Rolling Shutter: Identical panning speed: Canon EOS 7D vs Canon EOS 5D mark II

[drijfkip1]

The framerate conversion is much more annoying than the rolling shutter efect...

[MaSSiVe0101]

There is something wrong with your settings in this video.. Too much stutter, your frame rates don't match with Final.

[xiawei7909]

Also for motion pictures you need some blur and this is why usually only two times of frame speed is used for shutter speed.

[xiawei7909]

The reason why the faster shutter is not always better is because after a certain time if shutter speed is not multiples of the the frame rate they will be out of sync, which means the whole sensor will not be exposed for the same duration at the same time while the sensor is scanned from top to bottom, which causes the rolling shutter effect! Please correct me if I'm wrong.

[bnccristi]

you need to follow the 180' rule. 1/50 for 24/25fps, 1/60 for 30fps, 1/125 for 60fps. The shutter speed needs to be double the fps. But you can only have 1/50 the closest to 1/48 and 1/125 for 60fps as there is no 1/120 on cameras

[msscreenwriter]

Is that Brooklyn, or the lower east side?

[daliceinchains]

Whys it look so choppy?

[cubdukat]

Is this a symptom of all HDSLR's?

[thebeetalls]

could hardly see the effect with the video being so jittery, maybe you uploaded at the wrong FPS? or maybe my PC just doesn't like this video...

[jarballo]

I have shot over 50 videos with my Canon 7D and never once had that problem and I shoot a ton of sports action with it as well.

[Fernsehenpfanger]

Oh my... My head is go around...

[WashashoreProd]

Worth noting, but are you really supposed to be whip-panning in HD to begin with? It seems like sort of a pathological case. (Now with airplane propellers, that's different...)

[PaulPradaShow]

The 5D mk2 is the clear winner. Thanks for posting!

[Nebelvir123987]

now those are ugly houses

[meatball3000]

1/80 shutterspeed is your problem. Set your camera up properly (1/50 for 24/25fps) and you won't have such a problem.

[vishalkhanna19]

@meatball3000 Wouldn't a faster shutter speed be the right solution?

[meatball3000]

@vishalkhanna19 A faster shutter speed might help but you still want to keep it in multiples of double whatever your framerate is.

[vishalkhanna19]

@meatball3000 Thanks, buddy. I got a chance to try this out today and set shutter speed at 200 while shooting at 25fps. Worked fine.

[robblac]

yet another DSLR night mare, to go with bad quality video, TERRIBLE moire and aliasing, all for the sake of shallow DOF, lol whats the fucking point ?

[Lacidelson]

why is this video kinda laggy? I saw many vids with canon 5d m2 and 7d and lots of them are laggy, some of them really smooth. why is this? shutter speed? thanks

[RobbertGroenendijk]

@Lacidelson Shutter speed is only making your image look more smooth or more streched, depends on how long (shutter speed) you open the iris every 1/25 of a second (when shooting at 25p), the 'laggyness' might be your internet connection, i don't see any.

[Lacidelson]

@RobbertGroenendijk

I mean for me it seems like there is not enough blurring between two frames, there is a little gap between two frames which makes the video look not smooth enough.

I have a dell u2410 lcd. can my lcd make it look not so smooth? =/

[Lacidelson]

@Lacidelson

by fast movement it's blurred enough and looks smooth, but for example between 1:58 and 2:03 I see this "laggyness"

[RobbertGroenendijk]

@Lacidelson well it won't be your screen, it's maybe a liiiittle bit twitchy but that's just how this video has been exported i think. Although i know the problem, i'v had the thing you mention while playing games on my old dell laptop, it's probably due to the computers hardware. i'v got a brand new imac now, so no problems here ^^

[Lacidelson]

@RobbertGroenendijk I have a pc with quad core 2,5; nVidia GTS 280 1GB and 8GB DDR2 ram so I hope it's not my PC. maybe it's firefox's flash plugin, I'll download the video and watch it in MPC. thanks for helping!

[MortallicA91]

what about me?

I want the best for my money, Im currently studying 3d animation & multimedia production, But i want a camera good enough for pro looking...

7D costs 2000€ with a better lens and a shoulder mount.

I cant afford a cam corder like canon xf300 or sony ex1-3 about 6000€...

Im not a pro i just want the best for me, If ill be able to get a job or open my professional office then i should buy an expensive cam corder.

Am I wrong? 7d is the way?

[sourcekings]

@MortallicA91 dont get a 7d if you going to spend that much just get a 5d

[AhickmanProd]

when it comes to choosing a camera, the word wedding and feature do not go together in a sentence,

[TimmyTubularr]

OOH NOO EVERYTHING IS FALLING O- ...Never mind.. Stupid camera.

[JamesGreen321]

Can someone please explain to me what a rolling shutter is?? I can't find the info anywhere and the technique looks cool :)

[rsaddey]

@JamesGreen321 Just google for rolling shutter and pick the three ones from the top - you'll be an expert after having completed those :-)

[KitLynchRobinson]

I think it looks great - you just have to learn to work with it or around it - just as the 1st film makers couldn't move their cameras If you are going to be panning that fast you are chopping high energy shots in to punctuate things - hundreds of thousands of dollars are spent trying to get an effect that ups the energy - here is a cheap one -

the choppyness is more of an issue but that can be got rid of in flame - time remapping form 30 to 24 isn't going to help.

thanks for the test. 

