Rogue PVP Subtlety Guide - Level 85

[virajkumar1995]

really helpfull m8..ty

[dandoshomar]

ty dude really helped me

[raz0rv8]

thanx helped a lot for me being a starter , not anything new but well presented :) keep the good work

[Norocmorth]

I just have a question bout poisons, why do ppl put deadly poison on their fast off hand weapon when since you dont need to be always procing it wouldnt it be better on a slow main hand weapon? the instant poisons can go on the faster off hand weapon because ur striking with them more often = more dmg output.......... please respond

[5dscardcrazy]

@Norocmorth Deadly poisons secondary effec is that once it is at 5 stacks it will start procing your main hand poison whenever it self procs. therefore it is better to have your deadly posion at 5 stacks ASAP so you can start to proc IP both when deadly posion procs and when your main hand hits. Hope this helped

[Norocmorth]

@5dscardcrazy oh didnt know that thx

[a0cs]

Thx

[Norocmorth]

Umm hey wouldn't it be better to stack armour pen with gems for the heavily armour peeps?

[Masklin97]

what's the name of your unit frame?

[heyhey309]

just hit 85 yesterday. real helpful guide. thanks,

what UI is ur portrait with the combo watch?

[RetardGamingHD]

@heyhey309 @masklin97

it looks like Xperl.

[HqMetalOfficial]

Very good guide! Helped a lot thanks man.

[oOeonzOo]

But rogues get Crit from Agil... sooo???

[jadzaip]

why is it better to have faster OH weapon than MH weapon?

[Protpowa]

@jadzaip because the main hand does all the special skils atacks and the off hand only autoatack so its nice to be faster because of poison stacking in my opinion.

[jadzaip]

@Protpowa Ah, Thanks!

[jimmaras01]

So..We no need to use rupture in pvp?

Coz i am doing it and with 5 combo p...

Nice video help me a lot though....

[seba123400]

plss give me macro on normal atack bact :+?

[HenkeCoD]

That was an insane guide tbh! I just dinged 85 on my rogue, im working on my gear so far and i didn't have any freakiest idéa about how to play in pvp! thanks alot, it really helpd me! <3

[zputtan]

whats the green shit glowing? at 0:23 ??

[br0sf0r3va]

@zputtan its an addon called power aura's it can let you know when certain things have proced or ready to use

[iBennnyyyy]

Thanks for this vid helped alot for me cause I'm not really the pvp type so now I'm gunna give it a good go

[lilsttev]

would this spec good for leveling too?

[fillcs]

@lilsttev If u wanna be a pvper, u can lvlup whit Sub, very good to lvl =))

I did whit mine



[xeephm]

dude i love u, RAF leveled a rogue and was lost!

[JayIMcgallion]

i actually use mutilate cause im not a quick thinker and in sub you have to be quick and very strategic which i am not good at because i get really nervous lol. but mutilate spec gives me alot of survivability. i get like 140% dmg reduction at times in mutilate. blackjack which most ppl find as a waste of talents i see otherwise. then i have glyph of clock of shadows more dmg reduction plus removing all DoTs. and then deadened nerves. so i take nothing/ you take everything. xP

[dubzstuuup]

wat is the best rogue talent? is sub good

[MrArtakt]

@dubzstuuup For PVP yes

[bluEturtleTeve]

This was really usefull for me! I am RAF with my friend and i did a rogue.. Im lvl 70 and can't take anyone in duel. I dony know wich spell to use and so on :P Great vid!

[Stroudy91]

Great video Keep it up mate!

[MarkusMikkelsen1995]

Great video ty man!

[Mariussszzz]

Ty for guid its awesome !;)

[notty135]

i think im gonna be better on pvp rogue now :)

[dextersChannal]

subbed

[dextersChannal]

holy shit i am only 39 on my rouge but because of this guide i am getting like 26 kills and 2 death average i kill people before they move just keep stunning them only way they survive is if my all my stuns are on cd or they are a pally : ) thanks

[JogosAoCalhas]

DUEL MERCADER :D

[VikingHawthorn]

Hey Vespira, can you talk about some usefull macros following your reasoning.

[Phreq1337]

Wich addons are you using? :D

[TheSmokey2312]

hey awsome vid im a newb rogue gearing up what you do agains a mage that ice you all the time ?

[Blackomega95265]

Are there any macros that tell you when your hemo and recuperate wear off ?

