine pulled it outta of a cult, and John calvin who was a murderer gave it the name. and u would trust a doctrine like that? a doctrine of demons, a doctrine that completely spits in the face of God? its disgusting and completely makes God out to be a partial hypocrite, God reprobating people is partial and there is no love in it..
The God of the bible is a just God he does not predestine some to election and then, cut loose the others so they can be eternally damned... God tells us to be loving, yet he would pick some and not others for no reason, thts not loving at all thts just blasphemous and unjust and unmerciful, its cruel.... Do u know how hard it would be for God to make John 3:16 appear the way calvinists want it too? not hard at all. it would be nothing for Him to do tht but its not like tht for a reason...
The guy in the vid can show you where it says " He lays his life down for the sheep" well i wanna see where the word ONLY is.. oh its not there.. wanna know y? cause He even bought the false prophets who introduce destuctive heresies that bring swift destruction upon themselves as 2 Peter 2:1 says, denying the Master who bought them... its amazing how clear God makes it yet we still get beliefs like Limited Atonement.... so sad
1.Funny you should use "master," when the KJV uses the word "lord"... thought you were KJV only?
2, Stop taking one verse out of context.
2 Peter 2: is about false spiritual leaders, who are referred to as dogs and swine at the end of the chapter..metaphors for those who are unsaved. -Matt. 7:6
John 10: Jesus gives his life for the SHEEP- V. 11 + "Ye are NOT MY SHEEP
V.26= pharisees that Jesus did not die for. (Limited Atonement)
I was not going to go there, but since you outed yourself as NOT being KJV only...
Did you know that the word "WHOSOEVER" is not in the Greek text of John 3:16? The 2 Greek words translated "whosoever" literally mean "ALL THE", and should be more properly translated "all the believing"... Funny, that God gave his son so that only the believers would be saved. Kinda puts the Kabash on Jesus dieing for everyone... LOOK IT UP IN THE GREEK.
Finally back to Hebrews 10, when you told me to disregard verse 26, you sought to eliminate the one verse that shows that the people coming under judgment in verse 27 were not saved All the apostles preached to people giving them the knowledge of the truth, that does NOT mean that they were saved. Knowledge does not equal a conversion experience.
and persisting in your error will not change the fact that the people in verse 26 were unsaved.
im not talking about hebrews 10:26-27 right idc whether it u think they just knew about it, or they actually believed, think what u want about those verses.....10:29 goes on to say that people who were actually saved have a more severer punishment for falling away regardless of what verse 26 says, dont get me wrong every verse is important but 26 doesnt change the context at all..
ya i dont use KJV i use NASB. By all means its talking about false prophets, and if any one causes a little one to stumble, it would be better to put a millstone around his neck and throw him into the sea... being a false prophet is not good at all but 2 Peter 2:1 says denying the Master who bought them... hmmm He bought them yet there turning away and denying Him = No limited atonement... o well...
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To ARMINIANS -Romans 11:32 "for God has shut up all to unbelief, that he might have mercy on all".
To CALVINISTS -1 Timothy 4:10"for for this we both labour and are reproached, because we hope on the living God, who is Saviour of ALL MEN ESPECIALLY y of those believing."
DOUBTERS I Cor. 15:23-28"But every man in his own order:..For He must reign until He has put all enemies under His feet..last enemy...destroyed is DEATH... Son also Himself be subject unto Him..that God may be ALL IN ALL"
motibi 6 months ago
"Limited Atonement" hogwash! Guess sin doesn't matter, repentance, or remorse. Maybe its simply limited in that thru Grace we get away with it. So again, it doesn't matter. Guess (and I do that a lot) when the Lord cries because we care so little about sin we can keep doing it too. Guess, it doesn't matter that we knowingly continue to defile our Temples and others well-being because we have been Saved. Continued...
greghar2003 6 months ago
@greghar2003 Actually limited atonement is true. I couldn't accept this FACT like you but I had to accept it. For if Christ really died for everyone then preaching makes no sense since God won't judge them since Christ paid for their sins already. And who said God cries because we care so little about sin? Bible says he's furious at the wicked.
TheFox251 5 months ago
@TheFox251 I disagree for Christ DID die for everyone! However, it is only those who recognize this and reach out to Christ as their one and only Savior who can be saved. Christ WILL judge everyone, including those he Saves! But those Saved will not have to bare the "Lake of Fire". Mankind is in God's image, but it's the individual who must make the choice. Good or Evil? Once one Truly finds the Holy Spirit, sin will become disgusting and there will be remorse for doing so.
greghar2003 5 months ago
@greghar2003 Then Christ made salvation a POSSIBILITY and not a CERTAINTY. Did he also die for the unforgivable sin? Because if he didn't then that's not everyone. And the bible clearly says not everyone receives the Holy Spirit and that sinful man CANNOT come to God. And if you've watched this video I'm sure you got the part where even Jesus said he's not praying for everyone. Jesus even said NO ONE CAN come to me unless my Father draws him to me.
TheFox251 5 months ago
@TheFox251 Yes and No. But you're assumptions are not. For some, Salvation may be certain but for others it's not. Unforgivable sin, meaning what, idolatry? Yes, only if one repents. All men are sinful that is why we need Salvation. But finding the Holy Spirit helps us overcome those sinful ways. Are you above/beyond sin? No one is, but thru the Holy Spirit we do not want to, do less of it and have remorse for doing so. Yes, only thru Jesus may we enter Heaven,.
greghar2003 5 months ago
@greghar2003 Yes and no? That makes no sense. And if salvation is certain for some and not for everyone how can you say he died for everyone? By unforgivable sin I mean the sin the Pharisees committed that Jesus said would never be forgiven. There's a sin he never died for and that shows he didn't die for all sins. And the bible also says no man seeks God. God gives his Holy Spirit, he doesn't leave it out to be found since it's not available to everyone.
TheFox251 5 months ago
@greghar2003 And you are right in that the Holy Spirit does changes someone, but it's ultimately God decision to whom he gives it.
