well as i like both engines, and have mopar frineds who will tell you. a 455 can run with any motor stock or add on's. the hemi is a race motor though, RACE motor. i suspect the 455 stage motors are not 360hp, and i got friends who say more like 400 or 420. but they are not as hard to drive as a hemi on the street. cause its a RACE motor. so i say, great motors. capable of beating the other.
You could drive a stock showroom GS Stage 1 straight off the showroom floor to the track with out even popping the hood and it would run 13.9 - 14.2 all day long. No fuss just mash the throttle and go. Its design goal was to be able to run as quick as the best RPO cars and be trouble free. It was as quick as a Hemi and 2 to 3 tenths faster than the 440.
@DONDIVA1969 Yeah your right, those Buicks are a great looking car. But the car (s) that blitz both of them, were the 68-69 340 Barracudas and Darts. 14.1 in stock trim, mid low 13s with headers and pipes. Many a Stage 1 Buick have been destroyed on the street, by a stock budget racer 340 Mopar.
@46wireboy Good Grief, are you still peddeling that old article in Muscle Car mag of the 50 fastest, thats been eclipsed about 5 times since then, The next 50 fastest had the 440 6 pack Road Runner in Super Stock mag, running 12.80s way ahead of the Buick. I still have early 70s mags, the FASTEST drag race Stg 1 was 13.50..racing!!!!
Plenty of road tests of low 14.00 sec 340 Mopars from the day, and yes with 4 seats!!! 340 Darts werent called Supercar Killers for nothing!!.
Both the Road Runner and Buick were beautiful cars, regardless of which was faster. You have to love that old Mopar, but the Buick also had a style of it's own that was excellent. Every manufactuer, be it Ford, Chevy, Mopar, Buick, etc, all at one time or another came out with some truly gorgeous machines. 400 horsepower and shitty gas mileage- hell yeah! lol
the Buick IS just as the Roadrunner -factory appearing stock-. it basically means that these guys are running stock cars mostly but underneath they are customized. you could get your car to be this fast without losing much in looks. hence the point of this whole race. I think it's perfect because it actually shows how mostly stock cars COULD perform back then with a lil' work. Good race Hemi!
Thanks for posting. Dudek's Hemi is an awesome car and so is the Buick and the Vette. The numbers they are turning show how heavily modified these cars are. In this format the Hemi really shines-its race heritage has proven the potential of those great Hemi-heads. But on the street and showroom stock, the hemi will and did get beat. So many variables with cars and drivers. Lets just enjoy them all before electric cars take over.
@mrho4speed i am so glad to finally find a post with some dam unbiased sense. the hemi was a race motor, no one can argue with that. at the race track is where it shined. on the street it got beaten in street form. i keep telling people the gs/gsx was a street car, not a track car, so its apples and oranges. the buick could get beat at the track but kick ass on the street. Vice versa on the hemi. both great, both had their elements to shine. End of story.
@redbuick I agree. Here's something nobody talks about-how strong the 440 - 6 pak cars are. I have an old article of side by side runs of 440 vs hemi in identical roadrunners Even by switching drivers every run was the same - the 440 got off the line and ahead of the hemi for an 1/8 mile. Then the ? was would the hemi catch up? It did every run (and won) except for 1 run (hemi driver napping at light) This shows in a street race of < then 1/4 mile a hemi was vulnerable. For the $ give me 440.
@mrho4speed I agree with that also, you can also build a 440 into an almost unstoppable street motor. A friend of mine works on Mopars for a living, one of his customers has a 512 stroker motor that kicks out around 750hp & 800 lb-ft of torque, it's a monster. He left a car show with it one day, got up to around 55mph, then decided to stick his foot in it & still spun for about 30 feet, torque is where it's at, & the Mopar big block has got plenty of it
@71powerwagon and they were running 10 second quarter miles? Really and your still gonna say that the car was heavier. Both of those cars were probably chopped up all to hell to get weight reduction. Lol and calling them shitty isn't going to effect anything.... At least GM didn't have to sell one of their brands to an Itailian company to stay in buisness **cough** **cough** Chrysler ring a bell?
