@Arwiiss It's not true. Look it up. The age of consent is the same as Italy at 14 and 16 if one of the people concerned is over three years older. I don't know why they got this so wrong as they are usually correct.
So, Kazakhstan is partly in Europe, the Vatican doesn't have the lowest age of consent, and the high crime rate would be explained by the millions of visitors it receives each year, meaning it probably has effectively one of the lowest under any fair appraisal.
Another COMPLETE fail from QI. How this show stays on the air is beyond me.
@thespacialone Kazakhstan is technically Asia, so no, it's not Europe and The Vatican stands as having the lowest age of consent. The crime rate in the Vatican is also still impressive given the percentage of people there that commit crimes. It is silly to compare small populations to large populations but crime rates everywhere do that. Also, the show stays on air because the errors that they show are incredibly slim to the amount of true facts that they discuss.
@rawrrmeagan "Kazakhstan is technically Asia." And Russia is technically Europe, even though, what, 9/10ths of it is in Asia? My point was that continental boundaries for places like Kazakhstan are all too arbitrary for Fry to do his usual let's-mock-Alan-Davies-thing. He is so often wrong when he does, but that doesn't seem to stop the pompous sod.
I'm pretty sure the Vatican's age of consent is 14, in line with Italian law, and I cite wikipedia. Why is the age 12?
@rawrrmeagan "The crime rate in the Vatican is also still impressive given the percentage of people there that commit crimes."
"Impressive"? You utter drone. Best guess for annual visitors to Vatican state, 6,2000,000, resulting in an average of, is it?, 600 reported penal offences? I am unclear.
So less than 1 in 10,000 people who spend time within the state in a given year commit a penal offence (whatever that means, whether reports = activity anyway).
@rawrrmeagan "The age of consent in Italy is 14 years, with a close-in-age exception that allows those aged 13 to engage in sexual activity with partners who are less than 3 years older. The age of consent rises to 16 if one of the participants has some kind of influence on the other" (Wikipedia).
Yet Stephen Fry claimed it was 16. Is the Italian age for sexual consent set at 14 or 16? Is Stephen Fry making himself look stupid AGAIN?
@rawrrmeagan "the show stays on air because the errors that they show are incredibly slim to the amount of true facts that they discuss."
You miss my point. That the BBC churns out this drivel is only to be expected. That people still watch leaves me cold, when it is strewn with the basest errors, omissions and distortions imaginable.
The UK's chattering classes who lap this nonsense up won't be around for much longer. Good bloody riddance.
@thespacialone It is arguable that the age of consent in Italy could be at 16 from what you youself posted. The reason I comment is due to your use of the words 'chattering classes' and 'drone' that would suggest you see yourself as superior to people who watch these programs. I see no evidence that you are intellectually superior so I can only infer that you just think you are. This kind of attitiude is called snobbery and is built on delusion. If you don't like the UK then leave. Please.
@thespacialone The Vatican has the lowest age of consent if Europe (12) and it is considered a country. Regardless of crime being committed by visitors it does have the highest crime rate eg. could you dismiss crimes being committed in the UK by foreigners? You are an idiot.
@Easyandy100 Then why does every web site, including Wikipedia, say it's 14?
The point is the so-called crime stat is utterly arbitrary, as is your parallel. Millions of visitors annually and just a few hundred petty crimes. You're as thick as Stephen Fry, and I've pwned this joke show a dozen times, not because I'm the shit, but because it's dumbed down, specious GARBAGE. This is anti-Catholic propaganda.
Don't bother to reply, I'm not interested. And don't bother me again.
@thespacialone Obviously you are far too special to be bothered. If that is the case then don't post comments with your jumped up rubbish on it. And trust me I am not interested in you. Your pseudo intellectual status is brilliantly laughable. I can only assume you are joking. Well done, you got me!
@Easyandy100 Jumping in at the end of this argument, the crime stat is taken of context and he is correct about the age of consent. It's 14 in-line with Italian Law.
@Phlegasus No worries.I did get it wrong and I am a bit disappointed by the program and its' presenter as they are normally correct. Also, as the presenter is openly gay and with that in mind I think my friend might have been right in suggesting that saying the age of consent is 12 may have been anti Catholic propaganda. By complete coincidence, I am visiting the Vatican in July.
The Vatican does not have its own separate criminal code. Instead, as per Article 3 of the "Law of the Source of Law" (1 of 6 fundamental laws adopted upon ratification of the Lateran Treaty in 1929) the Vatican State generally uses current Italian national criminal law, as well as regional and municipal laws for Rome, as long as they do not conflict with ecclesiastical law or laws specifically promulgated by Pope for the Vatican.[As a result, the age of consent is 14, the same as Italy's.
Two things. Firstly, Kazakhstan is partially in Europe. Secondly, wikipedia gives a rather different view of Vatican law that pegs their age of consent alongside Italy's at 14. Can anyone verify their information?
@therequiembellishere can you verify wikipedia information? It's a user submitted information site and is much more liable to inaccuracies than a show that has several researchers. I do agree with you on Kazakhstan
@deadraptor667 I asked if someone could verify the information, not if a commentary on wikipedia. Regardless of the source, if it can be independently verified then it's credibility is raised. Certainly more so if we know where the information came from rather than blindly accepting everything QI says using themselves as the source and nothing else. It's a wonderful show but it's been wrong before.
The crime rate is easy to explain. Millions of tourists! It effectively has a much larger population because there are always thousands of people wandering around. I think Fry's prejudices got the better of him in this bit.
@SpazzyMcGee1337 the crime rate is for residents. you can't take a random crime rate figure based heavily on tourism and use that for another purpose. and for your information it's the show's researchers that come up with the info, not the Fry man. Sounds to me like you're a Christian apologist and not too happy with the truth.
2) The crime rate is the number of crimes divided by the population. Since tens of thousands of people pass through the Vatican regularly the number of people within the Vatican at any one time is usually far above the actual population of the Vatican. All of those people are still committing crimes at their usual rate. It's not just the people living there that are breaking laws.
3) Fry is obviously anti-religion and jumps at the chance to mock it.
and what proofs do you give for this...? Where did this information come from when all evidence points to other countries that have crimes far more than either Italy or the Vatican as you seem to just blurt out. England is on the top list and Italy nor the Vatican are in the top ten.