[franKruleR]

hm for me both are same. we need a motion control system for this test :D

[nelsonmilian00]

cmos sensor is a defective technology, those big company they don't care about that, cmos sensor is very cheap to manufacture and the sell the camcorders at the same price that ccd camcorders, cmos need to be redesign and maybe it will cost millions, but who will pay for that, panasonic, canon, jvc, sony? they only care there money.

[trueastern]

now try and turn up the shutter speed

[theryaner]

camera seems to do a good job with slow pans, which is normally what people would do. But WHO cares if your going to do a quick pan and then stop onto a subject. It's getting all motion blurred and crap which might add to the effect of movement.

[constantlyc]

Looks like both are pretty bad for panning...

A shame really.

[AgentOrange409]

@constantlyc Any camera with a CMOS sensor will produce the rolling shutter effect, so I don't know what you're complaining about.

[constantlyc]

@AgentOrange409 I wasn't complaining... Geez.

[785tt9gh]

Between the EX1 and the Canon 7D, which one would you choose for weddings and features and why? Thanks for your help.

[mike24p]

depends. I think you will need two or 3 cameras, esp when shooting 7D's to pull of a pro wedding shoot. If you have enough light, the EX1 and a b camera (could be 7D for low light) probably the best combo

[worldwidestudios]

@785tt9gh 7D for features. It's the kind of camera that allows you to set things up and get them perfect for pressing record. EX1 for events; in any sort of live, uncontrolled situations, you need fast, manual control on your camera.

[paulffake]

Of course, if you must whip pan, you can always shoot it slowly and speed it up in post by say 300%. You can then add motion blur to taste. It seems idiotic to force the camera to go beyond its limits. Also, use a better fluid head that doesn't jitter as you move it. Pros use pro gear.

[JimboCCL]

I have a 7D, but seriously, if you're going to be making whip pans of this nature you're not going to us any DSLR. The right tool for the right job. I only bought the 7D because I can change the lens and I needed a new still camera. I love it, but would never use it over my EX1 or HVX200 for creating really usable video. Use a hammer to hit the nail, not a screwdriver.

[mike24p]

the idea was to amplify the jello effect, who on earth would pan that fast, you should give it a shot, 7D video mode, of course it has its limitations compared to the EX1 and HVX200 but beats both when it comes to low light video.

[airdog77]

sony EX1 has CMOS sensor instead of CCD used in all other camcorders, so it must suffer from rolling shutter too.

[Pwells1]

@JimboCCL The 7d's optics, due to having a 35mm cinema sized sensor, are also vastly superior to the ex1 and hvx200.

[alexbormanbou]

@Pwells1 but the h264 video format is vastly inferior

[Pwells1]

@alexbormanbou Not vastly, just slightly. They're all RGB video, which makes them vastly inferior to the RED. h264 kind of sucks, but no video signal really gives you much room to color correct anyway.

[TheMehdieval]

i think the eos 7d is better for movies

and the 5d mark II is better for Pictures,

thats why the 5d mark II is more expensive.

[whitey211]

I don't know, 5D didn't really look much worse to me. It's definitely noticeable in both cameras though.

[pammpari]

thank you for doing this test. its is very important for most of us who are looking to buy one of these camera.

[chaucer44]

I'm so glad you posted this footage!!! Ok another question: is this footage slowed down, like, were you whip panning super fast, and then slowed it down quarter or half speed?

Because the panning left to right is very slow and in this video and you wouldn't expect this kind of jumpiness.

[mike24p]

the speed is 100% (30fps), just the panning speed itself changed during panning. it was shot at 30fps and the final output is 24fps and its causing the choppiness.

[ConsumerDV]

@mike24p Why did you output to 24p if you were uploading to YouTube? It plays 30p just fine.

[chaucer44]

That shutter roll is prettty bad. I'm not seeing this in other 5d sample footage. Is there a defect with your cam?

[mike24p]

not defective, just very fast pan

[UnderwoodLiam]

Im stuck between the 7D and th 5D2, im going to be using it a lot for video, and getting the film look..

from what i have researched, the 7D looks a lot more like film, and if your going to be using it professionally you will be lighting your scenes, and not using fast pans and tilts.

[mike24p]

fcp > quicktime movie

[kritspoherson]

what kind of capturing software, editing software, rendering settings and format did you use to get your video to show so well on youtube??

[louistorres]

It's funny because this technology will only get better. CCD chips don't suffer through the same rolling shutter as CMOS scanning does. That leads me to believe that if the world of photography will venture into this new world of combined photo/video, then the internal technology has to progress over to CCD chips. My first HD camera was the Sony FX1 which I bought the week it came out. Soon after, HD moved from 1080p to 1080i and I was stuck with a $5,000 camera that was old in under 2 years

[petercoffin]

1080i looks like crap, though.

[mike24p]

it is a bit more pronounced on the 5D2, it has to scan a larger sensor

[lthnnpwr]

Heh, very nice comparison.

So, is this only me, or is 5dII really suffers from the roll a bit more compared to the 7d?

[rkor87]

Thanks.

[rimasdvx]

Well done! So anyone can see more about it :)