Shroud of Turin w/ Dr. JJ Hurtak Oct 27 (pt 4)

[curlywolfone]

Please don't think my comments are to persuade you from this foolishness, but rather it's for the edification of the other readers; you can believe what ever you want, if you want to teach a doctrine of DAMNATION, go ahead, let your own blood be upon your head.

[paulagloria]

@curlywolfone

what are your comments for and are you happy with the results? Are you achieveing what you set out to do...save souls or be right?

[curlywolfone]

More New Age, Communist Blithering and yes let's take as many samples from the Shoud as NEEDED. It's important to get this fraud out ot the way as soon as possible. If you need visuale proof, go out and look at the birds and the beas and the flowers and the trees. The Pistus Sophia is even a Greater Fraud than the Shroud.

[paulagloria]

birds and bees do not produce the energy that you do here. I'm sticking to nature and Resurrection is a science

[Krazede]

Google it, I cannot explain it in 500 characters. It basically gives you a reason to believe in the Bible and God when Faith is not enough for the scientific minded, there must be visual proof mined. As if this glorius world and the creatures in it aren't enough to convince anyone that this could not have just happened by chance when the omeba crawled from the water.

[Krazede]

Yes His "Message" is for everyone. It is healthy to question anything that is detrimental to well being of our fellow man, our Mother Earth or our Father God. I'm not sure who are or what the definition of these "progressive" souls of which you speak? If atheists or agnostics or new agers are whom or what you consider "progressive" then our definitions of the very word are as different as night and day, or dark and light, or more simply put, Lucifer and Jesus. You avoided Pasqual's Wager, why?

[paulagloria]

not sure what is Pasqual's Wagner....I do like Wagner the Opra fellow

[Krazede]

Well, if your "study" of 9-11 led you to those conclusions, you are either a government disinformation agent or your study was incompetent. I refuse to turn this into a 9-11 debate. Ask yourself this, many were crucified and wrapped in cloth, why would a shroud of a normal being be guarded and kept this long and now stored so sacredly by the Vatican? I will conclude with a suggestion, if faith you lack in God, then research Pasqual's Wager. It alone is sufficent for those of your rationale.

[paulagloria]

isn't jesus's message for normal people? Is it healthy to hate one's own government and ignore the layers of disinformation that can lead those without all the details to think one way or another?

Resurrection is considered by the majority of "progressive" souls to be the height of disinformation.

[Krazede]

If Science could prove the existence of God or that Jesus was the Son of God Faith would be a moot point now wouldn't it? I think it's by God's design. He wants to spend eternity with souls that chose Him and loved Him by choice not because science took the choice away. When there is overwhelming scientific proof of say, 9-11 being an inside job, people scream conspiracy theory. When there is no scientific proof of Jesus or God they scream the same thing. A bit Contradictory don't you think?

[paulagloria]

my study of 9/11 took me away from an inside job that is now making ppl hate their own government with no idea of how to protect themselves.....granted you are talking about a high level of evolution where the "truth" reveals itself to sincere and earnest souls that brings it forth in their deepest heartfelt prayers.

However my point was simplier - just that the cloth proves something remarkable happened just cannot show who did it.

[Krazede]

Not much. I believe the Bible is the Word of God. I realize there are some watered down versions out there. NIV being one of the worst. I am Assyrian and my Holy Bible is the Peshitta Which is a translation into English By George Lamsa from the Ancient Eastern Manuscripts. Which were Aramaic by the way. The KJV is about as good as it gets after the Peshitta. How do I know this, Because I have a faith in my God that leads me There is no science that can prove it, it is from God of God and by God

[rabbitholecentral]

"There is no science that can prove it,"

are you sure of this?

[Krazede]

The point I was trying to make was this, There is verified blood evidence exactly where the Bible has explained Jesus's injuries were. Right down to the thumbs being turned. It can be placed in Jerusalem in about 700AD. Along with the facial cloth that just haoppens to have the exact same shape of blood stain as the Shroud.If this amount of evidence was presented against somone to try and convict them it would be more than enough.Because it's in regards to proof of Jesus is why it is insufficent

[rabbitholecentral]

whoa! for sure something remarkable happened but it does not show it is Jesus...it still could have been someone else they were describing in the Bible. Mistranslations and additions and deletions abound. What do you think of the theory that after this event (whether he pulled it off or not) the one going around with the people (not the stunt man if there was one) then left to Kashmir to hang with other accomplished souls and later died a normal death there...

just speculation

[Krazede]

If this cloth were found at a murder scene and the forensics that have been used on it were used and the findings that have been found were presented to a jury, there would be a conviction. The only reason this argument continues with an image that is described in the Bible to this exactness is because it is of Christ.

