Do you know that Christianity is correct? The world around us reveals that G-d DOES exist, and the historical evidence reveals that Jesus Christ really did come to this earth and there is overwhelming evidence that Jesus Christ really did physically rise from the dead. Jesus is coming again and the signs of the end times that were foretold in the Bible are coming to pass.
@whataboutvietnam LOL nor will it ever prove anything. I love all gundams but you can't exactly say which gundam is better because its not like they are ever going to meet and fight, you know unless they actually make an anime where they do that which would be weird.
@lolpanther123 To be honest when you think about it you just got to think what is the most op, i mean a nuclear reactor in Strike Freedom with how many guns, but then all the gundams from 00 have an unlimited operation time and the Trans Am, which boosts there ability...
@nikey646 Truthfully I like Strike Freedom the most but I wouldn't say it is the strongest. Hmm... Since you brought that up what would happen if you put a GN Drive into Strike Freedom. Or even Wing.
@lolpanther123 Wing didnt keep me to intereseted to be honest, so i couldnt say, but if you were to say put a GN Drive into the Strike Freedom, with Trans Am ready to use.....Well forget building an army, nothing could get past that shit imo
@lolpanther123 lol, i went to watch MS0087th i think it was, and the graphics just murdered it, wish sunrise would re-create all there classics would make it so worth watching them again in wide-screen! xD
@nikey646 XD hahaha wow, true though. I didn't know that the Strike Freedom used a nuclear reactor O_O. Isn't that extremely dangerous? Considering possible overheating lol.
@lolpanther123 Kira turned it off though, the neutron jammer was set differently when he went in the freedom. I'm not sure about the strike freedom but they're attacks were similar. SF was good, I thought. After I saw AC and UC it isn't the best. In my opinion.
I have to agree, I'm a die hard Wing Zero/Wing Zero Custom fanboy, but I'm pretty sure that 00 Qan[T] would win the fight, especially after its ELS enhancment.
Turn A. There isn't a gundam in the series that can top the Turn A. Granted Loran is a horrible pilot, it doesn't change the fact that it is the most powerful gundam in the series.
@Machdude Isn't that only because of the Moonlight butterfly that eats up any tech from here to jupiter? The 00 QAN(T) has better quantizing abilities than the 00 raiser in that it can teleport very far (setsuna mentions going to the ELS home planet If I'm not mistaken...). This puts the 00 QAN(T) at a HUGE advantage, but then again that is assuming VEDA would be able to predict the moonlight butterfly. I guess it would depend on the circumstances...though setsuna isn't much better of a pilot
In any skirmish, the Moonlight Butterfly is what makes Turn A overpowered. The toys that the 00 Qant has give him a distinct combat advantage but a single touch means an almost instant defeat.
@Machdude most abilities, but the quantum sword is big enough to cut through a large moon and it's a giant beam saber. Even if it means no physical contact, I think setsuna could be lucky with his dodges and win... maybe.
@Machdude if i remember right moonlight butterfly cant be activated at will and if you have to get close to the Qan(T) it would be suicide cuase then he can just fire up his teleporter and send you into the sun he technically wouldnt even have to lift his sword cuase his shield bits can open the teleportation portal which is how he moved to another galaxy in an instant so charging in he can get you and if you try to range attack he can still move his shield bits into your evasion paths
You do know that the MB works on anything it touches and that it has an effective range that can encompass the earth right? As far as it is concerned, you'd have to be well out of its reach to really score a hit. The nnoncanon stuff blows it out of proportions, but if the Qant needs to deploy its bits, it has to make sure those bits aren't within its range. Whereas the 00 has to strike in a straight line, the MB encompasses the entire radius of the Turn A.
@Machdude you still avoided the fact that the Moonlight butterfly cant be activated at will and the only way it would be activated would be late in a fight where it looks like he cant win still by that time he would already be in the cut up or sent to the sun then is also the fact that 00Qan(T) can wait out Moonlight butterfly by teleporting out of range or quantizing to avoid its affect then it also has alot of other abilites that arent even combat related it seems that Qan(T) is hacking now
The 00 Qant still operates within reasonable limits (limits that the Turn A can work with). You are neglecting one major fact, the 00 Qant is NOT that insane. The extremem abilities that it has only exists in Trans-Am or when it has prepped itself for warp (which means it isn't the perfect movement ability). This is also noting that as long as MB is active, the Turn A's performance is also improved. The last is, the Turn A can self repair. It IS the strongest Gundam.
@Machdude its only reasonable till he trans ams or quantizes which it can quantize without trans am and turn A can still end up losing even if it can repair its self i can still be destroyed and there is also the fact that setsuna can read his opponents thoughts so he would know when and wat the moonlight butterfly can do and how to avoid it and again thats assuming that he can activate MB which isnt certain and with trans-AM power up and the power up shield bits he would hard pressed to fight.
You are assuming that their mobility is in a different class from each other. They aren't. MB Turn A can fly around the world in an instant which even from the logical standpoint would mean that it could outspeed practically any Gundam short of warp. Also, Trans-Am burst actually LOWERS the performance of the Gundam so when he tries to use the whole Mind reader thing, 1 shot is all it takes. In combat, the only thing limiting Turn A is its power supply (which even the Twin Drive is not exempt).
@Machdude again trans am does have a time limit and it does drop preformance but its only temporary as it can also recharge while in battle and it seems that all ur relying on is the MB which again cant be used at WILL and even if he did then setsuna can still teleport away to recharge cuz teleport and quantizing dont require trans am and he can always return when MB has drained the energy also near the end of Qan(T) u noitce that QanT becomes biological cuz of the alien so its not tech anymore
No, Trans-Am BURST is the ability that lets Setsuna read other people's thoughts. It actually reduces the combat performances of the Qant in order to increase its processing power. And before you even say anything, Quantizing DOES require Trans-Am because it relies on it to generate the particles to do so. Setsuna has NEVER Quantized outside of Trans-Am. And considering the effective abilities of MB Turn A, running is never an option. He has to stop and fight somewhere.
@Machdude well lets see MB chase him down when he is in another galaxy but since the Qan(T) is now biological no need to run from the MB cuz it cant hurt him since its not tech also even if it can move that fast in MB mode then it still doesnt mean it has better mobility just means top speed faster mobility is all of the units overall evasion, speed, and limbs reaction time not just speed and even if it can move that fast Turn A pilot cant really use it at full potential since his mind cant
@Machdude process all the information moving at speed that lets you go around the earth in an instant and you cant say otherwise cause that is just a human limitation doesnt matter how advance they are so that extra speed is crap in battle anyways thats why they slow down when they are going to fight if you dont notice that also as far as piloting is concerned setsuna is better since he has training since he was a child and as an innovator better reflexes, processing, and Gforce resistance.
Now you are just railing. Fact is, we were never talking about Setsuna so why are you even bringing him in? The question is about Gundams and in this case, the Turn A is just better. It is faster, stronger, more resilient, better equipped and is more advanced from the base up. The 00 Qant has claim to be one of the strongest, but not THE strongest especially when the Turn A is there.
@Machdude when it comes to gundams you cant leave out the pilot cuz even if the gundam is unstoppable if he cant handle the gforces or information processing it will be useless and Turn A is only faster than 00 when in MB mode and MB mode doesnt effect ELS Qan(T) and really the only overpower quality of the Turn A would be MB which makes it that it doesnt have to fight anyone why would that be oh cuase it can still be destroyed in a fight that why it need MB to bad it doesnt work on the ELS QanT
Except this debate was never about the pilot. It's common knowledge, Loran is one of the worst pilots in the series. But considering G-force, the 00 Series renders it irrelevant, but so does the Turn A. You don't get it, the Turn A is the most advanced gundam in the world. it not only has accomodations for G-force, but it can literally regenerate its pilot. And you misunderstand. Outside of the Destructive properties of MB, it also increases the Turn A's abilities.
@Machdude again its not more advance than the 00 different diminsions and just cuase it can do that doesnt make the Turn A more powerful since a Qan(T) saber is still enough to cut it in half and then what doesnt matter if i can regenerate the fight is over when its destroyed and really if they use it at full power it would end up melting the Turn A away so then how can it heal it can still be destroyed and the quantizing ability would help the qant win because it would be able to avoid damage
Simjply having a means to take down the Turn A does not mean it is advanced. The RX-78 is capable of shooting down the Nu Gundam. Does that make it more advanced? No.
However, the 00 Qant's only advantage is its attacks in single bursts.
In static firepower, the Turn A is better. In speed, the Turn A is faster. In armaments, the Turn A is far better equipped. Hell, the Turn A even has a better power supply (Black Hole power supply). It is even leagues lighter than the Qant.
@Machdude You dont want to have to compare pilots cuase you know i am right also the Turn A isnt more advance than the Qan(T) you know that thing that went to another galaxy in a flash because they arent from the same timeline or universe or dimension
The Turn A jumps past that and is in the realm of nanomachines where the 00 Qant is still in solid tech. Yeah it's the most advanced.
Even considering the ELS, the Turn A is still the most advanced primarily because of its full warp capabilities. Forget about direct combat, when the Turn A can dismantle a Gundam from the inside out without even a firefight, it is pretty much the strongest hands down.
@Machdude so qant will dimantle itself to avoid damage which is wat quantizing is breaking himself down to particle and reforming himself and u know wat if it has nano machines setsuna and veda can hack those nano machines and initiate self destruct the more advance any tech the more weakness that tend to come up then is also the matter that in order to warp or dismantle anything your computer needs to accurately target and calculate it which GN particles counter these systems so it cant be used
Sigh, now you are just adding stuff out of your ass. Quantization shifts the Qant to another plane before reforming him somewhere else, except for any damage that it suffers. The 00 Gundam never did it so the Qant sure as hell can't. Veda also only works with other units connected to it. A completely independent gundam like the Turn A with its own super advanced system? Not happening. And as far as GN disturbances, the Turn A is past the point of minovsky particles and anything similar.
@Machdude they are GN particles not minovsky the are particles out of the Turn A universe so the Turn A gundam wasnt given compensation for something it never encountered before and ya the qant can interface with over machines just like seravee and that is why setsuna can use the qant cuz of his ability to interface with it and in order to shift to another plane you have to break urself down to particals anyway to shift to the other plane and it still a advance ability that ur turn A doesnt have
@trichrono you cant compensate for something that you never encounter before and the qant was never able to show its full ability in the movie and now with the ELS upgrade we dont know either and ELS come with the ability to absorb other machines and they also seem to be very adaptible so now wat are u gonna tell me that the turn A is above being asorbed i doubt that its super computer has ever been invaded by a living concious
@Machdude you cant compensate for something that you never encounter before and the qant was never able to show its full ability in the movie and now with the ELS upgrade we dont know either and ELS come with the ability to absorb other machines and they also seem to be very adaptible so now wat are u gonna tell me that the turn A is above being asorbed i doubt that its super computer has ever been invaded by a living concious miss reply
And yet the effective range for the Turn A is from Earth to Jupiter in the novels. Now this is not even getting into its ability to warp every part of itself in many ways which means that it can warp beam shots straight into the cockpit of its opponent. This ability effectively allows the turn A to fight without the need to even be in combat range and the attack itself can neither be evaded by the pilot nor can it be foreseen. No need to fight up close when it can win without a clash.
@Machdude the ELS Qan(T) is now the most advance gundam out there because now it has something no other gundam has true unlimited potential now it can grow more powerful and it can evovle and all from assimilating other tech and oragnic beings and it has the experience and knowledge of an entire ancient civilization and veda and still even if Turn A can do that why does it still insist on doing melee then and it wouldnt know the Qant can assimilate anyway and qant can quantize and then touch it
It isn't until it has displayed any remote advancements. As far as it is concerned, it still has a lot to go before it can touch the Turn A. Two major technologies are what make the Turn A the most advanced Gundam in the series. Black Hole core and Nanomachines. Effectively, it is the most advanced by a mile.