@MaranathaTre What you are missing is 'per capita'. With 500 people and 600+ crimes per year, Vatican City has more crimes than actual people, which you won't find any properly sized countries coming anywhere near. The numbers you are looking at (if you bothered to look at all) are likely just a total of crimes committed.
@canadianbirch You will be waiting for a very long time. Religion is designed to perpetuate itself. Nothing better than taking small children and telling them that they will burn for all of eternity if they don't believe a specific fairy tale.
Don't they estimate Mary was impregnated with that troublesome little Christ at the age of twelve? If it was good enough for the most widely publicised rape in history it should be good enough for us plebs.
@Jerrymanda101 A simple search on wikipedia or a team of researchers working for a t.v. show specialising in debunking myths and getting their facts straight, who are you gonna trust eh?
I'm an atheist, and you know what? I think that if there is going to be an age of consent, 12 is about what I would want it to be. That doesn't mean I support rape or molestation, you still have to have the individual's consent, but this fear of sex, the most natural biological function humans engage in, until the age of exactly 18 needs to stop, especially among the enlightened (ie: atheists).
@smashballbrawler 12 year olds are not old enough for sex. You might not promote pedophilia if you support lowering the age of consent, but you sure as fuck are making easier for pedophiles. I'm an atheist, too, and 12 year olds not mentally capable of sex. 12 is before they are even taught sex-ed (little as it helps) in schools.
@BentOnTheCross Well, 12 is usually (but not always) the define point of paedophilia. The onset of puberty that is. However, most western European countries have 15-16 to be sure the teen is done or close to finished with puberty. In my country (Norwsy) it is 16 and 15 in our neighbouring countries.
12 is deemed to young; I have heard interesting arguments on lowering it to 14, but never lower then that.
U are aware that its 16 in almost all if not all first world countries right? Personally, i dont think u should have sex until ur ready to raise a kid, if ur not ready at 20 id say wait a couple more years. We r seeing people rush into sex at stupidly young ages, and their parents end up having to raise a kid while their kid is still a kid. thats not right
@Varoonmg Sure, there are a lot of good cases for not having sex until a certain age. But we're talking about making laws. There are a lot of good cases for not drinking alcohol, but no reasonable person thinks there should be laws against it. Laws to "protect someone from themself", even if genuinely well-intentioned, are, and I'm hoping I don't sound like Glenn Beck here, fascism.
I wasn"t talking about laws to "protect someone from oneself"...but about at what age one could give consent to sexual intercourse...and that just depends on psychological and physical maturity....Objective criteria
@Varoonmg Yes, you are talking about a law to protect one from oneself. You shouldn't cut off both of your arms and legs for obvious reasons, but there isn't a law against it. That'd be stupid. The key word in age of consent is CONSENT. If a 6 year old wants to have sex, they're probably making a very bad decision. But so is the person who cuts off their arms and legs, and there isn't a law against that. You're saying, "You're too stupid to decide for yourself, so I'll decide for you."
@smashballbrawler There's a difference between stupidity and maturity
The law doesn't protect one from one's own stupidity, if say out of gross negligence I were to cause harm to someone, I can't use "stupidity" as an excuse to get away with it
On the hand, Maturity is a valid excuse, because someone who's mental faculties have been altered due to illness or young age, can claim that they weren't aware of the wrong they did..
The age of consent in the vatican is probaly 8 or 9, with all the pedophilia thats rife in the church especially the catholic church, the vaticans age of consent would be very low.
@MansonFan64 For you and every other person who'd love for this show to be seen in the US go here: "qi(dot)com /tv /petition(dot)php". It's the official petition to get it shown in the US.
@MansonFan64 Nownow, let's be reasonable. Europe has utter, utter, utter trash as well. Look up "oh oh Cherso" for example, which is pretty much Dutch Jersey Shore.
@MansonFan64 Why do Americans always say Europe? It's and English tv show. Shown in England and Ireland. Now, to my knowledge, its not shown in Germany etc, but I cold be wrong.
The Vatican does not have its own separate criminal code. As per Article 3 of the "Law of the Source of Law" the Vatican State generally uses current Italian national law, as well as regional and municipal laws for Rome, as long as they do not conflict with ecclesiastical law or laws specifically promulgated by Pope for the Vatican. As a result, the age of consent is the same as that of Italy.
MOTHER CHURCH is a multiheaded/somewhat headless monolith that has openly succeeded in allowing/committing: human rights atrocities, countless acts of child abuse, oppression of GLBTQ community, mass campaigns to discourage people from using condoms *despite the real need for such measures in high risk/high HIV concentrated locations*, and has given comfort/legal representations/cover/re-assignment to individuals who were KNOWN predators. Catholicism is so completely pathological and absurd.
If Tolkien's fictional Mordor existed in reality it would be the Vatican (the Orcs would be represented by the Cardinals).What happens 'In Vaticano' stays in the Vatican,behind closed doors.It is a bit like the House of Slytherin run by a man who appears to be a cross between Lucius Malfoy and Uncle Fester.As Mr Fry states correctly,it is a 'strange place' indeed.
@SZYGY7 I find it highly amusing that the members of Opus Dei who haunt Wikipedia have made a frantic effort to 'cover their tracks' by editing articles referencing the 12yo age of consent in the Vatican. And to obliterate the even more damning laws there allowing sex with minors or either gender.
The 'edit' comes on the heels of exposure of this matter.......I honestly do not believe that they REALLY changed the law in 2009, as it was still extant in 2010!
The ONLY reason that the Vatican changed the age of consent within its territory to 14, is due to the fact that they were exposed as having the lowest age of consent in all of Europe.....in the middle of a global clerical child abuse mega-scandal.
They are simply making a feeble attempt to cover their collective asses.....
@UnitedFan16 a defending of a statement is a debate. Its simply 2 sides discussing an issue. You brought forth your points, I brought forth mine, hence debate.
Still, are you saying your not even debating what laws should be, just that you find certain things gross?
@UnitedFan16 To this comment, I already pointed out above, for the 2-3rd time hhow your definition of pedophilia is not consistant with the dictionary usage or categorisation by orgs.
Nobody is defending pedophilia here, and I can only imagine you purposefully missed the point by yet again accusing me of defending pedophilia just as in past posts you accused me of possibly being a pedophile.
I can be for a position without being a recipient of the benefit of that position.
@UnitedFan16 Point #2 is yet again using the same failed argument as #1, which is the idea that sex is only useful for procreation and/or that its the only thing on their minds. Proper education lowers teen pregnancy rates and no age of consent laws slow down teen pregnancy rates, nor sex between young teens.
