America has the GREATEST Healthcare System in the world and proves that govt run socialist healthcare in Europe and Asia are ALL EPIC FAILS! President Palin will completely ELIMINATE govt run healthcare around the whole world with the Palin Revolution and convert all of these socialist systems into the VASTLY SUPERIOR privatized American free-market capitalist healthcare system!
DONT FORGET 34 MILLION OF UR PEOPLE GET NO MEDICAL SUPPORT STOP LISTENING TO THE INSURANCE FEAR FONGERS SIR U MUST SPEAK UP FIGHT TO SAVE UR COUNTRY END THE PRIVATE SYSTEM THE BEST SYSTEM IS A GOVT SYSTEM TOMMY DOUGLAS
So basically the point of this video is that we spend to much on healthcare, right? Not only does the private sector pays too much, but the public sector pays too much as well. Is that what is being stated? I'm just trying to be sure, cuz I thought everyone knew that.I thought the whole point of the debate was how to lower the Health care cost?
I keep being surprised how some folks throw terms as "liberal" and "socialist" around as if these were terrible diseases... and without knowing what they're talking about.
The Netherlands is a capitalist country... heck, we *invented* it, more or less. Still, we manage to provide social healthcare that:
- Covers everybody;
- Is NOT monopolized by the government;
- Fuses scial responsibility with privatised healthcare.
canada and the uk have government run healthcare, duh. that would be the reason why they are spending less. look at how many people come here because of our healthcare program. life expectancity of japan, look at their diet compared to ours. another issue, why would we even let the government take over our healthcare??? look at how that cant even handle running the postal service which is in debt. look at the SS which is going bankrupt and ur wanting them to run ur healthcare?
"after adjusting the per capita spending rates to international dollars (to account for Purchasing Power Parity), and includes both government and personal expenditures"
Well, considering our diet we eat....it's pretty overwhelmingly obvious that "we" die at a younger age! We have amoung the most obese people in the world. Now look at the more healthy people, yeah, they live longer than obese, duh. Anyone can throw a video on Youtube and skew the "results".
The technical statistical term for what you're doing is "whining" - bringing up a new variable to try and discredit a study without making even the most basic effort to find that variable's effects. If you had bothered to do so (or had even bothered read some of the comments) you'd know that even adjusting for obesity rates we still die faster and pay more. Do us all a favor and try to know what you're talking about before you open your mouth. Thanks.
"Whining"? No, more like tired of being taxed to death, tired of lazy people, tired of dopers, tired of the media jumping on the liberal bandwagon.....keep going? Excluding elderly, I just wonder how many people could actually survive without a gov't handing them their life plan in a china dish? Where did "Land of the Free" go? Do you really want gov't running even one more thing in your life?
I've also already commented about this process as well:
Step 1: You say something factually incorrect.
Step 2: I correct you.
Step 3: You ignore how wrong you were in Step 1 and jump to something completely unrelated that, conveniently, is just a bunch of irrelevant nonsense that cannot be proven/disproven with facts.
Step 4: I point out what you said is unprovable nonsense.
Step 5: You insist that unprovable nonsense is fact, then you say more unprovable nonsense. Go...
You are so smart! I just can't believe it...I mean, you must just sit and read facts every second of your day. Like I said, tired of liberal morons. AGAIN, if the government was taken away, COULD YOU survive?
Good work on the charts. The second was especially telling. One point on the life expectancy in this country though; I read somewhere that violent deaths (crime & traffic accidents) are significantly higher here and so of course greatly affect the average life expectancy. I wonder if there are statistics that compare life expectancies which remove accidental deaths from the equation?
my fear with any gov't run program (besides serendering more control to gov't) is that these programs seem to be nothing more than a elaborate ponzi scheme. be it mediare, medicaid, social security, sooner or later there will be more people collecting than paying in. this is why communism is doomed to faiilure, and why social security wont be there for me to collect.
I love it when people who cry about the government trying to improve the health and welfare of our country , were the ones who supported the degradation of our privacy.
you are just another delusional liberal. i know of know one whose privacy was violated by the patriot act. but if you feel obama and pelosi tell you when and even if you can go to doctor is not a drgradation of privacy, i suggest you see a proctologist to have your head removed from youe ass. I am so sick of liberal hypocrisy after 8 years of "dissent is patriotic" anyone who resists obama communizing of america is "unamerican."
Actually, if you had bothered to research the healthcare of the other countries we are trying to catch up to, you'd find that they DO go to the doctor when they want to and get treated at least as efficiently as Americans.
And they don't have to worry about the cost because its already covered.
Check these two videos out, (The first is an American nightmare and the second is a Czech republic nightmare)
if you believe in it so strongly then move to one these countries america is tring to "catch up with" and where does the money come from to cover the costs in a nationalized health care system? why do so many foreigners get major surgery performed here in the US.?
I can say that because you obviously have disdane for what the country was founded to be. so I say leave why should i sit back and watch you and people like you turn it into something it wasn't meant to be. and so you know I think everything you've said is stupid. please stop sending me messages, reading your posts is making my IQ drop.
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
Note the "General Welfare" has equal billing with "Common Defence".
The words "gereral welfare" are beong grossly misinterpreted. I highly doubt they meant for the government to seize wealth from one person and give it to another.
Although I think you've over dramatized the issue in that statement, do you have a problem with the Interstate system where money from people in California is used to pay for Interstates in New York, whether the Californians use them or not?
Or the public school system that takes money from people who don't even want kids?
I understand drawing lines somewhere but I disagree that healthcare is the place.
Modern Medicine is a hoax. You are better off without insurance. The American Medical Mafia is the leading cause of death in the US. Perscription Drugs and most invasive treatments have no clinical relevance. Stay away from doctors and hospitals unless you are injured or have a heart attack or can't breathe or are in labor.
Yep, that pretty much spells it out doesn't it. I don't see why more people can't get this, and whats more, why they don't see through the pile of crap the Republicans in Congress are putting up there to confuse them.
What is all this talk about a G.D. flag? The main problems in the U.S. are fear and ignorance. Americans are so isolated they do not know what goes on in other countries. The national narcissism we exhibit is very damaging and dangerous. It tires me out to think about this mess. Don't you realize it is a matter of divide and conquer on the part of a very wealthy few?
OH SAY CAN YOU EAT? A BACONATOR WITH FRIES, CAUSE AMERICANS CAN SO, THATS WHY THEY'RE FAT AS SHIT. .......OBESE FREAKING PEOPLE, A POLITE WAY TO SAY FAT BASTARDDDD, THIS IS MY BURGER KING, & THE HOMEEEEEE OF THE GAYZZZZZZZ.
All my fellow Europeans, lets stay healthy prove Americans that theres no need for Fast food crap... lazy people.
(i) When displayed either horizontally or vertically against a wall, the union should be uppermost and to the flag's own right, that is, to the observer's left. When displayed in a window, the flag should be displayed in the same way, with the union or blue field to the left of the observer in the street.
who gives half a fuck? the dude is talking about reforming the system by which we can maintain our health, and you're griping about a brightly colored piece of cloth?
if the dude can't do something as simple as finding out how to properly display a flag then how should he expect anyone to listen to his message? this is a fine example of what is wrong with the US health care system, its fucked up because people do not know what the hell they are doing. when someone makes a correction the reply is "who gives a fuck?! its just a brightly colored piece of cloth!"
i agree that the system is flawed, we need reform. just not the obama reform.
people are dying because of a failed experiment in free market medicine are your worried about a sideways flag? really? that is your priority at the moment. a sideways flag? what you all need is proper public healthcare like the rest of the industrialised world, along with better funded and understood education so that people are equipped to take part in the democratic process. not straight flags.
you do not understand what the free market is. our current system is burdened with massive amounts of government control and intervention. the failure of our system can be traced back to clinton when his reform took the decisions away from the patient and doctor and gave them to the insurance companies. don't be so quick to bash something that actually worked but was thrown out by the socialist clowns.
also, an improperly displayed flag isn't so hard to correct. stop being lazy.
I'm Aussie, we don't really experience that flag worship Yanks seem to have, I guess it's just a cultural thing, but it's not laziness, it's just that I don't understand how anyone could put such significance into a flag. Maybe if it was the bill of rights, a document with real significance that established to first secular nation on earth, then you might have a point. But when every other developed country is benefiting from public healthcare are your winging about...