@Machdude well all the Qant needs to do is touch it and it will assimilate turn A in a matter of seconds and the Qant was a perfect match for the ELS because its Quantizing lets it catch everything off guard and once it takes the Turn A gundam it will add its strengths to itself and that is why ELS Qant is the most advance and Quite literally the assimilation of technology takes a matter of few seconds while the assimilation of organics takes a few minutes that is true unlimited potential LEARN
@Machdude here is the way i see it they give u 2 choices one they tell u this processor is the most powerful and advance processor out there or u can get this processor it isnt as powerfull as the other but it will keep growing overtime and it wont stop so which one is more advance because honestly any tech short of ESL will fade away to time since ESL are living metal and an hive mind they dont really die or rust into nothingness and the turn A gundam cant grow anymore its stuck at that power
The Turn A is not only fully capable of doing the opposite, but its nanomachines by itself already allow it to combat enemies on the microscale. Considering that that they are essentially Nanites, they are likely one of the most effective weapons against practically any technological force. The difference is that while the 00 Qant has potential, the Turn A is a walking techbane. Yes the 00 Qant has the potential. Unfortunately, the Turn A is an unstoppable force.
@Machdude ya but wat about the fact that its fighting a living enemy with hivemind intellegence of countless speices its assimilated Turn A still cant stop itself from being assimilated hell even organic beings couldnt stop themselves from being assimilated so there is no was in hell nanomachines can cuz even cells failed at it meaning that the ELS are assimilated at a sub cell level they probably also converting cells to metal which is why it takes a few minutes longer on organics but still.
At its level, it doesn't have to when it can break down the component metals to sand. The ELS functions effectively as micro-organisms that can come together to form coherent shape. The ability of nanites is essentially the ability to reproduce itself using what it consumes as a base matter with the eventual result being a by product. Also, you neglect to understand how small nanomachines can be. The size is can be about the size of a cluster of atoms, far smaller than a cell.
@Machdude now who making things up since its atoms that make up all materials in the universe if a nanite was as small as a cluster of atoms then it wouldnt have much to make it up so it cant be that small and you neglect to understand how small living organisms can be ever heard of viruses and those are carbon based cells and the ELS who knows how small they can get and they seem to do exactly wat the Turn A nanites do and they can do way more than the nanites in Turn A can do assimilation
@Machdude all living things reproduce by consuming base matter or is that somethign u didnt learn in school really what do we take from food the materials so our cells can reproduce and produce energy and if a nanite can get that small u better believe living biengs can get that small too otherwise there is no way that the ELS can restructure the organic material into a metalic substance and Turn A is to limited to do wat u say it does why hasnt it reproduce into 2 turn A gundams cuz it cant
Not an individual cellular organism. At its base, each cell is a self contained organism. before it even undergoes mitosis, it can be punctured and killed which is easy if the opponent is as tiny an organism as a nanomachine. And at the size of a nanomachine, forget about replication, because a cellular organism cannot suddenly get smaller to replicate it, much less reproduce its functions (at which point it would have to be a magnitude smaller).
And quite simply, why is there only a single Turn A? Simple. A single Black hole Engine. Like the GN drive, the Black Hole engine is a self contained black hole which means that the only way to build one is with a Hadron Collider. While the Turn A is advanced, the technology required to build a hadron collider capable of creating a self contained black hole would be an astronomical undertaking. In the same way, it is not like the Qant can suddenly create a new GN drive.
@Machdude well the ELS are metallic organics so i doubt they can be punctured so easily and i am sure that the main mass of the ELS can reproduce technology it has assimilated but honestly 00 Qant and Raiser are way better becuase they were made to help humans evovle past thier limits in order to bring about understanding as a way to end war and it literaly connects the hearts of humans its better at bringing true peace better imo than Turn A gundam that will just bring about more destruction
@Machdude then there is the fact that the smaller a black hole is the greater its gravitation force is so the Turn A is its own weakness a micro fraction or a split micro second faliure of the containment unit will end up being the end of the gundam which is stupid seeing as they placed a black hole drive into a combat gundam meaning its been lucky so far that the black hole engine hasnt taken any damage and it will be impossible to repair once the engine is peirced and you cant deny it
The Black Hole tech functions similar to a wormhole reactor which by extension allows it to store its weapons in a space time pocket, which it can recall at the touch of a button. This not only allows it to warp attacks away from it, but it also allows it to protect the engine by temporally removing it from the suit. Ever wonder why the suit is so light? That's because it is HOLLOW. For the most part the Turn A has NOTHING in its main shell. This makes its only equal, the Turn X.
@Machdude so it can avoid damage well it still doesnt change the fact u cant contain a black hole forever if damage doesnt get you then time will time will always get anything doesnt matter how hi tech it is its just a matter of time and a matter of the internal damages of the black hole on the containment unit that cant be repaired because its on the inside of the contaiment unit still seems this arguement wont end so end it like this i will love Qant for being something more and u can like urs
Idiot, if it was that debilitating for the Turn A, it would never have been implemented at all. How long was the Turn A buried for? Even without human maintenance it can still manage the entirety of its systems. You are neglecting that this is the Gundam that can repair itself from crippling damage and even ressurect its pilot. Managing a Black Hole is like containing Anti-matter except that with the power being drawn from the black hole, it effectively can sustain itself forever.
@Machdude first of all you an idiot since that is in the realm of imagination because we all know if the nanite tried to repair the damage that was on the inside of a black hole containment unit it would get sucked in causing the black hole to expand to the point i cant be contained in that small unit secondly this is by the laws of real world that is what would happen and thats how i rated on in real world situation which is why i love gundam cuase it can be possible. idiot
But here's a question for you? What Gundam in the series can sustain a hit to the reactor and still consider itself close to anything except slag. The 00 Qant suffers this the worst prior to the ELS mode because it has 2 points of attack and if even 1 drive goes down, the whole thing shuts down. But even considering the ELS style 00 Qant, it still suffers from the fact that it is just as easy to blast the core of the unit and blow it up just the same. The difference here? The pilot dies.
@Machdude here is something you might not know first of all the ELS are a hivemind with individuals as an overall alien species which is why seperated by galaxies the troops recieved the order to stop the attack meaning that even if the body is destroyed the mind of that destroyed body would remain and be replanted into a new body by the hivemind so setsuna would end up losing his body but it would be restored and as the 00 Qant is now it can regenerate as well.
The Qant would survive, Setsuna himself likely would not. The ELS have proven to be able to assimilate into a symbiosis and replicate the human likeness, but as it has been shown, an assimilated and reproduced being holds none of their memories. So while it can regenerate the body, Setsuna as a person would cease to exist once he is killed.
And considering the Turn A, it really doesn't matter about numbers. If it can fly around the world in an instant, a moon sized core isn't exactly a problem.
@Machdude oh yeah well why did the ELS stop attacking and form the flower from setsuna;s memory its obvious that the ELS can hold on the the conscious of the people it has assimilated and that is how it grow to understand wat it assimilates which i cant restore into a new body since all they need it the conscious and i think it does matter its bad enough the Turn A cant do anything more than destroy but once it fails the black hole would proceed to destroy the galaxy thats why its not pratical.
The Qant would survive, Setsuna himself likely would not. The ELS have proven to be able to assimilate into a symbiosis and replicate the human likeness, but as it has been shown, an assimilated and reproduced being holds none of their memories. So while it can regenerate the body, Setsuna as a person would cease to exist once he is killed.
And considering the Turn A, it really doesn't matter about numbers. If it can fly around the world in an instant, a moon sized core isn't exactly a problem.
@Machdude i meant it can restore and either way the 00 Qant is still superior in the fact that it isnt just some and thats all its good for it brought peace to 2 warring civilizations and didnt have to hold the gun to someones head and even better when it blows up it can be restored by the ELS and better than that when it blows up it wont leave behind a galaxy destroying black hole oh god if that black hole was on earth ouch also the 00 Qant wouldnt need a pilot now like certain Turn A gundams
@Machdude since all ELS are individual conscioussness within a hivemind the 00 Qant wouldnt even need a physical pilot in it to operate since the pilot and Machine are always connected mentally if not physically and it can even be said that with the ELS upgrade the Qant might even be given a mind of its own cause now its alive as well so while Turn A gundam still needs a pilot in the cockpit the Qant doesnt meaning its always on the ready.
@Machdude is still superior in the fact that it isnt just some weapon of destruction and thats all its good for it brought peace to 2 warring civilizations to peace and it didnt have to hold a gun to someones head lets be honest thats all the moonlight butterfly is just a weapon so that no one could challenge the coward that built that gundam its original purpose was to keep peace through the use of fear with the power to destroy all tech on earth and thats the only reason it has that power
the Turn A ushered in an era of peace to the world by having the world start over. The MB doesn't have to kill people. But considering that this is over the strength of the gundam, you are losing track of the main idea. The Turn A is the most powerful Gundam in existence.
@Machdude power is relative plus what about all the people in the hospital that had to die from the machines failure and what about people with pacemakers or hearing aids also power would be being able to end a fight and keeping the fight ended if you just beat someone down like that then they will get back up and fight back later and honestly the Turn A gundam has no where else to go to then down in power over time then Qant will go up in power over time and thats what i consider real power
Sigh, You are starting to lose your train of thought and ranting at this point. The Turn A's ability is as the bane of technology and with its power, it doesn't really matter how powerful the Qant is, the MB will work on it. As it also has been said, the nanomachines from the Turn A will keep it in the best conditions without decay and will even repair damage over time. As the engine powering it is a black hole, it can in theory operate for millions of years. Good luck outlasting it, Qant.
@Machdude ELS Qant will live as long as the ELS civilization exsists and maybe even beyond that but still you cant contain a black hole for milions of years considering every day the containment unit will begin to be weaken and damaged from the inside out and it cant be repaired from the inside cuase nanites can withstand the force of a black hole hell i doubt even warp speed can out run the force of a black hole which is why its not a practical engine cause it will take out the planet
@Machdude and in the end that Turn A will always be limited by its Pilot and what its been programmed to do because it cant compensate for wat it hasnt been programmed to compensate for. and the Turn A greatest weakness besides its own engine would be that it still needs a pilot physically in the cockpit meaning its at it weakest then where as the ELS Qant no longer needs setsuna physically attached to the cockpit and he has greater reflex and reaction due to ELS Hivemind
@Machdude its not only the Turn A that can help the pilot reaction and processing time only difference is the Qant is the most advance since its already broken past the point of a lifeless machine and can continue to grow and gain new attributes to make it even more advance and powerful plus the guidence and the knowledge of an entire civilization with billions of consciouness which will continue to grow as well wat can the Turn A grow into nothing its stuck forever untill it destroys its self.
You keep on saying it will destroy itself when it can last perpetually in itself (Black holes can exist from hundreds of millions to billions of years) and with the passive power, keep itself in pristine condition. Also, while the 00 Qant can theoretically absorb technology, the Turn A can advance itself by warping any weapon into its holding which means that in the same universe, their abilities are about the same. The difference is that the Turn A works both ways, making it the stronger.
@Machdude umm warping weapons into its holding isnt the same as assimilating not even close its just equipping itself not expanding its attributes and range of abilities and then its limited to the items that it can warp in also ur seem to be confused the black hole isnt wat its gonna destroys itself i mean the black hole is gonna destroy the gundam by sucking it into itself and turning it into a singularity then it will grow and suck in the earth or planets close to it.
