So as a nihilist, can you ask questions? Such as when someone says "i like blue"... can you ask questions about why they like it or think that way? In a sense to show that their belief that blue rocks is only an opinion? I better example would be if someone says something like, "womans rights was a positive effect on the world", do you just say "how interesting!" or can you ask questions that would then lead the person to the other conclusion (aka socratic method). You never corrected them.
@Morgethein If you accept such a meaning then yes. But for some that may not be a meaning of life. Also as someone said in another video you are like the just crowd.
could someone regard him/herself as some sort of a weak nihilist, that he/she excepts nihilism but also excepts being a human and thus having emotions and preferences which might be more preferable than others. for example: jumping from a cliff isn't bad or good but a nihilist could recognize this but might hold the position that not jumping is better if you want to survive thus having an agenda on which you behave.
@Quiestre Nihilists believe that there is no objective truth. So most of them design their own subjective truths. In my opinion weak nihilists are the ones that stay nihilists meaning they just dont have any values at all.
@Valkbg With "weak" nihilists i mean epistemological Nihilists. that understand that all values have no meaning but still subscribe to a personal emotional preference they'd like to see in all humanity. You could say prefered subjective morals. I mean i understand nihilistic ideals but couldnt really live by them, because of my own ego and my upbringing aswell as my emotional reaction to what i perseive as reality.
He is wrong in assuming that consensus means objectivity. There is no mutual exclusiveness between the two terms. Consensus can be reached for the benefit of a group, i.e. language, but it doesn't follow that we now have reached an objective meaning. Objectivity means that something is not subject to change, any such consensus reached example could be subject to change. I see no rationale proof provided for the existence of inherent objective values, and that's what his refusal rests upon.
@Morgethein So... I can think and feel and believe whatever I want, but it means nothing, as morals are a conceptual notion made by people, and thus, do not truly exist? Nothing is truly the best, or the greenest, or the coolest, or the anything(est?) because everything is different to everyone and therefor nothing means anything? Interesting stuff here, this nihilism.
Wait so is morality actually an illusion but we can't argue against a universal moral premise because that would be violating nihilism? I'm not sure that that proves morality is not an illusion but it does prove that a nihilist can have no say in a universal moral premise.
if truth does not exist why it cant be subjective, if reality does not exist then who cares? if something doesnt exist there is no "right and wrong" because none of them exist i dont get that part..
@jadv91 Let me try to explain. Basically, lets just say you're floating in space for all eternity. No matter what you do, it will not affect anything and it won't matter. It's sort of like that. You can make bad choices of good choices but in the end nothing changes. Atoms will just do what atoms do.
Reality is not objective. The orange horse with a square circle for an ankle shoulder told me on Tuesday nights last Sunday, just after I milked the cardboard boxes and shaved my donkey's golden cherub.
That's why a meter is a different length in different cities, and why the weight of 1 liter of water is different in Canada than it is in Australia. It also explains why the sun revolves around the earth depending on where you are at the time.
@socrates0ne For your posited arbitrary universe, I can provide many other subjective ones that SEEM objective. But reality being objective is not a self-evident truth, nor can it ever be. Dance around that and deride the implications of that all you wish, but you know that you can't touch it. However, the truth of that notwithstanding, this is not the reason why Stefan's attempt to construct objective morality fails spectacularly.
I'm agreeing with you that reality is not objective. However, I DISAGREE with you that reality is not objective.
Since everything that can be objectively verified can not be objectively verified, all things that are objectively verified are inherently subjective. Objective subjectivity is subject to subjective objectivity. It's very simple.
So, we're in complete agreement, because we completely disagree with each other.
In analogy you compered values to tastes.....are you mocking everyones sense for reason? Its not like i can compare Ffouriers order to a pilling boxes full of apples. God knows i can try bu this is not philospohy 101
Excellent. While I found myself debating specific details throughout, by the end I found your beliefs to fall parallel with my own. However, I would describe them differently: truth as any man can figure (or perceive) it will be metaphor (not false) when compared to Truth (capitalized for objectivity/universality). That is to say; Truth in it's natural state is not observable by the logical structures it creates (us), but CAN be understood with metaphor (science, math, religion, etc.).
It sounds like you're arguing against the idea that the concepts of truth, values, and morality aren't real, but I think the nihilist position is that those concepts are pointless/worthless because the effect of them being real isn't necessarily different than if they weren't. For instance, a robot could be programmed to think it likes mustard. Does it really have a taste for mustard? Can you prove it? Does it matter? The answers to the last two are definitely "no".
human language contradicts itself but the things that the human talks about isn't a contradiction.... remember the closer you get to the truth, the harder it is to speak of it because you can't speak the truth, we humans can only state facts
contradicting yourself with this vid and the one on selfishness......morality being an illusion ............too many inconsistencies ...among the two vids saying blaming one for being selfish and calling it moral sup;ierority then saying morality is an illusion...
Things are as they are. The truth is the truth whether we perceive it accurately or not. I can't speak for all nihilists, but when you get down to it, who/what would it matter to if the universe consisted solely of vacuum, or didn't exist at all? Nobody. Nothing. Everything built upon that is simply potential behavior of increasingly complex atomic structures. Nihilism as you present it is clearly absurd (well done, btw). As I've interpreted and adapted it, anything more is just Lego play.
"I hope that it helps you understand that nihlism is no so much a problem to be solved but a diesease to be cured". If you are looking for a sensible unbiased discussion of this subject, look elsewhere.
The nihilism paradox is easily resolved this way. The only objective truth is that there are no OTHER objective truths. This is the only "true" certainty one can have, not that certainty even should matter.
the goal of health is just a personal preference, but an evolutionary one. and one that most people have. What we put in our mouths is just personal preference, but objective relative to the goal of health.. which is subjective. A bit different to something as arbitrary as liking a particular colour.
I don't understand why nihilism is opposed to objective truth. Why can't a nihilist believe it is objectively true that gases expand when heated and correct someone who thinks they contract when heated?
This video is full of arrogance and bigotry and does not reflect a nihilist thinking at all. It was made for masses to tell them "nihilism is bad" sorta like a parent tells to a kid "alcohol is bad".
A nihilist believes that truth does exist, he believes that values are real but useless and he believes morality is useless to him but useful for everyone else.
A nihilist is individualistic, without morals or values and does whatever he wants because he doesnt see any reason why he shouldnt.
...reported in the news paper the next day. The empiricist perspective of seeing the murder would have given it no more valid truth than seeing it in the newspaper the next day.
However to say the truth is meaningless is not to say there is no truth, to say blue is nice is itself truthful for that person, it is however a non-effective truth.
Another example of the meaninglessness of truth is:
I was on the bus the other day, the bus driver got in an argument with a passenger, the passenger got quite irate, and I said to myself 'If he kills him now, it would not matter if I was here or not, it would have happened anyway.'
i think that the real benefit of nihilism is how accepting it's concepts alters your thought process. in my opinion, it can go either one of two ways. either you become suicidal (hey, if nothing really matters anyway...) or you could do just the opposite and pursue whatever desires you may have, it's like a sense of mental liberation.
again, these are just opinions based on my own rationalization of the potential of nihilism.
