Vought F-8 Crusader vs. McDonnell Douglas F-4 Phantom II

[immortalass]

oh god oh god dont make me choose these two may be my all-time favourite fighters. these and the viper.

[petpetfernandez]

im a filipino and i know that paf has f-8 crusader.....all of the world retires its f-8.....where is the f-8??

[ti994apc]

The Crusader was clearly a better dog fighter. However, the North American F-107 Ultra Sabre would have kicked both their butts in a dogfight and it was made back in 1956. Back then the Airforce made possibly the biggest pick mistake of all times when the chose the Republic F-105. The F-105 was a horrible airplane. 50% were lost in Vietnam.

[suaspontetn]

fulcrum: in pure air to air, perhaps you are correct if the pilots are of equal ability; however, BVR weapons and acquisition resources give the phantom the advantage. Phantom did one thing better than any other fighter of its time: it brought to the fore the value of the platform being flexible to allow the weapons to do the fighting. Modern warfare: the classic dogfight is inevitable; however, the air force that coordinates and synchronizes all of its resources at the point of attack wins.

[Szarko32c]

Greatest? I think MiG-21 and Mirage III could beat both in dogfight...

[kayakutah]

@Szarko32c That would be incorrect. I've fought against both.

[cargo4441]

The f-8 was The hotrod but they built 5000 phantoms nuff said.

[dethica]

absolute beauties! thnx for the upload

[dobravery]

Phantom wins. Not due to who is the best dog-fighter, but because the #1 job of the carrier fighter is to PROTECT THE CARRIER. If you have a wave of Soviet bombers incoming, the F-4's missile armament is way more suited and capable. As vicious as Vietnam was, the real threat/mission was always the Soviets.

[foxrecon19d]

There can be no mistaking that the F4 Phantom II is one of the all time greatest planes EVER! Even in the year 2011, over 60 years after it's first flight, the mighty F4 Phantom serves in frontline NATO units such as the German Luftwaffe, REPLACING THE ULTRAMODERN MIG29!! Having said that, in the air-to-air role the Crusader is "simply unbeatable." The only US aircraft with a better kill/loss ratio than the F8 is the F15 Eagle. (21/3 to 100+/0 respectively)

[mossmusic]

Awesome! Thanks for the upload!

[ceilinggod]

I love my jet fighters . watching the film @2:27 to 2:38 was the Phantom's only kill shot , no gun .Chances were with missle tech at the time likley a miss . On the other hand when the Crusader lost him in the sun @247 to 304 he owned his azz , and he had a gun ! Never bring a knife to a gunfight !

[drbackjack]

The Phantom is so sexy compared to the crusader.

[ceilinggod]

@drbackjack sexy git ya kilt sometimes !

[FighterGuDude3214]

The last gunfighter...

[123TigerShark]

f-8 rocks hands down!!!!!!

[wildcatactual]

Ah yes, the great Wings series from The Discovery Channel's golden era. It's still the best military aviation series ever.I always enjoyed New Year's Day when they ran something like twelve hours back-to-back.

[maxcool951]

f-4 owns the crusader except that the phantom is unmanuverable

[ceilinggod]

@maxcool951 I love my jet fighters . watching the film @2:27 to 2:38 was the Phantom's only kill shot , no gun remember ! .Chances were with missle tech at the time likley a miss . On the other hand when the Crusader lost him in the sun @247 to 304 he owned his azz , and he had a gun ! Never bring a knife to a gunfight !

[mystinger72]

@ceilinggod Actually, you would be wrong. when the Nayy stood up Top Gun, they put together a pool of pilots that could fly the Rhino better than anyone, pilots who were not afraid to learn the a/c. These guys figured out how to beat the shit out of the Crusader boys. After a few days the F-8's were getting worked, the F-4 guys had figured out how to fly in the vertical

[ceilinggod]

@mystinger72 I can see your point on that . The Phantom does have one big advantage . The power of it's engines and it's climb rate , but it has one very deadly weakness . Never get into a turning fight with any aircraft . Slashing attacks only . One more point the Crusader has the second best win ratio of all mordern aircraft . Second only to the F-15 , and thats saying a lot .

