@TheHAMMER77777 "rights" I might add, that they were denied because they had a better tan than the rest of the local population. You live in relative comfort and security because someone,somewhere in some other time paid his taxes, took the time to elect people who were forward in their views and some paid the ultimate price for you to spout off. On behalf of those who came before you and did their civic duty: "You're welcome". Jackass.
What we have now SUCKS. It is called corporatism. Insurance companies are a layer of bureaucracy that gets between the patient and the doctor. Companies are coerced into providing health insurance. Insurance is not necessary, except for catastrophic insurance, like you have for large investments like your house. Legalize freedom in healthcare and costs will plummet. It is also a misconception that the costs are high due to the insurance company profits and pay, that is a fallacy.
Well, at least your honest about how much it would cost through taxes. Payroll tax is double taxation though, employers will simply reduce wages or reduce hiring and invest in capital. If health care is not rationed by a price system, it will be rationed through waiting lists, since gov cannot possibly meet the deman for health care since there is such a large demand. There has to be some sort of cost control, and the type government has is reducing the type of medicine and treatments offered.
(CBS)HEALTHCARE Lobbyists' Rise To Power: The pharma industry put its army of lobbyists into overdrive as Congress tried to complete a health care reform bill. 3,000 registered health care lobbyists on Capitol Hill-that's 6 for every single Congressman. And in many cases, those lobbyists are former members of Congress who shaped laws that benefited the industry they joined.This "revolving door" is perfectly legal, CBS News. To fight 2009 health reform *4,525 lobbyists,8 for each Congressman.
@BilkedToTheBrink dude..the cops are paid by local government..I don't mind states and local governments paving roads, etc. I don't want the feds involved. The 10th Ammendment states that any rights not enumerated in the Constitution belong o the states and the people. I certainly don't want government run or even subsidized (like Obamacare-i Know its private but still subsidized) healthcare..it should be purely market-based
(CBS)HEALTHCARE Lobbyists' Rise To Power: The pharma industry put its army of lobbyists into overdrive as Congress tried to complete a health care reform bill. 3,000 registered health care lobbyists on Capitol Hill-that's 6 for every single Congressman. And in many cases, those lobbyists are former members of Congress who shaped laws that benefited the industry they joined.This "revolving door" is perfectly legal, CBS News. To fight 2009 health reform *4,525 lobbyists,8 for each Congressman.
@4lifemrobama Free? LOL, Well, atleast the first dumbass posted a comment.
You'll pay for this just like social security, federal and state income tax. It'll come right out of your small little check, making it smaller.
Oh, and for all of those welfare babies that the poor are pumping out, You'll be paying for them. And so will I. An even better reason for women to go out, have some fun, and end up on the tax payers back even MORE!
They'll get welfare, HUD housing, and healthcare, Free.
lol, ya, it's just like how we pay for teachers and police, that goes oh so well, while were laying off teachers and cops by the thousands and slashing funding for both, don't think the government will do the same to healthcare when they need room in the budget? think again
I am Canadian, and I support your drive for single-payer health care. You guys south of the border are out to lunch. If you don't choose universal health care for all, you will go bankrupt, and be left behind.
@shmiggen I have many friends in Toronto that come to Buffalo cause they don't like waiting for the doctor's appointments there. I have a lot of family in Toronto too..great city, by the way...and your view Of Niagara Falls is much better
@TheHAMMER77777 there are some who go to the states for speed of access, but in general, the US system is terrible in comparison to Canada's. Every American is one chronic illness away from bankruptcy. That condition doesn't exist in Canada, and wait-lists are not that long - three months tops.
@shmiggen No, not every American is one illness from bankruptcy. I have excellent insurance, because that is what I chose to buy for my family, in a free market. People can choose to buy or not buy a product In Capitalism..thats how a free market works. Well, maybe where u are waiting lists aren't long, but again, I have friends in Toronto who disagree...and I wouldn't Tell you guys how to run your healthcare system..that's your business...similarly this is ours and we like it as is
@TheHAMMER77777 That's true. I was wrong to say that every American is a chronic illness away from pauperism. It's more like around two-thirds of the total US population, or about 200 million people. So you are correct. That is your way of life and you are happy with it. In Canada, we could not tolerate having two-thirds of our fellow men and women being so close to beggary. But like you say, it is simply two different systems.
@shmiggen No not true. 75% of us have private insurance. The rest would never be denied care in an emergency anyway. And bankruptcy isnt the worst thing anyway..people use it as a scam...they wipe out most or all of your debts and it only stays on your credit report For 7-10 Years..but anyway, i like our system
@TheHAMMER77777 So let me get this straight, you are ok to bargain for a third party payer in between you and your health care provider, rather than just eliminate him and bargain for the health care provider? The third party, then determines what they will or won't pay for based on cost but you object to the alternative because of waiting time? This makes sense to you?
@DAngelo136 not what I Said at all...private insurance is a product u one can buy or not..if u dont want a third party? Pay Cash...its not my business to take care of other's health, nor should anyone take care of mine. Merry Christmas
@TheHAMMER77777 What do you think private insurance is? It's a third party."Pay cash" you say? Then there would be no need for private insurance. That's the problem, a growing number of Americans can't afford health care and companies are finding it hard to find affordable packages for employees. If it's fine to pay into a private pool for insurance, wouldn't it follow that a larger pool (citizens) would be less expensive per participant?
@DAngelo136 u can choose to buy private insurance, or not. It is not fine for the government to be involved with health insurance....I don't want to subsidize it in any fashion. I don't think members of congress should get health insurance either. People (or their PRIVATE employers) should buy their own insurance, if they desire to.
@TheHAMMER77777 That's the major problem, a growing number of Americans are NOT buying insurance. Companies are finding the premiums more expensive than ever and American companies are dropping coverages. Now we pay more for health care as a share of GDP and have lower percentage of positive outcomes than countries with UHC. Why stay with a system that costs more and gives worse results?
@DAngelo136 GOOD let them not buy insurance...not my problem. If someone wants a product, they can buy it or not buy it. I do not want to subsidize anything. I don't care what the other countries do. I want to even repeal Obamacare. Let people do things for themselves. I Say no to nanny state and socialism
@TheHAMMER77777 It is your and my problem; when uninsured people seek treatment, it's usually in the emergency room and the problem is acute. What about children? the elderly? the poor? What about you? Can you say for sure what your economic status will be a year from now? If you or your loved one contracted a chronic disease, how long do you think you can afford to pay for it? Do you trust your insurance carrier to do the right thing or will they find a way not to pay?
@DAngelo136 I have the best insurance and have never had any problem with them. I think health is a privledge AND NOT A RIGHT. the private sector gave us the car, plane, cell phone, and most of the things you're using now. The government gave me the post office. I do not want to pay through government for anyone's health care. If i CHOOSE to buy private insurance that's up to me
@TheHAMMER77777 You have the best insurance? So you hope. Never had a problem? Yet. Health is a privilege? I take it that you don't have children and you are presently healthy. You sound like you are young-God bless you, because that can and will change. You don't have any clue how quickly that can change. Look around you, beside the post office, the water you drink, the clean air you breathe, the safety and freedom you possess is all government provided.
@TheHAMMER77777 including this medium you now proclaim your "independence". What about that great insurance company you purchased that policy from? Up until a few months ago, they had the "freedom" to deny that coverage to you as they saw fit even though you paid money for that policy. Not YOUR choice, THEIRS. My friend, you have taken the blue pill and have been asleep under the illusion of a freedom you don't have. You have no idea how vulnerable you are. Sweet dreams.
@DAngelo136 I have kids and they go to the best doctors. Even if I didn't have insurance, I'd pay Cash! Because I don't expect others to take care of my family. I work in insurance. Recissions only take place in individual (not group) policies, and ONLY IF SOMEONE LIED ON THEIR APPLICATION! Frankly they deserved it. Companies should be allowed to do that
@TheHAMMER77777 You work in insurance. That explains a lot. Ok here's my question to you. If an insurance company makes a profit by holding down costs which means denying claims, isn't that a conflict of interest? Secondly, if the present system "works" then how do you explain the fact that other countries with single-payer/universal health care spend less per capita, as a share of GDP and have more favorable outcomes than here? As a taxpayer, why would I choose this system?
@DAngelo136 ya but we shouldnt be regulated. We make Profits by denying FALSE claims. That is how a risk pool works. We do NOT deny legitimate claims. We rescind policies where people lie on their applications. We pay More cause our system is the best. I just visited my buddies in Canada. They live near the border, and come to the doctors here, because many will just bill the Canadian insurance, and they like the US doctors much better..I wonder why
@TheHAMMER77777 See, now I know you're FOS. Insurance companies make profits on the difference between the premiums paid in and claims paid out which are invested in the stock market. The industry reports that between 3-10% of all claims are fraudulent depending on the type of insurance. However, according to the Wikipedia entry, the insurance companies engage in the largest fraud by denying claims and delaying or losing paperwork.
@TheHAMMER77777 Secondly, as an industry with fiduciary responsibilites, the state regulates companies to maintain standards for solvency, sound business practices and to prevent irresponsible investments, like what happened to AIG, or did you forget that? If you worked in the insurance industry, a claim which I now question, you also would know that part of your training involves knowledge of federal and state regulations, just as banks and brokerages do as well.
