Tire Rack Tire Testing - Ice Traction: Studded vs. Studless

[fubecabr]

@jonathantatler

The studs used in WRC and other racing use much more aggressive and much sharper studs than normal street-legal tires. Regular studs are quite dull and don't really dig into ice very much and give WORSE traction on snow and dry/wet pavement.

[KiterTMK]

Strange how they contradict themselves. Look up:

Tire Rack - Winter Testing at the Arctic Circle: Studdable Winter/Snow

[shelter78]

@KiterTMK Indeed, I just watched the other one before I watched this one. I have to say the other test contained more data while this video is basically just a guy saying non-studded tires are better.

[ennot]

@jonathantatler there's a world of difference between what WRC people use and what we're allowed to use on the roads. Ever seen a WRC studded tire up close? You could probably kill with those studs

[TheNineveh]

@jonathantatler I agree with you, I have to run directional studded tires because directional nonstudded will not get me up my icy steep driveway.

[onehorsepower]

OK. I assume that the point of this vid is to show that newest generation of studdless tyres are better than OLD studded tyres that are no longer allowed in whatever country you are?

The only problem is that youtube is GLOBAL and even 4 years on, people still see this vid. In countries that allow studded tyres today, we KNOW that NEW studded tyres are SUPERIOR to studdless tyres on ice, even though studdless are VERY good these days.

Please make that more clear?!!

[123allrock]

simple question ? what tire brands where tested , modern tread compounds do make a difrence no countering that , but what modern studded tires verses the studless on wet Ice  also what is the life of these modern compound snows ?

[speck444]

that dosent sound right to me yhey had no proof to what they were saying besides i tryed to buy studded tires from tire rack and they told me i had to buy four i told them vip for less money they will never make it as a buissiness you cant tell the customer what to do unless your a church or a barroom

[hookitbigger]

This is why ice climbers use the new rubber soled boots and have done away with crampons.

[pd721]

Try that test on a normal wet or dry surface. Then you see that the studed tyres are not any good at all....

[420MrBudz]

@pd721 We are on ice!

[TheNineveh]

I think studded tires are good on Ice, but its a fact they are not as good on slushy or wet roads as a directional winter tire can perform.

[thewhistler]

@TheNineveh

What about my directional studded winter tires?

[TheNineveh]

@thewhistler dont get me wrong there good, but slushy or wet conditions have there way with studded tires.

[tundra243]

put 5 in of snow on the ice and we'll c who wins

[alexkvaskov]

test goodyear nordic studded tires

[ihmesekoilua]

Hehe. If you want to drive really, really slowly on an ice rink, apparently studless is the way to go. Seriously tho, actual motoring journalists and testers do these comparisons every year in actual winter conditions and studs vs studless tend to come up fairly equal nowadays. Personally I prefer studs simply because even an old tire with little tread is usable as long as it has some studs left, studless tires get useless as the rubber ages and wears.

[pr132002]

I feel that tirerack's reviews may be misleading just because it's a CONTROLED test with set speeds, certain selection of tires(studded/non), and 1 type of car. Im sure the results would differ according to the type of car(FR FF RR AWD), a more suitable selection of low, mid, high, grade tires(studded/non) and a better suited real life snow road. The studded tires should also be tested last because they cut up the ice and/or snow which makes it easier for studless tires to grip.

[aflipz]

absolute bullshit; they are comparing old ass studded tires to new studdless; try comparing MODERN studded tires like Nokians. In REAL tests done here in Canada studdable nokian haakka 5's did better without studs than the best studdless tires, add studs and NOTHING CAN TOUCH THEM.

THIS VIDEO IS WORTHLESS.

[noskidable]

None of the studless tires are able to prevent skid on the black ice, particularly the flat one re-frozen after molten.

[ZachandRob07]

tire rack probably has lots of money invested in studdless tires lol. studs are way better. i just had studlees snow tires on my wrx they did alright if that. just got some winter cat xt's and they are way better.

[x1tekja]

Oh I agree the type of studded tire you use makes a world of difference. If you are swapping tires for the winter, why not get something designed to perform in the environment you are using them in. Not merely compromise for whatever is cheapest or gives you better gas mileage. That is the last thing you think about when you loose control of your car.

[Circa1990]

Those studded tires in the test look like shitty ones =S

I have Nokian Hakkapeliitta 5 studded tires, and they are amazing. They have an advanced rubber compound combined with special studs and contact points for them and they out perform every other tire on ice. They have me a little over confident.

[logwind]

I have Bridgestone Blizzak WS60s (studless) on my S2000 and they make the car unstoppable in the snow. Best $600 I ever spent.

