i dont know why but i fucking loved the raw power of those galaxy wings totally raping those galor class ships and well then there's the klingons which i thought was brilliant just coming down shooting constantly firing not giving a sht who gets in the way even other klingons hahaha
Although I love DS9, this space battle makes no sense. The Federation could have just went at maximum warp around the Dominion fleet and beat them to DS9. The battle would have played out much differently.
@kosstmoran DS:9 was under Dominion control they would have turned the firepower against the Federation Fleet and those ships. That was the point of fighting where they fought.
@Sn0wc4t no, that's the Akira class. Basically what happened is that the producers of Enterprise took the Akira model, flipped it upside-down and made it look different enough that it looked like a pre-TOS ship (e.g. the nacelles, saucer and deflector)
Makes sense, why spend the production money designing a brand new ship when modifying an... "older" model costs half as much and still acheives the proper effect.
@KeromorV2 WTF MAN STAR WARS IS WAY BETTER THEN YOUR FUCKING STAR TREK THAT SUCKS AT LEAST STARWARS IS GOOD OVERALL UNLIKE FUCKING STAR TREK AND STARS GIRLS ARE HOT UNLIKE FUCKING STAR TREK GIRLS THAT ARE FAT AND UGLY WHO LIVE WITH THEIR PARENTS WHO ARE 45 YEARS OLD MOTHER FUCKER
@millionsofawesome OH NO YOU USED CAPS AND MADE ME CRAY WAH WAH WAH loser little starwars fan, the first 3 films wait no there the last 3 now WTF what an asshole are ok and the last 3 wait the 1st 3 sucked donkey balls and you would know about people living with there parents wouldnt you little girl err boy or whatever the fuck you are hahahahaha oh and ahahahahahahaha wait lets ahahahahahahahaha gay boi
Nice arrival of the klingons for once...although Sisko should've been a bit more smarter on how to do that battle, he lost a ton of fine officers and crew.
the largest mistake they did on the show is that they never showed us intrepid,sovereign,Prometheus class. its was established on screen and its cannon that those 3 classes are the most advanced ships in the fleet and quite powerful.
@miloootic At this point in this fictional timeline, the classes known as the Intrepid, Sovereign, and Prometheus were relatively novel. They had not yet been established as a staple within starfleet.
@RyJ yes but the stardates on first contact and voy clearly show that these classes were available at that time they should at least have appear in cameo and help in the battles prior to season 4 in DS9.
One thing I always liked about these episodes. For years we saw the Enterprise-D, a Galaxy class ship, exploring space, facing down the worst the galaxy has to offer, and discounting Gods only against the Borg did the Enterprise really feel outclassed.
Here we have a Galor Class destroyer, from how Sisko is intimidated by them, they sound like the Cardassian answer to the Galaxy Class. And one was knocked out in not a pitched battle, but as a speed bump, shows just how powerful it really was.
@tomblord12 I never understood the steam. Either the sauna deck is just above the bridge, or the Defiant is actually steam powered, and poor O'Brien is shoveling coal into the warp core....
@Chulva I always wondered that too. I'm pretty sure they would assign ships to save who they can in both fleets. The most badly damaged ships would probably get first priority and then they would go from there (like a triage).
@Chulva Considering that Starfleet needs every ship in this war I suppose that they will recover any ship that is salvageble. So I think there is hope for the Sitak and the Majestic.
@Jackneill45 - It's kind of an illusion. The Klingon BOP in the front gets hit and blows up while the BOP behind is firing at ships off-screen. The first BOP blows up on the camera side of the line the second BOP is firing in.
@Archedgar It was noted that Dominion weaponry was extremely effective against Federation shielding. At the same time, Starfleet adopted "skin tight" shielding to avoid power loss. In reality, it meant better effects and it meant that for the first time in Star Trek; the good guys didnt win by the end of the 45 minutes.
Exactly my point. It lost one wing and spun out of control. I think that torpedo which missed the BOP was supposed to rip it apart but it looks like the VFX-Teams made a minor VFX mistake.
@FekLeyrTarg By this point in the series it was all done on computers with no physical models or real pyro. I think the CGI guys were having so much fun blowing up ships that they decided to make that one spin out of control.
@tbeller80 - It didn't actually blow up its own wingman. The wingman just passes between the viewer's (i.e. you and I) position and the other BOP's line of fire.
I think that idiot Ron Moore just like seeing good guys die left and right...his idea of "gritty realism" with no regard for series canon...
TNG pretty much established that Cardassian warships were CRAP, the Enterprise easily disabled one and Captain Maxwell destroyed one with his shields down due to override...
Cardassian ships were not crap - simply lagged a generation behind Klingon/Federation vessels. It stand to reason that they have received some Dominion upgrades, but still I think Ron Moore burried this series just like he did later to Battlestar Galactia.
As for the small ships. As shown in this video and previous episodes, its very easy for the targetting computers of modern spacesships to target and destroy small ships.
As for anti-matter suicide explosions. It would be easy for the fleet to detect such a thing and they'd simply move away. Not to mention that several anti-matter explosions of that magnitude would have created subspace tears, making it impossible to go to warp or stay in warp, which would have prevented the fleet from reaching DS9.