Age of consent has to this day not done anything to help, but alot to harm teens.
We already have laws against physical and mental harm to all ages.
@UnitedFan16 You keep talking like the only reason to have sex is to have kids.
when teens have sex, babies are the last thing on their mind, and with good education, it will stay that way til they are ready. But you cant stop biology which will get them having sex whether they are completely fertile or not.
But I am willing to compromise on 14 as an age of consent. Hopefully good education can keep teens from having sex til they are better prepared. 14 sounds fine as a compromise.
@UnitedFan16 last, stop trying to character assassinate me. This isnt about me or what I want to do. Cant you keep a rational civil discussion about the topic? I am for homosexual rights, so will you now accuse me of being a homosexual?
@UnitedFan16 The only place that I saw use early pubertal age was WHO and when I looked it up, I got a medical site which described children who show signs of puberty before the actual onset, generally before the age of 8-9.
I also noticed that you actually agree with me, and prove that 12 and up, using our medical understanding, is after avg age of fertility and onset of period.
Yes, its below the avg age of sexual maturation, but again, we arent talking about child bearing issues, only sex.
@UnitedFan16 apparently i used the lingo in a way that confused you. I only meant post pubescent in that they have reached puberty, not completed it. Even if I used the terminology wrong, the context should have made it clear what i meant. Is your disagreement really because you refused to care about context?
Again though, didnt i already point out what pedophilia means? Why do you keep abusing the word, using it out of its meaning?
I did look it up, and every place uses prepubescent.
@UnitedFan16 To your next part, you have to prove its inherently harmful.
Even then, the debate over age of consent law is not usually over adults getting to hunt down teens for sex. Its 2 fold. First, people believe that parents should have charge over their teens, and if they agree to a relationship between their teen and an adult and its not forced, that should be the parents right.
Second, and most importantly, high age of consent laws end up turning kids into criminals without ... cont...
@waltermh111 cont... stopping or slowing pedophiles.
2 teens have sex no matter what, laws wont change that, but they become criminals with a life record of some level of rape charge often.
Some places have gradient age of consent laws, many US states do, saying say, a 13yo can have sex with a 14, a 14yo with a 16, and 16 with up to certain age, etc... Those are more sane, a good step.
You simplify and strawman the arguments at the loss of the debate and your side.
@UnitedFan16 Personal experience? Yes, personal experience with research. I like to know what I am talking about, all the way, not just up to what confirms my belief.
And watch out for the throwing of pedophile around, and even then, try to use it properly.
Its an interest in prepubescents, and we here are talking about pubescent children.
Even supposing I was speaking from experience, if my interest would be in post pubescent people, it wouldnt be pedophilia.
@UnitedFan16 You need to stop interchanging complete puberty with the onset of puberty.
When anybody else but you says puberty, they mean onset, in fact, in the post you responded to, I explained this, so are you trolling? Because you sure arent reading my posts.
@UnitedFan16 No, I guarantee, thats not why most countries have the age of consent at 16, nor is it unsafe to have sex before then. Again, the avg age of sexual maturity would be 14. You only did half your research then came to the conclusion you wanted.
Not that you get damage simply from sex at 14, you have to prove it. You have no basis for 16 being the limit, but then you also have to explain how its 13 in many civilised societies yet do just fine.
"In 1929, when the Lateran Treaty was signed, the age of consent in Italy was 12, and so the same was true then in Vatican City. However, since that time the Italian law has been changed, and so the laws of Vatican City (in accordance with the policy that was in place until Jan 1, 2009) changed automatically with them. Since there has been no change in the Italian age of consent since Jan 1, 2009, the two remain identical with no further review by the Vatican." -Wikipedia
@UnitedFan16 low teen pregnancy rates without less teen sex due to proper handling of the issue.
Sex can be done responsibly and without harm even before completion of reproductive parts since those arent needed if its done right.
You will never stop kids from having sex anyway, so making them criminals to suit your moral code is harmful and unforgivable to me because the record will haunt them all their life.
@UnitedFan16 The key, since we are talking not about the whole of puberty, but about the reproductive part, is that completion of that part in girls is usually 4 years after start of puberty, which avgs age 10.
You need to stop using completion of puberty, and puberty interchangably. Hormones start pumping around the onset of puberty, not at completion.
But even then, sex isnt all about reproduction these days, and with education and open honest frank discussion, many countries have ...
@UnitedFan16 So the goalpost is moved from puberty to "completing" puberty? lol
First, I know that you will find in countries where consent is 16, its not due to when completion is.
Also, age is 13 to this day in many countries, like canada and japan.
Some states in the US have gradient consent laws where legality is at 13 if the person is also close in age, and that closeness matters differently dependent on the ages.
@UnitedFan16 Actually, avg age of puberty ranges from 9-13 in girls, with 13 being the high end.
I think for guys its a year earlier both ways.
Of course avg then is about 11. Though you dont want sex to start at 11 due to the body needing a year or 2 after puberty to work on its growth spurt. 13 is a reasonable age some countries have, 12 is stretching it for sure.
I know you were trying to make more fun of it, I just cant help but educate.
I'm an atheist like everyone else here, but the law of the Vatican State in Italy in this matter follows today's Italian law, which is 14...still young, but not twelve. Until 1929, it WAS 12, but not any more
I'm an atheist like everyone else here, but the law of the Vatican State in Italy in this matter follows today's Italian law, which is 14...still young, but not twelve. Until 1929, it WAS 12, but not anymore
@austinguidry2 Actually, it may have kept all old laws, but the vatican divorced itself from italian law last year.
It defaults to the old laws of the treaty signing I believe, unless it defaults to the laws at the point of secession in 2009 from the italian legal system.
@mistacramer You also know it's bad when supposed freethinkers outrightly believe sketchy information as provided in the video. The info is incorrect.
insane, crazy religious nuts!
apparently theres little over 800 people living there, they must be raping choirboys on overdrive to have 600 crimes a year!
DemoraX 3 days ago
The answer is Spain with 13.
Easyandy100 1 week ago
wow i thought it would be lower than that- oh wait - they didn't get consent from all those little kids did they.....
freedom1234573 1 week ago 2
This fact does not surprise me, the sick paedo cunts!
