every horse is different so you should always try different ways to get the message across to them. I myself dont use anythin more than a round pen, lead rope, halter, and lunge whip (mainly for looks) but to each their own. May i just take the time to say though the owner of this stallion, Catwalk, intrusted him to Pat on his own will. There for it seems to me that if the owner didnt like what was goin on he could have stepped in and taken his horse out of there, right or wrong? You decide.
...while he learned his methods from others. He knows a lot but he lies a lot in his videos... Talking biological and ethological nonsense about horses... I understand its easier for people to accept his methods that way, but I find it distasteful... Anyways, people, keep and open mind, dont be brainwashed. Neither by his love nor by his hatred.Follow his methods, it should be great, just dont believe everything he says. keep your eyes open! please.dont tell me that only dumb people can do nhs!
mkay,while I believe he is great at what he does..."When the micropohne fell off,I should have stopped.I'm sorry for allowing confusion to evolve" Need translation? 'I'm sorry that I couldnt talk bullshit to you as I usually do'."no one works harder than I do to make the world a better place for horses" pretty hard to measure though is it?he is the loudest one,definitely.I have to thank him for introducing the world of NHS to me, but Im not an idiot. he takes a lot of credit for himself
Although i do not believe in any abuse to my horses when training them, I manage to get the same (or better) results than anyone I know that uses the parelli method. My thought? The parelli method is just a way for the Parelli family to make money.
While I do think that Parelli has some very good methods for training horses, his work with Catwalk was just atrocious. He gave the horse a few minutes to accept something it was frightened of, and then went straight to trying to force the issue using restraint and pain. Any other horseman would have been much more patient, gone back to basics and worked on approach and retreat methods to gain his trust and respect.
He is a fake! He showed his true colors his own horse rings his tail with unhappiness, he prays on the novice horseman and laughs his way to the bank!
The whole apology reads like a politician skirting the question.
TWITCHING and HOBBLING a horse is "natural horsemanship?"
So...he just BLAMES the horse?
JOHN LYONS worked with a horse that reared & struck out at anyone who tried to touch its ears. He never used a twitch nor a hobble. He used training and patience.
Shame on Parelli for skirting the question and for resorting to his old cowboy ways.
I shutter to think of how he finally got the horse bridled
Woohoo, the horse rears once, backs off a couple of times - because he is abused?! Seriously... if a horse wants to get away, he gets away! 600kg desperados are not stopped by a rope around the front leg... "abuse" means that the horse would have no way out of a painful situation than going into another situation. In this case, the horse could choose between pressure and attention - and even when he wasn't attentive, the pressure wasn't constant.
@Steedrider Hopefully, some people's horses never show their owners what their true nature is like - it would scare those people to death. As my old boss would say: "The most dangerous horses are those with a snoozy-lazy character - cause one day, they'll wake up."
Pat is a fake!Did he say the horse tricked him?He claims to know how horse's think,the whole "two brains"thing.His lack of knowing about horse's had that horse there,meaning he ment to have trained horse that he says has problems.Not a real problem horse.
@myblindhorse Yeah, no kidding. For someone who sells thousands of dollars of "horsenality" ideas, you'd think he'd have a better idea as to how to keep it simple stupid and not resort to cowboy twitches and hobbling.
Parelli is for beginners who are afraid of horses, he teaches people basics and it's a great schtick. This is however a nasty example of a showman trying to cram days or weeks worth of handling a damaged horse into a 30 minute segment to wow his fans. Rule one is patience, even he knows that, but we start to believe our own *&^#$% and then things like this happen. I'm not a Parelli hater, I'm a hater of phony's and zealots who don't care what they see, they just believe what they want to believe
Parelli is one of the best things that has happened to the American horse scene. These natural horsemanship trainers have a tough assignment: they have to teach amateur owners with limited skill how to improve their relationship with a horse, using methods that are most likely to keep horse and owner safe.
What most amateurs don't know is that there are some horses that need handling which appears to be abusive to the inexperienced. Kudos to Parelli for seeing this one through.
Guna throw in my 1 cent. 1st, I admire and am thankful for everyone that tries to make things better between horse and human.Thank U Mr. Parelli, for ur heart, ur intentions & results. We're all students and fortunate to have found the secret the privilage of learning from The Magnificent, Majestic HORSE.There are other ways/tweaks/understanding & everyone aplies it dif. I wud point to Klaus Hempfling. His methods r'nt 4 ever1,nor Pats. Both gifted. Which is most natural/best4the horse & results
well I just watched that video before I read this and guess I was pretty well right. I figured you had just gotten in deeper than planned for a clinic. Horse needed more time than you had and it just looked like 2 day horse "abuse" cause you did the same thing the next day. Well if thats what the horse needs thats what he/she needs. Catwalk didnt seem to me to be trying desperately to get away other than one occasion but it didnt last long. So he couldnt have felt to threatened.
I have read a few comments saying that it's nearly impossible to never get frustrated with a horse and would just like to say, last week I spent 5 1/2 hours trying to do a join up with a problem horse. I spent nearly the entire time singing Pink Floyd songs in my head and thinking about life, my next steps and all that jazz.
I never got the horse to hook on, had to call it a day when he finally just stopped and looked at me. I never felt frustration though, even when I saw the blisters.
"This comment has received too many negative votes" It's sad that people feel they have to resort to censorship and silencing unpopular views, just because those views differ from theirs. MrPonyMrDarcy's comment wasn't rude or even disrespectful - it just expressed a different viewpoint. To the cowardly censors, I say shame on you!
@fburton8 "cowardly censors" you should be ashamed for one it just received too many negative votes. YOU CAN READ IT IF YOU HIT SHOW!. So it has not been censored You yourself throw about people having imagination. you have one too I guess. Usually I respect(even if I don't agree with it your opinion) as you offer a discussion.
Two it is a young person how do we know it was not voted down cause of another reason like other children like a cyber bickering. WE DON"T KNOW. cont..
@mlposten "it has not been censored" You are right - the comment wasn't censored like it was actually deleted. I apologize for my inaccurate use of the word. I do think it was cowardly though, because it goes against the spirit of open discussion and debate. Let's say it smacks of censorship. Maybe it was just children cyber bickering - nice phrase, btw :-)
@fburton8 Thank you. You are right that it goes against the spirit of debate. I think youtube made the mistake for just because a comment receives negative votes it should be hid. To me it makes me want to see what was said, but that is me I guess. lol
And children cyber bickering, I don't know if you have facebook but it is rampant there. lol
@fburton8 I personally did not see anything wrong with the comment sa it was thier opinion but maybe others did and it is others opinion to vote it down. So in my opinion don't go making mountains out of mole hills.
what he's saying is exactly opposing what he did. the horse was terrified and he FORCED him to stay with him. I saw it. so don't say I cant have my opinion!
I have also done some parelli at pony club and the woman proceeded to whack another girl's horse with the 'carrot stick' before we intervened. I do not believe that parelli is the best natural horsemanship, and I have tried several. everyone is entitled to their P.O.V, but this is mine
Sounds like Catwalk was an excellent demonstration of how difficult it can be even for a top notch professional to change a horse with deep seated fear issues who has successfully defended that fear for many years. Pat needed to take away the horse's defenses or he'd never have any incentive to face his fear. Doesn't look or sound like abuse to me at all.
@josietrott "Pat needed to take away the horse's defenses or he'd never have any incentive to face his fear." To me that seems an odd statement to make. What incentive do you have in mind?
I think Pat Parelli and his methods are responsible for helping a lot of horses and owners become better because of them. Anyone who has worked with horses knows and understands what is being done here. They are'nt pets they are 1200 lbs of muscle that can hurt or kill you in an instant. If that's what it takes to get respect it will make a better horse rather than one who will end up in a feedlot because it is unmanageable.
@hollycabolly1 "Anyone who has worked with horses knows and understands what is being done here." I can't agree with that, sorry. I've worked with horses, including some headshy ones, and it is not at all clear why Pat was doing this to Catwalk rather than simple desensitization. (I would also use counter-conditioning, but am I right in thinking Pat doesn't do this?) At least, I haven't seen a full explanation yet - maybe it's on a DVD now?
@fburton8 Maybe because desensitization or counter-condtioning takes days or weeks, not hours, and Pat was in a demonstration and expected to make a change within an hour give that "normal" horses would have made the change in attitude/fear/response in that time frame. I say "normal" because all horses brought to demo's have problems, but as Pat pointed out, this one was in the top 3 of the thousands of 'very difficult' horses he's ever worked with.
@josietrott "Maybe because desensitization or counter-condtioning takes days or weeks, not hours," No, done properly desensitization takes a few hours at most, maybe with some repeat sessions to cement the lesson. With counter-conditioning a horse with deep seated fear can be turned around very quickly. You'd be surprised.
...capable of, for example building a true friendship and real mutual communication with humans, the horses will have to suffer. The video of Catwalk showes how little understanding of the horse is involved here and how much of egoistic human wishes. I think everyone should ask himself: how can anyone who wants to dominate be a true friend? Think about it. The horse is far more than just a ''stimuli - reaction object''.
All the traditional and also NH ways of treating the horses have the same purpose: to make a horse a slave to a human. So this video is not a surprise at all. But it is really sad that with all the available knowledge about the anatomy, psychology and intelect of the horse most of the people still treat those noble animals as the mere objects who have to serve their personal goals. As long as people will be ''blind'' an won't realize how intellectual beings horses are and what are they really..
I could tell from the video that the horse came with major head issues. If Pat had not persisted the way he did, the horse would have learned that he could do "x" and the human would leave him alone. Humans inadvertently teach horses lessons they do not want them to learn all the time with that very method.