I've never encountered or read a nihilist toward truth. Most nihilists are existential nihilists or moral nihilists. Their arguments don't fall to your refutations because your refutation required the nihilist's denial of truth.
Nhilism doesn't attempt to challenge truth, only the value placed on the truth. Truth is irrelevant because the value of truth has the same as the value of non-Truth, which is zero.
Nihilism is something that cannot be contradicted because it isn't a justification... When analyzing components at their ground level you begin to understand what has meaning and purpose in our lives. Its not something I can tell you because we don't know, we don't ever know. Realizing and coming to an understanding with this is crucial because it allows us to eliminate establishments we are manipulated into thinking we need to sustain reality, Nihilism's reality is SURVIVAL... nothing more
To say I like blue whether objective or subjective the easiest response is... I really don't give a rats is ass because social norms are justifications of opinions so to say that everything is an opinion one can determine what gives us satisfaction. To say Nihilism in general is a paradox is like saying its flawed and by that you are being ignorant, not wrong but IGNORANT to the general enlightenment.
There is something that is very misleading in this video. Nihilism is a theory of logic and skepticism, it is not a religion or Institution to be founded upon, but rejoiced... For nothing is true, nothing is ever close to true... But does it really matter, you see there are things we surround ourselves our lives WITH but never the less don't matter
I'm not a nihilist, but when you start using the word "preferable" around 5:50, it isn't clear what you mean. What does it mean to say that one statement is "preferable?" Doesn't that presuppose a value system?
I look at nihilism as something like an agnosticism about reality. Not an affirmative statement of truth, but a recognition of ignorance - that truth is not knowable (i.e. truth can't be justified). Others claim that X=5 or 8. A nihilist claims it's impossible to know.
@finny6 Good comment. I am not a nihilist either, and I don't believe anyone really is because a pure nihilist would just die. They wouldn;t have a will to power. But as an existentialist I believe that I choose what is true, what is reality. I know I am ignorant, but I will keep fighting that ignorance to establish my own truths. However in recognizing that those truths are mine, I will not attempt to make them objective or absolute or universally preferable.
rowbadmovies is making you aware of how he perceives your video, not insisting that you agree. Just as i'm telling you my perception, i don't expect you to change yours as much as i'm aware that my own is invalid, and so, therefore, is yours, and his, and hers, and theirs, and ours. if these words have any meaning at all? lol
rowbadmovies is making you aware of how he perceives your video, not insisting that you agree. Just as i'm telling you my perception, i don't expect you to change yours as much as i'm aware that my own is invalid, and so, therefore, is yours, and his, and hers, and theirs, and ours. if these words have any meaning at all? lol
I don't understand ontological Nihilism. Existentially and morally I agree with Nihilism. How can you say accurate statements about truth do not exist? I don't understand that.
- No statement is preferable to any other statement, because objective values are invalid.
This does not follow at all. Denying objective values applicable to all does not deny subjective values or preferences relative to a particular subject.
That means that you can have an opinion about nihilism (which he allowed for), but it is self-contradictory to attempt to correct somebody else, as the act of correcting somebody else assumes that the opinion is not just yours, but applies to both you and the person you are correcting (ie, it is objective).
Agreement doesn't make anything objective, and disagreement doesn't make it subjective.
The distinction between an opinion and an empirical observation should be obvious.
"Root Beer Floats are yummy" is an opinion, and is subjective regardless of the unanimity or ubiquity of that opinion. If we took a Root Beer Float and weighed it to be 10 onces, that would be objective, even if you are of the "opinion" that it is 5 lbs.
The point is, if we say "you are wrong" to somebody who asserts the existence of objective truth, we are EXPLICITLY claiming reality is a subjective and IMPLICITLY claiming that this claim applies universally ( by "correcting" them). After all, the "correctee" does not share that opinion.
If we say the nihilist is tentatively correct, then neither proposition can POSSIBLY be "correct", which is self-contradictory.
The existence of error doesn't exclude correctness.
I don't know how anyone can read "European Nihilism" and conclude that Neitsche was a nihilist. Neitsche is a post-nihilist, egoist and existentialist.
The 'Is Nihilism Possible?' slide is all wrong. You can correct according to speculation. Nihilists speculate just like everyone else speculates In fact this whole show is pretty poor. D4shawn pwns Stef on Tumblr.
These are the tenets of dumb nihilists, angst-ridden teenagers who would flunk a basic college philosophy course. "Truth does not exist" is a paradox. If it is true, then the sentence is meaningless and nihilism is self-defeating because it is a false doctrine. "Values are imaginary." If you mean they don't exist, this is absurd. The existence of values is indisputable; any legitimate nihilist would simply say that values are not a source of moral truth (which does not exist).
A vegetable could be more hurtful than a sword to swallow. It is simply what you take to be bad, and even if you do see it in one way does not mean it doesn't affect other things. Things you wouldn't even know happened.
Mathematics is subjective- It's an idea, and since you are keen on definitions, here's one for you. - existing by perception: existing only in the mind and not independently of it.. And I myself am a nihilist and no one I've ever heard of has made the claim you made about truth. Your arguments are full of strawmen.
I have nevet wanted to succumb to nihilism, because I have a heart. But perhaps that removed, I can't deny the truth in the chaos. It doesn't really mean anything.
"God exists". That's an illusion? Really? You thinking it's an illusion is an illusion in itself. It's an unfounded and unproven metaphysical claim, I would expect more from you.
I mean thats just language problems. How else can you say it. In fact your using this is itself an admition that there is no truth as I can flip the sentence and say "This sentence is false" this is the Liar paradox, maybe read some Tarski, there are many ways around this problem but it certainly can't be used to refute nihlism
I dunno pretty weak argument imo....... whats your grounds for just making a very broad and sweeping statement like reality is objective. Also your refutation on the grounds that if I say "Nothing is true" ,then what I say is true, and therfore something is true is bad.
his explanation is a gross over simplification and at points is simply incorrect. Niihilism is in it's simplest definition the belief that all value is subjective, and all reality is perspective.
So based on the nihilist beliefs and your example with food making me think of this, it would be a contradiction to be a vegetarian or vegan while also being a nihilist?
im getting a little lost here. i am using this definition for nihilism" an extreme form of skepticism: the denial of all real existence or the possibility of an objective basis for truth. being a nihilist is not saying "i have no preference for anything", at least from what i understand about nihilism. i would think a nihilist would say "no preference has greater value than another, as preference has no value". that is not the same has having no preference.
@perfectibility999 You said everything I was thinking much more eloquently than I could. "Morality" is simply an emergent aspect of group selection in a free market.
If you are a Nihilist in the sense that you believe nothing exists, doesn't that give you a free passage to do anything you want? Since whatever you do you're doing nothing in reality anyway.