TheFox251 5 months ago
@TheFox251 True it's all about choices ours and Gods. Yes salvation is for everyone who makes that choice. But they have to truly commit themselves to it. Simply because someone says so and even believe they are, doesn't mean they are. The Pharisees already made their choice so why would God offer his Grace to them? I previously meant only those that are 'truly" saved are certain. However, only God "truly" knows who they are. One may think so, but until that time, we won't truly know.
greghar2003 5 months ago
@greghar2003 Then if salvation is for everyone that makes that choice then why does the bible go in favour by saying that it is therefore not up to man's effort or choice but God who has mercy. When God chose Jacob over Isaac neither had any choice in the matter. Heck neither existed to make a choice. And Jesus during his time one earth only chose some people and chose to reveal himself to some while leaving some others out in the cold. He's not obligated to save anyone even if they make choice
TheFox251 5 months ago
@TheFox251 God knows us better than we know ourselves and when God chose Jacob he had a choice but didn't say no. They were smart and good enough to know to chose yes. Same with Noah and whoever. If he came to you, you would have that choice. Why would Jesus reveal himself to everyone It's his choice who to show and what to say? Obviously, not all are worthy.. We should not talk as if we know God well enough to say what he is obligated or should do. He is Good and will do the right thing.
greghar2003 5 months ago
@greghar2003 The bible doesn't mention he had a choice. What it does mention was God superiority in the matter. The fact is no one is worthy, that is why God is not obligated to do anything for any of us. We are sinners only thing God owes us is hell. Fortunately he sent his Son so that some won't go there and they'll be with him forever. Paul didn't have much of a choice in his conversion. God blinded him and shocked him and God didn't ask him if he could. God is the boss and we're not.
TheFox251 5 months ago
@TheFox251 Of course they did. You are being near-sighted and are beginning to refuse common sense into your argument. We ALL have choices and so does God. We are made in God's image, not the devil's or as robots or puppets!!! Simply stated, what this is about is Good vs Evil. Which side do people chose? Hell is not for good but only evil which serves as punishment. People chose to be Good or evil and those who want God's Grace must chose to be good and find the Holy Spirit.
greghar2003 5 months ago
@greghar2003 Pharaoh had no choice when God decided to harden his heart and raise him up to show his glory. I just let God be God. And it isn't about good vs. evil, it' all about God's glory. God gets glory in both the salvation and condemnation of people. And we are made in his image which is now an image tainted by sin and rebellion. God is holy and completely above us. The bible says no one is good. When Adam sinned all died. We didn't have a choice in Adam's sin affecting us.
TheFox251 5 months ago
@TheFox251 Please keep in mind I only say this because I DO CARE!!! I'm sorry but you are brainwashed. I sense you don't fully understand the words and arguments you list. Likewise being this way, you've shown me you are not one with the Holy Spirit yet. This is going nowhere, almost like talking with an atheist and as I said, I do care. As I said before, "Please forgive me Lord because I am inept and wish I could do more. With all my Love and Devotion, if I only had more." God Bless!
greghar2003 5 months ago
@greghar2003 Oh trust me I'm not brainwashed. I simply put the bible over man's tradition. And I am not an atheist I'm a Christian saved and bought by Jesus. I had no part in my salvation, God did it all. If I'm saved it's because he chose me before I even existed and determined that his Son would die for me and others. Tradition makes big on man's free will while the bible doesn't. If you read it as it is you'll find it difficult to conclude that man's will is completely free.
TheFox251 5 months ago
Guess, the only difference between Good and Evil is that Good believes in Christ. Guess by now, I should learn to control my anxiety over the Lord's heart-felt weeping because we refuse to obey his laws due to being Saved and self-righteous. Guess, I'm an idiot and should not be so concerned about others lack of caring for themselves and others. Guess, I'll try not to comment on these matters anymore because others seem to get angry and not understand. Continued...
greghar2003 6 months ago
Please forgive me Lord because I am inept and wish I could do more. I love you Lord with all my heart, more than life itself. With all my Love and Devotion, if I only had more. If only I could not be such a disappointment in your eye, and maybe sometime, brighten your day as much you do mine. God Bless everyone!
greghar2003 6 months ago
Calvinists are not blasphemous heretics. I might not happen to agree with the "limited atonement" petal of the tulip, but I can't see a reason for calling those who do blasphemous and heretics. In answer to 88momart's question, the reason why there is a lot of venom directed at Calvinists is their arrogance. To say that you have a deeper walk with God than someone who disagrees with you is arrogant and holier than thou.
Elizabeth1ification 6 months ago
@Elizabeth1ification I'm sorry if I sounded offensive...I didn't mean to sound like;," since becoming reformed, my walk is "deeper than someone else's"...what I was saying, is that my relationship with God is deeper than it used to be. My appreciation for the sufficiency of Jesus' atonement has greatly increased, and has radically changed my life, since becoming convinced of the "reformed" position. Didn't mean to sound arrogant!!
88momart 5 months ago
It has been my observation, that those who adhere to and teach Reformed Theology, are more zealous and passionate towards God. Their understanding of His Sovereignty, affords them a deeper walk with Him, and an even greater appreciation for their salvation. And the Scriptures plainly teach that this position is absolutely Biblical. Why so much venom directed towards those who are willing to "let God be God"?
88momart 6 months ago in playlist *James White*
@TheKJVberean
I've read John 6:37-44 many times, maybe you should read it once again. I know what verse 40 says. You should read what verse 44 says, " No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. "
And verse 65, " And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father. "
Of course everyone who believes has eternal life, but people pervert the word, "whosoever".
ETHANGELIST 11 months ago
@TheKJVberean
Jesus taught Calvinism blatantly: John 6:37-44
ETHANGELIST 11 months ago
I used to be a whosoever guy, and used to teach the free will gospel, but when I stopped letting people tell me what the Bible teaches, and began to let the Holy Spirit teach me, I begin to see that we had been deceived. John 1 :12-13 clearly says that the new birth is not attained by the "free will of man". Romans 9 says the same thing. Even Israel was elected before the nation was ever born. Anyone who studies their Bible, and or the history of the church, can know the truth and be free.
brotherRonnie 1 year ago
LaneCh is spreading false doctrine in the body of Christ an causing harm and confusion. He thinks he is glorifying God with calvinism and preaching the truth, but he is slandering and misrepresenting the god of the bible. The god of calvinism is NOT the God of the bible. Calvinists try to twist all the clear verses of Scripture, that contridict their false doctrine, around and give them different meanings. Lane will have to answer to God one day. Please pray for him.
cherubimX 1 year ago
Do Arminians just come to these reformed videos and never listen to them?It doesn't seem they do because they constantly ask the same questions over and over that the video answers completely and with scripture.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
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Calvinism proves that Christians are not loving people.
Not only do you believe that the majority of humanity will not be saved but that God has purposed for the majority of humanity to not be saved.
What does one make of a God and a Church which believes that it is good that majority of humanity is damned?
Are we to say that this people and this God loves us? Or that he hates us.
Now I understand Fred Phelps.
SamWiseGingy 1 year ago
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kawayan65 1 year ago
@17:00 - Actually, God does seem to say, "whoever wants to, come and take my stuff!" Revelation 22:17, "The Spirit and the bride say, "Come." And let the one who hears say, "Come." And let the one who is thirsty come; let the one who wishes take the water of life without cost."