@trichrono u know wat i am just gonna end this any scientist would agree that a machine that has cross the line to the living being and that can continue to evolve and grow overtime and as well as assimilate to increase its knowledge and attributes is a more advance machine because to construct something that continues to grow is a feat that takes more knowledge and advancements than a machine that will always be the same like the Turn A. In short the 00 Qant is a walking miracle to science
No, it is only such in potentia, a potential that it has not yet attained. Considering the attributes, even if the 00 gundam was to assimilate all of earth's tech in AD, it would still be unable to meet the standards of the Turn A. you also overestimate the ELS because they can't fully absorb technology. They can produce effects similar to GN particles, but are unable to replicate finer technology like GN drives and complex instruments.
The mere fact that it can be modified to uyse such weapons is the main advantage of it. Advancement is subjective.
And you don't seem to understand. A self contained black hole is essentially what's keeping itself in check. As the series notes, its likely not even in the main unit and it likely is being powered by means of a wormhole connection. thus even if it did have the potential for failure (which it does not given its exceedingly long lifespan) it would still be in no danger.
@Machdude also i need to be more specific on the warping in weapons its just equipping things that it has in its arsenal which itself would still be limited and really just warping in new weapons doesnt mean that its advancing because the main body the gundam itself will always be the same never growing also do you even know wat warp means its a method through which one can exceed the speed of sound so idk how warping in weapons works unless the weapons have engines themselves i doubt that.
The ability to warp in weapons also accounts for the fact that it can optimize itself to use those weapons. The power source by itself is a control but considering that the suit itself was made to be able to house weapons, it quite literrally would be a suit that would be able to use any weapon it can get its hands on.
The ability to warp in weapons also means that it is using wormholes to bring new weapons to its vicinity. Considering that this ability can warp beams into a cockpit, yeah...
@Machdude oh god am i really gonna explain this well sigh stil well the ship or gundam would surround itself in a normal time bubble while compressing space and time in front of it and expanding it in the rear hence reaching faster than light travel however the problem lies int he fact that if the gundam collides with a pebble at this speed will it would blow up which is why it needs a capable shield the Turn A doesnt have so it cant warp in weapons idk wat it is but that isnt warping
The Turn A is not using FTL travel. It literally is using instantaneous warping which means that it jumps through space time. It isn't plotting a shrunken timeline, it is opening up a hole on one side and out another. Silos empty? Warp them from a warehouse far away. No weapons? Do the same. Armor too strong to penetrate? Teleport a shot straight into their cockpit.
The point is, this ability is not movement, it is actual teleportation.
@Machdude i also know all the weapons it can warp in and they arent that impressive
Beam Cannon x 2
Beam Saber x 2
Multi-Porpose Silo x 6
Beam Rifle
Gundam Hammer x 2
Minchi Drill
Shield
infact if its so advance why does it still need a hammer and drill and shield also these items are held on in DOC bases which the turn A gundam destroyed with its moonlight butterfly nice going also the nanomachine regeneration isnt instantaneous the only impressive weapon is its nuclear weapons
The items held in the DOC bases are what has been found. Its upper limits is unknown primarily because the Turn A dissolved many of its own weapons in its history with the MB. The hammers are a powerful exception because they were covered with the nanomachines in the MB that allowed it to be distinguished and not dissolved. Considering its civilization's tech level, it would not see any advancements in tech. But place it in another world and watch it have a field day.
@Machdude if you still think its more advance go for it doesnt matter any which way seeing as how u dont even know how the systems specify but watever i just know its its own worst enemy and i will leave it at that u also have to wonder why those nukes in its chest havent blown up yet either but watever on that too go ahead believe wat u want
If it was that easy especially when you have to wonder if it even has nukes in its chest at all. And combining it all, it has an I-field that is powerful enough to stop physical attacks in addition to beam attacks. It is as protected as it gets. On the other hand, if you shoot the core of the Qant, whatever mode it is in, it will blow. Gn drives may be powerful, but one shot is all it takes. It's not even like the ELS can replicate them either, if it is gone, it is gone.
@Machdude then the left over ELS pieces will just take a new host and use it as a base to reform hence the power of assimilation and the Qant has its own shield systems also the I-Field cant protect from an explosion on its inside so if u shot the Turn A core it goes boom too and cant come back and i know it carries nukes in its chest which is the worst place to carry something like that well think watever u want i know the ELS Qant is the most advance and with the least technical problems
@Machdude then the left over ELS pieces will just take a new host and use it as a base to reform hence the power of assimilation and the Qant has its own shield systems also the I-Field cant protect from an explosion on its inside so if u shot the Turn A core it goes boom too and cant come back and i know it carries nukes in its chest which is the worst place to carry something like that well think watever u want i know the ELS Qant is the most advance and with the least technical problems
And as it is to finally cap, it is not its own worse enemy. Having already been blown up before, the Turn A is still fully capable of reviving itself to full capacity. Blasting a hole in its chest will not send it into a state of meltdown or structural collapse. hell, even the nukes have to be properly armed before they can detonate (ever studied an actual nuclear warhead). But that's only considering it in its physical. Good luck penetrating an I-field that can stop solid hits.
@Machdude I-field isnt so mighty seeing as it cant fire with the shield up and if it did it would be stupid cuz that would make it plot armor ever notice why no gundam has with a shield ever fired with the shield on cuz u cant. also it can stop attacks from the inside and on top of that u just have to keep pressing the attack till the I-Field collapses or has to shut down due to overheating the circuits from continues use on top of that the GN sabre is 2 prong attack one with physical hits.
I-field + Warping beams means that it can attack from inside its defenses without hitting the field. But that too is besides the point. It can freely move with the I-field so it can effectively be used to deflect attacks for an opening. But its main benefit is that it can block wave motion attacks with ease which is why it is relevant to begin with. When its overall performance can match the 00 Qant point for point, the field's primarily value is as a powerful backup shield.
@Machdude then it use the GN particles in the edge to heat it up to super high temperature and vibrate the particles to a point that it would be a laser saw so its both physical and energy based at the same time and the I-Field isnt meant to repulse both attacks at the same time on top of that it cant stop pressure waves cuz it still gets knocked back from explosions force also he still has to drop that shield to attack at some point cause if he doesnt he will lose when it fails.
Now you are just railing. That logic is not relevant considering that the I-field is a barrier that blocks both,. Your logic is simply A+B = AB except that it isn't the case. It would simply translate to A+B=C. To break a barrier like that, what matters is the intensity which is the most debatable point. But you are bringing hypothetical concepts in which is in how you use a tech. of course turtling is not a way to win. The I-field is just a defensive feature, not a dependent factor.
@Machdude the reasons why the Turn A looks so weak in the series is cuz it is because of the safety systems keep it from spamming all its best weapons cause doing so would most likely cause the blackhole engine to hit critical and overload hence it has fail safe that cant be overwritten which is why it still relies on its melee weapons and why the moonlight butterfly cant be used for extended periods and speaking of moonlight butterfly that is well plot armor or is plot attack.
Doesn't change the fact that it is the most powerful weapon in the story. Even considering the power of the other series, the Turn A is still holding one of the most powerful power sources in the series which is unmatched by others. As it is, even its normal weapons are ramped up because even its beam rifle has the capacity to shoot shots that are wave motion levels as its normal output.
@Machdude at first i thought MB was a energy based attack but no it isnt it is nanites that destroy the tech but its plot armor because the MB can never be used at full power they claim it can be used at it cant even surround the earth because that would mean the Turn A gundam is throwing off more mass than it actually has so its impossible if it was gonna hit jupiter and earth it would need the entire mass of earth to actually reach both sides maybe more someone didnt think that attack through
With its output, the Turn A would literally be manufacturing them from energy. Yes it is entirely possible on the fusion level (the only limitation there was the energy output). The science is never explained but considering the battle with Gym, it would have already converted its entirety into nanomachines if it were to be as such. As far as the MB is concerned, its upper limits have never been confirmed, as is that of the 00 Qant.
@Machdude then that systems is totally impracticle considering using that attack would firstly still impossible to cover the earth but would leave it sitting after MB was used cuase it wouldnt even have an I-Field energy to put up. Then it still has all those fail safes and really its more hype than truth with the Turn A systems cuase if it ramps up the beam attack then it cant be teleported cuz it doesnt warp beams i just explained that cuz the bema has more power than the system can handle
Fail safes it needs not considering that it was already capable of operating with the bare minimum of what the reactor can provide. The sheer scope of what the Black Hole Engine could generate would still allow it to function at optimal capacity because its standard weapons do not tax the system at any substantial rate. The only drawback is that its MB would be disabled until the systems return to normal.
However, i would throw that right back. Trans-Am? Completely nukes the performance of the 00 Qant. Gn Drives? Perfectly viable targets and there are TWO of them to hit. Essentially even if the Turn A had any weaknesses at all, the 00 Qant not only has the same, but it isn't even armed very well.
In other words, the majority of what you criticize also holds true for the Qant as well.
@Machdude true but wat i am trying to prove is that the Turn A is far from unstoppable and i know that Qants weaknesses as well and the Qant is heavily armed just cuz it doesnt have a huge assortment of weapons doesnt mean it isnt well armed. the GN sabre as many modes that it changes with the shield bits and the same goes for the GN rifle or cannon and the shield bits themselves are an amazing weapon to have which the Turn X has too but not the Turn A
And what I am trying to prove is simply that the Turn A is still at an advantage against the 00 Qant. All of its strongest weapons are only effective against large targets and its standard weapons are all trumped by the Turn A. At its core, the Turn A is still the stronger.
@Machdude and in the end to me the unlimited potential of the ELS Qant is wat makes it the most advance cuz it can keep growing and no other gundam can do that wanna throw MBs around fine with me the Qant is biological now. wanna throw nukes good do it the Qant has its shield bits to repulse both physical and energy attacks as well as bieng able to teleport ur nukes back wanna teleport beams go for it teh GN particles will counter that ability anyway besides the Qant will keep growing overtime
The potential is not unlimited. The ELS can assimilate technology on a technical level, but at the finer details, it does not have those benefits. While it can grow a new cannon as a result of innovation, it cannot absorb an energy source. And is it is shown, the MB is using nanites which means that even if it is biological in part, technology is still technology and those nanites can still tear them apart at the cellular level especially when they blow up just like any machine.
@Machdude no for the nanites to work the tech has to be full tech before it can be broken down to sand otherwise the nanites wont begin breaking it down becuase they arent supposed to hurt organic biengs so the ELS outer shell would be enough to stop the nanites and actaully the power source would be a bio version of the technology it absorbed meaning the nanites wouldnt begin breaking down the ELS Qant from well to but it simply fear that it is a a living thing they shouldnt hurt.
No it does not. Under nanotech, under the circumstances, it would have been fully capable of dismantling even organisms to tiny particles. However, nanites work at a microscopic level. It doesn't matter how dense the shell is, it would rip through the particle bonds or perhaps even its atomic structure. And as it is, the ELS still registers a signature as a technological unit (what is life but electrical impulses) and not a meatsack. As a target, it is perfectly viable.
@Machdude also the Qant can deploy the shield bits within the route of the nuke and itself so that it can teleport the nuke back which would be called using ur enemies strength against them. haha its funny u dont know how the warping beams work but u think u do let me run it by u again in order to teleport to anything to any point a few things needed necessary power and calculation because teleportation is affected by the smallest details such as radiation density, solar drift etc.
The Qant has not shown any ability to warp anything other than itself with further problems being that it needs to create the field with its bits before it can accelerate to that point.
But as it is said, the Turn A's ability to teleport beams means that it completely bypasses any need for a preparation gate. In addition, as one of the most advanced gundams in the series, why is calculations ever a problem when its OS dwarfs even the devil gundam?
