Non ahmadi are Non Muslim and Kafir according to Ahmadi Leaders.wmv

[10011011110]

Consider the hadith: "If a man says to his brother, O kafir (disbeliever)!' Then surely one of them is such (i.e., a Kafir). " So how can we attempt to make that mistake? It is a serious thing to call someone a kafir. Even the hypocrites of Islam who acted like Muslims but really were not were first mentioned by Allah to be hypocrites, and then Allah made them distinguished through tests - they were not killed outright. So why then should ANY Muslim call another who says they are Muslim a kafir?

[10011011110]

Consider the hadith where a sahaba kills a disbeliever on the battlefield who said la illaha ilallah, but was then killed. This sahab was still rebuked by the Holy Prophet (saw), because no matter what, as Muslims we have to give the benefit of the doubt to everyone. If someone calls themself a Muslim, then we have to accept their statement. A Muslim is a kafir in the sense that they have denied one of the articles of Islam. But we must nevertheless not call them a kafir because Allah judges.

[10011011110]

When you disbelieve in a prophet of God, then yes, you become a disbeliever. But we Ahmadis are not supposed to call any Muslims disbelievers because this matter lies entirely in Allah's hands. We do not know of the status of anyone and we are not allowed to put this label on ourselves. Allah knows who is a kafir, but we cannot say that no matter what. But it is true that whoever disbelieves in Masih-e-Maud (as) is a kafir. Whoever claims to be a Muslim, will be regarded as a Muslim.

[xiaahmad]

@10011011110 but your leaders called other ppl kafir and non muslim and ur not replying to that

[10011011110]

@xiaahmad The calling of others kafir is only related to those who are the ulema. When any insult is made towards Ahmadis, it is done by the ulema. The ulema are the ones who are responsible for those who they lead. I'll find the hadith that mentions this, I don't remember which Sunan it was in. But, the issuing of kafir goes to those who made the fatwas. The common people who have not issued this are not the kafirs. Those who specifically call another kafir are the ones mentioned in the hadith

[10011011110]

@xiaahmad For example. MrFarooo has called all Ahmadis (by the term qadianis) kafir. This comment he has made is without justification, and cannot be proven. It is a mere insult which goes back to him. If any Ahmadi also called another non-Ahmaid Muslim kafir, then that Ahmadi has made themselves kafir as well. Again, the fatwas were made by maulvis, not by the common people. The enemies of the Promised Messiah (as) were the leaders who denounced him, and then those who agreed knowingly.

[MrFarooo]

qadianis are kafir!!!

[xiaahmad]

Mirza Ghulam writes:

At any rate, when the great God has revealed to me that every body

whom my Call has reached and who has failed to accept my claim, is NOT A MUSLIM, and is liable to account before God

(truth about Split page 147)

[xiaahmad]

A request to Ahmadies please dont tell us what ur 3rd or 4th leader beliefs coz its known fact that ur leaders keep chaning the stance the PROOF THAT I HAVE GIVEN are from YOU JAMMAT"S FOUNDER, and HIS TWO SONS out of which ONE was ur 2nd Leader :)

[Peaceworld111]

response:

watch?v=NXtEcPa8jIQ

[xiaahmad]

@Peaceworld111

I think u havnt seen the video even :) in this video I mentioned that Mirza Tahir have belief that non ahmadies are not non muslim

its your Mirza Ghulam, Mirza Mahmud, Mirza Bashir according to whom Non ahmadies are Non muslim, Kafir and out of fold of Islam

[Peaceworld111]

@xiaahmad Mirza Tahir Ahmad (ra) actually answers all the above quotations (though indirectly). see from 3:40

watch?v=NXtEcPa8jIQ

thankyou

[xiaahmad]

@Peaceworld111

I have seen that video and I took the audio from the video it self :) so u need to see the proofs

Mirza Tahir says non one has right to declare other person non muslim

but Mirza Ghulam did that, Mirza Mahmud did that and Mirza Bashir did that

So make up ur mind whom to follow Mirza Ghulam , Mahmud and Bashir or Mirza Nasir , Tahir or Masroor

[xiaahmad]

@Peaceworld111

Simple question for you do u consider non ahmadies to be muslim or non muslim?

[Peaceworld111]

@xiaahmad Huzoor says "But at the same time, that anybody who believes in Islam who acts on Islam and does everything according to Islam, but does not believe in Jesus (as), what would be his position? If he does not believe in Jesus (as) his time is over and is not concerned with Islam anymore. What is the harm? yet even if he rejects a single prophet of God, in the sight of Allah he is not a true Muslim at all. He may continue to call himself whatever he likes, but if there is an Imam.......

