Pt 1 Institute Lesson Creation ex Nihilo/Council of Gods

[GmaM11]

A garden of disinformation. God took Abraham from paganisiam to reveal YHWH.. Council of the gods, not Gods. Strong's Concrdnc (Hb): #430 gods=any person characterized by greatness, power, mighty, angels, exceeding #410 compound proper names i.e.Great & Mighty. Re: Babylonian captivity: Babylon: think Daniel & SH, Ms, AB +those killed for the faith or returned to Jerusalem Moses was raised by his Hebrew mother, the One God, YHWH gave His Word to Moses. Thanks for the lesson in "Twistianity"

[LDS4Life71]

@GmaM11 And Moses was just a prophet, and he testified that another would come, and that was Jesus Christ, and I believe he was taught much more than what made into todays's sciptures, and I believe he knew about Joseph SMith, just like the great teacher of righteousness did, and so did enoch.

[LDS4Life71]

Joseph Smith and the Biblical Council of Gods.

By David Bokovoy

2010 FAIR Conference

[LDS4Life71]

You mentioned a text which date back to 1800BC. Ra-what texts?

[KerryShirts]

Emanuel Tov's book on Textual Criticism of the Hebrew Bible shows the Torah has been changed though.

[KerryShirts]

Where did you ever hear or see me say Nazi?!

[GmaM11]

Nazi philosophy in Torah? What a joke!!! That is because you do not understand the Hebrew Roots and their conceptual thinking. The Westerner does not understand Hebrew idioms, so they take everything literally....like when the "earth opened up and swallowed" which means they went into the desert. There is no word for judgment, Hebrew is "mishpat" meaning deliverance. Hence, the Book of Judges in the Hebrew Bible is the Book of Deliverance.

[GmaM11]

I am telling you, the Torah scrolls found when they excavated Solomon's temple are exactly the same as today's Torah scrolls. Every faithful Israelite wrote their personal Torah scroll. It was their most prized possession. The only changes are in "punctuation marks" and some are spaced differently, but the original 350,000 letters remain the same in meaning. There are slight variations in the way letters are formed between sects, like Ashkanazi and Shepardic.

[GmaM11]

Torah was written by the "finger" of God. It has not changed in 3500 years. The scholars who wrote those tablets are not Hebrew scholars, they are scholars of Kaballah, Gnosticism, mysticism, pagan theories of their gods. Beware of them and anyone these pagan heresies. "Hear, Oh Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is One." Deut. 6:4-6. John 1:1:4 "In the beginning was the Word (Torah), and the Word was God and the Word was with God" See 51 Biblical references to oneness.

[TheBackyardProfessor]

@GmaM11

Never changed? I honestly just cannot believe that. I LOVE the Torah, but it seems unnecessary to try and make it perfect. Nothing ever handled by we humans remains perfect. God allows us our humanity, weaknesses and mistakes.

[LDS4Life71]

@GmaM11 Moses, Abraham, and the earliest of Jews were originally polytheist, and due to the captivity of Babylon under King Nebuchanezzar, and the destruction of the temple of Solomon, they shifted then to henotheistic to monotheistic. The original people who believe in the true God of house of Israel were polytheistic.

[Thebraversword]

This Ugarit he speaks of,isn't that in Syria?

[LDS4Life71]

@BYP

When you spoke of the archaeology done in the holy land, and reassessment of the christian doctrine today by scholars, are you only talking about the dead sea scrolls or are there other writs you also?

[Thebraversword]

@LDS4Life71 This Ugarit tablets he speaks of are from the Canaanite religion,and not from the Israelites. Sorry but this guy is misleading you.

[LDS4Life71]

@Thebraversword Why should people interested in the Old Testament want to know about this city and its inhabitants? Simply because when we listen to their voices we hear echoes of the Old Testament itself. Several of the Psalms were simply adapted from Ugaritic sources; the story of the flood has a near mirror image in Ugaritic literature; and the language of the Bible is greatly illuminated by the language of Ugarit.

Give the set a chance, man

[Thebraversword]

@LDS4Life71 The Canaanites religion was strongly influenced by Mesopotamian and Egyptian religious practices. Like other people of the Ancient Near East Canaanite religious beliefs were polytheistic, with families typically focusing worship on ancestral household gods and goddesses or the elohim (gods) , while acknowledging the existence of other deities such as Baal and el ( el is just a generic word for god,Orthodox rabbis prefer to use HaShem meaning The Name).

[LDS4Life71]

@Thebraversword I'm impressed you have read up and know somethings about the origins of that area. I actually had to go and look up that word Ugarit.

[lyra2008]

Interesting, thanks for sharing.

[trappedhere2]

El - Elohim, aren't these old names made up of parts?

[gamesbok]

El is the Babylonian Moon god. The Plural, in Hebrew, is Elohim, the God(s) of Israel. Yhwh was the God of Judah, probably invented by Hezakia.

North of Israel is meaningless.  Does he mean Damascus? Does he mean Beruit? I think he's actually talking about Iraq, the centre of the El worship, of, and the home of Abraham.