@DAngelo136 Nonsense..we only deny where there is a legitimate reason. I am familiar with regulations, I am just against them. I am in sales, so my job is to sell policies. Even though "obamacare" would actually help my industry, I am personally against it on principle (though most in my field admittedly support it)..I am a libertarian on these issues, and want as little government as possible, like Ron Paul
@TheHAMMER77777 "We only deny where there is a legitimate reason" You mean like pre-existing conditions, whatever the hell that may be. Your guy Ron Paul is a closeted racist who's just spouting the warmed over junk that you can find in "Conscience Of A Conservative" by Barry Goldwater printed in 1964. He's pretends to be informed on the Constitution but hasn't got a clue about it. As for as "little government as possible" you want to run this country like you run a grocery store
@DAngelo136 Pre exisisting conditions MUST be excluded. What if u didn't buy auto insurance until we have a car accident? How can u run a risk pool like that? GoldWater is a hero and should have been President. Yes thats EXACTLY how i want to tun the country. Paul is a hero to many people..i dont agree with him on foreign poilcy though, but on domestic issues he's right on!
@TheHAMMER77777 even the framers had the foresight to put in the "necessary and proper" clause in the Constitution because even they knew that as time changes the legislature must have the flexibility to make laws necessary to keep up with the times.
@TheHAMMER77777 Uh, huh. Really? let me refer you to : United States v.Darby(1941) "The amendment states but a truism that all is retained which has not been surrendered.
@TheHAMMER77777 (con't)" There is nothing in the history of its adoption to suggest that it was more than declaratory of the relationship between the national and state governments as it had been established by the Constitution before the amendment or that its purpose was other than to allay fears that the new national government might seek to exercise powers not granted, and that the states might not be able to exercise fully their reserved powers....."
@TheHAMMER77777 Uh,huh. "This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, SHALL BE THE SUPREME law of the land; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the constitution or laws of any state to the contrary notwithstanding." (caps mine). Again, I know you're FOS
@TheHAMMER77777 Your arguments are getting weaker and weaker. There was a little dispute about that issue of "states rights" around 1861-1864. You might have heard about it, Ken Burns made a nice little documentary about it; The Civil War. When I went to school, I learned that my side won and your side, um, lost. They even made ol' Bob Lee's property a cemetery behind it. Don't tell me you're still fighting that war?
@DAngelo136 I am, and your lazy faggot ass isnt getting my Money..i want to keep my Money and my rights..Every Time u pay a tax u are giving up your rights to do want with It
@TheHAMMER77777 Hmm, homophobic too I see. I'm going to take a stab here, you have kids, right? I chose not to have them, so why am I paying for yours? Why should YOU get a deduction for procreating? While I may not be part of the 1% I can safely assume that my net worth is higher than yours,significantly. So in essence, I'm supporting you, your kids and your family. I served in the military, so did my father, grandfather, brother, uncles and cousins, for your effin' "rights"
@DAngelo136 i hate fags. I am against the deduction, man...i just want a simple flat tax...u were never In Any Military...all my family is in there....Military folks are very conservative. U are a broke moocher..and i dont have kids for the record
@TheHAMMER77777 Oh, so you're a liar too. Remember this gem?: "I have kids and they go to the best doctors. Even if I didn't have insurance, I'd pay Cash! Because I don't expect others to take care of my family." Nobody care what you think about gays; If you think everybody in the military is "conservative", think again. You would'nt know a conservative if William F.Buckley smacked you and announced "I'm here" with perfect diction.
@TheHAMMER77777 Again you lie. You said "and i dont have kids for the record". That contradicts ""I have kids and they go to the best doctors." Which is it? You got 'em or you don't. You calling yourself a "conservative" is intellectually dishonest. I know conservatives, talk with them, even read a couple of their books; you're no conservative. Right now, your integrity and your intellect are in serious question and one of them is going to take a fall if not both.
@DAngelo136 motherfucker..my family is none of your fucking business. I am an ultra conservative. I support Mr Santorum for Presidnet though all, including Paul bring up some good points
@TheHAMMER77777 Wow, I must have hit a nerve. Hey pal, YOU brought up family not me. Remember: "...I have kids and they go to the best doctors." which you emphatically followed with: "...Because I don't expect others to take care of my family." And then you said: "u were never In Any Military...all my family is in there...." Is this what you mean by "family values"? Hey, don't start none; won't be none.
@TheHAMMER77777 "rights" I might add, that they were denied because they had a better tan than the rest of the local population. You live in relative comfort and security because someone,somewhere in some other time paid his taxes, took the time to elect people who were forward in their views and some paid the ultimate price for you to spout off. On behalf of those who came before you and did their civic duty: "You're welcome". Jackass.
@TheHAMMER77777 "rights" I might add, that they were denied because they had a better tan than the rest of the local population. You live in relative comfort and security because someone,somewhere in some other time paid his taxes, took the time to elect people who were forward in their views and some paid the ultimate price for you to spout off. On behalf of those who came before you and did their civic duty: "You're welcome". Jackass.
@TheHAMMER77777 "rights" I might add, that they were denied because they had a better tan than the rest of the local population. You live in relative comfort and security because someone,somewhere in some other time paid his taxes, took the time to elect people who were forward in their views and some paid the ultimate price for you to spout off. On behalf of those who came before you and did their civic duty: "You're welcome". Jackass.
@TheHAMMER77777 "rights" I might add, that they were denied because they had a better tan than the rest of the local population. You live in relative comfort and security because someone,somewhere in some other time paid his taxes, took the time to elect people who were forward in their views and some paid the ultimate price for you to spout off. On behalf of those who came before you and did their civic duty: "You're welcome". Jackass.
@TheHAMMER77777 In other words, it has no real meaning other than to allay those opponents of the passage of the Constitution. It was a political move.
@TheHAMMER77777 Getting personal now, I see. So while you can't use logic, reasoning or history, you have to resort to the tool of the adolescent. SMH, the least you could do for the free education I've given you is to say "thank you" and be on your way.
@TheHAMMER77777 Here is the complete citation: United States v.Darby 312 U.S. 100, 124 (1941). Like Ron Paul, you talk a good game about the Constitution but never look up the court cases. He never quotes from "The Federalist Papers" or the controlling federal court cases on those controversies. Why? Because, it won't back up his skewered view of the Constitution. I found that case in 10 minutes, why can't he? Why can't you?
@TheHAMMER77777 Again with the profanity. Can't compete intellectually, so like a spent round, you just peter out. Pathetic. FYI, I'm a taxpayer, an entrepreneur, autodidact and gainfully employed. You see, my foul mouthed friend, a society is only as strong as it's weakest link. As Jesus said: ""But when you give a banquet, invite the poor, the crippled, the lame, the blind, and you will be blessed." (Luke 14:13)
@DAngelo136 if u give people things u encourage dependency, dumbass. I dont want handouts..i want the govt to leave me alone communist..move to France
@TheHAMMER77777 Do you pay for private security? Do you travel on private roads? Do you have a personal fire department? Guess what? You ARE expecting other to take care of your family. Police and fire protection, infrastructure and road maintenance are all part of the commons of which we all pay for. With money issued and backed by the...the...say it with me...government. One more thing, your industry is regulated by a government agency, I wonder why?
@TheHAMMER77777 What about American business? More companies are dropping coverages because they simply can't afford the premiums even at group rates. It comes down to this; do you believe that health is a privilege or a right? As an individual, what leads you to believe that you are not interdependent on others? What leads you to believe that you don't live in a quasi-socialist state already in which you thrive and prosper? Last question: If the private sector is such a better
@TheHAMMER77777 Congress has universal health care, veterans, the poor and the elderly. Why not expand the coverage to all Americans and expand the pool and reap the benefits of lower costs, better preventave care and lower drug costs? Do you see any other country emulating the American model of health care? No. That should tell you something.
@TheHAMMER77777 Nobody's asking you to take care of anyone. Why do object to doing what you're already doing and paying more for the same thing you could get like other industrialized countries? You already pay for the millionaires in Congress' health care as well as their families. Why can't you have the same thing that they have? And they work for YOU. Afraid of being called a "communist"?
The initial premise in this video is a little bit off... "How many people should have access to health care?" Everybody does, however a large portion of those 47 million without health insurance are able to afford it but choose to put other things before paying for insurance each month.
@ FatTony726: Health care is not like Starbucks or grocery chains...it is NOT a market good...the reason it should NOT be for-profit is because you never know when you will need to access the health care system...what if somebody is in a car accident through no fault of their own? What if they are uninsured or underinsured? Those costs are then passed onto people who have insurance and/or are healthy, which jacks up their monthly premiums. It is an inefficient and unfair system.
@ilovemycat00 It is a market good..someone has to pay for the research that goes into it and the providers..this is done (like everything else like inventing the computer, or car) by the private market with a desire to make A Profit...nothing wrong with this
I like the idea of health care for all. The only problem is, really how does it get paid for? Based on the video some of the taxes would come from companies and top wage earners. These people got to the top by being "good" business people. Not to say what they do is good or moral it's how one plays the game. So the thought that they would be paying in without it effecting the general public is very naive. The trickle down theory. We will always end up paying more. Not to say how the system is n
@FatTony726 <-- Believe me, they have this worked into the system in the VA care and it's a problem easily solved. HEALTH CARE is the ONLY THING we ever BUY IN America that we agree to with NO CLUE what they are going to charge us until it's too late. IS THIS NOT NUTS? Look up "NO Insurance MRI". The "out of pocket" pmts. are often the total value of the procedure, so that Helath Ins. Pmts to them are PURE PROFIT. Now THAT is a wrong incentive.
@coolbreezed You're a fucking moron if you don't believe in Universal health care for all. All the evidence clearly state that UHC would be better then the current system.
Americans have been lied to. I compiled a blog titled "Corporate Executives Deny 57 Million Americans Healthcare - by Bill Woollam" Just Google that.
The US health care system is one of the worst in the world and has been compromised by the US Administration, the Health Insurance and Management Offices, and American Medical Assoc.
Canada, Britain, France and Cuba have hassle free, debt-free, comprehensive, universal health plans where every citizen receives health care with no added costs
V.A. Hospital benefits are great!! I was young, dumb and so entered the military when I was 20. Just because I did that, I received LIFETIME SINGLE PAYER healthcare (and dental) for 4 years of being taken care of by the Army and trained on heavy equipment ops! So tell me again how single payer is bad??? I have perfect health and teeth because of it and oh yeah, when I am old, I can live in a VA nursing home plus be buried for FREE in a National Cemetery of my choosing with a 21 gun salute.