Clinton and flags and socialism, I don't know how anyone can take you seriously. I'll admit that my understanding of free market economics is not comprehensive. I have read a couple of books on it and see some good points but it's all so patently naive. case in point; show me a single country that has not benefited from fully public healthcare with a single payer system. ill go you one further, show me a country with public healthcare for which capitalism has suffered any great loss
just because a socialist regime is demonstrably bad, doesn't mean social spending in a democratic capitolist coutry is. your not going to slip into some stalinist dictatorship just because hospitals and schools are properly funded by public money. Seriously where does all this socialist paranoia come from? the cold wars over comrade, most of the world is trying to find equilibrium, not hanging onto the flag pole of a sinking ship
the more power that is given to a central government the less liberties and freedoms are given to the people. that is why the founders of the US government set it up as a federalist organized republic. the US is not a democracy. i am on a government health care system, people that show signs of flu (which around here could be swine flu) are given an appointment to be checked two weeks later. and yet people think a government system is better than the one we have now.
yeah, pointing out the administration that got us into our current health care system, who can really take history seriously? now, you are less likely to die from cancer in the US than you are in canada, the UK and france. odd huh? most of those countries have higher taxes and a VAT as well. there are people in those countries that go to the US for life saving treatment because their government deemed the treatment as elective.
i know quite a few Aussies that take great pride in their flag. a flag represents the government, land, people, and ideas. i really do not understand how a flame war started up just by me making a correction about the display of his flag.
yeah, you're right. The flag is crooked, and yes it does represent the intent of the such as the Bill of Rights and Constitution, and pride in a flag is an important thing when what it represents is a worthwhile and noble ideal.
I also agree with you about Obama's healthcare reforms: I thought Hilary's were much better!
look @ all the fat ass people in America,they eat fast food sit on their fat asses and click their remote. fast food = FAT FOOD see super size me. from er fat ass was 265lbs now 203lbs lean & mean 203lbs
That chart showing what we spend on healthcare compared to life expectancy is ridiculous, but you see it everywhere. There are so many factors that contribute to life expectancy. Do you really think that most people in the country die because of bad medical care? Of course not. Just to throw one example out there, how about diet? Considering how good the health care is in this country (not the funding, just the care) that argument is getting stale.
As I explained in many previous comments, no, it doesn't show our system is killing us. What it does show is that we're paying double for no good reason.
You're mistaken that our healthcare is "good." Our healthcare is actually very poor by almost every metric except very advanced medicine such as cancer treatment and organ transplants (ironically, the treatments you'll be least likely to need).
What people don't realize is that the truth automatically becomes a lie when it's politically unacceptable once one has been properly brainwashed. I'm glad to see that you appreciate this.
Why would you want to actually look at statistics like this? What kind of an American are you? Good Americans memorize anti-health care mantras as they love their god and guns you moron. The last thing any patriot should do is think let alone look at numbers that show the communists in Cuba are beating us at health care. Grow a pair of red, white, and blue gonads you commie pinko. We're Americans and we have a right to the most expensive health care in the world!
Many Americans think we have the best health care system because of uninformed political figures like Rush Limbaugh who has said many a times that we have the best health care system.
America has the best technology for science research to cater healthcare for the RICH!! Only for those that are able to afford it!! The middle Class cannot pay for it unless they have insurance... lose your job as many do these days and there's goes the insurance...
Rush Limbaugh is a total American redneck aficionado... anyone seen him in Cuba already to get a cheap liver/pancreatic transplant due to the prescription drug overdose he's getting?
This is a response I get over and over, "I don't believe in math becuase the numbers don't show what I want them to show." What a scholarly counterpoint.
If you're so informed, why don't you show us your metrics? That's a rhetorical question. You don't have numbers becuase you've based your ideas on unfounded hearsay.
no one is disputing we spend the most per capita on healthcare than any nation on earth, and that it is...as u say, "bleeding us dry." but why u ask?
well, quite simple really. researching the history of insurance companies, u will find when the GOVERNMENT decided to play favorites, establish medicaid (failure, cost 1.1 trill a year) and social security, things went to shit.
people could no longer afford their OWN hc, and had to rely on a pool to pay.
Hmmm...I see if you're reasoning...If every other country has a public system with lower prices...but we have a public-private hybrid and there's something wrong in our system driving abnormally high prices....that problem must be...the public part.
Good point, let's switch to a 100% private system that we know will work becuase we've seen it work in dozens of other countries. I retract this video and stand corrected.
Side note: Combined Fed and state, Medicaid costs about $600B/year.
the free market always win. it is because of government intervention that we have this problem in the first place.
medicaid is corrupt to begin with. governments create "cost-sharing" initiatives which tax the consumer and force absurd co-pays. went to the pharmacy and was told i needed to clear $364 until medicaid would even kick in.
You're on Medicaid? Are you joking? As a taxpayer paying for your services, I respectfully ask that you shut the fuck up so that we can enact reform that will lower my taxes and increase your services. And, no, you don't get any say in the matter.
Most citizens qualify for medicaid. A doctor told me it would supplement whatever my insurance wouldn't cover. I gave it a shot.
I don't see how you think we can pay for this "health care." Have you read the 1,000 page bill or are you just going off obama talking points?
Nice to see citizens lobby on behalf of the messiah. As Franklin once said, "When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic."
"You agree seniors like Medicare and it's good and we shouldn't mess with it?"
I don't think that's what he was saying.
Also, universal health care has been tried in the US in Massachusetts. 3% of the population STILL doesn't have insurance and the costs of health care is increasing faster than anywhere else in the US.
US Health care problems are mostly due to being incredibly wasteful in the govt plans we do have and the fact that Americans just plain live unhealthy lives.
Yeah, we'll have to disagree somewhat on the character issue.
I do agree however that we do generally all have a better more rosey opinion of our govt when we are younger and more naive.
It's unfortunate that we are old enough to vote usually long before we are old enough to make informed decisions. But, if you old enough to die for this country, then you should also be allowed to vote.
I don't buy your assertions. Newsish's stats (see the newest video) show tort reform ideas to be a drop in the bucket, in other words, a distraction. Likewise it is with this idea that malpractice premiums are a problem.
I've looked for the stat's, and I CAN'T FIND THEM.
I think the reason is that they don't exist or that you (or the people who have mislead you to block real reform) exaggerate.
This issue is like McCain's earmarks. Bad, but irrelevant to solving anything.
Whatever. Insurance co's like doctors so much that they don't mind paying out millions in lawsuits.
Health care is expensive, therefore the govt should run it?
I don't see any of you reform people willing to discuss the govt's miserable failure with their existing social programs to include this video and an attempt to discuss it with Newish.
You are the one that claimed in capitol letters that you couldn't find any stats.
All I did was basically repeat what you said, "Malpractice ins stats don't exist". It was sarcasm.
Once again, you reform types won't discuss govt's track record of running all of our important social programs out of money. It's important, but if you choose to ignore it then it's pretty doubtful that malpractice ins. rates mean anything to you REGUARDLESS of what they are.
Continuing this discussion is vital to US competitiveness because what you anti-reformers continue to ignore is that DOING NOTHING to reform our hodge-podge healthcare delivery systems is bankrupting our people FASTER than the social programs that are currently in the red.
What you fail to recognize is that more money currently washes away down the insurance company premium rat hole than would be contributed toward "evil" taxes under a robust simplified non-profit system.
When I said I couldn't "find stats," I meant I couldn't find stats THAT BACK UP YOUR UNSUPPORTED ASSERTION.
I told you I perform appraisals of medical practices at my firm. The stats I've seen show that average malpractice premiums are below 1% of practice revenue. For our comparable data, we rely primarily on The AMA Physician Compensation and Production Survey, Medical Economics, and Pratt's.
Your "point" is unsupported.
You're like McLame going after earmarks--DROPS IN THE BUCKET!
Speaking of "cowards," you are the one who has COWERED from sourcing your assertions. I have not. You are now cowering AGAIN--by changing the topic to the deficit when my challenge to you was simply to provide a statistical basis for what you claimed to be true about malpractice costs.
I'm a deficit HAWK. See the Medicare video to learn that Medicare's costs were on a DOWNWARD TREND (until Bush's private "Advantage" plans were introduced) while private insurance costs WENT UP.
Not only are malpractice costs NOT that large (relative to medical revenues), but they have NOT been conclusively proven to be the primary driver of doctors' voluminous testing of patients.
The FEE-FOR-SERVICE STRUCTURE is the primary driver excessive testing. If doctors were paid according to metrics of overall patient health & efficiency (rather than by volume of office visits & tests), this would NOT be a problem.
Refer to articles/studies on Kaiser & The Mayo Clinic for details.
I can't help but notice a complete lack of facts or numbers in your comment. It's almost as if what you're saying has no basis in reality - as if some one told you this and you blindly believed them without question. Please provide one hard fact or credible research suggesting:
1. That tort reform will reduce costs 50% in the
US.
2. Medicare costs are higher than the equivalent under private insurance.
3. Medicare has a lower satisfaction rate than private insurance.
General practitioners pay about $200,000 a year in malpractice insurance. Imagine a small practice with 3 or 4 doctors and all medical professionals on staff, then add additional overhead. Expensive? Yes of course.
Tort reform is necessary to put a cap on lawsuits to reduce medical costs.
Obamacare doesn't address this and neither do you.
60,00 AARP members cancelled their memberships over Obamacare. Yeah, our senior citizens are making a statement.
Our govt can't run Medicair and Medicaid without running out of money. Or how about Social Security and the postal service?
Bottom line is Obamacare IS rationed healthcare. How could it not be when they will succeed once again, in running important social programs out of money.