1. Nukes would not be effective, as shields would protect against the blast very effectively.
2. They couldn't warp around the fleet, as the Jem Hadar would simply suicide against their ships in warp and destroy them easily.
3. Have to remember that these ships are taking fire from dozens of other ships, it just isn't all shown on screen, so thats why they're destroyed so "easily". The Seatag and Majestic likely already had weakened shields from enemy fire.
Its amazing how fast the ships gets destroyed with one/two hits in a large battle but in smaller battles each ship is capable of taking on significant damage. Even if you consider that the ships are being attacked by multiple enemy ships, they just blow up so much faster it seems.
You mean the Sovereign class that sucked against misearble 3 S'ona ships ? :D Or one nearly assimilated by Borg scout sphere ? Or perhaps one that even with assist of two Valdore-class warbirds was shooting duck for Scimtar ? The only battle worthy designs in Federation fleet were Galaxy/Nebula, Prometheus and Intrepid class..
@AnteyPL 3 S'ona ships with illegal weaponry whilst in a nebula it was not fitout for? It was not assimilated by the scout, it destroyed it. The fact the Borg beamed over is irrelevant. And the Scimitar was a far more heavily armed vessel. Your films/episodes would be incredibly boring if the Federation always won. The writers have to give a bloody nose to keep us interested. The Intrepid was not a combat vessel neither was the Nebula. The Galaxy once upfitted proved formiddable.
You write "Scimitar was a far more heavily armed vessel" - my point exactly. What do you wish to dispute ? Legality of weapons, please... be serious. Intrepid/Nebula/Galaxy class - right, they were not combat dedicated starships. Suprisingly, these designs handled difficult situations far better than shiny Enterprise-E....still missing the point ?
@AnteyPL I'm saying you are comparing ships we have frequently seen in battle scenerios to a ship we have seldom seen. In each movie, the E-E was supposed to be on the back foot otherwise we wouldn't want. If you trueluy want to test things, get the technical specs, get a simulator and try it. That said you are essentially comparing different types and classes of vessel. It would be like comparing a frigate against an aircraft carrier - apples and oranges. Just enjoy the show!
@AnteyPL he was using the soverign class ship lol while miss donatra warbird was a brand new design i believe i thing the ship was quite strong as it has better armour and shields i m not sure the S'ona class though dun mind if u explaine
@AnteyPL hi Picard was using the soverign class ship lol(as his enterprise Galaxy class was destroyed ) while miss donatra warbird was a brand new design i believe i think the ship was quite strong as it has better armour and shields i m not sure the S'ona class though dun mind if u explaine btw the defiant cLass was though too
Outnumbered 2 to 1? Heres a thought- Tactical Nuclear Weapons! I mean they could easily build warheads that are hundreds of megatons,, which would be more devastating than all the quantum torpedos the whole ship has. Maybe the Federation would puss out of it, but at least the Klingons would
that whole thing where the good side are in trouble and someone else comes in to help is used a lot like in mass effect if do the paragon action to save the council
I have to say DS9 is probably my favorite Trek series, then TNG, then Voyager, and last Enterprise, never really watched the originals too far before my time
@UncleDeluxe The usual answer is that the computers on starships can easily pickk off small targets like that and destroy them. But if you send HUGE waves after a ship there is no way it would be able to compensate. The real reason for lack of fighters was lack of funding for DS9.
It's the fighters that have NO SENSE whatsover - simple power balance states that fighters stand no chance against capital ships. Not enough power for shields and weapons. Physics. Battlestar Galacita Universe beeing notable exception. In Star Trek, Star Gate or Babylon 5 universe fighters are expandable and useless.
Fghters have limited endurance - that's why you need carrier vessel (Battlestar, Imperial Star Destroyer). And my argument still stands: small ship - small power source - small power output - weak shields and weak weapons.In World War II aircraft carried comparable heavier munitions than ships they were attacking and were flying against on board weapons of limited efficiency at maximum range. In space age, this would clearly be no longer the case in ships vs ship.
@AnteyPL Everything you're arguing is hypothetical. If you're going that route, It's far more likely that they'd send wave after wave of expendable unmanned drones anyway.
That's right - and that's why manned fighters have no sense in ST and other universes.
Small auxiliaries (shutlles, yachts, runabouts) are entirely different thing, just like small RHIBs and lifeboats or barques for today's sea-going vessels.
Again - even in Star Trek, drones need fuel. Small drone - small amount of fuel - shorter range and endurance.
@ScireSpire port nacelle you mean..it's one of those blue glowey things on a starship..in this case the one on the left of ships like the Enterprise and others - it's actually one of the warp engines! :-)
@mrbigck81 That the enemy also had warp and could probably outflank them because of superior numbers. And even if they did outrun the fleet, then they'd have to face DS9 in the front and the enemy fleet in the back, making things worse.
@clutchness He always proved useful to Sisko and the gang. You could also ask yourself why Sisko is in charge of a 600 ship fleet as a young captain when there should be half a dozen or more admirals in command.