I have been around horses for 31 years and what was on that video was blown way out of proportion. I am not a Parelli student however, I respect his work. His method has kept a lot of people from all skill levels from getting hurt and having a better relationship with Horses. Firstly, these are on avg 1200lb animals and Secondly, this was a stallion they are very different from a mare or gelding. Sometimes you have to try something different for the betterment of the animal, he was not hurt.
There is always a risk in demonstrating handling techniques in public. What one horse might accept during a private session changes when you put it on display in front of a crowd. The energy levels change, the horse reacts accordingly. Most of the time a handler can overcome that extra stress. Sometimes the horse cannot. Hindsight is better than 20/20 vision. In this scenario it may have been best to lay off, give the horse a more private venue to learn. The horse changed the game.
@PaisleyJones "love how all the negative posts have no thumbs up and the postives have at least 65 +... what does that tell you then?" Vote stuffing by Parelli fans? Really, I wouldn't read too much into the votes either way!
/ok i'm not buying it 'give the horse time it needs... no force used' YOU TIED ITS LEG UP... oh yeah no force, plenty of time -.- well done parelli, never liked you, now i hate you.
So Parelli managed to screw the horse up even more by trying to force it into doing something it was scared of and people are saying he has great methods? That horse wouldn't have fought if he would've taken a step back and worked more slowly. He seemed to be trying to show off and it looked like he was losing his head the more that horse was acting up, which only makes the horse act up more.17 years experience here and I'm going with Monty Roberts' work instead.
everyone can make a mistake and learn from it, thats part of the process, there is no way he can be perfect every single time he works with a new horse. If for the majority of his cases he is helping and treating "problem" horses instead of having them sold off at an auction, then he's doing a great job.
Woooooooow, people. So many of these comments just disgust me. One, Pat Parelli has great methods which have actually helped a large amount of people gain a better bond with their horses. Sure, some people don't use these methods, but that doesn't mean they don't work. In ONE session, he used a method that he doesn't usually, but he wasn't "abusing" him. Abuse is sending horses off to slaughter, leaving them without food or water, whipping them till they bleed. Get over yourselves.
Parelli, and themethods, are a joke!!! RTTH(Road to the horse) 2011, where Pat got bucked off when he pushed his colt too far too fast, he had any evidence of that removed from the internet. If he's such an honest clinician, why wouldn't he have sucked up his pride, and let it go??
He does a good job of making it look good, but there are HOLES in his training. A few of his "demo's" have proven that!!
Holy crap people, can a human not make mistakes? Do you honestly expect every horseman to accomplish goals perfectly? We make mistakes so we can grow. Pat Paralli admitted his wrong and thought about how he would do it differently in the future. Give the guy the credit he deserves. Those who continue to bash this wise gentlemen even after this apology are the ones who are in the wrong. Move on! I don't practice Paralli, but I think he takes everything to heart. Why ruin that?
There are hundreds of horses out there who aren't on a crowded trailer to the slaughter house in Mexico because of the Parelli's, people who were ready to give up on problem horses or those who were no longer riding have found they can have a better relatioship with their horse and enjoy them in a partnership, play with them etc, so lighten up all you criticizers and haters, there are many methods out there to explore, choose what suits you but make sure the horse comes first.
Oh, and he obviously did something wrong or he wouldn't have written an open letter about it people...duh. There were a lot of people who walked out of this demonstration and were disgusted by what they saw. For those of you saying everyone makes mistakes..thats like saying "I abuse my kids sometimes, but everyone makes mistakes right?" Give me a break people...he did wrong and he knows it and thats why he took the time to write an open letter. I don;t forgive people who treat animals this way.
@FrillySlayerPig Give it a rest. I doubt you have any friends with that kind of attitude. You're blowing this out of proportion. What paralli did was hardly a slap on the hand. You make it seem he BEAT the horse, which clearly he didn't. He admits that the method he used was probably a little more than the horse can handle. He understands what he needs to do next time. What more do you want? Get over yourself miss I'm-so-pefect. The guy has more guts to admit his wrong than any guy I know.
Oh you mean using a twitch and a rope to tie the horses leg and FORCE a bridal on his face when he is scared of it like you did at your last workshop? People walked out they were so disgusted. If PRESSURE is the only way to get a horse to do what you want then why does Klaus Ferdinand Hempfling able to control horses from all over the world without even a bridal or any FORCEFUL methods. Hempfling uses BODY LANGUAGE which is how horses communicate. You're ignorant.
Ignorance abounds in this world. The ones that do not respect that a horse can think and change in an instance are called dead people. Some "horse predator" instilled the fear in Catwalk.
i've seen mistakes made by ALL,and i mean ALL!!! horsemanship clinicians.and it has always been the immature who are quick to point fingers,criticize,or accuse them of abuse.but it is fellow horse lovers who sincerely ask,"have you figured out and fixed the problem yet?"like gossiping wives ye who criticize with ridicule.petty as politicians.but there are always more lazy serfs who quickly wag their heads against the successful diligent.
I want to know if his wife is such an "expert dressage" queen in her own right, why is she always cowering behind her husband whenever a horse has a difference of opinion on what exactly is his (the horse's) idea? She's useless.
echo3rhythm - You may think they've made the world a more dangerous place for horses and humans but its clear that you have no idea what your talking about. Maybe if you stopped being such an ignorant tosser for 5 minutes you'd look into something before forming an opinion about it.
i love you pat keep up the good work i have done natural for 6 years and loved every moment of it and some times you have to have bad days like every one :)
I think pat parelli is a brilliant man and he doesn't abuse horses. If you don't have the same opinion, fine, but don,t come hating on him. What does it change? nothing. Hate is no good and it only hurts you.
I doubt we can say some person has better methods and results -period-.
The Parelli method works well for me, and I think we don't have to ALL use the same method. If parelli doesn,t work for you, if you don't like it, no one can force you.
But hating is really stupid. Why spend your energy on hating someone or a method? What will it change? I never abused my horse he has never been harmed or anything and he's in a much better shape now that I use the parelli method than he ever was.
ok heres the thing.... a horse of that size is a dangerous horse and although love is good,respect is better...if anyone who bitched about that video knew anything about horses AT ALL they would be able to see that although the horse was slightly stressed,he wasnt panicky or ready to bolt at any time. I love everything about Pats methods and have used them on my own horses and have had nothing but phenominal results,and im only a level 1 at best. Nuff said
The incident with Catwalk proved to many that there is nothing "natural" about the methods used. I understand that Pat felt that this was an extreme case, but the fact that he has to resort to stronger, alternative methods to sort out the horse indicates that the original Parelli theory that their methods can be used on any horse of any age, breed, etc. is not true. I believe that there is a fine line between teaching a horse not to fear and learned helplessness, and this now has been crossed.
We love you always Pat. You and Linda HAVE DEFINITELY made the world a better place for horses and humans. Keep up the awesome work you do. Be proud of yourselves and ignore the haters... Its just tall poppy syndrome.
Too bad Pat Parelli has taken so much flak over this but when you're the best you're at the top of the heap & a pretty big target & unfortunately that's the way losers and idiots react! This was an extremely bad off horse....why not take your anger out on the previous predators who created this situation? Anyway, thanks for the explanation Pat. You have made the world a much better place for horses & the humans who love them!!! God Bless You always!!!
Hi, I have had horses and children. All show the greats love and respect toward me. Why? The answer is just plain horse sence. Never react but, always respond. Make the correction eaqual to the act. I think Pat Parelli is a good horseman. Thank you kindly, TJ Hunter
lol this sounds like a really fun horse to gain the trust of good luck parelli :) ive seen worse handling i still highly respect you and for all those that oppose not just parelli but cliton and chris and many others you need to be more open minded and see more situations. not all horses are calm and gentle and just go along with what you tell them they are allllllll different. some are very testy and you cant always predict what a horse is going to do you have to have a back up plan. :)
@giengremmen didn't think of that, I guess dale carnegie didn't know that much about birds. point he was making was not letting your ego get in the way of what you should be doing, or at least thats what I get from it.
Some horses are a pain to handle and work with. I had a horse with a bad attitude and showed out worse than catwalk and actually kicked more people and dogs than she should have. I would liked to seen parelli work with her. You can only do so much with difficult horses.
In the late '80s, we hosted a Parelli clinic at a ranch in the SF Bay Area. He worked a young (and known agressive) paint stud in with a full round pen of horses. When the stud tried to mount the horse he was riding, he isolated it, had his assistant work with it, and refused to work with it further. He laid blame for the animals behavior here: he said that women shouldn't own studs and asked if she were cycling. She'd had a hysterectomy @ 13 due to cancer. Lost me then & never went back. Sorry.
@petrodvoretz Ya, I completely agree that he should stop if the horse comes to a good stopping point. But the situation doesn't necessarily make that easy for him to do so I'm not saying that what he did was justified, that's just unfortunately what happens as a result for these trainers.
See, the problem is trainers like Parelli who conduct clinics are under pressure because they are working in front of an audience. If he were working with the horse in a quiet and private environment it would be easier for him to keep his cool and perhaps come to a stopping point for the day and pick everything up the next day. But he can't do that in front of an audience. It certainly puts more pressure on the trainer if he has to make a demonstration of it.
@shannikki100 Whoever it is that puts on demonstrations has to deal with the pressure or don't put on the demonstration. If the best thing to do was to stop and work with the horse (animal) at a later date, then that is what Parelli should have done, and explained to the audience for the reason, which at the same time would teach the audience to do the same if they found themselves in a similar predicament. The demonstrators are under pressure, but so is everyone else in their lives.