Stu3100 2 weeks ago
this just isnt true..lol wish it was though!
osiris510 2 weeks ago
whys that ?
cymrutube3 1 week ago
Read the article "Age of consent" on wikipedia. 13 in spain! -_-
TheJo4an 2 weeks ago in playlist Fler videoklipp från AtheistMediaBlog
I think it's pretty clear why they keep consent age at so low numbers. I mean come-on anyone really needs explanation?
Arwiiss 3 weeks ago
@Arwiiss It's not true. Look it up. The age of consent is the same as Italy at 14 and 16 if one of the people concerned is over three years older. I don't know why they got this so wrong as they are usually correct.
Easyandy100 2 weeks ago
So why do they fuck 10 year olds in the Vatican
cymrutube3 1 week ago
So why do they fuck 10 year olds in the Vatican
cymrutube3 1 week ago
This has been flagged as spam show
So why do they fuck 10 year olds in the Vatican
cymrutube3 1 week ago
so why do they fuck 10 yos in the vatican
cymrutube3 1 week ago
@cymrutube3 If you have some information concerning child sex abuse in the Vatican then you should get in touch with the authorities immediately.
Easyandy100 1 week ago
I dunno im just guessing
cymrutube3 1 week ago
Cos teen girls are horny ?
cymrutube3 1 week ago
what? Catholic priest loves child sex, SHOCKER!
rugbyanden 1 month ago
Kazakstan is in Europe, atleast a part of it...
Klewken 1 month ago
So, Kazakhstan is partly in Europe, the Vatican doesn't have the lowest age of consent, and the high crime rate would be explained by the millions of visitors it receives each year, meaning it probably has effectively one of the lowest under any fair appraisal.
Another COMPLETE fail from QI. How this show stays on the air is beyond me.
thespacialone 1 month ago
@thespacialone Kazakhstan is technically Asia, so no, it's not Europe and The Vatican stands as having the lowest age of consent. The crime rate in the Vatican is also still impressive given the percentage of people there that commit crimes. It is silly to compare small populations to large populations but crime rates everywhere do that. Also, the show stays on air because the errors that they show are incredibly slim to the amount of true facts that they discuss.
rawrrmeagan 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@rawrrmeagan "Kazakhstan is technically Asia." And Russia is technically Europe, even though, what, 9/10ths of it is in Asia? My point was that continental boundaries for places like Kazakhstan are all too arbitrary for Fry to do his usual let's-mock-Alan-Davies-thing. He is so often wrong when he does, but that doesn't seem to stop the pompous sod.
I'm pretty sure the Vatican's age of consent is 14, in line with Italian law, and I cite wikipedia. Why is the age 12?
thespacialone 1 month ago
@rawrrmeagan "The crime rate in the Vatican is also still impressive given the percentage of people there that commit crimes."
"Impressive"? You utter drone. Best guess for annual visitors to Vatican state, 6,2000,000, resulting in an average of, is it?, 600 reported penal offences? I am unclear.
So less than 1 in 10,000 people who spend time within the state in a given year commit a penal offence (whatever that means, whether reports = activity anyway).
thespacialone 1 month ago
@rawrrmeagan "The age of consent in Italy is 14 years, with a close-in-age exception that allows those aged 13 to engage in sexual activity with partners who are less than 3 years older. The age of consent rises to 16 if one of the participants has some kind of influence on the other" (Wikipedia).
Yet Stephen Fry claimed it was 16. Is the Italian age for sexual consent set at 14 or 16? Is Stephen Fry making himself look stupid AGAIN?
thespacialone 1 month ago
@rawrrmeagan "the show stays on air because the errors that they show are incredibly slim to the amount of true facts that they discuss."
You miss my point. That the BBC churns out this drivel is only to be expected. That people still watch leaves me cold, when it is strewn with the basest errors, omissions and distortions imaginable.
The UK's chattering classes who lap this nonsense up won't be around for much longer. Good bloody riddance.
thespacialone 1 month ago
@thespacialone It is arguable that the age of consent in Italy could be at 16 from what you youself posted. The reason I comment is due to your use of the words 'chattering classes' and 'drone' that would suggest you see yourself as superior to people who watch these programs. I see no evidence that you are intellectually superior so I can only infer that you just think you are. This kind of attitiude is called snobbery and is built on delusion. If you don't like the UK then leave. Please.
Easyandy100 1 month ago
@thespacialone Hey, be grateful for this "drivel". Have you seen what America's churning out? Sheesh.
proprodigySD 4 weeks ago
@proprodigySD "be grateful for this drivel."
You be "grateful" for it. Drivel is drivel, and I'll give this brainrot a wide berth.
thespacialone 4 weeks ago
@thespacialone The Vatican has the lowest age of consent if Europe (12) and it is considered a country. Regardless of crime being committed by visitors it does have the highest crime rate eg. could you dismiss crimes being committed in the UK by foreigners? You are an idiot.
Easyandy100 1 month ago
@Easyandy100 Then why does every web site, including Wikipedia, say it's 14?
The point is the so-called crime stat is utterly arbitrary, as is your parallel. Millions of visitors annually and just a few hundred petty crimes. You're as thick as Stephen Fry, and I've pwned this joke show a dozen times, not because I'm the shit, but because it's dumbed down, specious GARBAGE. This is anti-Catholic propaganda.
Don't bother to reply, I'm not interested. And don't bother me again.
thespacialone 1 month ago
@thespacialone Obviously you are far too special to be bothered. If that is the case then don't post comments with your jumped up rubbish on it. And trust me I am not interested in you. Your pseudo intellectual status is brilliantly laughable. I can only assume you are joking. Well done, you got me!
Easyandy100 1 month ago
@Easyandy100 Jumping in at the end of this argument, the crime stat is taken of context and he is correct about the age of consent. It's 14 in-line with Italian Law.
Phlegasus 2 weeks ago
@Phlegasus No worries.I did get it wrong and I am a bit disappointed by the program and its' presenter as they are normally correct. Also, as the presenter is openly gay and with that in mind I think my friend might have been right in suggesting that saying the age of consent is 12 may have been anti Catholic propaganda. By complete coincidence, I am visiting the Vatican in July.
Easyandy100 2 weeks ago
@thespacialone I support anti-Catholic propaganda.
proprodigySD 4 weeks ago
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@proprodigySD "I support anti-Catholic propaganda."
I don't care.
thespacialone 4 weeks ago
trepmud !
maxvdvlugt 1 month ago
The crime rate says nothing because it's such a small country. Of course the rate of crime is huge in there, when you have few people living there.