[blazerboy525]

@logwind 600 bucks? holy crap! Prime Well PA-100, $82 a tire. best tires I've ever had

[APBriggs2009]

Makes the car unstoppable? I thought that studded tyres should make the car stop better! :P

[sunnyjason]

unstoppable in the snow seems a bad thing to me...lol, jk I know what you mean.

[torchind]

would be nice to know what tire they used for stud less. by the tread it looks like Firestone for the studded. but the Firestone is a good deep snow tire. adding studs gives you a little bit better traction on ice but primarily isn't a ice tire. most dedicated ice tires like the one they prob used for the test on glare ice prob sucks balls in deep stuff

[valg22088609]

That guy needs to take his head out of his ass for a second,

Anyone of you ever try Nokian studed tires ? my guess is not.

When you stud a tire that's made to be used without stud you remove contact surface between the tire and the ground. Where as with nokians and similars, non studed and studed are different models and the studs are mounted on small cushions that soften with temperature from rolling on asphalt... that's the difference

[8motion]

best tires are Nokains... The Blizzak...are not stable at speed...just good in deep snow..and maybe ice..etc... ( Canadian Quebec Laurentians..driver)

[offfiman]

Yes, Nokia's Hakkapeliitta tires have won many awards from ice/snow side.

[Poorestgump]

rayadiktotx is an idiot of course he has no need for snow tires but considering half of the continental US including the north uses snow tires. He lives in texas no wonder.

[Iluv2raceit]

Yes, the new generation of studless tires perform better than the traditional studded tires. What the narrator didn't say was the reason why. The studs themselves act like miniature skates (no kidding), so they have a tendency to slide rather than actually provide traction. The main cause of this is the studs are not long enough to provide significant penetration into an icy surface. The reason for this is because the studs are regulated in length to prevent damage to road surfaces.

[Binsky31]

i got a set of blizzacks and had them studded, they work unreal and grip like crazy on these icey ass canadian roads, eh

[Iluv2raceit]

Your Blizzaks will perform better WITHOUT studs - no kidding.

[Poorestgump]

Got the same blizzacks but no need for studs.

[ILuvQuebec]

people that drive suvs are the most stupid people abd cause the most accidents they think there fuckin it man when in reality there driving a peice a shit they dont even need this is not the north pole unlike dumbass usa we have snow plows here and 6 inches even a foot a snow wont stop any front wheel drive car with snow tires only retards need suv's

[BulaCounty]

Since you dont have kids, boat or a trailer-and the will to move these things from point A to B, you have no idea what the flips coming out of your yap. In 10-15 yrs when you have a family make sure u keep the same small sedan your driving now. Dont be a dumb ass and get a vehicle that can hold a family,their things,pull a trailer, and drive to a campsite/boat dock. I see lots of familys pulling trailers with 4 bangers. Only an ignorant (one who lacks knowlege) kid would say what you've said.

[mathiastheok]

Funny, Teknikens,Auto Motor & Sport,Auto Zeitung, In Motor,Consumer Reports and the Canadian Automobile Protection Association whom test every snow tire available ever year (They are Canada, Scandinavian and Norwegian agencys, you know, from the parts of the world with the most snow and ice)

And they come up with just the opposite result that Tire Rack does. Perhaps testing on an ice rink just doesn't give real world results like testing in the uhhhh real world.

[imprezal2345]

simply put: you're an idiot.

[driftnut56]

I just face palmed at that comment. you can't put that much trust into your all wheel drive system because although it may help you to go a little bit better then other people it does not help you when you are braking numbskull which is what every one needs winter tires for. if you have awd you can go just fine from the stop sign but whats gonna help you stop at the next sign or light when some little kid is crossing and the entire intersection is frozen with smoothed ice huh?

[rayadiktotx]

You make a point. But when 71% of the world's population lives where there is hardly any snow or ice, why will people need to invest in tires for ice?? PLus, that is why you do not drive on icy roads and what the hell will kids be doing in the street at freezing temperatures. I live in Texas, so there is no need for ice tires. My r32 goes through mud, wet roads and sand dunes along galveston and padre island and I don't have to worry about shi**t. =)

[driftnut56]

well neighbour, up here in Canada is where we need to worry about things like that. when it snows in all but 3-4 months of the year and school is in session all through out the winter it is important to have proper snow tires. last year there were nearly 200 collisions in calgary, alberta in approx. 1 week because of heavy icing in the roads and you know why? because A) people were being reckless (especially the ones with AWD) and B) people didn't feel it necessary to change to winter tires

[rayadiktotx]

Ok, so you are telling me that people with AWD drive reckless?? I suggest you look at the facts. SUV's and compact cars are the vehicles that are involved in the majority of accidents in Alberta during the winter period and it is true that ice is the blame but why would you run expensive snow tires on your 2WD Civic, Explorer, SUV or useless american made vehicles if the tires have a higher value than the car itself. NO OFFENSE. I just think snow tires are a waste of money.

