Refuting Darwin's Evolution at San Diego's Natural History Museum in Balboa Park 1

[pernch]

"Man himself has evolved from some smiley creature that crawled out of the ocean millions of years ago."... as opposed to being walking clumps of dirt that God breathed on as we are presented in the bible. Walking clumps of dirt that are inherently evil apart from God... By comparison, I don't see how evolution's position is so offensive or crazy.

[tdrothrock]

@pernch macro evolution is offensive because it is a lie. its a poor attempt to rob God of His glory in creation and deludes people into thinking that they will never face God with all their evil. God is merciful why not just accept mercy? Why resist His mercy in Christ? Who can comprehend God? none. So we just make up fanciful stories that make no sense. Something came from nothing and randomly created all matter and life? That is crazy and worse ... deadly.

[pernch]

@tdrothrock Of course if you try to squish the process of "macro-evolution" that would take millions of years into a few milljennia it would seem crazy, even offensive. But for arguments sake, let's say that "macro-evolution" didn't occur. Lets say that all of the species of animals alive now (as well as the billions of species that are extinct) were created as they are and that was undeniable proof of a divine creator. How do we know which creator it was? Yahweh? Allah? Zeus? Thor? Ra?

[tdrothrock]

@pernch the fact that anything exist should cause reasonable people to believe that their is a creator. Either the creator is eternal or the universe is eternal. Something cannot come from nothing. Science tells the universe is finite. If that is true there must be an eternal creator. After careful study of the Bible I believe it is the God of the Bible. I have considered other religions too. None appear to have pure motives and an honest beginning. My opinion doesnt matter only the truth.

[pernch]

@tdrothrock EVERY religion has shady parts of its history. Christianity is no exception and you don't have to look far to find them. Of course we'll never know the full extent of it because so many opposing sources were snuffed out by early Christians. What exactly do you mean by "pure motives and honest beginning"?

[tdrothrock]

@pernch The Christian faith is built upon a collection of writings by many men over many years. These writings can be validated by history and science. Islam was begun by one man thought to be a lunatic and murderer himself. His writings in the Quran call for murder of Jews and Christians. Mormons again one man. JW's there own writing have proven inconsistent. Many false prophesies of the end. Buddhism and Hinduism are man centered and unable to be validated.

[pernch]

@tdrothrock There are passages in the bible that also call for the deaths of others (witches, unruly children, anyone who tries to get you to worship anyone but Yahweh, etc), and Moses, the lawgiver himself, was ordered to kill many on His behalf, not to mention the Egyptian he killed on his own. Speaking of Moses, is there even any historical evidence for the Egyptian Exodus? Surely there would be mountains of evidence to support this story, as well as all of the others.

[evilbob2200]

@pernch dont forget darwin was a devout christian

[gusb232]

talkorigins(DOT)org/faqs/faq-t­ransitional.html

also search donexodus,

Kanbane52,

Ken miller

all christians that have great info about evolution.

[FiverBeyond]

This is so sad. I visit Balboa Park and the Natural History Museum now and then, and they do a great job of running a public museum, mixing good scientific credential with good appeal to the common viewer.

I'd advise everyone to go visit it when you have a free afternoon. Just go in the opposite exit from where this man is.

[Cardiffdance]

Only the old and tired Creationist fallacies, then...

I was hoping for something new and exciting. Nevermind!

[conallk]

tdroth: "This fossil record is highly speculative."

Please explain, and on what grounds do you say this? This is akin to the smear statement "The Bible is wrong" without backing it up.

Consider tetrapods. We have ancestral fossil fish in older rock strata (back to 400 mya), then transitional forms (Tiktaalik,380 mya), then tetrapods (360-370 mya).

The same holds for 100s of studied taxa: mammals, birds, bivalves, gastropods, etc.

What reading have you actually done on evolution?

[conallk]

Post #3 of 3.

6:43 -- misquoting Darwin, a favorite ploy of Mr. Benson.

In Chap. 6 of the Origin of Species, Darwin sets up a difficult question to be examined:

"To suppose that the eye ... could have been formed by natural selection, seems, I freely confess, absurd in the highest possible degree."

Darwin then goes on to propose a set of modifications that could lead to the evolution of the eye, starting from simple photoreceptors. "Rejection of God" is not apparent in Darwin's discussion.

[conallk]

Post #2 of 3.

More falsehood.

4:47 -- mutations are a "loss of information" and "never produce new structure, function."

I encourage Mr. Benson to consult a basic genetics textbook.