[rabbitholecentral]

@√Krazede

I want to understand your point better.......

[Jimpsterr]

This chick should manifest some breasts for herself.

[mrcon5]

why?

[CANARVONKID]

I think this woman was smoking some weed before she recorded this programme!

[rabbitholecentral]

I wasn't be I am interested n the oil from hemp to cure cancer (see "run from the cure" by rick simpson)

do you dislike "weed"?

[CANARVONKID]

No I don't dislike it, only the effect it has on young minds!

There are already too many counter culture groups out there!

[eriiiiiiiiiii]

I can appreciate her enthusiasm for exploring the unkown and her search for answers, but trying to help create a world or country where we would live with an equal distribution of wealth is like giving a 4.0 GPA to a 2.0 calibur student just for the sake of being fair, even though an actual 4.0 student earns it through hard work and "over-time" effort. People deserve to enjoy as much wealth as they work for. Privileges should be earned, not handed out for the sake of being fair or equal.

[Krazede]

I agree but you have left out one very important aspect concerning fairness. People should not be allowed to obtain wealth at the expense of others by unlawful means. ie... A man's Labor belongs to himself.Taxing our wages, which is not constitutional, The 16th Ammend. was created for Capital Gains and not personal wages, yet we are required to pay these illegal taxes. This being just one example. We have been enslaved by these abominations of justice and that can NEVER be defined as FAIR.

[notatwat5]

even if u accept the dating as true with the bacteria residue and all, it still does not explain how the image could of been transfered onto the shroud.

[althorp23]

Carbon dating experiment was done with an ordinary sea shell that was dried and then burned dated it at 1Million years old, and the fossil was dated to 2 Million years old. Carbon dating is not accurate. In fact the world itself is not as old as carbon dating on dinosaur fossils show millions of years old, and one done on a mummified dinosaur of the type found in the Dakota area shows that the similar species was only 400 years old!

[paulagloria]

wow interesting...how can I learn more?

[eriiiiiiiiiii]

Are you one of those "thumpers" who believes the world is only about 2-3,000 years old and that it all started with Adam and Eve? Genesis mentions Adam and Eve and Creation only a few lines apart, but there is scientific evidence that the Earth was around a long time before the dawn of Man. Even the Catholic Church believes in evolution and science.

[Krazede]

Actually the earth was created millions if not billions of years ago. Adam and Eve go back around 6,000 years by generational tracking but even that could be incorrect.. The issue here is that God didn't mention when after creating the planet that he created Adam and Eve. If you knew anything at all about the Bible you would see the story of creation in the 1st chapt. of Gene. and the creation of Adam and Eve in the 2nd Chapt.

[Decebal825]

I'm sorry to have to tell you this but carbon dating showed that the shroud is a fake.

[paulagloria]

sorry to tell you this but the man who invented it said the readings were not accurate and couldn't be as they were testing the mold and not the fabric which to date they have not figured out how to remove the mold from. does that make sense to you?

[GreenTea200]

the shroud has been proven scientifically to not be a fake. it is genuine. the only thing left for those who want to debate further is whether they accept it as a remnant from the Resurrection process experienced by Jesus.

read more at this site, shroudstory(dot)com

it's very helpful.

[Deesrickchevrolet]

Actually, the part they test had been repaired, One of the guy's tested it was shown by a couple here in the States. It will on be on the discovery channel. Even the guy that tested it did not beleive them at first, but found they were correct. So the part they used for carbon dating had been repaired, so it through the test off. He did a report on the finding and passed it on to others, then cancer killed him. They said it's up to the church to allow another test.

It Is the burial cloth

[Deesrickchevrolet]

Watch this one, Don't listen to a bunch of crap. This is only part six, but yu can see coins over Christ eye of the time Ponchus pilot, and plack around his neck that's says the king of Jews.

Just like the Bible says, imagine that.

Believe it or not, I DO!

[MAIKESIERRA]

A powerful rival for Mr. Hurtak, Maike Sierra known in Chile and part(report) of the world for his(her,your) experiences of contact with the ufos and his(her,your) crew members who 2006 I achieve the record mas big in the world of the phenomenon ufo obtained by a person.

[MAIKESIERRA]

the biblie is not for sel , hurtak is not crist

Hurtak go home

fromm Chile

[dingorex]

DaVinci wasn't born until 1452,the Shroud is documented in France in the 1300s,so DaVinci could not have been the artist.

[dingorex]

I did not mean to imply it is a work of artistry,Isabela Pikzic(I can't spell and the book is downstairs)gave me a book on the Symposium of 1990ish and the blood was contact formed first with the oxidation dehydration of the top fibrils being untouched under the blood stains so a hypothetical painter would have had to paint realistic,anatomically correct blood stains,pools,flows then paint the body image without a base medium,,people this is a 3D image of the Resurrection!!!