@71powerwagon lol yeah but the funny thing is..... Buick busted hemis ass in the fastest factory runs! And thats where it counts son! BUICK ALL THE WAY! I am a pround owner of a Skylark and would never trade her in for anything else.
The ONLY stock car in 1970 (last year for high compression engines) that was faster than the Buick GS with the Stage 1 option was the Boss 429 Mustang.
the L88 427 and all aluminum version ZL1 both produced alot more HP the the 426 Hemi and the Boss 429 is the the ford engine with open chambered heads. I believe the Boss 429 mustangs had the best power to weight ratio and is often over looked.
The only legitimate comparison would be running these cars showroom stock. I mean you can modify anything to run, hell they got VW powered Beetles that run in the 11's. If the cars were showroom stock and the mods were limited to carb and timing mods and factory available gears only, the Buick would have stomped the Hemi and the Vette.
@DONDIVA1969 I absolutely agree that the only way to compare them is to run absolutely bone stock. I am not sure who would win but nobody would have believed it if Chrysler just said the hemi was great. The Hemi earned it's legendary status one street race at a time.
If Mopars they didn't exist, I would definitely have a Buick GS455. That 455 with 510lb/ft of torque is just amazing! Plus, I'd drive to the track in complete comfort. When I get there, I'd take off the AC belt , run anywhere from 10-12 second 1/4s, reinstall the belt and drive home with the air and cruise on! I'm a Mopar guy but those (68-72) Buicks were pretty cool.
If you compare all the GM cars from classics to Muscle.....Who now dominated...Pontiac,Chevy,Buick,Olds,Cadillac..........Hemispherical heads.Whoopy.
Hmm. I don't know it looks like this Hemi isn't having to much trouble dominating the entire field. Be real man, the Hemi was the first to 200mph, first to 300 mph, and first to 200 in Nascar. I like ALL the musclecars, but it kills me to hear generalizations like all GM is better than everything else basically. Not true. They all had their good cars and bad cars.
When talking stock, the GS, Hemi, and the 440-6 packs were all king of the road. They were equal. Big block chevy's are awesome for sure, but the LS6 just came up short. The LS6 was probably the more overstated supercar engine back then. The GS stage 1 was the most understated by far. But it would clean your clock. lol
pontiac40069- for every small block chevy that beats a Hemi, there's a Hemi that will beat that same SBC. In the end the Hemi always wins. Unless you talk about a car that needs to corner. Then the small block is the way to go. Small block chevy's are badass engines, but they can't compare to Hemi's in raw natural power. Your SBC that beats a stock block Hemi, is a lot more modified than that Hemi your beating. I promise!
you're comparing big block to small block. for fun heres a few engines that did beat the hemi: ford 427 cammer, ford 427 cobra jet , chevy 427 ZL1, chevy 454 LS6, buick 455 stage 1
@joshual1887 Actually "pontiac40069" was the one comparing the big block to small block. I just responded. Also, there's no such animal as a 427 cobra jet. They did however make a 428 cobra jet, and also a 385 series 429 cobra jet. Niether would beat the Hemi assuming they were all in tune and in similar weight cars. I agree though that the ford 427 Hemi would run with a race Hemi. I think the ZL1 427 was neck and neck with a well tuned Hemi. Stage 1 would beat the LS6 when both are in tune.
though rare, the 427 cobra jet can be found in 1967 shelby mustangs, as well as 1966 ford fairlanes. buick also made a stage 2 but very rare. i didnt realize u were commenting someone else
@joshual1887 The Stage 2 prototypes, only two were made, but they showed promise. They were estimated just shy of 600bhp, running 4:56 gearing they had a few sub 12 runs on polyglass shit-tires. Would easily be a stock 10 second on slicks.
I don't know if you guys notice, but the Roadrunner is winning these races on the big end where the Hemi really starts to show its advantage in design of the free breathing cylinder heads. They didn't go through all that trouble in 1964 to make the 2nd gen. Hemi head work on the B, RB block for nothing.
What was the point of this race? They take a mildy hopped (if you can call it that) buick 455 and pit it against a heavely modified hemi in a body that's probably500lbs lighter and expect that the buick or chevy might win?
holy shit...