@p4h10oso what its bad you entered the military?!?!?!?! And shut ups those benifits are only for military members and vets we would we want civilians to have that?
Note to all collectivist commentating. You all can start? your own communal living system right here in the US! There are enough you big government liberal no experience morons both rich and poor. So why not just do? it? What are you waiting for? Hollywood liberals, law school liberals, professors, and politicians. You can do it here in the United States and have community healthcare! Just don't put a gun? to MY head and FORCE me into it. I will sit back to see just how well it works....
This must be the health care of America NOW! We are the only industrialized country in the WORLD that doesn't provide universal insurance for everybody! Why isn't our government doing this NOW! D*** YOU GREEDY INSURANCE COMPANIES!
@TheHAMMER77777 Okay, let's rip up the pavement on the street you live on, tell the fire station that would come when your house is burning, and the police who'd come after you are robbed that you don't want this "communist shit". Dude! THEY WILL COLLECT YOUR TAX dollars either way, so would you like SOMETHING for this money, or are you content to just GIVE it away for nothing in return?
There is no fundamental right to healthcare. In fact, the United States doesn't provide it's citizens with any affirmative rights (stuff the government does for you), it just provides it's citizens w/ negative right (stuff the government can't do to you).
I think we should keep it this way. No to single payer
@coolbreezed Just wait until you get sick and face a $500,000 bill from the hospital that your private, for-profit health insurance company will not pay...do me another favor, do not call the police or fire departments or utilize K-12 public schools or universities and colleges...all entities that are at least in part, funded by taxpayers.
@ilovemycat00 If I get sick I will not selfishly expect my neighbors to pay for my individual healthcare.Thats the difference between a responsible person and a greedy leach.
Your 2nd argument is flawed because its basic premise is that if I approve of a town public police force then I must approve of any and every industry being nationalized by the fed. gov (like w/ single payer). Its ridiculous to compare town police, fire, etc. w/ a massive fed. gov. bureaucratic single payer nightmare.
@coolbreezed yeah lets make sure insurance companies can kick people off the rolls because they are sick so when you get sick dont complain when your insurance company shows you the door
@jdprice455 Every time I argue against single payer, some leftist says not to come to him when my evil "for profit" insurance company rejects me for no reason. Is this your only argument? LOL!
How about I promise not to call you when my evil insurance company denies me coverage and you promise that I will never have to pay for anyone else's free gov. healthcare? But you can't do that because single payer only works when gov. forces people to pay for others. I'm not forcing you to do anything.
@jdprice455 Now that I answered you, can I predict your next argument? Let me guess ... your rebuttal is right from the Michael Moore playbook? You will either ask whether I'm a christian and then tell that I'm a hypocrite because I don't support your left wing policies. Or you will try to convince me that because I don't support a massive federal gov. bureaucracy controlling my healthcare then I somehow don't support locally controlled police, fire, and public schools. Am I right? LOL.
Funny how even among the republicans single payer polls very well why do you think denmark germany and canada are eating our lunch when it comes to a good business climate free market solutions have failed if the free market was so good I wouldnt be on here advocating for single payer now would I, you hate obamacare what about mitt romney care after all its more a conservative version of health care reform haha i just love hypocrites on the right on this issue
@jdprice455 Your response is hard to read given your childlike grammar but I'll try. First of all, you are incorrect in stating that free market solutions failed as they have not all been tried yet. Additionally, I am familiar w/ no poll indicating that conservatives overwhelmingly, or even by a majority, support single payer. Also, Canada, Denmark, and Germany are not "eating or lunch". Further this video is in response to single payer and not obamacare so any reference to it is irrelevant.
@coolbreezed They wont work at all especially if they benefit the insurance companies not the consumer thats an excuse for the other side to say let them run free and wild and do whatever they want without any consequences of their actions for God sake they rip off military families charging them outrage premiums even before Obamacare was ever drafted now they use that law by lying and saying inaccurate things.
@jdprice455 Are you a child? The reason I ask is because your grammar is absolutely atrocious. Your response is a rambling run-on sentence. Please get back to me when you are able to communicate like an educated adult.
@coolbreezed Ok then why when republicans had the gavel back from 2003-2006 where was the free market solutions then, Obama-care may not be perfect but at least its a start, your side has barked about health care reform but did NOTHING to enact it, look at them now they dont want to fix the problems with the bill its all about repeal and replace but as usual your side has no replace other than going back to the way it was. free reign no accountability. typical right wing way of doing nothing
@jdprice455 Your grammar is horrible, however I will attempt to address your point.
First of all, you wrongfully assume that because I don't like singe payer I then agree with every GOP talking point. Only partisan idiots have "sides". For instance, when GOP had the majority they passed a large entitlement plan called Medicare D. I don't agree with that bill. Conversely, I don't disagree all parts of Obamacare, just the parts that harms the economy and invades upon our individual liberty.
@coolbreezed Btw its common for your side to think I will attack your religion not knowing im christian as well i guess your next lil joke will be ooo im a big govt leftist heard it all before come up with something better please you conservatives bore me with cheap comebacks yawnnn
@jdprice455 The reason why that is common is because left wingers have been unsuccessfully trying to use the religion/hypocrite argument for years. I was simply rebutting it before you could bring it up. Also, if you support single payer then by definition you support big gov. because it is impossible to implement single payer w/o drastically increasing the size of gov. As for your politics, folks who want single payer generally share other left wing views so. Do you not share those views?
@coolbreezed Why not have one system where everybody pays in from the moment of life until the day you die it would be a better business climate if we had one even the right wing chamber of commerce has had support for a single payer, yes it would mean the end of private insurance companies but I dont care because they dont provide any good services the moment you get sick they drop you because they cant make money off a sick person.
It's so easy to spend other peoples' money. If you really want to save costs in the healthcare system, the only way to effectively do that is to flatten out the beaurocratic structure of the insurance system. Most medical providers attribute approx. 30% of their overhead to dealing with that beaurocracy. If that were eliminated, we would not have a crisis. By eliminating all third party payers including medicare and moving to a private pay system you would see huge savings.
@dlacr ... with the 30% savings on the supply side of healthcare services, there is immediate savings. If citizens were allowed to contribute in Pre-tax dollars into a medical savings account, their purchasing power is increased by approx 30% as well... thus effectively giving a huge discount on healthcare on the consumer side. Now since every person can shop for the best value, you will see healthcare providers become increasingly competitive for your business.
@dlacr "It's so easy to spend other peoples' money. "
This is ultimately the problem with trying to reason with people who support socialism. Far too many people in this country feel entitled to free things, even if it ends up being harmful the economy, and in turn themselves. The government can not run things efficiently, yet many people want socialized medicine?
What is soooo disturbing is that the USA lives as though there are no alternatives to the pathetic HC USA system. we've tried everything! but Congress uses public HC Insurance for life, good for them, not for the public?
@LegacyMicro It works in all of Europe and most of Asia. Botswana has a higher rate of successful immunizations than the United States, and France is consistently rated as having the best healthcare in the world - and their system is based off a series of government "public options" to supplement the private industry.
@xleftoutindigox Botswana has a population of < 2 million. USA=+300 million. As of 2008 the life expectancy at birth in Botswana = 54 years.(I'd be almost dead.) USA=78 years. Average household income in Botswana=$5,840 (I made more than that when I was a part-time clerk at 7-Eleven in the eighties.)USA=+$50,000. Unemployment Botswana=40% USA=10%. According to you single payer will equal 40% unemployment, <$6000 annual income, and life will end at 54. I enjoy the comfort of MY heath care plan.
@LegacyMicro I'd love to know where you heard that. Was it from Health and Human Services and Health Ministry official statements from the United States and Botswana? Or was it from the public notifications from the United Nation's World Health Organization? Both specifically state that Botswana has a better healthcare system than the United States - and by "better system", I mean one of payment. The treatment itself is the virtually same in most industrialized countries.
Everyone of these people have "access" to healthcare!! Nobody is making it illegal for then to prioritize healthcare as the most important expense in their lives.. Single payer is the worst thing that could ever happen to this nation. Nothing "free" is treated as valuable..
@JMBare It's not "free", its just as paid for as our private insurance now, just instead of paying that private insurer the premium, you pay the Medicare for All program a tax. You still pay money either way; the care doesn't change at all, only the person who pays your bills.
Where is the money coming from to pay for this single payer socialized medicine. There are more people then fire departments. This pie chart is BS. Yea tax tax tax and tax some more. What about the people who chose NOT to have health coverage as their god given right to do, they are now being forced to buy it and under the US Constitution the US Gov can not force to people to make purchases such as health care. Lets just throw out the Constitution and wrap ourselves around Europe's FAILED model.
Excellent ViD. My only complaint is that chiropractic services are included. Chiropractic treatment is a fraud. No one should be forced to pay for it as part of the nation's healthcare plan. Britain is on the way to discrediting it as a recent libel case brought up the fraudulent, non scientific nature of it. If people want to obtain chiropractic, non injury massage and untested acupunture, then they can pay for that themselves. We will all have much more money with a single payer system.
If the health care system is 37th in quality and super expensive when the government pays for 60% then what difference is another 40% FROM THE GOVERNMENT: lower quality and further expense is a logical extension. SECONDLY: I heard the words "efficient administration" whilst staring at a pie chart with 5 new "tax slices", each slice requiring it's own legally liable bureaucracies to collect and one more to pull it together and many more to audit. usahealthcarereformdiscussion.blogspot.com
Dr. Donald Berwick, the man who will run your health care: "I cannot believe that the individual health care consumer can enforce through choice the proper configurations of a system as massive and complex as health care. That is for leaders to do. ... About 8% of GDP is plenty for 'best known' care. ... A progressive policy regime will control and rationalize financing—control supply."