[mystinger72]

@ceilinggod Yes, the story is that even while turning the F-4 was pretty alright. It had a poor rate of turn of course against the MiG-17, but it could stay with a -21, in fact, according to the Have Donut report they were pretty much equal in ever aspect save top speed (Phantom won). The F-8 could low speed turn better than the F-4, but the F-4 didn't bleed energy, these guys learned to stay fast and run a lag turn........

[mystinger72]

@ceilinggod In a lag turn you run a slightly bigger circle slightly faster than your opponent. Mugs McKeown, Jack Ensch, Tooter Teague, Houston, and Pettigrew all knew the F-4 inside and out, knew how to make it do thing most of the F-4 pilots in the WORLD didn't think possible. The story goes that they learned and then went out and psanked the "Saders, then said "you'll have to do more than sit back there and kill us.....

[ceilinggod]

@mystinger72 Actually , we are both right . Long range the last thing you wanted to deal with was an F-4 ... Up close and visual if you saw an F-8 go ahead and punch out and save yourself some trouble .

[mechsuit80]

This would have been even better if it was vs. a F8U-3 crusader III. Too bad they didn't make it.

[ChallengerGuy22]

would have been nice if they actually gave hard numbers on the 2 aircraft and how they did vs one another feel free to point me to other vids thanks

[airstrike1622]

I love the F-4

[mrwxyz101]

phantom might be fast but crusader is gig to kick its ass

[WackoWizzardness]

f-4 is awesome...

[USAFBuster]

The MiG-29 gonna kill'em all. lol

[kblackav8or]

@USAFBuster No actually it will be some big chopping machine in the Arizona desert. Then they will make soda cans from what is left. Should save more of them in flying conditions as they are awesome to watch at a show. 

[USAFBuster]

@kblackav8or Well, I wish I can own one of those, lol.

[FieldMarshalB]

Ok, I'm not a flier, but I always thought that the f-4 was a rather ugly aircraft. It doesn't look like it should be able to fly. The f-8, however has style for sure.

[Paulmichael9]

I think F-4 is better. F-8 is kinda sloppy in Dogfight. I got shot down in an F-8 crusader yesterday by an F-4E Phantom. Then I shot 6 F-8s later.

[YanYan1337]

Im in the usaf but the Crusader is BY FAR my favorite fighter of all time :D

beautiful jet :D then comes the F15 and F22

[xTomcatsForeverVF84x]

F-4's, F-8's, and F-14's are THE most hottest and classic fighters of naval aviation

[Stover36]

The Phantom was really nice, but the Crusader was just hardcore.

[discofishing]

where's the rest of this video?

[xfire7]

Don`t forget the EE lightning!

[ItTheIt]

Having only 1 engine can be a bit of an enemy as well.

[M4A108]

F-8 Deadly in gun sight + Veteran pilots from world war 2

F-4 Advance Fighter jets and using heat missile + Newbies pilots.

Because most of veterans from world war 2 is using guns their fighter plane and they don't like it the way missile thing.

[hammerogod]

The F8 could out-anything the F4 did except make noise. The F4 was far noiser. I am a huge Crusader fan. I loved the F4's too but only because they looked so cool with the afterburners on. I loved the look on the pilots faces when they got taxied close to the edge on the tiny Essex class carriers (Bonnie Dick and Oriskany)

[makoshiropapa]

F-8 looks like a great white shark.

[stevensrsp]

my dad was a marine he had these in his squadron. he was in vmcj-1 and vmcj-3, they had rf-8 crusaders rf-4 phantoms and a-6. He knew maj gen drax williams .

my dad flew rf-4s and a-6s. these were great planes.

[CounterClaws]

I have this and a documentary of the F8 on VHS

[justforever96]

:45 Crusader looks like a cross between F-16 and a Harrier! Sort of...drooped wings and a big tail/single engine, anyway. Does anyone know what sort of "scope" is shown in the F-4 at 1:25? Is that a "B"-scope, or a "C"-scope, or what? I've been trying to figure out. I don't remember; I believe the circle shows the target ahead of you, how far it is left or right or above you, and the line at the bottom shows the range. I'm not sure. The little lines may be the vectors of other planes?

[penguinskywalker]

I love this beautiful airplane ... partly because it reminds me of the MiG-21. Thanks for this fabulous video. :)

[fourfortyroadrunner]

Miramar--my station 70-74, maintained GCA RADAR and TACAN. Helped install new FPN-52. Our shop off back end of "boresight" range used to sight F8, other guns I feel old--first of F14's showed up '73 or so, now obsolete already.