TheATHF 3 months ago
can you give me some insight on what happend? yea! umm hemi just whooped my 455 buick ass!
gtarz40ful 3 months ago
well as i like both engines, and have mopar frineds who will tell you. a 455 can run with any motor stock or add on's. the hemi is a race motor though, RACE motor. i suspect the 455 stage motors are not 360hp, and i got friends who say more like 400 or 420. but they are not as hard to drive as a hemi on the street. cause its a RACE motor. so i say, great motors. capable of beating the other.
redbuick 6 months ago
You could drive a stock showroom GS Stage 1 straight off the showroom floor to the track with out even popping the hood and it would run 13.9 - 14.2 all day long. No fuss just mash the throttle and go. Its design goal was to be able to run as quick as the best RPO cars and be trouble free. It was as quick as a Hemi and 2 to 3 tenths faster than the 440.
DONDIVA1969 9 months ago
@DONDIVA1969 why would you want as gs? i would go for a 1970 buick gsx.
damnlazypeople 7 months ago
@DONDIVA1969 Yeah your right, those Buicks are a great looking car. But the car (s) that blitz both of them, were the 68-69 340 Barracudas and Darts. 14.1 in stock trim, mid low 13s with headers and pipes. Many a Stage 1 Buick have been destroyed on the street, by a stock budget racer 340 Mopar.
kramrollin69 6 months ago
@kramrollin69 No way did any stock 340 mopars destroy any
Stage1 on the street. Are you on crack? Stock trim 14.1. Crack.
Try 15.00. Stage1's; best I've seen pre-internet was 12.8.
Normally around 13.2. Back in the 80's there was a compilation
of 4 car mags quickest muscle car times and the fastest TRUE
muscle car was the Stage1. The 340 dart came in 50th. 2 cars
were illegitimate #1 & #2; Cobra and some ungodly 1 off Vette.
By the way true muscle cars have 4 seats.
46wireboy 1 month ago
@46wireboy Good Grief, are you still peddeling that old article in Muscle Car mag of the 50 fastest, thats been eclipsed about 5 times since then, The next 50 fastest had the 440 6 pack Road Runner in Super Stock mag, running 12.80s way ahead of the Buick. I still have early 70s mags, the FASTEST drag race Stg 1 was 13.50..racing!!!!
Plenty of road tests of low 14.00 sec 340 Mopars from the day, and yes with 4 seats!!! 340 Darts werent called Supercar Killers for nothing!!.
kramrollin69 1 month ago
Both the Road Runner and Buick were beautiful cars, regardless of which was faster. You have to love that old Mopar, but the Buick also had a style of it's own that was excellent. Every manufactuer, be it Ford, Chevy, Mopar, Buick, etc, all at one time or another came out with some truly gorgeous machines. 400 horsepower and shitty gas mileage- hell yeah! lol
Commandant88 10 months ago
the Buick IS just as the Roadrunner -factory appearing stock-. it basically means that these guys are running stock cars mostly but underneath they are customized. you could get your car to be this fast without losing much in looks. hence the point of this whole race. I think it's perfect because it actually shows how mostly stock cars COULD perform back then with a lil' work. Good race Hemi!
Kina1981 10 months ago
Fords are slow, I guess you haven't seen the 9 second Mach 1, on street tires
gremx360 10 months ago
Thats funny, that Vette launched like a rocket, but had no top end.
ellroyblues72 11 months ago
Buick all the way!
MrGeo7k 1 year ago
The only way that you could beat (Barely) a Buick is to have 2x4Bbl!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
1899lpv 1 year ago
@1899lpv True.....That, and the fact that I wasn't driving the GS.
torchss 10 months ago
Thanks for posting. Dudek's Hemi is an awesome car and so is the Buick and the Vette. The numbers they are turning show how heavily modified these cars are. In this format the Hemi really shines-its race heritage has proven the potential of those great Hemi-heads. But on the street and showroom stock, the hemi will and did get beat. So many variables with cars and drivers. Lets just enjoy them all before electric cars take over.
mrho4speed 1 year ago 2
@mrho4speed i am so glad to finally find a post with some dam unbiased sense. the hemi was a race motor, no one can argue with that. at the race track is where it shined. on the street it got beaten in street form. i keep telling people the gs/gsx was a street car, not a track car, so its apples and oranges. the buick could get beat at the track but kick ass on the street. Vice versa on the hemi. both great, both had their elements to shine. End of story.