I´m proud of being European ! I will never (EVER ! ) have to fear if I will or will not be able to pay my medical bills ! I will never be confronted with the doctor have to think in a profit perspective of my illness... You are afraid of socialist medicine ? Huuu, watch out with the comunists, they are coming for you ...
One of the best explanations on "the health care question."
If this 4 minute, 20 second production had a million bucks behind it to support repeated showings on television and on the web, real medicare for all would be achieved. Thanks for the superb work.
Your forgeting that most of 47 million are young people who choose not to have insurance because they don't see the point in paying something that they will probably never need.
don't force me to pay for an obese, sedentary,smoker's diabetic's coronary bypass and foot amputation. That is his/her responsibility since they had a lifetime to get into their predicament. My money won't pull them back to good health; it will only increase quantity of life and does nothing for quality of life if they make some better (informed) choices.
The sad thing is that eventually these commies will have their way as slowly make more and more americans dependant on central gov't. It will end the land of oppotunity and the rest of the world will wonder what happened when your dependant gav't ran out of hand outs. that's what its about.
@joemoya no...you're stupid. Sorry for giving a less thorough explanation but really this argument is tired. The statistics favor socialized healthcare and to correct you is just a waste of time
-America is ranked 37 in healthcare, yet spends the most
-Virtually EVERY other industrial nation runs some form of socialized plan, including all the top spots
-59% of american physicians want a single payer system (pulled from "Annals of Internal Medicine2008")
everybody pays taxes so everybody pays for healthcare, and im sure youd like single payer if you got sick, its more efficient and dosnt go away when you need it most.
Everybody pays taxes but some will run up bigger bills than what they pay in. These are the folks who want single payer.
I'm cool with the idea of helping someone who is too poor to pay for their medical expenses. But that's quite apart from being raided by people who can pay but don't want to pay for their own bills.
Instead they want to offload their bill onto some sucker down the line. That's BS.
Anthem health is asking for a 39% increase in health premiums in California. Lets do nothing and see how long this can go on. I say let one state (California SB 810) start single payer and see how it goes.
@Spytheweb Unlikely that California will try anything close to single payer given their current financial insolvency.
Here's the problem with single payer, once you give an entitlement there it is nearly impossible to take it away, even if its in the countries best interest. Market reforms and promoting individual responsibility is more favorable to penalizing hard working responsible citizens with higher taxes and worse HC for the irresponsibility of folks who choose not to purchase insurance.
@Spytheweb California could become the next Saskatchewan! Or it could be Colorado which also has a single payer bill currently languishing in the Legislature.
@Spytheweb One State? Maine has had it for the last 6 years and it is totally broke. It failed and went down like a flaming arrow. I think people just need to start looking around and see how it HAS FAILED all over the planet regardless of some fancy smooth talking Youtube video. Yeah they have it in Maine and it is broke and needs the Gov to bail it out. I don't care what the left argument is, socialized medicine is NOT the answer and will bankrupt this country even faster then it is already.
@SendinK9 Maine, does not have a single payer system,let alone for years it just became legal for a state to start a single payer system under Obamacare (thanks to Kucinich). As for failing all over the planet, England, Canada, Australia,Taiwan, & to Medicare.
@Fuctmentality Are your for real?! First off in Maine it is called the Dirigo Choice health plan bill which was implemented in 2001, which began providing coverage in January 2005 so yes it is YEARS and is now broke. Democratic Governor John Baldacci signed the plan into law with a bevy of familiar promises. By 2009, it would cover all of Maine's approximately 128,000 uninsured citizens. System-wide controls on hospital and physician costs would hold down insurance premiums. CONT>
@Fuctmentality There would be no tax increases. The program was going to provide insurance for everyone and save businesses and patients money at the same time. After five years, fiscal realities as brutal as the waves that crash along Maine's famous coastline have hit the insurance plan. The system that was supposed to save money has cost taxpayers $155 million and is still rising. CONT>
@Fuctmentality As for Canada, I live in Washington State and I can look out my back window at Victoria BC, I listen to thier radio station every day at work for the last 18 years 100.3 the Q and I know everything that goes on over there including talking to my Canadian friends on Ham radio and I know for a fact it is broke and also limits coverage. Last month the radio station held a donation drive to help a local man pay for his cancer treatments which , CONT>
@Fuctmentality were not covered under the Provençal health care coverage. Not only that the Doctors are all underpaid so the quality of care is low, nurses strikes, doctor strikes and hospitals closing due to lack of funding all have been broadcasted on thier news over the years and recently. I think it is you who needs to start doing his homework and if you live in Maine I can honestly say you don't even know what is going on in your own State nor less Canada. CONT>
@Fuctmentality Only the extremely naive liberals fell for this BS Obamacare in the first place. It was railroaded threw in back room deals and swindles against 75% of the American people who were against it not to mention it violates the US Constitution. After Nov the repeal actions will start taking place.
@SendinK9 I have a rule, if it takes someone more than 2 replies to respond to one comment that person is an idiot, & it's most likely a waste of time reading them. Good day sir.
@Fuctmentality Well unfortunately I cant explain all the facts in one or two lines, I also hate to see people wallow around the blogs fact-less so consider it my pleasure in helping you avoid that problem any further however, it would require some reading on your part so maybe your right, its a waste of time.
When you go to the dmv, why should you wait in line, you're rich why can't you go to the head of the line? Because you have money does not mean you are better or have more rights than anyone else. Why is it that other countries get it right and America can't. This is not only about people this is about business and the economy. Other countries that have universal health have a healthier and more productive work force and companies operate with lower overhead.
If I am willing to pay more to a doctor for treatment then why should I have to wait behind those who pay less?
That's what I don't get about single payer.
Single payer puts people who work hard and make the right lifestyle and financial decisions throughout their lives on the same level as those who do not.
If we are going to have any meaningful healthcare reform in the U.S. it has to start with protections of a person's ability to contract individually with their HC provider.
@coolbreezed i agree with the last part of what you said. If they reformed, I'm sure there will still be by contract HC but, it will probably be very comprehensive and very costly to you single they won't be collecting as many premiums. I am still on the fence about all this. I understand the problems on boths sides. On one side we have unregulated psychopaths and on the other we have sociopaths who are friends with the psychopaths and guess what...we don't win...so far, that's what I gather. ;)
@Poonard Not following. I'm interested in you point of view and, of course, rebutting it if I disagree, so please explain what you mean by the psychopaths and sociopaths you are talking about.
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@TheHAMMER77777 "rights" I might add, that they were denied because they had a better tan than the rest of the local population. You live in relative comfort and security because someone,somewhere in some other time paid his taxes, took the time to elect people who were forward in their views and some paid the ultimate price for you to spout off. On behalf of those who came before you and did their civic duty: "You're welcome". Jackass.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
What we have now SUCKS. It is called corporatism. Insurance companies are a layer of bureaucracy that gets between the patient and the doctor. Companies are coerced into providing health insurance. Insurance is not necessary, except for catastrophic insurance, like you have for large investments like your house. Legalize freedom in healthcare and costs will plummet. It is also a misconception that the costs are high due to the insurance company profits and pay, that is a fallacy.
DCUPtoejuice 3 months ago
@DCUPtoejuice Don't want a 3rd party? Pay Cash. Merry Christmas
TheHAMMER77777 1 month ago
Well, at least your honest about how much it would cost through taxes. Payroll tax is double taxation though, employers will simply reduce wages or reduce hiring and invest in capital. If health care is not rationed by a price system, it will be rationed through waiting lists, since gov cannot possibly meet the deman for health care since there is such a large demand. There has to be some sort of cost control, and the type government has is reducing the type of medicine and treatments offered.
groam6666 3 months ago
(CBS)HEALTHCARE Lobbyists' Rise To Power: The pharma industry put its army of lobbyists into overdrive as Congress tried to complete a health care reform bill. 3,000 registered health care lobbyists on Capitol Hill-that's 6 for every single Congressman. And in many cases, those lobbyists are former members of Congress who shaped laws that benefited the industry they joined.This "revolving door" is perfectly legal, CBS News. To fight 2009 health reform *4,525 lobbyists,8 for each Congressman.
BilkedToTheBrink 3 months ago
@BilkedToTheBrink dude..the cops are paid by local government..I don't mind states and local governments paving roads, etc. I don't want the feds involved. The 10th Ammendment states that any rights not enumerated in the Constitution belong o the states and the people. I certainly don't want government run or even subsidized (like Obamacare-i Know its private but still subsidized) healthcare..it should be purely market-based
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
(CBS)HEALTHCARE Lobbyists' Rise To Power: The pharma industry put its army of lobbyists into overdrive as Congress tried to complete a health care reform bill. 3,000 registered health care lobbyists on Capitol Hill-that's 6 for every single Congressman. And in many cases, those lobbyists are former members of Congress who shaped laws that benefited the industry they joined.This "revolving door" is perfectly legal, CBS News. To fight 2009 health reform *4,525 lobbyists,8 for each Congressman.
BilkedToTheBrink 3 months ago
GOOD..if people want it they can buy it...not my problem
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
We need free health care
4lifemrobama 4 months ago
@4lifemrobama Free? LOL, Well, atleast the first dumbass posted a comment.
You'll pay for this just like social security, federal and state income tax. It'll come right out of your small little check, making it smaller.
Oh, and for all of those welfare babies that the poor are pumping out, You'll be paying for them. And so will I. An even better reason for women to go out, have some fun, and end up on the tax payers back even MORE!
They'll get welfare, HUD housing, and healthcare, Free.