[xiaahmad]

@Peaceworld111

Thats what I am saying that your Jammat consider us non muslim

but Mirza Tahir, Masroor says that no one has right to declare other person kafir

when I ask common ahmadies regarding what they consider us they say muslim.

So simple question from you for you non ahmadies are Muslim or Non Muslim?

[Peaceworld111]

....appointed by God everybody must except him. If he does not, whether the follower of th Imam calls him a Muslim or non-Muslim it is irrelevant. Because Allah will not except anyone's faith if he has sent an Imam himself...."

Now back to ur question, do I consider you a Muslim? Yes!

Now where do you see the contradiction between the Promisd Messiah (as) and Mirza Tahir Ahmad (as)?

[xiaahmad]

@Peaceworld111

Again no one is talking about what ALLAH consider us or not

point is what ur Jammat consider us, your past leaders called non ahmadies, Kafir, Out of Pale of Islam and Non Muslim

where as ur few recent ones call us muslim and says no one has a right to declare other non muslim

So who is right? Currently ahmadies and their leaders

or Past Ahmadies and your leaders?

Simple question What you consider non ahmadies to be ? MUSLIM or NON MUSLIM?

[muzammilmian03]

@xiaahmad I cross checked and based on your quotes... Let me ask you this? If your (sunni / shi'a) Imam Mehdi that you await shows up today as foretold by Muhammed and says He's from ALLAH& A SUBORDIANTE PROPHET OF ALLAH! Who's mission is to revive ISLAM & SAYS THAT YOU MUST ACCEPT HIM AS A SUBORDIANTE PROPHET & all other prophets OF ALLAH like Muhammed Saw, Jesus, Ibrahiem etc.. And says anyone who doesn't follow Prophet Muhammed's Islam is a Kafir, would you still argue with him. Yes or NO?

[xiaahmad]

@muzammilmian03

We already say that we consider Ahmadis to be NON MUSLIM we dont hide the belief.... Its ahmadis who hide the belief like now ur trying to defend it.... and I am sure before this u use to claim that ahmadis does not declare non ahmadis to be kafir and non muslim

[muzammilmian03]

@xiaahmad I wanted a Yes or NO

& you're defense as to why you wouldn't accept the Imam Mehdi sent by Allah, who was foretold by Muhammed saw, comes on time with all the signs & follows the True Teachings of Islam

Anyways, Maybe u don't know but it is you own Islamic ummah, all 72 sects who got together and branded us as kafir (we are 73rd)

/watch?v=yaX5SDflvv4

Thanks to your ummah, this prophecy was fulfilled as it was foretold by prophet muhammed s.a.a.w

[xiaahmad]

@muzammilmian03

Again u ignore the point we know what u later leader belief but u didnt comments upon MIRZA GHULAM and MIRZA MAHMUD statements :)

Yes we consider those who reject ESA(AS) as non muslim and we also consider those who believe in NEW FAKE prophet as non muslim as well.... but WHO GAVE MIRZA GHULAM RIGHT TO DECLARE OTHER PPL KAFIR???

[muzammilmian03]

@xiaahmad OH SORRY MA BAD! =)

Who gave the right 2 Mirza Ghulam Ahmed to declare other kafir?! LOL

I don't think u understood my point, but anyways, if u want a direct answer

MGAQ MERELY REPEATED WHAT HAZART MUHAMMED S.A.W & QURAN SAID ABOUT KAFIRS

BUT U SIR TOOK THE LIBERTY OF BLAMING THAT ON MGAQ WHO U THINK DECLARED U KAFIR

see the dilemma

Besides, think about it, if you're loyal to Allah, Muhammed saw, Holy Quran etc & are a non-violent muslim

Will Allah still judge u as kafir? i think not

[xiaahmad]

@muzammilmian03

Quran does not say that those who does not believe in MIRZA GHULAM is not muslim

but mirza Ghulam and his sons claimed that

So what we believe we openly claim

but ahmadiyya jammat hide their belief so let me ask u do u consider non ahmadis to be Muslim or Non Muslim?