Limited Atonement? Why then did John the Baptist declare, "Behold, the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world"?
retirebefore25guy 1 year ago
@retirebefore25guy "the world" means "Mankind", not any individual! You have to make a difference, because there are 2 kinds of children in this world. God's Children, and Satan's Children. Jesus says that. And He came to Regenerate God's Children.
klaudelus 1 year ago
Doesnt the bible speak of the false prophets [non-elect] who "deny the Lord that BOUGHT them" If He BOUGHT them, then He died for them.
shanecruey 1 year ago
@shanecruey the elect, who were bought by his blood, may deny Christ before they receive the Holy spirit and regenerated. Didn't even the apostle Peter deny knowing Jesus three times before the rooster crowed. Denying Christ does not necessarily mean that someone is lost.
DougCameraMan 11 months ago
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Wow you all need to get a life!
frankvallisinatra 1 year ago
doctrine of inability is plainly taught in Acts 8:22-23 "Repent of this wickedness and pray to the Lord. Perhaps he will forgive you for having such a thought in your heart. For I see that you are full of bitterness and captive to sin.” We are 'captives' and in 'bondage' to sin and yet Peter makes it clear that Simon had to repent. And Peter qualifies that 'if possible' God will forgive him, not saying ur definitely forgiven
e7c7o7 1 year ago
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Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God personally preplanned (hatched the idea of) the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
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YES OR NO?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
Your argument about the boss / employee relationship proves the OPPOSITE of your contention. Yes the boss is all-powerful in his place of work, yes, if you refuse to obey him you will be fired. So with God. God is all powerful - tells us all what to do, how to live & commands all men everywhere (Acts 2) to repent and believe in Jesus. If we ignore this command, we will 'get fired'. God is still in charge (as the boss is still in charge) but we fail to benefit any longer from association with him
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
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@cornwallsteve If God knew who would be saved and who would be lost before time,then that means that God knew there would be a finite number of people born who wouldn't choose Him and who would go to Hell before He ever created them,right?So then God created people with no hope of Heaven,when He could have just not let them be born.,but He did allow their births for His purpose.God's will WILL always be done and God's will is to save some and let the others stay in their sin,to show His wrath.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve Even if you hold to the Arminian view that God saw who would choose Him and He chose them based on that,it still doesn't change the fact that God made people for Hell with no hope of ever being saved.God will show ALL His attributes to His creation,Love,Mercy,Grace and Wrath.His ways are not our ways,but it seems that when He does things different than men,men reject Him and create a god in their own image,man hates the TRUE GOSPEL.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN God is not responsible for the sin and loss of those people, they are. Calvinists do a neat 'double book-keeping entry' to shift the blame from God onto the lost ones, whilst maintaining his sovereignty, as ordainer of all outcomes - You can't have it both ways. Calvinism effectively accuses God of sin, if he is the author / designer of all eventuality. Biblical Christianity lays the blame for sin at the foot of the perpetrator, so God, being sinless, is not responsible for their loss.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve But if it was God's will that everyone go to Heaven,then why just not let those who will be born with no hope of salvation,not be born?Because if they were never born then they would never go to Hell.Again,since God made people who He knew, had no hope of Heaven,why would Jesus die for them?That would be illogical of God saying there was hope for them and that Jesus died for them when,when there's not and He really didn't.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN God is not a control freak.
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God is not a puppet master with his hand inside a glove puppet called Satan.
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Just read this call of God to his people, and let it inform your understanding of his generous, loving heart towards men even in their rebellion..
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"As I live, says the Lord GOD, I have NO PLEASURE in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn, turn from your evil ways; for why will you die, O house of Israel?" Ez 33:11
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NO pleasure.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve And we were once counted with the wicked,true, and just because He has no pleasure in the death of the wicked is irrelevant,but the difference between the unregenerate sheep and the goats is,once the sheep Hear the Effectual call of God,we come,they won't ever come.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN according to this theory, that God has created a universe then ordained every tiny detail that ever happens, even to controlling the will of men, why did he bother with this whole 1st creation. If what you suggest is true, he could have gone straight to the eternal state, no need for men to be tested, as God, you claim, creates the outcome anyway. This is plain nonsense. Read the Bible story, and you see time and time again, God appealing to men to repent, asking them to choose him.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@CBALLEN It matters hugely that God states he has no pleasure in the death of the wicked. Calvinism claims that it gives God maximum glory to create these men in order to damn them - this claim that God's highest glory doesn't give him pleasure? Are we expected to believe this contradiction? No. God and the angels rejoice when a sinner repents! why, if he made them do it - this is a no-brainer. You claim God's emotions are that fickle - like a child play-acting with toys?!
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve Still,God created men who will go to Hell without any hope of Heaven.even before their birth.So you, like me, can only witness to people,not that God loves them all and wants them all to be saved,we can only witness to the world to repent and believe in the gospel,call upon the name of the Lord and be saved,because all that do this will be saved.As far as Angels rejoicing,this too is true,because Angels are just like humans as far as not knowing who God's elect are.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN I have a question for you. If a 'saved Christian' loses their way for a few days, and commits a major sin (such as adultery), do you believe that God has ordained that this event take place? If so, did he organise and plan for this saint to enact this? Did God cause this to take place? Presumably you think so, as you believe God in his sovereignty ordained every event and eventuality? So you must reckon that God is responsible, or co-responsible for sin?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve I believe that God had to have ordained it,or it would not have happened,but I also believe Romans 8:28.Just like when some preachers say that God caused these earth quakes, hurricanes,tornadoes,ect, and all the newscasters and even people who call themselves Christians say that it wasn't God,and put those who said it down,when God absolutely He did.Amos 3:6 Is a trumpet blown in a city, and the people are not afraid? Does disaster come to a city, unless the LORD has done it?