Pat, I do believe that you used the completely correct methods to this scene. And if you didn't then i think seeing this video, that everything worked out fine and you will be more careful in the future. And guys, remember, just because he has trained horses doesn't mean that he isn't going to get frustrated sometimes. And if you know ANYTHING about horses you know what i mean. I believe that pat was correct in this scenario.
pat parelli is the best horseman alive!! if he did this, and is appologising then why keep going on about it!! no one is perfect, and just because he did the wrong thing that dosent mean the whole parelli method is wrong!?!
2 of 2 He charges people to come to his seminars and they demand and expec thim to cure the horses ills all in a day or 2, He would not attempt what he did normally as any qualifed trainer would do so. Most people are there for the hoopla and him to try and sell his product to. Give him a break, he did what nobody welse seemd to do and in the end the horse will be happier for it. Training horses is not alwasy fluffy and candy and that is the way of it.
I am not a Parelli devotee. that isn't to say I don't like his methods I find that other trainers methods work better for me. That said. I saw nothing in that video that ever crossed the line of abuse or cruelty except the abuse and cruelty the owners or prior owner of that horse did to him to get him there. either by not following thru with training or creating that situation. Pat is a fantastic trainer and is one of the biggest supporters of compassionate treatment of horses Part 1 of 2
Okay first of all, he was not hurting the horse. I know some of you disagree with this but he wasn't. I've grown up around cowboys and my grandfather has done things like that in the past with the more difficult horses. Sometimes when you tie a rope around their leg and hold it out, it helps the horse to realize what is happening and to focus more on you and what you're doing. My dad once got a horse in the ring and had to wrestle it to the ground to be able to touch it and calm it down no pain
People,packed first himself to your nose before ya judge about others! Which of you clever guys is flawless and perfect? What do you think, how to become a natural Horseman?By learning from mistakes and solutions found what Pat has certainly made!Nobody should throw stones with dirty fingers for someone!Life is a whole learning process, which will never end! Someone master the game of life, someone cannot.PS:anti-Parelli, you're just jealous that ya can't do better ;).Sorry,if my English is bad.
as a horse owner for over 30 years I have learned that not all training techniquies work for all horses. They all have the same survival instincs but the way that they react to a technique is diffrent. I have found that once a horse understands what is expected and gets over fears they will usually will do it willingly. pat has some good points as do others I try to take the good parts of their techniques and use them and for get the rest
@jozie1992 Haven't been a horse owner for 30 years...but agree with and follow the same philosophy....right now I have a 5 yr old tb gelding that I can't get to lift his right front foot due to a prolonged stone bruise that abscessed....am trying clicker training...do you have any other ideas for getting a balky 16 hh horse to pick up his foot??
@itsibitsirider Glad to hear you're trying clicker training. Have you got a good book on it, or have someone to show you how to do it properly? That's quite important or else you might be disappointed. With CT your horse should be picking up his feet willingly on cue in a couple of days - it's one of the easier things to train. Good luck!
@fburton8 Thank you so much for the encouragement...I've done clicker training with my dogs...I know you start with something they already know and reward them when they comply...then move on to the behaviour you want and reward the try...as soon as they start to do what you ask you click and reward....the problem I have with Gavin is that he's suspicious as soon as I approach his bad foot side and will move away from me...if I tie him he panics...if I get someone to hold him he panics...
yeah i get tough on my horses they kick me i kick them back and the same dam thing would happen if they were in the wild in a herd setting. If this makes me a abusive horse owner so be it but for owning horses for more than 30 years i have no problem with them wanting to be in my pocket .So carry on PAT and keep your great work up!
Pat was NOT abusing this horse HE WAS SAVING Catwalk . His owners could have decided to give up and send him to the slaughter house. PAT just proved he can make a bad horse GOOD again. Sometimes it takes more force to get though theses critters heads.The horse was not harmed and the results were positive. Lets see you try and see how far you get.
@razrbladefaerie - again, a comment from someone who has absolutely no idea of what the Parelli program is. If you're actually reading these posts, most of the posters think that Parelli people "abuse" their horses - that they're not friendly enough, that they stress their horses out by shaking the rope, or tapping them with the carrot stick - so please don't say that you want to be "tough" on your horse or you'll never hear the end of it.
Hi Pat, you are a great horseman and you have done a lot, said that, you know to well that not many horses can give trust in a couple of hours...so, by forcing this trust, everything you will build on, what will be like?
Give the horse the choice if he want to trust you and when.
@fburton8 Hi I don't remember saying match aggression with aggression???Seriously, did I? I said matching a horses "enthusiasm, power, persistance....WITHOUT BEING FORCEFUL" (matching aggression would be forceful wouldn't it--its war) Plain and simple I believe Pat felt he needed to up the anti a little to up attendance and went too far....he had to know that horse needed more time and work done with it beyond the limits of that presentation....to quote Pat, "take the time and takes...."
@chappysmom87 Hi! What you say makes complete sense. You're right that matching aggression would be forceful. I'm glad we agree on that and I apologize for misinterpreting your original statement.
I am not very happy with what happened with Catwalk at that exhibit. My big thing is that if he was such a hard, challenging horse to demo with, why are you pressuring him and yourself to the point where you use a technique that reminds me very much of what our ancestors used to train colts, that broke legs, and killed some horses. So how can you tell me that you need to "Take the time it takes so it takes less time" when you used a short cut and didn't exhibit what you preach? Just a thought.
Thanks, Pat. I like that you published this. And if I ran into a brick wall with some ruined horse I was rehabilitating, and had the opportunity to get some hands-on help from you, I still would take it in a New York second.
Genious has always seen heavy opposition from mediocrity.
Keep doing your great work Pat. - we are still a LOT of people out here who understand what it is you are doing and teaching, and our horses love us for it.
@TheAnnestube "You cannot rush, or force it or you'll push the horse over the edge"
That is what he did! he pushed the horse until it was rearing and doing all kinds of stuff!
"try another tactic" ?!
"catwalk has been successfully bridled and competed" yeah really! just a few days after this? you would not have had any time to practice and train the horse. no way!
I'm no fan of Pat Parelli but everyone totally overreacted to that. That is NOT abuse good job Pat for sticking to your guns and doing what needed to be done. All of you bridleless, barefoot, extremists have probably never dealt with a horse like that and would be completely lost if you had to deal with a stallion with behavior issues. Natural horsemanship is great...although is it EVER natural for a human to be on a horse...no...get over it.
@amybabe6188 "good job Pat for sticking to your guns" Pat certainly stuck to Catwalk's gums! Seriously, you need to be careful labelling everyone who has concerns as "extremist". As it happens, I have dealt with stallions with behaviour issues on numerous occasions and never felt at a loss as to what to do. I would love to have worked with Catwalk - he seems a nice, genuine sort of horse, not rank or prone to unprovoked aggression.
I've owned horses for over 50 years and when I saw the tape of Pat and Catwalk it is quite obvious that this horse has major problems caused by poor handleing. Stallions need to be handled a little differently that regular horses, especially ones with huge egoes. Still and always will use Pat Parelli methods.
@fisherranch6 "obvious that this horse has major problems caused by poor handleing" Agreed.
"especially ones with huge egoes" What on earth do you mean by that?! Imo, it's not appropriate or helpful to bring ego into the equation. It implies meeting force with force, aggression with aggression. Do you really think that's a good idea?
@fburton8 --don't think of 'ego' in human-terms, but in horses' terms. I think it's the lack of having a true understanding of how Parelli's philosophy is. Ego could be dominance (which is not negative) in a horse's personality. The reference to 'matching energy' is just that...'energy' but never 'agression'. Also, depending on the 'horsenality' & the situation & purpose, Parelli recommends 'calmness', 'less energy' & such-also. Check out PNH's "Horsenality" philosophy--would be helpful.
@Classifiedize "don't think of 'ego' in human-terms, but in horses' terms" Thanks for clarifying. The problem with using human words & concepts to describe horses is that (some) people will assume it means the same thing as it does with humans. That can be a massive fail (big mistake). I've worked with bold, confident, pushy, aggressive, inattentive, self-trusting-only, etc. horses - but I never met an egotistic horse.
Sounds like Parelli took the "show must go on" edict over his own principles. Well everyone has a bad day now and then, Lord knows I've lost my focus plenty of times with animals and done the wrong thing, but it sounds like it all worked out ok. But this statement would have gone over better delivered in person, with a few moments of Catwalk being handled and ridden.
I never doubted Pat...my gosh!! If ANYONE is out for the BEST OF THE HORSE, it's Pat & Linda. I first got into horses in 1999 & into PNH in 2000, though I looked into at least 3 other famous "trainers". I found "horse people" to be a very odd sort....they are almost worse than today's political climate of the Dems vs Repubs or Conservatives vs Liberals...and you have to be mighty odd to be worse than that!
I really hope all the concerned people went after the grooms and the trainer of "Catwalk" for what they did to him before Pat Parelli was asked to fix him. what the grooms and trainer did is ABUSE!
I really hope all the concerned people went after the grooms and the trainer of "Catwalk" for what they did to him before Pat Parelli was asked to fix him. what the grooms and trainer did is ABUSE!
@HeartofEquus I respect your opinion. I studied horse psychology and this is the way a horse thinks and reacts to bocy language. Try to respect other opinions and try not to get influenced by the comments in the video. If you look at the video you can see that PP is calm the whole time, there is NO ABUSE at all in this video. I dont have to convince you, if your method works, stick with it is all i can say. The horse his wellbeing comes first, whatever way you choose
@4HorsesandHolding I also agree your point of view and one smart rap is better i totally agree. but i get the fealing that people are influenced to much by the comments on the video. I would reccomend for anyone to look at this video trough their own point of view.