[driftnut56]

Yah and those are the reckless ones and the ones that opted for the cheaper tires. I always pass people in SUV's that have slid into the ditch because they feel so confident when they take off quicker then me that they don't realize they can't stop or slow down as quickly. I have a 1995 Mercedes S320 w/ RWD and I hardly ever slide or slip unless I really push it and I accredit my ability to control my car to the amazing winter tires I have installed. My Tahoe also has winters and its even better

[driftnut56]

Also, I don't run winter tires because I wanna save MY vehicle. I put them on because I wanna prevent the loss of life. I don't care if my car is blown to little bits and pieces so long as I don't hurt anyone in the process. IDK about you but 150 dollars a tire is not very much if I can prevent a collision between myself and another driver, don't you think?

[rayadiktotx]

You have a point. look at the video of "drifting r32"...it seems like i could have fun with my r32 in the snow with some snow tires

[ILuvQuebec]

your a dumbass american what else is new lol

[rayadiktotx]

Fuck you..and i bet you drive an american made vehicle..ahaha

[dimos47ki7]

uuum these tires are for those who actually need them...so 29% of the world population, are interested on these tires...

have u ever driven on snow or ice?

[rayadiktotx]

I never said that 29% are interested on these tires. I said 71% of the worlds population is concentrated where there is hardly any snow or ice... And to that 29%, we cannot assume that all of those people own their own car. So that leaves a couple million who have to drive through ice and snow. And yes, I took my r32 to Colorado and the Icy roads were not a big problem for me. It's not like im going to go 70mph on an icy hill!

[dimos47ki7]

anyway, these tires are for people who needs them...

and of course you are much safer with these tires on a 2wd car, than summer tires and 4wd.

at the end, grip is all that matters, especially when breaking, and when u brake, 4wd is totally useless

[ILuvQuebec]

your right on the money my friend

[jtbo]

Ice hockey arena for tyre testing?

Well, I guess they can't afford to do testing at cold climate, but really that test is not telling much of anything from tyre except parking speeds.

In higher speed studs are extended more as weight of stud pulls it out and that adds to grip.

But I must say that my studdless tyres are making deep scratches to ice too, it is amazing what they can do today.

Choose tyre to fit your driving conditions, if there is more often tarmac then studdless is better.

[pjohns30]

I say bull I've ran both kinds on 65 Ford rwd cars and studs out perform studless tires everywhere you just have to get the right ones. In the video they are using a Firestone Winter force which is a hard compound light vehicle tire that can be run year round. I would recommend a Goodyear UltraGrip. They will wear out in fairly fast if you run them in the summer but so will the studless ones that are made with a soft compound. If you go to 1.15 it doesn't even look like he is turning sharp enou

[codprawn]

What about all the Rally cars? They always use stuuded tyres on ice and snow. Looking at the studs on that tyre they were so worn they should have been thrown away!!!

[kullsyreholdig01]

Wow... so everyone from Scandinavia has just got it wrong all these years? Unlikely... Proper studded tires are unrivalled on ice, no question. On snow? Hmm. On wet tarmac? Studless would win. Easy as that.

[AmayaYuukuno]

Well. Not everyone in Scandinavia drive on studded. And the rest of what you wrote is why.

For those living in cities where you seldom have snow on the roads it feels rather superfluous to use studded. But if you live on the countryside where you won't have snowplows about; studded are the only sensible choice.

Choose tires depending on what conditions you are going to drive in. Simple as that.

[jtbo]

I drive in Scandinavia, I use tires with and without studs.

Studless tyres have improved really a lot, they are actually usable now, but best studded tyres are still ahead in all around grip.

Gettin all season tyres means there won't be not even near grip levels of studless tyres.

Continental Viking Contact 5 is good studdless tyre.

Continental Winter Viking 2 and Nokia Hakkapelitta 5 are good studded tyres.

We have our own compunds here, even tyre names can be same elsewhere.

[oyo4jc]

Ok so lets say that you live in area that gets a lot of snow and ice. I want to be able to drive at least 65mph on the highway, be able to turn like I normally would on the streets if they were dry, and I want to maintain control. Would I be better off with studded or studdless tires?

[stugasm]

well from the video the studless are better... however no mater what tires you have, they will NOT provide the same traction as tires on dry pavement. However, having a good set of winter tires makes a world of a difference when it comes to driving in winter conditions.

[ballathug69]

Hmmm maybe this video has something to do with the fact that tirerack has many more studless tires available for sale on their website..

[Backizzz]

This video is a joke. Sure, in one way its telling the truth, because they are literally telling you they compare modern studless tyres to cheap studded tires with technology from the '60s... If they would compare some Nokian Hakka 5 they would be praising them instead, they use the latest compound technology and are really offering some good traction on ice!

