Paul Ryan on the failed stimulus: Washington is moving the goal posts and doubling-down

[loudchristian2112]

@UBSCARED I dont know how to break this news to you, but GDP is calculated by this equation: C+I+G+(E-I). G is government spending. Government spending has risen exponentially, and has exploded enough to raise the whole equation. Investment, or I, has plummeted. Just because the government spends a shit ton and lifts this Keynesian equation, don't act like these absurd policies have worked.

[saltwn]

w/o the stimulus many more would have suffered and suffered truly. Get off this, "I don't want Obama to be President anymore" crap and work with him a bit. Jeeps!

[GOPkicksbutt]

The ONLY way to bring jobs back to America is to lower the minimum wage to $2/hr.

This is the only way we can compete with China. Ryan and my fellow republicans need to act on this now. Employers also should not have to carry the burdern of paying for health care either. Go et em Paul!

[m4mature17plus]

Yes Obama, we do want our change, our $change back.

[Ecosse57]

ryan for president.

[ErikS1975FreeState]

The Stimulus has been around for 18 months & now instead of losing 700,000 jobs a month & have a -7% growth rate were creating 100,000 jobs a month & so far in 2010 we've created a net of jobs instead of losing a net of jobs each month.

[anryth]

@ErikS1975FreeState what data are you looking at?

[ErikS1975FreeState]

@anryth CBO & OMB

[anryth]

@ErikS1975FreeState maybe you need some glasses to read those reports because there is not a net gain in jobs. census workers being fired and rehired over and over does not count as job creation. taking on massive debt in order to gain slight growth is not real growth. also, a lot of people do not understand opportunity cost and how it relates to government crowding out the private sector.

[ErikS1975FreeState]

@anryth So you don't trust the CBO or OMB? The economy had a negative growth rate of -7% & 18 months later were growing at 3% not great but its a hell of a lot better then -7%. You don't completely recover from the "Great Recession" in 18 months.

[anryth]

@ErikS1975FreeState as i said, artificial growth is not real growth. solving the problem by kicking the can down the road only insures that when the can finally kicks back, its going to more painful than it would have been if you had solved the problem correctly in the first place. in other words, our economy is a ponzi scheme, it is unsustainable. berney madoff went to jail for doing what the government is doing right now. Keynesian economics does not work.

[ErikS1975FreeState]

@anryth Simple question do you or don't you trust the CBO & OMB? Were never going to get the Budget Deficit & Debt down until we get some rapid growth in the economy 4-5% or better economic growth, 100,000 or better Private Sector jobs created per month. You can try to cut the Budget all you want but without strong Economic Growth its like grasping for air underwater without an Air Tank its pointless. If you really want to cut the Budget in this Economic Climate I would like to hear where.

[TheLegalImmigrant05]

@ErikS1975FreeState "Simple question do you or don't you trust the CBO & OMB?" Trust their DATA or trust their MODELS? The data may be OK (harder to falsify, though possible), but their MODELS are crap. They calculate the effect not by actually new jobs in the real world, but through their mathematical models, which PRESUPPOSE that stimulus spending creates jobs. They assume a multiplier effect that isn't there in the real world. So no, that shit I don't trust, and neither should you.

[ErikS1975FreeState]

@TheLegalImmigrant05 Now your going down a road that only accountants, economists & mathematical nerds would be interested in traveling 

[TheLegalImmigrant05]

@ErikS1975FreeState Is that supposed to refute my point?

[ErikS1975FreeState]

@TheLegalImmigrant05

I was making fun of it.

[anryth]

@ErikS1975FreeState as i said, there havnt been 100,000 private sector jobs created every month this year. get some glasses. you still dont realize that huge deficits are the cause for the depressed economy. every dollar the government borrows, is one less dollar the private sector can borrow. every dollar the government steals as tax, is one less dollar the private sector can invest. opportunity cost, you see what the government creates but you dont see what they suppress.

[ErikS1975FreeState]

@anryth

In the future before you reply to what someone says actually read what they've said so you & they know what your replying to. Don't put words in other people's mouth. Its called common courtesy.

I said that once the economy starts consistently growing at 4-5% or better per month & is creating 100,000 Private Sector jobs or more per month net & the Unemployment Rate starts falling then we'll know the economy is doing well. Right now its still pretty sluggish but we've come a long way.