Allow health ins, co's to compete across state lines.That's competition. My state maybe has 7 now, and that's a monopoly.
Obamacare is about power and control or they wouldn't bother with it.
OK, but what % of total costs does that number represent? What will reasonable reform bring that number down to? What'll the effect on overall costs be?
You need to find a credible economist who says, "if we do this, this, and this for tort reform, then we'll reduce that malpractice insurance costs to X and lower healthcare costs by Y%"
My prediction is that Y% will not be sufficiently high to reduce healthcare to 10% of GDP (which is what I consider a reasonable cost).
I prepare valuations of medical practices frequently. Although some large practices that conduct risky procedures (eg. doctors who inject pain reducing medication into spines) pay high premiums, I've never valued a practice with premiums greater than 1% of revenue.
Furthermore, I work in the same bldg as SCPIE Insurance, and I see these guys at lunch!
We don't know where the idea that malpractice premiums are hindering care comes from.
It is true that some states have taken steps to limit the cost of malpractice insurance, as some are pretty low. but it is also true that many have not.
I'll find a current source with national averages. Rates vary greatly from state to state. I am surprised that you are unaware of high malpractice insurance rates. Search it for yourself, in some states it can get pretty expensive. Not too hard to confirm.
"hindering care"? No, it just adds to the price of healthcare.
If you are relying on Cuba or China or many other countries such as Sweden to provide an honest answer you are as naive as you look . I am sure all of them can spin the numbers for you.
Yeah. And now the chinese government is paying citizens to have more than one child whereas before certain regions were subject to population control. They didn't go for the old switcharoo like Americans like to do which is procreate til ya just can't take no more, . then start a war and kill off a couple hundred thousand and then "baby boom" about 10 years later. No sir. The chinese are playing for keeps this time. Oh, and don't forget about the passive invasion from our friends to the south.
Health care is not in the Constitution. It is not in the Bible.
Health care is illegal.
Those who vote for health care will burn in hell. We need to support the rich, not the useless poor. Poverty is caused by laziness and immorality, and I don't want to pay for these fucks.
You are completely misrepresenting legitimate arguments against Health care. Why would you do that? If you are so confident that you are in the right about giving Health care over to the government to deal with than rely on the strength of your own arguments, not by deceitful tactics like pretending you are against health care and purposefully acting retarded.
Tactics like these just point out the weakness true arguments for nationalized health care really have.
in the US we spend about 49 cents for every dollar on bureaucratic and marketing overhead, in canada they spend about 29 cents for every dollar on bureaucracy.
But I guess if we had nationalized health care, it would take away some of the incentive for poor people to become mercenaries in the US military.
George Washington Christ isn't in the bible either.
Now, its perfectly fine that you want to criticize Republicans and what not, but what you are doing is lying. You are a discredit to your own argument. If you think your case is honestly superior then face if squarely and fairly and be confident that the best argument will win the day.
Your current tactic is only fit for a lying coward.
"You sound very insecure and defensive. I must be telling the truth. Your comment proves I am right."
Are you Homle then?
lol, it proves you are right does it? Well, I happen to be neither a Republican, nor a theist. I was being defensive however because I don't like dishonorable tactics used in any argument. I have chided people who argue on my side of the issues before for being insulting to those they argue with because it only distracts from the real issues.
There is no double standard. Republicans can have guns anywhere, anytime. DemocRATS, who are communist, socialist, terrorist Nazis, can never have firearms, anywhere, anytime. This is what the Constitution says, this is what the Bible says. George Washington Christ was a Republican, just like all good Americhristians are.
Democrats are terrorists. They cannot legally own guns. It is time for all DemocRATS to be thrown in Guantanamo, they must pay for their anti-Americanism.
Our healthcare would match our amount spent if we stopped paying for so many illegals (other countries don't worry about that as much).........and maybe nuking McDonalds would help haha. Let's spend money on building a wall and then worry about reforming health care
I agree with the graph, but disagree with Newsish's analysis:
1. US life expectancy is low because of lifestyle choices; high fat diets, excessive drug/alcohol use, high murder/violence rates, etc. Our health care is a factor, but not a driver.
2. We spend 3X per capita that other countries spend. Why? Because we fund the world's R&D, piss away 9% of total costs on litigation, and ration NOTHING under Medicare
Obamacare does not address #1, and exaccerbates #2. Reform yes! Obamacare no!
For some reason, we can't come to terms accepting that UHC has become public infrustructure now that we have reached a population density high enough to warrant it. Wage slaves have been duped by there masters that it will cost them more or that the quality will go down if they scrap their policies for UHC. Your graph indicates how the drones only look to their next check and not the big picture. If they only knew they would have 300 more per month net for 150 per month in new taxes...
"Per capita" means for each person, so if you had 100 people paying £50 each for their health care it would still be the same per capita cost as 1000 or 200,000 or even just 1 person paying £50 each.
Incidentally Britain is ranked 18th globally for its healthcare but spends 50% per capita compared to USA which is ranked 37th. If you leave your vital national services in the hands of people only interested in making money, they'll only be interested in making money.
You're right but some people don't understand the whole "Making money" problem with our American health care... business. Calling it a system feels like a sham. You don't make money here if your insurance covers everything all the time.
Keep preaching the good word amigo! I hope one day that Americans have the ability to stop thinking about themselves for once and start caring about those in less fortunate positions.
This should not even be a debate to begin with. This is Unconstitutional. No where in the Constitution does it say the Government should supply Heath Care to everyone.
Under the 'General Welfare clause; you say? sorry that specifically points to the Enumerated powers and they clearly list what Congress can do. Health Care is for the people and the States. end of story.
Even if this bill does pass it will go before the Judicial Branch for review. it's unconstitutional, it won't become law.
the only people who benefit from private healthcare are the insurance companies and politicians paid for by them, that is fact and has already been proven.
ram: so...by your logic we could say that the only people that profit from the private info tech industry are Microsoft and Dell. And that we should nationalize them and take eeevil profit out of the system. Then we could all have a new PC every year for FREE!
Name one program the govt runs efficiently. One program they haven't fucked up totally.
Take a 100 level course in economics and learn something.
Microsoft, Dell, IBM and the rest do make profit from the ICT industry, but that is not the debate, the debate is HEALTH CARE in caps just in case your menial reading skills are lacking. I stated that the only ones who profit from the current Healthcare system are the insurance companies and the politicians that advocate private healthcare, this is a matter of fact and public record. By your logic I suppose the DOD and Criminal Justice are fucked up to name two, or do you mean since Obama?
ram: Yes, I understand; my point is that profit is not more "evil" in the health care industry than it is in ANY other industry.
Profit is the only foolproof method ever developed to determine when an industry is running efficiently. Low (or no) profit means you're inefficient and you shut down operations (bankruptcy) and divert the capital to more efficient industries.
That's why govt programs suck; there's no profit and no measure of efficiency. And yeah, DoD is incredibly wasteful.
johnr, does your avocation of profit extend to the greedy bankers in wall street who have now profited from the bale out advocated by both administrations. It always amazes me that when there are proposed programs to help the poorest in society that people get so irate, the health care insurance industry makes much more than it puts in or gives to you that is a fact and they are spending millions of dollars in propaganda discrediting the proposal
ram: I defend all "profit" that is legally earned, regardless of the amount/percentage. I encourage the ruthless prosecution of all who break the law; people like Madoff, etc.
I'll also agree there are times when people legally earn profits that I would consider excessive. The problem with giving govt the power to "punish" them, is that there will be no end to it, as the definition of "excessive" is subjective and there are just too many corrupt McCarthyites out there who will demagogue it.
ram: One more point. IMO we have a moral obligation to help the truly helpless. Problem is, I define this group as consisting only of orphans, the mentally/physically disabled, and the elderly.
Democrats expand the group to anyone who will vote for them. IMO there are FAR too many able bodied adults getting govt subsidies, and they (and we) would be better off with less of it. My opinion.
I live in England, but am an American citizen, i get everything absolutely free in england, all my medication is free. All my appointments free. And then im on holiday in America and one appointment is like $200 WTF.
dude. the U.K health Care system employs 1.4 million people. the 3rd largest agency in the world. it occupies 1/3 of their economy. Their government is broke, they are in negative equity. Their system is an epic failure and the majority of their people in numerous polls in their state don't like their current system
newish: You can make a case that reform of the US system is necessary, but if you're going to defend the UK's system you're on thin ice.
Of all the European systems, the UK's is probably in the worst shape...both financially and in terms of quality of services rendered. And although their system needs a major overhaul, the voters are terrified they'll lose out. That's the fundamental problem with socialism; once people have it they cling to it like a junkie clings to his needle.
"i never want to see crack sold in convenient stores."
Yes, its much better when its sold on the streets and makes billions for the least scrupulous people on earth. Besides, don't you remember when Cocaine was legal? It was sold in Coke, it was just like caffeine.
