@steeveazerty Thanks for the compliment and thanks for watching. I apologize for not explaining things very well. I'm not very good at computer stuff. Never worked on semi-hermetics. The biggest systems I've repaired are 5 ton (and smaller) residential equipment.
These were the first dampers with Belimo servo motors I've worked with. They're power open/power close but not hard to figure out. I'm used to dampers that power to close and use a spring return to open. They're a simple design that can be reconfigured for a power open/spring return application. Start collar installation is easy with a pair of dividers and a decent pair of snips. It takes an extra minute to cut a perfect hole. Time well-spent, in my opinion.
Great job, 5tank!! It's nice to see a properly sized (snug fitting) hole cut for the starting collar. I noticed that the damper motors were Belimos. I had Belimo motors on all of the dampers on the air-handlers at Hinsdale Middle School. They were expensive as heck. They were retrofits to replace the pneumatic dampers that were previuosly on the system. Once they went to DDC Building Controls, they switched from pneumatic to Belimos and had frequency drives installed on the blowers.
What happens to the airflow that's not needed in other zones that don't require cooling/heating? Does it dump or do you just cut back. Is there any means of capacity modulation to compensate for loss of airflow during low load periods when only one or two zones call?
@pclle The SPRD bypasses excess air from the supply plenum to the return. In theory, static pressure (and volume) is increased if only one zone calls. That zone should satisfy the thermostat fairly quickly. The hope is that the zone is brought to temp before any limits are reached.
@pclle Reaching temp limits is assured if one of the thermostats is left in the off position. This type of zone system is used to keep temperatures in different zones 'even'. It's a helluva lot cheaper than a VAV system with multi-stage heating/cooling and variable speed blower.
@PutSome5tankOnIt Right on, thanks for the discussion, I've seen many systems like this, particularly Honeywell, but they do sometimes cause nuissance issues. Look forward to your videos.
I don't mind multi zone systems too much. I'm stuck working on POS Alerton systems where the actuators pulse the dampers open and closed. You can make a sandwich in the time it takes for the slow ass computer to set the damper to the right cfm.
@DrZarkloff You're talking about a variable air volume system, right? I have zero experience on those. All motorized dampers I've seen are controlled by low voltage servo motors. They all move at a snail's pace. The control boards also take their sweet time sending signals to the dampers. Homeowners aren't 'shocked' by instant air volume changes at the registers when dampers take a minute or two to transition between the open and closed positions.
....@Nutintoitbut2doit You're entitled to your opinion but you'd be wrong.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 day ago PutSome5tankOnIt 1 day ago
I sometimes tell my boss, "I would agree with you if you were right"....And when I'm telling my wife or kids why we can or can't do a specifc something, I usually innumerate....I start by telling them "Number two, blah blah blah...Number three, blah blah blah....My 13 year old once asked me, "Hey Dad, what's number one?"..."#1 is I'm always right" I told him.
@V8Jagnut It looks worse than it is. The zone system is an economical option when people in different offices want to maintain slightly different temps.
@erd675 Zone system controls aren't especially complicated. The design and installation are the biggest factors. When in doubt... oversize the supply ducting. The zone systems that perform the poorest are the ones that rely on bypassing large amounts of air.
@tstatech There's a way to 'cheat' on zone systems without installing a bypass/SPRD damper. Not all installations lend themselves to easy routing of a bypass duct and access to adjust the SPRD. I've dialed in systems where the motorized supply damper defaults to about 10% open when in the 'closed' position. This works best on systems with 3 or more zones. The system constantly allows a trickle of air flow to zones that are not calling. I don't advocate it, but this method works in rare cases.
@PutSome5tankOnIt I have thought of that. Another method for a 2 zone setup would be to use a regular motorized damper that has a stop. You could tie that damper to the smaller zone. You could use a differential pressure switch to actuate as an alternative. I want to find an alternative because I fear that an ECM and an SPRD might start to dance with one another.
@tstatech For your zone system, you may want to opt for a multispeed blower instead of variable. That should eliminate the added expense of fancy controls and make the system more service-friendly. I try to keep my installs as simple as possible.
