Cost of production do not determine prices

[hiphopshop75]

holyshit you're ugly

[TheLegalImmigrant05]

@PatriotInChief Yes, I really don't want a President, but as long as we are going to get one anyway, I'd rather it be Ron Paul. All the others are statist fucks and outright clowns with no principles and no integrity.

[PatriotInChief]

@TheLegalImmigrant05 you really dont want a president? and there's no candidate you like?

[PatriotInChief]

@TheLegalImmigrant05 LOL really?

[TheLegalImmigrant05]

@PatriotInChief  Really what exactly?

[shihonage]

This is the most horrible desync I've ever seen. I can only watch this video without looking at it... which brings the point, why not just stick to radio-style format then ;)

[TheLegalImmigrant05]

@shihonage Apologies... I am switching from Photo Booth to iMovie for good

[jrdroptini]

Nice to see you back.

[PatriotInChief]

Which candidates do you like for 2012

[TheLegalImmigrant05]

@PatriotInChief Want to take a guess? :) The true answer is nobody - I don't want a president.

[PatriotInChief]

Hey man. Good to hear from you.

[eagleeye1975]

I would say that supply and demand CONTRIBUTES to the price determination, but only insofar as it informs the subjective valuation of the individual purchaser. When it's all said and done, prices are only truly set by an agreement between the seller and buyer on an individual basis.

[suchafool990]

yaaay you're back!

[TheLegalImmigrant05]

@voiceofreason467 "art may have a price for it, but it isn't based on a market price" What does this even mean? Price (which is the same as market price - a price at which an object can be bought or sold) not based on ... market price???? You are confusing me :)

[lengthyounarther]

voiceofreason, watch a single episode of pawn stars or antiques road show. Even the most reviered works of art can have their prices collapse even though their history remains the same. The ruff estimates they use to asses monitary prices are based on the arbitrage of the market, same as the prices for beef, fords, or gold. Not some formula that such and such historical ambiance automatically imbues art piece X with a dollar value of Y.

[lengthyounarther]

@voiceofreason467 Any art dealer in the world will tell you your wong about this.Because a piece of art has a certain historical connection or other ansilary trait does not imbue some kind of automatic price. prices of all art fluctuate largely based on how much people subjectivly value it, and also on supply.Lots of artists works have been highly valued only to become unpopular and see their prices collape for no other reason then people just dont care as much regardless of their history.

[lengthyounarther]

@voiceofreason467 your confusing the asking price for the actual price which can only been know as a historical fact. For example if I have a remberant painting that i say I will sell for a million dollars, thats the asking price. however if nobody is willing to buy it for that amount, we dont actually know the price yet, only what I would like to get. If somebody comes and offers me 750 thousand and I accept, then the price was the latter amount not what I orinally asked.

[TheLegalImmigrant05]

@voiceofreason467 So how does this show that my reasoning about subjective preferences of buyers and sellers determining market prices is incorrect? :) Art is perfect, because say a Rembrandt is hugely valuable because it is very scarce: they won't make any more Rembrandts. So subjective valuations of buyers and sellers determine a price at which s trade will take place.

"Prices set by the market" = many people buying and selling based on their subjective preferences.

[TheLegalImmigrant05]

@voiceofreason467 I know exactly what you mean, but what I was trying to explain is that the "data-driven" approach is wrong. How do you even know what data to look at? You have to have some kind of theory BEFORE picking data to tell you which data is relevant and which is not. Also, please look at my argument re: economics being the study of human action. Data is something you observe AFTER action takes place, it doesn't explain the logic of action itself. Human action is non-deterministic.

[TheLegalImmigrant05]

@voiceofreason467 "Just because the Austrian can make predictions doesn't mean they can be taken seriously about how the economy works" OK, is your claim that they made those correct predictions by accident? I mean, they could have, I suppose. :)

"many Economists during that time ... were making the same exact predictions" Name 2 for each of those crises, and also show how their explanations were radically different from the austrian method. Then you have an argument.

Thanks for commenting.

[TheLegalImmigrant05]

@voiceofreason467 How do you test the statement, "People act by choosing among scarce means to achieve their desired ends"? The entire body of Austrian economics can be deduced from this one axiomatic statement. You are correct: austrians don't rely heavily on data and math to formulate their theories; they employ a very different method, and for some very good reasons. But to say that because of that it shouldn't be taken seriously is strange, especially given the theory's explanatory power.

[TheLegalImmigrant05]

@voiceofreason467 That is interesting. Austrians should not be taken seriously? :) Austrian economists correctly predicted, say the crash of 1929 (Mises) and the crisis of 2007-08 (Peter Schiff, for example), yet they shouldn't be taken seriously.

The thing about economics is that it is a science of the human action, and as such should be different from natural sciences in method. Human beings are not determined, they have free will, unlike rocks or planets. Economics study human choice.

[TheLegalImmigrant05]

@voiceofreason467 How so? If this logic (that consumer valuations determine price, and that value is imputed backwards from those valuations) is correct, how does it fall apart in the case of one particular industry?

[crazypants88]

Good video.

The sound is a little out of sync and the end seems to cut you off.

[TheLegalImmigrant05]

@crazypants88 That (sync issues) must be the Photo Booth app. I should've used iMovie instead.