@4HorsesandHolding I didnt say that this horse is agressive! I said that if you do not hold your ground with persistant horses you finally get a agressive horse. If you look carefully to the video you will see that Pat doesnt get the result he wants and therefore continues. He hasnt got a moment to reward the horse yet. Please read my comments and the video carefully. It is to bad that people get influenced by the text in the video. The one who wrote it has a softer view on training
@4HorsesandHolding I am not discussing whether or not Linda is abusive. i am discussing what the comments on the video are. Pat is not abusive in the video.
@4HorsesandHolding Who is Linda? Your right about the horse owner is likely to start his problems. That is what i am trying to explane to you. If it has come this far you have to hold your ground and you MUST win or else you eventually get a agressive horse, that is when you start a psychological fight. Asking is the best and if you have a gentile horse it works. But if you have a horse that is already messed up by people you sometimes have to start this psycological fight
He is using force.. horses are using forse. I am not saying he or horses are abusive. They are using force. However, this is a shortcut and it would have been smarter to work this horse at home. Do not let his ego bother you. PP is meant to be as a basis which you can work from not to fully do it the way he does if you dont like it, be creative. If a horse has been a leader of humans all his life, it takes some persistance. Horses hit each other and pat doesnt
In a situation where both human and any horse would decide to really use force, it's unlikely that a human will be the victor. The only reason a human even stands a chance at "winning" is because of the good nature of horses. They (generally) do not want confrontation.
@4HorsesandHolding It is all about patience and asking. If asking doesnt work, you take more serious actions. The video doesnt show abuse. See my comment above please. You dont have to explane to me the way a horse thinks. I studied horse psychology and i know how the brain and body language works. I do agree with you, but this video doesnt show abuse. Mostly is shows a that there is more time needed. Asking is best, but hold your ground when you are in a dominance struggle
I dont agree that PP is using abusive tactics. Sometimes you come across horses that are true leaders and it takes a lot to convince them. Have you seen him hitting the horse? No, this is a psychological struggle. Have you ever studied horses together and especially when a new horse is introduced to other horses? That is a lot more abusive than PP shows in the video. If you want to be a leader, you have to be assertive, this is NOT abusive. Why are you so bothered by his ego? Be independent
I dont agree that PP is using abusive tactics. Sometimes you come across horses that are true leaders and it takes a lot to convince them. Have you seen him hitting the horse? No, this is a psychological struggle. Have you ever studied horses together and especially when a new horse is introduced to other horses? That is a lot more abusive than PP shows in the video. If you want to be a leader, you have to be assertive, this is NOT abusive. Why are you so bothered by his ego? Be independent.
Even if horses did "abuse" each other (which they naturally don't as a rule) - are you saying Pat isn't capable of behaving in a more reasoning manner than horses?
Do you have any examples of the excessive abuse? There have been several comments by people who have seen Pat be a bit "rough" with horses, somehow they all get ignored by the people who can (somehow) so adamantly defend him.
@palominogirl59 No, it's not. It's all about establishing whether the methods used on Catwalk can be justified by *anyone*. Are the methods good or bad? Effective or ineffective? Natural or unnatural? It wouldn't make any difference to me if it was PP or any other big (or small) name trainer in that arena.
They have nothing to lose - and nothing to gain. I'm sure Pat knows it won't change the minds of those who dislike him or don't believe in his methods, and I heard that they have something like 8 hours of footage. Obviously they're not going to release 8 hours of video, which means it would have to be edited, which means all you people would say, "well they edited the video". Why should he bother? I wouldn't if I were him, why bother??
@palominogirl59 The evening show lasted 8 hours?? Even so, I'm sure it would be easy enough to upload to YouTube in 30min sections on their channel. Are they worried about the cost of doing that? I'd be happy to pay so that everyone (myself included, of course) who is interested can see exactly what went on. It would be instructive. It would correct any impression that they don't want people to see it. They would gain approval for being honest and open - I would be the first to applaud it.
@heartofequus (cont) By the way, my horse knows how to "lead" with a rope around his leg. It helps teach them not to panic if their leg gets caught in something. Of course, I'm sure you teach your horses that by mental telepathy, so there again, I'm training my horse wrong. Sorry (not!)
@palominogirl59 "Of course, I'm sure you teach your horses that by mental telepathy, so there again, "
There certainly IS a spirtual aspect to be considered when a horse and a human bond. (Not sure if anyone would call it 'mental telepathy.')
An FT horse reaches a point of unconditional trust, (unlike the 'conditional trust' of learned helplessness). Conditional trust is like obeying the speed limit. You 'trust' the traffic cop to not punish you with a ticket as long as you OBEY. (Cont.)
every horse is different so you should always try different ways to get the message across to them. I myself dont use anythin more than a round pen, lead rope, halter, and lunge whip (mainly for looks) but to each their own. May i just take the time to say though the owner of this stallion, Catwalk, intrusted him to Pat on his own will. There for it seems to me that if the owner didnt like what was goin on he could have stepped in and taken his horse out of there, right or wrong? You decide.
RinsFallenAngel08 1 day ago
.....I think he lost his temper and got pissed off. As Matlock Rose said, "An ill-tempered man, NEVER made a good horse. Matlock was a real horseman.
Jrebindixie 2 weeks ago
...while he learned his methods from others. He knows a lot but he lies a lot in his videos... Talking biological and ethological nonsense about horses... I understand its easier for people to accept his methods that way, but I find it distasteful... Anyways, people, keep and open mind, dont be brainwashed. Neither by his love nor by his hatred.Follow his methods, it should be great, just dont believe everything he says. keep your eyes open! please.dont tell me that only dumb people can do nhs!
GlidingArt99 3 weeks ago
mkay,while I believe he is great at what he does..."When the micropohne fell off,I should have stopped.I'm sorry for allowing confusion to evolve" Need translation? 'I'm sorry that I couldnt talk bullshit to you as I usually do'."no one works harder than I do to make the world a better place for horses" pretty hard to measure though is it?he is the loudest one,definitely.I have to thank him for introducing the world of NHS to me, but Im not an idiot. he takes a lot of credit for himself
GlidingArt99 3 weeks ago
Although i do not believe in any abuse to my horses when training them, I manage to get the same (or better) results than anyone I know that uses the parelli method. My thought? The parelli method is just a way for the Parelli family to make money.
hunterxjumperxlovex 3 weeks ago
While I do think that Parelli has some very good methods for training horses, his work with Catwalk was just atrocious. He gave the horse a few minutes to accept something it was frightened of, and then went straight to trying to force the issue using restraint and pain. Any other horseman would have been much more patient, gone back to basics and worked on approach and retreat methods to gain his trust and respect.
xxibitsuxx 3 weeks ago
He is a fake! He showed his true colors his own horse rings his tail with unhappiness, he prays on the novice horseman and laughs his way to the bank!
JoyfuloneAim 1 month ago
If I were Catwalk's owner, I would gum twitch Pat...of course there would be an opology later, that makes it ok...right?
lapindeluxury 1 month ago
The whole apology reads like a politician skirting the question.
TWITCHING and HOBBLING a horse is "natural horsemanship?"
So...he just BLAMES the horse?
JOHN LYONS worked with a horse that reared & struck out at anyone who tried to touch its ears. He never used a twitch nor a hobble. He used training and patience.
Shame on Parelli for skirting the question and for resorting to his old cowboy ways.
I shutter to think of how he finally got the horse bridled
easystephorsemanship 1 month ago 4
Woohoo, the horse rears once, backs off a couple of times - because he is abused?! Seriously... if a horse wants to get away, he gets away! 600kg desperados are not stopped by a rope around the front leg... "abuse" means that the horse would have no way out of a painful situation than going into another situation. In this case, the horse could choose between pressure and attention - and even when he wasn't attentive, the pressure wasn't constant.
Steedrider 1 month ago 2
@Steedrider Hopefully, some people's horses never show their owners what their true nature is like - it would scare those people to death. As my old boss would say: "The most dangerous horses are those with a snoozy-lazy character - cause one day, they'll wake up."
Steedrider 1 month ago
I'm "sorry" you didn't understand me? What a cr*p apology that is.
1990enzo 2 months ago 2
Pat is a fake!Did he say the horse tricked him?He claims to know how horse's think,the whole "two brains"thing.His lack of knowing about horse's had that horse there,meaning he ment to have trained horse that he says has problems.Not a real problem horse.
myblindhorse 2 months ago
@myblindhorse Yeah, no kidding. For someone who sells thousands of dollars of "horsenality" ideas, you'd think he'd have a better idea as to how to keep it simple stupid and not resort to cowboy twitches and hobbling.
easystephorsemanship 1 month ago
Parelli is for beginners who are afraid of horses, he teaches people basics and it's a great schtick. This is however a nasty example of a showman trying to cram days or weeks worth of handling a damaged horse into a 30 minute segment to wow his fans. Rule one is patience, even he knows that, but we start to believe our own *&^#$% and then things like this happen. I'm not a Parelli hater, I'm a hater of phony's and zealots who don't care what they see, they just believe what they want to believe
Cosmosdh 2 months ago
Parelli is one of the best things that has happened to the American horse scene. These natural horsemanship trainers have a tough assignment: they have to teach amateur owners with limited skill how to improve their relationship with a horse, using methods that are most likely to keep horse and owner safe.
What most amateurs don't know is that there are some horses that need handling which appears to be abusive to the inexperienced. Kudos to Parelli for seeing this one through.
lessyejoy 2 months ago 4
Guna throw in my 1 cent. 1st, I admire and am thankful for everyone that tries to make things better between horse and human.Thank U Mr. Parelli, for ur heart, ur intentions & results. We're all students and fortunate to have found the secret the privilage of learning from The Magnificent, Majestic HORSE.There are other ways/tweaks/understanding & everyone aplies it dif. I wud point to Klaus Hempfling. His methods r'nt 4 ever1,nor Pats. Both gifted. Which is most natural/best4the horse & results
Thadeus1836 2 months ago 3
well I just watched that video before I read this and guess I was pretty well right. I figured you had just gotten in deeper than planned for a clinic. Horse needed more time than you had and it just looked like 2 day horse "abuse" cause you did the same thing the next day. Well if thats what the horse needs thats what he/she needs. Catwalk didnt seem to me to be trying desperately to get away other than one occasion but it didnt last long. So he couldnt have felt to threatened.