@Machdude simple i just explained cuz it has no information about the GN particle programmed into it thats why its still limited to wat been programmed into their OS thats why and the Turn A does have a teleportation gate which would be the nanites that assemble into a gate around the rifle jsut like the shield bits just smaller duh thats why it doesnt teleport wat it doesnt touch and Qant can deploy the gates in the same route the attack is coming from unlike the Turn A the Qant gate is movable
And yet again the same can be said about the minovsky particles which essentially do the same thing. Especially since both work on an electromagnetic level, it really renders them both moot and if anything, the one that should be affected is the 00 Qant since the Minovsky particles have a lasting period of DAYS when it comes to electromagnetic interference.
@Machdude ya sit down cuz its science class time well then all these factors affect the teleportation systems wanna know why well let me tell u teleportation is as simple as breaking apart the initial target to particles and then coping they exact position each particle was in and rebuilding those particles at the chose destination now while those particles are in transfer solar drift, radiation density and any obstacles between the systems and the destination will have to be solved before use
And yet here you are arguing about theoretical technology with mundane science class? This is theoretical tech, which means it is not confined by your "laws". But hey why not. Following the fundamentals of space time, it may follow the principles of a wormhole where it bends space time to open up a channel from point A in time 1 to point B in time 2. With the timespace bent in such a way, it can effectively warp a shot into any location. Basics Star Trek, care to try Gundam?
@Machdude right but also remeber that the Turn A also has specifications none of which ever mention that it can bend space and time it can teleport on the spot but it cant manipulate space and time and it doesnt warp either cuz it doesnt have that ability built into it as well as u should know that all ways of travel or movement will always have some sort a obstacle that has to be compenstated for before it is used
@Machdude fact is that even though it doesnt seem like it gundams and star trek all actually follow the laws of physics even if it doesnt seem like it and future tech that can exsists and their limitations are all there
The laws of the space time theories are specifically made to break the laws of physics. Once you get into such concepts as dimensions, physics take second seat because it isn't about going through physical barriers, it is about bypassing them entirely.
@Machdude that is true but the Turn A doesnt have those abilities it doesnt have warp wat it does have is teleportation basic teleportation and even breaking the laws of physics u still will always have new obstacles to deal with on a totally different plain. the Turn A doesnt have the ability to manipulate time at all so it doesnt matter wat breaking laws of physics means cuz the Turn A wasnt made with the ability to break any rules or laws a physics its jsut advance with teleporting abilities
And as I said before, it already does or else it would not be a canonical ability. While it is not explained in the sciences yet, it still does not change the fact that it is fully capable of such abilities which is what makes it powerful. All I can do is speculate, but when it already has that ability, there is no sense in arguing that it does not work when it clearly has been confirmed to work.
@Machdude now where do the GN particles come in simple the GN particles are basically going to interfere with the teleportations systems targeting and computing systems and if the systems cant get an accurate read it wont use it due to the fact that the beam could very well end up in the Turn A own cockpit as well as miss by 8 miles thats a fail safe and the Turn A cant calculate the GN particles random movements and mass because it doesnt have the data on such particles to help calculate
Not on sufficiently advanced systems. it functions similar to the minovsky particle principle and even if that were true, the Turn A would also do the same in return due to the fact that it does THE SAME THING. Considering that both units exist in a time period where it is no longer an issue, there is no POINT in even addressing sensor intererence at all when it is effectively either a mutual or a deader than Elvis point which in this case, is the latter.
@Machdude no the GN particles work on different plane than Minovsky particles cuz they have different compensitions and mass as well as different dispersition patterns also the Turn A gundam doesnt release minovsky particles wanna know why black hole engine thats why also Qant is a close range combat along with enchanced ranged ability and it still aims with both computer and pilot control meaning manual with computer assist aiming and the shield bits total pilot control with Quantam brainwaves
Idiot, the Minovsky particles are the very foundations of many of the OG techs such as the I fields and with the Turn A's incorporation of it, it doesn't even have to spread them, it deploys the effects simply through combat. On the other hand, GN particle disturbances remain active only while particles are being distributed and the effects are essentially the same which is electromagnetic disturbance, an effect that the Turn A is already capablke of operating beyond.
@Machdude welll no dur all the gundams disperse GN particles through out the entire combat and it still doesnt matter in the end becuase the GN particles still will end up affecting the Turn A becuase like i said before its not made to compensate for something that it has never encountered but the Qant is still manually aimed it doesnt need to use teleportation systems and the setsuna along with tieria handle all the compensations for anamolies.
And as I said before, it clearly does not when the Turn A is already operating beyond the effects of EM radiation. By your logic, it would mean that the Turn A would not be able to do so because its own radiation would affect its own sensors. But here is the thing, they don't. The effect of GN particles is already EM radiation and the difference is mainly that GN particles do not seem to last very long whereas MP radiation lasts for days.
@Machdude GN radiation will last as long as the Gundam is in operation thats all it needs and EM radiations come all different forms and will interfere with energy based technology doesnt matter wat just cuz it was made to deal with one EM radiation it doesnt mean it was made to deal with another form
MP radiation is in a constant state of flux that is never stable which means that if you are above it, your sensors are fine. GN radiation is just a form of EM radiation and even at its best, it would probably do the same thing. So different forms of radiation? MP radiation is already spanning practically any form of radiation.
@Machdude also sensors are a big part of the Turn A gundam cuz it still needs to be able to pinpoint the enemy location and much of the aiming is computer based at least when it comes to teleportation cuz teh human mind cant handle calculating teleportation data at a fast enough rate to make it a efficient weapon i am sure that loran can pick up the beam rifle and aim it manually in cases where teh sensors cant be relied on.
Quite simply, if the Turn A is able to operate under the effects of the Minovsky particles, the GN particles essentially do not matter. You are missing the entire point, the GN particles, do not work as a magical method of disabling conventional sensors, it provides EM interference through radiation, an effect that the Minovsky particles already implement which means that it does nothing outside of looking pretty at this point.
@Machdude all data on wat can run interference wether it be gravity, radiation, solar drift, anti matter, dark matter, etc must be in teh system before usage thats why teleporting longer distances takes more time to teleport cuz it needs calculation time so that they dont reform on the outside of a super nova or trapped by the black hole, in fact if u notice all the gundams and mobile suits in 00 either aim manually like lock-on or like the gundams compensated for the GN particle interference
@Machdude so before u ever think of trying to tell me wat i dont know guess wat ur the one that doesnt know how ur own teleportation system works and u still think u can tell me that i dont know u bettter think again and another thing the Turn A doesnt warp or bend space and time it teleports they are different concepts get ur phrasings right if ur gonna try and disprove me at least get ur dam phrasing right and i also just explained how teleportation works and why its countered
As a result what you have just handed me is a long list of things that you made up or assumed is not viable in the sense that you think that it is actually a factor when what you just gave is essentially just noise. Considering that you spent 4-5 posts just trying to say how GN particles work when Minovsky particles do pretty much the same thing just serves to show how little you have even seen in the series.
@Machdude so now wat ur Turn A teleport system is out but u will try to deny that because idk why really i just proved why the teleportation system wont work but u wont listen i also explained wat warp is few days back but u didnt listen cuz ur still using the wrong phrasing and Turn A isnt able to bend space and time thats just wat u added with a misguidedly named warp ability so as far as i am concerned this arguement has reach the point were u shut down and deny the world of facts good job
@Machdude i just explained warp and teleport and i just explained why the GN particles cancel teleport because it cant get an accurate targeting tto the destination with all the unknown variables that the GN particles present to the teleport. and warp cant move beams into a pilots cockpit becuase warp is a method to move at faster than light not instant traveling. and the only way the Turn A can teleport beams would be the only kind of teleport there is and it is countered by GN interference.
@Machdude even teleporting requires aiming u seem to be misguided in thinking that its some magical ability that doesnt miss and doesnt require anything other than the push of a button but no fact is it requires alot of knowledge calculation and information and that just how science is it looks magical but alot of work goes on in those processors teh Turn A isnt god it isnt something that perfectly aims cuz it doesnt its affected by variables itself but its managed to compensate with information
Of course the Turn A is not god, but it is sufficiantly advanced to the point where it is fully capable of using space time as its weapon. The major thing that defines the Turn A is the fact that it is an enigma with technology that ended the era before it. So while it is not effectively god in the literal sense, it may as well be to anything short of itself because it stands on technology that no normal mobile suit can even hope to possess.
@Machdude really when has that Turn A gundam ever broken the bounderies of time ever it doesnt use space and time and everyone knows it even in the unit specs it never mentions the ability to warp space and time. wat it does mention is the black hole engine, all its weapons, all its features to protect the pilot, its regeneration ability, its I-field being able to stop nukes its teleportation ability, but nothing not even a small mention of space time use go look it up nothing
@MaStEr615 Nobody is gonna argue against that.
ChaosZack08 1 day ago
@MaStEe615 yes wing zero could easily roflstomp freedom, freedom cant even destroy a colony with one shot
TheKnightmareAngel 3 days ago
DID YOU EVER HEARD ABOUT FRAPS,NOOB?
Redxyellow1 3 days ago
they fight like the anime almost!
cobeoe 3 days ago
wow most of the time i visit a freedom vs wing video with freedom winning i see wing fan shitting a hate storm
negima47 3 weeks ago
@negima47 EPIC HATE SSTORM IN 3..2..1..HIS IS F@#&ING BULLS@#$ WING ZERO WOULD TOTALLY ROFLSTOMP FREEDOM ZOMFGAWD 0_o (takes epic rage shit)
MaStEr615 2 weeks ago
@MaStEr615 lol made my day
negima47 2 weeks ago
i hear that bgm called "Just communication"
do you hear it guys?
Resdrillva 1 month ago
@Resdrillva Yes I heard that :D so cool
SamerIRAQ 1 month ago
i fucking love idiots who record their tv by pointing the camera at the screen.
ABeans07 1 month ago
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Do you know that Christianity is correct? The world around us reveals that G-d DOES exist, and the historical evidence reveals that Jesus Christ really did come to this earth and there is overwhelming evidence that Jesus Christ really did physically rise from the dead. Jesus is coming again and the signs of the end times that were foretold in the Bible are coming to pass.
marionetemanJ 1 month ago
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freedom was more small than the epic wing zero <.<"...
Nekotico 1 month ago
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Nekotico 1 month ago
wow, one of the few times i havent seen an argument over gundams devolve into a shitstorm of hate.
personally, Strike Freedom's my favourite, but Turn A and X take top spots since Tomino himself said so. cant argue with the boss.
type8000 1 month ago
its for pc too?
RoyalGun3r 2 months ago
wing zero rules
SouheaX 2 months ago
As a gamer, this looks awesome. As a wing fan, this proves nothing.
whataboutvietnam 2 months ago
@whataboutvietnam LOL nor will it ever prove anything. I love all gundams but you can't exactly say which gundam is better because its not like they are ever going to meet and fight, you know unless they actually make an anime where they do that which would be weird.
lolpanther123 2 months ago
@lolpanther123 To be honest when you think about it you just got to think what is the most op, i mean a nuclear reactor in Strike Freedom with how many guns, but then all the gundams from 00 have an unlimited operation time and the Trans Am, which boosts there ability...