AzBirdDog 3 months ago
@AzBirdDog ya end the nanny state
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
@AzBirdDog there is no free...good point
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
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@4lifemrobama No such thing as free
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
lol, ya, it's just like how we pay for teachers and police, that goes oh so well, while were laying off teachers and cops by the thousands and slashing funding for both, don't think the government will do the same to healthcare when they need room in the budget? think again
383man 4 months ago
I am Canadian, and I support your drive for single-payer health care. You guys south of the border are out to lunch. If you don't choose universal health care for all, you will go bankrupt, and be left behind.
shmiggen 4 months ago
@shmiggen thats why many of u come here to the US for care..yep, makes sense
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
@TheHAMMER77777 many? not really. less than a hundred I'd wager.
shmiggen 3 months ago
@shmiggen I have many friends in Toronto that come to Buffalo cause they don't like waiting for the doctor's appointments there. I have a lot of family in Toronto too..great city, by the way...and your view Of Niagara Falls is much better
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
@TheHAMMER77777 there are some who go to the states for speed of access, but in general, the US system is terrible in comparison to Canada's. Every American is one chronic illness away from bankruptcy. That condition doesn't exist in Canada, and wait-lists are not that long - three months tops.
shmiggen 3 months ago
@shmiggen No, not every American is one illness from bankruptcy. I have excellent insurance, because that is what I chose to buy for my family, in a free market. People can choose to buy or not buy a product In Capitalism..thats how a free market works. Well, maybe where u are waiting lists aren't long, but again, I have friends in Toronto who disagree...and I wouldn't Tell you guys how to run your healthcare system..that's your business...similarly this is ours and we like it as is
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
@TheHAMMER77777 That's true. I was wrong to say that every American is a chronic illness away from pauperism. It's more like around two-thirds of the total US population, or about 200 million people. So you are correct. That is your way of life and you are happy with it. In Canada, we could not tolerate having two-thirds of our fellow men and women being so close to beggary. But like you say, it is simply two different systems.
shmiggen 3 months ago
@shmiggen No not true. 75% of us have private insurance. The rest would never be denied care in an emergency anyway. And bankruptcy isnt the worst thing anyway..people use it as a scam...they wipe out most or all of your debts and it only stays on your credit report For 7-10 Years..but anyway, i like our system
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
@TheHAMMER77777 So let me get this straight, you are ok to bargain for a third party payer in between you and your health care provider, rather than just eliminate him and bargain for the health care provider? The third party, then determines what they will or won't pay for based on cost but you object to the alternative because of waiting time? This makes sense to you?
DAngelo136 1 month ago
@DAngelo136 not what I Said at all...private insurance is a product u one can buy or not..if u dont want a third party? Pay Cash...its not my business to take care of other's health, nor should anyone take care of mine. Merry Christmas
TheHAMMER77777 1 month ago
@TheHAMMER77777 What do you think private insurance is? It's a third party."Pay cash" you say? Then there would be no need for private insurance. That's the problem, a growing number of Americans can't afford health care and companies are finding it hard to find affordable packages for employees. If it's fine to pay into a private pool for insurance, wouldn't it follow that a larger pool (citizens) would be less expensive per participant?
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 u can choose to buy private insurance, or not. It is not fine for the government to be involved with health insurance....I don't want to subsidize it in any fashion. I don't think members of congress should get health insurance either. People (or their PRIVATE employers) should buy their own insurance, if they desire to.
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 That's the major problem, a growing number of Americans are NOT buying insurance. Companies are finding the premiums more expensive than ever and American companies are dropping coverages. Now we pay more for health care as a share of GDP and have lower percentage of positive outcomes than countries with UHC. Why stay with a system that costs more and gives worse results?
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 GOOD let them not buy insurance...not my problem. If someone wants a product, they can buy it or not buy it. I do not want to subsidize anything. I don't care what the other countries do. I want to even repeal Obamacare. Let people do things for themselves. I Say no to nanny state and socialism
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 It is your and my problem; when uninsured people seek treatment, it's usually in the emergency room and the problem is acute. What about children? the elderly? the poor? What about you? Can you say for sure what your economic status will be a year from now? If you or your loved one contracted a chronic disease, how long do you think you can afford to pay for it? Do you trust your insurance carrier to do the right thing or will they find a way not to pay?
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 I have the best insurance and have never had any problem with them. I think health is a privledge AND NOT A RIGHT. the private sector gave us the car, plane, cell phone, and most of the things you're using now. The government gave me the post office. I do not want to pay through government for anyone's health care. If i CHOOSE to buy private insurance that's up to me
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 You have the best insurance? So you hope. Never had a problem? Yet. Health is a privilege? I take it that you don't have children and you are presently healthy. You sound like you are young-God bless you, because that can and will change. You don't have any clue how quickly that can change. Look around you, beside the post office, the water you drink, the clean air you breathe, the safety and freedom you possess is all government provided.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 including this medium you now proclaim your "independence". What about that great insurance company you purchased that policy from? Up until a few months ago, they had the "freedom" to deny that coverage to you as they saw fit even though you paid money for that policy. Not YOUR choice, THEIRS. My friend, you have taken the blue pill and have been asleep under the illusion of a freedom you don't have. You have no idea how vulnerable you are. Sweet dreams.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 I have kids and they go to the best doctors. Even if I didn't have insurance, I'd pay Cash! Because I don't expect others to take care of my family. I work in insurance. Recissions only take place in individual (not group) policies, and ONLY IF SOMEONE LIED ON THEIR APPLICATION! Frankly they deserved it. Companies should be allowed to do that
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 You work in insurance. That explains a lot. Ok here's my question to you. If an insurance company makes a profit by holding down costs which means denying claims, isn't that a conflict of interest? Secondly, if the present system "works" then how do you explain the fact that other countries with single-payer/universal health care spend less per capita, as a share of GDP and have more favorable outcomes than here? As a taxpayer, why would I choose this system?
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 ya but we shouldnt be regulated. We make Profits by denying FALSE claims. That is how a risk pool works. We do NOT deny legitimate claims. We rescind policies where people lie on their applications. We pay More cause our system is the best. I just visited my buddies in Canada. They live near the border, and come to the doctors here, because many will just bill the Canadian insurance, and they like the US doctors much better..I wonder why
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 See, now I know you're FOS. Insurance companies make profits on the difference between the premiums paid in and claims paid out which are invested in the stock market. The industry reports that between 3-10% of all claims are fraudulent depending on the type of insurance. However, according to the Wikipedia entry, the insurance companies engage in the largest fraud by denying claims and delaying or losing paperwork.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 Secondly, as an industry with fiduciary responsibilites, the state regulates companies to maintain standards for solvency, sound business practices and to prevent irresponsible investments, like what happened to AIG, or did you forget that? If you worked in the insurance industry, a claim which I now question, you also would know that part of your training involves knowledge of federal and state regulations, just as banks and brokerages do as well.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 Nonsense..we only deny where there is a legitimate reason. I am familiar with regulations, I am just against them. I am in sales, so my job is to sell policies. Even though "obamacare" would actually help my industry, I am personally against it on principle (though most in my field admittedly support it)..I am a libertarian on these issues, and want as little government as possible, like Ron Paul
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 "We only deny where there is a legitimate reason" You mean like pre-existing conditions, whatever the hell that may be. Your guy Ron Paul is a closeted racist who's just spouting the warmed over junk that you can find in "Conscience Of A Conservative" by Barry Goldwater printed in 1964. He's pretends to be informed on the Constitution but hasn't got a clue about it. As for as "little government as possible" you want to run this country like you run a grocery store
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 Pre exisisting conditions MUST be excluded. What if u didn't buy auto insurance until we have a car accident? How can u run a risk pool like that? GoldWater is a hero and should have been President. Yes thats EXACTLY how i want to tun the country. Paul is a hero to many people..i dont agree with him on foreign poilcy though, but on domestic issues he's right on!
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 even the framers had the foresight to put in the "necessary and proper" clause in the Constitution because even they knew that as time changes the legislature must have the flexibility to make laws necessary to keep up with the times.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 no we must uphold the 10th ammendment..get rid of medicare and ss..they violate my rights
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 Uh, huh. Really? let me refer you to : United States v.Darby(1941) "The amendment states but a truism that all is retained which has not been surrendered.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 (con't)" There is nothing in the history of its adoption to suggest that it was more than declaratory of the relationship between the national and state governments as it had been established by the Constitution before the amendment or that its purpose was other than to allay fears that the new national government might seek to exercise powers not granted, and that the states might not be able to exercise fully their reserved powers....."
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 FUCK ALL THAT..STATES RIGHTS BABY....end the nanny state
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 Uh,huh. "This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, SHALL BE THE SUPREME law of the land; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the constitution or laws of any state to the contrary notwithstanding." (caps mine). Again, I know you're FOS
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 Your arguments are getting weaker and weaker. There was a little dispute about that issue of "states rights" around 1861-1864. You might have heard about it, Ken Burns made a nice little documentary about it; The Civil War. When I went to school, I learned that my side won and your side, um, lost. They even made ol' Bob Lee's property a cemetery behind it. Don't tell me you're still fighting that war?