RideLifeAway 3 months ago 3
I have read a few comments saying that it's nearly impossible to never get frustrated with a horse and would just like to say, last week I spent 5 1/2 hours trying to do a join up with a problem horse. I spent nearly the entire time singing Pink Floyd songs in my head and thinking about life, my next steps and all that jazz.
I never got the horse to hook on, had to call it a day when he finally just stopped and looked at me. I never felt frustration though, even when I saw the blisters.
MrShadowdeth 3 months ago
"This comment has received too many negative votes" It's sad that people feel they have to resort to censorship and silencing unpopular views, just because those views differ from theirs. MrPonyMrDarcy's comment wasn't rude or even disrespectful - it just expressed a different viewpoint. To the cowardly censors, I say shame on you!
fburton8 3 months ago
@fburton8 "cowardly censors" you should be ashamed for one it just received too many negative votes. YOU CAN READ IT IF YOU HIT SHOW!. So it has not been censored You yourself throw about people having imagination. you have one too I guess. Usually I respect(even if I don't agree with it your opinion) as you offer a discussion.
Two it is a young person how do we know it was not voted down cause of another reason like other children like a cyber bickering. WE DON"T KNOW. cont..
mlposten 3 months ago
@mlposten "it has not been censored" You are right - the comment wasn't censored like it was actually deleted. I apologize for my inaccurate use of the word. I do think it was cowardly though, because it goes against the spirit of open discussion and debate. Let's say it smacks of censorship. Maybe it was just children cyber bickering - nice phrase, btw :-)
fburton8 3 months ago
@fburton8 Thank you. You are right that it goes against the spirit of debate. I think youtube made the mistake for just because a comment receives negative votes it should be hid. To me it makes me want to see what was said, but that is me I guess. lol
And children cyber bickering, I don't know if you have facebook but it is rampant there. lol
mlposten 3 months ago
@fburton8 I personally did not see anything wrong with the comment sa it was thier opinion but maybe others did and it is others opinion to vote it down. So in my opinion don't go making mountains out of mole hills.
mlposten 3 months ago
what he's saying is exactly opposing what he did. the horse was terrified and he FORCED him to stay with him. I saw it. so don't say I cant have my opinion!
I have also done some parelli at pony club and the woman proceeded to whack another girl's horse with the 'carrot stick' before we intervened. I do not believe that parelli is the best natural horsemanship, and I have tried several. everyone is entitled to their P.O.V, but this is mine
MyPonyMrDarcy 3 months ago
Sounds like Catwalk was an excellent demonstration of how difficult it can be even for a top notch professional to change a horse with deep seated fear issues who has successfully defended that fear for many years. Pat needed to take away the horse's defenses or he'd never have any incentive to face his fear. Doesn't look or sound like abuse to me at all.
josietrott 3 months ago
@josietrott "Pat needed to take away the horse's defenses or he'd never have any incentive to face his fear." To me that seems an odd statement to make. What incentive do you have in mind?
fburton8 3 months ago
@josietrott
did u see the video of him doing it?
MyPonyMrDarcy 3 months ago
I think Pat Parelli and his methods are responsible for helping a lot of horses and owners become better because of them. Anyone who has worked with horses knows and understands what is being done here. They are'nt pets they are 1200 lbs of muscle that can hurt or kill you in an instant. If that's what it takes to get respect it will make a better horse rather than one who will end up in a feedlot because it is unmanageable.
hollycabolly1 3 months ago
@hollycabolly1 "Anyone who has worked with horses knows and understands what is being done here." I can't agree with that, sorry. I've worked with horses, including some headshy ones, and it is not at all clear why Pat was doing this to Catwalk rather than simple desensitization. (I would also use counter-conditioning, but am I right in thinking Pat doesn't do this?) At least, I haven't seen a full explanation yet - maybe it's on a DVD now?
fburton8 3 months ago
@fburton8 Maybe because desensitization or counter-condtioning takes days or weeks, not hours, and Pat was in a demonstration and expected to make a change within an hour give that "normal" horses would have made the change in attitude/fear/response in that time frame. I say "normal" because all horses brought to demo's have problems, but as Pat pointed out, this one was in the top 3 of the thousands of 'very difficult' horses he's ever worked with.
josietrott 3 months ago
@josietrott "Maybe because desensitization or counter-condtioning takes days or weeks, not hours," No, done properly desensitization takes a few hours at most, maybe with some repeat sessions to cement the lesson. With counter-conditioning a horse with deep seated fear can be turned around very quickly. You'd be surprised.
fburton8 3 months ago
Pat needs to watch his temper than he would have thought to put his mic back on. I'm a huge fan of Robert Whitaker though.
MrJuDavis 3 months ago
...capable of, for example building a true friendship and real mutual communication with humans, the horses will have to suffer. The video of Catwalk showes how little understanding of the horse is involved here and how much of egoistic human wishes. I think everyone should ask himself: how can anyone who wants to dominate be a true friend? Think about it. The horse is far more than just a ''stimuli - reaction object''.
UrsaMPG 3 months ago
All the traditional and also NH ways of treating the horses have the same purpose: to make a horse a slave to a human. So this video is not a surprise at all. But it is really sad that with all the available knowledge about the anatomy, psychology and intelect of the horse most of the people still treat those noble animals as the mere objects who have to serve their personal goals. As long as people will be ''blind'' an won't realize how intellectual beings horses are and what are they really..
UrsaMPG 3 months ago
Parelli training is punishment and negative reinforcement based so the way Catwalk was treated is not surprising.
Whipperin1 3 months ago
I could tell from the video that the horse came with major head issues. If Pat had not persisted the way he did, the horse would have learned that he could do "x" and the human would leave him alone. Humans inadvertently teach horses lessons they do not want them to learn all the time with that very method.
mlbachg 3 months ago
I have been around horses for 31 years and what was on that video was blown way out of proportion. I am not a Parelli student however, I respect his work. His method has kept a lot of people from all skill levels from getting hurt and having a better relationship with Horses. Firstly, these are on avg 1200lb animals and Secondly, this was a stallion they are very different from a mare or gelding. Sometimes you have to try something different for the betterment of the animal, he was not hurt.
dmittauer 4 months ago
Thank You PAT! and LOOOVE YOU!!!
horsechick861 4 months ago in playlist More videos from ParelliTube
There is always a risk in demonstrating handling techniques in public. What one horse might accept during a private session changes when you put it on display in front of a crowd. The energy levels change, the horse reacts accordingly. Most of the time a handler can overcome that extra stress. Sometimes the horse cannot. Hindsight is better than 20/20 vision. In this scenario it may have been best to lay off, give the horse a more private venue to learn. The horse changed the game.
KeeperOCats 4 months ago
love how all the negative posts have no thumbs up and the postives have at least 65 +... what does that tell you then?
PaisleyJones 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@PaisleyJones "love how all the negative posts have no thumbs up and the postives have at least 65 +... what does that tell you then?" Vote stuffing by Parelli fans? Really, I wouldn't read too much into the votes either way!
fburton8 4 months ago
/ok i'm not buying it 'give the horse time it needs... no force used' YOU TIED ITS LEG UP... oh yeah no force, plenty of time -.- well done parelli, never liked you, now i hate you.
DeathKitty123456 4 months ago
@DeathKitty123456 Your comment screams "mature".
ElizabethDee07 4 months ago
@ElizabethDee07 I am mature, i am just passionate, i hate people treating horses like crap and in this case i believe the horse was.
DeathKitty123456 4 months ago
So Parelli managed to screw the horse up even more by trying to force it into doing something it was scared of and people are saying he has great methods? That horse wouldn't have fought if he would've taken a step back and worked more slowly. He seemed to be trying to show off and it looked like he was losing his head the more that horse was acting up, which only makes the horse act up more.17 years experience here and I'm going with Monty Roberts' work instead.
hollisterluv1204 4 months ago
everyone can make a mistake and learn from it, thats part of the process, there is no way he can be perfect every single time he works with a new horse. If for the majority of his cases he is helping and treating "problem" horses instead of having them sold off at an auction, then he's doing a great job.
nbarry2240 4 months ago
Woooooooow, people. So many of these comments just disgust me. One, Pat Parelli has great methods which have actually helped a large amount of people gain a better bond with their horses. Sure, some people don't use these methods, but that doesn't mean they don't work. In ONE session, he used a method that he doesn't usually, but he wasn't "abusing" him. Abuse is sending horses off to slaughter, leaving them without food or water, whipping them till they bleed. Get over yourselves.
DownInTheDirtCountry 5 months ago 3
Parelli, and themethods, are a joke!!! RTTH(Road to the horse) 2011, where Pat got bucked off when he pushed his colt too far too fast, he had any evidence of that removed from the internet. If he's such an honest clinician, why wouldn't he have sucked up his pride, and let it go??
He does a good job of making it look good, but there are HOLES in his training. A few of his "demo's" have proven that!!
CalamityJane031 5 months ago 2
Holy crap people, can a human not make mistakes? Do you honestly expect every horseman to accomplish goals perfectly? We make mistakes so we can grow. Pat Paralli admitted his wrong and thought about how he would do it differently in the future. Give the guy the credit he deserves. Those who continue to bash this wise gentlemen even after this apology are the ones who are in the wrong. Move on! I don't practice Paralli, but I think he takes everything to heart. Why ruin that?