But i will have to say Imo Strike Freedom = Best.
nikey646 1 month ago
@nikey646 Truthfully I like Strike Freedom the most but I wouldn't say it is the strongest. Hmm... Since you brought that up what would happen if you put a GN Drive into Strike Freedom. Or even Wing.
lolpanther123 1 month ago
@lolpanther123 Wing didnt keep me to intereseted to be honest, so i couldnt say, but if you were to say put a GN Drive into the Strike Freedom, with Trans Am ready to use.....Well forget building an army, nothing could get past that shit imo
nikey646 1 month ago
@nikey646 I only got to see the 1st episode of Wing but the graphics gave me a headache so that's all I watched of it. But I know what it does.
lolpanther123 1 month ago
@lolpanther123 lol, i went to watch MS0087th i think it was, and the graphics just murdered it, wish sunrise would re-create all there classics would make it so worth watching them again in wide-screen! xD
nikey646 1 month ago
@nikey646 XD hahaha wow, true though. I didn't know that the Strike Freedom used a nuclear reactor O_O. Isn't that extremely dangerous? Considering possible overheating lol.
lolpanther123 1 month ago
@lolpanther123 Kira turned it off though, the neutron jammer was set differently when he went in the freedom. I'm not sure about the strike freedom but they're attacks were similar. SF was good, I thought. After I saw AC and UC it isn't the best. In my opinion.
lemmehaviet 1 month ago
@lolpanther123 they both used nuclear reactors, but they were originally created by the corindators, aka the smart guys, so they wouldnt overload...
nikey646 1 month ago
@nikey646 oh I see.
lolpanther123 1 month ago
sorry for my stupidity...but is this for pc.?
skycrowleo 2 months ago
@skycrowleo PS3 japan only
LadyTigresshatake 2 months ago
@LadyTigresshatake Ps2 actually. This is ACE3. ACE:R is for Ps3.
senseij7 2 months ago
@senseij7 oops my bad you're right I completely forgot this was on PS2.
LadyTigresshatake 2 months ago
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the unreleased games look so awesome they almost let you pilot the full power of the gundams an ms's
cobeoe 3 months ago
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cobeoe 3 months ago
puedo descargarlo, o como lo consigo xq esta bien bueno ese juego
3lordofgilwell 3 months ago
que juego es este? es el dinasty warrior gundam 3? o otro, y para q consola es?
3lordofgilwell 3 months ago
@3lordofgilwell Lo pone en el título, ACE 3 y es para PS2, solo disponible en Japón y en Japonés
ZeroXXG00W0 3 months ago
The game kills the simulator element by adding the aimbot
arbiter7x 4 months ago
Dream match right here. Could only be made better if it was strike Freedom and they were in space.
Riku006 4 months ago
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hey i have a question can i play it on my pc ? and if yes where to download it ? i need some help >.<
SuP3RAnGeL 4 months ago
hey i have a question can i play it on my pc ? and if yes where to download it ? i need some help >.<
SuP3RAnGeL 4 months ago
if they did this in an anime form this would so epic
Xinathor 4 months ago
I have to agree, I'm a die hard Wing Zero/Wing Zero Custom fanboy, but I'm pretty sure that 00 Qan[T] would win the fight, especially after its ELS enhancment.
TeeKup 5 months ago
@TeeKup No gundam to date has 00 QAN(T)'s power. As much as I love wing gundam zero, DX, and deathscythe. Unicorn can come pretty close though
7kiku7honda7japan 5 months ago
Turn A. There isn't a gundam in the series that can top the Turn A. Granted Loran is a horrible pilot, it doesn't change the fact that it is the most powerful gundam in the series.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude Isn't that only because of the Moonlight butterfly that eats up any tech from here to jupiter? The 00 QAN(T) has better quantizing abilities than the 00 raiser in that it can teleport very far (setsuna mentions going to the ELS home planet If I'm not mistaken...). This puts the 00 QAN(T) at a HUGE advantage, but then again that is assuming VEDA would be able to predict the moonlight butterfly. I guess it would depend on the circumstances...though setsuna isn't much better of a pilot
7kiku7honda7japan 4 months ago
In any skirmish, the Moonlight Butterfly is what makes Turn A overpowered. The toys that the 00 Qant has give him a distinct combat advantage but a single touch means an almost instant defeat.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude most abilities, but the quantum sword is big enough to cut through a large moon and it's a giant beam saber. Even if it means no physical contact, I think setsuna could be lucky with his dodges and win... maybe.
7kiku7honda7japan 4 months ago
@Machdude if i remember right moonlight butterfly cant be activated at will and if you have to get close to the Qan(T) it would be suicide cuase then he can just fire up his teleporter and send you into the sun he technically wouldnt even have to lift his sword cuase his shield bits can open the teleportation portal which is how he moved to another galaxy in an instant so charging in he can get you and if you try to range attack he can still move his shield bits into your evasion paths
trichrono 4 months ago
You do know that the MB works on anything it touches and that it has an effective range that can encompass the earth right? As far as it is concerned, you'd have to be well out of its reach to really score a hit. The nnoncanon stuff blows it out of proportions, but if the Qant needs to deploy its bits, it has to make sure those bits aren't within its range. Whereas the 00 has to strike in a straight line, the MB encompasses the entire radius of the Turn A.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude you still avoided the fact that the Moonlight butterfly cant be activated at will and the only way it would be activated would be late in a fight where it looks like he cant win still by that time he would already be in the cut up or sent to the sun then is also the fact that 00Qan(T) can wait out Moonlight butterfly by teleporting out of range or quantizing to avoid its affect then it also has alot of other abilites that arent even combat related it seems that Qan(T) is hacking now
trichrono 4 months ago
The 00 Qant still operates within reasonable limits (limits that the Turn A can work with). You are neglecting one major fact, the 00 Qant is NOT that insane. The extremem abilities that it has only exists in Trans-Am or when it has prepped itself for warp (which means it isn't the perfect movement ability). This is also noting that as long as MB is active, the Turn A's performance is also improved. The last is, the Turn A can self repair. It IS the strongest Gundam.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude its only reasonable till he trans ams or quantizes which it can quantize without trans am and turn A can still end up losing even if it can repair its self i can still be destroyed and there is also the fact that setsuna can read his opponents thoughts so he would know when and wat the moonlight butterfly can do and how to avoid it and again thats assuming that he can activate MB which isnt certain and with trans-AM power up and the power up shield bits he would hard pressed to fight.
trichrono 4 months ago
You are assuming that their mobility is in a different class from each other. They aren't. MB Turn A can fly around the world in an instant which even from the logical standpoint would mean that it could outspeed practically any Gundam short of warp. Also, Trans-Am burst actually LOWERS the performance of the Gundam so when he tries to use the whole Mind reader thing, 1 shot is all it takes. In combat, the only thing limiting Turn A is its power supply (which even the Twin Drive is not exempt).
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude again trans am does have a time limit and it does drop preformance but its only temporary as it can also recharge while in battle and it seems that all ur relying on is the MB which again cant be used at WILL and even if he did then setsuna can still teleport away to recharge cuz teleport and quantizing dont require trans am and he can always return when MB has drained the energy also near the end of Qan(T) u noitce that QanT becomes biological cuz of the alien so its not tech anymore
trichrono 4 months ago
No, Trans-Am BURST is the ability that lets Setsuna read other people's thoughts. It actually reduces the combat performances of the Qant in order to increase its processing power. And before you even say anything, Quantizing DOES require Trans-Am because it relies on it to generate the particles to do so. Setsuna has NEVER Quantized outside of Trans-Am. And considering the effective abilities of MB Turn A, running is never an option. He has to stop and fight somewhere.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude well lets see MB chase him down when he is in another galaxy but since the Qan(T) is now biological no need to run from the MB cuz it cant hurt him since its not tech also even if it can move that fast in MB mode then it still doesnt mean it has better mobility just means top speed faster mobility is all of the units overall evasion, speed, and limbs reaction time not just speed and even if it can move that fast Turn A pilot cant really use it at full potential since his mind cant
trichrono 4 months ago
@Machdude process all the information moving at speed that lets you go around the earth in an instant and you cant say otherwise cause that is just a human limitation doesnt matter how advance they are so that extra speed is crap in battle anyways thats why they slow down when they are going to fight if you dont notice that also as far as piloting is concerned setsuna is better since he has training since he was a child and as an innovator better reflexes, processing, and Gforce resistance.
trichrono 4 months ago
Now you are just railing. Fact is, we were never talking about Setsuna so why are you even bringing him in? The question is about Gundams and in this case, the Turn A is just better. It is faster, stronger, more resilient, better equipped and is more advanced from the base up. The 00 Qant has claim to be one of the strongest, but not THE strongest especially when the Turn A is there.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude when it comes to gundams you cant leave out the pilot cuz even if the gundam is unstoppable if he cant handle the gforces or information processing it will be useless and Turn A is only faster than 00 when in MB mode and MB mode doesnt effect ELS Qan(T) and really the only overpower quality of the Turn A would be MB which makes it that it doesnt have to fight anyone why would that be oh cuase it can still be destroyed in a fight that why it need MB to bad it doesnt work on the ELS QanT
trichrono 4 months ago
Except this debate was never about the pilot. It's common knowledge, Loran is one of the worst pilots in the series. But considering G-force, the 00 Series renders it irrelevant, but so does the Turn A. You don't get it, the Turn A is the most advanced gundam in the world. it not only has accomodations for G-force, but it can literally regenerate its pilot. And you misunderstand. Outside of the Destructive properties of MB, it also increases the Turn A's abilities.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude again its not more advance than the 00 different diminsions and just cuase it can do that doesnt make the Turn A more powerful since a Qan(T) saber is still enough to cut it in half and then what doesnt matter if i can regenerate the fight is over when its destroyed and really if they use it at full power it would end up melting the Turn A away so then how can it heal it can still be destroyed and the quantizing ability would help the qant win because it would be able to avoid damage
trichrono 4 months ago
Simjply having a means to take down the Turn A does not mean it is advanced. The RX-78 is capable of shooting down the Nu Gundam. Does that make it more advanced? No.
However, the 00 Qant's only advantage is its attacks in single bursts.
In static firepower, the Turn A is better. In speed, the Turn A is faster. In armaments, the Turn A is far better equipped. Hell, the Turn A even has a better power supply (Black Hole power supply). It is even leagues lighter than the Qant.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude You dont want to have to compare pilots cuase you know i am right also the Turn A isnt more advance than the Qan(T) you know that thing that went to another galaxy in a flash because they arent from the same timeline or universe or dimension
trichrono 4 months ago
The Turn A jumps past that and is in the realm of nanomachines where the 00 Qant is still in solid tech. Yeah it's the most advanced.