KemiiSu 1 month ago
The Vatican does not have its own separate criminal code. Instead, as per Article 3 of the "Law of the Source of Law" (1 of 6 fundamental laws adopted upon ratification of the Lateran Treaty in 1929) the Vatican State generally uses current Italian national criminal law, as well as regional and municipal laws for Rome, as long as they do not conflict with ecclesiastical law or laws specifically promulgated by Pope for the Vatican.[As a result, the age of consent is 14, the same as Italy's.
kgboy72 2 months ago
@kgboy72 nice copy and paste from wikipedia lol.
also Spain's age of consent is is 13 so it is the lowest atm...if anyone cares.
M4rkC93 1 month ago
Two things. Firstly, Kazakhstan is partially in Europe. Secondly, wikipedia gives a rather different view of Vatican law that pegs their age of consent alongside Italy's at 14. Can anyone verify their information?
therequiembellishere 2 months ago
@therequiembellishere can you verify wikipedia information? It's a user submitted information site and is much more liable to inaccuracies than a show that has several researchers. I do agree with you on Kazakhstan
deadraptor667 2 months ago
@deadraptor667 I asked if someone could verify the information, not if a commentary on wikipedia. Regardless of the source, if it can be independently verified then it's credibility is raised. Certainly more so if we know where the information came from rather than blindly accepting everything QI says using themselves as the source and nothing else. It's a wonderful show but it's been wrong before.
therequiembellishere 2 months ago
The Vatican will eventually allow gay marriage to support their pedo priests.
HentaiFundamentalist 2 months ago
@HentaiFundamentalist The pope hates homosexuals, he says it is an abomination, of course he also lies about Condoms giving you HIV so go figure..
Brendan9895 1 month ago
Fun facts. That christianity for you. :O/ ★★★★★
Katalyzt
Katalyzt 3 months ago
The head of the Catholic church and it has the lowest age of consent and highest crime rate, why does that not surprise me?
Stu3100 3 months ago
Who lives in the Vatican at 12?
zeldaofarel 3 months ago in playlist More videos from AtheistMediaBlog
The crime rate is easy to explain. Millions of tourists! It effectively has a much larger population because there are always thousands of people wandering around. I think Fry's prejudices got the better of him in this bit.
SpazzyMcGee1337 3 months ago
@SpazzyMcGee1337 the crime rate is for residents. you can't take a random crime rate figure based heavily on tourism and use that for another purpose. and for your information it's the show's researchers that come up with the info, not the Fry man. Sounds to me like you're a Christian apologist and not too happy with the truth.
llkdll 3 months ago
@llkdll
1) I'm a happy-go-lucky atheist.
2) The crime rate is the number of crimes divided by the population. Since tens of thousands of people pass through the Vatican regularly the number of people within the Vatican at any one time is usually far above the actual population of the Vatican. All of those people are still committing crimes at their usual rate. It's not just the people living there that are breaking laws.
3) Fry is obviously anti-religion and jumps at the chance to mock it.
SpazzyMcGee1337 3 months ago
Its obviously because the separation of church and state.
grendelee 3 months ago
and what proofs do you give for this...? Where did this information come from when all evidence points to other countries that have crimes far more than either Italy or the Vatican as you seem to just blurt out. England is on the top list and Italy nor the Vatican are in the top ten.
MaranathaTre 3 months ago
@MaranathaTre What you are missing is 'per capita'. With 500 people and 600+ crimes per year, Vatican City has more crimes than actual people, which you won't find any properly sized countries coming anywhere near. The numbers you are looking at (if you bothered to look at all) are likely just a total of crimes committed.
Azeral777 3 months ago
12 year old boys and the crime is the priests farking the boys.
Leowen2 3 months ago
So what this is saying the Vatican has the most child molesters.
That would make sense. Oh it is not child molesting if you lower
the age of consent hmmm. I would believe that concerning the Vatican
dragonseptor 3 months ago
It should also have the lowest birth rate in Europe as well surely. . .
MsOneiroi77 3 months ago
I can't wait until all religion is gone from the earth.
canadianbirch 3 months ago
@canadianbirch You will be waiting for a very long time. Religion is designed to perpetuate itself. Nothing better than taking small children and telling them that they will burn for all of eternity if they don't believe a specific fairy tale.
killerkerara 3 months ago
Piss on Mr Fry.
RepentAmerica454 4 months ago
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Sharingthegospel45 4 months ago
the crime rate is caused by pick pockets working the tourists, they save the kiddie diddling for the parishes.
thebigdawg61 4 months ago
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Not surprising AT ALL! Those filthy catholics just LOVE to rape little boys...
HepburnFlicks 4 months ago
@HepburnFlicks Rape is illegal, no matter whether the age of the person is above the age of consent. So what you posted does not make sense...
Eastenderzz 3 months ago 8
@Eastenderzz It's not illegal if you're a priest. Then you'll just get shuffled around so you can continue doing it. Yay Catholicism!
Lleanlleawrg 3 weeks ago
Don't they estimate Mary was impregnated with that troublesome little Christ at the age of twelve? If it was good enough for the most widely publicised rape in history it should be good enough for us plebs.
shoeshiner100 5 months ago
That is perfectly acceptable. Teens are young adults, and the most under represented group in the world.
I will be adding a page to my site, which will feature amazing teens.
Candynipple com
dietwithmiller 5 months ago
That is perfictly acceptable. Teebs are young adults, and the most under represented group in the world.
I will be adding a page to my site, which will featur amazing teens.
Candynipple com
dietwithmiller 5 months ago
Sorry Stephen Fry but whenever you attack Catholics with your lies you always end up looking like the sad little man you really are.
The Age of Consent for the Vatican is the same as it is for Italy - 14 years, unless it involves a person in authority in which case it's 16 years.
A simple search on Wikipedia for "age of consent Vatican" would have shown that to be the case!
wikipedia(dot)org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_Europe#Vatican_State
Jerrymanda101 6 months ago
@Jerrymanda101 14years. Wow that makes it ok, 12 is disgraceful but 14? right on.
Rincewind211 6 months ago
@Jerrymanda101 I think QI's sources are slightly more reliable than wikipedia...
MrSuperEgg 5 months ago
@Jerrymanda101 A simple search on wikipedia or a team of researchers working for a t.v. show specialising in debunking myths and getting their facts straight, who are you gonna trust eh?
shoeshiner100 5 months ago
To be fair, the high crime rate is due to the millions of tourists.