redbuick 6 months ago
@redbuick I agree. Here's something nobody talks about-how strong the 440 - 6 pak cars are. I have an old article of side by side runs of 440 vs hemi in identical roadrunners Even by switching drivers every run was the same - the 440 got off the line and ahead of the hemi for an 1/8 mile. Then the ? was would the hemi catch up? It did every run (and won) except for 1 run (hemi driver napping at light) This shows in a street race of < then 1/4 mile a hemi was vulnerable. For the $ give me 440.
mrho4speed 6 months ago
@mrho4speed I agree with that also, you can also build a 440 into an almost unstoppable street motor. A friend of mine works on Mopars for a living, one of his customers has a 512 stroker motor that kicks out around 750hp & 800 lb-ft of torque, it's a monster. He left a car show with it one day, got up to around 55mph, then decided to stick his foot in it & still spun for about 30 feet, torque is where it's at, & the Mopar big block has got plenty of it
jrt88fan 6 days ago
@mrho4speed Oh, & it's in a 1971 'Cuda
jrt88fan 6 days ago
I read the hemi was 528 cu.in. VS the Buick at 462. Fords are sloooooooooooow.
grngs1 1 year ago
@grngs1
actually it says in hotrod.com that it was 496ci HEMI, with 615 rwhp.
nevertheless, i still dare to say buick would have been faster if these cars would have been unmodified (factory stock)
bastardeyez 1 year ago
What did you guys think was going to happen!?Mopars have been winning forever,KEEP TRYING CHEVY AND FORD!HA HA HA!
71powerwagon 1 year ago
@71powerwagon AND THE ROADRUNNER WAS THE BIGGEST CAR ! OH AND BYE THE WAY BUICK AND CHEVY ARE THE SAME,JUST IN A SHITY COVER LOL!
71powerwagon 1 year ago
@71powerwagon and they were running 10 second quarter miles? Really and your still gonna say that the car was heavier. Both of those cars were probably chopped up all to hell to get weight reduction. Lol and calling them shitty isn't going to effect anything.... At least GM didn't have to sell one of their brands to an Itailian company to stay in buisness **cough** **cough** Chrysler ring a bell?
Buick70GSX 1 year ago
@71powerwagon lol yeah but the funny thing is..... Buick busted hemis ass in the fastest factory runs! And thats where it counts son! BUICK ALL THE WAY! I am a pround owner of a Skylark and would never trade her in for anything else.
Buick70GSX 1 year ago
That's depressing... nobody representin buick :-(
snowman4839 1 year ago
The ONLY stock car in 1970 (last year for high compression engines) that was faster than the Buick GS with the Stage 1 option was the Boss 429 Mustang.
WHW2541 1 year ago
@WHW2541 FAIL, 440-6 cars win every time.
gumper1986 1 year ago
@WHW2541 Yeah, but what was faster than the Mustang? The 1970 Buick GSX lolz. It had the most torque of any muscle car of that era :D
margolo 1 year ago
the L88 427 and all aluminum version ZL1 both produced alot more HP the the 426 Hemi and the Boss 429 is the the ford engine with open chambered heads. I believe the Boss 429 mustangs had the best power to weight ratio and is often over looked.
10mak01 1 year ago
The only legitimate comparison would be running these cars showroom stock. I mean you can modify anything to run, hell they got VW powered Beetles that run in the 11's. If the cars were showroom stock and the mods were limited to carb and timing mods and factory available gears only, the Buick would have stomped the Hemi and the Vette.