Even considering the ELS, the Turn A is still the most advanced primarily because of its full warp capabilities. Forget about direct combat, when the Turn A can dismantle a Gundam from the inside out without even a firefight, it is pretty much the strongest hands down.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude so qant will dimantle itself to avoid damage which is wat quantizing is breaking himself down to particle and reforming himself and u know wat if it has nano machines setsuna and veda can hack those nano machines and initiate self destruct the more advance any tech the more weakness that tend to come up then is also the matter that in order to warp or dismantle anything your computer needs to accurately target and calculate it which GN particles counter these systems so it cant be used
trichrono 4 months ago
Sigh, now you are just adding stuff out of your ass. Quantization shifts the Qant to another plane before reforming him somewhere else, except for any damage that it suffers. The 00 Gundam never did it so the Qant sure as hell can't. Veda also only works with other units connected to it. A completely independent gundam like the Turn A with its own super advanced system? Not happening. And as far as GN disturbances, the Turn A is past the point of minovsky particles and anything similar.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude they are GN particles not minovsky the are particles out of the Turn A universe so the Turn A gundam wasnt given compensation for something it never encountered before and ya the qant can interface with over machines just like seravee and that is why setsuna can use the qant cuz of his ability to interface with it and in order to shift to another plane you have to break urself down to particals anyway to shift to the other plane and it still a advance ability that ur turn A doesnt have
trichrono 4 months ago
@trichrono you cant compensate for something that you never encounter before and the qant was never able to show its full ability in the movie and now with the ELS upgrade we dont know either and ELS come with the ability to absorb other machines and they also seem to be very adaptible so now wat are u gonna tell me that the turn A is above being asorbed i doubt that its super computer has ever been invaded by a living concious
trichrono 4 months ago
@Machdude you cant compensate for something that you never encounter before and the qant was never able to show its full ability in the movie and now with the ELS upgrade we dont know either and ELS come with the ability to absorb other machines and they also seem to be very adaptible so now wat are u gonna tell me that the turn A is above being asorbed i doubt that its super computer has ever been invaded by a living concious miss reply
trichrono 4 months ago
And yet the effective range for the Turn A is from Earth to Jupiter in the novels. Now this is not even getting into its ability to warp every part of itself in many ways which means that it can warp beam shots straight into the cockpit of its opponent. This ability effectively allows the turn A to fight without the need to even be in combat range and the attack itself can neither be evaded by the pilot nor can it be foreseen. No need to fight up close when it can win without a clash.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude the ELS Qan(T) is now the most advance gundam out there because now it has something no other gundam has true unlimited potential now it can grow more powerful and it can evovle and all from assimilating other tech and oragnic beings and it has the experience and knowledge of an entire ancient civilization and veda and still even if Turn A can do that why does it still insist on doing melee then and it wouldnt know the Qant can assimilate anyway and qant can quantize and then touch it
trichrono 4 months ago
It isn't until it has displayed any remote advancements. As far as it is concerned, it still has a lot to go before it can touch the Turn A. Two major technologies are what make the Turn A the most advanced Gundam in the series. Black Hole core and Nanomachines. Effectively, it is the most advanced by a mile.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude well all the Qant needs to do is touch it and it will assimilate turn A in a matter of seconds and the Qant was a perfect match for the ELS because its Quantizing lets it catch everything off guard and once it takes the Turn A gundam it will add its strengths to itself and that is why ELS Qant is the most advance and Quite literally the assimilation of technology takes a matter of few seconds while the assimilation of organics takes a few minutes that is true unlimited potential LEARN
trichrono 4 months ago
@Machdude here is the way i see it they give u 2 choices one they tell u this processor is the most powerful and advance processor out there or u can get this processor it isnt as powerfull as the other but it will keep growing overtime and it wont stop so which one is more advance because honestly any tech short of ESL will fade away to time since ESL are living metal and an hive mind they dont really die or rust into nothingness and the turn A gundam cant grow anymore its stuck at that power
trichrono 4 months ago
The Turn A is not only fully capable of doing the opposite, but its nanomachines by itself already allow it to combat enemies on the microscale. Considering that that they are essentially Nanites, they are likely one of the most effective weapons against practically any technological force. The difference is that while the 00 Qant has potential, the Turn A is a walking techbane. Yes the 00 Qant has the potential. Unfortunately, the Turn A is an unstoppable force.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude ya but wat about the fact that its fighting a living enemy with hivemind intellegence of countless speices its assimilated Turn A still cant stop itself from being assimilated hell even organic beings couldnt stop themselves from being assimilated so there is no was in hell nanomachines can cuz even cells failed at it meaning that the ELS are assimilated at a sub cell level they probably also converting cells to metal which is why it takes a few minutes longer on organics but still.
trichrono 4 months ago
At its level, it doesn't have to when it can break down the component metals to sand. The ELS functions effectively as micro-organisms that can come together to form coherent shape. The ability of nanites is essentially the ability to reproduce itself using what it consumes as a base matter with the eventual result being a by product. Also, you neglect to understand how small nanomachines can be. The size is can be about the size of a cluster of atoms, far smaller than a cell.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude now who making things up since its atoms that make up all materials in the universe if a nanite was as small as a cluster of atoms then it wouldnt have much to make it up so it cant be that small and you neglect to understand how small living organisms can be ever heard of viruses and those are carbon based cells and the ELS who knows how small they can get and they seem to do exactly wat the Turn A nanites do and they can do way more than the nanites in Turn A can do assimilation
trichrono 4 months ago
@Machdude all living things reproduce by consuming base matter or is that somethign u didnt learn in school really what do we take from food the materials so our cells can reproduce and produce energy and if a nanite can get that small u better believe living biengs can get that small too otherwise there is no way that the ELS can restructure the organic material into a metalic substance and Turn A is to limited to do wat u say it does why hasnt it reproduce into 2 turn A gundams cuz it cant
trichrono 4 months ago
Not an individual cellular organism. At its base, each cell is a self contained organism. before it even undergoes mitosis, it can be punctured and killed which is easy if the opponent is as tiny an organism as a nanomachine. And at the size of a nanomachine, forget about replication, because a cellular organism cannot suddenly get smaller to replicate it, much less reproduce its functions (at which point it would have to be a magnitude smaller).
Machdude 4 months ago
And quite simply, why is there only a single Turn A? Simple. A single Black hole Engine. Like the GN drive, the Black Hole engine is a self contained black hole which means that the only way to build one is with a Hadron Collider. While the Turn A is advanced, the technology required to build a hadron collider capable of creating a self contained black hole would be an astronomical undertaking. In the same way, it is not like the Qant can suddenly create a new GN drive.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude well the ELS are metallic organics so i doubt they can be punctured so easily and i am sure that the main mass of the ELS can reproduce technology it has assimilated but honestly 00 Qant and Raiser are way better becuase they were made to help humans evovle past thier limits in order to bring about understanding as a way to end war and it literaly connects the hearts of humans its better at bringing true peace better imo than Turn A gundam that will just bring about more destruction
trichrono 4 months ago
@Machdude then there is the fact that the smaller a black hole is the greater its gravitation force is so the Turn A is its own weakness a micro fraction or a split micro second faliure of the containment unit will end up being the end of the gundam which is stupid seeing as they placed a black hole drive into a combat gundam meaning its been lucky so far that the black hole engine hasnt taken any damage and it will be impossible to repair once the engine is peirced and you cant deny it
trichrono 4 months ago
The Black Hole tech functions similar to a wormhole reactor which by extension allows it to store its weapons in a space time pocket, which it can recall at the touch of a button. This not only allows it to warp attacks away from it, but it also allows it to protect the engine by temporally removing it from the suit. Ever wonder why the suit is so light? That's because it is HOLLOW. For the most part the Turn A has NOTHING in its main shell. This makes its only equal, the Turn X.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude so it can avoid damage well it still doesnt change the fact u cant contain a black hole forever if damage doesnt get you then time will time will always get anything doesnt matter how hi tech it is its just a matter of time and a matter of the internal damages of the black hole on the containment unit that cant be repaired because its on the inside of the contaiment unit still seems this arguement wont end so end it like this i will love Qant for being something more and u can like urs
trichrono 4 months ago
Idiot, if it was that debilitating for the Turn A, it would never have been implemented at all. How long was the Turn A buried for? Even without human maintenance it can still manage the entirety of its systems. You are neglecting that this is the Gundam that can repair itself from crippling damage and even ressurect its pilot. Managing a Black Hole is like containing Anti-matter except that with the power being drawn from the black hole, it effectively can sustain itself forever.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude first of all you an idiot since that is in the realm of imagination because we all know if the nanite tried to repair the damage that was on the inside of a black hole containment unit it would get sucked in causing the black hole to expand to the point i cant be contained in that small unit secondly this is by the laws of real world that is what would happen and thats how i rated on in real world situation which is why i love gundam cuase it can be possible. idiot
trichrono 4 months ago
But here's a question for you? What Gundam in the series can sustain a hit to the reactor and still consider itself close to anything except slag. The 00 Qant suffers this the worst prior to the ELS mode because it has 2 points of attack and if even 1 drive goes down, the whole thing shuts down. But even considering the ELS style 00 Qant, it still suffers from the fact that it is just as easy to blast the core of the unit and blow it up just the same. The difference here? The pilot dies.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude here is something you might not know first of all the ELS are a hivemind with individuals as an overall alien species which is why seperated by galaxies the troops recieved the order to stop the attack meaning that even if the body is destroyed the mind of that destroyed body would remain and be replanted into a new body by the hivemind so setsuna would end up losing his body but it would be restored and as the 00 Qant is now it can regenerate as well.
trichrono 4 months ago
The Qant would survive, Setsuna himself likely would not. The ELS have proven to be able to assimilate into a symbiosis and replicate the human likeness, but as it has been shown, an assimilated and reproduced being holds none of their memories. So while it can regenerate the body, Setsuna as a person would cease to exist once he is killed.
And considering the Turn A, it really doesn't matter about numbers. If it can fly around the world in an instant, a moon sized core isn't exactly a problem.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude oh yeah well why did the ELS stop attacking and form the flower from setsuna;s memory its obvious that the ELS can hold on the the conscious of the people it has assimilated and that is how it grow to understand wat it assimilates which i cant restore into a new body since all they need it the conscious and i think it does matter its bad enough the Turn A cant do anything more than destroy but once it fails the black hole would proceed to destroy the galaxy thats why its not pratical.
trichrono 4 months ago
The Qant would survive, Setsuna himself likely would not. The ELS have proven to be able to assimilate into a symbiosis and replicate the human likeness, but as it has been shown, an assimilated and reproduced being holds none of their memories. So while it can regenerate the body, Setsuna as a person would cease to exist once he is killed.
And considering the Turn A, it really doesn't matter about numbers. If it can fly around the world in an instant, a moon sized core isn't exactly a problem.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude i meant it can restore and either way the 00 Qant is still superior in the fact that it isnt just some and thats all its good for it brought peace to 2 warring civilizations and didnt have to hold the gun to someones head and even better when it blows up it can be restored by the ELS and better than that when it blows up it wont leave behind a galaxy destroying black hole oh god if that black hole was on earth ouch also the 00 Qant wouldnt need a pilot now like certain Turn A gundams
trichrono 4 months ago
@Machdude since all ELS are individual conscioussness within a hivemind the 00 Qant wouldnt even need a physical pilot in it to operate since the pilot and Machine are always connected mentally if not physically and it can even be said that with the ELS upgrade the Qant might even be given a mind of its own cause now its alive as well so while Turn A gundam still needs a pilot in the cockpit the Qant doesnt meaning its always on the ready.
trichrono 4 months ago
@Machdude is still superior in the fact that it isnt just some weapon of destruction and thats all its good for it brought peace to 2 warring civilizations to peace and it didnt have to hold a gun to someones head lets be honest thats all the moonlight butterfly is just a weapon so that no one could challenge the coward that built that gundam its original purpose was to keep peace through the use of fear with the power to destroy all tech on earth and thats the only reason it has that power
trichrono 4 months ago
the Turn A ushered in an era of peace to the world by having the world start over. The MB doesn't have to kill people. But considering that this is over the strength of the gundam, you are losing track of the main idea. The Turn A is the most powerful Gundam in existence.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude power is relative plus what about all the people in the hospital that had to die from the machines failure and what about people with pacemakers or hearing aids also power would be being able to end a fight and keeping the fight ended if you just beat someone down like that then they will get back up and fight back later and honestly the Turn A gundam has no where else to go to then down in power over time then Qant will go up in power over time and thats what i consider real power
trichrono 4 months ago
Sigh, You are starting to lose your train of thought and ranting at this point. The Turn A's ability is as the bane of technology and with its power, it doesn't really matter how powerful the Qant is, the MB will work on it. As it also has been said, the nanomachines from the Turn A will keep it in the best conditions without decay and will even repair damage over time. As the engine powering it is a black hole, it can in theory operate for millions of years. Good luck outlasting it, Qant.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude ELS Qant will live as long as the ELS civilization exsists and maybe even beyond that but still you cant contain a black hole for milions of years considering every day the containment unit will begin to be weaken and damaged from the inside out and it cant be repaired from the inside cuase nanites can withstand the force of a black hole hell i doubt even warp speed can out run the force of a black hole which is why its not a practical engine cause it will take out the planet
trichrono 4 months ago
@Machdude and in the end that Turn A will always be limited by its Pilot and what its been programmed to do because it cant compensate for wat it hasnt been programmed to compensate for. and the Turn A greatest weakness besides its own engine would be that it still needs a pilot physically in the cockpit meaning its at it weakest then where as the ELS Qant no longer needs setsuna physically attached to the cockpit and he has greater reflex and reaction due to ELS Hivemind
trichrono 4 months ago
@Machdude its not only the Turn A that can help the pilot reaction and processing time only difference is the Qant is the most advance since its already broken past the point of a lifeless machine and can continue to grow and gain new attributes to make it even more advance and powerful plus the guidence and the knowledge of an entire civilization with billions of consciouness which will continue to grow as well wat can the Turn A grow into nothing its stuck forever untill it destroys its self.