[Grennyoutrage]

Thanks played as pvp rogue for ages but never used things in that way.

[ReapzOneGaming]

i OMG'd



[WillixMandella]

Hey Vespira! I'm going to make my own guide(s) for my two subtlety Specs. Hopefully I include the right information and such. I have to do two guides for 2 different specs that I use.

Still looking at the new videos!! Keep it up! :)

-Willix

[tubetwink]

interface add ons suxxx ^^ .. play with basic ui or DIEEEE!! ^^

[MacEffie]

I suck for a long time as a rogue. Can not get the hang of it. Liked your guide but do you have a adres for more info?

[1mrhatta1]

Good beginner guide. helped me out a lot. i have made some of my own alterations to my char's talent tree and glyphs, but i still use the core of what you have there in your talent tree.

good job :)

[BiltzBud]

addon for the attacks ur using above you?

[sexymagnus1omg]

Nice vid, but I'd like to know which addOn you have for your actionbar layout. And i dont see the benefits for using crippling poisen and waylay (sublety, 2nd line, 2nd talent) at the same time.

[SechahMusic]

Hey, I need help. Im REALLY new s dont bash me for it. :P so how do I get talent tree abilities to the action bar? (ie: Hemo or Pre med) or for a key binding? I cant drag and drop anything from my talent tree. PLEASE HELP!

[FizzyProduction]

@SechahMusic spellbook

[TheMerseysiderPSN]

@SechahMusic Go into your spellbook(p)

[sickink2]

@SechahMusic Don't drag from your talent tree. They will be in your spell book under whichever tab the spells are from.

[iOwnzZTheScope]

Thanks, I know own the bgs !

[Nazara2u]

thank you very much sir!

[Cloud7Triger]

love how you walk through this and take your time. and the view on what your showing on spec is clear to see. 

[nitedrgn]

Thanks for the help! This is really good info, i used to be good but this made me beat the shit out of people thanks!

[vic3000ass]

what is the name of your healthframe addon?

[acdcfreakouter]

Dude, helped me a ton :D

[XScarred4life]

Low level guide: Stealth Ambush Hemo, backstab, backstab vanish (wait for max energy) Amubsh and repeat, using shiv to utilize crip poison and kicking when needed. usually you dont even have to restealth to get a kill

[frostedlambs]

hi im just geting into my rouge again

[minermax4444]

nice guid man

[hooah808]

Awesome vid

[anch088]

how to make this Mracosr cheap Shot, Garrote .Ambush



[MrWaza005]

as for gemin wise u want to stak agi if u run cheat death if u dont run cheat death run agi+resil for yellow and agi+hit and ur priority goes hitcap between 5-6 percent but try to hit 5 on the dot but doesnt mater. then goes agi, crit and expertise!!!!!! not haste! haste is useless for pvp because u have energytic recovery. So always keep recupe up. xpertise cap is round 20-22 not sure but if u have suficient xpertise u wont miss ur stun and fineshers and ur gouge without bleeds up.

[TheN1ckz]

Can any rogues answer this question.

What is the best opener? Garrote, Cheap shot, or Ambush? I always can't decide when I am faced with a split second decision and I would love to know which one is best. Are there certain classes that different openers can work on better?

Thanks. :)

[MrGameshit]

@TheN1ckz hmm I use ambush on pallys dk and warro hunter cheaps on druids garrote on lock mage and priest shams rogue

[TheGoodart123]

@MrGameshit

so you ambush pallys dks, warriors and hunters? then on druids you cheap shot, then garrote on casters?

sorry but i didn't understand that, not trying to troll or anything.

[Talem2727]

@TheGoodart123 I think he means Ambush platies and Mail that are gunna be meleeing more. garrote is a silence, so it's ideal for putting on mages,locks,priests a.k.a clothies :) CS is useful yes. but with KS and CS being together now. I wouldn't reccomend the use other than to keep a healer from healing and such.

[MrWaza005]

@TheN1ckz the best opener i found now is garote because of the silience now tht CS has a dr wid ur kidney which prevents u from stunlocking effeciently like in the old days. my opener always goes sap and premid the recupe the 2 points of straight away then garote, shiv to apply crip. then get 5 cp up recupe it 5 cp and snd pool ur engergy with 5 cp up ready to go shadow step kidney and dance em. if vsn a caster keep up ur silience wid garote when ur dancin and do not miss ur interupts :)

[TheDeathofGrace]

@TheN1ckz i never cheap shot. i garrote casters and ambush noncasters. cheap shot if you are trying to get away by using shandowdance.