@stefbot thanks for the upload! It's always refreshing to see philosophical videos/discussions on youtube instead of all that justin bieber, lady gaga crap
I wouldn't really say every single thing is a personal preference; I believe there are some truths, but none of them hold significance to providing meaning to life. My humble opinion.
I believe that all truths exist for a certain duration of time before they are disproven. This means that I dont except anything as absolutely true, but I do assume that some beliefs are useful before they are disproven.
@0oz the reasons concepts and ideas are intangible is because they come from the mind and the mind is intangible. however, the mind exists. otherwise, the entire field of mental health wouldn't exist. so concepts and ideas do exist, but their existence is dependent on the number of people who believe in it and the strength of their belief. whereas the existence of something tangible doesn't require belief to be real
Today at work someone told me I was a nihilist, and I disagreed.
After reading this, I suppose by simply disagreeing with his statement proved my point. That was the easiest arguement I've ever had. Though, I can't help but to think trying to have a debate with a nihilist would be incredibly dull.
"no objective value statements can be made with food" I thought if you like choclate and I like vanilla that is subjective not objective? Is this not true?
Nihilism is primarily the rejection of FAITH, in other words, the rejection of any belief that is based on fairy tales and has no connection with reality - i.e. God, government, family, morality, philosophy. It has nothing to do with personal tastes, as they simply exist inside one's head, just like a rock simply exists - it doesn't need a justification. You can, however, look for a justification of "objective needs" like authoritarianism, capitalism, religion, war, exploitation, racial hatred.
16:00 If no truth is preferable to any other truth - if all perspectives are mere opinions, then a beleif in universal truth cannot be opposed.
If no opinion is preferable to pecan ice cream yumminess - if all ice cream preferences are mere opinions, then a belief in pecan supremacy cannot be opposed.
Correct, because opposition to a subjective value judgement is preposterous.
The Straw Man is a type of Red Herring because the arguer is attempting to (easily) refute his opponent's position... but instead attacks a position—the "straw man"—not held by his opponent.
And I repeated it because you use strawman arguments like a crutch, repetitively, predictably, ad nauseum.
If I prefer purple over white then does that mean I value purple over white. I keep getting caught up on the whole value and personal preference thing.
This is hard to understand for non-nihilists. I thought about this by myself and I like watching this to know I'm not the only one who thinks like this. Also I'm 14 so people think I'm insane....They are products of society
Is empathy for other humans (and animals to a smaller degree) not logical as we can make a fairly accurate assumption of someone's emotions and nervous system being relatively similar to ours?
How isn't the old "do what you woud upon yourself to others" (or whatever it is) not morality based in reason?
I wince when I hear people speak of either "rights" or "morality." It's all implicitly theological.
Questions of value have no "right" answer. What often passes for "moral discourse", is really an articulation of common aspiration (whether due to cultural development, biology, or both) and utility arguments.
Seeing as that is what most "moral" discourse really is, I don't see why we continue with mystifications originating in superstition.
What the fuck was this. Is that all? You only rejected one aspect of nihilism that barely anyone agreed with anyway. What about objective values, or more importantly, objective morality?
Imagine I have a bag of red, green, and blue marbles. Would I be true if I said, "this system is consistent in that the color of the next marble I draw will ALWAYS be random"?
What if I am from a small isolated island and I have never spoken or heard English. You tell me I must breathe to live and I will have no idea what you are talking about. I will certainly not have to breath to live because 'breathe' and 'live' are meaningless.
Any example of truth anyone can come up with is subjective. For instance, I must breathe to live right? Not necessarily. I can remain frozen in ice for a long time without breathing and be resuscitated. Technically I didn't die and I was liv
Say we develop genetic technology where I can grow gills. I grow them and I can breathe under water. The only way you can tell me I MUST breathe air is by banning cloning technologies and forcing me to get a reverse surgery to go back to lung breathing.
Nihilist believe in value, but not objective value.
A nihilist would say that if you believe in objective value, that is your own personal value. If you want other people to believe in objectivism, you have to compete and make a good argument. Claiming that objectivism is a universal truth is like starting an argument by saying you are right, without even waiting to hear what your opponents claims are. You assume truth and value are universal.
"If no truth is preferable to an other truth, if all perspectives are mere opinions- then a belief in universal truth can not be opposed"
As I understand it, nihilism does not say that no truth is preferable to another truth. It says whatever truth you prefer is a truth you prefer. A truth can be preferable to another truth if you decide it is.
There is no 'objectively preferable'. Say someone has what's called pica. Pica is a disorder characterized by a desire to eat chalk, dust, clay, paper, mucous. Again, there is no such thing as 'objectivity' because there are exceptions to EVERY rule or example you can give.
@drew335533 ANY exception is suitable. Why? Because the letters and words 'orbit' and 'sun' have no universally preferable meaning. Only YOU give them meaning. YOU decide that the earth orbits around the sun. If we did not create meaning there would be no earth.
The earth would still exist external to our mind. I would say they have meaning because you can understand what I am saying. I don't decide that the earth orbits around the sun, it is show by empirical testing. I can't make the earth not orbit the sun.
@drew335533 The only reason I can understand what you are writing is because we agree to the meanings of these words. I could decide at any time that the word 'earth' or 'orbit' has no meaning or definite value. If we were not here to observe the earth, there would be no earth. Much the same way different animals percieve colors differently, or some animals are blind and sense by sonar, we sense the earth. Empiricism is based on senses and thus entirely subjective and flawed. Knowledge is finite
@drew335533 'Earth' and 'sun' are simply words that YOU decide the meaning. If our minds did not apply meaning to specific vowels, consonants, sounds we make with out bodies, there would be no meaning. Meaning is absent without you there to consent to it. Therefore the earth does not orbit around the sun unless you say it does, and I say it does.
The words food and objectively and preferable and all words only have meaning if you allow them to have meaning. You are agreeing to their terms. You are producing their sounds. Therefore the nihilist position is supported. Any meaning to words or to your sounds or to life is the meaning you give it. Any value you have for gravel or for donuts or for bananas is your value.
"No food is 'biologically' preferable to any other food."
Many primitive tribes process poisonous plants, make them healthy and nutritious, and sustain themselves on them. A banana may be 'biologically' preferable to a doughnut unless the banana is green with mold and the doughnut is fresh. My point is, there are always exceptions, always variables, and that these variables can not be predicted and reproduced with enough consistency to render any authority legitimate.
I've watched two youtube videos about nihilism and so far I've yet to see a so called 'nihilist' give a convincing rebuttal.
'ANihilist' seems to be the most enthusiastic defender of nihilism but he is really turning me off by have NO substance to his arguments. In my next comment I'll give some EXAMPLES of what I'm talking about.
Well shit what kind of argument do you want I am more articulate than you think. These little boxes do not have enough room for something fleshed out I am afraid.
Truth is just a word. Just a guttural sound that humans emit and because of their ability to do so are so satisfied with themselves. What said humans do not realize is that they should give themselves credit for creating the sounds, and for deciding what the sounds mean, rather than for 'discovering' the 'truth'.