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 I am, and your lazy faggot ass isnt getting my Money..i want to keep my Money and my rights..Every Time u pay a tax u are giving up your rights to do want with It
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 Hmm, homophobic too I see. I'm going to take a stab here, you have kids, right? I chose not to have them, so why am I paying for yours? Why should YOU get a deduction for procreating? While I may not be part of the 1% I can safely assume that my net worth is higher than yours,significantly. So in essence, I'm supporting you, your kids and your family. I served in the military, so did my father, grandfather, brother, uncles and cousins, for your effin' "rights"
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 i hate fags. I am against the deduction, man...i just want a simple flat tax...u were never In Any Military...all my family is in there....Military folks are very conservative. U are a broke moocher..and i dont have kids for the record
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 Oh, so you're a liar too. Remember this gem?: "I have kids and they go to the best doctors. Even if I didn't have insurance, I'd pay Cash! Because I don't expect others to take care of my family." Nobody care what you think about gays; If you think everybody in the military is "conservative", think again. You would'nt know a conservative if William F.Buckley smacked you and announced "I'm here" with perfect diction.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 I do but theyre no longer dependents i meant..theyre adults, dumbass. I Know conservatives..i am one
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 Again you lie. You said "and i dont have kids for the record". That contradicts ""I have kids and they go to the best doctors." Which is it? You got 'em or you don't. You calling yourself a "conservative" is intellectually dishonest. I know conservatives, talk with them, even read a couple of their books; you're no conservative. Right now, your integrity and your intellect are in serious question and one of them is going to take a fall if not both.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 motherfucker..my family is none of your fucking business. I am an ultra conservative. I support Mr Santorum for Presidnet though all, including Paul bring up some good points
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
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@TheHAMMER77777 Wow, I must have hit a nerve. Hey pal, YOU brought up family not me. Remember: "...I have kids and they go to the best doctors." which you emphatically followed with: "...Because I don't expect others to take care of my family." And then you said: "u were never In Any Military...all my family is in there...." Is this what you mean by "family values"? Hey, don't start none; won't be none.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 "rights" I might add, that they were denied because they had a better tan than the rest of the local population. You live in relative comfort and security because someone,somewhere in some other time paid his taxes, took the time to elect people who were forward in their views and some paid the ultimate price for you to spout off. On behalf of those who came before you and did their civic duty: "You're welcome". Jackass.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
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@TheHAMMER77777 "rights" I might add, that they were denied because they had a better tan than the rest of the local population. You live in relative comfort and security because someone,somewhere in some other time paid his taxes, took the time to elect people who were forward in their views and some paid the ultimate price for you to spout off. On behalf of those who came before you and did their civic duty: "You're welcome". Jackass.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
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@TheHAMMER77777 "rights" I might add, that they were denied because they had a better tan than the rest of the local population. You live in relative comfort and security because someone,somewhere in some other time paid his taxes, took the time to elect people who were forward in their views and some paid the ultimate price for you to spout off. On behalf of those who came before you and did their civic duty: "You're welcome". Jackass.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
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@TheHAMMER77777 "rights" I might add, that they were denied because they had a better tan than the rest of the local population. You live in relative comfort and security because someone,somewhere in some other time paid his taxes, took the time to elect people who were forward in their views and some paid the ultimate price for you to spout off. On behalf of those who came before you and did their civic duty: "You're welcome". Jackass.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 In other words, it has no real meaning other than to allay those opponents of the passage of the Constitution. It was a political move.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 fuck that shit...states rights baby..go fuck yourself
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 Getting personal now, I see. So while you can't use logic, reasoning or history, you have to resort to the tool of the adolescent. SMH, the least you could do for the free education I've given you is to say "thank you" and be on your way.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 Here is the complete citation: United States v.Darby 312 U.S. 100, 124 (1941). Like Ron Paul, you talk a good game about the Constitution but never look up the court cases. He never quotes from "The Federalist Papers" or the controlling federal court cases on those controversies. Why? Because, it won't back up his skewered view of the Constitution. I found that case in 10 minutes, why can't he? Why can't you?
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 go fuck off lazy communist..u just want free shit..get a job, and stop depending on me to pay for you...asshole
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 Again with the profanity. Can't compete intellectually, so like a spent round, you just peter out. Pathetic. FYI, I'm a taxpayer, an entrepreneur, autodidact and gainfully employed. You see, my foul mouthed friend, a society is only as strong as it's weakest link. As Jesus said: ""But when you give a banquet, invite the poor, the crippled, the lame, the blind, and you will be blessed." (Luke 14:13)
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@DAngelo136 if u give people things u encourage dependency, dumbass. I dont want handouts..i want the govt to leave me alone communist..move to France
TheHAMMER77777 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 Do you pay for private security? Do you travel on private roads? Do you have a personal fire department? Guess what? You ARE expecting other to take care of your family. Police and fire protection, infrastructure and road maintenance are all part of the commons of which we all pay for. With money issued and backed by the...the...say it with me...government. One more thing, your industry is regulated by a government agency, I wonder why?
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 What about American business? More companies are dropping coverages because they simply can't afford the premiums even at group rates. It comes down to this; do you believe that health is a privilege or a right? As an individual, what leads you to believe that you are not interdependent on others? What leads you to believe that you don't live in a quasi-socialist state already in which you thrive and prosper? Last question: If the private sector is such a better
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 choice, why is it operating so badly and why would any rationally self interested person choose to continue to use it?
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 Congress has universal health care, veterans, the poor and the elderly. Why not expand the coverage to all Americans and expand the pool and reap the benefits of lower costs, better preventave care and lower drug costs? Do you see any other country emulating the American model of health care? No. That should tell you something.
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
@TheHAMMER77777 Nobody's asking you to take care of anyone. Why do object to doing what you're already doing and paying more for the same thing you could get like other industrialized countries? You already pay for the millionaires in Congress' health care as well as their families. Why can't you have the same thing that they have? And they work for YOU. Afraid of being called a "communist"?
DAngelo136 3 weeks ago
The initial premise in this video is a little bit off... "How many people should have access to health care?" Everybody does, however a large portion of those 47 million without health insurance are able to afford it but choose to put other things before paying for insurance each month.
HBKatlanta 5 months ago
@HBKatlanta nobody ever gets denied in an emergency
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
@ FatTony726: Health care is not like Starbucks or grocery chains...it is NOT a market good...the reason it should NOT be for-profit is because you never know when you will need to access the health care system...what if somebody is in a car accident through no fault of their own? What if they are uninsured or underinsured? Those costs are then passed onto people who have insurance and/or are healthy, which jacks up their monthly premiums. It is an inefficient and unfair system.
ilovemycat00 5 months ago
@ilovemycat00 It is a market good..someone has to pay for the research that goes into it and the providers..this is done (like everything else like inventing the computer, or car) by the private market with a desire to make A Profit...nothing wrong with this
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
I'm a democratic socialist pretending to be a conservative republican, and I support single payer healthcare.
Figila001 6 months ago
I like the idea of health care for all. The only problem is, really how does it get paid for? Based on the video some of the taxes would come from companies and top wage earners. These people got to the top by being "good" business people. Not to say what they do is good or moral it's how one plays the game. So the thought that they would be paying in without it effecting the general public is very naive. The trickle down theory. We will always end up paying more. Not to say how the system is n
1seanalba 6 months ago
Are you nuts? If there is no out of pocket expenses. Then there is no incentive to save on health care.
FatTony726 8 months ago
@FatTony726 <-- Believe me, they have this worked into the system in the VA care and it's a problem easily solved. HEALTH CARE is the ONLY THING we ever BUY IN America that we agree to with NO CLUE what they are going to charge us until it's too late. IS THIS NOT NUTS? Look up "NO Insurance MRI". The "out of pocket" pmts. are often the total value of the procedure, so that Helath Ins. Pmts to them are PURE PROFIT. Now THAT is a wrong incentive.
BilkedToTheBrink 3 months ago
@coolbreezed You're a fucking moron if you don't believe in Universal health care for all. All the evidence clearly state that UHC would be better then the current system.
NYC1E1 8 months ago
@NYC1E1 i dont believe in it..fucking moron..every man for themselves
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Americans have been lied to. I compiled a blog titled "Corporate Executives Deny 57 Million Americans Healthcare - by Bill Woollam" Just Google that.
The US health care system is one of the worst in the world and has been compromised by the US Administration, the Health Insurance and Management Offices, and American Medical Assoc.
Canada, Britain, France and Cuba have hassle free, debt-free, comprehensive, universal health plans where every citizen receives health care with no added costs
Chidanandaji 9 months ago
V.A. Hospital benefits are great!! I was young, dumb and so entered the military when I was 20. Just because I did that, I received LIFETIME SINGLE PAYER healthcare (and dental) for 4 years of being taken care of by the Army and trained on heavy equipment ops! So tell me again how single payer is bad??? I have perfect health and teeth because of it and oh yeah, when I am old, I can live in a VA nursing home plus be buried for FREE in a National Cemetery of my choosing with a 21 gun salute.
p4h10oso 10 months ago
@p4h10oso what its bad you entered the military?!?!?!?! And shut ups those benifits are only for military members and vets we would we want civilians to have that?
fbibarbie 3 months ago
Note to all collectivist commentating. You all can start? your own communal living system right here in the US! There are enough you big government liberal no experience morons both rich and poor. So why not just do? it? What are you waiting for? Hollywood liberals, law school liberals, professors, and politicians. You can do it here in the United States and have community healthcare! Just don't put a gun? to MY head and FORCE me into it. I will sit back to see just how well it works....
AroundSun 11 months ago
@AroundSun excellent point, buddy! Im with you
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
This must be the health care of America NOW! We are the only industrialized country in the WORLD that doesn't provide universal insurance for everybody! Why isn't our government doing this NOW! D*** YOU GREEDY INSURANCE COMPANIES!
mstevahn 1 year ago 2
@mstevahn FUCK THIS COMMUNIST SHIT..I DONT WANT THIS SHIT
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
@TheHAMMER77777 Okay, let's rip up the pavement on the street you live on, tell the fire station that would come when your house is burning, and the police who'd come after you are robbed that you don't want this "communist shit". Dude! THEY WILL COLLECT YOUR TAX dollars either way, so would you like SOMETHING for this money, or are you content to just GIVE it away for nothing in return?
BilkedToTheBrink 3 months ago
Sounds like a plan of serfdom; let me off this plantation.
patricialee76 1 year ago
We cannot do this! This might make rich and poor equal, my god its the end of the world!
studape 1 year ago
There is no fundamental right to healthcare. In fact, the United States doesn't provide it's citizens with any affirmative rights (stuff the government does for you), it just provides it's citizens w/ negative right (stuff the government can't do to you).