MsAltarEgo 5 months ago
There are hundreds of horses out there who aren't on a crowded trailer to the slaughter house in Mexico because of the Parelli's, people who were ready to give up on problem horses or those who were no longer riding have found they can have a better relatioship with their horse and enjoy them in a partnership, play with them etc, so lighten up all you criticizers and haters, there are many methods out there to explore, choose what suits you but make sure the horse comes first.
saidama1 6 months ago 6
Oh, and he obviously did something wrong or he wouldn't have written an open letter about it people...duh. There were a lot of people who walked out of this demonstration and were disgusted by what they saw. For those of you saying everyone makes mistakes..thats like saying "I abuse my kids sometimes, but everyone makes mistakes right?" Give me a break people...he did wrong and he knows it and thats why he took the time to write an open letter. I don;t forgive people who treat animals this way.
FrillySlayerPig 6 months ago
@FrillySlayerPig Give it a rest. I doubt you have any friends with that kind of attitude. You're blowing this out of proportion. What paralli did was hardly a slap on the hand. You make it seem he BEAT the horse, which clearly he didn't. He admits that the method he used was probably a little more than the horse can handle. He understands what he needs to do next time. What more do you want? Get over yourself miss I'm-so-pefect. The guy has more guts to admit his wrong than any guy I know.
MsAltarEgo 5 months ago
Comment removed
FrillySlayerPig 6 months ago
Oh you mean using a twitch and a rope to tie the horses leg and FORCE a bridal on his face when he is scared of it like you did at your last workshop? People walked out they were so disgusted. If PRESSURE is the only way to get a horse to do what you want then why does Klaus Ferdinand Hempfling able to control horses from all over the world without even a bridal or any FORCEFUL methods. Hempfling uses BODY LANGUAGE which is how horses communicate. You're ignorant.
FrillySlayerPig 6 months ago
Ignorance abounds in this world. The ones that do not respect that a horse can think and change in an instance are called dead people. Some "horse predator" instilled the fear in Catwalk.
twolittlehorses4me 6 months ago
i've seen mistakes made by ALL,and i mean ALL!!! horsemanship clinicians.and it has always been the immature who are quick to point fingers,criticize,or accuse them of abuse.but it is fellow horse lovers who sincerely ask,"have you figured out and fixed the problem yet?"like gossiping wives ye who criticize with ridicule.petty as politicians.but there are always more lazy serfs who quickly wag their heads against the successful diligent.
salupaginahit 6 months ago 2
I want to know if his wife is such an "expert dressage" queen in her own right, why is she always cowering behind her husband whenever a horse has a difference of opinion on what exactly is his (the horse's) idea? She's useless.
operaluvr 6 months ago
echo3rhythm - You may think they've made the world a more dangerous place for horses and humans but its clear that you have no idea what your talking about. Maybe if you stopped being such an ignorant tosser for 5 minutes you'd look into something before forming an opinion about it.
Messalena1 7 months ago
i love you pat keep up the good work i have done natural for 6 years and loved every moment of it and some times you have to have bad days like every one :)
makala291 7 months ago
I think pat parelli is a brilliant man and he doesn't abuse horses. If you don't have the same opinion, fine, but don,t come hating on him. What does it change? nothing. Hate is no good and it only hurts you.
Naessly 7 months ago 3
I doubt we can say some person has better methods and results -period-.
The Parelli method works well for me, and I think we don't have to ALL use the same method. If parelli doesn,t work for you, if you don't like it, no one can force you.
But hating is really stupid. Why spend your energy on hating someone or a method? What will it change? I never abused my horse he has never been harmed or anything and he's in a much better shape now that I use the parelli method than he ever was.
Naessly 7 months ago 4
Clinton Anderson has much better methods and results. PERIOD!
littlesqueakersrats 7 months ago
ok heres the thing.... a horse of that size is a dangerous horse and although love is good,respect is better...if anyone who bitched about that video knew anything about horses AT ALL they would be able to see that although the horse was slightly stressed,he wasnt panicky or ready to bolt at any time. I love everything about Pats methods and have used them on my own horses and have had nothing but phenominal results,and im only a level 1 at best. Nuff said
missleahbobea 7 months ago 2
Just a thought, Why not post a video of these now so easy to bridle horse!?
superbigjohnson 7 months ago 4
Okay everyone who hates Pat is just wrong. Sometimes force has to be used against horses, but i saw no abuse
HauntingMidnight 7 months ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
There is only one heap PP is at the top of, the manure heap of weirdos. Just saying..........
rlhagan56 7 months ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Pat Parelli is a fucking psycho moron.
astoria791 7 months ago
Parelli is supost to be "natural". I don't think using ropes to tie the horses legs is natural...
Montly99 7 months ago
A good horseman does NOT have to explain their methods. PP is a moron.
rlhagan56 7 months ago
hey Pat why don't you try serving God first my friend stay safe.
JASONANDTRACI 7 months ago
The incident with Catwalk proved to many that there is nothing "natural" about the methods used. I understand that Pat felt that this was an extreme case, but the fact that he has to resort to stronger, alternative methods to sort out the horse indicates that the original Parelli theory that their methods can be used on any horse of any age, breed, etc. is not true. I believe that there is a fine line between teaching a horse not to fear and learned helplessness, and this now has been crossed.
RachyM 8 months ago 5
Why not make a new video of Catwalk having no problem wirth bridling and ear handling?
missChicquita 8 months ago 5
We love you always Pat. You and Linda HAVE DEFINITELY made the world a better place for horses and humans. Keep up the awesome work you do. Be proud of yourselves and ignore the haters... Its just tall poppy syndrome.
Messalena1 8 months ago 86
@Messalena1 i believe theyve made it a more dangerous place for horses and humans.
echo3rhythm 7 months ago
Too bad Pat Parelli has taken so much flak over this but when you're the best you're at the top of the heap & a pretty big target & unfortunately that's the way losers and idiots react! This was an extremely bad off horse....why not take your anger out on the previous predators who created this situation? Anyway, thanks for the explanation Pat. You have made the world a much better place for horses & the humans who love them!!! God Bless You always!!!
Goldenhorse77 8 months ago 38
Hi, I have had horses and children. All show the greats love and respect toward me. Why? The answer is just plain horse sence. Never react but, always respond. Make the correction eaqual to the act. I think Pat Parelli is a good horseman. Thank you kindly, TJ Hunter
terrin855 2 months ago 2
lol this sounds like a really fun horse to gain the trust of good luck parelli :) ive seen worse handling i still highly respect you and for all those that oppose not just parelli but cliton and chris and many others you need to be more open minded and see more situations. not all horses are calm and gentle and just go along with what you tell them they are allllllll different. some are very testy and you cant always predict what a horse is going to do you have to have a back up plan. :)
xxlosergotnetxx 8 months ago 27
Right on.
susieant1 8 months ago
@mustangsthree: birds try to impress each other all the time... Especially males in spring, their main occupation is to impress females...
giengremmen 9 months ago
@giengremmen didn't think of that, I guess dale carnegie didn't know that much about birds. point he was making was not letting your ego get in the way of what you should be doing, or at least thats what I get from it.
mustangsthree 8 months ago
Some horses are a pain to handle and work with. I had a horse with a bad attitude and showed out worse than catwalk and actually kicked more people and dogs than she should have. I would liked to seen parelli work with her. You can only do so much with difficult horses.
wolfsvain2 9 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
In the late '80s, we hosted a Parelli clinic at a ranch in the SF Bay Area. He worked a young (and known agressive) paint stud in with a full round pen of horses. When the stud tried to mount the horse he was riding, he isolated it, had his assistant work with it, and refused to work with it further. He laid blame for the animals behavior here: he said that women shouldn't own studs and asked if she were cycling. She'd had a hysterectomy @ 13 due to cancer. Lost me then & never went back. Sorry.
sisqsis 9 months ago
One reason why birds and horses are happy is because they are not trying to impress other birds and horses. ~Dale Carnegie
mustangsthree 9 months ago 2
@petrodvoretz Ya, I completely agree that he should stop if the horse comes to a good stopping point. But the situation doesn't necessarily make that easy for him to do so I'm not saying that what he did was justified, that's just unfortunately what happens as a result for these trainers.
shannikki100 9 months ago
so why did you delete my toprated comment?
workingdogbarney 10 months ago
See, the problem is trainers like Parelli who conduct clinics are under pressure because they are working in front of an audience. If he were working with the horse in a quiet and private environment it would be easier for him to keep his cool and perhaps come to a stopping point for the day and pick everything up the next day. But he can't do that in front of an audience. It certainly puts more pressure on the trainer if he has to make a demonstration of it.
shannikki100 10 months ago
@shannikki100 Whoever it is that puts on demonstrations has to deal with the pressure or don't put on the demonstration. If the best thing to do was to stop and work with the horse (animal) at a later date, then that is what Parelli should have done, and explained to the audience for the reason, which at the same time would teach the audience to do the same if they found themselves in a similar predicament. The demonstrators are under pressure, but so is everyone else in their lives.
MrAmarilloSky 10 months ago
@MrAmarilloSky I completely agree.
shannikki100 9 months ago
Pat, I do believe that you used the completely correct methods to this scene. And if you didn't then i think seeing this video, that everything worked out fine and you will be more careful in the future. And guys, remember, just because he has trained horses doesn't mean that he isn't going to get frustrated sometimes. And if you know ANYTHING about horses you know what i mean. I believe that pat was correct in this scenario.
HorseWishList 10 months ago 80
pat parelli is the best horseman alive!! if he did this, and is appologising then why keep going on about it!! no one is perfect, and just because he did the wrong thing that dosent mean the whole parelli method is wrong!?!