@AnteyPL An adjutant is an assistant. Sisko was one of Ross' primary planners, not ship commanders. That's why he had to give the ship to Dax for a while. Sisko designed the mission, but as staff it's not his job to carry it out. If anything, Ross should have been commanding the mission since he was in command of that whole sector with Sisko advising him on the bridge.
@tbeller80 Adjutant is not an assistant. It is an appointment as a personal staff officer to a senior flag/general/air officer and is a role performed by one or more senior line officers. They are usually in charge of all the organisation, administration and discipline of a military command. It is used to provide strategic experience to a senior line officer before being appointed to a flag/general/air rank. In this instance, Ross gave command of the taskforce to Sisko as his representative.
@MrSatireTube Where are you getting that definition from? That sounds more like a combination of a chief of staff and an aide de camp. In my battalion and brigade, the senior personnel officers are called adjutants. The XO/CoS is in charge of the unit's organization and administration. It just seems odd to me that an admiral would delegate command of a significant chunk of the fleet to a subordinate who wasn't in command position.
@tbeller80 I'm getting that definition from my experience with the military. In terms of this series, they have based it very much upon the Navy. It is perfectly reasonable for a Chief of Operations to delegate a taskforce command to a senior captain who happens to be their adjutant in this case. Sisko was in a command position. An adjutant is a command position allbeit not necessarily a line command.
@MrSatireTube I've been in Army going on 13 years which is where my opinions come from. I'll admit I'm not an expert on Navy organization, but it appeared to me that he was ordered to give up command of his ship in order to serve as Ross' chief of staff or operations officer which means any number of fleet or task force commanders would be in line before him to take command of half of Starfleet's ships.
@tbeller80 And it was actually a relatively small taskforce he was given operational command over (627 ships) which was cobbled together with elements of 3 fleets though only 2 arrived on time. There were ten complete fleets at the time of the War and an estimated strength of 1500 Starfleet vessels per fleet. Thereby this was a taskforce and a "punt" by Starfleet Command to see if Sisko could do it.
@MrSatireTube For Starfleet, it seemed like this early in the war Sisko was taking over for a sizable chunk of the existing fleet and the admirals were very concerned about this. 1500 ships seems excessive for a fleet size when they were aghast that the 7th fleet lost 90% of the ships in the Tyra battle (98/112 lost).
@MrSatireTube I can't imagine Admiral Halsey telling a staff officer "We'll attack this island, and because you thought of it first, I'll be back at Pearl while you're in charge."
@tbeller80 It is reasonable however for the commander of a strategic operation to divide commands and assign personal staff to control them. It is pretty much command delegation 101. You must have experienced this in your line of work?
@MrSatireTube Actually I rarely experience command "delegation" unless the commander wasn't physically in the area (meetings, leave, sickness). I've participated in my share of battles, but nothing so large enough that a commander wouldn't be there to lead an operation himself. When a commander delegates responsibility, it's usually to another line commander.
@tbeller80 I know the US Army have a slightly differed meaning as the Adjutant position leans more towards administrative/personnel functions. The definition used by Star Trek is the more traditional naval use of the term. You are right however that the position is part of the executive staff. It is actually traditional that the CO would command an operation whilst the adjutant controls it. Perfectly used in this storyline. Sisko is there as the CO personal representative.
@AlphaCentCom Just because it's a 3D battlefield doesn't mean either side can avoid battles being joined between fleets. Both sides have to live on planets, have spacedocks, have bases and resources from interstellar bodies.. the battles are normally fought for and around those, like this one. Yeah, you could warp over or under in cloak over some big outnumbering fleet, but you got to park that ship sometime for fuel and repairs. (:
Ya know.... there really isn't any suspence when the defiant takes damage. Because they have about 9 of the major characters onboard, so what do they do? They kill/wound a bunch of un named crewmen :P
Man excelsior kicks ass sulu would have been proud
wayneandgarth122 6 days ago
no freaking star wars can get as cool as this!
AGIOVA100 1 week ago
i dont know why but i fucking loved the raw power of those galaxy wings totally raping those galor class ships and well then there's the klingons which i thought was brilliant just coming down shooting constantly firing not giving a sht who gets in the way even other klingons hahaha
xeNeonification 2 weeks ago
@xeNeonification lol the american cavalry are here, it's ww2 all over again
kensei85 1 week ago
Evasive manouvers.
Pattern loop de loop.
Antlion666 3 weeks ago
Best part of this whole vid is at 6:53 when the Klingon Vor'Cha cruisers and birds of prey are raining death upon the Dominion fleet!
Awesome!!
Woodchuckk 4 weeks ago 2
That's why you don't mess with a black man :-P
boyblady 1 month ago
No amount of snub fighter dog fights in Star Wars can ever compare to this one sequence in Star Trek.
cam2d2 1 month ago
At 6:25 didn't that ship look a lot like the Scimitar?
Iomeces 1 month ago
I love the scene at 5:10. This is the power of a galaxy class vessel! Maybe the monologue of the cardassian captain sounds like this:
At first the Galore ship is firing at star fleet ships "Take this! Take this! HAHA!"