Mutations can involve the insertion of duplicated DNA, the deletion of DNA, or substitutions of existing DNA. Errors in meiosis can lead to the multiplication of the entire genome (polyploidy).

Mutations can have beneficial, harmful, or neutral effects, shown by countless exp'ts on fruit flies, bacteria, etc.

[conallk]

Post #1 of 3.

This is just outright embarrassing. Mr. Benson can glorify Christ without spreading misinformation. Is he deliberately being deceitful, or is he just uninformed?

4:27 -- transitional forms "don't exist" in the fossil record. WRONG.

* There are now many transitional fossils between dinosaurs (NOT modern lizards) and birds, including Sinornis and Microraptor.

* Transitional fossil betwen fossil lobe-finned fish and earliest tetrapod: Tiktaalik (Shubin et al. 2006. Nature).

[tdrothrock]

This fossil record is highly speculative. We have monkeys and chimps. There DNA varies from ours by a few % but yet we dramatically different. Why did all the transitional forms between our supposed common ancestor go extinct? Shouldn't some still be living? If not shouldn't 1000's of fossils much closer to our current state be found in the fossil record?

[tdrothrock]

If we did evolve and it all happened randomly without a any governing thought or being where does all this ultimately end. We over populate the earth and all die? We become geniuses and live forever? or until some random astroid hits our planet and kills us all. Or the ever expanding universe disappears and becomes?

[Danmill23]

tdr, Are you not they guy who lost his son? What was the meaning of that event? Why did it happen? Where is the purpose? Your excuse is to claim "god" (who is in control) "moves in mysterious ways" Your desire is for meaning. You want someone in control. You want it so bad, even when something happens that seems out of control, random and bad, (I assume) you believe it really is under control, just you can see how. 911 was not under government control Kennedy was not killed by conspiracy. ...

[Danmill23]

There is both NO-ONE and EVERYONE in the drivers seat.

Within chaos is order and within order is chaos.

The two go together hand in hand.

--------------------------

Evolution has a random element but it also has a STRICT discerning and governing factor.

I fear you keep yourself in a state of ignorance about evolution. This keeps it at arms length. It also allows you to spread false information without it being a direct lie. This is how to fight a loosing battle.

[Danmill23]

You have lost.

Give in and investigate how god made the animals.

or

Believe it was magic and spread your stupid, pointless, half lies to all the choir and make your cherished god look like as bigger fool as you.

Harsh but 100% truth.

Wake up..

[tdrothrock]

Ha! Lost what? I am not trying to win a thing. Are you trying to pick a fight with me:-) Again what is your point? Give in and investigate how God made animals? What does that mean? I am not in a total state of ignorance nor am I a liar. I have read and gone back and forth with those who cherish anything that they think will undermine a belief in God. It always ends the same. Fill in the unknowns with assumptions that make your point. One day you may stand before this God and hear "you lost".

[Danmill23]

This is the thing about deluded people with no ability to assess facts, they always think they are right.

(Ok I'm going overboard here)

Dude if you think that the evolution stuff you provided in this video is a reflection of you knowing what you are talking about ... "You are lost" and you can hear this truth now whilst alive.

"I have read ..."

Great defence TD. I have read as well. Your lack of specifics is very telling.

[Danmill23]

Yes I am (in one sense) trying to pick a fight. But tell me Td what is you video hoping to achieve.

Td I feel I can gloat because either way I win. Either you join us and accept evolution (BTW you can still keep your god delusion if you wish) and that wat we have one less person from the bronze age pissing in the font of human knowledge and achievement or you can continue to blather uslessness. The cool thing about the latter is your ineptitude makes the effort pointless. (and your wrong)

[tdrothrock]

Humble yourself before God you win. Maintain your ignorant pride and loose your very soul. Do you realize how foolish your argument actually is? I may be putting words in your mouth but you guys say pretty much the same thing. There was a big bang and tada the earth. then a soupy mix randomly appears. Then life randomly appears. then life randomly diversifies and becomes what we see today. Now that's miraculous!

[tdrothrock]

You like the whole name calling thing? Makes you feel superior in every way I suppose? Very telling of what? See evolutionist love delve into the details and get lost. All the while missing the big picture? Where did we come from and where are we going. Something cannot come from nothing so either the universe is eternal or a creator is eternal. universe random? God creator? Both r hard to accept but only one makes sense.

[Danmill23]

"There was a big bang and tada the earth."

"Then life randomly appears."

Td these are cartoons. They are partially derived from ignoracne and partially the happend so you can make your self feel more confident by ridicule.

Have I refered to you sky daddy? No.