[terryleejack]

@fourfortyroadrunner haha i was also stationed at miramar nas in 73 to 75,with vfp-63,nice base too,fightertown usa!

[terryleejack]

@fourfortyroadrunner 

[DJtaka86]

"Phantom Pilots saw the Crusaders cannon as an older generation of tech" HA!!!

and we had to build a who new phantom just to give it a cannon - unless you want the gun pod and no extra fuel!

[Flyboy207]

@DJtaka86 Yeah, but you still have 2 underwing tanks.

[santafesino007]

jaglavaksoldier !!!GREAT VIDEO!!!!

5 STARS!!

[markvinas31]

We had those F-8's from 1977 to 1988 (Philippine Air Force).

[rustyATV]

Got any lying around for sale? Lol!

[markvinas31]

Yes!! In Clark Airbase I think there are around 2 lots of assorted F-8 parts for sale as well as the airframe

[terryleejack]

outstanding aircraft,i was an fi8 plane capton for the crusader in vfp-63 stationed at nas miramar in the early 70's and i loved it,great video thanks

[exenrontexas]

@terryleejack I served on the USS Bon Homme Richard as ship's company on the last cruise in 1970. VFP-63 was our photo recon squadron. I was a PH and we got good shots from them.

[JimBeer61]

@terryleejack , my pops was xo for two years and then CO for 1 year of VFP-63 during 72-75 i think. Hope he wasn't to rough on ya!

[sureshot649]

outstanding video.

[BadenBuccaneer]

F-8 Crusader! MiG-Master!!

[TheSubzerogr]

@BadenBuccaneer F4E MIG KILLER,and WORLD'S LARGEST DISTRIDUTOR OF MIG PARTS.How'sthat shortie?

[BadenBuccaneer]

@TheSubzerogr Not bad, buddy! But in Vietnam the F-8 dominates the Mig and had the best kill ratio of any american plane! That why the F-8 is called the MiG-Master!!

[TheSubzerogr]

@BadenBuccaneer Listen,i like F8,especialy the 4 vulcans(now THAT'S fire power).

But Phantom is something else,its the No.1 name global,and HE is still flying.Here in Greece we have the best Phantom in the world aka AUP,and i am very proud.

[BadenBuccaneer]

@TheSubzerogr The Phantom was a fantastic plane! No doubt about it! In Germany we also still have some Phantoms, but I think their time is over! Especially if you compare the Phantom with the Eurofighter Typhoon!! And one last thing: the F-8 Crusader had no Vulcans! It had 4 Mk12 Colt Brownings!!..;-)

[TheSubzerogr]

@BadenBuccaneer In fact i compare Phantom with EF.In Frisian Flag a greek AUP shot down a RAFALE using IRIS-T missile!Of course(as usual) thats UNofficial cover.Now tell me how is that possible?Its the plane or the pilot?I think both.

[BadenBuccaneer]

@TheSubzerogr I would say a bad teached french pilot and a greek pilot, who can handle his Phantom very well!..;-)

[TheSubzerogr]

@BadenBuccaneer I tell you a secret.some pilots from each wing,are trained in advance technics of their aircrafts.We call that SOT,which means Tactical arms school (Like TOP GUN).Perhaps the PHANTOMANIAC that shots Rafale was graduate from there.

[BadenBuccaneer]

@TheSubzerogr So, here we go!!That was also a reason, why the Crusaders dominate the MIG. Cause their pilots were trained in dogfight tactics at the Crusader College of VF-124. That was the predecessor of TOP GUN. At first the Phantom Pilots were not trained in such tactics, cause they relied on their missiles. But during the Vietnam War TOP GUN was established for Phantom Pilots of the US Navy!

[TheSubzerogr]

@BadenBuccaneer Well...nice talking to you.Going to take nap.See you around and by the way, nice aircraft your nickname

[hammerogod]

@BadenBuccaneer Heh... Yeah. The Phantoms didn't even have guns until that gun pod was added after they had been deployed for a couple of years. I would not have wanted to get into a close in fight while driving an F4. Sidewinders and Sparrows were amazing technology for the period but they sure didn't cover all the bases.

[fulcrumSMT29]

Phantom is a good plane, but the Crusader owns the Phantom!

[TurkishHistorian1923]

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