trichrono 4 months ago
You keep on saying it will destroy itself when it can last perpetually in itself (Black holes can exist from hundreds of millions to billions of years) and with the passive power, keep itself in pristine condition. Also, while the 00 Qant can theoretically absorb technology, the Turn A can advance itself by warping any weapon into its holding which means that in the same universe, their abilities are about the same. The difference is that the Turn A works both ways, making it the stronger.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude umm warping weapons into its holding isnt the same as assimilating not even close its just equipping itself not expanding its attributes and range of abilities and then its limited to the items that it can warp in also ur seem to be confused the black hole isnt wat its gonna destroys itself i mean the black hole is gonna destroy the gundam by sucking it into itself and turning it into a singularity then it will grow and suck in the earth or planets close to it.
trichrono 4 months ago
@trichrono u know wat i am just gonna end this any scientist would agree that a machine that has cross the line to the living being and that can continue to evolve and grow overtime and as well as assimilate to increase its knowledge and attributes is a more advance machine because to construct something that continues to grow is a feat that takes more knowledge and advancements than a machine that will always be the same like the Turn A. In short the 00 Qant is a walking miracle to science
trichrono 4 months ago
No, it is only such in potentia, a potential that it has not yet attained. Considering the attributes, even if the 00 gundam was to assimilate all of earth's tech in AD, it would still be unable to meet the standards of the Turn A. you also overestimate the ELS because they can't fully absorb technology. They can produce effects similar to GN particles, but are unable to replicate finer technology like GN drives and complex instruments.
Machdude 4 months ago
The mere fact that it can be modified to uyse such weapons is the main advantage of it. Advancement is subjective.
And you don't seem to understand. A self contained black hole is essentially what's keeping itself in check. As the series notes, its likely not even in the main unit and it likely is being powered by means of a wormhole connection. thus even if it did have the potential for failure (which it does not given its exceedingly long lifespan) it would still be in no danger.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude also i need to be more specific on the warping in weapons its just equipping things that it has in its arsenal which itself would still be limited and really just warping in new weapons doesnt mean that its advancing because the main body the gundam itself will always be the same never growing also do you even know wat warp means its a method through which one can exceed the speed of sound so idk how warping in weapons works unless the weapons have engines themselves i doubt that.
trichrono 4 months ago
The ability to warp in weapons also accounts for the fact that it can optimize itself to use those weapons. The power source by itself is a control but considering that the suit itself was made to be able to house weapons, it quite literrally would be a suit that would be able to use any weapon it can get its hands on.
The ability to warp in weapons also means that it is using wormholes to bring new weapons to its vicinity. Considering that this ability can warp beams into a cockpit, yeah...
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude oh god am i really gonna explain this well sigh stil well the ship or gundam would surround itself in a normal time bubble while compressing space and time in front of it and expanding it in the rear hence reaching faster than light travel however the problem lies int he fact that if the gundam collides with a pebble at this speed will it would blow up which is why it needs a capable shield the Turn A doesnt have so it cant warp in weapons idk wat it is but that isnt warping
trichrono 4 months ago
The Turn A is not using FTL travel. It literally is using instantaneous warping which means that it jumps through space time. It isn't plotting a shrunken timeline, it is opening up a hole on one side and out another. Silos empty? Warp them from a warehouse far away. No weapons? Do the same. Armor too strong to penetrate? Teleport a shot straight into their cockpit.
The point is, this ability is not movement, it is actual teleportation.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude i also know all the weapons it can warp in and they arent that impressive
Beam Cannon x 2
Beam Saber x 2
Multi-Porpose Silo x 6
Beam Rifle
Gundam Hammer x 2
Minchi Drill
Shield
infact if its so advance why does it still need a hammer and drill and shield also these items are held on in DOC bases which the turn A gundam destroyed with its moonlight butterfly nice going also the nanomachine regeneration isnt instantaneous the only impressive weapon is its nuclear weapons
trichrono 4 months ago
The items held in the DOC bases are what has been found. Its upper limits is unknown primarily because the Turn A dissolved many of its own weapons in its history with the MB. The hammers are a powerful exception because they were covered with the nanomachines in the MB that allowed it to be distinguished and not dissolved. Considering its civilization's tech level, it would not see any advancements in tech. But place it in another world and watch it have a field day.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude if you still think its more advance go for it doesnt matter any which way seeing as how u dont even know how the systems specify but watever i just know its its own worst enemy and i will leave it at that u also have to wonder why those nukes in its chest havent blown up yet either but watever on that too go ahead believe wat u want
trichrono 4 months ago
If it was that easy especially when you have to wonder if it even has nukes in its chest at all. And combining it all, it has an I-field that is powerful enough to stop physical attacks in addition to beam attacks. It is as protected as it gets. On the other hand, if you shoot the core of the Qant, whatever mode it is in, it will blow. Gn drives may be powerful, but one shot is all it takes. It's not even like the ELS can replicate them either, if it is gone, it is gone.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude then the left over ELS pieces will just take a new host and use it as a base to reform hence the power of assimilation and the Qant has its own shield systems also the I-Field cant protect from an explosion on its inside so if u shot the Turn A core it goes boom too and cant come back and i know it carries nukes in its chest which is the worst place to carry something like that well think watever u want i know the ELS Qant is the most advance and with the least technical problems
trichrono 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Machdude then the left over ELS pieces will just take a new host and use it as a base to reform hence the power of assimilation and the Qant has its own shield systems also the I-Field cant protect from an explosion on its inside so if u shot the Turn A core it goes boom too and cant come back and i know it carries nukes in its chest which is the worst place to carry something like that well think watever u want i know the ELS Qant is the most advance and with the least technical problems
trichrono 4 months ago
And as it is to finally cap, it is not its own worse enemy. Having already been blown up before, the Turn A is still fully capable of reviving itself to full capacity. Blasting a hole in its chest will not send it into a state of meltdown or structural collapse. hell, even the nukes have to be properly armed before they can detonate (ever studied an actual nuclear warhead). But that's only considering it in its physical. Good luck penetrating an I-field that can stop solid hits.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude I-field isnt so mighty seeing as it cant fire with the shield up and if it did it would be stupid cuz that would make it plot armor ever notice why no gundam has with a shield ever fired with the shield on cuz u cant. also it can stop attacks from the inside and on top of that u just have to keep pressing the attack till the I-Field collapses or has to shut down due to overheating the circuits from continues use on top of that the GN sabre is 2 prong attack one with physical hits.
trichrono 4 months ago
I-field + Warping beams means that it can attack from inside its defenses without hitting the field. But that too is besides the point. It can freely move with the I-field so it can effectively be used to deflect attacks for an opening. But its main benefit is that it can block wave motion attacks with ease which is why it is relevant to begin with. When its overall performance can match the 00 Qant point for point, the field's primarily value is as a powerful backup shield.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude then it use the GN particles in the edge to heat it up to super high temperature and vibrate the particles to a point that it would be a laser saw so its both physical and energy based at the same time and the I-Field isnt meant to repulse both attacks at the same time on top of that it cant stop pressure waves cuz it still gets knocked back from explosions force also he still has to drop that shield to attack at some point cause if he doesnt he will lose when it fails.
trichrono 4 months ago
Now you are just railing. That logic is not relevant considering that the I-field is a barrier that blocks both,. Your logic is simply A+B = AB except that it isn't the case. It would simply translate to A+B=C. To break a barrier like that, what matters is the intensity which is the most debatable point. But you are bringing hypothetical concepts in which is in how you use a tech. of course turtling is not a way to win. The I-field is just a defensive feature, not a dependent factor.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude the reasons why the Turn A looks so weak in the series is cuz it is because of the safety systems keep it from spamming all its best weapons cause doing so would most likely cause the blackhole engine to hit critical and overload hence it has fail safe that cant be overwritten which is why it still relies on its melee weapons and why the moonlight butterfly cant be used for extended periods and speaking of moonlight butterfly that is well plot armor or is plot attack.
trichrono 4 months ago
Doesn't change the fact that it is the most powerful weapon in the story. Even considering the power of the other series, the Turn A is still holding one of the most powerful power sources in the series which is unmatched by others. As it is, even its normal weapons are ramped up because even its beam rifle has the capacity to shoot shots that are wave motion levels as its normal output.
Machdude 4 months ago
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Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude at first i thought MB was a energy based attack but no it isnt it is nanites that destroy the tech but its plot armor because the MB can never be used at full power they claim it can be used at it cant even surround the earth because that would mean the Turn A gundam is throwing off more mass than it actually has so its impossible if it was gonna hit jupiter and earth it would need the entire mass of earth to actually reach both sides maybe more someone didnt think that attack through
trichrono 4 months ago
With its output, the Turn A would literally be manufacturing them from energy. Yes it is entirely possible on the fusion level (the only limitation there was the energy output). The science is never explained but considering the battle with Gym, it would have already converted its entirety into nanomachines if it were to be as such. As far as the MB is concerned, its upper limits have never been confirmed, as is that of the 00 Qant.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude then that systems is totally impracticle considering using that attack would firstly still impossible to cover the earth but would leave it sitting after MB was used cuase it wouldnt even have an I-Field energy to put up. Then it still has all those fail safes and really its more hype than truth with the Turn A systems cuase if it ramps up the beam attack then it cant be teleported cuz it doesnt warp beams i just explained that cuz the bema has more power than the system can handle
trichrono 4 months ago
Fail safes it needs not considering that it was already capable of operating with the bare minimum of what the reactor can provide. The sheer scope of what the Black Hole Engine could generate would still allow it to function at optimal capacity because its standard weapons do not tax the system at any substantial rate. The only drawback is that its MB would be disabled until the systems return to normal.
Machdude 4 months ago
However, i would throw that right back. Trans-Am? Completely nukes the performance of the 00 Qant. Gn Drives? Perfectly viable targets and there are TWO of them to hit. Essentially even if the Turn A had any weaknesses at all, the 00 Qant not only has the same, but it isn't even armed very well.