[luciw1632]

What about Lucent Ember topaz for our Yellow sockets? Does crit really outweigh resilience?

[armagedoc66]

why is serrated blades not important?

[PlayboyTheHunterxD]

whats the hp bar addon ?



[AAHSKEETSKEETSKEET]

Creepy that you're a chick, but better than alliance I guess

[Steav00]

Thx for the tips

[makumasen]

super duper helpful guide. wish u were alliance though :)

[Punkxxx77]

Good video Bro! 

[jandegrote1]

is snd realy any good in pvp ?

[SirAngusOBeefington]

@share512, you do gain more energy from the ticks of Recuperate, 12 every tick, so 12 every 3 seconds

[MajorSimon]

Awesome vid, subbed.

[share512]

you do not gain additional energy with recoop .. its just 12 energy when you pop recoop .. one time thing .. not continuous

[kryptocake]

Great video, was just the video I was looking for and after seeing a couple attempts at the same thing done worse, This video hit the spot.

Thanks!

[MsFailnub]

YES!! FINALLY A HORDE!!!! caps...

[Yslalich]

Hey nice video, I have just one thing to say. When i'm opening someone I immediatly Recuperate after my Premiditation, so with a Cheap shot/Garrote then spam ambush opener, I have the periodic energy recuperation for 5 sec, and i gain 5 pts anyway after ambush. so i reput recuperate one me for 32 sec, Thumbs up so people can see, thx nice video

[Peaslovehappiness]

backstab



[DavidOwnsPvp]

On alliance



[DavidOwnsPvp]

Hello What class and race Would be best for pvp rouge?:D

[hejmeddig6661]

@DavidOwnsPvp I would say human (alliance) for a good every man for him-self that's good to escape from fear and that kind of things :)

[MisterPsycho1423]

still dont get how some rouges crit 30k.. lol

[Warhamer116]

@MisterPsycho1423 Not enough resi mostly.

I mean my rouge (sub, 85, full pvp) almost 1shotted pve geared moonkin druid... but then again moonkins are squishy

[MonkeyJazz75]

Cool vid man, you say "subtlety" weird lol. "Seltlety" :P

[bjht92]

@MonkeyJazz75 That's much more correct that pronouncing it suBtlety. It's a silent "b".

[MonkeyJazz75]

@bjht92 who said its pronounced with the b? its pronounced "Sud-l-tee" he says seltlety

[CompHelpOnDemand]

@MonkeyJazz75 It's pronounced Sut-ul-tee

[MonkeyJazz75]

@CompHelpOnDemand dont rlly need so much emphasis on the "t", listen to it next time, usually sounds like a "d" but anyway, i nvr made that comment to get in a stupid argument on utube, i have a life, so please shhhhh and stop messaging me

[MultiDede2]

Thanks you so much, i was totaly lost how i should use my abilitys and when. now i pwn all :D cant thanks you enough :D

[DrFrankenschtein]

Thanks for making this. After reviewing this video, I went into Strand of the Acients and shit on kids. Seems a lot like Sub back in Burning Crusade, although there are some big differences obviously. Regardless, it's fuckin' good times. \m/

[estatisticac2011]

Thanks a lot for your guide. its help a lot!

[falcor]

Cool video very informative. Learned a lot from it. Looking forward to see more videos. Cheers Sneakyhammer EU Doomhammer

[Mehspirit]

Can someone tell me exactly what he says at 2:15 to 2:22? Thanks.

[Mehspirit]

Very good guide.

[mufasalord]

you didnt say anything about using rupture, wouldnt that be important to use as a subtlety rogue?

[Kaali974]

@mufasalord Lol he said it, rupture is irrelevant since hemo bleed gives you the 16% damage bonus, don't use rupture at all, it isn't neseccary.