[muzammilmian03]

@xiaahmad

1) Quran says to believe in all of prophet of Allah, Mirza Ghulam Ahmed (as) is a subordinate prophet, but you think otherwise

2) once again, you don't read my comments fully, if u don't care then why should I waste my time on u, once again, Mirza Ghulam ahmed/sons only repeated what the quran said about muslim/kafir but u think otherwise

3) ahmadiyya doesn't hide bro, go to the site and find out yourself LOL

4) from me, if you pray to allah and say kalma shahada, you're a muslim

[thenextplayer]

@muzammilmian03 : complete ref: "This point is worth remembering that the prophets who are blessed with authority to call their non-believers as KAFIRS are only the Prophets who bring from God a Shariah and new Injuctions. But all others besides the Shariah Bearing Prophets , that is , Mulhams and Muhaddith, no matter how high their station is in sight of God. Rejecting their claim does not render anyone a Kafir."

Tiryaq ul Quloob page 131 in RK 15 page 432

[muzammilmian03]

@thenextplayer Thanks for the Quote!

Ahmed (as) is a subordinate Prophet to Muhammed (saw). Ahmed (as) didn't bring a new Sharia (law from Alalh) or never claimed to be a new prophet. In the quote it says Mulhams and Muhaddith. Which is true! But remember, Ahmed (as) is also the Prophet Messiah and Mehdi, Ibn e Marium aka 2nd metaphorical return of Essa (as).

Even though you don't accept him, Doesn't mean you're a kafir since you read Kalima Shahadat, but everyone say we are kafir?! WHAT!.

[xiaahmad]

@muzammilmian03

Read the references I gave coz ur comment is dsproving MIRZA GHULAM ,MAAHMUD and BASHIR

[muzammilmian03]

@xiaahmad My comment is EXACTLY in accordance with what Ahmed (as) and his son said regarding the views of muslims. It is you who fail to understand his view and then you complain about it

You quote RK out of context without reading any of his other work, then you get awfully confused & use those quotes as your arguments against Ahmadis LOL

Such a bad cycle and it's getting annoyingly repetitive

Pray to Allah that he may hasten the return of 'physical Jesus' so u can prove Ahmadiyya wrong

[xiaahmad]

@muzammilmian03

I have read it with context and it does not give any other meaning.

if u dont wana accept the proofs its ur choice but that will not prove anything.

Please and see the truth stop following a guy like Masroor and MGA

follow Prophet Muhammad (SAW) and companions

[muzammilmian03]

@xiaahmad You have read it with context but have you bothered understanding its meaning?! LOL

please sir, if you failed to see the promised messiah Ahmed (as), no problem, keeping waiting for your floating-jesus to appear before you from the skies. Say hi from me when you see him ok!

Promised Messiah Ahmed (as) and Khalifa Masroor (ra) has taught us to follow Prophet Muhammed saw teachings so... I would rather follow my Masroor than your mullahs who only give fatwa against each others

[xiaahmad]

@thenextplayer

So does that mean he was with Shariah as he called other ppl NON MUSLIM ?

[thenextplayer]

@xiaahmad Apparantly yes.. He claimed on a gradual scale.. starting from aalim>mujaddid> Mehdi> Esa> Prophet without Sharia and Wahi> Prophet with Wahi but no sharia> Prophet with Sharia

He claimed few of his own religious duties that His followers need to fullfill eg Chanda.. If an Ahmadi does not pay chanda.. He is kicked out.. ( a compulsary thing) . Further he rejected Jihad and doctrine of Jihad. This is a modified sharia as I see it. and thus he finally claimed himself a sharia Prophet

[muzammilmian03]

@xiaahmad We are hiding the belief?! WHAT!?

You really don't come in much contact with Ahmadi do you, no wonder you're so misinformed

No man, you’re gravely mistaken, I don’t blame you since there is a lot of hatred/ lies against the Jama’at of Allah, it was something that happens to the righteous people of Allah, they have to go through trials.

HISTORY REPEATS ITSELFS, just like it happened before in the times of Hazart Essa (as) and Prophet Muhammed saw (pbuh), we are seeing it unfold

[muzammilmian03]

@xiaahmad As for Kafir or not,

1) No man has the right to declare anyone kafir (you’re going against Islamic teachings)

2) Allah alone will judge who is righteous/ muslim/kafir on the day of judgement and either reward him or punish him accordingly

3) u may call us Kafir, but we will not repeat your mistake by calling u that, you have other buddy sects to do so ie shi'a/ sunni

4) Watch with an open heart /watch?v=NXtEcPa8jIQ

5) Pray Pray Pray

[xiaahmad]

@muzammilmian03

THen who gave this right to MIRZA GHULAM and MIRZA MAHMUD?