In other words, the majority of what you criticize also holds true for the Qant as well.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude true but wat i am trying to prove is that the Turn A is far from unstoppable and i know that Qants weaknesses as well and the Qant is heavily armed just cuz it doesnt have a huge assortment of weapons doesnt mean it isnt well armed. the GN sabre as many modes that it changes with the shield bits and the same goes for the GN rifle or cannon and the shield bits themselves are an amazing weapon to have which the Turn X has too but not the Turn A
trichrono 4 months ago
And what I am trying to prove is simply that the Turn A is still at an advantage against the 00 Qant. All of its strongest weapons are only effective against large targets and its standard weapons are all trumped by the Turn A. At its core, the Turn A is still the stronger.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude and in the end to me the unlimited potential of the ELS Qant is wat makes it the most advance cuz it can keep growing and no other gundam can do that wanna throw MBs around fine with me the Qant is biological now. wanna throw nukes good do it the Qant has its shield bits to repulse both physical and energy attacks as well as bieng able to teleport ur nukes back wanna teleport beams go for it teh GN particles will counter that ability anyway besides the Qant will keep growing overtime
trichrono 4 months ago
The potential is not unlimited. The ELS can assimilate technology on a technical level, but at the finer details, it does not have those benefits. While it can grow a new cannon as a result of innovation, it cannot absorb an energy source. And is it is shown, the MB is using nanites which means that even if it is biological in part, technology is still technology and those nanites can still tear them apart at the cellular level especially when they blow up just like any machine.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude no for the nanites to work the tech has to be full tech before it can be broken down to sand otherwise the nanites wont begin breaking it down becuase they arent supposed to hurt organic biengs so the ELS outer shell would be enough to stop the nanites and actaully the power source would be a bio version of the technology it absorbed meaning the nanites wouldnt begin breaking down the ELS Qant from well to but it simply fear that it is a a living thing they shouldnt hurt.
trichrono 4 months ago
No it does not. Under nanotech, under the circumstances, it would have been fully capable of dismantling even organisms to tiny particles. However, nanites work at a microscopic level. It doesn't matter how dense the shell is, it would rip through the particle bonds or perhaps even its atomic structure. And as it is, the ELS still registers a signature as a technological unit (what is life but electrical impulses) and not a meatsack. As a target, it is perfectly viable.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude also the Qant can deploy the shield bits within the route of the nuke and itself so that it can teleport the nuke back which would be called using ur enemies strength against them. haha its funny u dont know how the warping beams work but u think u do let me run it by u again in order to teleport to anything to any point a few things needed necessary power and calculation because teleportation is affected by the smallest details such as radiation density, solar drift etc.
trichrono 4 months ago
The Qant has not shown any ability to warp anything other than itself with further problems being that it needs to create the field with its bits before it can accelerate to that point.
But as it is said, the Turn A's ability to teleport beams means that it completely bypasses any need for a preparation gate. In addition, as one of the most advanced gundams in the series, why is calculations ever a problem when its OS dwarfs even the devil gundam?
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude simple i just explained cuz it has no information about the GN particle programmed into it thats why its still limited to wat been programmed into their OS thats why and the Turn A does have a teleportation gate which would be the nanites that assemble into a gate around the rifle jsut like the shield bits just smaller duh thats why it doesnt teleport wat it doesnt touch and Qant can deploy the gates in the same route the attack is coming from unlike the Turn A the Qant gate is movable
trichrono 4 months ago
And yet again the same can be said about the minovsky particles which essentially do the same thing. Especially since both work on an electromagnetic level, it really renders them both moot and if anything, the one that should be affected is the 00 Qant since the Minovsky particles have a lasting period of DAYS when it comes to electromagnetic interference.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude ya sit down cuz its science class time well then all these factors affect the teleportation systems wanna know why well let me tell u teleportation is as simple as breaking apart the initial target to particles and then coping they exact position each particle was in and rebuilding those particles at the chose destination now while those particles are in transfer solar drift, radiation density and any obstacles between the systems and the destination will have to be solved before use
trichrono 4 months ago
And yet here you are arguing about theoretical technology with mundane science class? This is theoretical tech, which means it is not confined by your "laws". But hey why not. Following the fundamentals of space time, it may follow the principles of a wormhole where it bends space time to open up a channel from point A in time 1 to point B in time 2. With the timespace bent in such a way, it can effectively warp a shot into any location. Basics Star Trek, care to try Gundam?
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude right but also remeber that the Turn A also has specifications none of which ever mention that it can bend space and time it can teleport on the spot but it cant manipulate space and time and it doesnt warp either cuz it doesnt have that ability built into it as well as u should know that all ways of travel or movement will always have some sort a obstacle that has to be compenstated for before it is used
trichrono 4 months ago
@Machdude fact is that even though it doesnt seem like it gundams and star trek all actually follow the laws of physics even if it doesnt seem like it and future tech that can exsists and their limitations are all there
trichrono 4 months ago
The laws of the space time theories are specifically made to break the laws of physics. Once you get into such concepts as dimensions, physics take second seat because it isn't about going through physical barriers, it is about bypassing them entirely.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude that is true but the Turn A doesnt have those abilities it doesnt have warp wat it does have is teleportation basic teleportation and even breaking the laws of physics u still will always have new obstacles to deal with on a totally different plain. the Turn A doesnt have the ability to manipulate time at all so it doesnt matter wat breaking laws of physics means cuz the Turn A wasnt made with the ability to break any rules or laws a physics its jsut advance with teleporting abilities
trichrono 4 months ago
And as I said before, it already does or else it would not be a canonical ability. While it is not explained in the sciences yet, it still does not change the fact that it is fully capable of such abilities which is what makes it powerful. All I can do is speculate, but when it already has that ability, there is no sense in arguing that it does not work when it clearly has been confirmed to work.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude now where do the GN particles come in simple the GN particles are basically going to interfere with the teleportations systems targeting and computing systems and if the systems cant get an accurate read it wont use it due to the fact that the beam could very well end up in the Turn A own cockpit as well as miss by 8 miles thats a fail safe and the Turn A cant calculate the GN particles random movements and mass because it doesnt have the data on such particles to help calculate
trichrono 4 months ago
Not on sufficiently advanced systems. it functions similar to the minovsky particle principle and even if that were true, the Turn A would also do the same in return due to the fact that it does THE SAME THING. Considering that both units exist in a time period where it is no longer an issue, there is no POINT in even addressing sensor intererence at all when it is effectively either a mutual or a deader than Elvis point which in this case, is the latter.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude no the GN particles work on different plane than Minovsky particles cuz they have different compensitions and mass as well as different dispersition patterns also the Turn A gundam doesnt release minovsky particles wanna know why black hole engine thats why also Qant is a close range combat along with enchanced ranged ability and it still aims with both computer and pilot control meaning manual with computer assist aiming and the shield bits total pilot control with Quantam brainwaves
trichrono 4 months ago
Idiot, the Minovsky particles are the very foundations of many of the OG techs such as the I fields and with the Turn A's incorporation of it, it doesn't even have to spread them, it deploys the effects simply through combat. On the other hand, GN particle disturbances remain active only while particles are being distributed and the effects are essentially the same which is electromagnetic disturbance, an effect that the Turn A is already capablke of operating beyond.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude welll no dur all the gundams disperse GN particles through out the entire combat and it still doesnt matter in the end becuase the GN particles still will end up affecting the Turn A becuase like i said before its not made to compensate for something that it has never encountered but the Qant is still manually aimed it doesnt need to use teleportation systems and the setsuna along with tieria handle all the compensations for anamolies.
trichrono 4 months ago
And as I said before, it clearly does not when the Turn A is already operating beyond the effects of EM radiation. By your logic, it would mean that the Turn A would not be able to do so because its own radiation would affect its own sensors. But here is the thing, they don't. The effect of GN particles is already EM radiation and the difference is mainly that GN particles do not seem to last very long whereas MP radiation lasts for days.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude GN radiation will last as long as the Gundam is in operation thats all it needs and EM radiations come all different forms and will interfere with energy based technology doesnt matter wat just cuz it was made to deal with one EM radiation it doesnt mean it was made to deal with another form
trichrono 4 months ago
MP radiation is in a constant state of flux that is never stable which means that if you are above it, your sensors are fine. GN radiation is just a form of EM radiation and even at its best, it would probably do the same thing. So different forms of radiation? MP radiation is already spanning practically any form of radiation.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude also sensors are a big part of the Turn A gundam cuz it still needs to be able to pinpoint the enemy location and much of the aiming is computer based at least when it comes to teleportation cuz teh human mind cant handle calculating teleportation data at a fast enough rate to make it a efficient weapon i am sure that loran can pick up the beam rifle and aim it manually in cases where teh sensors cant be relied on.
trichrono 4 months ago
Quite simply, if the Turn A is able to operate under the effects of the Minovsky particles, the GN particles essentially do not matter. You are missing the entire point, the GN particles, do not work as a magical method of disabling conventional sensors, it provides EM interference through radiation, an effect that the Minovsky particles already implement which means that it does nothing outside of looking pretty at this point.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude all data on wat can run interference wether it be gravity, radiation, solar drift, anti matter, dark matter, etc must be in teh system before usage thats why teleporting longer distances takes more time to teleport cuz it needs calculation time so that they dont reform on the outside of a super nova or trapped by the black hole, in fact if u notice all the gundams and mobile suits in 00 either aim manually like lock-on or like the gundams compensated for the GN particle interference
trichrono 4 months ago
@Machdude so before u ever think of trying to tell me wat i dont know guess wat ur the one that doesnt know how ur own teleportation system works and u still think u can tell me that i dont know u bettter think again and another thing the Turn A doesnt warp or bend space and time it teleports they are different concepts get ur phrasings right if ur gonna try and disprove me at least get ur dam phrasing right and i also just explained how teleportation works and why its countered
trichrono 4 months ago
As a result what you have just handed me is a long list of things that you made up or assumed is not viable in the sense that you think that it is actually a factor when what you just gave is essentially just noise. Considering that you spent 4-5 posts just trying to say how GN particles work when Minovsky particles do pretty much the same thing just serves to show how little you have even seen in the series.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude so now wat ur Turn A teleport system is out but u will try to deny that because idk why really i just proved why the teleportation system wont work but u wont listen i also explained wat warp is few days back but u didnt listen cuz ur still using the wrong phrasing and Turn A isnt able to bend space and time thats just wat u added with a misguidedly named warp ability so as far as i am concerned this arguement has reach the point were u shut down and deny the world of facts good job
trichrono 4 months ago
Check the wiki, it pretty much confirms it. All i'm doing is hazarding how it does it. But can it? Definitely.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude i just explained warp and teleport and i just explained why the GN particles cancel teleport because it cant get an accurate targeting tto the destination with all the unknown variables that the GN particles present to the teleport. and warp cant move beams into a pilots cockpit becuase warp is a method to move at faster than light not instant traveling. and the only way the Turn A can teleport beams would be the only kind of teleport there is and it is countered by GN interference.
trichrono 4 months ago
@Machdude even teleporting requires aiming u seem to be misguided in thinking that its some magical ability that doesnt miss and doesnt require anything other than the push of a button but no fact is it requires alot of knowledge calculation and information and that just how science is it looks magical but alot of work goes on in those processors teh Turn A isnt god it isnt something that perfectly aims cuz it doesnt its affected by variables itself but its managed to compensate with information
trichrono 4 months ago
Of course the Turn A is not god, but it is sufficiantly advanced to the point where it is fully capable of using space time as its weapon. The major thing that defines the Turn A is the fact that it is an enigma with technology that ended the era before it. So while it is not effectively god in the literal sense, it may as well be to anything short of itself because it stands on technology that no normal mobile suit can even hope to possess.
Machdude 4 months ago
@Machdude really when has that Turn A gundam ever broken the bounderies of time ever it doesnt use space and time and everyone knows it even in the unit specs it never mentions the ability to warp space and time. wat it does mention is the black hole engine, all its weapons, all its features to protect the pilot, its regeneration ability, its I-field being able to stop nukes its teleportation ability, but nothing not even a small mention of space time use go look it up nothing
trichrono 4 months ago
The ability to teleport is already encompassed in space time(unless it is using an alternate method to do so).
As i also said before, most of it is just an educated guess on technology. On the other hand, it doesn't change the fact that it can teleport.
Machdude 4 months ago