@Nutintoitbut2doit I would have preferred a discharge air temperature sensor. This zone system will rely on the primary limit to keep the heating side from tearing up the heat exchanger. A DAT sensor and a low temperature limit on the suction line (wired in series) would likely provide the best protection against extreme temps.
@fritzhvac Not my best work. I'm not always allowed to do everything the way I want to do it. I'll get my way in the future. There's another system in this building that I'll be zoning. I'll pimp it out and then go back on this first system to set it up proper.
The name of the game nowadays is to save money. Eventually, the ducting for this system will be upgraded. I prefer to oversize the supply ducts when using an SPRD (Static Pressure Relief Damper). Minimizing bypass airflow lowers the risk of hitting the temperature limit parameters. These zone systems are supposed to maintain similar temps in all zones. One office at 68* and the other at 70*. If one thermostat is satisfied, the other zone should get extra air to satisfy that thermost quickly.
hello man, i have seen plenty video.Very good job, so thank you.
I wanted to know...do you have repair a semi hermetic compressor ( emmerson copeland or something else ). And if it was possible to see it.
And ideally, if you put some stategic pop up information in your video because i don't understand all the operations
steeveazerty 10 months ago
@steeveazerty Thanks for the compliment and thanks for watching. I apologize for not explaining things very well. I'm not very good at computer stuff. Never worked on semi-hermetics. The biggest systems I've repaired are 5 ton (and smaller) residential equipment.
PutSome5tankOnIt 10 months ago
These were the first dampers with Belimo servo motors I've worked with. They're power open/power close but not hard to figure out. I'm used to dampers that power to close and use a spring return to open. They're a simple design that can be reconfigured for a power open/spring return application. Start collar installation is easy with a pair of dividers and a decent pair of snips. It takes an extra minute to cut a perfect hole. Time well-spent, in my opinion.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 year ago
Great job, 5tank!! It's nice to see a properly sized (snug fitting) hole cut for the starting collar. I noticed that the damper motors were Belimos. I had Belimo motors on all of the dampers on the air-handlers at Hinsdale Middle School. They were expensive as heck. They were retrofits to replace the pneumatic dampers that were previuosly on the system. Once they went to DDC Building Controls, they switched from pneumatic to Belimos and had frequency drives installed on the blowers.
NLBheating 1 year ago
What happens to the airflow that's not needed in other zones that don't require cooling/heating? Does it dump or do you just cut back. Is there any means of capacity modulation to compensate for loss of airflow during low load periods when only one or two zones call?
pclle 1 year ago
@pclle The SPRD bypasses excess air from the supply plenum to the return. In theory, static pressure (and volume) is increased if only one zone calls. That zone should satisfy the thermostat fairly quickly. The hope is that the zone is brought to temp before any limits are reached.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 year ago
@PutSome5tankOnIt So by bypassing air into the return wouldn't that cause either a freeze up or high limit lockout at some point?
pclle 1 year ago
@pclle Reaching temp limits is assured if one of the thermostats is left in the off position. This type of zone system is used to keep temperatures in different zones 'even'. It's a helluva lot cheaper than a VAV system with multi-stage heating/cooling and variable speed blower.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 year ago
@PutSome5tankOnIt Right on, thanks for the discussion, I've seen many systems like this, particularly Honeywell, but they do sometimes cause nuissance issues. Look forward to your videos.
pclle 1 year ago
I don't mind multi zone systems too much. I'm stuck working on POS Alerton systems where the actuators pulse the dampers open and closed. You can make a sandwich in the time it takes for the slow ass computer to set the damper to the right cfm.
DrZarkloff 1 year ago
@DrZarkloff You're talking about a variable air volume system, right? I have zero experience on those. All motorized dampers I've seen are controlled by low voltage servo motors. They all move at a snail's pace. The control boards also take their sweet time sending signals to the dampers. Homeowners aren't 'shocked' by instant air volume changes at the registers when dampers take a minute or two to transition between the open and closed positions.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
....@Nutintoitbut2doit You're entitled to your opinion but you'd be wrong.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 day ago PutSome5tankOnIt 1 day ago
I sometimes tell my boss, "I would agree with you if you were right"....And when I'm telling my wife or kids why we can or can't do a specifc something, I usually innumerate....I start by telling them "Number two, blah blah blah...Number three, blah blah blah....My 13 year old once asked me, "Hey Dad, what's number one?"..."#1 is I'm always right" I told him.
cameron030362 1 year ago
good job. looks a bit overkill for the job it has to do.