CBALLEN 1 year ago
Steve do you not realize that The RCC was SYNERGISTIC AND THAT WAS THE REASON FOR THE REFORMATION?Martin Luther risked his life to separate from their doctrine,that's what it mostly was about,The Pope claiming rule over all Christians and Catholicism teaching that man had to cooperate with God before God could save a person.That's why Arminianism is just Catholicism without the frills.In America reformed belief was all there was at one time,then Jesuits infiltrated the protestant churches.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve Jacob Arminius was trained by Jesuits to teach Molinism and cause problems for the reformers,it was Romes attempt to bring all protestant churches back under Romes umbrella and control.ALL Protestant Christian cults,Jws, Mormons,oneness Pentecostals ect are a product of Arminianism,with the exception of Universalism.Read up on the Jesuits and you will be shocked about where your beliefs came from,they are wicked men.This is where the saying all roads lead to Roman came from.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN Thanks for the history lesson (genuinely!) but I dont take my lead from ANY of them, I just ask God to teach me from the BIble. I wonder, if you think God caused the Christian to sin (as Driscoll claims several in his congregation are living in adultery etc) then why castigate them / encourage them to do anything about it, if only God does it? In fact, why offer any moral guidance to anybody if they are nothing to do with the outcomes of their lives. Why get out of bed in the morning?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve Repentance is a dead work under law.Believing Jews were told to repent of going back to law.Repentance from dead works in context of Hebrews is don't return to works of law but serve in the Spirit of liberty.Christ is not pleased with constant repentance and moral works for believers.Christ is not a minister of sin Gal 2 16,17 Constant repentance going back not forward is the law of works
polopowers1 1 year ago
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
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@polopowers1 2nd contradiction you offer (quote): "Christ is not pleased with constant repentance and moral works for believers.Christ is not a minister of sin". You undermine the truth of the gospel here. I agree Christ is not a minister of sin, and for this reason he wants his children to NOT SIN, which by definition, according to Christ and the Apostles, is precisely to remain in a place of 1. Repentance of sin/self, and 2. Righteous living - holiness - avoiding sin - doing the works of God
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@polopowers1 2nd contradiction you offer (quote): "Christ is not pleased with constant repentance and moral works for believers.Christ is not a minister of sin". I agree Christ is not a minister of sin, for this reason he wants his children to NOT SIN. This by definition (according to Christ and the Apostles) is to remain in a place of 1. repentance, and 2. righteous living, holiness, NOT SINNING, doing the works of God. You appear to be undermining the very gospel of repentance and holy faith!
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve Brother,as I've said before ,man does exactly what His heart most desires ,but God ordains what He does,how all this works out,I couldn't tell you.Just like the men who killed Jesus,they did exactly what they wanted to do to Jesus,but God ordained the very men who did it,to be the ones to do it.Judas ,same thing.The Bible says that man plans what he will do,but it's God who directs his steps.God's ways are not our ways and I couldn't begin to tell you how He does it.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN You are trying to have it both ways.
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You claim that man does exactly what his heart most desires, making MAN 100% responsible for his actions.
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Then on the other hand you make God see 100% responsible for everything that ever happens.
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Can you not see this is impossibile - a conceptual deadlock forced by your insistence on Calvinistic dble predestination. God is NOT responsible for sin. It is contrary to his character. God IS SINLESS. God tempts no-one to sin.James 1:13
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@CBALLEN Once again - you cant use the death of Christ to prop up this argument because God was in Christ self sacrificing. This is very different from the mass of sin in mankind. Christ laid down his own life - he said, "no man takes my life from me, but I lay it down and take it up again."
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"And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the [ra], that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not" (Jonah 3:10)
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God waits for man to repent.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve Look,I''ve tried to show you what the Bible says,but you don't believe it.I wish you well.God Bless
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN Before signing off, please answer this one question - From what you have written, do you believe that when a man brutally rapes and murders an infant, God planned this event, and organised the lives of the perpetrator and the victim to this end, in order to glorify himself?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve Your answer can be found in scripture,man makes his plans,but God directs his steps,just as He did in the death of His Son and Josephs kidnapping,being sold into slavery,being imprisoned and finally being made a powerful ruler.As Joseph said to his brothers,you intended it for evil,but GOD intended it for good to save many alive.He didn't say the evil you intended God USED FOR GOOD,He said it was God's intention that all happen just as it did.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve Why won't you answer any of my question?Why did God allow people to be born with no hope of Heaven if His intention was to save everyone?
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN OK - I'll answer you quick, but I need to know in the particular instance I describe.. (I believe that God made men with every hope of heaven, and provided them all with every opportunity, and will judge each according to their moral choices and response to his calling in their lives. Foreknowledge is not dictatorial design)
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To my question - Did God cause, by predetermination, the man to rape and kill the infant? Did this predetermination occur in order to most glorify himself?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve God gets the glory in the end for ALL THINGS,since ALL HIS HOLY WILL WILL BE ACCOMPLISHED.Again,why do you think He let men be born just to Go to Hell?Why did He allow them to be born knowing they had no hope?
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN Of all our conversation, I need you to please try to answer this question, as I have realised it is the nub of the debate between us. You think that God caused the wicked man to rape and murder the infant, and that this maximises his eternal glory. Am I correct?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve I've answered it many times already are you not reading what I wrote?Man does the evil He wants to do in his own heart,but God directs that evil and even stops it at times,God controls the steering and the brakes of men.Joseph's brother originally wanted to kill Joseph,but God stopped them,so unless God has a purpose for something happening,it does NOT HAPPEN.Why He does things like He does is His secret and I do not know,but I know what the Bible says about it.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve Would you be so kind as to answer me now?
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN (I'm not into the easy 'invite Jesus into your heart' type message at all. I Agree Jesus did not teach that. But what he did do, when anyone asked him what they had to do to be saved, is he told them what to do. He did not say ever, 'you can't do anything about it, you'll have to wait for God to save you if you're lucky!'
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So you do believe God makes men lie, steal, blaspheme, rape, murder, and harm infants. This is unbelievable. You actually think that God, who is love, does this?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve You're getting very monotonous to talk to here,WHY DID GOD ALLOW PEOPLE TO BE BORN THAT HE KNEW HAD NO HOPE FOR HEAVEN IF HIS INTENT WAS TO SAVE EVERYONE?
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN Sorry, I thought I ansad that -
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"God allowed all people to be born with opportunity to seek him and find him.
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"God has made from one blood EVERY nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings, so that they should seek the Lord, IN THE HOPE that they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us" Acts 17
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God hopes for all men to seek him.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve That still doesn't answer the question since those born without hope of Heaven didn't have an opportunity.No matter what happened,while they were alive on Earth they didn't have any hope.God let them be born to go to Hell.So how can you say that Jesus died for all when He couldn't help them and why do you say God wants all saved,when He knew they wouldn't be,that just makes no sense at all.please explain.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN [you just suggested I was not being Christian for avoiding answering a question.... pls see my qu. below.] In answer to yours (I do keep trying) ... The verse I shared clearly states that God made all men everywhere to reach out and seek him - he is not far from any of us, and God created all nations IN THE HOPE that they would seek him, You are standing against the simple beauty of this revealed truth by going to the extreme opposite end of the spectrum and refusing to see the balance.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve No ,you're still not answering it,God knew the very people who would go to Hell by name,but He still allowed them to be born,so how could you say that Jesus died for these people to forgive their sin when He obviously didn't die for them.Jesus only died for believers,that's it.So if you say Jesus died in hopes of saving everyone,then that's ridiculous.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN - But mate, IT'S NOT ME SAYING IT, it's the Bible. read the words, these are not my words... (I know God knows the future, but time is seriously real, outcomes not fixed.)