[TheBackyardProfessor]

El was many things....... but I have not heard of him being the Babylonian Moon god........where do I read about that? Thanks!

[Chisox636]

I have not heard the Babylonian moon god angle either. I've always been taught that El was a father god or fertility god, thus the bull representation.

[GmaM11]

@gamesbok Elohim is a plural verb, not a noun, referring to His many functions as creator. Hebrew verbs/concepts. Greek is absstract/nouns.. Check this out.....if God is our spiritual father and He physically impregnated Mary, Jesus would be spawn of an incestuous relationship. The Book of Abraham is a fraud, The books referred to are Kaballistic, Gnostic texts. Torah was written by God Deut, 6:4-6 "Hear, Oh Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is One." 51 quotes testify His oneness

[gamesbok]

@GmaM11 Philo didn't think so. Too much Nazi philosophy in the Torah for me to accept it as God's word.

[mormonanswerman]

Hey Kerry, looking pretty spiffy in this video set, you're a great teacher!

[TheBackyardProfessor]

Heh...... I almost thought it was someone else - GRIN!

[LDSML]

This was a great serie! Thanks again. You should make videoes of ALL institut books. I think we need an internett institute anyway. I have never been able to attend an institute. Would be great to ahve one on line! I could just sit and listen to you all day... You rock!

[TheBackyardProfessor]

Heh......I thought that was what my videos could be seen as is an Institute on the Internet....woo hoo! Or are you flippin sayin I now have to wear a blinkerin suit when I teach?!?!?!?!?!?!?! AAARRRRGGGGHHHhhhh!!!!!!!!! LOL!

[LDSML]

Hmm depends on if YOU guys except US girls to wear a pretty dress on the ocation... AAARRRRGGGGHHHhhhh!!!!!!!!! (how did you make the smiley agin, the one grinning.. I only remember how to make the devil one). I need to start gathering these ... on "backyardinstitutt" ... Seriosly not everybody lives close enough to church instituts. This is really great! Not everyone is even the right age or singel, married ones are too busy.

[TheBackyardProfessor]

LOL! OK, suits for we men, dresses for you gals. Ayiyi...... I can't fake it on the vids, but you can when watching! How am I ever gonna know if you really are wearing a dress while I blab?

[LDSML]

What .. do you mean you dont trust on our word!!!??? Naw really BYP! (6)

[angelmarauder]

Gaining some weight there? I mean, certain people are referring to you as 'big guy', eh? ;-D

[TheBackyardProfessor]

Yeah well......you know, I have decided to diet now. I shall get my weight off soon.

[RESTOREDAPOLOGETICS]

Yea BYP, keep these vids coming, I have a long playlist in your name on my channel. I wish other Apologists, like you & FAIR would do what you & I are doing more.

Part 1 Council of the Gods is often depicted in early to later Christian art as God enthroned surrounded by numerous angels. Some of these angels are seated in heaven, but then are depicted as jumping or falling out of their seats as they fight the other angels & end up falling out of their seats, falling to become the falling angels.

[RESTOREDAPOLOGETICS]

Part 2: Council: 1 Nephi 1:8-11 is a classic ancient Hebrew type council of pre-mortal spirits or angels surrounded around God enthroned. A number of earlier bibles don't start with creation, they start showing council in heaven, angels surrounding God enthroned & angels falling after battle in heaven. Michael thrusting out satan & his angels; their demonification or becoming demons because they rebelled. RESTORED APOLOGETICS BLOG. Scroll down to art works. 2 Nephi 9:8-19; Jacob 3:11; Psa.82.

[RESTOREDAPOLOGETICS]

Part 3, Adam comes down from heaven. Creation of World fresco, Rusuti, Filippo fl. 1308-17 San Francesco, Upper Church, Assisi, Italy Giraudon. Bridgeman Art Lib. Intern. Pre-mortal Christ watches Adam descend through realm travel symbol, mandorla, looks like (). This symbol is around Christ as he descends into hell; or ascends into heaven in other art works. Adam comes down in this art work, just as in BOM, when Christ & 12 others descend or "they came down" from heaven to earth. 1Ne.1:9-11.

[RESTOREDAPOLOGETICS]

Part 4: Bible of Robert de Bello- England S- E- Canterbury 1240-53 AD. Historiated initial with scenes of Genesis. Showing council in heaven, falling angels; & creation scenes below on earth. God lifts Eve out of Adam's side, by hand clasp, to create her.

BIBLE German Nuremberg Anton Koberger 17 February 1483. Father & praying angels around scene, watch Christ create Eve out Adam's side. She enters the realm of earth life by being pulled by hand grip into life. Google image: Creation of Eve.

[RESTOREDAPOLOGETICS]

Part 5: Medieval Miniatures, Dept. of Manuscripts, Royal Lib. of Belgium. Com. by L M J Delaisse, Pub. Harry N. Abrams, NY: p.96-8. Creation & Fall of Angels. Historiated Bible of Guiard Des Moulins, Paris, 1410. Ms. 9001. f. 19. 5th miniature, Lucifer is rising from circle of archangels. He wears a crown & in his overbearing pride, he proclaims his boastful attitudes. Inscribed on a scroll which he holds in his hand is: Ascendam in coelum (I will ascend into heaven). Isa.14:12-19.