Personally, I don't even drink products with caffeine, but I have no problem with people who do.
aliothemage: I've got a streak of libertarianism in me, but I reject any form of "pure" ideology. A bit of libertarianism is OK; all things in moderation.
Re drugs, I think we should examine the european experiments (primarily the dutch) and have an honest debate about it. I think it would be OK to conduct an experiment and legalize non addictive drugs...not so sure about narcotics though.
"I think we should examine the european experiments (primarily the dutch)"
Well, its awesome you have an open mind on the subject. And I'm not quite as crazy as I sound, I would want to experiment the same way first, and legalize things gradually but I am confident that this would have good effects on society. I would suggest looking at the drug legalization in Portugal, its had enormous success.
Who cares? Canada ranks 29th (WHO - world health organization) whereby US is #37. #1 is Norway and #2 is Sweden but then again the people from these countries pay somewhere b/w 45-50% income tax.
1. Stop treating illegal immigrants free of charge. Implement a "stabilize and deport" policy for emergencies, simply deport for non-emergencies.
2. Let people have tax-free health care savings accounts that they fund themselves and only carry insurance for catastrophic care. You don't insure against an oil change or a flat tire, do you?
3. End restrictions on interstate commerce for insurance.
The reason the graph shows that Americans spend more is because we pay for all of our health care up front, and not with our taxes. In a country like Japan or Canada, they only pay a small amount to the doctor, but
America has the GREATEST Healthcare System in the world and proves that govt run socialist healthcare in Europe and Asia are ALL EPIC FAILS! President Palin will completely ELIMINATE govt run healthcare around the whole world with the Palin Revolution and convert all of these socialist systems into the VASTLY SUPERIOR privatized American free-market capitalist healthcare system!
ecwaufisxtreme 1 year ago
DONT FORGET 34 MILLION OF UR PEOPLE GET NO MEDICAL SUPPORT STOP LISTENING TO THE INSURANCE FEAR FONGERS SIR U MUST SPEAK UP FIGHT TO SAVE UR COUNTRY END THE PRIVATE SYSTEM THE BEST SYSTEM IS A GOVT SYSTEM TOMMY DOUGLAS
thenovascotia20 1 year ago
@thenovascotia20
Best system is the government system? You are really an idiot, seeing as the socialist model has failed.
JRooster101 1 year ago
@JRooster101 how? living longer and spending less is not a failure
theaceofspades39 1 year ago
@theaceofspades39
Spending less? That's why they are moving towards private health care options considering what they have now is unsustainable.
JRooster101 1 year ago
@JRooster101 did you even watch the video?
theaceofspades39 1 year ago
@thenovascotia20
There are zero denials of care in America.
JRooster101 1 year ago
So basically the point of this video is that we spend to much on healthcare, right? Not only does the private sector pays too much, but the public sector pays too much as well. Is that what is being stated? I'm just trying to be sure, cuz I thought everyone knew that.I thought the whole point of the debate was how to lower the Health care cost?
d00mie74 1 year ago
If you ever run for a political seat you have my vote the video just made to much sense and very hard for the pundits to refute.
TerroristKiller1 1 year ago
That graph really nailed it, kudos!
I keep being surprised how some folks throw terms as "liberal" and "socialist" around as if these were terrible diseases... and without knowing what they're talking about.
The Netherlands is a capitalist country... heck, we *invented* it, more or less. Still, we manage to provide social healthcare that:
- Covers everybody;
- Is NOT monopolized by the government;
- Fuses scial responsibility with privatised healthcare.
Oh well...
Gragham77 1 year ago
Newsish, this shit is just epic... awesome awesome awesome
Craigipedia 1 year ago
canada and the uk have government run healthcare, duh. that would be the reason why they are spending less. look at how many people come here because of our healthcare program. life expectancity of japan, look at their diet compared to ours. another issue, why would we even let the government take over our healthcare??? look at how that cant even handle running the postal service which is in debt. look at the SS which is going bankrupt and ur wanting them to run ur healthcare?
St3phxoxo 2 years ago
check the links dude:
"after adjusting the per capita spending rates to international dollars (to account for Purchasing Power Parity), and includes both government and personal expenditures"
kemku 2 years ago
Well, considering our diet we eat....it's pretty overwhelmingly obvious that "we" die at a younger age! We have amoung the most obese people in the world. Now look at the more healthy people, yeah, they live longer than obese, duh. Anyone can throw a video on Youtube and skew the "results".
huntthat 2 years ago
The technical statistical term for what you're doing is "whining" - bringing up a new variable to try and discredit a study without making even the most basic effort to find that variable's effects. If you had bothered to do so (or had even bothered read some of the comments) you'd know that even adjusting for obesity rates we still die faster and pay more. Do us all a favor and try to know what you're talking about before you open your mouth. Thanks.
Newsish 2 years ago
"Whining"? No, more like tired of being taxed to death, tired of lazy people, tired of dopers, tired of the media jumping on the liberal bandwagon.....keep going? Excluding elderly, I just wonder how many people could actually survive without a gov't handing them their life plan in a china dish? Where did "Land of the Free" go? Do you really want gov't running even one more thing in your life?
huntthat 2 years ago
I've also already commented about this process as well:
Step 1: You say something factually incorrect.
Step 2: I correct you.
Step 3: You ignore how wrong you were in Step 1 and jump to something completely unrelated that, conveniently, is just a bunch of irrelevant nonsense that cannot be proven/disproven with facts.
Step 4: I point out what you said is unprovable nonsense.
Step 5: You insist that unprovable nonsense is fact, then you say more unprovable nonsense. Go...
Newsish 2 years ago
You are so smart! I just can't believe it...I mean, you must just sit and read facts every second of your day. Like I said, tired of liberal morons. AGAIN, if the government was taken away, COULD YOU survive?
huntthat 2 years ago
you did watch the video yea?
16% of GDP is what you get when the gov does nothing.... Wait thats wrong, 16% is what happens when gov allows it.
I for one can tell you id rather be haggled by a gov beurocrat, Than be denied by my health insurance agency because a was raped or born to big.
If a gov 'takeover' can drop the spending to 10% then more power to em'
Therealoutrageus 2 years ago
@Newsish
I don't consider challenging your claim that life expectancy is necessarily connected to quality of health care to be 'whining'.
rockandrock44 1 year ago
A person goes out of their way to show reliable easy to find facts and figures and your response is to call them a name? interesting...
nuumskee 2 years ago 2
Good work on the charts. The second was especially telling. One point on the life expectancy in this country though; I read somewhere that violent deaths (crime & traffic accidents) are significantly higher here and so of course greatly affect the average life expectancy. I wonder if there are statistics that compare life expectancies which remove accidental deaths from the equation?
EPRVa62 2 years ago
that aside why do the only posible solutions being considered have to involve higher taxes, new gov't agencies. and more gov't control?
nooyawker319 2 years ago
my fear with any gov't run program (besides serendering more control to gov't) is that these programs seem to be nothing more than a elaborate ponzi scheme. be it mediare, medicaid, social security, sooner or later there will be more people collecting than paying in. this is why communism is doomed to faiilure, and why social security wont be there for me to collect.
nooyawker319 2 years ago
I'm willing to bet you had no problem with the government control of the last administration.
corthew 2 years ago
what government control are you talking about?
nooyawker319 2 years ago
Lets start with the Patriot Act.
I love it when people who cry about the government trying to improve the health and welfare of our country , were the ones who supported the degradation of our privacy.
corthew 2 years ago
you are just another delusional liberal. i know of know one whose privacy was violated by the patriot act. but if you feel obama and pelosi tell you when and even if you can go to doctor is not a drgradation of privacy, i suggest you see a proctologist to have your head removed from youe ass. I am so sick of liberal hypocrisy after 8 years of "dissent is patriotic" anyone who resists obama communizing of america is "unamerican."
nooyawker319 2 years ago
when obama and his cronies finally do put the kool-aid of nationalized health care on the table, take a big gulp. i hope all liberals choke on it.
nooyawker319 2 years ago
Actually, if you had bothered to research the healthcare of the other countries we are trying to catch up to, you'd find that they DO go to the doctor when they want to and get treated at least as efficiently as Americans.
And they don't have to worry about the cost because its already covered.
Check these two videos out, (The first is an American nightmare and the second is a Czech republic nightmare)
/watch?v=zpeYpw89OFI
/watch?v=3mL2gGQIc1w
corthew 2 years ago
if you believe in it so strongly then move to one these countries america is tring to "catch up with" and where does the money come from to cover the costs in a nationalized health care system? why do so many foreigners get major surgery performed here in the US.?
nooyawker319 2 years ago
That has to be about the stupidest thing you've said so far.
Move to another country?
Dude, this is my home as much as yours.
How dare you suggest that anyone should have to leave the country just for not agreeing with you!
What arrogance!
corthew 2 years ago
I can say that because you obviously have disdane for what the country was founded to be. so I say leave why should i sit back and watch you and people like you turn it into something it wasn't meant to be. and so you know I think everything you've said is stupid. please stop sending me messages, reading your posts is making my IQ drop.
nooyawker319 2 years ago
What the country was founded to be?