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"God has made from one blood EVERY nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings, so that they should seek the Lord, IN THE HOPE THAT THEY MIGHT grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from EACH ONE OF US" Acts 17.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@CBALLEN - God hopes people will turn to him - we are told this, so it must be true. He waits patiently, appealing to us. The lost only will have themselves to blame, carrying great regret that they could have chosen for God but didn't, and there's no way they would be able to say God fixed the outcome deliberately. They rejected his light, his calling, his sacrifice, his grace.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@CBALLEN - "The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance." 2 Peter 3:9
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"that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life."For God so LOVED THE WORLD that he gave his one and only Son, that WHOEVER believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him." John 3:15-17
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve 2 Peter is talking about the elect not everyone,you still won't take scripture seriously and continue to throw it out there without being honest.I''m not debating with you to try and make myself look good in any way,as Christians we should search for the truth,not just try and make our doctrine look good.Fact is,Arminianism is flawed Satanic Catholic doctrine put out by Catholics to try and bring back Protestants to the Catholic Church and under the Pope,you're almost there.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
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cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@CBALLEN In a nutshell, It's what happens in this lifetime that determines a person's eternal state, not what happened before they were born in pre-eternity. The things that were ordained in pre-eternity, were provision of salvation, and foreknowledge. What we do in this lifetime with what Jesus provided, is the determinant. That God foreknew this, did not make HIM the determinant of our being saved of lost. In his sovereignty he gave choice. This is why he rewards and punishes us after death.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve That fact remains that God knew every person before time who would not be saved,yet He let let them be born to go to Hell,so no,time is fixed as far as God is concerned,unless you want to claim God is not all knowing as most Arminians have to do to hold on to their doctrine that there's hope for everyone.That's the only way you can remain consistent by claiming God is ignorant,for this very reason.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve For the very reason that Jesus is not trying to save ALL men without exception,is the reason ALL does not mean ALL men without exception,but means Jews and Gentiles,Kings and rulers,slave and free ect. depending on the context.This is one reason among many,that Arminianism is as false a doctrine as JW,s, Mormonism,Oneness Pentecostalism.Can God save these people though?Yes He can even save Muslims,not because of their false religions but in spite of them.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN Thanks again for your thoughts. This is your problem. Because God foreknew what men and angels would choose & do, you claim that God is responsible for these events as he didn't have to go ahead with the plan. But if this were the case, he wouldn't foreknow the events, as the events would not be going to happen. (Im not saying he doesnt know the future, just that, if he decided not to go ahead, there wd be nothing to foreknow. This is a philosophical trap. But free choice explains it.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
You still didn't answer the question.How come God allowed people to be born with no chance of salvation?Why not just let all the elect be born then no one would go to Hell?Does this mean God is evil?He could have stopped it.Just like the question you asked me,I think if God didn't want something to happen He could stop it,we have many examples of Him stopping man's sin.So if God doesn't stop man's sin,that means He has a plan that includes sin.And just like Jesus'death,He plans man's sin.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN I will answer you in the 2 posts below
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But please, you still need to address my central question. Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are ou suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
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YES OR NO?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve You have never answered anything other than God gives everyone a choice of coming or not,you say" He rewards our good works and punishes our disobedience, that doesn't change the FACT that GOD KNOWS WHO ARE AND WHO AREN'T HIS!!HE KNEW THIS BEFORE TIME.SO,WHY WOULD GOD BELIEVE EVERYONE MIGHT BELIEVE IN CHRIST AND HOLD OFF CHRIST'S RETURN FOR THESE PEOPLE WHO WON'T BE COMING,INSTEAD OF JUST THOSE WHO WILL BE COMING?2 PETER is definitely SPEAKING OF waiting for THE SHEEP,NOT GOATS!
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN This also should cause you to understand that ALL PEOPLE doesn't mean ALL PEOPLE without exception.All just means JEWS and GENTILES.Again,why would Jesus die for everyone without exception,when God knows ,BY NAME who won't be saved?The Bible says that Jesus died for HIS PEOPLE ONLY!Once you understand this you will also understand how God's will WILL be done,that everyone who Jesus died for WILL BE SAVED and NONE WILL BE LOST! Please try to understand the true GOSPEL!
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve The only way that you can get around these truths I have given you,iS to become an open theists and claim that GOD is NOT ALL KNOWING.Many Arminians seen to be willing to COMPROMISE THE TRUTH OF THE GOSPEL and WHO GOD IS,to hold on to a BLASPHEMOUS FALSE GOSPEL that will send those that teach it to HELL as Paul clearly taught. This is very serious,anyone who claims God is weak and ignorant is SATANIC!!
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN You take the biscuit. You think you are so right , but cannot even begin to answer my question. I have posted this question about 6 times now, and you consistently avoid it. I shall post it again for you above. Please let me know your thoughts, as this is the sticking point to seeing your point of view as biblical. I have tried to answer your question using scripture, and my own thoughts. Now please turn to expressing an answer to this honest question in the post above this..... thanks.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
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@CBALLEN Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc.
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Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment?
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Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
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YES OR NO?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@CBALLEN Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
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YES OR NO?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@CBALLEN Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
.
YES OR NO?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@CBALLEN my central question:-
Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
.
YES OR NO?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@CBALLEN Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
.
YES OR NO?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@CBALLEN Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
.
YES OR NO?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@CBALLEN Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are you suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
.
YES OR NO?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve But lets take your point of view man by free will depravity chose to rape children, God did not interfere. Which God is more loving, God of subjective interference, or God who ordained all for man to admit total powerlessness? Not semi powerlessness which says God is not totally powerful all the time.You seem like a reasonable person, Steve so I ask you which came first God's Spirit or His Virtues (holiness,truth,mercy,etc)? God was simultaneously Spirit Virtue Con't
polopowers1 1 year ago
@polopowers1 None of what I have written infers semi-powerlessness on the part of God!! On the contrary, it proves he can cope with all eventuality, and has the summary of all events. He will be glorified by proving that all darkness / sin was worthless and futile, and all that was of himself is true, just, love, right. Which is why the onus is on us to CHOOSE ARIGHT, and he has given us all and each everything we need to seek and find God. Please see the scripture above to summarise my position
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve God's self existing Life is perpetual Life. He cannot suspend His Nature.He said to Moses I Am That I AM. God is Life by Spirit and Virtue( mercy truth love etc.) If man has power autonomous or virtue of good independent of God, your saying billions of people with knowledge and power are free of God. This is impossible because than God is not all powerful always because free will entities have power not in His control.The same with any virtue you claim man has independent of God.