1holliehorsecrazy1 10 months ago 3
2 of 2 He charges people to come to his seminars and they demand and expec thim to cure the horses ills all in a day or 2, He would not attempt what he did normally as any qualifed trainer would do so. Most people are there for the hoopla and him to try and sell his product to. Give him a break, he did what nobody welse seemd to do and in the end the horse will be happier for it. Training horses is not alwasy fluffy and candy and that is the way of it.
Race62hud 11 months ago 2
I am not a Parelli devotee. that isn't to say I don't like his methods I find that other trainers methods work better for me. That said. I saw nothing in that video that ever crossed the line of abuse or cruelty except the abuse and cruelty the owners or prior owner of that horse did to him to get him there. either by not following thru with training or creating that situation. Pat is a fantastic trainer and is one of the biggest supporters of compassionate treatment of horses Part 1 of 2
Race62hud 11 months ago 5
This has been flagged as spam show
Okay first of all, he was not hurting the horse. I know some of you disagree with this but he wasn't. I've grown up around cowboys and my grandfather has done things like that in the past with the more difficult horses. Sometimes when you tie a rope around their leg and hold it out, it helps the horse to realize what is happening and to focus more on you and what you're doing. My dad once got a horse in the ring and had to wrestle it to the ground to be able to touch it and calm it down no pain
Mandy888100 11 months ago 3
People,packed first himself to your nose before ya judge about others! Which of you clever guys is flawless and perfect? What do you think, how to become a natural Horseman?By learning from mistakes and solutions found what Pat has certainly made!Nobody should throw stones with dirty fingers for someone!Life is a whole learning process, which will never end! Someone master the game of life, someone cannot.PS:anti-Parelli, you're just jealous that ya can't do better ;).Sorry,if my English is bad.
RawRockCrystal 1 year ago 3
as a horse owner for over 30 years I have learned that not all training techniquies work for all horses. They all have the same survival instincs but the way that they react to a technique is diffrent. I have found that once a horse understands what is expected and gets over fears they will usually will do it willingly. pat has some good points as do others I try to take the good parts of their techniques and use them and for get the rest
jozie1992 1 year ago 4
@jozie1992 most inteligent comment award goes to jozie 1992
open minded a rare thing these days.
123456789mischief 10 months ago 3
@jozie1992 Haven't been a horse owner for 30 years...but agree with and follow the same philosophy....right now I have a 5 yr old tb gelding that I can't get to lift his right front foot due to a prolonged stone bruise that abscessed....am trying clicker training...do you have any other ideas for getting a balky 16 hh horse to pick up his foot??
itsibitsirider 9 months ago
@itsibitsirider Glad to hear you're trying clicker training. Have you got a good book on it, or have someone to show you how to do it properly? That's quite important or else you might be disappointed. With CT your horse should be picking up his feet willingly on cue in a couple of days - it's one of the easier things to train. Good luck!
fburton8 8 months ago
@fburton8 Thank you so much for the encouragement...I've done clicker training with my dogs...I know you start with something they already know and reward them when they comply...then move on to the behaviour you want and reward the try...as soon as they start to do what you ask you click and reward....the problem I have with Gavin is that he's suspicious as soon as I approach his bad foot side and will move away from me...if I tie him he panics...if I get someone to hold him he panics...
itsibitsirider 8 months ago
Comment removed
workingdogbarney 1 year ago
yeah i get tough on my horses they kick me i kick them back and the same dam thing would happen if they were in the wild in a herd setting. If this makes me a abusive horse owner so be it but for owning horses for more than 30 years i have no problem with them wanting to be in my pocket .So carry on PAT and keep your great work up!
23turborail 1 year ago
@23turborail "i get tough on my horses they kick me i kick them back" Is this what Parelli teaches? Surely not!
fburton8 1 year ago 3
Pat was NOT abusing this horse HE WAS SAVING Catwalk . His owners could have decided to give up and send him to the slaughter house. PAT just proved he can make a bad horse GOOD again. Sometimes it takes more force to get though theses critters heads.The horse was not harmed and the results were positive. Lets see you try and see how far you get.
23turborail 1 year ago
Pat Parelli is a gift to our Horses unlike our great Government !! It's the people that our new to the Horse World that do not understand! OMP!
Sanityish 1 year ago
I still think he should have thought it through more..
Shawnshawna 1 year ago 4
really let it go we all make mistakes...he has done so many good things with alot of horses. so this one of some amount of mistakes.:)
horseloveificayshion 1 year ago
@razrbladefaerie - again, a comment from someone who has absolutely no idea of what the Parelli program is. If you're actually reading these posts, most of the posters think that Parelli people "abuse" their horses - that they're not friendly enough, that they stress their horses out by shaking the rope, or tapping them with the carrot stick - so please don't say that you want to be "tough" on your horse or you'll never hear the end of it.
palominogirl59 1 year ago
@workingdogbarney SITTING ON THE BLEACHERS WATCHING IS LIGHT YEARS FROM DOING IT! WHEN YOU DAL WITH THOSE TYPE OF HORSES MAKE A COMMENT!
ALL THAT WOULD HAPPEN TO YOU IS YOU WOULD GET HURT!
MsNobody2121 1 year ago 2
.....
ElectricHorseman66 1 year ago
Hi Pat, you are a great horseman and you have done a lot, said that, you know to well that not many horses can give trust in a couple of hours...so, by forcing this trust, everything you will build on, what will be like?
Give the horse the choice if he want to trust you and when.
LESS IS MORE.
ElectricHorseman66 1 year ago
@fburton8 Hi I don't remember saying match aggression with aggression???Seriously, did I? I said matching a horses "enthusiasm, power, persistance....WITHOUT BEING FORCEFUL" (matching aggression would be forceful wouldn't it--its war) Plain and simple I believe Pat felt he needed to up the anti a little to up attendance and went too far....he had to know that horse needed more time and work done with it beyond the limits of that presentation....to quote Pat, "take the time and takes...."
chappysmom87 1 year ago
@chappysmom87 Hi! What you say makes complete sense. You're right that matching aggression would be forceful. I'm glad we agree on that and I apologize for misinterpreting your original statement.
fburton8 1 year ago
@fburton8 Hi Sometimes is tough to be very clear when there is only a limited amount of space for a reply : ) I to am glad we agree on this....
chappysmom87 1 year ago
I am not very happy with what happened with Catwalk at that exhibit. My big thing is that if he was such a hard, challenging horse to demo with, why are you pressuring him and yourself to the point where you use a technique that reminds me very much of what our ancestors used to train colts, that broke legs, and killed some horses. So how can you tell me that you need to "Take the time it takes so it takes less time" when you used a short cut and didn't exhibit what you preach? Just a thought.
MedoraCowgirl 1 year ago 25
Thanks, Pat. I like that you published this. And if I ran into a brick wall with some ruined horse I was rehabilitating, and had the opportunity to get some hands-on help from you, I still would take it in a New York second.
nameofthepen 1 year ago
Genious has always seen heavy opposition from mediocrity.
Keep doing your great work Pat. - we are still a LOT of people out here who understand what it is you are doing and teaching, and our horses love us for it.
TheAnnestube 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@TheAnnestube "You cannot rush, or force it or you'll push the horse over the edge"
That is what he did! he pushed the horse until it was rearing and doing all kinds of stuff!
"try another tactic" ?!
"catwalk has been successfully bridled and competed" yeah really! just a few days after this? you would not have had any time to practice and train the horse. no way!
what he is saying is a bunch of bull shit!
jeaninedressage 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@TheAnnestube "Genious has always seen heavy opposition from mediocrity."
Even when it's spelt incorrectly?
MdnightZodiac 1 year ago
I'm no fan of Pat Parelli but everyone totally overreacted to that. That is NOT abuse good job Pat for sticking to your guns and doing what needed to be done. All of you bridleless, barefoot, extremists have probably never dealt with a horse like that and would be completely lost if you had to deal with a stallion with behavior issues. Natural horsemanship is great...although is it EVER natural for a human to be on a horse...no...get over it.
amybabe6188 1 year ago
@amybabe6188 i totally agree with you - people need to get over themselves.
TheAnnestube 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@amybabe6188 - i totally agree with you - people need to get over themselves.
TheAnnestube 1 year ago
@amybabe6188 "good job Pat for sticking to your guns" Pat certainly stuck to Catwalk's gums! Seriously, you need to be careful labelling everyone who has concerns as "extremist". As it happens, I have dealt with stallions with behaviour issues on numerous occasions and never felt at a loss as to what to do. I would love to have worked with Catwalk - he seems a nice, genuine sort of horse, not rank or prone to unprovoked aggression.
fburton8 1 year ago
I've owned horses for over 50 years and when I saw the tape of Pat and Catwalk it is quite obvious that this horse has major problems caused by poor handleing. Stallions need to be handled a little differently that regular horses, especially ones with huge egoes. Still and always will use Pat Parelli methods.
fisherranch6 1 year ago
@fisherranch6 "obvious that this horse has major problems caused by poor handleing" Agreed.
"especially ones with huge egoes" What on earth do you mean by that?! Imo, it's not appropriate or helpful to bring ego into the equation. It implies meeting force with force, aggression with aggression. Do you really think that's a good idea?
fburton8 1 year ago
@fburton8 --don't think of 'ego' in human-terms, but in horses' terms. I think it's the lack of having a true understanding of how Parelli's philosophy is. Ego could be dominance (which is not negative) in a horse's personality. The reference to 'matching energy' is just that...'energy' but never 'agression'. Also, depending on the 'horsenality' & the situation & purpose, Parelli recommends 'calmness', 'less energy' & such-also. Check out PNH's "Horsenality" philosophy--would be helpful.