This is was the country was founded to be:
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
Note the "General Welfare" has equal billing with "Common Defence".
corthew 2 years ago
The words "gereral welfare" are beong grossly misinterpreted. I highly doubt they meant for the government to seize wealth from one person and give it to another.
nooyawker319 2 years ago
Although I think you've over dramatized the issue in that statement, do you have a problem with the Interstate system where money from people in California is used to pay for Interstates in New York, whether the Californians use them or not?
Or the public school system that takes money from people who don't even want kids?
I understand drawing lines somewhere but I disagree that healthcare is the place.
corthew 2 years ago
Definitely hit the nail on the head there!
huntthat 2 years ago
Modern Medicine is a hoax. You are better off without insurance. The American Medical Mafia is the leading cause of death in the US. Perscription Drugs and most invasive treatments have no clinical relevance. Stay away from doctors and hospitals unless you are injured or have a heart attack or can't breathe or are in labor.
canaan1967 2 years ago
Right, stay away from hospitals unless you have a medical condition that requires hospitalization. Good advice.
Newsish 2 years ago
I like your style. And you're cute. I don't do friend requests but I'm definitely subbing. =D
AkbarTheGreat 2 years ago
Yep, that pretty much spells it out doesn't it. I don't see why more people can't get this, and whats more, why they don't see through the pile of crap the Republicans in Congress are putting up there to confuse them.
timeduardo 2 years ago
fuckn dickhead
JAGaLOON609 2 years ago
What is all this talk about a G.D. flag? The main problems in the U.S. are fear and ignorance. Americans are so isolated they do not know what goes on in other countries. The national narcissism we exhibit is very damaging and dangerous. It tires me out to think about this mess. Don't you realize it is a matter of divide and conquer on the part of a very wealthy few?
robost 2 years ago 2
OH SAY CAN YOU EAT? A BACONATOR WITH FRIES, CAUSE AMERICANS CAN SO, THATS WHY THEY'RE FAT AS SHIT. .......OBESE FREAKING PEOPLE, A POLITE WAY TO SAY FAT BASTARDDDD, THIS IS MY BURGER KING, & THE HOMEEEEEE OF THE GAYZZZZZZZ.
All my fellow Europeans, lets stay healthy prove Americans that theres no need for Fast food crap... lazy people.
old4u2 2 years ago
hahaha
yeah, a mate of mine shot himself in the foot with a 12-guage: UGLY :p
Luckily he was covered by Medicare!
MythicalSword 2 years ago
great vid, i am going to forward this to as many right wing idiots as i can. btw glad i voted for nader
denisdeveze 2 years ago
your flag is displayed backwards.
(i) When displayed either horizontally or vertically against a wall, the union should be uppermost and to the flag's own right, that is, to the observer's left. When displayed in a window, the flag should be displayed in the same way, with the union or blue field to the left of the observer in the street.
gobblox38 2 years ago
who gives half a fuck? the dude is talking about reforming the system by which we can maintain our health, and you're griping about a brightly colored piece of cloth?
darklordoprah 2 years ago
if the dude can't do something as simple as finding out how to properly display a flag then how should he expect anyone to listen to his message? this is a fine example of what is wrong with the US health care system, its fucked up because people do not know what the hell they are doing. when someone makes a correction the reply is "who gives a fuck?! its just a brightly colored piece of cloth!"
i agree that the system is flawed, we need reform. just not the obama reform.
gobblox38 2 years ago
people are dying because of a failed experiment in free market medicine are your worried about a sideways flag? really? that is your priority at the moment. a sideways flag? what you all need is proper public healthcare like the rest of the industrialised world, along with better funded and understood education so that people are equipped to take part in the democratic process. not straight flags.
LukeOfTroy 2 years ago
you do not understand what the free market is. our current system is burdened with massive amounts of government control and intervention. the failure of our system can be traced back to clinton when his reform took the decisions away from the patient and doctor and gave them to the insurance companies. don't be so quick to bash something that actually worked but was thrown out by the socialist clowns.
also, an improperly displayed flag isn't so hard to correct. stop being lazy.
gobblox38 2 years ago
I'm Aussie, we don't really experience that flag worship Yanks seem to have, I guess it's just a cultural thing, but it's not laziness, it's just that I don't understand how anyone could put such significance into a flag. Maybe if it was the bill of rights, a document with real significance that established to first secular nation on earth, then you might have a point. But when every other developed country is benefiting from public healthcare are your winging about...
LukeOfTroy 2 years ago 2
Clinton and flags and socialism, I don't know how anyone can take you seriously. I'll admit that my understanding of free market economics is not comprehensive. I have read a couple of books on it and see some good points but it's all so patently naive. case in point; show me a single country that has not benefited from fully public healthcare with a single payer system. ill go you one further, show me a country with public healthcare for which capitalism has suffered any great loss
LukeOfTroy 2 years ago
just because a socialist regime is demonstrably bad, doesn't mean social spending in a democratic capitolist coutry is. your not going to slip into some stalinist dictatorship just because hospitals and schools are properly funded by public money. Seriously where does all this socialist paranoia come from? the cold wars over comrade, most of the world is trying to find equilibrium, not hanging onto the flag pole of a sinking ship
LukeOfTroy 2 years ago 2
the more power that is given to a central government the less liberties and freedoms are given to the people. that is why the founders of the US government set it up as a federalist organized republic. the US is not a democracy. i am on a government health care system, people that show signs of flu (which around here could be swine flu) are given an appointment to be checked two weeks later. and yet people think a government system is better than the one we have now.
gobblox38 2 years ago
yeah, pointing out the administration that got us into our current health care system, who can really take history seriously? now, you are less likely to die from cancer in the US than you are in canada, the UK and france. odd huh? most of those countries have higher taxes and a VAT as well. there are people in those countries that go to the US for life saving treatment because their government deemed the treatment as elective.
gobblox38 2 years ago
market failure. free market economics works, but for market failure: just ask Allen Greenspan
MythicalSword 2 years ago
i know quite a few Aussies that take great pride in their flag. a flag represents the government, land, people, and ideas. i really do not understand how a flame war started up just by me making a correction about the display of his flag.
gobblox38 2 years ago
yeah, you're right. The flag is crooked, and yes it does represent the intent of the such as the Bill of Rights and Constitution, and pride in a flag is an important thing when what it represents is a worthwhile and noble ideal.
I also agree with you about Obama's healthcare reforms: I thought Hilary's were much better!
MythicalSword 2 years ago
look @ all the fat ass people in America,they eat fast food sit on their fat asses and click their remote. fast food = FAT FOOD see super size me. from er fat ass was 265lbs now 203lbs lean & mean 203lbs
CATTLEDOGwatchNsheep 2 years ago
You are awesome! I loved this video! Keep up the good work. News that's humorous! Smart!
WherestheCoolPlaces 2 years ago
That chart showing what we spend on healthcare compared to life expectancy is ridiculous, but you see it everywhere. There are so many factors that contribute to life expectancy. Do you really think that most people in the country die because of bad medical care? Of course not. Just to throw one example out there, how about diet? Considering how good the health care is in this country (not the funding, just the care) that argument is getting stale.
ickyzorro 2 years ago
As I explained in many previous comments, no, it doesn't show our system is killing us. What it does show is that we're paying double for no good reason.
You're mistaken that our healthcare is "good." Our healthcare is actually very poor by almost every metric except very advanced medicine such as cancer treatment and organ transplants (ironically, the treatments you'll be least likely to need).
Newsish 2 years ago
What people don't realize is that the truth automatically becomes a lie when it's politically unacceptable once one has been properly brainwashed. I'm glad to see that you appreciate this.
emaildoctor 2 years ago
Why would you want to actually look at statistics like this? What kind of an American are you? Good Americans memorize anti-health care mantras as they love their god and guns you moron. The last thing any patriot should do is think let alone look at numbers that show the communists in Cuba are beating us at health care. Grow a pair of red, white, and blue gonads you commie pinko. We're Americans and we have a right to the most expensive health care in the world!
emaildoctor 2 years ago 2
Michelle Bachmann has already reported me to the New House Committee on Un-American Activities.
Newsish 2 years ago
When America spends 51% of the entire world's amount of research, no one really needs to spend much.
Thanks for showing us that other countries need to thank us for riding on our coat tails.
And life expectancy... ever heard of ceteris paribus?
Do Americans get treated faster, our diet, exercise, stress... there are a million reasons why this comparison falls short of academic rigor.
Is the numbers based on PPP(purchasing power parity)? What methodology was used for PPP?
KendrickJ2 2 years ago
Americans die the fastest because of bad eating habits!!
0lympia2008 2 years ago
Such a good video. I'm glad you did this.
LoryLandskipper 2 years ago
Many Americans think we have the best health care system because of uninformed political figures like Rush Limbaugh who has said many a times that we have the best health care system.