polopowers1 1 year ago
@polopowers1 Quite a convoluted proposition if I may say. But let me try... God in his sovereignty, had a decision to make. Whether or not to create. His virtue / love (always synonymous with his being) decided to create. So I do not question the moral ethic of his choice to do so. I must look to scripture to interpret the outcomes, contingent upon his love / justice (as God IS love). I observe that the sovereign grant of free will within restricted boundaries, sufficient for testing (cont)
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve God did not need to make a decision.But let us keep it simple can God suspend His virtues yes or no? God is not a God of forever neither is He infinite.This may surprise you, but God is perpetual in Nature which means He is always magnified in His virtues.Though He is immutable He is greater in proportion in living His self existing Life, as He lives.This is the Nature of self existence. God is not moral but like law He exceeds law by His perpetual Life .This not convoluted truth
polopowers1 1 year ago
@polopowers1 You are denying God's revelation of himself by these thoughts. They may be philosophically 'balanced' to your mind, but they fail on several levels. You claim God is not moral. God is the very definition of moral! God is righteous, in him is no unrighteousness, and he commands us to emulate him in this as closely as possible. God manifested fully in Christ, and Christ displayed the righteousness of God. God IS the God of eternity (which is the infinite forever).
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve when I say God made a decision, I mean, he acted in volition. He chose to enact creation. And your theories about the universe only being able to contain one will are true in the utimate state, but in 1st creation, God has held himself back - he exercises patience and longsuffering according to scripture, in order that, out of love, people will repent and enter eternal life. This is his highest intention in 1st creation. His ability to allow Satan / Sin to reign temporarily in...
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@polopowers1 ... this world, prove that God is superior to all that is 'not-God' or sin. He will prove that every single whiff of rebellion against him, is of zero worth and effectiveness into eternity. God is sovereign, and can easily cope with 1st creation rebellion against his stated will - by sovereign grant of his highest purpose, to allow free will in his creation. You deny the very raison d'etre of 1st creation.
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All that is not of faith is sin.
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In him is no sin
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He is faithful
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve You cannot explain God until you understand His Nature.God is never in suspense or suspended to another will. God being near everyone of us does not mean man has power to reach out by some good within himself.And even if God were to help by His Spirit and Word man does not have any virtue within Himself to act in faith. All free will suspends God's Nature for a moment which is impossible.God never questions within Himself should I create or not create that is suspense
polopowers1 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve God is not a moral self righteousness.God never wanted law to be compared to His Nature The whole law is frustrated morality. Christ exceeds morals they never compare to fruit of the Spirit.The law is not equal to God being moral.God's Nature exceeds morality hence the death of Christ to satisfy. If God were moral the law would satisfy.Self righteous indignation is often the believers quest trying to satisfy God morally. It is impossible.Gos is perpetual virtue not morality.
polopowers1 1 year ago
@polopowers1 You say, if God were moral, the Law would satisfy. You miss the point. Nobody fulfilled the law, so the law was never satisfied. But Christ fulfilled the law in every respect, thus proving his virtue, EXACTLY BECAUSE he fulfilled the Law. It is a false dichotomy. God is righteous (let's not use the word moral). In him is no sin. If you dont agree with this, you have failed to understand the HOLY nature of God.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@polopowers1 cont. men's reciprocation to God, or opposition to God, was granted in first creation, balanced by 1. the culpability of each individual for their choices, judged by their deeds, whether righteous or wicked, and 2. the reparation of eternal reward / punishment, according to men's choices / actions. (the most important of which is repentance and belief in Christ! and HIS works) ie blessed are you who mourn now, for you shall be comforted. Woe to you who are rich, youve had ur reward.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@polopowers1 cont.. But all good is from God, and God is light, and him is no darkness. Darkness is by defn. absence of light. God can sovereignly override anything at will, but chooses not to. God can use Satan to his ends, but is never the source or cause of sin contrary to his righteousness. God is causative to the potential / existence of darkness by creating - ie separating light from dark. But his love / truth knows the outcome is infinitely better to create, than not to, despite the cost.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve God created the tree of knowledge of good and evil not Satan.God called it good.Why because Gos is not moral equal to the law.He is perpetual virtue better than all law.God can creaate evil because it is not His innate virtue but a proposition of His Knowledge and knoledge is not evil by itself.God called evil knowledge good.Man is powerless having knowledge of evil and must do it.
polopowers1 1 year ago
@polopowers1 Indeed God did create the Tree of knowledge of Good and Evil. This was necessary in order to test the inclinations of each individual man, to facilitate the opportunity to be with God, or without God - ie if they would obey God (by turning from evil and obeying God, by turning to God's provision of salvation in repentance and faith) or disobey God (by living for self, flesh, world, sinful pleasures. Christ is the light that enlightens every man that comes into the world (John 1:9)..
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@polopowers1 cont.. By definition, if God was going to create, he would have to create 'not-God' in juxtaposition to himself. This inherently meant that the potential for 'evil' 'sin' would be brought into being, as only God is perfect / immutable / sinless. So what you appear to be doing is 1. undermining the raison d'etre of 1st creation, to create moral beings with decision making powers (under the sovereign grant of God) who's main function in life is to 'choose this day who you will serve'
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@polopowers1 cont.. and 2. You appear to be undermining the very definition of Sin, which is 'not-God'. We are told that anything that is not of faith is sin. God by definition cannot be faithless, so God cannot be the author of sin. If one creates freedom, one creates by definition freedom to err, but if the error is 1. commanded not to be done 2. provision for escape provided at the time 3. provision of grace after the event & restitution, then God is TOTALLY non-culpable for sin. He hates sin
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve conclusion: I agree that man can only sin aside from God, but there is one thing that God in his sovereign love has enabled man to do - any man - and that is to REPENT of sin and turn to God, who grants escape from sin, to whosoever calls on him. God has put eternity in the hearts of men, shown them his eternal power & Godhead (Romans 1) and enlightened them all (John 1:9). He then COMMANDS ALL MEN EVERYWHERE to repent. He is not double minded - he states his unequivocal will.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve It is not antithetical to his sovereignty that men choose not to cooperate with God, as God has sovereignly ordained the facility that they may do this. This was in order that He and his saints are not saddled with Satan / Sin for eternity, as Satan / Sin are anathema to God. He would not want to share eternity with any being who prefers darkness to light, and there will only be light in the New Earth, no darkness. God in righteousness will not coexist with unrighteousness.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@polopowers1 (Acts 17- Paul to unbelievers) God, who made the world and everything in it.. gives to all life.. He has made from one blood every nation of men .. so that they should seek the Lord, IN THE HOPE that they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from EACH ONE OF US; for IN HIM WE LIVE and move and have our being, as also some of your own poets have said, ‘For we are also His offspring.’"
