"The human self is such a derived, established relation, a relation that relates itself to itself and in relating itself to itself relates itself to another. This is why there can be two forms of despair in the strict sense. If a human self had itself established itself, then there could be only one form: not to will to be oneself, to will to do away with oneself, but there could not be the form: in despair to will to be oneself."
"Such a relation that relates itself to itself, a self, must either have established itself or have been established by another.
If the relation that relates itself to itself has been established by another, then the relation is indeed the third, but this relation, the third, is yet again a relation and relates itself to that which established the entire relation."
"In the relation between two, the relation is the third as a negative unity, and the two relate to the relation and in the relation to the relation; thus under the qualification of the psychical the relation between the psychical and the physical is a relation. If, however, the relation relates itself to itself, this relation is the positive third, and this is the self."
@forthesakeofmovies he did say that he would drain some of the christianity out of it, which i still find hilarious to this day. is that what you mean? if the misunderstanding is deeper i am keen to hear your views on it
@forthesakeofmovies sorry i accidentally deleted your original comment, here it is: How does he so totally misunderstand the whole of The Sickness unto Death and yet know so many of the details? It's as if he's decided to read past whole passages and ignore the spirit of the work.
Basically, he constitutes the definition of despair: he would have to lie to himself to read Kierkegaard this way. It's fascinating!
1) Despair is not the self. Read pages 22-23 of the section "The Universality of Despair", and that becomes an impossible interpretation. Actually, read Kierkegaard's definition of self on the first page, and he makes it quite clear that the self is the positive third.
2) Kierkegaard writes explicitly about what the cure of despair is: faith (or rather, this is the opposite of despair). It's quite clear that this has to do with resting transparently in the power that established one.
@chrisltft For sure; sorry for writing so much. I just get frustrated when people try to read God out of Kierkegaard. Dreyfus does it too (well, for that matter, a lot of existentialists did).
Unfortunately, in doing so they miss wholly what Kierkegaard was saying. Obviously, I am not claiming that I understand Kierkegaard fully; all I can say is that Roderick's interpretation is fundamentally askew, and he isn't really conveying Kierkegaard to the audience.
@forthesakeofmovies point taken. he glosses kierkegaard to set up the point that the self is a despairing relation, which he builds on in the next lecture by tying those concepts to baudrillards view of the world as completely simulated and meaningless. Most of the lecture series end with more than a subtle hint that atheism is an answer that should comfort no one.
@chrisltft i like his interpretation. i don't think that there is anything wrong with contextualizing older writings in modern times, to make them fit. it is not the only way of legitimate and proper interpretation, but it is definitely one way. i don't think that to interpret an older work only in its older context is that only legitimate and appropriate way of interpreting that text, and to say so seems to circumvent the freedom of appropriate and legitimate interpretation
Interesting insights into modern times. Actually, I am not so sure if the difference between "Wurthering Heights" and "Love Story" is as great as he thought. I've seem "Love Story" six or seven times and I have cried each time.
5:05 cut to students in little wool sweaters lol
EZkill25l7 9 months ago 3
@EZkill25l7 I lol'd
pencert 2 months ago
Profound
Smokeclouds702 1 year ago
"The human self is such a derived, established relation, a relation that relates itself to itself and in relating itself to itself relates itself to another. This is why there can be two forms of despair in the strict sense. If a human self had itself established itself, then there could be only one form: not to will to be oneself, to will to do away with oneself, but there could not be the form: in despair to will to be oneself."
forthesakeofmovies 1 year ago
"Such a relation that relates itself to itself, a self, must either have established itself or have been established by another.
If the relation that relates itself to itself has been established by another, then the relation is indeed the third, but this relation, the third, is yet again a relation and relates itself to that which established the entire relation."
forthesakeofmovies 1 year ago
"In the relation between two, the relation is the third as a negative unity, and the two relate to the relation and in the relation to the relation; thus under the qualification of the psychical the relation between the psychical and the physical is a relation. If, however, the relation relates itself to itself, this relation is the positive third, and this is the self."
forthesakeofmovies 1 year ago
@forthesakeofmovies he did say that he would drain some of the christianity out of it, which i still find hilarious to this day. is that what you mean? if the misunderstanding is deeper i am keen to hear your views on it
chrisltft 1 year ago
@forthesakeofmovies sorry i accidentally deleted your original comment, here it is: How does he so totally misunderstand the whole of The Sickness unto Death and yet know so many of the details? It's as if he's decided to read past whole passages and ignore the spirit of the work.
Basically, he constitutes the definition of despair: he would have to lie to himself to read Kierkegaard this way. It's fascinating!
chrisltft 1 year ago
1) Despair is not the self. Read pages 22-23 of the section "The Universality of Despair", and that becomes an impossible interpretation. Actually, read Kierkegaard's definition of self on the first page, and he makes it quite clear that the self is the positive third.
2) Kierkegaard writes explicitly about what the cure of despair is: faith (or rather, this is the opposite of despair). It's quite clear that this has to do with resting transparently in the power that established one.
forthesakeofmovies 1 year ago
@forthesakeofmovies thanks, i'll have another read...
chrisltft 1 year ago
@chrisltft For sure; sorry for writing so much. I just get frustrated when people try to read God out of Kierkegaard. Dreyfus does it too (well, for that matter, a lot of existentialists did).
Unfortunately, in doing so they miss wholly what Kierkegaard was saying. Obviously, I am not claiming that I understand Kierkegaard fully; all I can say is that Roderick's interpretation is fundamentally askew, and he isn't really conveying Kierkegaard to the audience.
forthesakeofmovies 1 year ago
@forthesakeofmovies point taken. he glosses kierkegaard to set up the point that the self is a despairing relation, which he builds on in the next lecture by tying those concepts to baudrillards view of the world as completely simulated and meaningless. Most of the lecture series end with more than a subtle hint that atheism is an answer that should comfort no one.
chrisltft 1 year ago
@chrisltft i like his interpretation. i don't think that there is anything wrong with contextualizing older writings in modern times, to make them fit. it is not the only way of legitimate and proper interpretation, but it is definitely one way. i don't think that to interpret an older work only in its older context is that only legitimate and appropriate way of interpreting that text, and to say so seems to circumvent the freedom of appropriate and legitimate interpretation
lajungesombre 4 months ago
Really well done with some great arguments. The website is a jem too! Thx to whoever organized all of this!
lapzter 1 year ago
The mere marketing and commodification of values and identiy have destroyed values and identity.
TheGamingPhilosopher 1 year ago
I'm sure Richard Linklater, Bill Hicks and this guy all come from the same family.
zootsoot2006 2 years ago
Great lecture, and more relevant than ever! Thanks for uploading these videos.
JacobSchriftman 2 years ago
Interesting insights into modern times. Actually, I am not so sure if the difference between "Wurthering Heights" and "Love Story" is as great as he thought. I've seem "Love Story" six or seven times and I have cried each time.
JayPhilosopher 2 years ago
This was incredibly moving!
phazt 2 years ago
THANK-YOU FOR THIS.
puffetee 2 years ago
no worries
they all end well, but this one is awesome :)
chrisltft 2 years ago 2
thanks
CruSaD3Rs 2 years ago