Indeed, truth is not something that one may literally grasp or see. It is merely an imaginary means of validating what we perceive to be real. Forgive my lack of clarity but I am in a rush right now I would like to have discussions with anyone who wants to discuss Nihilism or philosophy in general.
As a person who is trying to learn a thing or two about Nihilism, I find that it would be most helpful if people like 'Bertny' or 'Anihilist' would actually give EXAMPLES that show how this video is inacccurate.
i found most of this stuff to be accurate i believe myself to be a nihilist a statement that does not sit well with most of the people at my school because i go to a catholic school ( Parents Choice not mine ) i feel that religion is wrong but i believe in personnal preferences and that is their choice. living in australia we have no national religion this means that our government does not hold any bias towards certain religions and we are free to believe what we want altho there are bigots.
The only interesting definition of "nihilism" is the one that speaks of the lacking existense of moral values... and there's no paradox within that one.
I've come to the conclusion that nihilism isn't contradictory, but ti's pretty much useless as far as a philosophy goes. It's like saying " the universe is just made of matter and energy and there's nothing else to be said about it". But our existence, our individuality, consciousness, exists, and even nihilists admit that. We may not know the objective truth of it all, but it's just an excuse to stop halfway and say "there can be no objective or universal morality". Why? I say yes there can be.
So on one hand I see morality as completely pointless but on another I believe everyone should love each other what the fuck am I!
inferno634 1 week ago
Nihilists are not allowed to have an opinion lol
clintcastle 2 months ago
@clintcastle Yes they are lol
sticksquash 2 weeks ago
Mathematics is not subjective..but accounting is...lol
tillman40 2 months ago 2
So as a nihilist, can you ask questions? Such as when someone says "i like blue"... can you ask questions about why they like it or think that way? In a sense to show that their belief that blue rocks is only an opinion? I better example would be if someone says something like, "womans rights was a positive effect on the world", do you just say "how interesting!" or can you ask questions that would then lead the person to the other conclusion (aka socratic method). You never corrected them.
bluefootedpig 3 months ago
Very excellent presentation. I enjoyed watching.
jbearden 3 months ago
sorry, the free man already killed your god
12NadaSurf12 3 months ago
@Morgethein If you accept such a meaning then yes. But for some that may not be a meaning of life. Also as someone said in another video you are like the just crowd.
Valkbg 5 months ago
@Morgethein You are contradicting yourself. You say life has no meaning and then state a meaning of life.
Valkbg 5 months ago
could someone regard him/herself as some sort of a weak nihilist, that he/she excepts nihilism but also excepts being a human and thus having emotions and preferences which might be more preferable than others. for example: jumping from a cliff isn't bad or good but a nihilist could recognize this but might hold the position that not jumping is better if you want to survive thus having an agenda on which you behave.
Quiestre 5 months ago
@Quiestre Nihilists believe that there is no objective truth. So most of them design their own subjective truths. In my opinion weak nihilists are the ones that stay nihilists meaning they just dont have any values at all.
Valkbg 5 months ago
@Valkbg With "weak" nihilists i mean epistemological Nihilists. that understand that all values have no meaning but still subscribe to a personal emotional preference they'd like to see in all humanity. You could say prefered subjective morals. I mean i understand nihilistic ideals but couldnt really live by them, because of my own ego and my upbringing aswell as my emotional reaction to what i perseive as reality.
Quiestre 5 months ago
He is wrong in assuming that consensus means objectivity. There is no mutual exclusiveness between the two terms. Consensus can be reached for the benefit of a group, i.e. language, but it doesn't follow that we now have reached an objective meaning. Objectivity means that something is not subject to change, any such consensus reached example could be subject to change. I see no rationale proof provided for the existence of inherent objective values, and that's what his refusal rests upon.
Pomaori 6 months ago
I think Walt Disney was a little nihilistic. Can anyone disprove this that likes stereotypes..I mean after all "It's a small world after all"
LaharlD2 6 months ago
@Morgethein So... I can think and feel and believe whatever I want, but it means nothing, as morals are a conceptual notion made by people, and thus, do not truly exist? Nothing is truly the best, or the greenest, or the coolest, or the anything(est?) because everything is different to everyone and therefor nothing means anything? Interesting stuff here, this nihilism.
Scipiothegreat 6 months ago
I don't quite understand nihilism... if everything is just not real...how am I typing. Please help this make sense...
Scipiothegreat 6 months ago
Nihilism is just retarded =/
theboytiger 7 months ago
@theboytiger no that's you
SuperSkepticism 7 months ago
Wait so is morality actually an illusion but we can't argue against a universal moral premise because that would be violating nihilism? I'm not sure that that proves morality is not an illusion but it does prove that a nihilist can have no say in a universal moral premise.
rangaman94 7 months ago
if truth does not exist why it cant be subjective, if reality does not exist then who cares? if something doesnt exist there is no "right and wrong" because none of them exist i dont get that part..
jadv91 7 months ago
@jadv91 Let me try to explain. Basically, lets just say you're floating in space for all eternity. No matter what you do, it will not affect anything and it won't matter. It's sort of like that. You can make bad choices of good choices but in the end nothing changes. Atoms will just do what atoms do.
cybershockandifrit 7 months ago
Great video!
sevieht 8 months ago
Maybe I'm dumb, but I'm still missing the part where it's explained how reality is objective?
anonymouse27 8 months ago
@anonymouse27
Reality is not objective. The orange horse with a square circle for an ankle shoulder told me on Tuesday nights last Sunday, just after I milked the cardboard boxes and shaved my donkey's golden cherub.
That's why a meter is a different length in different cities, and why the weight of 1 liter of water is different in Canada than it is in Australia. It also explains why the sun revolves around the earth depending on where you are at the time.
It's also why science doesn't work.
socrates0ne 8 months ago
@socrates0ne For your posited arbitrary universe, I can provide many other subjective ones that SEEM objective. But reality being objective is not a self-evident truth, nor can it ever be. Dance around that and deride the implications of that all you wish, but you know that you can't touch it. However, the truth of that notwithstanding, this is not the reason why Stefan's attempt to construct objective morality fails spectacularly.
anonymouse27 7 months ago
@anonymouse27
I'm agreeing with you that reality is not objective. However, I DISAGREE with you that reality is not objective.
Since everything that can be objectively verified can not be objectively verified, all things that are objectively verified are inherently subjective. Objective subjectivity is subject to subjective objectivity. It's very simple.
So, we're in complete agreement, because we completely disagree with each other.
socrates0ne 7 months ago
@socrates0ne Good. I'm glad you see the light.
anonymouse27 7 months ago
In analogy you compered values to tastes.....are you mocking everyones sense for reason? Its not like i can compare Ffouriers order to a pilling boxes full of apples. God knows i can try bu this is not philospohy 101
TaleBulleta 9 months ago
Excellent. While I found myself debating specific details throughout, by the end I found your beliefs to fall parallel with my own. However, I would describe them differently: truth as any man can figure (or perceive) it will be metaphor (not false) when compared to Truth (capitalized for objectivity/universality). That is to say; Truth in it's natural state is not observable by the logical structures it creates (us), but CAN be understood with metaphor (science, math, religion, etc.).