Then, two galaxy classes aproaching and opening fire: "Shit! Go away! Escape Speed! Escape speed!" :-D
TheorinEdhel 1 month ago
Some of the best television of the 90s!
IsleFreeThinker1 2 months ago
Although I love DS9, this space battle makes no sense. The Federation could have just went at maximum warp around the Dominion fleet and beat them to DS9. The battle would have played out much differently.
kosstmoran 2 months ago
@kosstmoran DS:9 was under Dominion control they would have turned the firepower against the Federation Fleet and those ships. That was the point of fighting where they fought.
clerickolter 1 month ago
0:04 Bottom centre of frame. Isn't that the NX-01? (Or a ship class extremely similar to it 8-S )
Sn0wc4t 2 months ago
@Sn0wc4t no, that's the Akira class. Basically what happened is that the producers of Enterprise took the Akira model, flipped it upside-down and made it look different enough that it looked like a pre-TOS ship (e.g. the nacelles, saucer and deflector)
babylon218 2 months ago
@babylon218 Aaaah! Thanks. 8-)
Makes sense, why spend the production money designing a brand new ship when modifying an... "older" model costs half as much and still acheives the proper effect.
Sn0wc4t 2 months ago
@Sn0wc4t It is an akira class cruiser. Remember the NX class wasn't untill after DS9
ElensarFFXI 1 month ago
@ElensarFFXI The NX-01 that I was meaning was the original Enterprise (Cpt Archer) so roughly 150yrs BEFORE DS9. ;-)
Thank You though, I see what you mean. :-)
Sn0wc4t 1 month ago
@Sn0wc4t haha Yeah I was meaning as in when it was created from our point of view not the actual time line :)
ElensarFFXI 1 month ago
millionsofawesome fuck you!
stargateedy 2 months ago
STAR WARS FOR THE WIN
millionsofawesome 2 months ago
@millionsofawesome STARWARS FOR THE LOSERS BUT THEN YOUR A LOSER SO YOU KNOW THAT!
KeromorV2 2 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@KeromorV2 WTF MAN STAR WARS IS WAY BETTER THEN YOUR FUCKING STAR TREK THAT SUCKS AT LEAST STARWARS IS GOOD OVERALL UNLIKE FUCKING STAR TREK AND STARS GIRLS ARE HOT UNLIKE FUCKING STAR TREK GIRLS THAT ARE FAT AND UGLY WHO LIVE WITH THEIR PARENTS WHO ARE 45 YEARS OLD MOTHER FUCKER
millionsofawesome 2 months ago
@millionsofawesome OH NO YOU USED CAPS AND MADE ME CRAY WAH WAH WAH loser little starwars fan, the first 3 films wait no there the last 3 now WTF what an asshole are ok and the last 3 wait the 1st 3 sucked donkey balls and you would know about people living with there parents wouldnt you little girl err boy or whatever the fuck you are hahahahaha oh and ahahahahahahaha wait lets ahahahahahahahaha gay boi
KeromorV2 2 months ago
@millionsofawesome what a fail troll. I suppose watching both would be out of the question?
blightsoot 2 months ago
Nice arrival of the klingons for once...although Sisko should've been a bit more smarter on how to do that battle, he lost a ton of fine officers and crew.
falcon3268 2 months ago
the largest mistake they did on the show is that they never showed us intrepid,sovereign,Prometheus class. its was established on screen and its cannon that those 3 classes are the most advanced ships in the fleet and quite powerful.
miloootic 3 months ago
@miloootic oh they were there, just a little bit off camera ;)
ascend501 3 months ago
@miloootic They were also the newest, so there probably weren't a whole lot of them around.
baalthegreat 3 months ago
@baalthegreat ur prob right too bad
miloootic 3 months ago
@miloootic At this point in this fictional timeline, the classes known as the Intrepid, Sovereign, and Prometheus were relatively novel. They had not yet been established as a staple within starfleet.
RyJ 2 months ago
@RyJ yes but the stardates on first contact and voy clearly show that these classes were available at that time they should at least have appear in cameo and help in the battles prior to season 4 in DS9.
miloootic 2 months ago
That's alota ships. O.O
pupbenny 3 months ago
One thing I always liked about these episodes. For years we saw the Enterprise-D, a Galaxy class ship, exploring space, facing down the worst the galaxy has to offer, and discounting Gods only against the Borg did the Enterprise really feel outclassed.
Here we have a Galor Class destroyer, from how Sisko is intimidated by them, they sound like the Cardassian answer to the Galaxy Class. And one was knocked out in not a pitched battle, but as a speed bump, shows just how powerful it really was.
Teranewone 4 months ago
i wonder when the federation does a ship that dosent blow up it's consoles and gets steamy everytime it got's few hits
tomblord12 4 months ago
@tomblord12 I never understood the steam. Either the sauna deck is just above the bridge, or the Defiant is actually steam powered, and poor O'Brien is shoveling coal into the warp core....
faa788 4 months ago
@faa788 the "steam" is actually coolant
OneWingedAngel50 3 months ago
@tomblord12 those explosive consoles are the leading cause of death lol
labartic 4 months ago
You have to wonder if the Seatac and Majestic where recovered or if anyone survived those blasts...