V8Jagnut 1 year ago
@V8Jagnut It looks worse than it is. The zone system is an economical option when people in different offices want to maintain slightly different temps.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 year ago
never worked on zone stuff before im still green to it but sure as shit i will this coming monday lol so thanx for another vid
erd675 1 year ago
@erd675 Zone system controls aren't especially complicated. The design and installation are the biggest factors. When in doubt... oversize the supply ducting. The zone systems that perform the poorest are the ones that rely on bypassing large amounts of air.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 year ago
Nice work. I like the fact that you want to do it without bypass air.
Can't wait to see the other system all pimped out.
tstatech 1 year ago
@tstatech There's a way to 'cheat' on zone systems without installing a bypass/SPRD damper. Not all installations lend themselves to easy routing of a bypass duct and access to adjust the SPRD. I've dialed in systems where the motorized supply damper defaults to about 10% open when in the 'closed' position. This works best on systems with 3 or more zones. The system constantly allows a trickle of air flow to zones that are not calling. I don't advocate it, but this method works in rare cases.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 year ago
@PutSome5tankOnIt I have thought of that. Another method for a 2 zone setup would be to use a regular motorized damper that has a stop. You could tie that damper to the smaller zone. You could use a differential pressure switch to actuate as an alternative. I want to find an alternative because I fear that an ECM and an SPRD might start to dance with one another.
tstatech 1 year ago
@tstatech For your zone system, you may want to opt for a multispeed blower instead of variable. That should eliminate the added expense of fancy controls and make the system more service-friendly. I try to keep my installs as simple as possible.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 year ago
Good fix Sir 5tank, did you install a DATS in the system? I like zones.
Great Video Brother
Nutintoitbut2doit 1 year ago
@Nutintoitbut2doit I would have preferred a discharge air temperature sensor. This zone system will rely on the primary limit to keep the heating side from tearing up the heat exchanger. A DAT sensor and a low temperature limit on the suction line (wired in series) would likely provide the best protection against extreme temps.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 year ago
@PutSome5tankOnIt Another great video Sir 5tank. :-)
Nutintoitbut2doit 1 year ago
@Nutintoitbut2doit You're a much better technician than I am. Thank you for the compliment.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 year ago
@PutSome5tankOnIt I dont think so, but thank you.
Nutintoitbut2doit 1 year ago
@Nutintoitbut2doit You're entitled to your opinion but you'd be wrong.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 year ago
@PutSome5tankOnIt I'm wrong alot lol.
Nutintoitbut2doit 1 year ago
@Nutintoitbut2doit I'm always right. I don't have a wife to tell me I'm wrong. If I was married... well... she'd be wrong a lot, too.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 year ago
@PutSome5tankOnIt LOL
Nutintoitbut2doit 1 year ago
The Zone King !!!
That was to cool !!!
Man you make it look easy !!!
You definitely know your sh!t , glad to see you in your element brother !!!
Great Video !!!
fritzhvac 1 year ago
@fritzhvac Not my best work. I'm not always allowed to do everything the way I want to do it. I'll get my way in the future. There's another system in this building that I'll be zoning. I'll pimp it out and then go back on this first system to set it up proper.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 year ago
The name of the game nowadays is to save money. Eventually, the ducting for this system will be upgraded. I prefer to oversize the supply ducts when using an SPRD (Static Pressure Relief Damper). Minimizing bypass airflow lowers the risk of hitting the temperature limit parameters. These zone systems are supposed to maintain similar temps in all zones. One office at 68* and the other at 70*. If one thermostat is satisfied, the other zone should get extra air to satisfy that thermost quickly.
PutSome5tankOnIt 1 year ago
Excellent work on the cheap. Keep it up.
agoodm 1 year ago