YouMayCa11MeV 9 months ago
It sounds like you're arguing against the idea that the concepts of truth, values, and morality aren't real, but I think the nihilist position is that those concepts are pointless/worthless because the effect of them being real isn't necessarily different than if they weren't. For instance, a robot could be programmed to think it likes mustard. Does it really have a taste for mustard? Can you prove it? Does it matter? The answers to the last two are definitely "no".
NsaneNtheNbrane 10 months ago
human language contradicts itself but the things that the human talks about isn't a contradiction.... remember the closer you get to the truth, the harder it is to speak of it because you can't speak the truth, we humans can only state facts
TheHarumScarum 10 months ago
contradicting yourself with this vid and the one on selfishness......morality being an illusion ............too many inconsistencies ...among the two vids saying blaming one for being selfish and calling it moral sup;ierority then saying morality is an illusion...
MrAndols 10 months ago
"What is that chinging noise?"
scar504 11 months ago
For anyone who desires the truth, I would highly recommend checking out the scribd website that is listed on my channel.
DreamsofMajesty 11 months ago
Things are as they are. The truth is the truth whether we perceive it accurately or not. I can't speak for all nihilists, but when you get down to it, who/what would it matter to if the universe consisted solely of vacuum, or didn't exist at all? Nobody. Nothing. Everything built upon that is simply potential behavior of increasingly complex atomic structures. Nihilism as you present it is clearly absurd (well done, btw). As I've interpreted and adapted it, anything more is just Lego play.
ShankDanny 11 months ago
That is very interesting!
Adlasyn 1 year ago
"I hope that it helps you understand that nihlism is no so much a problem to be solved but a diesease to be cured". If you are looking for a sensible unbiased discussion of this subject, look elsewhere.
kkownzor 1 year ago 17
"Nothing is true but this statement." fix'd
The nihilism paradox is easily resolved this way. The only objective truth is that there are no OTHER objective truths. This is the only "true" certainty one can have, not that certainty even should matter.
MichaelExe 1 year ago
a nihilist can say "you've chosen health as your personal preference, and given that, this food is better than that food, for that goal" can't he?
jameshanley40 1 year ago
the goal of health is just a personal preference, but an evolutionary one. and one that most people have. What we put in our mouths is just personal preference, but objective relative to the goal of health.. which is subjective. A bit different to something as arbitrary as liking a particular colour.
jameshanley40 1 year ago
I'm going to do my nihilism homework. "I like nihilism"
bronxman4u2000 1 year ago
I don't understand why nihilism is opposed to objective truth. Why can't a nihilist believe it is objectively true that gases expand when heated and correct someone who thinks they contract when heated?
DeverHB 1 year ago
This video is full of arrogance and bigotry and does not reflect a nihilist thinking at all. It was made for masses to tell them "nihilism is bad" sorta like a parent tells to a kid "alcohol is bad".
A nihilist believes that truth does exist, he believes that values are real but useless and he believes morality is useless to him but useful for everyone else.
A nihilist is individualistic, without morals or values and does whatever he wants because he doesnt see any reason why he shouldnt.
Del249 1 year ago
@Del249 sounds like you, sir, just gave a proper definition of existentialism instead.
therookie93 1 year ago
...reported in the news paper the next day. The empiricist perspective of seeing the murder would have given it no more valid truth than seeing it in the newspaper the next day.
So truth is truth and nothing else.
peterjjune 1 year ago
However to say the truth is meaningless is not to say there is no truth, to say blue is nice is itself truthful for that person, it is however a non-effective truth.
Another example of the meaninglessness of truth is:
I was on the bus the other day, the bus driver got in an argument with a passenger, the passenger got quite irate, and I said to myself 'If he kills him now, it would not matter if I was here or not, it would have happened anyway.'
So if there was a murder it would have been...
peterjjune 1 year ago
So you pronounce it Nyilism as in Bill Nye?
mynameisjonas45 1 year ago
i think that the real benefit of nihilism is how accepting it's concepts alters your thought process. in my opinion, it can go either one of two ways. either you become suicidal (hey, if nothing really matters anyway...) or you could do just the opposite and pursue whatever desires you may have, it's like a sense of mental liberation.
again, these are just opinions based on my own rationalization of the potential of nihilism.
k1ngCrims0n 1 year ago
I've never encountered or read a nihilist toward truth. Most nihilists are existential nihilists or moral nihilists. Their arguments don't fall to your refutations because your refutation required the nihilist's denial of truth.
BryJolly927 1 year ago
I prefer red...
TomahawkTerror 1 year ago
Nhilism doesn't attempt to challenge truths, only the perceived value placed upon the truth. Value is subjective, therefore the truth is irrelevent.
goomhs 1 year ago
Nhilism doesn't attempt to challenge truth, only the value placed on the truth. Truth is irrelevant because the value of truth has the same as the value of non-Truth, which is zero.
goomhs 1 year ago
@goomhs Great comments.
landgabriel 1 year ago
Nihilism is something that cannot be contradicted because it isn't a justification... When analyzing components at their ground level you begin to understand what has meaning and purpose in our lives. Its not something I can tell you because we don't know, we don't ever know. Realizing and coming to an understanding with this is crucial because it allows us to eliminate establishments we are manipulated into thinking we need to sustain reality, Nihilism's reality is SURVIVAL... nothing more
constan34 1 year ago
@constan34 I agree with this
landgabriel 1 year ago
To say I like blue whether objective or subjective the easiest response is... I really don't give a rats is ass because social norms are justifications of opinions so to say that everything is an opinion one can determine what gives us satisfaction. To say Nihilism in general is a paradox is like saying its flawed and by that you are being ignorant, not wrong but IGNORANT to the general enlightenment.
constan34 1 year ago
There is something that is very misleading in this video. Nihilism is a theory of logic and skepticism, it is not a religion or Institution to be founded upon, but rejoiced... For nothing is true, nothing is ever close to true... But does it really matter, you see there are things we surround ourselves our lives WITH but never the less don't matter
constan34 1 year ago
I'm not a nihilist, but when you start using the word "preferable" around 5:50, it isn't clear what you mean. What does it mean to say that one statement is "preferable?" Doesn't that presuppose a value system?