I think we should keep it this way. No to single payer
coolbreezed 1 year ago
@coolbreezed Just wait until you get sick and face a $500,000 bill from the hospital that your private, for-profit health insurance company will not pay...do me another favor, do not call the police or fire departments or utilize K-12 public schools or universities and colleges...all entities that are at least in part, funded by taxpayers.
ilovemycat00 1 year ago
@ilovemycat00 If I get sick I will not selfishly expect my neighbors to pay for my individual healthcare.Thats the difference between a responsible person and a greedy leach.
Your 2nd argument is flawed because its basic premise is that if I approve of a town public police force then I must approve of any and every industry being nationalized by the fed. gov (like w/ single payer). Its ridiculous to compare town police, fire, etc. w/ a massive fed. gov. bureaucratic single payer nightmare.
coolbreezed 1 year ago
@ilovemycat00 they shouldnt Be Funded by taxpayers
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
@coolbreezed yeah lets make sure insurance companies can kick people off the rolls because they are sick so when you get sick dont complain when your insurance company shows you the door
jdprice455 1 year ago
@jdprice455 Every time I argue against single payer, some leftist says not to come to him when my evil "for profit" insurance company rejects me for no reason. Is this your only argument? LOL!
How about I promise not to call you when my evil insurance company denies me coverage and you promise that I will never have to pay for anyone else's free gov. healthcare? But you can't do that because single payer only works when gov. forces people to pay for others. I'm not forcing you to do anything.
coolbreezed 1 year ago
@jdprice455 Now that I answered you, can I predict your next argument? Let me guess ... your rebuttal is right from the Michael Moore playbook? You will either ask whether I'm a christian and then tell that I'm a hypocrite because I don't support your left wing policies. Or you will try to convince me that because I don't support a massive federal gov. bureaucracy controlling my healthcare then I somehow don't support locally controlled police, fire, and public schools. Am I right? LOL.
coolbreezed 1 year ago
Funny how even among the republicans single payer polls very well why do you think denmark germany and canada are eating our lunch when it comes to a good business climate free market solutions have failed if the free market was so good I wouldnt be on here advocating for single payer now would I, you hate obamacare what about mitt romney care after all its more a conservative version of health care reform haha i just love hypocrites on the right on this issue
jdprice455 11 months ago
@jdprice455 Your response is hard to read given your childlike grammar but I'll try. First of all, you are incorrect in stating that free market solutions failed as they have not all been tried yet. Additionally, I am familiar w/ no poll indicating that conservatives overwhelmingly, or even by a majority, support single payer. Also, Canada, Denmark, and Germany are not "eating or lunch". Further this video is in response to single payer and not obamacare so any reference to it is irrelevant.
coolbreezed 11 months ago
@coolbreezed They wont work at all especially if they benefit the insurance companies not the consumer thats an excuse for the other side to say let them run free and wild and do whatever they want without any consequences of their actions for God sake they rip off military families charging them outrage premiums even before Obamacare was ever drafted now they use that law by lying and saying inaccurate things.
jdprice455 11 months ago
@jdprice455 Are you a child? The reason I ask is because your grammar is absolutely atrocious. Your response is a rambling run-on sentence. Please get back to me when you are able to communicate like an educated adult.
coolbreezed 11 months ago
@coolbreezed Ok then why when republicans had the gavel back from 2003-2006 where was the free market solutions then, Obama-care may not be perfect but at least its a start, your side has barked about health care reform but did NOTHING to enact it, look at them now they dont want to fix the problems with the bill its all about repeal and replace but as usual your side has no replace other than going back to the way it was. free reign no accountability. typical right wing way of doing nothing
jdprice455 11 months ago
@jdprice455 Your grammar is horrible, however I will attempt to address your point.
First of all, you wrongfully assume that because I don't like singe payer I then agree with every GOP talking point. Only partisan idiots have "sides". For instance, when GOP had the majority they passed a large entitlement plan called Medicare D. I don't agree with that bill. Conversely, I don't disagree all parts of Obamacare, just the parts that harms the economy and invades upon our individual liberty.
coolbreezed 11 months ago
@coolbreezed Btw its common for your side to think I will attack your religion not knowing im christian as well i guess your next lil joke will be ooo im a big govt leftist heard it all before come up with something better please you conservatives bore me with cheap comebacks yawnnn
jdprice455 11 months ago
@jdprice455 The reason why that is common is because left wingers have been unsuccessfully trying to use the religion/hypocrite argument for years. I was simply rebutting it before you could bring it up. Also, if you support single payer then by definition you support big gov. because it is impossible to implement single payer w/o drastically increasing the size of gov. As for your politics, folks who want single payer generally share other left wing views so. Do you not share those views?
coolbreezed 11 months ago
@coolbreezed Why not have one system where everybody pays in from the moment of life until the day you die it would be a better business climate if we had one even the right wing chamber of commerce has had support for a single payer, yes it would mean the end of private insurance companies but I dont care because they dont provide any good services the moment you get sick they drop you because they cant make money off a sick person.
jdprice455 11 months ago
@coolbreezed right on!
TheHAMMER77777 3 months ago
opposing single payer is just ignorance, pure and simple.
eltouristoduo 1 year ago
It's so easy to spend other peoples' money. If you really want to save costs in the healthcare system, the only way to effectively do that is to flatten out the beaurocratic structure of the insurance system. Most medical providers attribute approx. 30% of their overhead to dealing with that beaurocracy. If that were eliminated, we would not have a crisis. By eliminating all third party payers including medicare and moving to a private pay system you would see huge savings.
dlacr 1 year ago
@dlacr ... with the 30% savings on the supply side of healthcare services, there is immediate savings. If citizens were allowed to contribute in Pre-tax dollars into a medical savings account, their purchasing power is increased by approx 30% as well... thus effectively giving a huge discount on healthcare on the consumer side. Now since every person can shop for the best value, you will see healthcare providers become increasingly competitive for your business.
dlacr 1 year ago
@dlacr "It's so easy to spend other peoples' money. "
This is ultimately the problem with trying to reason with people who support socialism. Far too many people in this country feel entitled to free things, even if it ends up being harmful the economy, and in turn themselves. The government can not run things efficiently, yet many people want socialized medicine?
NerfDeathcoil 1 year ago
What is soooo disturbing is that the USA lives as though there are no alternatives to the pathetic HC USA system. we've tried everything! but Congress uses public HC Insurance for life, good for them, not for the public?
DjWellDressedMan 1 year ago
and why should millionaires have to pay for the poor's medical bills?
nottinmatterz2day 1 year ago
This is a perfect example of the "everything works on paper" theory...
LegacyMicro 1 year ago
@LegacyMicro It works in all of Europe and most of Asia. Botswana has a higher rate of successful immunizations than the United States, and France is consistently rated as having the best healthcare in the world - and their system is based off a series of government "public options" to supplement the private industry.
xleftoutindigox 1 year ago
@xleftoutindigox Botswana has a population of < 2 million. USA=+300 million. As of 2008 the life expectancy at birth in Botswana = 54 years.(I'd be almost dead.) USA=78 years. Average household income in Botswana=$5,840 (I made more than that when I was a part-time clerk at 7-Eleven in the eighties.)USA=+$50,000. Unemployment Botswana=40% USA=10%. According to you single payer will equal 40% unemployment, <$6000 annual income, and life will end at 54. I enjoy the comfort of MY heath care plan.
LegacyMicro 1 year ago
@LegacyMicro I'd love to know where you heard that. Was it from Health and Human Services and Health Ministry official statements from the United States and Botswana? Or was it from the public notifications from the United Nation's World Health Organization? Both specifically state that Botswana has a better healthcare system than the United States - and by "better system", I mean one of payment. The treatment itself is the virtually same in most industrialized countries.
xleftoutindigox 1 year ago
Everyone of these people have "access" to healthcare!! Nobody is making it illegal for then to prioritize healthcare as the most important expense in their lives.. Single payer is the worst thing that could ever happen to this nation. Nothing "free" is treated as valuable..
JMBare 1 year ago
@JMBare It's not "free", its just as paid for as our private insurance now, just instead of paying that private insurer the premium, you pay the Medicare for All program a tax. You still pay money either way; the care doesn't change at all, only the person who pays your bills.
xleftoutindigox 1 year ago
Where is the money coming from to pay for this single payer socialized medicine. There are more people then fire departments. This pie chart is BS. Yea tax tax tax and tax some more. What about the people who chose NOT to have health coverage as their god given right to do, they are now being forced to buy it and under the US Constitution the US Gov can not force to people to make purchases such as health care. Lets just throw out the Constitution and wrap ourselves around Europe's FAILED model.
SendinK9 1 year ago
Excellent ViD. My only complaint is that chiropractic services are included. Chiropractic treatment is a fraud. No one should be forced to pay for it as part of the nation's healthcare plan. Britain is on the way to discrediting it as a recent libel case brought up the fraudulent, non scientific nature of it. If people want to obtain chiropractic, non injury massage and untested acupunture, then they can pay for that themselves. We will all have much more money with a single payer system.
murmur5555 1 year ago
oh yes more PROGRESSIVE COMMUNIST CRAP
readyxxi 1 year ago
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usahealthcarereformdiscussion.blogspot.com
supermario00110011 1 year ago
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usahealthcarereformdiscussion.blogspot.com
supermario00110011 1 year ago
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If the health care system is 37th in quality and super expensive when the government pays for 60% then what difference is another 40% FROM THE GOVERNMENT: lower quality and further expense is a logical extension. SECONDLY: I heard the words "efficient administration" whilst staring at a pie chart with 5 new "tax slices", each slice requiring it's own legally liable bureaucracies to collect and one more to pull it together and many more to audit. usahealthcarereformdiscussion.blogspot.com
supermario00110011 1 year ago
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supermario00110011 1 year ago
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@supermario00110011 usahealthcarereformdiscussion.blogspot.com
supermario00110011 1 year ago
Dr. Donald Berwick, the man who will run your health care: "I cannot believe that the individual health care consumer can enforce through choice the proper configurations of a system as massive and complex as health care. That is for leaders to do. ... About 8% of GDP is plenty for 'best known' care. ... A progressive policy regime will control and rationalize financing—control supply."
modifiedcontent 1 year ago
I´m proud of being European ! I will never (EVER ! ) have to fear if I will or will not be able to pay my medical bills ! I will never be confronted with the doctor have to think in a profit perspective of my illness... You are afraid of socialist medicine ? Huuu, watch out with the comunists, they are coming for you ...