DONDIVA1969 1 year ago
@DONDIVA1969 I absolutely agree that the only way to compare them is to run absolutely bone stock. I am not sure who would win but nobody would have believed it if Chrysler just said the hemi was great. The Hemi earned it's legendary status one street race at a time.
ryan66100 1 year ago
If Mopars they didn't exist, I would definitely have a Buick GS455. That 455 with 510lb/ft of torque is just amazing! Plus, I'd drive to the track in complete comfort. When I get there, I'd take off the AC belt , run anywhere from 10-12 second 1/4s, reinstall the belt and drive home with the air and cruise on! I'm a Mopar guy but those (68-72) Buicks were pretty cool.
qmopar 2 years ago
Anyone know when the next F.A.S.T. event with Dudek is?
mine1username 2 years ago
That RoadRunner was kicking ass all day!
matrox 2 years ago
If you compare all the GM cars from classics to Muscle.....Who now dominated...Pontiac,Chevy,Buick,Olds,Cadillac..........Hemispherical heads.Whoopy.
raramesis 2 years ago
Hmm. I don't know it looks like this Hemi isn't having to much trouble dominating the entire field. Be real man, the Hemi was the first to 200mph, first to 300 mph, and first to 200 in Nascar. I like ALL the musclecars, but it kills me to hear generalizations like all GM is better than everything else basically. Not true. They all had their good cars and bad cars.
mine1username 2 years ago 2
When talking stock, the GS, Hemi, and the 440-6 packs were all king of the road. They were equal. Big block chevy's are awesome for sure, but the LS6 just came up short. The LS6 was probably the more overstated supercar engine back then. The GS stage 1 was the most understated by far. But it would clean your clock. lol
mine1username 2 years ago
Greenbean dont want no part of that HEMI with his junk ass buick....
moparniac 2 years ago
im a PROFESSIONAL ENGINE BUILDER IVE SBC'S THAT WOULD SMOKE STOCK BLOCK HEMI'S
pontiac40069 2 years ago
pontiac40069- for every small block chevy that beats a Hemi, there's a Hemi that will beat that same SBC. In the end the Hemi always wins. Unless you talk about a car that needs to corner. Then the small block is the way to go. Small block chevy's are badass engines, but they can't compare to Hemi's in raw natural power. Your SBC that beats a stock block Hemi, is a lot more modified than that Hemi your beating. I promise!
mine1username 2 years ago
you're comparing big block to small block. for fun heres a few engines that did beat the hemi: ford 427 cammer, ford 427 cobra jet , chevy 427 ZL1, chevy 454 LS6, buick 455 stage 1
joshual1887 1 year ago
@joshual1887 Actually "pontiac40069" was the one comparing the big block to small block. I just responded. Also, there's no such animal as a 427 cobra jet. They did however make a 428 cobra jet, and also a 385 series 429 cobra jet. Niether would beat the Hemi assuming they were all in tune and in similar weight cars. I agree though that the ford 427 Hemi would run with a race Hemi. I think the ZL1 427 was neck and neck with a well tuned Hemi. Stage 1 would beat the LS6 when both are in tune.
mine1username 1 year ago
though rare, the 427 cobra jet can be found in 1967 shelby mustangs, as well as 1966 ford fairlanes. buick also made a stage 2 but very rare. i didnt realize u were commenting someone else
joshual1887 1 year ago
@joshual1887 The Stage 2 prototypes, only two were made, but they showed promise. They were estimated just shy of 600bhp, running 4:56 gearing they had a few sub 12 runs on polyglass shit-tires. Would easily be a stock 10 second on slicks.
Arcticun 1 year ago
Junk ass buick??? I'm a Mopar guy too, but that GS is a bad ass car whether you agree or not. Pretty sick comment.
mine1username 2 years ago
I wouldnt call it a junkass Buick, Its a fast ass Buick that just happened to lose to a faster car.
matrox 2 years ago
I don't know if you guys notice, but the Roadrunner is winning these races on the big end where the Hemi really starts to show its advantage in design of the free breathing cylinder heads. They didn't go through all that trouble in 1964 to make the 2nd gen. Hemi head work on the B, RB block for nothing.
411member 2 years ago
roadrunner ,the fastest car I ever owned, the only one that scared me..
mymoonbow42 2 years ago
I have a Buick that will scare you!
slowasss 2 years ago
What was the point of this race? They take a mildy hopped (if you can call it that) buick 455 and pit it against a heavely modified hemi in a body that's probably500lbs lighter and expect that the buick or chevy might win?
deletetotheend 2 years ago
Nope..you didn't have to heavily modify the Hemi to run like that. You could get them to run like that with bolt on performance.
matrox 2 years ago
Hemi mopars still dominating after all these years. Sorry about your luck GM boys!
schlongtip 2 years ago