RevZman 6 months ago
No wonder Italy has so many man whores, LG hunting is legal trolololololololol
ScrakeShredder 7 months ago
The age of concent in the Vatican is 14, the same as Italy. The Vatican uses Italian national law. Still pretty gross though.
JazielLandrie 7 months ago
I'm an atheist, and you know what? I think that if there is going to be an age of consent, 12 is about what I would want it to be. That doesn't mean I support rape or molestation, you still have to have the individual's consent, but this fear of sex, the most natural biological function humans engage in, until the age of exactly 18 needs to stop, especially among the enlightened (ie: atheists).
smashballbrawler 9 months ago
@smashballbrawler 12 year olds are not old enough for sex. You might not promote pedophilia if you support lowering the age of consent, but you sure as fuck are making easier for pedophiles. I'm an atheist, too, and 12 year olds not mentally capable of sex. 12 is before they are even taught sex-ed (little as it helps) in schools.
BentOnTheCross 9 months ago
@BentOnTheCross You would be surprised to know how much twelve year olds know.
KinguNoKin 8 months ago
@BentOnTheCross Well, 12 is usually (but not always) the define point of paedophilia. The onset of puberty that is. However, most western European countries have 15-16 to be sure the teen is done or close to finished with puberty. In my country (Norwsy) it is 16 and 15 in our neighbouring countries.
12 is deemed to young; I have heard interesting arguments on lowering it to 14, but never lower then that.
GnosticAtheist 8 months ago
@GnosticAtheist Norwsy is gibberish for Norway btw,.
GnosticAtheist 8 months ago
@smashballbrawler
U are aware that its 16 in almost all if not all first world countries right? Personally, i dont think u should have sex until ur ready to raise a kid, if ur not ready at 20 id say wait a couple more years. We r seeing people rush into sex at stupidly young ages, and their parents end up having to raise a kid while their kid is still a kid. thats not right
truekinggrim 8 months ago
@truekinggrim May I know why you are linking the Age of Consent Issue with only Procreation?
The Age of Consent should be related to Physical & Psychological Maturity of the individual to have the Intercourse & give Consent to it
So 16 sounds fine to me
U seem to consider sexual relationships only from the procreative side, but most people don't have sex to procreate nowadays, and claiming that
" u should have sex until ur ready to raise a kid" sounds quite medieval
Ever heard of condoms?
Varoonmg 8 months ago
@smashballbrawler I'm an atheist 2 but
1 should remember that there's a difference between Physical & Psychological Maturity
& in any case, at 12 we are only at the onset of Puberty, most teenagers haven't even fully Developed Reproductive Organs
The reason Atheists are "enlightened" is because we rely on Medical Scientific Facts,but what U proposed is in no way coroborated by Science
Anal penetration should have a higher Age of Consent for obvious anatomical reasons
I'm Gay too by the way
Varoonmg 8 months ago
@Varoonmg Sure, there are a lot of good cases for not having sex until a certain age. But we're talking about making laws. There are a lot of good cases for not drinking alcohol, but no reasonable person thinks there should be laws against it. Laws to "protect someone from themself", even if genuinely well-intentioned, are, and I'm hoping I don't sound like Glenn Beck here, fascism.
smashballbrawler 7 months ago
@smashballbrawler
I wasn"t talking about laws to "protect someone from oneself"...but about at what age one could give consent to sexual intercourse...and that just depends on psychological and physical maturity....Objective criteria
Varoonmg 7 months ago
@Varoonmg Yes, you are talking about a law to protect one from oneself. You shouldn't cut off both of your arms and legs for obvious reasons, but there isn't a law against it. That'd be stupid. The key word in age of consent is CONSENT. If a 6 year old wants to have sex, they're probably making a very bad decision. But so is the person who cuts off their arms and legs, and there isn't a law against that. You're saying, "You're too stupid to decide for yourself, so I'll decide for you."
smashballbrawler 7 months ago
@smashballbrawler There's a difference between stupidity and maturity
The law doesn't protect one from one's own stupidity, if say out of gross negligence I were to cause harm to someone, I can't use "stupidity" as an excuse to get away with it
On the hand, Maturity is a valid excuse, because someone who's mental faculties have been altered due to illness or young age, can claim that they weren't aware of the wrong they did..
That's why children don't go to jail
Consent depends on Maturity
Varoonmg 7 months ago
It would be really tough for a person to cut off BOTH arms without some assistance.
billwalkerable 5 months ago
Highest "crime" rate? I'd be curious what those crimes are.
eirefrance 9 months ago
@eirefrance news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/2639777.stm Gives a few examples.
gateman42 9 months ago
do catholics have no shame?
gatedicath 9 months ago
The age of consent in the vatican is probaly 8 or 9, with all the pedophilia thats rife in the church especially the catholic church, the vaticans age of consent would be very low.
fuckstick1984 10 months ago
12? Always theorised why the vatican would protect pedo priests and now i know why. CAUSE ITS COMPLETELY NORMAL FOR THEM IN THEIR OWN COUNTRY!!!!!
MrNintoku 10 months ago 81
So, europe gets an amazing show like this and I'm stuck with Jersey Shore. Oh, America, I are dissapoint.
MansonFan64 11 months ago 204
@MansonFan64 For you and every other person who'd love for this show to be seen in the US go here: "qi(dot)com /tv /petition(dot)php". It's the official petition to get it shown in the US.
manhunt48 10 months ago
@MansonFan64 Europe no, this is England.
equiums1 4 months ago in playlist grey areas
@equiums1 Well, Britain. ;)
Stitch216 4 months ago
@equiums1 No it is not, it is Great Britain.
JohnS1704 3 months ago 5
@JohnS1704 I can agree with that,
equiums1 3 months ago
@MansonFan64 God bless the internet my friend. We used to have good TV though.
slytown 4 months ago
@MansonFan64 Nownow, let's be reasonable. Europe has utter, utter, utter trash as well. Look up "oh oh Cherso" for example, which is pretty much Dutch Jersey Shore.
FrisianDude 4 months ago
@MansonFan64 Why do Americans always say Europe? It's and English tv show. Shown in England and Ireland. Now, to my knowledge, its not shown in Germany etc, but I cold be wrong.
iamadamsusername 3 months ago
@iamadamsusername But not Scotland and Wales? I think you mean Britain, not England, for the second part.