[RESTOREDAPOLOGETICS]

6: Ezk.28:13-19; 1Jn.3:7-11; Rev.8:10,12:4-9; Jude6; 2Pet.2:4; R G Hamerton-Kelly, Pre-existence Wisdom & The Son of Man, Cambridge Un. Press 1973; Angelo S Rappoport, Ancient Israel Myths & Legends, 1, see chap. on War in Heaven.

Members of council are beneha-elohim, "sons of God." Very early Hebrews may have perceived their God as surrounded by a pantheon of lesser gods. (Jefferey B. Russell, The Prince of Darkness, Radical Evil & the Power of Good in History, Cornell Un. Press, 1988, 31).

[RESTOREDAPOLOGETICS]

7: "The Son of God is older than all His creatures, so that He was a fellow -councillor with the Father in His work of creation:" Shepherd of Hermas, 160 AD, Ante-Nicene Fathers, 2:3, intro. n. p.12 bk.1, Vision 2, c.4; p.35-6, bk.3, sim. 5, c.5-6, n.9, & 4, & p.47, bk.3, Sim.9, c.12; Jn.1:3, Col.1:15-16; Cité de Dieu La - Augustinus, council, fallen angels, creation hand clasp. Les Très Riches Heures du Duc de Berry, council in heaven. Mâcon - BM - ms. 0002 - f. 002 council & fall of angels.

[RESTOREDAPOLOGETICS]

8: Fall of the Rebellious Angels, from Les Très Riches Heures du Duc de Berry, Brothers Limbourg, Franco-Flemish, AD 1411-16. Some angels fall from council seats & become fallen angels. Seats left vacant are filled by those who, after birth & death, return to glory! Having repented, been washed clean of sins, clothed in white. Nibley, Old Testament & Related Studies,156-7; Temple & Cosmos, 108; DT, THE PRE-EXISTENCE: OUR PRE-EARTH LIFE AS SPIRITS IN A FAMILY IN HEAVEN, SLC, UT: RH&PS, 1993.

[TheBackyardProfessor]

FAIR is actually kickin rear in this area. They are really rollin with steam right now. Man the Wiki is astonishing!

[GRANADA405]

Brilliant I so love your stuff Kerry. Hands across the sea brother hands across the sea.

[TheBackyardProfessor]

Well I am more than happy to share...... I have so blasted much junk, er stuff, to teach it would scare the livin daylights outta ya!

[ReligionThink]

Way to go BYP excellent very enjoyable!

[TheBackyardProfessor]

Thanks man....... I am enjoying your vids as well!

[omiolo2]

"something out of nothing"

leaves reason to the side!

[omiolo2]

a bola tie, really?

Did you ride in on a horse??

=)

[TheBackyardProfessor]

Oh heck yeah man. I had to leave my horse and revolver outside though........hey we are in the WILD West here in Idaho, we take our gunslinging seriously - GRIN!

[Christisms]

I have maybe heard one scholar talking about this concept of the Council of the Gods. What other sources (preferably online) would be good to read on this subject matter?

[TheBackyardProfessor]

FAIR and the Neal A. Maxwell Institute has some materials on this.....

[Ausatmen]

Where in Texas were you? I would love if you taught at my school!

[TheBackyardProfessor]

If you are asking me, I am in Idaho. Dunno where you got Texas from......

[Ausatmen]

Oh my apologies I read the description wrong.

[TheBackyardProfessor]

No problem..... I make mistakes like that all the lovin time.....

[StorminMormin91]

Kerry, have you ever thought of being a religion teacher at BYU, BYUI, or any other Church campus?

[TheBackyardProfessor]

I have, but no, I am really, REALLY happy with my job. I can teach like this as a substitute, as well as produce my own videos anytime I wish to.

[StorminMormin91]

Fair enough, Kerry!

And I know, i should go, I just need to find the time. I have a great Missionary BOM teacher, and some other great religion clasees. But I could definitely benefit from Institute. Perhaps I'll look into it.

[StorminMormin91]

WHAT!

Nice! Please, come teach here, and I will SO go to institute!

[TheBackyardProfessor]

GO to Institute anyway. It's there for your own benefit.....there are some GREAT teachers at Institute, learn from them as well. You only short change yourself if you don't go.

[Bibl3Thumper]

You in Priesthood meeting?

[TheBackyardProfessor]

No, at Institute on Thursday evening.....

[TheArchangelMichael1]

you should apply for youtube partnership,so you can post this AMAZING lesson all in one.can't wait for pt.2

[TheBackyardProfessor]

I have, they say I don't qualify.......

[Bibl3Thumper]

@TheBackyardProfessor

Thanks for the video. Even though I dont agree with your theology, I still very much enjoy watching an informed LDS speak about his own beliefs. It sure keeps me on my toes. God Bless-Brock

[TheBackyardProfessor]

No problem.......... thanks for the friend invite, I accepted.