WyrmPrince 2 years ago
America has the best technology for science research to cater healthcare for the RICH!! Only for those that are able to afford it!! The middle Class cannot pay for it unless they have insurance... lose your job as many do these days and there's goes the insurance...
Sundawncer 2 years ago
Rush Limbaugh is a total American redneck aficionado... anyone seen him in Cuba already to get a cheap liver/pancreatic transplant due to the prescription drug overdose he's getting?
:??:
TTaranak 2 years ago
Comment removed
WyrmPrince 2 years ago
WE'RE ALWAYS #1 in everything!!!
LOL
Sundawncer 2 years ago 2
Nice graph bambi -
Problem - how many illegals are the other systems supporting?
I don't trust your work at all. You will not sway the informed, only the pathetic parasites.
mstaff657 2 years ago
This is a response I get over and over, "I don't believe in math becuase the numbers don't show what I want them to show." What a scholarly counterpoint.
If you're so informed, why don't you show us your metrics? That's a rhetorical question. You don't have numbers becuase you've based your ideas on unfounded hearsay.
Newsish 2 years ago
ur video is intellectually dishonest.
no one is disputing we spend the most per capita on healthcare than any nation on earth, and that it is...as u say, "bleeding us dry." but why u ask?
well, quite simple really. researching the history of insurance companies, u will find when the GOVERNMENT decided to play favorites, establish medicaid (failure, cost 1.1 trill a year) and social security, things went to shit.
people could no longer afford their OWN hc, and had to rely on a pool to pay.
ImNeilPatrickHarris 2 years ago
Hmmm...I see if you're reasoning...If every other country has a public system with lower prices...but we have a public-private hybrid and there's something wrong in our system driving abnormally high prices....that problem must be...the public part.
Good point, let's switch to a 100% private system that we know will work becuase we've seen it work in dozens of other countries. I retract this video and stand corrected.
Side note: Combined Fed and state, Medicaid costs about $600B/year.
Newsish 2 years ago
the free market always win. it is because of government intervention that we have this problem in the first place.
medicaid is corrupt to begin with. governments create "cost-sharing" initiatives which tax the consumer and force absurd co-pays. went to the pharmacy and was told i needed to clear $364 until medicaid would even kick in.
what a joke.
and u want to maximize this?
ImNeilPatrickHarris 2 years ago
You're on Medicaid? Are you joking? As a taxpayer paying for your services, I respectfully ask that you shut the fuck up so that we can enact reform that will lower my taxes and increase your services. And, no, you don't get any say in the matter.
Newsish 2 years ago
LOL.
Most citizens qualify for medicaid. A doctor told me it would supplement whatever my insurance wouldn't cover. I gave it a shot.
I don't see how you think we can pay for this "health care." Have you read the 1,000 page bill or are you just going off obama talking points?
Nice to see citizens lobby on behalf of the messiah. As Franklin once said, "When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic."
ImNeilPatrickHarris 2 years ago
Subscribed
Now I have two good news sources, the other being TYT.
JohnKiller118 2 years ago 3
"You agree seniors like Medicare and it's good and we shouldn't mess with it?"
I don't think that's what he was saying.
Also, universal health care has been tried in the US in Massachusetts. 3% of the population STILL doesn't have insurance and the costs of health care is increasing faster than anywhere else in the US.
US Health care problems are mostly due to being incredibly wasteful in the govt plans we do have and the fact that Americans just plain live unhealthy lives.
Aliothemage 2 years ago
Aliothemage
Thanks.
Newsish is con man and a liar. I think that's clear from the previous block of comments.
chancedagardner 2 years ago
"Newsish is con man and a liar."
I wouldn't go that far, I just think hes mistaken. I thought govt could solve our problems a few years back just as he does.
Aliothemage 2 years ago
Aliothemage
Yeah, we'll have to disagree somewhat on the character issue.
I do agree however that we do generally all have a better more rosey opinion of our govt when we are younger and more naive.
It's unfortunate that we are old enough to vote usually long before we are old enough to make informed decisions. But, if you old enough to die for this country, then you should also be allowed to vote.
chancedagardner 2 years ago
Do you know what the word "projection" means?
Newsish 2 years ago
chancedagardner:
Could you please simply provide me one source of statistics that you believe reliably demonstrates that malpractice premiums are excessive.
Newsish's data was sourced. Your assertions are not. So please come UP to his level of argument/debate.
Thanks.
RepublicStanding 2 years ago
RepublicStanding
What you can't do any research on your own? Could I please do it for you?
Newish's source already supports my statement about malpractice insurance adding to the cost of healthcare.
You obviously have access to a computer.
Do it yourself.
chancedagardner 2 years ago
chancedagardner:
I don't buy your assertions. Newsish's stats (see the newest video) show tort reform ideas to be a drop in the bucket, in other words, a distraction. Likewise it is with this idea that malpractice premiums are a problem.
I've looked for the stat's, and I CAN'T FIND THEM.
I think the reason is that they don't exist or that you (or the people who have mislead you to block real reform) exaggerate.
This issue is like McCain's earmarks. Bad, but irrelevant to solving anything.
RepublicStanding 2 years ago
Republic
Your a f@#$ing liar.
Malpractice insurance stats don't exist.
Whatever. Insurance co's like doctors so much that they don't mind paying out millions in lawsuits.
Health care is expensive, therefore the govt should run it?
I don't see any of you reform people willing to discuss the govt's miserable failure with their existing social programs to include this video and an attempt to discuss it with Newish.
....And in to the fire. More change.
Govts limited budget=limited healthcare.
chancedagardner 2 years ago
chancedagardner:
Thanks for yet ANOTHER unproven assertion.
If, as you say, "malpractice stats don't exist," why should anyone believe what you're saying about malpractice premiums being a big problem.
You're lying. {I DARE you to PROVE me wrong if you're not.}
RepublicStanding 2 years ago
Repub
You are the one that claimed in capitol letters that you couldn't find any stats.
All I did was basically repeat what you said, "Malpractice ins stats don't exist". It was sarcasm.
Once again, you reform types won't discuss govt's track record of running all of our important social programs out of money. It's important, but if you choose to ignore it then it's pretty doubtful that malpractice ins. rates mean anything to you REGUARDLESS of what they are.
Why continue the discussion?
chancedagardner 2 years ago
chancedagardner:
Continuing this discussion is vital to US competitiveness because what you anti-reformers continue to ignore is that DOING NOTHING to reform our hodge-podge healthcare delivery systems is bankrupting our people FASTER than the social programs that are currently in the red.
What you fail to recognize is that more money currently washes away down the insurance company premium rat hole than would be contributed toward "evil" taxes under a robust simplified non-profit system.
RepublicStanding 2 years ago
Republic
What good is govt. mandated healthcare if there is no money to actually provide healthcare?
chancedagardner 2 years ago
chancedagardner:
What good is the STATUS QUO if there is no money to actually provide healthcare?
RepublicStanding 2 years ago
Republic
I see that once again you've avoided the point that govt runs all our social programs out of money.
I got your point that healthcare is expensive, and I actually agree.
So, stop making it and actually respond to my point.
chancedagardner 2 years ago
chance
When I said I couldn't "find stats," I meant I couldn't find stats THAT BACK UP YOUR UNSUPPORTED ASSERTION.
I told you I perform appraisals of medical practices at my firm. The stats I've seen show that average malpractice premiums are below 1% of practice revenue. For our comparable data, we rely primarily on The AMA Physician Compensation and Production Survey, Medical Economics, and Pratt's.
Your "point" is unsupported.
You're like McLame going after earmarks--DROPS IN THE BUCKET!
RepublicStanding 2 years ago
Republic
Fu#$ing coward.
And again you avoid responding to my statement.
What good is govt heathcare if they piss away the budget and there's nothing left to actually provide healthcare.
Look at medicair, medicaid and social security.
You want the govt to run healthcare, so why not discuss THE MOST central issue?
You won't discuss it, and neither would Newish.
I am not surprised.
Because govt. will run a new health program out of money just like it has with our other social programs.
chancedagardner 2 years ago
chancedagardner:
Speaking of "cowards," you are the one who has COWERED from sourcing your assertions. I have not. You are now cowering AGAIN--by changing the topic to the deficit when my challenge to you was simply to provide a statistical basis for what you claimed to be true about malpractice costs.
I'm a deficit HAWK. See the Medicare video to learn that Medicare's costs were on a DOWNWARD TREND (until Bush's private "Advantage" plans were introduced) while private insurance costs WENT UP.
RepublicStanding 2 years ago
re: RepublicStanding
Well to be fair.
The malpractice costs aren't that large.
However the money spent on defensive medicine or excess tests is.
The flipside though being that a lot of those tests happen because reimbursement for procedures are "per service" rather than "per results".
And it seems that changing reimbursement practices is far more effective in lowering unnecessary tests, than changes to malpractice law.
So you basically have an issue of "causation".
greyflcn 2 years ago
greyflcn:
Not only are malpractice costs NOT that large (relative to medical revenues), but they have NOT been conclusively proven to be the primary driver of doctors' voluminous testing of patients.