I look at nihilism as something like an agnosticism about reality. Not an affirmative statement of truth, but a recognition of ignorance - that truth is not knowable (i.e. truth can't be justified). Others claim that X=5 or 8. A nihilist claims it's impossible to know.
finny6 1 year ago
@finny6 Good comment. I am not a nihilist either, and I don't believe anyone really is because a pure nihilist would just die. They wouldn;t have a will to power. But as an existentialist I believe that I choose what is true, what is reality. I know I am ignorant, but I will keep fighting that ignorance to establish my own truths. However in recognizing that those truths are mine, I will not attempt to make them objective or absolute or universally preferable.
landgabriel 1 year ago
"God exists." Illusion haha
therookie93 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
rowbadmovies is making you aware of how he perceives your video, not insisting that you agree. Just as i'm telling you my perception, i don't expect you to change yours as much as i'm aware that my own is invalid, and so, therefore, is yours, and his, and hers, and theirs, and ours. if these words have any meaning at all? lol
TheAIDSCARRIER 1 year ago
rowbadmovies is making you aware of how he perceives your video, not insisting that you agree. Just as i'm telling you my perception, i don't expect you to change yours as much as i'm aware that my own is invalid, and so, therefore, is yours, and his, and hers, and theirs, and ours. if these words have any meaning at all? lol
TheAIDSCARRIER 1 year ago
I don't understand ontological Nihilism. Existentially and morally I agree with Nihilism. How can you say accurate statements about truth do not exist? I don't understand that.
NekoD3m0n 1 year ago
He says: If we accept the nihilist position
- No statement is preferable to any other statement, because objective values are invalid.
This does not follow at all. Denying objective values applicable to all does not deny subjective values or preferences relative to a particular subject.
buybuydandavis 1 year ago 15
@buybuydandavis
That means that you can have an opinion about nihilism (which he allowed for), but it is self-contradictory to attempt to correct somebody else, as the act of correcting somebody else assumes that the opinion is not just yours, but applies to both you and the person you are correcting (ie, it is objective).
socrates0ne 8 months ago
@socrates0ne
So if we share the opinion that Root Beer Floats are yummy, it is Objectively True that they are?
What a peculiar notion.
buybuydandavis 7 months ago
@buybuydandavis
Agreement doesn't make anything objective, and disagreement doesn't make it subjective.
The distinction between an opinion and an empirical observation should be obvious.
"Root Beer Floats are yummy" is an opinion, and is subjective regardless of the unanimity or ubiquity of that opinion. If we took a Root Beer Float and weighed it to be 10 onces, that would be objective, even if you are of the "opinion" that it is 5 lbs.
socrates0ne 7 months ago
@buybuydandavis
The point is, if we say "you are wrong" to somebody who asserts the existence of objective truth, we are EXPLICITLY claiming reality is a subjective and IMPLICITLY claiming that this claim applies universally ( by "correcting" them). After all, the "correctee" does not share that opinion.
If we say the nihilist is tentatively correct, then neither proposition can POSSIBLY be "correct", which is self-contradictory.
The existence of error doesn't exclude correctness.
socrates0ne 7 months ago
I don't know how anyone can read "European Nihilism" and conclude that Neitsche was a nihilist. Neitsche is a post-nihilist, egoist and existentialist.
DaveDoggOwns 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
type God into myspace and check out my videos there
godkingofthepunks 1 year ago
The 'Is Nihilism Possible?' slide is all wrong. You can correct according to speculation. Nihilists speculate just like everyone else speculates In fact this whole show is pretty poor. D4shawn pwns Stef on Tumblr.
podrag 1 year ago
These are the tenets of dumb nihilists, angst-ridden teenagers who would flunk a basic college philosophy course. "Truth does not exist" is a paradox. If it is true, then the sentence is meaningless and nihilism is self-defeating because it is a false doctrine. "Values are imaginary." If you mean they don't exist, this is absurd. The existence of values is indisputable; any legitimate nihilist would simply say that values are not a source of moral truth (which does not exist).
TheRedHutt 1 year ago
"God Exists.... ehehe... illusion" Hahaha... oh man. That was awesome. Was NOT expecting that, but that added a nice touch to the video.
StainedShuriken333 1 year ago
i wish i had the time to give a full response but i don't
first, your not very funny and Nietzsche is not a nihilist
second, dont confuse nihilism with subjectivism
third, sorry i said your not funny
TheWillIamLee87 1 year ago
A vegetable could be more hurtful than a sword to swallow. It is simply what you take to be bad, and even if you do see it in one way does not mean it doesn't affect other things. Things you wouldn't even know happened.
whydoangelscry 1 year ago
Mathematics is subjective- It's an idea, and since you are keen on definitions, here's one for you. - existing by perception: existing only in the mind and not independently of it.. And I myself am a nihilist and no one I've ever heard of has made the claim you made about truth. Your arguments are full of strawmen.
XxMetalManxX 1 year ago 5
I agree
2Godbdaglori 1 year ago
I have nevet wanted to succumb to nihilism, because I have a heart. But perhaps that removed, I can't deny the truth in the chaos. It doesn't really mean anything.
fairiebee 1 year ago
wow those are some terrible definitions... Nihilists do not believe in "human projected truth" not that we "deny" reality or scientific facts...
Jester2415 1 year ago
Your examination contains the easiest examples to argue. You seem insistent that the nihilist corrects others.
RowBadMovies 1 year ago
@RowBadMovies Are you a nihilist who is correcting me? ;)
stefbot 1 year ago 18
@stefbot He hasn't really corrected you, merely stated his opinion on your video.
D3vilz4dvocate 1 year ago
@stefbot
Epic win on your part.
drew335533 1 year ago
"God exists". That's an illusion? Really? You thinking it's an illusion is an illusion in itself. It's an unfounded and unproven metaphysical claim, I would expect more from you.
ogirv101 1 year ago
Perhaps they should look up all the schools of Nihilism Existential, Ethical, political, Mereological and many other forms of Nihilism.
ZachVMNTX1 1 year ago
thanks this really helped
tommorellorules 1 year ago
I mean thats just language problems. How else can you say it. In fact your using this is itself an admition that there is no truth as I can flip the sentence and say "This sentence is false" this is the Liar paradox, maybe read some Tarski, there are many ways around this problem but it certainly can't be used to refute nihlism
Dewaters65 1 year ago
I dunno pretty weak argument imo....... whats your grounds for just making a very broad and sweeping statement like reality is objective. Also your refutation on the grounds that if I say "Nothing is true" ,then what I say is true, and therfore something is true is bad.
Dewaters65 1 year ago
How silly is it to say that truth is subjective?
You can disbelieve gravity all you want, walking off a cliff is still going to kill you.
lordthawkeye 1 year ago
@lordthawkeye Gravity doesn't exist for bubbles, they float not fall, dawg.
Erich745 1 year ago
@Erich745
Actually, in calm wind, they will fall. :p
lordthawkeye 1 year ago
what. the fuck? so nihilism is just not believing anything? someone explain
subwayisgoodxxx 1 year ago
@subwayisgoodxxx
his explanation is a gross over simplification and at points is simply incorrect. Niihilism is in it's simplest definition the belief that all value is subjective, and all reality is perspective.
NDLlama1 1 year ago
So based on the nihilist beliefs and your example with food making me think of this, it would be a contradiction to be a vegetarian or vegan while also being a nihilist?
caughtXinXaXmoment 1 year ago
im getting a little lost here. i am using this definition for nihilism" an extreme form of skepticism: the denial of all real existence or the possibility of an objective basis for truth. being a nihilist is not saying "i have no preference for anything", at least from what i understand about nihilism. i would think a nihilist would say "no preference has greater value than another, as preference has no value". that is not the same has having no preference.
ancientcian 1 year ago
@ancientcian thas wat i wuz gonna say
woss this geezer onabout eh?
natmanprime 1 year ago
NIHILITY by DECAPITATED
Ehb42021 1 year ago
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perfectibility999 1 year ago
@perfectibility999 You said everything I was thinking much more eloquently than I could. "Morality" is simply an emergent aspect of group selection in a free market.