Occono 2 months ago
@Occono touché
iamadamsusername 2 months ago
The Vatican does not have its own separate criminal code. As per Article 3 of the "Law of the Source of Law" the Vatican State generally uses current Italian national law, as well as regional and municipal laws for Rome, as long as they do not conflict with ecclesiastical law or laws specifically promulgated by Pope for the Vatican. As a result, the age of consent is the same as that of Italy.
user2112 1 year ago
@user2112 Key word in your comment... "Generally". Nice try though champ!
BobReefer 1 year ago
I though it was 14...
Ninjazap1 1 year ago
@Ninjazap1 : I was reading around and it has changed (at the time of this show it was 12). Now it is 14...
christianjerk666 11 months ago
I suspect the crime rate has to do with it being a pilgrimage/tourist site.
OccidentalMan 1 year ago 2
It also has the lowest I.Q.
kusalaviro 1 year ago 5
MOTHER CHURCH is a multiheaded/somewhat headless monolith that has openly succeeded in allowing/committing: human rights atrocities, countless acts of child abuse, oppression of GLBTQ community, mass campaigns to discourage people from using condoms *despite the real need for such measures in high risk/high HIV concentrated locations*, and has given comfort/legal representations/cover/re-assignment to individuals who were KNOWN predators. Catholicism is so completely pathological and absurd.
Hoo8MyPi 1 year ago
One word.... WOW!!!!
ChuriAMVids 1 year ago
If Tolkien's fictional Mordor existed in reality it would be the Vatican (the Orcs would be represented by the Cardinals).What happens 'In Vaticano' stays in the Vatican,behind closed doors.It is a bit like the House of Slytherin run by a man who appears to be a cross between Lucius Malfoy and Uncle Fester.As Mr Fry states correctly,it is a 'strange place' indeed.
SZYGY7 1 year ago
@SZYGY7 I find it highly amusing that the members of Opus Dei who haunt Wikipedia have made a frantic effort to 'cover their tracks' by editing articles referencing the 12yo age of consent in the Vatican. And to obliterate the even more damning laws there allowing sex with minors or either gender.
The 'edit' comes on the heels of exposure of this matter.......I honestly do not believe that they REALLY changed the law in 2009, as it was still extant in 2010!
19lfm12 1 year ago
The ONLY reason that the Vatican changed the age of consent within its territory to 14, is due to the fact that they were exposed as having the lowest age of consent in all of Europe.....in the middle of a global clerical child abuse mega-scandal.
They are simply making a feeble attempt to cover their collective asses.....
19lfm12 1 year ago
Chris Hansen does not approve of Vatian City.
ih8makinusernames 1 year ago
lower the age of consent to from 12 years to 12 months and the crime rate "might" drop!
AdvocatusDiaboliAU 1 year ago 75
@AdvocatusDiaboliAU Ewww. That would open up a whole other can wouldn't it?!
tangledweb79 1 year ago
@AdvocatusDiaboliAU LOL
EllyMcCormack 1 year ago
Papal Authority is the Beast that received the wound and healed.
slateiq 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 a defending of a statement is a debate. Its simply 2 sides discussing an issue. You brought forth your points, I brought forth mine, hence debate.
Still, are you saying your not even debating what laws should be, just that you find certain things gross?
waltermh111 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 To this comment, I already pointed out above, for the 2-3rd time hhow your definition of pedophilia is not consistant with the dictionary usage or categorisation by orgs.
Nobody is defending pedophilia here, and I can only imagine you purposefully missed the point by yet again accusing me of defending pedophilia just as in past posts you accused me of possibly being a pedophile.
I can be for a position without being a recipient of the benefit of that position.
waltermh111 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 Point #2 is yet again using the same failed argument as #1, which is the idea that sex is only useful for procreation and/or that its the only thing on their minds. Proper education lowers teen pregnancy rates and no age of consent laws slow down teen pregnancy rates, nor sex between young teens.
Age of consent has to this day not done anything to help, but alot to harm teens.
We already have laws against physical and mental harm to all ages.
waltermh111 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 You keep talking like the only reason to have sex is to have kids.
when teens have sex, babies are the last thing on their mind, and with good education, it will stay that way til they are ready. But you cant stop biology which will get them having sex whether they are completely fertile or not.
But I am willing to compromise on 14 as an age of consent. Hopefully good education can keep teens from having sex til they are better prepared. 14 sounds fine as a compromise.
waltermh111 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 My early posts did not use all 3 terms in same sentence.
Looking back, I used puberty, and if you checked ages, I was obviously talking about onset, not post competion
Early pubescent refers to hitting puberty before avg, the technical term is Precocious Puberty
Its the term that always comes up when searching for early pubescent
kidshealth . org/parent/medical/sexual/precocious.html
I do my research, do yours. pedophilia is not interest in kids up until their completion of puberty
waltermh111 1 year ago
Gee, I wonder why a bunch of catolic priest would want a low age of consent...
HailTheLulz 1 year ago
Pedobear gives the Vatican City his Platinum Seal of Approval.
wl0883 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 last, stop trying to character assassinate me. This isnt about me or what I want to do. Cant you keep a rational civil discussion about the topic? I am for homosexual rights, so will you now accuse me of being a homosexual?
waltermh111 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 The only place that I saw use early pubertal age was WHO and when I looked it up, I got a medical site which described children who show signs of puberty before the actual onset, generally before the age of 8-9.
I also noticed that you actually agree with me, and prove that 12 and up, using our medical understanding, is after avg age of fertility and onset of period.
Yes, its below the avg age of sexual maturation, but again, we arent talking about child bearing issues, only sex.
waltermh111 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 apparently i used the lingo in a way that confused you. I only meant post pubescent in that they have reached puberty, not completed it. Even if I used the terminology wrong, the context should have made it clear what i meant. Is your disagreement really because you refused to care about context?
Again though, didnt i already point out what pedophilia means? Why do you keep abusing the word, using it out of its meaning?
I did look it up, and every place uses prepubescent.
waltermh111 1 year ago
Kazakhstan is georgraphically a part of Europe.
keropekerope 1 year ago
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@keropekerope Part of Kazakhstan is georgraphically a part of Europe.
vgerdj 1 year ago
You would think that an organization that promotes abstinence until marriage would have a high standard regarding the age of consent.
JaMoond 1 year ago 43
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harj2009 1 year ago
@JaMoond nothing wrong with sex aslong as its done in marriage and not out of it
harj2009 1 year ago
@JaMoond Of course not. If you can't have sex until you're married, you'll wanna get married pretty quickly....
jursle 10 months ago
@JaMoond Yeah, it sure is ironic.