Chulva 4 months ago
@Chulva I always wondered that too. I'm pretty sure they would assign ships to save who they can in both fleets. The most badly damaged ships would probably get first priority and then they would go from there (like a triage).
Psiros2161 4 months ago
@Chulva Considering that Starfleet needs every ship in this war I suppose that they will recover any ship that is salvageble. So I think there is hope for the Sitak and the Majestic.
sunlightguy75 3 months ago
lol, is it just my immignation or at 7:29 did a Klingon ship on the right flank destroy's lead Klingon ship that was escorting the Defiant?
Jackneill45 4 months ago
@Jackneill45 The real question is: Did that klingon ship get in the way of the other one?
Hades2000 4 months ago
@Jackneill45 It's crew with die WITHOUT HONOR!
faa788 4 months ago
@Jackneill45 I believe that's a case of 'friendly fire'
sunlightguy75 3 months ago
@Jackneill45 I think americans call this "friendly fire" ? ^^
TheorinEdhel 1 month ago
@Jackneill45 - It's kind of an illusion. The Klingon BOP in the front gets hit and blows up while the BOP behind is firing at ships off-screen. The first BOP blows up on the camera side of the line the second BOP is firing in.
JMcH 1 month ago
Poor Will - he's always the target!!!
T0X0PHILUS 4 months ago
Love garaks expression when the klingons arrive XD
barmyguy900 4 months ago
This is why I like STDS9, There was so many great large scale battles, felt like the entire show was nothing but Full Scale War All the time.
StarFoxKitsune 4 months ago
great!
gentoo52 5 months ago
I agree with Garrek's thinking.....hope for the best,but plan for the worst.
rtds9fan 5 months ago 2
1 of the best eps of DS9
presto7919 6 months ago
was the enterprise E the only combat ready sovereign class during the dominion war? send a fleet of them bad boys in and its back in time for tea ;p
bigyin109 6 months ago
@bigyin109
It wasn't, just like Prometheus class. Anyway, given E's poor combat performance, it wouldn't make much of the difference...
AnteyPL 6 months ago
But, I do think this is where the Klingons come in like the Cavalry. Just in the niche of time.
DBro65 6 months ago
Nope.
DBro65 6 months ago
I'm thinking this is where the Cardassians turn on the Jem'Hadar fleet.
DBro65 6 months ago
the full poem nationalcenterdotorg/ ChargeoftheLightBrigade
FERViolin2010 6 months ago
This is terrible. Where the @#*$&% are their shields? they are dropping ships with a single phaser burst.
Archedgar 6 months ago
@Archedgar It was noted that Dominion weaponry was extremely effective against Federation shielding. At the same time, Starfleet adopted "skin tight" shielding to avoid power loss. In reality, it meant better effects and it meant that for the first time in Star Trek; the good guys didnt win by the end of the 45 minutes.
MrSatireTube 6 months ago
@MrSatireTube
Nope - it's not like conformal shielding applied on Sovereign class at time of Star Trek Nemesis.
It's lack of shielding.
AnteyPL 6 months ago
@AnteyPL Not sure what you mean?
MrSatireTube 6 months ago
all of those enemy ships vs 12 Borg Cubes...enough said :P
FERViolin2010 6 months ago
@FERViolin2010 That would become ....20 borg cubes. :)
temporaldisplacement 6 months ago
@quantum460 haiz he always like to raise his eyebrow whenever he issues an order those federation fighters are really weak no shieLds or some sort
Badboy21thekiller 6 months ago
Have you ever watched the right Bird of Prey at 7:31?
FekLeyrTarg 6 months ago
@FekLeyrTarg You mean the one that blew up his own wingman then crashed into the battleship?
tbeller80 6 months ago
@tbeller80
Yes, that one. Have you noticed something odd with that BOP right before it crashes?
FekLeyrTarg 6 months ago
@FekLeyrTarg It was blown in half and spun in a circle. What else?
tbeller80 6 months ago
@tbeller80
Exactly my point. It lost one wing and spun out of control. I think that torpedo which missed the BOP was supposed to rip it apart but it looks like the VFX-Teams made a minor VFX mistake.
FekLeyrTarg 6 months ago
@FekLeyrTarg By this point in the series it was all done on computers with no physical models or real pyro. I think the CGI guys were having so much fun blowing up ships that they decided to make that one spin out of control.
tbeller80 6 months ago
@tbeller80
I think we all have fun with those scenes. :-)
FekLeyrTarg 6 months ago
@tbeller80 - It didn't actually blow up its own wingman. The wingman just passes between the viewer's (i.e. you and I) position and the other BOP's line of fire.
JMcH 1 month ago
I think that idiot Ron Moore just like seeing good guys die left and right...his idea of "gritty realism" with no regard for series canon...
TNG pretty much established that Cardassian warships were CRAP, the Enterprise easily disabled one and Captain Maxwell destroyed one with his shields down due to override...
stryker214 7 months ago
@stryker214
Cardassian ships were not crap - simply lagged a generation behind Klingon/Federation vessels. It stand to reason that they have received some Dominion upgrades, but still I think Ron Moore burried this series just like he did later to Battlestar Galactia.