[paulagloria]

could you call me 212.982.0021? I want to learn more from you

[dingorex]

I got most of my information from all the books,Shroud Spectrum newsmag,the net,so my info is recycled in a sense. Isabel Piczek is an artist/physicist,her paper was called Physics and Theology,The True Function of the Shroud Deciphered,,Barry Schwortz of shroud,dot,com would be able to get in touch with her,,The Case for Christ's Resurrection is the 3D DVD that was on YouTube but was pulled,Oh and I'm not Catholic anymore.

[paulagloria]

a vid on the shroud was pulled!!!! I am amazed why?

[guydecervens]

You are trying to say the 1988 carbon dating of the Turin Shroud is in doubt! Phew! Read the Qur'an, Jesus was not crucified! It has been a hoax all along. Why? The Romans, after they killed the original Christians, claimed the prophet Jesus as a 'God' for the Assyrian Sun-God innovation. The 'shroud' was made by Leonardo Da Vinci using an amino-carbonyl reaction. Wake up Paula!

[paulagloria]

I studied with a miracle master in India who cut the head off a bird and reattached it. Therefore I look deeper than your average good hearted liberal interpretation of Jesus.  To me it is ALL about the ressurection, anything else about Christianity (including the Islamic denial) is not the Christianity I'm talking about.

[guydecervens]

The 'Miracle Master' in India obviously carried out a slight of hand on you Paula. How much money did he extract from the poor dead chiken he used to dupe you? The 'Islamic Denial' that Jesus was not in fact crucified was not just Islamic until Rome murdered 14 million people to stamp out the 'Heresy'. The death and 'Ressurection' was only set in place to fit in with the HO-Rah/Osiris/Dionysian cult of those suberting the real Message of Jesus.

[paulagloria]

ntact for resurrection to take place. So resurrection is not a Christian thing only BUT to get Christianity going I bet it was part of the PF needed to co-opt who ever wanted to whatever irrelevant of the facts and life of the saint.

[paulagloria]

see dingorex comment above. another thing...this does not show it was Jesus so the Koran could be right about that....this shows someone did it. I just saw a reference book (which I couldn't check out of the library) that referred to LUK a small bone at the base of the spine that needs to be kept i

[paulagloria]

the reference book was on esoteric Judiasm

[westframe]

I wonder why these types of discussions come across so serious. That's all ;)

[paulagloria]

what were you expecting when you came to this vid?

[westframe]

What I would like to see is a little bit of humor in these types of discussions. I can't imagine Enoch being only a serious energy with ancient roots. I imagine angels to be funny and very present... thanks ;)

[paulagloria]

ha-ha-ha velen dank!

[max4099]

help is on its way red lights and ? you will see(dummy)

[paulagloria]

I missed this comment....what do you mean?

[peterthesongman]

There is the Creator in a sense we are co creators but if we adjoin to Him, His will this is the only way to find hapiness. 'The secret' is the film that elucidates how to get 'things' in the world, not one word is spoken of our Creator

[paulagloria]

good point...this is an aspect of one of the limitations of that movie and why it does not really help people to change things except to indicate that such knowledge is there is valuable. thanks for stopping by!

[dimphil]

Our power over the world is tremendous. Jesus said that if we believed we could say to that mountain be cast into the sea and it would be done. I especially like Jesus telling his disciple to fish and there in the mouth of the fish was the coin to pay the taxes of both of them. Also the Bible states that Jesus did not need mans testimony about man because he knew what was in a man. And yet He still loved us and gave his body and blood as a sacrifice for our atonement.

[AMOS2809]

Jesus is God!I love you Jesus.

[agilbosco]

excuse us, paula gloria.

This was my daugther yesterday, writing you in german.

she dìdn`t know that her comment actually would rieach you.

Amaying topic, indeed the shroud of turin .

Is your Name Messer?

we are living in Germany.

With regards,

abel gil

[paulagloria]

now I'm really curious.. what does leute mean? I'm in NYC...funny how when you resonate w a topic it feels like the person is close!

[agilbosco]

Leute means ..people

She wrote: Hi, people

[paulagloria]

what a sweet energy is inspired to come up when the topic is lofty. Hi yourself!

[agilbosco]

hi leute

[paulagloria]

a little abstract for me...

[swordslanga]

god bless you puala

[paulagloria]

be sure to go to David Rolfe's trailer

(davidrolfe0 in the vid responses above)on his soon to be released new film on the shroud. I'm very eager to see it and he has been gracious about the fair use of his older film...