BNL07604 8 months ago
@JaMoond Nope, just double ones
purerizzo 7 months ago
" " " " " " They've never bothered to change it since " " " " " " " (GIGANTIC AIR QUOTATION MARKS)
EclecticSceptic 1 year ago
*makes generic joke about preists and young boys*
postmasterw00t 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 To your next part, you have to prove its inherently harmful.
Even then, the debate over age of consent law is not usually over adults getting to hunt down teens for sex. Its 2 fold. First, people believe that parents should have charge over their teens, and if they agree to a relationship between their teen and an adult and its not forced, that should be the parents right.
Second, and most importantly, high age of consent laws end up turning kids into criminals without ... cont...
waltermh111 1 year ago
@waltermh111 cont... stopping or slowing pedophiles.
2 teens have sex no matter what, laws wont change that, but they become criminals with a life record of some level of rape charge often.
Some places have gradient age of consent laws, many US states do, saying say, a 13yo can have sex with a 14, a 14yo with a 16, and 16 with up to certain age, etc... Those are more sane, a good step.
You simplify and strawman the arguments at the loss of the debate and your side.
waltermh111 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 Personal experience? Yes, personal experience with research. I like to know what I am talking about, all the way, not just up to what confirms my belief.
And watch out for the throwing of pedophile around, and even then, try to use it properly.
Its an interest in prepubescents, and we here are talking about pubescent children.
Even supposing I was speaking from experience, if my interest would be in post pubescent people, it wouldnt be pedophilia.
waltermh111 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 You need to stop interchanging complete puberty with the onset of puberty.
When anybody else but you says puberty, they mean onset, in fact, in the post you responded to, I explained this, so are you trolling? Because you sure arent reading my posts.
waltermh111 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 No, I guarantee, thats not why most countries have the age of consent at 16, nor is it unsafe to have sex before then. Again, the avg age of sexual maturity would be 14. You only did half your research then came to the conclusion you wanted.
Not that you get damage simply from sex at 14, you have to prove it. You have no basis for 16 being the limit, but then you also have to explain how its 13 in many civilised societies yet do just fine.
waltermh111 1 year ago
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Talk about corrupt
ExtremeBogom 1 year ago
"In 1929, when the Lateran Treaty was signed, the age of consent in Italy was 12, and so the same was true then in Vatican City. However, since that time the Italian law has been changed, and so the laws of Vatican City (in accordance with the policy that was in place until Jan 1, 2009) changed automatically with them. Since there has been no change in the Italian age of consent since Jan 1, 2009, the two remain identical with no further review by the Vatican." -Wikipedia
illuminatiLovesUS 1 year ago
I think the pope disliked this
divenutslincoln 1 year ago 2
lolvatican
Reiff444 1 year ago
Not a surprise! In Latin America and North America the believers crime is more than 75%, according to federal statistics in USA
elmachucho 1 year ago
lol he thought Kazakstan was in Europe
MamaMario13 1 year ago
@MamaMario13 Not seriously. Alan Davies is a professional comedian and he was taking the piss. "Lol" at you for missing the point so completely.
KeplersDream 1 year ago
@KeplersDream sorry i wont express laughter over the internet again
MamaMario13 1 year ago
@MamaMario13 You're forgiven. Now stand in a corner with your hands on your head while you think about what you did. My work here is done.
KeplersDream 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 low teen pregnancy rates without less teen sex due to proper handling of the issue.
Sex can be done responsibly and without harm even before completion of reproductive parts since those arent needed if its done right.
You will never stop kids from having sex anyway, so making them criminals to suit your moral code is harmful and unforgivable to me because the record will haunt them all their life.
waltermh111 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 The key, since we are talking not about the whole of puberty, but about the reproductive part, is that completion of that part in girls is usually 4 years after start of puberty, which avgs age 10.
You need to stop using completion of puberty, and puberty interchangably. Hormones start pumping around the onset of puberty, not at completion.
But even then, sex isnt all about reproduction these days, and with education and open honest frank discussion, many countries have ...
waltermh111 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 So the goalpost is moved from puberty to "completing" puberty? lol
First, I know that you will find in countries where consent is 16, its not due to when completion is.
Also, age is 13 to this day in many countries, like canada and japan.
Some states in the US have gradient consent laws where legality is at 13 if the person is also close in age, and that closeness matters differently dependent on the ages.
Its 14 in italy, and 15 in some countries.
Its 18 in US on average.
waltermh111 1 year ago
I think a very few in the vatican uphold that age of consent, which would explain the crime rate
Somai82 1 year ago
@UnitedFan16 Actually, avg age of puberty ranges from 9-13 in girls, with 13 being the high end.
I think for guys its a year earlier both ways.
Of course avg then is about 11. Though you dont want sex to start at 11 due to the body needing a year or 2 after puberty to work on its growth spurt. 13 is a reasonable age some countries have, 12 is stretching it for sure.
I know you were trying to make more fun of it, I just cant help but educate.
waltermh111 1 year ago
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I'm an atheist like everyone else here, but the law of the Vatican State in Italy in this matter follows today's Italian law, which is 14...still young, but not twelve. Until 1929, it WAS 12, but not any more
austinguidry2 1 year ago
I'm an atheist like everyone else here, but the law of the Vatican State in Italy in this matter follows today's Italian law, which is 14...still young, but not twelve. Until 1929, it WAS 12, but not anymore
austinguidry2 1 year ago
@austinguidry2 Well, it's only two years, I'm sure a 50 year old can wait that long.
SQuiRR3LM0nk3y 1 year ago
@austinguidry2 Actually, it may have kept all old laws, but the vatican divorced itself from italian law last year.
It defaults to the old laws of the treaty signing I believe, unless it defaults to the laws at the point of secession in 2009 from the italian legal system.
waltermh111 1 year ago
You know it is bad when the excuse is "She told me she was 12!"
mistacramer 1 year ago 57
@mistacramer Comment win!
sonoki82 1 year ago
@mistacramer You also know it's bad when supposed freethinkers outrightly believe sketchy information as provided in the video. The info is incorrect.
TampaRed 1 year ago
@mistacramer It's even worse when it's "He told me he was 12!"...
Zappamaniac 1 year ago
@Zappamaniac
No it's just as bad.
Anon12356 1 year ago
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ibizajoey 1 year ago