PJCelis 1 year ago
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perfectibility999 1 year ago
If you are a Nihilist in the sense that you believe nothing exists, doesn't that give you a free passage to do anything you want? Since whatever you do you're doing nothing in reality anyway.
doom032 1 year ago
great film. kudos!
socaldave88 1 year ago
@socaldave88 thanks!
stefbot 1 year ago
@stefbot thanks for the upload! It's always refreshing to see philosophical videos/discussions on youtube instead of all that justin bieber, lady gaga crap
dsalazar19 1 year ago
The only thing any of us know for sure is that we(ourselves) exist.
100bml 1 year ago
I think postive value statements should always be regarded as false, i.e "X is good" or "X is bad" are always false statements.
This means negative value statements are always true. So "X is neither good nor bad" is always a true statement.
In my understanding this is a nihilistic position, but I am unsure.
goremand 1 year ago
I wouldn't really say every single thing is a personal preference; I believe there are some truths, but none of them hold significance to providing meaning to life. My humble opinion.
bqureshi21 1 year ago
Oh right, so it is true that truth does not exist?
That's pretty cool, it's not like it's false by definition or something. :P
michaba03m 1 year ago
I believe that all truths exist for a certain duration of time before they are disproven. This means that I dont except anything as absolutely true, but I do assume that some beliefs are useful before they are disproven.
Does this make me a nihilist?
bengron 1 year ago
Correct me if I'm wrong.
Is this video saying that intangible things do not exist like concepts and ideas?
And do things need to be tangible in order to exist?
0oz 2 years ago
@0oz the reasons concepts and ideas are intangible is because they come from the mind and the mind is intangible. however, the mind exists. otherwise, the entire field of mental health wouldn't exist. so concepts and ideas do exist, but their existence is dependent on the number of people who believe in it and the strength of their belief. whereas the existence of something tangible doesn't require belief to be real
cantlandaswitchflip 1 year ago
Darkness, light, word, existence. Could it be false? salvation is nothing, nothing is salvation.
f4zaken 2 years ago
i like ur videos, and u kept me interested, the whole video, you should be a teacher. :)
xjsk88 2 years ago
Ok so if truth does not exist, does that mean that existence is not true?
Raphael431 2 years ago
LoL bad latin pronunciation, the nihil word should be pronounced as the same part of nihilismus of German he said.
Caporacolo 2 years ago
Today at work someone told me I was a nihilist, and I disagreed.
After reading this, I suppose by simply disagreeing with his statement proved my point. That was the easiest arguement I've ever had. Though, I can't help but to think trying to have a debate with a nihilist would be incredibly dull.
InkBleedsDeeper 2 years ago
"no objective value statements can be made with food" I thought if you like choclate and I like vanilla that is subjective not objective? Is this not true?
LibertyJedi 2 years ago
Nihilism is primarily the rejection of FAITH, in other words, the rejection of any belief that is based on fairy tales and has no connection with reality - i.e. God, government, family, morality, philosophy. It has nothing to do with personal tastes, as they simply exist inside one's head, just like a rock simply exists - it doesn't need a justification. You can, however, look for a justification of "objective needs" like authoritarianism, capitalism, religion, war, exploitation, racial hatred.
samometal 2 years ago
You take an extreme look at philosophy of language which words reflect only on them self's, when really they reflect of reality and self.
Forkroute 2 years ago
16:00 If no truth is preferable to any other truth - if all perspectives are mere opinions, then a beleif in universal truth cannot be opposed.
If no opinion is preferable to pecan ice cream yumminess - if all ice cream preferences are mere opinions, then a belief in pecan supremacy cannot be opposed.
Correct, because opposition to a subjective value judgement is preposterous.
NihilistImp 2 years ago
And you base your opinion on what?
You contradict yourself and claim to be rational.
how funny.
Forkroute 2 years ago
After definitions: Strawman, strawman, strawman.
NihilistImp 2 years ago
haha oic, it's sort of an incantation, you say it three times, and it's an argument! outstanding.
stefbot 2 years ago 10
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NihilistImp 2 years ago
The Straw Man is a type of Red Herring because the arguer is attempting to (easily) refute his opponent's position... but instead attacks a position—the "straw man"—not held by his opponent.
And I repeated it because you use strawman arguments like a crutch, repetitively, predictably, ad nauseum.
NihilistImp 2 years ago
any context you should update us about it?
Forkroute 2 years ago
If I prefer purple over white then does that mean I value purple over white. I keep getting caught up on the whole value and personal preference thing.
diglamash 2 years ago
Correct. Nihilism fails when one "corrects" another. Doing so would assign a value where there are none.
Interesting though, how quick we are to "cure" a "disease" which hinders our ability to "prove" people "wrong", or,
attack anything that threatens the ego.
The happy nihilist actively seeks to destroy all value.
This video makes the case!
Perhaps it was satirical?
mostlymediocre 2 years ago 2
This is hard to understand for non-nihilists. I thought about this by myself and I like watching this to know I'm not the only one who thinks like this. Also I'm 14 so people think I'm insane....They are products of society
littlebigpie 2 years ago
This adressed to the Nihilists.
Is empathy for other humans (and animals to a smaller degree) not logical as we can make a fairly accurate assumption of someone's emotions and nervous system being relatively similar to ours?
How isn't the old "do what you woud upon yourself to others" (or whatever it is) not morality based in reason?
Please criticise it.
YouKnowWhereThisEnds 2 years ago
Depends which sort of "nihilist" you ask.
I wince when I hear people speak of either "rights" or "morality." It's all implicitly theological.
Questions of value have no "right" answer. What often passes for "moral discourse", is really an articulation of common aspiration (whether due to cultural development, biology, or both) and utility arguments.
Seeing as that is what most "moral" discourse really is, I don't see why we continue with mystifications originating in superstition.
RadicalSolutions 2 years ago
And what's wrong with morals growing out of common aspirations, utility arguments or biological?
Forkroute 2 years ago
Nihilism is not easily defined by non-Nihilist as this video shows.
Glapo 2 years ago
@Glapo i agree, i mean "That interesting"!
mohawkid 2 years ago
What the fuck was this. Is that all? You only rejected one aspect of nihilism that barely anyone agreed with anyway. What about objective values, or more importantly, objective morality?
NE0C0R7EX 2 years ago
You're quite right of course, I should really have dealt with every important philosophical concept in 16 minutes, thanks for the reminder! :)
stefbot 2 years ago
You added this video more than a year ago.. do you plan on making any more videos that will address the remaining two philosophical aspects?