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God is close to all men, available to be sought and found despite their sin.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve "The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance." 2 Peter 3:9
Surly you understand that since God knows who won't be saved,that Jesus' return in not predicated on God being patient toward people He knows will never come to Him.To believe differently would insinuate that God is fooling Himself.The "YOU" are people HE knows will come,they just haven't been born yet.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN this is astounding friend. I have answered your question over and over, but you are refusing to hear mine. But you tell me I'm not very Christian??. I wonder why this is? Let me try again. I agree with you God knows before time who will accept him and who would not. I believe very strongly that the Bible clearly repeats many times that God is waiting for all people to turn to him, gives them every opportunity. If they dont it is not HIS fault but theirs. Hence their punishment / reward.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve Why would God wait for people to come to Him unless God is ignorant?He already knows who will and who won't come,so WHAT WOULD BE GOD'S REASON FOR WAITING FOR GOATS TO COME?You're still not answering, is God evil for letting people be born who He knows will just GO TO HELL?Yes or No and why?
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN God is just. HE rewards those who obey him, and punishes those who flagrantly rebel. If God was the CAUSE of their sin and rejection of him, then he would be guilty himself! and the punishment would not be justly given to the sinner. But God IS just, and if you read the parable of the talents, you see that what men do with what God gives them, results in their punishment / reward. To suggest that God stacked the deck so men had no real choice is misrepresenting God's love / justice.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@CBALLEN But just because God knew what some sentient free moral agents would choose, which he knew would result in some going to a lost eternity, if he didnt go ahead, then the loss would be greater, as nobody would be in eternity with him. He chose in his infinite wisdom that the benefit outweighed the cost, and the explanation, is, that to maintain his perfect character of love and justice, he gave men liberty to choose or reject him. Those who rejected can only sin. Those who repent he saves
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@CBALLEN I'm no where near Catholicism. Thanks for the warning though!.
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You still need to address my central question. Are you suggesting that God is/was the 'author' who caused, contrived and predetermined all the sinful actions of rape, murder, sexual assault, blasphemy, Israel's sacrifice of their children in the fire to Molech etc. Are ou suggesting this was by God's design and enactment? Are you suggesting that God preplanned the brutal rape and murder of small children by tyrants?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve Why won't you answer the question,that's not very Christian of you.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve It is God who causes us the be born again by changing our nature from a God hater to a God lover first,only then will we want our Lord Jesus.We didn't choose Him,He chose us.
1 Peter 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the
resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead.
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN So do you believe God makes men lie, steal, blaspheme, rape, murder, and harm infants. Do you actually think that God, who is love, does this?.. perpetrates gross and malevolent abominable sin?
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve Pro.16:4 The LORD has made everything for its own purpose, Even the wicked for the day of evil.What is not a thing that exists?
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve Why didn't Jesus tell the Pharisees that He loved them all and that He wanted them all to be saved and to just ASK HIM INTO THEIR HEARTS instead of just telling them they didn't hear Him because they were not His sheep and could not escape Hell?Does this sound like the Jesus preached by most preachers who say that God loves everyone and is trying to save them but they just won't let Him?
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve Even the elect don't always come to Christ the first time they hear the gospel,that's why the Bible tells us that we can grieve the Holy Spirit,and that some plant and some water,but it's God who gives the increase,meaning that We all can hear the general call,and not come,but once the effectual call comes from God,(Jn 6:44)then the elect will come to Christ , be saved and kept until our GLORIFICATION!
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve I've had Aminian's ask me can I honestly tell people that God loves them and wants to save them?I said no.AND NEITHER DID THE DISCIPLES TELL THE LOST THIS,THEY PREACHED THAT JESUS DIED FOR SINNERS AND TO REPENT AND BELIEVE THE GOSPEL,THIS IS WHAT I DO,telling everyone that Jesus loves them and wants to save them is a man made gospel.How can we tell everyone that Jesus loves them and wants to save them all if some have no hope of salvation or Heaven?
CBALLEN 1 year ago
@CBALLEN "Then Jesus beholding him LOVED HIM, and said unto him, One thing you lack: go your way, sell whatever you have, and give to the poor, and you shall have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me. And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions." Mark 10:21
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Jesus loved this man, not hated him, but he failed to respond to the message and call of salvation.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve God does not need to prove anything.Because God ordains changes nothing I act by faith not knowing what He has ordained.I'm in suspense He is not! It changes nothing of the proposition of faith except I try to accept God's will, while freewill proposition thinks by faith they can change it by faith and morals
polopowers1 1 year ago
@polopowers1 Noone says God needs to prove anything, but prove it he will - his righteous judgment will be seen by all to be 100% just, true, love, right.
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As for man reaching out to God, God ordained that he be not far from each of us in the hope (did you catch that - this is God's word!!!) IN THE HOPE that men might grope for him and find him. GOD HOPES!!!!
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Your problem is that you are redefinind repentance as a work, a righteous act. It's the opposite. ITs the END of man's works....
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@polopowers1 repentance is PROOF POSITIVE that a man recognises his utter helplessness, and inability to save himself. THis is why repentance is the only thing a man can do that please God! The thing he requires of us - repentance of self works, self effort, self righteousness, and looking to God to provide the salvation, righteousness, and works.
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In turning this over, you stand against the only hope that man has, that he may repent, indeed is commnaded to repent and believe in GOD not self.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve If I was to believe in repentance and works for God to work His salvation in me Steve. I would be relegating the effects of Christ to please God to what I can do. Christ died to please God's Nature, His Holy Character He did that between Himself and God.Christ did not please God with my repentance. He pleased God without it.Christ is totally effective to God without me.This is often forgotten. Christ is the satisfaction of God not Christ and my works or repentance to save me.cont
polopowers1 1 year ago
@polopowers1 Very clearly - repentance PROVES there is NO VIRTUE in man - and the act of repentance is mans recognition of that utter helplessness. You are parodying repentance as the opposite, which is greatly to your loss. How can I explain... every man born on the planet walks and talks and sleeps at night, before they are saved. Now all this is a gift from God - nothing of them, life is a gift from God. You would never advocate lying in a coffin because you refuse to contribute to Gods work!
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@polopowers1 By repenting you are proving that you rely ONLY on the works of Christ, not your own. It is all of his merit, his persuasion within you, the sole satisfaction of God. So by repenting, you are indicating to God that this is your plea - nothing of myself, all of Christ. The trouble is, you are denying that God has made it possible for all men to repent, the very thing he commands of them. Does Christ enlighten every man that comes into the world, or not? it's not man's self but Christ
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve By grace are you saved though faith and that not of yourselves it is the gift of God not of works unless any man should boast.Repentance is God's gift to us it cannot be manufactured by man from within himself as if man had some virtue to offer
polopowers1 1 year ago
@polopowers1 cont... Hebrews 6:1 says: "not laying again the foundation of repentance FROM DEAD WORKS, and of faith toward God".
