Metroidvania

[yanorei]

today I have become a man. my body is ready.

[capucchan8]

this genre was started by rygar on the nes, people need to give that game credit, it would have been one of the better nes games if it had a saving mechanism, at least a password system

[jdhyqf]

Maze of Galious

[icemanx5x]

Lol porn game's? Look at Avgn's video game reviews. There is a review on atria porn games theres alot of them haha

[donov25]

@icemanx5x Metroidvania porn games specifically.

[RaineMan213]

All games are Metroidvanias, but we don't notice. Damn. They missed Star Tropic.

[PrimalLight2323]

7:00 - "What a terrible night to have a podcast."

Win.

[BagoZonde]

Retrogaming is cool! I working on one game for c64, maybe it will be available in 2011 I hope so! Retro games are more than games from definition itself.

[Th3Skull3r]

Ahh, Super Metroid and Cave Story, among my favorite games of all time.

Sometimes 3-D game design simply doesn't cut it nowadays.

[endlessrepeat]

Today, even Wikipedia disavows the word "Metroidvania."[original research?]

[endlessrepeat]

@TheBilly Er...I was making a joke. At 7:52 the video says, "Epilogue: Today, even Wikipedia disavows the word 'Metroidvania.'" By putting "[original research?]" after it, I was implying that that claim was unsupported. It would have been clearer if I had put quotation marks around the quote in the first place, though.

[miciso666]

whats the castlevania game where u shoot loads of bats???

[BlackshirtsGBR]

Yes, Super Metroid is overrated, along with Jordan, oxygen, and sex.

[DarkZeroVenarius]

Well, Shadow Complex fits into the section perfectly, as the developers directly used castlevania and metroid games as reference material to create something that really brings joy again... though, only on xbla

[doomedperson]

What a bunch of retards. Super Metroid has got to be one of the most overrated games ever.

[Makron5]

Metroidvania isn't obsolete. It's just underdone. You'll it see it pop up every so often though, but not nearly enough. The Genre appears a lot more in Portable and Indie markets though since it mainly is a 2D genre at its heart. I'd like to see a game in 3D inspired by this genre with a heavy basis on exploration, retracing and gaining abilities.

[Makron5]

@Makron5 Of course since Metroidvania is very dependent on platforming to create barriers the formula would need to be heavily modified to take inspiration or there would need to be a mastery of creating a 3D platformers that aren't confusing.

[RecklessYouth333]

@Makron5

They've done it already. Ever play the Metroid Prime trilogy?

[Makron5]

@RecklessYouth333 I want something outside these two franchises and for PC.

[HaunterV]

@Makron5 cavestory

[ShadowArtist]

@Makron5 There is, it's called the Metroid Prime Trilogy....

[Makron5]

@ShadowArtist for PC

[TonyTheTGR]

Kirby SuperStar and that one... Cave place. Thing. La Mulana too, if you're a complete heathen.

[dastan666]

You forgot Cadash, the arcade game

[dastan666]

You're ass is obsolete. And I'm not talking of Shadow Complex, i actually play these old games

[boohiss3]

I posit that Arkham Asylum is 3d Metroidvania

[garrahasfunk]

SHADOW COMPLEX

[violetdawning]

Metroidvania's >any other Castlevania except IV....IV is da best Castlevania

[VideoGamer945]

NEEEERRRRRDS

[TechnotheTechie]

Nerds rule the Earth, don't diss or we will DELETE you

[VideoGamer945]

I am a very proud nerd, I said that in irony. I mean, just look at my channel name!

[TechnotheTechie]

i was gonna say...

[zeldamaster52]

@TechnotheTechie amen

[TheF1PinkVoltaDream]

``The Retronauts: Jeremy Parish, Scott Sharkey of 1up and Chris Kohler of Wired, discussing an obsolete video game sub genre: "Metroidvania". ´´

yes, unfortunately halo took over, and then came a bunch of lame generic fps

[LughTube1]

Scott Sharkey is what a journalist should be: Hard Drinking, hard smoking, and doesn't so much write as knife-fight with a pen.

[mruppel2]

Castlevania was the only game to remain 2D in PSX era, and this is the formula, not Metroid

[rahnyc4]

metroidvania? pst... more like metroid. metroid been doing it before castlevania.

[MRCAB]

but castlevania did it more.

[rahnyc4]

did what more?