[mufasalord]

@Kaali974 lol well that explains alot. thanks 

[YouNo0bz]

Great Video.. Very very helpful I'll sub for you .. you deserve it great job man keep it up ;)

[Itzladner15]

I know this kinda stuff but i hear that a really important thing for rogues to do is to stunlock the person they are fighting in order to get the upper hand how would you go about doing this thanks :)

[VesmarEntertainment]

@Itzladner15 Stunlock is more or less dead now that kidney shot and cheap shot share the same DR. Stunlocking referred to opening on a person with CS and following it up with a KS right before it ended. Meaning that before the opponent has done anything you already have a ton of damage into them, dots up, s/d or whatever. That really isnt the case anymore

[Heartseeker01]

@VesmarEntertainment hey dude im a sub rogue and i have a quick question why not use rupture and garrote i mean sub mastery is bleed effects

[Sirstealthsalot]

@Itzladner15 I stunlock and still kick major booty on my rogue. Opening with ambush is just plain stupid at 85. I open with cheap shot if melee or hunter, then kidney and backstab spam, get recoup up, maybe a SnD, and a hemo on em. Then keep backstabbing and kidney shotting and keeping recoup up.

[nkjuanma]

1 person is a frost mage

[MajorSimon]

@nkjuanma Im a frost mage didnt dislike o_O?

[mindkrall]

Thanks man, just what I was after...

[BigBongoBalls]

its hem-o not he-mo.

[SnaerMayne]

good vid

[TheBrunozxc]

Cool vid...but i have to disagree about the "use everything u have before you use preparation"...

i know...its kinda obvious that the perfect situation will be like that, but the perfect situation almost never happens ;D

I would rather recommend people to "try" to use it after you wasted ur CDs, but if you need another Smoke for a kill...do not hesitate. =D

[FitnessMC]

I don't understand what he means by hemo bleed. I mean it just increases the damage of bleed effects so why wouldn't rupture be a good choice to use???

[TheRaymond7896]

@FitnessMC u need to buy the glyph that makes your hemo bleed the target for 30% of the damage, he forgot to cover it

[FitnessMC]

@TheRaymond7896 thanks

[tofflan555]

do you still use backstab i was watching mercader after last patch 4.2 he sad now u won't need it and use hemo as main cp generator

[MrGolyash]

u rock man :)

[manveru666]

Would instant poison be better than wound poison in battlegrounds?

[VesmarEntertainment]

@manveru666 I personally dont think so. I think that wound poison is necessary to mitigate heals. Most BG teams these days (rated or unrated) tend to have a fair distribution of healers.

[manveru666]

@VesmarEntertainment I see your point but you're losing damage for a mere 10% healing reduction. That seems moot especially with recent healing buffs (200% crit heals).

[deathscream29]

on seconds thought, there is a lot wrong with this guide.

First off, you didn't highlight a few of the other required sub talents.

Nightstalker MUST be 2/2 so in an arena you have an improved chance of getting the first sap, every bit helps a lot.

Remorseless Strikes was nit highlighted either. As much as you talk about energy regen, I'm surprised you forgot/ignored that.

last, you said Glyph of BS or SnD...Scratch BS. The glyph of SnD will help 954798574 times more than 5 energy.

[VesmarEntertainment]

@deathscream29 I agree with you for the most part, however everything that you listed can be switched out for something different based on the situation. This video was to go over the basics and give people a entry level understanding of Sub PvP. I didn't want to just focus on arena or bgs or world pvp - I wanted to give a general overview of rotations/gemming/specing etc.

[Warhamer116]

@VesmarEntertainment BTW what's your opinion on when/how to use Shadowstep?

I mostly reserve it for cc'ing or kiting enemies as a rogue "charge" to close distance if sprint is not available, and bleed amplifier against heavily armored targets like prot warrs or blood dk's (damn the one time i thought, "what would happen if i SS/ambushed Blood DK?" and boom, death strike and full hp)

[pfmar]

what talent do u think i should take away so i can get nightstalker in 2/2 if i have the same talents as the video? and a noobie question. i just started playing wow so. how do i get the action bars as he have?

[Conrado9000]

@pfmar Dowload the addon Bartender, it helps you customise your bars to whatever you want

[deathscream29]

Lol great vid other than the talent build.

2/2 nightstalker or GG.

[CancerChristChest]

FINALLY a guid thats ac tually usefull. Thx allot m8!

[Mulmad1337]

addons? :P

[Ambit10n9]

How long have rogues been able to poison their thrown weapons?

[wildmandaggers1]

@Ambit10n9 a long time

[KaliZma91]

Great video, you know your stuff and this guide really puts down the basics, this helped me a lot :)

[Mulmad1337]

EU or US? and server?