Td I understand what you believe but you do not understand what you fight against. But amazily your have the blind naked ballsy overconfidence to think you know the thruth on matters you've only really heard about.

[Danmill23]

I'm going to give you a gift Td.

The gift of knowledge. Visit my shoes for a time.

-----------

"Christians are against homosexuality, but what they don't realize is that christ married a man. Sure the marrage was never consumated. I understand that, but IN THE BIBLE christ married a man. This fact alone destroys their arguments about gay marrage and homosexuality in general. The stupid hyporacy of these deluded christians is amazing to me. Insanity!"

How do you repond to this argument?

[tdrothrock]

Are you nuts? Jesus married a man in the Bible? What are you talking about? I am sure some play on words. I dont only have problems with homosexuality but proud pastors, religious arrogance, and well I ll stop. I am as guilty of sin as the next guy. Thats what Christianity is all about. We sinned, Christ paid the penalty on our behalf to demonstrate God's justice and mercy.

[Danmill23]

Let's do this slowly td. I am trying to teach you something. Why do you think I'm nuts IF I claim Jesus married a man AND is says so in the bible. Why am I nuts? ------------------- Let me make another example claim. Lets say you say I'm nuts for claiming Jesus married a man in the bible. I respond... "You christians don't know what you believe. Read you bible. It's amazing you don't even know about Jesus's marrage. AND HE MARRIED A MAN. A male. unbelieveable" --- how do you respond?

[tdrothrock]

Well I am headed off to sleep for tonight but cant wait to hear where you are going with this. But how do I respond? Given that I do read my Bible through a couple times each year, and that Jesus did not marry a man, unless you are playing with words, I would respond: you are yanking my chain and trying to prove some point that is yet unclear to me. I have my guesses and you got a jump on me but let's see where this goes.

[Danmill23]

Ok you got it.

I'm Yanking your chain.

I'm making some deeply clever play on words.

Anyone who made sush a stupid claim that it is written in the bible that Jesus married a man has CLEARLY not read the bible.

They are grossly miss informed.

Not only am I confronted with this exact situation by people professing this and that about evolution. I can see that they are wrong in sense that they lack any depth in understanding what is proposed or wht they are arguing against.

Cont (A)

[Danmill23]

Cont (A)

Now if I try and correct someone I get all types of resistance and diversions and giant load of ignorance masquerading as knowledge.

Weather I use the carrot or the stick none of these people ever respond. Not only do they refuse to accept evolution THEY EVEN REFUSE TO UNDERSTAND IT.

This is the ultimate point. Refusal to understand, whilst confidently arguing against is proof of dogmatic, closed minded, blind silly resistance.

My stupidity is thinking I can help people understand

[gusb232]

@Danmill23 HUH married a Dude? Chapter and verse please.

[tdrothrock]

Cartoons? What do cartoons have to do with origins of the Universe? Confident by ridicule? i learned that from you. LOL

The fact Im breathing says to me there must be a God that created me. Again something did not come from nothing. Or do you think it did? Oh you dont know and hope science will find an answer one day. If something cannot come from nothing you got a little problem. Something is eternal. if that is so we could never arrive at today. Could we?

[tdrothrock]

I thought I did. Maybe you missed it in my earlier comment?

[CerasoliOne]

Darwin postulated that man sprang from the apes. This guy proves that we all didn't make it.

[Danmill23]

Guys this is a perfect example of the oldest and weakest arguments against evolution.

Ironic that it takes place in front of a museum.

[tdrothrock]

Old and weak arguments? Old yes. Weak no. Why are none of the transitional forms leading to modern humans still alive. We have a wide variety of apes, chimps, monkeys today but nothing remotely close to a human. Why not. That's just humans we could go through 1000's of species and find the same.

[Danmill23]

"Weak no"

Explain how you find these arguments not weak. I am seriously interested. Why are these arguments "not weak". I really am interested.

Please explain.

[tdrothrock]

He argues there is a God that created us with a purpose. That's not weak but powerful and requires less faith than believing randomness created all that I see. Randomness generates chaos and destruction. If the universe is eternal and randomly created how did this day arrive. Going back eternally or infinitely we would never arrive at today. Its absurd at every level. There must be a God. He must have created us. He must have a purpose.

[Danmill23]

no lol

First he does use WEAK, old arguments that have never been effective in the past.

Second if you do not understand why your claim that one thing requires more "faith" than another this is SO MONUMENTALLY IRRELEVANT then you have just proven how truly inept and ineffectual you are in this debate.

Please delete all my comments. Ignore what I say and carry on.