KETC | Living St. Louis | Loop Streetcars

[SpaceVulcan]

Used to run in Milan? Ha, they are still very much running! Some are way past 8 yrs old btw, and running smoothly at that: it's much easier to see newer streetcars broken than these old bangers!

[AGandDL]

It's coming! 2013!

[ArtStone]

Trolleys were also relied on heavily by the central planners of the Soviet Union. Public control of all means of transportation is one of Engel's principles of Communism from the 1800s. Destroying GM and private vehicle ownership fits right in with that plan.

[Tubes12AX7k]

Smart zoning is probably the #1 issue. There should be greater encouragement for corner stores, pharmacies, and barber shops to be located adjacent to, or in neighborhoods, the way it used to be.

[Tubes12AX7k]

I'll hit a few of the comments here in one swoop: 1) the "economic reasons" for buses was dependent on cheap oil - which is largely gone. 2) BOTH main streets and rail right-of-ways need to be protected to discourage sprawl. 3) Careful zoning and incentives will encourage malls, light industry, and corner stores to locate along the right-of-ways. 4) Encourage people & small businesses to locate on these routes rather than build new roads. 5) Relax, you can still keep your car.

[Greggo2]

For all you economic streetcar deniers in the U.S., please explain to me why Toronto continues to have lots of streetcars? Until I moved to the suburbs, I took the 501 Queen car to work.

[aldoso2]

I don't understand why the milan trams have changed their number

[piratef2004]

With the Success of the F-Line in San Francisco. I can not see how St. Louis can pass this opportunity. It will be successful if done right.

[at1212b]

I'm glad to say Toronto still uses streetcars extensively!

[T9XWRL]

Lay down new tracks? As I recall, when the streetcars were removed from most streets the tracks were not removed, just paved over.

[avguy2006]

Great video. Streetcars would be an excellent addition to any city.

I have heard the song before and I love it, but I cannot remember the title. Can anyone identify it for me?

[Cockroach2008]

More expensive junk to maintain!

$32 million for a transportation vehicle which will never see a profit.

Burn it and junk it!

[froggyola]

You have no vision or known personality.

[Cockroach2008]

You have no money and not a realist!

Too expensive! Buses will serve just fine.

Burn them and junk them all!

[froggyola]

You're the loser in St.Louis not me! hahahaha.

[Cockroach2008]

No, you are the loser if you give $1 to save this junk or to put the system back into service.

You go ahead and sink your money down a rat hole. At least the city is smart enough to recognize that the entire system was and remains a looser and won't give any money towards this folly of an idea.

Junk them all, cut them up and melt them all down into materials for new transportation products.

Junk the trolley cars, cut them up and melt them down!

[froggyola]

Your name is appropriate. SPLAT!!! Right under my feet.

[Cockroach2008]

Nope! No SPLAT!!! I never saw or felt your foot!

Are you having fun roasting hot dogs and marshmallows by the heat of a burning St. Louis street car? I bet you are and with the street car as a heat source, they taste better too!

[kemetnusayf]

Perhaps you should read the Great American Streetcar Conspiracy. Your sentiments are exactly the same as GM, Standard Oil and Firestone. And, as for your comment that busses will serve just fine...the average age of a streetcar was fifty years and had very few mechanical failures. What bus can match that record.

[Cockroach2008]

I am well aware what these corporations did to the Key System in the San Francisco area. I do agree with the judgment and I do not agree the damages awarded of $1.

A tremendous injustice. Identical to what is happening in the banking industry today. They behave badly, the government gives them a financial bailout, permits bonus payments to the executives, permits them to keep their positions for bad behavior.

Interesting to me, GM gets a bailout, but says the CEO must go!

Hippocracy!

[Cockroach2008]

We are in agreement. I have no bone with trolleys or steam locomotives because they are what they are. My issue is we are being asked to preserve something for the interests of a very few. That costs. You & I are being to asked to pay for it without benefit to us.