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This defines that repentance is the OPPOSITE of dead works - it is by definition refusing dead works, and placing one's faith in God, not oneself. I think you have the truth in reverse!
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@cornwallsteve I am righteous, I am holy, these are positions Christ has given me. I don't achieve them. I accept my state in Christ and do good works out of gratitude, not to become more of anything I already am in Christ. Resting in Christ obedience repentance is not than my daily lifestyle this would undermine the effect of the Atonement as being pleasing to God
polopowers1 1 year ago
@polopowers1 - What place do you credit repentance then in the process of conversion and Christian life? If as you claim 1. repentance is a dead work, and cannot effect the conversion process, and 2. The Christian should not repent as this is an act of 'un-faith' IT seems you have not repented. The truth is that conversion is CONTINGENT upon repentance according to Christ and the Apostles. If you have not repented, in and of yourself, you are not born again. You are relying on a myth.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@polopowers1
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Luke 15: "I say unto you, that likewise joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repents".
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Acts 3:19: "Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out."
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What order are we shown here? 1. repent, 2. be converted, 3. your sins will be forgiven. the forgiveness of God follows your conversion which is contingent upon your repentance. And the agents of God, preach the gospel, instucting people to repent, believe, and be saved.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@polopowers1 Acts 17:30: "God... now commands ALL MEN EVERYWHERE to repent:"
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
@polopowers1 I have not suggested that good works contribute to a person's salvation. Only repentance FROM dead works, which is not a work, as by definition it is repentance FROM dead works, and is indeed COMMANDED by God as a prerequisite to relationship with him, as it indicates reliance on God NOT self.
cornwallsteve 1 year ago
Can you please reload this video or something, because it just keeps stopping in the middle of the sermon and it is very chopped up. Thank you.
reginaDexant 1 year ago
Wonderful teaching! I'm not a Calvinist, I heard about him, but never read anything about him or his teaching, nor St. Augustine.
But, I've come to know what you are teaching, most of it for the most part, a couple of scriptures grabbed my attention, because I did not take note of them.
But this proves what God's word states, But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teaches you of all things, and is truth.
ez2seeu2 1 year ago
If you regard the historical context. then you must conclude that the comparison of the TWO covenants, and the explanation of Christ sacrifice being better than the sacrifices in the old covenant was written for the benefit of the Jews...Is this book not called the epistle of PAUL to the HEBREWS? (KJV)
None the less, verse 26- receiving the knowledge of the truth, is not synonymous
with salvation. People hear the gospel, and have knowledge of it every day, that does not make them Christians.
x8xMIDNIGHTMAREx8x 1 year ago
forget verse 26 its verse 29 im talking about and its talking about the blood covenant with Jesus Christ not the old testament covenant...
IamNOTlikeUnymore 1 year ago
FORGET BIBLE VERSES THAT ESTABLISH CONTEXT AND BELIEVE WHAT YOU SAY?!?!?!
Are you Kidding me? lol you really are a theological novice. Sorry if this seems a bit harsh, but you need to read a good book on biblical interpretation. "Knowing Scripture by R.C. Sproul is a good start...
x8xMIDNIGHTMAREx8x 1 year ago
verses 19 to 29 give u the context, they were saved by the covenant with Jesus and fell away its a simple as tht,.. Do you know where calvinism originated? Augustine pulled it outta of a cult, and John calvin who was a murderer gave it the name. and u would trust a doctrine like that? a doctrine of demons, a doctrine that completely spits in the face of God? its disgusting and completely makes God out to be a partial hypocrite, God reprobating people is partial and there is no love in it..
IamNOTlikeUnymore 1 year ago
The God of the bible is a just God he does not predestine some to election and then, cut loose the others so they can be eternally damned... God tells us to be loving, yet he would pick some and not others for no reason, thts not loving at all thts just blasphemous and unjust and unmerciful, its cruel.... Do u know how hard it would be for God to make John 3:16 appear the way calvinists want it too? not hard at all. it would be nothing for Him to do tht but its not like tht for a reason...
IamNOTlikeUnymore 1 year ago
The guy in the vid can show you where it says " He lays his life down for the sheep" well i wanna see where the word ONLY is.. oh its not there.. wanna know y? cause He even bought the false prophets who introduce destuctive heresies that bring swift destruction upon themselves as 2 Peter 2:1 says, denying the Master who bought them... its amazing how clear God makes it yet we still get beliefs like Limited Atonement.... so sad
IamNOTlikeUnymore 1 year ago
1.Funny you should use "master," when the KJV uses the word "lord"... thought you were KJV only?
2, Stop taking one verse out of context.
2 Peter 2: is about false spiritual leaders, who are referred to as dogs and swine at the end of the chapter..metaphors for those who are unsaved. -Matt. 7:6
John 10: Jesus gives his life for the SHEEP- V. 11 + "Ye are NOT MY SHEEP
V.26= pharisees that Jesus did not die for. (Limited Atonement)
You have to tread ENTIRE CHAPTERS.
for CONTEXT!
x8xMIDNIGHTMAREx8x 1 year ago
I was not going to go there, but since you outed yourself as NOT being KJV only...
Did you know that the word "WHOSOEVER" is not in the Greek text of John 3:16? The 2 Greek words translated "whosoever" literally mean "ALL THE", and should be more properly translated "all the believing"... Funny, that God gave his son so that only the believers would be saved. Kinda puts the Kabash on Jesus dieing for everyone... LOOK IT UP IN THE GREEK.
whosoever is not there...
x8xMIDNIGHTMAREx8x 1 year ago
Finally back to Hebrews 10, when you told me to disregard verse 26, you sought to eliminate the one verse that shows that the people coming under judgment in verse 27 were not saved All the apostles preached to people giving them the knowledge of the truth, that does NOT mean that they were saved. Knowledge does not equal a conversion experience.
and persisting in your error will not change the fact that the people in verse 26 were unsaved.
x8xMIDNIGHTMAREx8x 1 year ago
im not talking about hebrews 10:26-27 right idc whether it u think they just knew about it, or they actually believed, think what u want about those verses.....10:29 goes on to say that people who were actually saved have a more severer punishment for falling away regardless of what verse 26 says, dont get me wrong every verse is important but 26 doesnt change the context at all..
IamNOTlikeUnymore 1 year ago
ya i dont use KJV i use NASB. By all means its talking about false prophets, and if any one causes a little one to stumble, it would be better to put a millstone around his neck and throw him into the sea... being a false prophet is not good at all but 2 Peter 2:1 says denying the Master who bought them... hmmm He bought them yet there turning away and denying Him = No limited atonement... o well...
IamNOTlikeUnymore 1 year ago