AnteyPL 6 months ago
Comment removed
stryker214 7 months ago
this is finally the time when starfleet gave the galaxy class ships some balls!
chicagomarchingbands 8 months ago
As for the small ships. As shown in this video and previous episodes, its very easy for the targetting computers of modern spacesships to target and destroy small ships.
lordchaos3819 8 months ago
As for anti-matter suicide explosions. It would be easy for the fleet to detect such a thing and they'd simply move away. Not to mention that several anti-matter explosions of that magnitude would have created subspace tears, making it impossible to go to warp or stay in warp, which would have prevented the fleet from reaching DS9.
lordchaos3819 8 months ago
Some answers:
1. Nukes would not be effective, as shields would protect against the blast very effectively.
2. They couldn't warp around the fleet, as the Jem Hadar would simply suicide against their ships in warp and destroy them easily.
3. Have to remember that these ships are taking fire from dozens of other ships, it just isn't all shown on screen, so thats why they're destroyed so "easily". The Seatag and Majestic likely already had weakened shields from enemy fire.
lordchaos3819 8 months ago
How come there arn't large anti-mater explosions when these ships get destroyed. You would think one ship going down would take everyone out..
TheKilak 8 months ago
Its amazing how fast the ships gets destroyed with one/two hits in a large battle but in smaller battles each ship is capable of taking on significant damage. Even if you consider that the ships are being attacked by multiple enemy ships, they just blow up so much faster it seems.
jutau 8 months ago
@jutau it is a bit odd, isn't it...
retepish 8 months ago
@jutau its because CBS didnt give startrek enough money so there are no shield affects or large scale hull damage :(
JimmyJames81196 8 months ago
Good edit. Thanks for posting.
vonBeavis 9 months ago
ever notice that the Cardassian ships are shaped exactly like the symbol on their flag
Kahlessrocks 9 months ago
WHERE IS CAPTAIN PICKARD DONT HE HAVE THE BEST SHIP IN THE FLEET!!!??!?!?
FERViolin2010 9 months ago
@FERViolin2010 only one soveriegn class starship armed with quantum torpedos not excatly enough
Badboy21thekiller 6 months ago
@FERViolin2010 at least 5 sovereign class starships fully armed with quantum torpedos would be sufficient to poke a hole in dominion lines
Badboy21thekiller 6 months ago
@Badboy21thekiller
You mean the Sovereign class that sucked against misearble 3 S'ona ships ? :D Or one nearly assimilated by Borg scout sphere ? Or perhaps one that even with assist of two Valdore-class warbirds was shooting duck for Scimtar ? The only battle worthy designs in Federation fleet were Galaxy/Nebula, Prometheus and Intrepid class..
AnteyPL 6 months ago
@AnteyPL 3 S'ona ships with illegal weaponry whilst in a nebula it was not fitout for? It was not assimilated by the scout, it destroyed it. The fact the Borg beamed over is irrelevant. And the Scimitar was a far more heavily armed vessel. Your films/episodes would be incredibly boring if the Federation always won. The writers have to give a bloody nose to keep us interested. The Intrepid was not a combat vessel neither was the Nebula. The Galaxy once upfitted proved formiddable.
MrSatireTube 6 months ago
@MrSatireTube
You write "Scimitar was a far more heavily armed vessel" - my point exactly. What do you wish to dispute ? Legality of weapons, please... be serious. Intrepid/Nebula/Galaxy class - right, they were not combat dedicated starships. Suprisingly, these designs handled difficult situations far better than shiny Enterprise-E....still missing the point ?
AnteyPL 6 months ago
@AnteyPL I'm saying you are comparing ships we have frequently seen in battle scenerios to a ship we have seldom seen. In each movie, the E-E was supposed to be on the back foot otherwise we wouldn't want. If you trueluy want to test things, get the technical specs, get a simulator and try it. That said you are essentially comparing different types and classes of vessel. It would be like comparing a frigate against an aircraft carrier - apples and oranges. Just enjoy the show!
MrSatireTube 6 months ago
@AnteyPL he was using the soverign class ship lol while miss donatra warbird was a brand new design i believe i thing the ship was quite strong as it has better armour and shields i m not sure the S'ona class though dun mind if u explaine
Badboy21thekiller 6 months ago
@AnteyPL hi Picard was using the soverign class ship lol(as his enterprise Galaxy class was destroyed ) while miss donatra warbird was a brand new design i believe i think the ship was quite strong as it has better armour and shields i m not sure the S'ona class though dun mind if u explaine btw the defiant cLass was though too
Badboy21thekiller 6 months ago
Outnumbered 2 to 1? Heres a thought- Tactical Nuclear Weapons! I mean they could easily build warheads that are hundreds of megatons,, which would be more devastating than all the quantum torpedos the whole ship has. Maybe the Federation would puss out of it, but at least the Klingons would
HouseofAtreus01 9 months ago
I share Garrek's philosophy
SwordsmanMercenary 9 months ago
@4:50...Admiral Ackbar speaks.
julebuggy 9 months ago
@julebuggy Admiral Ackbar! FOR ALL YOUR FLEET ACTION NEEDS! POTENTIALLY INVOLVING TRAPS....
simpsonfan13 7 months ago
that whole thing where the good side are in trouble and someone else comes in to help is used a lot like in mass effect if do the paragon action to save the council
B1izzardHawk 10 months ago
I have to say DS9 is probably my favorite Trek series, then TNG, then Voyager, and last Enterprise, never really watched the originals too far before my time
mattsmt20 10 months ago
Finally.... fighters in the ST universe. It always bothered me that space combat was reserved to huge capital ships. Makes no sense.