I live in Finland and our roads are pure ice the whole winter so having a good set of tires is important if you care about your family.

[donaldjr1969]

What really makes the friction tire very good in a lot of areas in the USA is that we do not get a lot of ice. Most of the continental US does a good job of clearing the roads. And driving on wet or dry pavement with studs, they do worse than blizzaks. Plus, studded tires are restricted or illegal in most parts of the US and Canada. So for most N American areas, we see very little ice to make good use of studs. Blizzaks do very well in snow and are a good compromise having owned both types.

[8motion]

Blizzak are not that good for all conditons.Try Nokians and your will never look back ...Dry,wet,slush,snow,ice -40 C or F up 5-8 or 48F ..

[donaldjr1969]

I have never had a complaint with my WS-50's. They have always got me through the conditions you described with aplomb. Now I am not so sure about the WS-60 because its tread does not look as aggressive as the WS-50 plus it has 1/8" less tread when new.

When my WS-50's are worn out, then I will see what my options are. To be honest, Nokians are hard to find in my area, as are Gislaveds and other Scandinavian snow tires.

[8motion]

Its not so much the tread but rubber compound..the makes the difference..

Have you noticed that when temperature rise above 5 degrees celcius that the tires get squirmy.. all the best

[donaldjr1969]

Yeah, it is around 10-12C here and my blizzaks feel like riding on sponges. :( I will admit that can be disconcerting for those using blizzaks for the 1st time.

What I meant by tread was the actual pattern of the WS60 vs WS50. The WS60, as you already know, has less voids than the WS50 and many say the WS60 is not as good in deep snow compared to the WS50. Btw, I found out a local dealer DOES carry Nokians! I may get studded hakka 5s when these wear out. I can use studded tires here.

[phnx86]

There is no way that studless tires could outperform studded tires on ice. Here in Finland local car magazines do annual tests, and never has a studless tire won. Next time Tire Rack should try some real studded tires, like Nokian Hakka 5 or Michelin X-Ice North. Studded tires in this video, Firestone Winterforces, are not even sold here in Finland where studded tires have been used for ages.

[snowrocket]

Their website has the particulars of their test(s). For the most part, I find The Tire Rack to be a reputable company from whom I've bought most of my tires for the past 14 years.

[pdrworks1]

Funny how they don't tell you which actual tires they are testing- I'm pretty sure there are more than a few choices for studded tires. If they are testing the cheapest crappiest studded tires  against the most expensive studdles then this is pointless. In the real world there is usually snow on top of the ice too.

[Andreaszzz84]

This is bullshit! Propaganda!

Studless tires will NEVER be better than studded tires!

[kgaede67]

I am the former VP of Nokian Tires North America... This stuff is nonsense... I can say no more that that... Aweful, aweful stuff... This is should be illegal...

[fartman10284]

...try testing some Nokian Hakka 4 or Hakka 5studded tires. You will see a difference compared to the Winterforce studded tires and difference to the current generation of friction snow tires. Winterforce tires unstudded are still excellent snow tires.

[Choice777]

doesn't it feel weidr to see a car without licence plates ? it like it's ugly :)

[z28fitzie]

why would you test 40 year old compounds when you can get studable new generation snows??!! new compound + new studs = Good. Studded tire technology didn't stop evolving in the 1960's! they have improved them in Europe to the point that they are not even close in comparison to '60's studs. If you want to do a proper test of the best os both technologies, do it right. Don't rig the test to sell more snow tires from your website.

[mwrightp]

z28fitzie: actually it's true, i just got out of a meeting with nokian, and they stated that studdable tire technology hasn't advanced as quickly or as much as studless tire technology. their is a lot more that goes into the tires than just the compound and studs (i.e. sipes, tread design, how the sipes are cut, speed rating, etc.) one of the biggest factors in severe weather traction is water dispersion, that's one reason why there has been a big shift to studless in the tire industry.

[thewhistler]

@z28fitzie They did that because the study was funded by bridgestone, who produced the blizzacks.

I have ran blizzacks and I have ran studded tires and I take the studs over the bliizacks any day.

That is just my opinion though.

The only way to properly test this is to get someone with no financial interest in selling more expensive tires and have them test it in a double blind study on the same car and not let them see what tires are on the car.

[30YRSIC]

what jerks, i ran studded snows on all 4 tires on my t bird, i ended up passing 4 wheel drive trucks. i was doing 50 mph, the trucks could not keep up with me. complete control. what do you get when you put rubber on ice>? a HOCKEY PUCK!

[fubecabr]

@30YRSIC

Absolutely agree. My FWD maxima with blizzaks usually outperforms my 7200lb 4x4 diesel truck with all season tires in Alaska winter road conditions..

[dr1345]

less talk, more show

[Biffbradford]

less talk, more *SNOW!*