If mass transit were economical & served more, I would support it. Our current city designs don't make it practical.

Steam locomotives & street cars should be paid for by those who use them or want them preserved. Not me!

Junk them!

[Corvettably]

You should actually bother to read up on some history first. GM didn't have anything to do with the decline of streetcars. Simple economics did them in. A second rate lawyer trying to make his way in DC (Snell) was the one who spread the crap about GM in order to further his own objectives. The myth has been debunked but a number of people haven't bothered to read the follow up articles.

Looks like you are one of them.

[Corvettably]

Taken for a Ride was based heavily on Snell's work and his "facts". Perhaps you should read Cliff Slater's pier reviewed article on the subject. I would also suggest reading some some of the other authors who have pointed out why streetcars in particular declined in the US for simple economic reasons. If nothing else, please explain how GM, who at best had interest in no more than 10% of US streetcar Co's could have killed off the other near 90%? Simply logic says GM didn't do it. Facts do too.

[Intransitman]

Hey, the road in front of your home isn't operated on a profit or loss basis. Gas taxes along with other fees only cover about 20% of road expenses & now with the auto industry getting almost $100 billion in bailout money from Uncle Sam. What are you complaining for?

[Cockroach2008]

The road in front of my home is a private street. But I understand your point. It does connect to a public street.

What is disturbing is the trolley is so limited in where it can go. It can not be as flexible to move where the transportation patterns of the people change. At least a bus can take a detour for a couple of days. Trolleys require the installation of a very expensive infrastructure (comparatively).

The auto industry should NOT be bailed out, neither should these trolleys!

[Intransitman]

Though this streetcar project isn't a bailout. It's about undoing some of the damage done by previous governments.

[redoctober90]

We're still lucky that we have somewhat of a shadow of the old Pittsburgh lines. We had PCC's running on a single track right of way until 2000. The final four running are scattered across the country (one is being regauged for SF, two are on display, and one is at the PA trolley museum). If you feel up to it, SEPTA in Philadelphia still has some beautifully restored post-war PCC's running in the streets.

[buflyer]

Wow, very encouraging. I'm on a committee to to something similiar in Winnipeg Canada. Great report

[Streetcar1743]

I know Dave here in the pictures. When I helped out at the museum where the real 1743 streetcar lives, he and I really became friends. He also works at the Wabbash, Frisco and Pacific riding model railroad in Grover, MO.

[vikingvolvo]

How sad, an entire spot on St. Louis and street cars, and no mention of the fact that the St. Louis Streetcar Company built most of the streetcars in America, that were then exported to countries around the world, when America kneeled to the altar of the Freeway. The PCCs in this video? Built in St. Louis!! The PCC's in San Francisco, from Philly and NJ? St. Louis. How can St. Louis journalists be so dreadfully uninformed. How fast people forget.

[cheeseeveryday]

I didn't know this myself. Yes, that is sad.

[TheBeatlesSTL]

Growing Up In The Delmar Loop I Was On The Old

Hoimont Line Many Times Before Its Last Run

Great Video!!

[waynebrasler]

In the days of the Delmar streetcar line, Delmar west of Skinker was a sophisticated shopping mecca with great dining(Golden Fried Chicken Loaf), theaters (Varsity, Tivoli), bookstores, drug stores and the Loop itself. Putting streetcars back in would be a surefire hit and major tourist attraction at a fraction of what it costs to build light rail.

[TheBeatlesSTL]

I Seconed That!@!

[berrygirl964]

Mark,

THANK YOU for this! I love history and the beautiful, old streetcars were amazing! I hope they can make a comeback.

[ManufacturedManFtM]

Hey.. My grandmother used to work at Golden Fried Chicken Loaf. She was a pie maker there. Does anyone know what year they closed? And is the old building still there? I think have street cars back on Delmar would be fantastic...I would sure love to ride one. My mom rode them all over the city when she was a kid.