[anryth]

@ErikS1975FreeState once again you dont understand. we have not come a long way and the stimulus is only stimulating the debt while suppressing the economy. the economy is not going to consistently grow 4-5% and we are not going to create 100k jobs per month if we keep following this path. Keynesian economics dont work, period. how many times do people have to make a mistake before they realize their error? japan has passed 9 stimulus bills since 1990, and they are still sluggish. L2economics.

[ErikS1975FreeState]

@anryth

We simply disagree here & you can keep arguing your point & I'll keep arguing mind because at least we both believe in it but I don't think we'll get anywhere.

At least you actually read what I wrote before you replied to me this time. I appreciate that.

[mcap52]

@ErikS1975FreeState As long as we are following a clueless community organizer you will not see any sustained growth,and the only jobs will be in the private sector. Sorry,but we have not come a long way,unless you are talking about the amount of debt we now have.

[ErikS1975FreeState]

@mcap52

You should write editorials

[Slipknotyk06]

@ErikS1975FreeState - I've been trying to slowly expose myself to more and more economic theory. There is one basic error in Keynesianism when it relates to unemployment. I believe that a man making 100K per year that loses his job will nearly immediately pick one up for 50 or 75K in order to keep a roof over his head, while still looking for the 100K job. This basic fact is denied in Keynesianism, which argues that in a downturn it is the responsibility of the Government to make the 100k job.

[ErikS1975FreeState]

@Slipknotyk06 I have a lot of respect for Milton Friedman even though I don't agree with him on everything like the Minimum Wage or Living Wage or the idea that Government should stay completely out of Government. I'm not a keynesian on Economics either, I'm with Jack Kennedy & Bill Clinton on Economics, expand trade, keep taxes down, Fiscal Responsibility use Government to empower people who are down to get back up but not try to do it for them Use Government to regulate the Economy not dictate

[Slipknotyk06]

@ErikS1975FreeState - There is a very fine line between regulation and misregulation. I honestly believe that the minimum wage is a job killer, but there is also some benefit derived from it. If you're old enough, you might remember elevator operators. The reason why Hotel elevator operator jobs are such a small field is because minimum wage has made them expensive enough to where a company gets a better benefit from modern elevators. Full Service gas stations are also subject to this.

[ErikS1975FreeState]

@Slipknotyk06

I'm talking about common sense regs like Worker Safety that sorta thing

[Slipknotyk06]

@ErikS1975FreeState - That I can agree with. However, I do believe that this can be overregulated and dictated, too. OSHA has the power to shut down a business during an investigation of workplace safety hazards that could be mitigated by the workers themselves. Grease on floors, and such. Also, you have to pretty much idiot-proof everything. McDonald's actually got sued by their own employee when they spilled coffee on themselves... as an aside, McDonalds has bad luck with coffee whatsoever.

[Slipknotyk06]

@ErikS1975FreeState - We've recovered from a DEPRESSION in 18 months before. Look at the Depression of 1920. Unemployment went overnight to 25% and was at 4% within 18 months, and 1% in 4 years. What caused this? HUGE cuts in Federal spending, HUGE cuts in income taxes (windfall profits tax from WW1) and the period resulting was the Roaring 20s, arguably the decade with the most innovation in Mankind's history, along with the 80s and 90s.

[ErikS1975FreeState]

@Slipknotyk06

You have depression mixed up with recession but nice try though. What were going through are the worst economic times since the late 70's- early 80's if you look at the Unemployment. Not the 1930's.

[Slipknotyk06]

@ErikS1975FreeState - I'm stating we've come back from far worse, far faster.

Plus, the year I mentioned was 1920, not the 1930s. Pay close attention to this. To give yourself a general idea of what happened just wiki the Depression of 1920.

[1Tarz]

@ErikS1975FreeState What???? Oh you watch MS/NBC. I think the dats for this past month was another 450k jobs lost.

[ErikS1975FreeState]

@1Tarz

And you watch FNC are we done accusing people of what they watch

[000MrAnderson]

At least we are not losing 500 million jobs a month like Pelosi warned of.

[RailRoadCar9]

16% unemployment in northern California , Where are the jobs

[3martijns]

Marxist Regime Continues Unending March towards Cliff of Destruction, Pushing All Taxpayers and All USA Residents Ahead of them!!

Hutt 1, Hutt 2, Hutt 3, .........................Crash and Burn!!!