AngeloBGC 1 year ago
@AngeloBGC I bet you also enjoy having longer waits to be seen at the hospital, and having less skilled doctors, don't you?
NerfDeathcoil 1 year ago
One of the best explanations on "the health care question."
If this 4 minute, 20 second production had a million bucks behind it to support repeated showings on television and on the web, real medicare for all would be achieved. Thanks for the superb work.
Hutch
impeachthem 1 year ago
Yah it's not like madicade and medicare are bankruped.
simontimon2 1 year ago
Your forgeting that most of 47 million are young people who choose not to have insurance because they don't see the point in paying something that they will probably never need.
simontimon2 1 year ago
single payer is all about passing on your medical bill to some sucker down the line!
works good if you are the type that runs up medical bills.
orangedac 1 year ago
@orangedac
"single payer is all about passing on your medical bill to some sucker down the line!"
Insurance is the same way.
kmarinas86 1 year ago
@kmarinas86
..except you can opt out of insurance and pay your medical bills instead of paying other people's medical bills with single payer.
i could do without a hoard of free loaders raiding my wallet, thanks.
orangedac 1 year ago
This is not factual. It is propganda. Sad thing is some people will beleive this crap.
glynn72 1 year ago
Medicare, Medicade, Social Security, etc. Great programs?
glynn72 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
don't force me to pay for an obese, sedentary,smoker's diabetic's coronary bypass and foot amputation. That is his/her responsibility since they had a lifetime to get into their predicament. My money won't pull them back to good health; it will only increase quantity of life and does nothing for quality of life if they make some better (informed) choices.
1cont 1 year ago
I think the analyses of a single payer health care system is completely wrong in this video.
joeseth05 1 year ago
The sad thing is that eventually these commies will have their way as slowly make more and more americans dependant on central gov't. It will end the land of oppotunity and the rest of the world will wonder what happened when your dependant gav't ran out of hand outs. that's what its about.
joemoya 1 year ago
@joemoya no...you're stupid. Sorry for giving a less thorough explanation but really this argument is tired. The statistics favor socialized healthcare and to correct you is just a waste of time
-America is ranked 37 in healthcare, yet spends the most
-Virtually EVERY other industrial nation runs some form of socialized plan, including all the top spots
-59% of american physicians want a single payer system (pulled from "Annals of Internal Medicine2008")
boorens18 1 year ago
@joemoya "slowly make more and more americans [will be] dependant on central gov't" - you mean like Big Business does? Big Business being:
Lockheed Martin
Boeing
McDonnell Douglas
Blackwater
GM
Lehman Brothers
AIG
Bear Sterns
and any and all other business reliant on gov't contracts, bail outs, and tax breaks
Tweekki 1 year ago
So far all the "I'm agin' it!" arguments boil down to: "I've never suffered, so screw you."
Opposition to single-payer is a sign of a deep personal moral failure.
geekmastermind 1 year ago
Single payer is all about passing on your medical bill to some sucker down the line.
orangedac 1 year ago
everybody pays taxes so everybody pays for healthcare, and im sure youd like single payer if you got sick, its more efficient and dosnt go away when you need it most.
aSheeple 1 year ago
Everybody pays taxes but some will run up bigger bills than what they pay in. These are the folks who want single payer.
I'm cool with the idea of helping someone who is too poor to pay for their medical expenses. But that's quite apart from being raided by people who can pay but don't want to pay for their own bills.
Instead they want to offload their bill onto some sucker down the line. That's BS.
orangedac 1 year ago
Anthem health is asking for a 39% increase in health premiums in California. Lets do nothing and see how long this can go on. I say let one state (California SB 810) start single payer and see how it goes.
Spytheweb 1 year ago 14
@Spytheweb Unlikely that California will try anything close to single payer given their current financial insolvency.
Here's the problem with single payer, once you give an entitlement there it is nearly impossible to take it away, even if its in the countries best interest. Market reforms and promoting individual responsibility is more favorable to penalizing hard working responsible citizens with higher taxes and worse HC for the irresponsibility of folks who choose not to purchase insurance.
coolbreezed 1 year ago
@Spytheweb California could become the next Saskatchewan! Or it could be Colorado which also has a single payer bill currently languishing in the Legislature.
ilovemycat00 1 year ago
@Spytheweb One State? Maine has had it for the last 6 years and it is totally broke. It failed and went down like a flaming arrow. I think people just need to start looking around and see how it HAS FAILED all over the planet regardless of some fancy smooth talking Youtube video. Yeah they have it in Maine and it is broke and needs the Gov to bail it out. I don't care what the left argument is, socialized medicine is NOT the answer and will bankrupt this country even faster then it is already.
SendinK9 1 year ago
@SendinK9 Maine, does not have a single payer system,let alone for years it just became legal for a state to start a single payer system under Obamacare (thanks to Kucinich). As for failing all over the planet, England, Canada, Australia,Taiwan, & to Medicare.
You don't care what reality is.
Fuctmentality 1 year ago
1.)
@Fuctmentality Are your for real?! First off in Maine it is called the Dirigo Choice health plan bill which was implemented in 2001, which began providing coverage in January 2005 so yes it is YEARS and is now broke. Democratic Governor John Baldacci signed the plan into law with a bevy of familiar promises. By 2009, it would cover all of Maine's approximately 128,000 uninsured citizens. System-wide controls on hospital and physician costs would hold down insurance premiums. CONT>
SendinK9 1 year ago
2.)
@Fuctmentality There would be no tax increases. The program was going to provide insurance for everyone and save businesses and patients money at the same time. After five years, fiscal realities as brutal as the waves that crash along Maine's famous coastline have hit the insurance plan. The system that was supposed to save money has cost taxpayers $155 million and is still rising. CONT>
SendinK9 1 year ago
3.)
@Fuctmentality As for Canada, I live in Washington State and I can look out my back window at Victoria BC, I listen to thier radio station every day at work for the last 18 years 100.3 the Q and I know everything that goes on over there including talking to my Canadian friends on Ham radio and I know for a fact it is broke and also limits coverage. Last month the radio station held a donation drive to help a local man pay for his cancer treatments which , CONT>
SendinK9 1 year ago
4.)
@Fuctmentality were not covered under the Provençal health care coverage. Not only that the Doctors are all underpaid so the quality of care is low, nurses strikes, doctor strikes and hospitals closing due to lack of funding all have been broadcasted on thier news over the years and recently. I think it is you who needs to start doing his homework and if you live in Maine I can honestly say you don't even know what is going on in your own State nor less Canada. CONT>
SendinK9 1 year ago
5.)
@Fuctmentality Only the extremely naive liberals fell for this BS Obamacare in the first place. It was railroaded threw in back room deals and swindles against 75% of the American people who were against it not to mention it violates the US Constitution. After Nov the repeal actions will start taking place.
SendinK9 1 year ago
@SendinK9 I have a rule, if it takes someone more than 2 replies to respond to one comment that person is an idiot, & it's most likely a waste of time reading them. Good day sir.
Fuctmentality 1 year ago
@Fuctmentality lol, Defeat sometimes works that way... NEXT!!!
Funny, your liberal friends in Washington felt the same way about reading the health care bill lol...
SendinK9 1 year ago
@SendinK9
Defeat? I doubt it. But I'm not going to wast my time.
Fuctmentality 1 year ago
@Fuctmentality Well unfortunately I cant explain all the facts in one or two lines, I also hate to see people wallow around the blogs fact-less so consider it my pleasure in helping you avoid that problem any further however, it would require some reading on your part so maybe your right, its a waste of time.
SendinK9 1 year ago
@Fuctmentality BTW, in order to care about what reality is you have to first live in it...
SendinK9 1 year ago
When you go to the dmv, why should you wait in line, you're rich why can't you go to the head of the line? Because you have money does not mean you are better or have more rights than anyone else. Why is it that other countries get it right and America can't. This is not only about people this is about business and the economy. Other countries that have universal health have a healthier and more productive work force and companies operate with lower overhead.
Spytheweb 1 year ago
If I am willing to pay more to a doctor for treatment then why should I have to wait behind those who pay less?
That's what I don't get about single payer.
Single payer puts people who work hard and make the right lifestyle and financial decisions throughout their lives on the same level as those who do not.
If we are going to have any meaningful healthcare reform in the U.S. it has to start with protections of a person's ability to contract individually with their HC provider.
coolbreezed 1 year ago
@coolbreezed i agree with the last part of what you said. If they reformed, I'm sure there will still be by contract HC but, it will probably be very comprehensive and very costly to you single they won't be collecting as many premiums. I am still on the fence about all this. I understand the problems on boths sides. On one side we have unregulated psychopaths and on the other we have sociopaths who are friends with the psychopaths and guess what...we don't win...so far, that's what I gather. ;)
Poonard 1 year ago
@Poonard Not following. I'm interested in you point of view and, of course, rebutting it if I disagree, so please explain what you mean by the psychopaths and sociopaths you are talking about.
coolbreezed 1 year ago