NE0C0R7EX 2 years ago
Well, you might want to check out my free book on objective ethics, available on my website.
stefbot 2 years ago
Imagine I have a bag of red, green, and blue marbles. Would I be true if I said, "this system is consistent in that the color of the next marble I draw will ALWAYS be random"?
muffin1102 2 years ago
This is all so mind blowing >:(
pompyromage 2 years ago
ing the whole time I was in the ice.
What if I am from a small isolated island and I have never spoken or heard English. You tell me I must breathe to live and I will have no idea what you are talking about. I will certainly not have to breath to live because 'breathe' and 'live' are meaningless.
universatile 2 years ago
Any example of truth anyone can come up with is subjective. For instance, I must breathe to live right? Not necessarily. I can remain frozen in ice for a long time without breathing and be resuscitated. Technically I didn't die and I was liv
universatile 2 years ago
Say we develop genetic technology where I can grow gills. I grow them and I can breathe under water. The only way you can tell me I MUST breathe air is by banning cloning technologies and forcing me to get a reverse surgery to go back to lung breathing.
universatile 2 years ago
Nihilist believe in value, but not objective value.
A nihilist would say that if you believe in objective value, that is your own personal value. If you want other people to believe in objectivism, you have to compete and make a good argument. Claiming that objectivism is a universal truth is like starting an argument by saying you are right, without even waiting to hear what your opponents claims are. You assume truth and value are universal.
universatile 2 years ago
"If no truth is preferable to an other truth, if all perspectives are mere opinions- then a belief in universal truth can not be opposed"
As I understand it, nihilism does not say that no truth is preferable to another truth. It says whatever truth you prefer is a truth you prefer. A truth can be preferable to another truth if you decide it is.
universatile 2 years ago
There is no 'objectively preferable'. Say someone has what's called pica. Pica is a disorder characterized by a desire to eat chalk, dust, clay, paper, mucous. Again, there is no such thing as 'objectivity' because there are exceptions to EVERY rule or example you can give.
universatile 2 years ago
@universatile
The earth orbits around the sun? What exception can you give?
drew335533 1 year ago
@drew335533 ANY exception is suitable. Why? Because the letters and words 'orbit' and 'sun' have no universally preferable meaning. Only YOU give them meaning. YOU decide that the earth orbits around the sun. If we did not create meaning there would be no earth.
landgabriel 1 year ago
@landgabriel
The earth would still exist external to our mind. I would say they have meaning because you can understand what I am saying. I don't decide that the earth orbits around the sun, it is show by empirical testing. I can't make the earth not orbit the sun.
drew335533 1 year ago
@drew335533 The only reason I can understand what you are writing is because we agree to the meanings of these words. I could decide at any time that the word 'earth' or 'orbit' has no meaning or definite value. If we were not here to observe the earth, there would be no earth. Much the same way different animals percieve colors differently, or some animals are blind and sense by sonar, we sense the earth. Empiricism is based on senses and thus entirely subjective and flawed. Knowledge is finite
landgabriel 1 year ago
@drew335533 'Earth' and 'sun' are simply words that YOU decide the meaning. If our minds did not apply meaning to specific vowels, consonants, sounds we make with out bodies, there would be no meaning. Meaning is absent without you there to consent to it. Therefore the earth does not orbit around the sun unless you say it does, and I say it does.
universatile 9 months ago
The words food and objectively and preferable and all words only have meaning if you allow them to have meaning. You are agreeing to their terms. You are producing their sounds. Therefore the nihilist position is supported. Any meaning to words or to your sounds or to life is the meaning you give it. Any value you have for gravel or for donuts or for bananas is your value.
universatile 2 years ago
"No food is 'biologically' preferable to any other food."
Many primitive tribes process poisonous plants, make them healthy and nutritious, and sustain themselves on them. A banana may be 'biologically' preferable to a doughnut unless the banana is green with mold and the doughnut is fresh. My point is, there are always exceptions, always variables, and that these variables can not be predicted and reproduced with enough consistency to render any authority legitimate.
universatile 2 years ago
"No statement is preferable to any other statement, because objective values are invalid."
Preferable to whom? Preferences are entirely subjective.
universatile 2 years ago
I've watched two youtube videos about nihilism and so far I've yet to see a so called 'nihilist' give a convincing rebuttal.
'ANihilist' seems to be the most enthusiastic defender of nihilism but he is really turning me off by have NO substance to his arguments. In my next comment I'll give some EXAMPLES of what I'm talking about.
dopejoel 2 years ago
Well shit what kind of argument do you want I am more articulate than you think. These little boxes do not have enough room for something fleshed out I am afraid.
Anihilist 2 years ago
Yeah objective moral truth is bullshit
Anihilist 2 years ago
Truth is just a word. Just a guttural sound that humans emit and because of their ability to do so are so satisfied with themselves. What said humans do not realize is that they should give themselves credit for creating the sounds, and for deciding what the sounds mean, rather than for 'discovering' the 'truth'.
universatile 2 years ago
Indeed, truth is not something that one may literally grasp or see. It is merely an imaginary means of validating what we perceive to be real. Forgive my lack of clarity but I am in a rush right now I would like to have discussions with anyone who wants to discuss Nihilism or philosophy in general.
Anihilist 2 years ago
As a person who is trying to learn a thing or two about Nihilism, I find that it would be most helpful if people like 'Bertny' or 'Anihilist' would actually give EXAMPLES that show how this video is inacccurate.
dopejoel 2 years ago
Truth not existing is a truth ahah that form of Nihilism is false and for idiots. There is more to Nihilism than what this lout has to say about it.
Anihilist 2 years ago
i found most of this stuff to be accurate i believe myself to be a nihilist a statement that does not sit well with most of the people at my school because i go to a catholic school ( Parents Choice not mine ) i feel that religion is wrong but i believe in personnal preferences and that is their choice. living in australia we have no national religion this means that our government does not hold any bias towards certain religions and we are free to believe what we want altho there are bigots.
1c22x333 2 years ago
this is basically all wrong. i am a nihilist and almost all of this is incorrect.
Bertny 2 years ago
I guess that means being a nihilist means never having to provide reasons or evidence... :)
stefbot 2 years ago
Apparently so. =/
dopejoel 2 years ago
1.42 minutes and I've seen enough... solipsism is not nihilism... but if you want to mix it... fine..
DocStrange0123 2 years ago
The only interesting definition of "nihilism" is the one that speaks of the lacking existense of moral values... and there's no paradox within that one.
ballaballaballen 2 years ago
I've come to the conclusion that nihilism isn't contradictory, but ti's pretty much useless as far as a philosophy goes. It's like saying " the universe is just made of matter and energy and there's nothing else to be said about it". But our existence, our individuality, consciousness, exists, and even nihilists admit that. We may not know the objective truth of it all, but it's just an excuse to stop halfway and say "there can be no objective or universal morality". Why? I say yes there can be.
yuberries 2 years ago
hahah thats very interesting.
razenoise 2 years ago
Who cares!
preciouspaul847 2 years ago
Comment removed
GrantMorey 2 years ago