UncleDeluxe 10 months ago
@UncleDeluxe The usual answer is that the computers on starships can easily pickk off small targets like that and destroy them. But if you send HUGE waves after a ship there is no way it would be able to compensate. The real reason for lack of fighters was lack of funding for DS9.
simpsonfan13 7 months ago
@UncleDeluxe
It's the fighters that have NO SENSE whatsover - simple power balance states that fighters stand no chance against capital ships. Not enough power for shields and weapons. Physics. Battlestar Galacita Universe beeing notable exception. In Star Trek, Star Gate or Babylon 5 universe fighters are expandable and useless.
AnteyPL 6 months ago
@AnteyPL Sure, because squadrons of fighters have NEVER in history taken out a large vessel. :::facepalm:::
UncleDeluxe 6 months ago
@UncleDeluxe
Fghters have limited endurance - that's why you need carrier vessel (Battlestar, Imperial Star Destroyer). And my argument still stands: small ship - small power source - small power output - weak shields and weak weapons.In World War II aircraft carried comparable heavier munitions than ships they were attacking and were flying against on board weapons of limited efficiency at maximum range. In space age, this would clearly be no longer the case in ships vs ship.
AnteyPL 6 months ago
@AnteyPL Everything you're arguing is hypothetical. If you're going that route, It's far more likely that they'd send wave after wave of expendable unmanned drones anyway.
UncleDeluxe 6 months ago
@UncleDeluxe
That's right - and that's why manned fighters have no sense in ST and other universes.
Small auxiliaries (shutlles, yachts, runabouts) are entirely different thing, just like small RHIBs and lifeboats or barques for today's sea-going vessels.
Again - even in Star Trek, drones need fuel. Small drone - small amount of fuel - shorter range and endurance.
AnteyPL 6 months ago
@agolosha LoL. Greatly appreciated :) Thanks.
ScireSpire 10 months ago
@agolosha Umm... So in other words the only function of it is that it glows.
ScireSpire 10 months ago
What is a port nercel?
ScireSpire 10 months ago
@ScireSpire Agolosha is wrong. The correct answer is: Who cares?
UncleDeluxe 10 months ago
@UncleDeluxe I kind of do :(
ScireSpire 10 months ago
@ScireSpire port nacelle you mean..it's one of those blue glowey things on a starship..in this case the one on the left of ships like the Enterprise and others - it's actually one of the warp engines! :-)
danivarius 10 months ago
@danivarius Yay! Thanks :)
ScireSpire 10 months ago
Galaxy class starships are BAD. ASS. Hell all the federation ships are badass when in battle :D
GalaxyMagician 10 months ago
I have a question! The federation fleet couldn't pass by the
dominion fleet while on warp? What stopped them???
mrbigck81 11 months ago
@mrbigck81 That the enemy also had warp and could probably outflank them because of superior numbers. And even if they did outrun the fleet, then they'd have to face DS9 in the front and the enemy fleet in the back, making things worse.
Cyke101 11 months ago
Love this show. However, Garrek would never have been on a federation vessel. Especially the bridge during a war with the Cardassians.
clutchness 1 year ago
@clutchness He always proved useful to Sisko and the gang. You could also ask yourself why Sisko is in charge of a 600 ship fleet as a young captain when there should be half a dozen or more admirals in command.
tbeller80 9 months ago
@tbeller80
He was adiutant to CIC, Admiral Ross - man in charge of campaign.
AnteyPL 6 months ago
@AnteyPL An adjutant is an assistant. Sisko was one of Ross' primary planners, not ship commanders. That's why he had to give the ship to Dax for a while. Sisko designed the mission, but as staff it's not his job to carry it out. If anything, Ross should have been commanding the mission since he was in command of that whole sector with Sisko advising him on the bridge.
tbeller80 6 months ago
@tbeller80 Adjutant is not an assistant. It is an appointment as a personal staff officer to a senior flag/general/air officer and is a role performed by one or more senior line officers. They are usually in charge of all the organisation, administration and discipline of a military command. It is used to provide strategic experience to a senior line officer before being appointed to a flag/general/air rank. In this instance, Ross gave command of the taskforce to Sisko as his representative.