The FEE-FOR-SERVICE STRUCTURE is the primary driver excessive testing. If doctors were paid according to metrics of overall patient health & efficiency (rather than by volume of office visits & tests), this would NOT be a problem.
Refer to articles/studies on Kaiser & The Mayo Clinic for details.
RepublicStanding 2 years ago
Newsish
Can you read?
I think you've back-pedaled as far as you can go.
Time to muddy up the water misquoting me.
Read my last statement again, and if you can't come up with anything better, than I think that we are done.
chancedagardner 2 years ago
Newsish
I get the feeling that 49.9999% less wouldn't make a difference either, because it isn't 50%.
Seniors don't want Obamacare because they love Medicare, more of you BS logic.
Govt can't run it's current social programs without running out of money, so let's give them more money and control.
Govt has already come up with many new fees and costs this year alone. Expanded service? Absolutely not.
Let's not forget about the deficit, more undeniable truth about govts lack of responsabilty
chancedagardner 2 years ago
Newish
Where do you get 50%?
The point IS...Malprcatice insurance costs are exhorbitant and that adds substantially to the cost of healthcare.
Even it only reduced the cost by 25%, it's still substantial, and that would knock the sh@@ out of your stupid graph.
You should care what our seniors think, because they don't want Obamacare.
Alot of people are beginning to see past the BS.
You're the one without the details, you left them out of your video because they don't support your position
chancedagardner 2 years ago
thanks
d0ch0us10 2 years ago
hey am gonna change my account of youtube and then subscribe to you again okey
d0ch0us10 2 years ago
sounds good.
Newsish 2 years ago
What an A@#hole.
Why is it that healthcare is expensive?
How do we fix it?
Why is it expensive to treat the poor and the elderly?
So let's all just trust our government to take over healthcare.
Have you heard of tort reform?
Are you aware that our government is responsible for our failing Medicair and Medicaid systems?
I usually don't bother commenting on such crap, but you people who believe this propaganda are just idiots.
chancedagardner 2 years ago
I can't help but notice a complete lack of facts or numbers in your comment. It's almost as if what you're saying has no basis in reality - as if some one told you this and you blindly believed them without question. Please provide one hard fact or credible research suggesting:
1. That tort reform will reduce costs 50% in the
US.
2. Medicare costs are higher than the equivalent under private insurance.
3. Medicare has a lower satisfaction rate than private insurance.
Good luck with that.
Newsish 2 years ago
Newish
General practitioners pay about $200,000 a year in malpractice insurance. Imagine a small practice with 3 or 4 doctors and all medical professionals on staff, then add additional overhead. Expensive? Yes of course.
Tort reform is necessary to put a cap on lawsuits to reduce medical costs.
Obamacare doesn't address this and neither do you.
60,00 AARP members cancelled their memberships over Obamacare. Yeah, our senior citizens are making a statement.
AARP btw is considered liberal
chancedagardner 2 years ago
Newish
That's "60,000".
Our govt can't run Medicair and Medicaid without running out of money. Or how about Social Security and the postal service?
Bottom line is Obamacare IS rationed healthcare. How could it not be when they will succeed once again, in running important social programs out of money.
Allow health ins, co's to compete across state lines.That's competition. My state maybe has 7 now, and that's a monopoly.
Obamacare is about power and control or they wouldn't bother with it.
chancedagardner 2 years ago
You didn't show one single piece of evidence that I asked for. Please research the word "research."
Newsish 2 years ago
Newsish
Your own research supports my claim about exhorbitant malpractice insurance.
Now you're going to pretend that I've got it wrong?
What an A@@hole.
If you want more up to date research on malpractice insurance than you've already found then find it yourself.
Do I have to provide research on the national debt as well?
chancedagardner 2 years ago
OK, but what % of total costs does that number represent? What will reasonable reform bring that number down to? What'll the effect on overall costs be?
You need to find a credible economist who says, "if we do this, this, and this for tort reform, then we'll reduce that malpractice insurance costs to X and lower healthcare costs by Y%"
My prediction is that Y% will not be sufficiently high to reduce healthcare to 10% of GDP (which is what I consider a reasonable cost).
Newsish 2 years ago
Newsish
Who cares what the EXACT savings would be.
You don't have be a rocket scientist to know that those additional costs are driving up the cost of healthcare.
And with tort reform, govt doesn't have take over our system.
How about allowing ins co's to compete across state lines to allow competion?
Listen, I am repeating myself.
How about we just agree to disagree, you continue with your dreams of a bigger govt. and I'll dream in favor of the exact opposite.
chancedagardner 2 years ago
chancedagardner:
What is the source for your statistics?
I prepare valuations of medical practices frequently. Although some large practices that conduct risky procedures (eg. doctors who inject pain reducing medication into spines) pay high premiums, I've never valued a practice with premiums greater than 1% of revenue.
Furthermore, I work in the same bldg as SCPIE Insurance, and I see these guys at lunch!
We don't know where the idea that malpractice premiums are hindering care comes from.
RepublicStanding 2 years ago
RepublicStanding
It is true that some states have taken steps to limit the cost of malpractice insurance, as some are pretty low. but it is also true that many have not.
I'll find a current source with national averages. Rates vary greatly from state to state. I am surprised that you are unaware of high malpractice insurance rates. Search it for yourself, in some states it can get pretty expensive. Not too hard to confirm.
"hindering care"? No, it just adds to the price of healthcare.
chancedagardner 2 years ago
you are full of shit
you must not talk to any doctors - namely obgyn
mstaff657 2 years ago
If you are relying on Cuba or China or many other countries such as Sweden to provide an honest answer you are as naive as you look . I am sure all of them can spin the numbers for you.
Proof you need a lot more education.
child.
mstaff657 2 years ago
Haha you got pwned nerd.
SamtotheSkillz 2 years ago
It's true. If you shoot yourself in the foot, you're fucked.
WiiAreSIN 2 years ago
Yeah. And now the chinese government is paying citizens to have more than one child whereas before certain regions were subject to population control. They didn't go for the old switcharoo like Americans like to do which is procreate til ya just can't take no more, . then start a war and kill off a couple hundred thousand and then "baby boom" about 10 years later. No sir. The chinese are playing for keeps this time. Oh, and don't forget about the passive invasion from our friends to the south.
Kangsryche 2 years ago
well done!
slackologist 2 years ago
Good video.. Yet, you don't do a thorough benefits to the individuals entering a system such as National Health Insurance.
bit (dot) ly/1b5qDX
plopo404 2 years ago
Dude GREAT video!
Thanks!
The1Conservative 2 years ago
WOOWWOW, AWSOME CHART. THank You
UberGodless 2 years ago
Excellent !
A breath of fresh air to find so much sense.
Lucem2 2 years ago
Thank you!
RepublicStanding 2 years ago
Vote Bri for President.
BeRad117 2 years ago
Health care is not in the Constitution. It is not in the Bible.
Health care is illegal.
Those who vote for health care will burn in hell. We need to support the rich, not the useless poor. Poverty is caused by laziness and immorality, and I don't want to pay for these fucks.
HomleandSecurity 2 years ago 2
Screw you "Homle"
You are completely misrepresenting legitimate arguments against Health care. Why would you do that? If you are so confident that you are in the right about giving Health care over to the government to deal with than rely on the strength of your own arguments, not by deceitful tactics like pretending you are against health care and purposefully acting retarded.
Tactics like these just point out the weakness true arguments for nationalized health care really have.
Aliothemage 2 years ago
in the US we spend about 49 cents for every dollar on bureaucratic and marketing overhead, in canada they spend about 29 cents for every dollar on bureaucracy.
But I guess if we had nationalized health care, it would take away some of the incentive for poor people to become mercenaries in the US military.
VikingNinjitsu 2 years ago
I;m not misrepresenting anything. I tell the truth of George Washington Christ.
Health care is not in the Constitution. It is not in the Bible.
Try to prove otherwise.
HomleandSecurity 2 years ago
George Washington Christ isn't in the bible either.
Now, its perfectly fine that you want to criticize Republicans and what not, but what you are doing is lying. You are a discredit to your own argument. If you think your case is honestly superior then face if squarely and fairly and be confident that the best argument will win the day.
Your current tactic is only fit for a lying coward.
Aliothemage 2 years ago
Comment removed
kenzaburo 2 years ago
"You sound very insecure and defensive. I must be telling the truth. Your comment proves I am right."
Are you Homle then?
lol, it proves you are right does it? Well, I happen to be neither a Republican, nor a theist. I was being defensive however because I don't like dishonorable tactics used in any argument. I have chided people who argue on my side of the issues before for being insulting to those they argue with because it only distracts from the real issues.
Aliothemage 2 years ago
There is no double standard. Republicans can have guns anywhere, anytime. DemocRATS, who are communist, socialist, terrorist Nazis, can never have firearms, anywhere, anytime. This is what the Constitution says, this is what the Bible says. George Washington Christ was a Republican, just like all good Americhristians are.