Classifiedize 1 year ago
@Classifiedize "don't think of 'ego' in human-terms, but in horses' terms" Thanks for clarifying. The problem with using human words & concepts to describe horses is that (some) people will assume it means the same thing as it does with humans. That can be a massive fail (big mistake). I've worked with bold, confident, pushy, aggressive, inattentive, self-trusting-only, etc. horses - but I never met an egotistic horse.
fburton8 1 year ago
Sounds like Parelli took the "show must go on" edict over his own principles. Well everyone has a bad day now and then, Lord knows I've lost my focus plenty of times with animals and done the wrong thing, but it sounds like it all worked out ok. But this statement would have gone over better delivered in person, with a few moments of Catwalk being handled and ridden.
nnels54 1 year ago
I never doubted Pat...my gosh!! If ANYONE is out for the BEST OF THE HORSE, it's Pat & Linda. I first got into horses in 1999 & into PNH in 2000, though I looked into at least 3 other famous "trainers". I found "horse people" to be a very odd sort....they are almost worse than today's political climate of the Dems vs Repubs or Conservatives vs Liberals...and you have to be mighty odd to be worse than that!
CKassel55 1 year ago
@CKassel55 ummm, ok?
cowgirlgina 1 year ago
Any updates on Catwalk's progress?
fburton8 1 year ago
I really hope all the concerned people went after the grooms and the trainer of "Catwalk" for what they did to him before Pat Parelli was asked to fix him. what the grooms and trainer did is ABUSE!
MsNobody2121 1 year ago
@MsNobody2121 Are you concerned about what happened to Catwalk before PP was asked to 'fix' him? Or are you not concerned?
fburton8 1 year ago
I really hope all the concerned people went after the grooms and the trainer of "Catwalk" for what they did to him before Pat Parelli was asked to fix him. what the grooms and trainer did is ABUSE!
MsNobody2121 1 year ago
@HeartofEquus I respect your opinion. I studied horse psychology and this is the way a horse thinks and reacts to bocy language. Try to respect other opinions and try not to get influenced by the comments in the video. If you look at the video you can see that PP is calm the whole time, there is NO ABUSE at all in this video. I dont have to convince you, if your method works, stick with it is all i can say. The horse his wellbeing comes first, whatever way you choose
Sabetteful 1 year ago
@Sabetteful FINALLY SOMEONE WITH EYES AND A BRAIN!! I SO AGRREE WITH YOU!!
trixtera 1 year ago
@Sabetteful "I studied horse psychology" I'd be interested to know where or with whom. In particular, where did your ideas about dominance come from?
fburton8 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Sabetteful "But if you have a horse that is already messed up by people you sometimes have to start this psycological fight"
DEAD WRONG! Why 'start a psychological fight' for NO reason?
That only ESCALATES the fear and adrenalized 'stress hormones,' (cortisol) and establishes a Negative Relationship!
Why?
Why?
HeartofEquus 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Sabetteful "But if you have a horse that is already messed up by people you sometimes have to start this psycological fight"
DEAD WRONG! Why 'start a psychological fight' for NO reason?
That only ESCALATES the fear and adrenalized 'stress hormones,' (cortisol) and establishes a Negative Relationship!
Why?
When there are other methods that DON'T create pain and fear?
HeartofEquus 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Sabetteful "But if you have a horse that is already messed up by people you sometimes have to start this psycological fight"
DEAD WRONG! Why 'start a psychological fight' for NO reason?
That only ESCALATES the fear and adrenalized 'stress hormones,' (cortisol) and establishes a Negative Relationship!
Why?
When there are other methods that DON'T cause pain and fear? (and could have accomplished the same thing in LESS time.)
HeartofEquus 1 year ago
@HeartofEquus go to a Buck Branamann Clinic and get some help.
MsNobody2121 1 year ago
@4HorsesandHolding I also agree your point of view and one smart rap is better i totally agree. but i get the fealing that people are influenced to much by the comments on the video. I would reccomend for anyone to look at this video trough their own point of view.
Sabetteful 1 year ago
@4HorsesandHolding I didnt say that this horse is agressive! I said that if you do not hold your ground with persistant horses you finally get a agressive horse. If you look carefully to the video you will see that Pat doesnt get the result he wants and therefore continues. He hasnt got a moment to reward the horse yet. Please read my comments and the video carefully. It is to bad that people get influenced by the text in the video. The one who wrote it has a softer view on training
Sabetteful 1 year ago
@4HorsesandHolding I am not discussing whether or not Linda is abusive. i am discussing what the comments on the video are. Pat is not abusive in the video.
Sabetteful 1 year ago
@4HorsesandHolding Who is Linda? Your right about the horse owner is likely to start his problems. That is what i am trying to explane to you. If it has come this far you have to hold your ground and you MUST win or else you eventually get a agressive horse, that is when you start a psychological fight. Asking is the best and if you have a gentile horse it works. But if you have a horse that is already messed up by people you sometimes have to start this psycological fight
Sabetteful 1 year ago
@Sabetteful "But if you have a horse that is already messed up by people you sometimes have to start this psycological fight" Fight? Says who?
fburton8 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Sabetteful "But if you have a horse that is already messed up by people you sometimes have to start this psycological fight"
DEAD WRONG! Why 'start a psychological fight' for NO reason?
That only ESCALATES the fear and adrenalized 'stress hormones,' (cortisol) and establishes a Negative Relationship!
Why?
Why?
HeartofEquus 1 year ago
He is using force.. horses are using forse. I am not saying he or horses are abusive. They are using force. However, this is a shortcut and it would have been smarter to work this horse at home. Do not let his ego bother you. PP is meant to be as a basis which you can work from not to fully do it the way he does if you dont like it, be creative. If a horse has been a leader of humans all his life, it takes some persistance. Horses hit each other and pat doesnt
Sabetteful 1 year ago
@Sabetteful
In a situation where both human and any horse would decide to really use force, it's unlikely that a human will be the victor. The only reason a human even stands a chance at "winning" is because of the good nature of horses. They (generally) do not want confrontation.
4HorsesandHolding 1 year ago
@4HorsesandHolding It is all about patience and asking. If asking doesnt work, you take more serious actions. The video doesnt show abuse. See my comment above please. You dont have to explane to me the way a horse thinks. I studied horse psychology and i know how the brain and body language works. I do agree with you, but this video doesnt show abuse. Mostly is shows a that there is more time needed. Asking is best, but hold your ground when you are in a dominance struggle
Sabetteful 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
I dont agree that PP is using abusive tactics. Sometimes you come across horses that are true leaders and it takes a lot to convince them. Have you seen him hitting the horse? No, this is a psychological struggle. Have you ever studied horses together and especially when a new horse is introduced to other horses? That is a lot more abusive than PP shows in the video. If you want to be a leader, you have to be assertive, this is NOT abusive. Why are you so bothered by his ego? Be independent
Sabetteful 1 year ago
I dont agree that PP is using abusive tactics. Sometimes you come across horses that are true leaders and it takes a lot to convince them. Have you seen him hitting the horse? No, this is a psychological struggle. Have you ever studied horses together and especially when a new horse is introduced to other horses? That is a lot more abusive than PP shows in the video. If you want to be a leader, you have to be assertive, this is NOT abusive. Why are you so bothered by his ego? Be independent.
Sabetteful 1 year ago
@Sabetteful
-
Be independent? lol
-
Even if horses did "abuse" each other (which they naturally don't as a rule) - are you saying Pat isn't capable of behaving in a more reasoning manner than horses?
-
Psychological abuse.
-
Shortcuts and force are NOT training.
4HorsesandHolding 1 year ago
@freedombarb101
Do you have any examples of the excessive abuse? There have been several comments by people who have seen Pat be a bit "rough" with horses, somehow they all get ignored by the people who can (somehow) so adamantly defend him.
4HorsesandHolding 1 year ago
@fburton8 (cont) See, it gets more and more clear that it is ALL about the "who" and not about the "what".
palominogirl59 1 year ago
@palominogirl59 No, it's not. It's all about establishing whether the methods used on Catwalk can be justified by *anyone*. Are the methods good or bad? Effective or ineffective? Natural or unnatural? It wouldn't make any difference to me if it was PP or any other big (or small) name trainer in that arena.
fburton8 1 year ago
@fburton8 Really - what *have* they got to lose?
They have nothing to lose - and nothing to gain. I'm sure Pat knows it won't change the minds of those who dislike him or don't believe in his methods, and I heard that they have something like 8 hours of footage. Obviously they're not going to release 8 hours of video, which means it would have to be edited, which means all you people would say, "well they edited the video". Why should he bother? I wouldn't if I were him, why bother??
palominogirl59 1 year ago
@palominogirl59 The evening show lasted 8 hours?? Even so, I'm sure it would be easy enough to upload to YouTube in 30min sections on their channel. Are they worried about the cost of doing that? I'd be happy to pay so that everyone (myself included, of course) who is interested can see exactly what went on. It would be instructive. It would correct any impression that they don't want people to see it. They would gain approval for being honest and open - I would be the first to applaud it.
fburton8 1 year ago
@heartofequus (cont) By the way, my horse knows how to "lead" with a rope around his leg. It helps teach them not to panic if their leg gets caught in something. Of course, I'm sure you teach your horses that by mental telepathy, so there again, I'm training my horse wrong. Sorry (not!)
palominogirl59 1 year ago
@palominogirl59 "Of course, I'm sure you teach your horses that by mental telepathy, so there again, "
There certainly IS a spirtual aspect to be considered when a horse and a human bond. (Not sure if anyone would call it 'mental telepathy.')
An FT horse reaches a point of unconditional trust, (unlike the 'conditional trust' of learned helplessness). Conditional trust is like obeying the speed limit. You 'trust' the traffic cop to not punish you with a ticket as long as you OBEY. (Cont.)
HeartofEquus 1 year ago