MrSatireTube 6 months ago
@MrSatireTube Where are you getting that definition from? That sounds more like a combination of a chief of staff and an aide de camp. In my battalion and brigade, the senior personnel officers are called adjutants. The XO/CoS is in charge of the unit's organization and administration. It just seems odd to me that an admiral would delegate command of a significant chunk of the fleet to a subordinate who wasn't in command position.
tbeller80 6 months ago
@tbeller80 I'm getting that definition from my experience with the military. In terms of this series, they have based it very much upon the Navy. It is perfectly reasonable for a Chief of Operations to delegate a taskforce command to a senior captain who happens to be their adjutant in this case. Sisko was in a command position. An adjutant is a command position allbeit not necessarily a line command.
MrSatireTube 6 months ago
@MrSatireTube I've been in Army going on 13 years which is where my opinions come from. I'll admit I'm not an expert on Navy organization, but it appeared to me that he was ordered to give up command of his ship in order to serve as Ross' chief of staff or operations officer which means any number of fleet or task force commanders would be in line before him to take command of half of Starfleet's ships.
tbeller80 6 months ago
@tbeller80 And it was actually a relatively small taskforce he was given operational command over (627 ships) which was cobbled together with elements of 3 fleets though only 2 arrived on time. There were ten complete fleets at the time of the War and an estimated strength of 1500 Starfleet vessels per fleet. Thereby this was a taskforce and a "punt" by Starfleet Command to see if Sisko could do it.
MrSatireTube 6 months ago
@MrSatireTube For Starfleet, it seemed like this early in the war Sisko was taking over for a sizable chunk of the existing fleet and the admirals were very concerned about this. 1500 ships seems excessive for a fleet size when they were aghast that the 7th fleet lost 90% of the ships in the Tyra battle (98/112 lost).
tbeller80 6 months ago
@MrSatireTube I can't imagine Admiral Halsey telling a staff officer "We'll attack this island, and because you thought of it first, I'll be back at Pearl while you're in charge."
tbeller80 6 months ago
@tbeller80 It is reasonable however for the commander of a strategic operation to divide commands and assign personal staff to control them. It is pretty much command delegation 101. You must have experienced this in your line of work?
MrSatireTube 6 months ago
@MrSatireTube Actually I rarely experience command "delegation" unless the commander wasn't physically in the area (meetings, leave, sickness). I've participated in my share of battles, but nothing so large enough that a commander wouldn't be there to lead an operation himself. When a commander delegates responsibility, it's usually to another line commander.
tbeller80 6 months ago
@tbeller80 I know the US Army have a slightly differed meaning as the Adjutant position leans more towards administrative/personnel functions. The definition used by Star Trek is the more traditional naval use of the term. You are right however that the position is part of the executive staff. It is actually traditional that the CO would command an operation whilst the adjutant controls it. Perfectly used in this storyline. Sisko is there as the CO personal representative.
MrSatireTube 6 months ago
Which episode?
22cevans 1 year ago
Tell the Klingons we are having a party on Bajor they will bring the Blood Wine and the Women.
smcneal057 1 year ago
Galaxy Class: 1
Galor Class: 0
pinoi78 1 year ago 3
I can't tell you how many times I've rewound the first SEVEN seconds of this video.
pinoi78 1 year ago
IT'S A TRAP!
SuperXela69 1 year ago 9
worst act ever
markoforge 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
they sure love their excelsiors.
sniperdude12a 1 year ago
One thing you have to wonder...why the hell is Doctor Bashir still on the bridge and not in Sickbay in the middle of a battle?
PippinRally 1 year ago
Hmmm i prefer akhbar's its a trap honestly...
vengefulnoob 1 year ago
All the characters are acting as if they aren't fighting in a 3-Dimensional environment.... XD!!
AlphaCentCom 1 year ago 22
@AlphaCentCom
Same with the majority of shows. Actually every one I can think of at the moment. Works in FPS games too, no-one ever looks up.. :D
FraggingBard 9 months ago
@AlphaCentCom Just because it's a 3D battlefield doesn't mean either side can avoid battles being joined between fleets. Both sides have to live on planets, have spacedocks, have bases and resources from interstellar bodies.. the battles are normally fought for and around those, like this one. Yeah, you could warp over or under in cloak over some big outnumbering fleet, but you got to park that ship sometime for fuel and repairs. (:
Frazzledotd 9 months ago
@AlphaCentCom
Khan had that problem too.
TheKilak 8 months ago
@quantum460 sacrafice of angels
SovietSquirel 1 year ago
Sacrifice of Angel
psrdanovic 1 year ago
Ya know.... there really isn't any suspence when the defiant takes damage. Because they have about 9 of the major characters onboard, so what do they do? They kill/wound a bunch of un named crewmen :P
99legion 1 year ago
Watch "Galaxy Quest":
"I will die!!!"
"Nobody will die."
"I will, I don't have first name, just last and rank" :)
psrdanovic 1 year ago
@99legion
Sacrifice of angels, it's shown roughly halfway
thewildborne 1 year ago
gotta love the klingons
nascar138 1 year ago 10
Well edit. I enjoyed this!
Admiral8Q 1 year ago
I would've loved to sit in one of those Peregrines. Too bad that the work on "Invasion of Cardassia V3" was stopped.
FekLeyrTarg 1 year ago
Nice. Thx.
viperhalberd 1 year ago