[GraunKee91]

@Mulmad1337 US

[Mulmad1337]

@GraunKee91 too bad :(

[GraunKee91]

@Mulmad1337 mh? i need this fckn recup addon. >.<

[itasTheRogue]

nice video. but what id like u to add are more glyphs pls

[Crosswizz]

Great video, subbed :)

[jokkeglad]

What about "Mastery rating"?

[Shogun1236]

Make a 4.2 guide

[anthcybo]

It's hard to teach someone how to play rogue in 5 minutes because there's so much that's situational, but this was a really good video.

[fenitas95rogue]

i'm going to buy us wow for play in that server cus my server always sleep -.-

[Sapounos]

what addons do you use mate??

[godzillahn]

Nice video, but this is a very basic video, can you go alittle bit deeper with when to pop cd's when to gouge if a mage blinks etc, that would be really helpful for me. Thanks!

[Fernando31611]

NIce guide. Last weekend I tried subtlety PVP. I felt it has more movility but I have had trouble with the DPS wich seems to be so low in coparission to the Mutilate damage. Evicerate does as much damage as one backstab, so it is nearly useless, and SaD is not useful cause many times target is out of mele range. Can you give me any sugestions. I post this because as Muti I used to kill easily Warriors, DK, palls ,mages ano others, but cant do the same as sub. TK

[kentaur3]

@Fernando31611 Thats why you have talent to increase rupture damage.

[fullmetal891]

@Fernando31611 lol u cant just switch to a completly new spec and expect to start owning everyone with it, u have to get used to it and feel how it works. Sub takes a lot more skill in my opinion but has much more potential than Mut.

[DaSexyGoat]

man your actaully the best

[FameMonsterRS]

@locstahftw you want landslide on your main hand + pyrium weapon chain on ur offhand

[locstahftw]

hey vespira i was just wondering which weapon enchants r the best for rogues right now, both assassination and sub? shud i include pyrium weapon chain, hurricane, or landslide? if so which one shud go on which, MH or OH?

[FameMonsterRS]

Hey Vesp, on ur preview to cata pvp vid u are wearing 2 scale slicers by the looks of it, do you use scale slicer/s at all?

[cryonicblue]

I just wanted to thank you for this video, made it easy even for a moron like me to master the basics of sub fun =)

[xDanglesx]

I love you man thankyou so much bro

[PatN889]

Very nice intro video! I'm currently teaching my cf how to PHP on her relatively fresh first 85 and this helps out a ton!

[MrCrystalfang]

Whats that addon that tells you when stuffs off CD like [Heedless Carnage] and stuff

[Pismigioeret]

Can you make an updated video similar to the other one you made (named WoW Patch 4.0 Rogue Guide), of what talents you think are good now, rotations, etc? :)

[VesmarEntertainment]

@Pismigioeret Thats what this video is :D. The reason I dont want to say "use this EXACT talent build" is because there are a ton of 'correct' options depending on your gameplay. PVP is a lot more situational than PVE

[Pismigioeret]

@VesmarEntertainment But this video is subtetly pvp, what about everything else? :D

[FaceSmashGaming]

Hey How To Get Poisons? I Cant FInd Anywhere!

[mordecaitheweedguy]

Great vid man!

[GetGankedProductions]

you fucking own and so does your quality

[Angellight100]

thanks ^^ by: Kreniks 

[Iggy727]

Is the green bar above him an add-on or proc or what? Tyvm

[Crousar]

thanks for the info, i recently bad a rogue going straight PvP since 10 as sub and didn't know much about it till i watched other vids., thanks man for your help

[gardini100]

hmm okay then back to backstabb ..i might wait until i ding 85 since pure hemo build up works great at my lvl 72 love the 29 energy cost and spam of evis hehe..and i used wound on both blades ..but gone change to cripple at off-hand ...have been rogue since the the pure morning "rolled 5 of them to max lvl"...so what do i do ..i learn form the best :)....thanks for the tips !

[FjuskN]

Vespira, please answer!

Are you going to create a new PVP movie? :)

[spectre087]

yo Awesome awesome awesome guide. really detailed and good for people just now learning the basics of sub pvp. I wud rate 5/5 stars if u cud still do that (damn u youtube >: / ) just saying good guide way to go keep it up bro.  - Morphaholic - Chromaggus US

[nperkovic89]

this is the best guild

awsome vespira