[MRCAB]

Hmm... my comment disappeared... Anyways:

There were more Castlevania games like that, than there were Metroid games like that; therefore, Castlevania did it more.

[TheF1PinkVoltaDream]

metroidvania is a genre

[rahnyc4]

yeah, a genre that was created by metroid.

[TheF1PinkVoltaDream]

indeed, but castelvania is also a big part of that genre

[Kyithios]

It's not, it's a name given by people who later contrasted the Metroid series when Symphony of The Night came out, with the exact same formula, with the addition of leveling up in RPG form; the term "Metroidvania" was never official in any sense, and is more just a nickname for Action Adventure Exploration. Many games, as pointed out, were like this; including Blaster Master, Cave Story, Simon's Quest (Although so vague it sucked) and even Ys.

[TheF1PinkVoltaDream]

well, itmay not be an official genre but if you ask old school gamers about what´s metroidvania they´ll probably tell you that its a genre or subgenre but the thing is that its a very well known word.

[Kyithios]

I'm one of those people, FYI. I just don't recognize it as an official genre or subgenre because it's silly to think that way. Metroid and Castlevania were not the only ones to do it, that was the point of this video and podcast. It's a very well known word, particularly thrown around with I Wanna Be The Guy and games like it.

[TheF1PinkVoltaDream]

well i do agree that its silly but its kind of a fan made genre so its ovbiously gonna be that way lol btw nice super metroid video you made, i like the music :)

[Kyithios]

Thanks. Pretty soon when I get unlazy I'll show how to get some other items early and demonstrate other abilities you can use. When I get unlazy.

[SNKTHX2000]

Scott Sharkey is brilliant, very funny.

[DarkTenka]

"So basically all games became Metroid Vania when the became 3D" .. uhh no? WTF? .. I cant think of ANY new games that combine both exploration and puzzle solving like 2D Metroid/Castlevania.

On another note: MetroidVania is rising from the dead!

Blit-Blot's Aquaria is fucking awesome!

Also see the upcoming Shadow Complex for XBLA.

[Addicted2gaming]

Fallout? Elder Scrolls? ZELDA?

[DarkTenka]

NO they are not Metroid Vania, you do not need to collect anything to progress in those games. You can go everywhere you want in the game from the start, just you may die if you're too low lvl.

Fallout/Elder Scrolls are TOO open ended to be called MetroidVania. Metroid Vania is an open-ended environment which must be unlocked in stages, and how you unlock them is solved via puzzles/exploring or defeating key enemies and in some cases using special tricks (see Sequence breaking).

[DarkTenka]

As for Zelda .. well I guess Zelda is somewhat Metroidvania (I can only draw from Zelda 64 mind you). Theres something I cant quite put my finger on though, It doesnt have as many "tricks" as your typical metroidvania game.

Blah, well Zelda being the exception there still isnt anything else out there, not ot mention of "every 3D game nowadays" you only stated 3 Names and only 1 of them being correct.

[Addicted2gaming]

As for "being correct", that's a matter of opinion, as you don't get to say what's correct and what isn't. Fallout and Elder Scrolls have some dungeons which can only be accesed if you've gotten a certain item/skill. Also, Diablo does this to a certain level aswell.

[DarkTenka]

Im not saying what's correct and what isnt, the fact that Fallout/Elder Scrolls and Diablo ARENT Metroidvania is.

All of those games are RPG's and subsequently "unlocking" area's in those games is not as the result of finding something or figuring something out, its as the result of grinding your characters stats to a higher level.

Castlevania was also an RPG but it never let the RPG side of it influence Metroidvania side, achieving progress was directly linked to finding items/exploring.

[Addicted2gaming]

Dude, there were a ton of quests that you could only get to if you had gotten an item or figured out something. If you wanted to get to Tristram in Diablo, you'd have to touch these stones in the correct order, if you wanted to reach one of the final dungeons you'd have to have gotten the Horadric Cube from the previous village. In Fallout 3, your decisions affected your final game, and thus the places you could go to. Same for Oblivion.

[DarkTenka]

That does not make Metroidvania, it makes RPG maybe .. but not Metroidvania.

Metroidvania I think is best described as a series of nonlinear sub-environments unlocked via to the USE of collectable abilities. Not the completion of quests, and not an entire nonlinear environment from the start.

[namayake]

Legacy of Kain: Soul Reaver

The modern Prince of Persia series.