Democrats are terrorists. They cannot legally own guns. It is time for all DemocRATS to be thrown in Guantanamo, they must pay for their anti-Americanism.
End of debate.
HomleandSecurity 2 years ago
Our healthcare would match our amount spent if we stopped paying for so many illegals (other countries don't worry about that as much).........and maybe nuking McDonalds would help haha. Let's spend money on building a wall and then worry about reforming health care
MomentsAfter 2 years ago
I agree with the graph, but disagree with Newsish's analysis:
1. US life expectancy is low because of lifestyle choices; high fat diets, excessive drug/alcohol use, high murder/violence rates, etc. Our health care is a factor, but not a driver.
2. We spend 3X per capita that other countries spend. Why? Because we fund the world's R&D, piss away 9% of total costs on litigation, and ration NOTHING under Medicare
Obamacare does not address #1, and exaccerbates #2. Reform yes! Obamacare no!
JohnR22926 2 years ago
Agreed 100%
MomentsAfter 2 years ago
For some reason, we can't come to terms accepting that UHC has become public infrustructure now that we have reached a population density high enough to warrant it. Wage slaves have been duped by there masters that it will cost them more or that the quality will go down if they scrap their policies for UHC. Your graph indicates how the drones only look to their next check and not the big picture. If they only knew they would have 300 more per month net for 150 per month in new taxes...
imataxslave 2 years ago
Japan has 1/3 the population which explains why they spend less on health care. Japan — Population: 127,288,416 (July 2008 est.).
Try again.
uwejuwe 2 years ago
How fucking stupid are you? Do you know what "per capita" means? Do you know how to do basic division?
Newsish 2 years ago
"Per capita" means for each person, so if you had 100 people paying £50 each for their health care it would still be the same per capita cost as 1000 or 200,000 or even just 1 person paying £50 each.
Incidentally Britain is ranked 18th globally for its healthcare but spends 50% per capita compared to USA which is ranked 37th. If you leave your vital national services in the hands of people only interested in making money, they'll only be interested in making money.
BaronFitz 2 years ago
You're right but some people don't understand the whole "Making money" problem with our American health care... business. Calling it a system feels like a sham. You don't make money here if your insurance covers everything all the time.
Zeeroyuy 2 years ago
Keep preaching the good word amigo! I hope one day that Americans have the ability to stop thinking about themselves for once and start caring about those in less fortunate positions.
leercup 2 years ago
GREAT VIDEO!
n75e 2 years ago
Great vid, but you might want to change the title, "economics", not "ecomomics", surely?
peterukk 2 years ago
I have always enjoyed your videos and this time its no exception. Keep it up.
sabbirsa 2 years ago
This should not even be a debate to begin with. This is Unconstitutional. No where in the Constitution does it say the Government should supply Heath Care to everyone.
Under the 'General Welfare clause; you say? sorry that specifically points to the Enumerated powers and they clearly list what Congress can do. Health Care is for the people and the States. end of story.
Even if this bill does pass it will go before the Judicial Branch for review. it's unconstitutional, it won't become law.
VodkaAce 2 years ago
Too bad Obama didn't do a presentation like this at townhall meetings!
mollycanadian 2 years ago
the only people who benefit from private healthcare are the insurance companies and politicians paid for by them, that is fact and has already been proven.
ram15361 2 years ago
ram: so...by your logic we could say that the only people that profit from the private info tech industry are Microsoft and Dell. And that we should nationalize them and take eeevil profit out of the system. Then we could all have a new PC every year for FREE!
Name one program the govt runs efficiently. One program they haven't fucked up totally.
Take a 100 level course in economics and learn something.
JohnR22926 2 years ago
Microsoft, Dell, IBM and the rest do make profit from the ICT industry, but that is not the debate, the debate is HEALTH CARE in caps just in case your menial reading skills are lacking. I stated that the only ones who profit from the current Healthcare system are the insurance companies and the politicians that advocate private healthcare, this is a matter of fact and public record. By your logic I suppose the DOD and Criminal Justice are fucked up to name two, or do you mean since Obama?
ram15361 2 years ago
ram: Yes, I understand; my point is that profit is not more "evil" in the health care industry than it is in ANY other industry.
Profit is the only foolproof method ever developed to determine when an industry is running efficiently. Low (or no) profit means you're inefficient and you shut down operations (bankruptcy) and divert the capital to more efficient industries.
That's why govt programs suck; there's no profit and no measure of efficiency. And yeah, DoD is incredibly wasteful.
JohnR22926 2 years ago
johnr, does your avocation of profit extend to the greedy bankers in wall street who have now profited from the bale out advocated by both administrations. It always amazes me that when there are proposed programs to help the poorest in society that people get so irate, the health care insurance industry makes much more than it puts in or gives to you that is a fact and they are spending millions of dollars in propaganda discrediting the proposal
ram15361 2 years ago
ram: I defend all "profit" that is legally earned, regardless of the amount/percentage. I encourage the ruthless prosecution of all who break the law; people like Madoff, etc.
I'll also agree there are times when people legally earn profits that I would consider excessive. The problem with giving govt the power to "punish" them, is that there will be no end to it, as the definition of "excessive" is subjective and there are just too many corrupt McCarthyites out there who will demagogue it.
JohnR22926 2 years ago
ram: One more point. IMO we have a moral obligation to help the truly helpless. Problem is, I define this group as consisting only of orphans, the mentally/physically disabled, and the elderly.
Democrats expand the group to anyone who will vote for them. IMO there are FAR too many able bodied adults getting govt subsidies, and they (and we) would be better off with less of it. My opinion.
JohnR22926 2 years ago
Stop listening to this joseph gerbils of the obama brownshirts!
It is socialism totalitarianism beyond your wildest dreams people! Wake up! It is an unprecedented government take over!
America has to stand up for it's values and principles. It has to stand up for free market and liberty.
'those who give up their freedom for [social] security [and healthcare] deserve neither'. -Benjamin Franklin
I plege allegiance to the Flag of USofA, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty for all
11thsockpuppet 2 years ago
I live in England, but am an American citizen, i get everything absolutely free in england, all my medication is free. All my appointments free. And then im on holiday in America and one appointment is like $200 WTF.
sonad28 2 years ago
dude. the U.K health Care system employs 1.4 million people. the 3rd largest agency in the world. it occupies 1/3 of their economy. Their government is broke, they are in negative equity. Their system is an epic failure and the majority of their people in numerous polls in their state don't like their current system
VodkaAce 2 years ago
You are just full of misinformation. How does 1.4 million (assuming that's even true) equal 1/3 of a population of 61 million people?
Newsish 2 years ago
newish: You can make a case that reform of the US system is necessary, but if you're going to defend the UK's system you're on thin ice.
Of all the European systems, the UK's is probably in the worst shape...both financially and in terms of quality of services rendered. And although their system needs a major overhaul, the voters are terrified they'll lose out. That's the fundamental problem with socialism; once people have it they cling to it like a junkie clings to his needle.
JohnR22926 2 years ago
it still beats libertarianism, i never want to see crack sold in convenient stores.
VikingNinjitsu 2 years ago
"i never want to see crack sold in convenient stores."
Yes, its much better when its sold on the streets and makes billions for the least scrupulous people on earth. Besides, don't you remember when Cocaine was legal? It was sold in Coke, it was just like caffeine.
Personally, I don't even drink products with caffeine, but I have no problem with people who do.
Aliothemage 2 years ago
aliothemage: I've got a streak of libertarianism in me, but I reject any form of "pure" ideology. A bit of libertarianism is OK; all things in moderation.
Re drugs, I think we should examine the european experiments (primarily the dutch) and have an honest debate about it. I think it would be OK to conduct an experiment and legalize non addictive drugs...not so sure about narcotics though.
JohnR22926 2 years ago
"I think we should examine the european experiments (primarily the dutch)"
Well, its awesome you have an open mind on the subject. And I'm not quite as crazy as I sound, I would want to experiment the same way first, and legalize things gradually but I am confident that this would have good effects on society. I would suggest looking at the drug legalization in Portugal, its had enormous success.
Aliothemage 2 years ago
fantastic graph! I totally called where the US would be. My question is though,
Where does Canada fit on the graph?
fr1daythe13th 2 years ago
Who cares? Canada ranks 29th (WHO - world health organization) whereby US is #37. #1 is Norway and #2 is Sweden but then again the people from these countries pay somewhere b/w 45-50% income tax.
sabbirsa 2 years ago
The answer is simple AND constitutional:
1. Stop treating illegal immigrants free of charge. Implement a "stabilize and deport" policy for emergencies, simply deport for non-emergencies.
2. Let people have tax-free health care savings accounts that they fund themselves and only carry insurance for catastrophic care. You don't insure against an oil change or a flat tire, do you?
3. End restrictions on interstate commerce for insurance.
Problem solved.
LibertarianinMA 2 years ago
The reason the graph shows that Americans spend more is because we pay for all of our health care up front, and not with our taxes. In a country like Japan or Canada, they only pay a small amount to the doctor, but