[DarkTenka]

LoK- Soul Reaver = Yes, thank you and those games were great! (although defiance wasnt Metroidvania)

Modern PoP ... Havent played em, so I couldnt give my opinion, but you quoted Soul Reaver, suggesting you understand the concept. Thats going to make me check out the recent PoP games.

[namayake]

The most recent PoP games definitely fall into this category; especially by the second game Warrior Within. New areas *from within pre-existing/previously explored areas* are unlocked as new abilities are acquired. The boss battles can be ridiculously difficult though. After spending literally hours trying to defeat the final boss I through up my hands in frustration and just watched the games ending here on youtube. Regardless, Warrior Within is a great game.

[DarkFenix48]

I played Two Thrones and wasn´t metroidvania at all. But it´s ok, I haven´t played the other ones.

[SNKTHX2000]

Retronauts is great.

[needlesinyourvein]

hahahahaha "its a bad night to have a podcast."

[Yohko86]

Bit-Blot's Aquaria can also be considered a Metrovania-type game since it's heavy on the ideas of exploration and interconnecting realms.

[SamYarbrough77]

metroidvania is not a genre it was defined only as castlevania ripping the metroid formula off hence the name, I think all 3 are annoying overcaffeinated nerds.

[zoddman]

Chris Koehler's so fucking annoying.

[ValisFan1]

How about playing Super Pitfall. Its one of my favorite MetroidVania games, I don't get why Super Pitfall gets so much crap.

[paladinjoe]

I agree, Scott Sharkey is hilarious.

He can put the word "fuck" in anything and make it funny, he coined the terms "who gives a sideways fuck" and "tomfuckery". Genius.

[DoctorScissors]

I've heard the refered to as Castletroids.

[jpkushin]

I love Scott Sharkey. I listen to old retronauts episodes all the time. He's a cigarette-smoking, coffee-drinking, foul-mouthed, sarcastic cynical critic. He's well-read, quick-witted, technologically savvy and downright hilarious. Sharkey, please become a writer/stand-up comedian.

[Lianas1980]

I never get why people have to discus this kind of thing.. it does not matter what the genre is as long as its not badly done.

[jetlagboy]

"Metroidvania" is a better term than "NLEG's".

[GlennMagusHarvey]

As for Cave Story: I actually don't consider it to be a NLEG because (1) areas aren't sufficiently interconnected and (2) most items either merely progress the plot or are weapons that don't actually add exploring capability. Areas are opened up mostly by plot events, not powerups or exploration.

Mega Man ZX and Zelda games are in a grey area: areas are interconnected and have exploring-ennabling powerups, but it's debatable whether exploration is a big part of the game.

Also, I forgot CvHoD.

[GlennMagusHarvey]

I have not played most of the games you mention, but the following are games that I have played and I consider NLEGs:

Metroid,Metroid 2,Super Metroid,Fusion,Prime,ZeroMissi­on

Castlevania: SotN,CotM,AoS

Eternal Daughter

Lyle in Cube Sector

La-Mulana

Hebereke (a.k.a. U-four-ia)

many of the Knytt Stories games

I have not played Cv64,LoD,DoS,PoR,LoI,CoD, Metroid Prime2,Prime3,Hunters, Knytt Within a Deep Forest, Seiklus, Zillion, Blaster Master, Adventure Island 4, or most games you mention here.

[GlennMagusHarvey]

2. I define the genre differently from how you define it. I define it as a game that requires

I attach no dimensional requirement to it (it can be 2D or 3D, or if you count time as a dimension, 4D for changing world features).

I believe a castletroid (or NLEG, as I'll abbreviate it) is defined by having a continuous, sufficiently interconnected world, exploring which is the player's goal, and there are various powerups scattered about that let the player explore more and more of said world.

[GlennMagusHarvey]

I'm going to respectfully disagree with you on this matter.

1. Wikipedia's disavowing of this term is due to their policy against "no novel research". I was one of probably a good number of editors who tried to document this phenomenon on Wikipedia, only to get shot down due to this policy. (I made an article called "non-linear exploration game" or something. Other people worked on "Metroidvania".)

[GlennMagusHarvey]

lol, I call them castletroids. Or better yet, non-linear exploration game.

[jpkushin]

How about Rygar? That game was actually pretty good (except for annoying spawning--it's Tecmo, what do you expect?). I love the overworld music too. It has a classical symphonic feel to it at certain points.