I wonder if Dick Cheney would have gotten all of his heart surgeries if he was a private citizen? With his pre-existing condition he would have been DENIED! But nope my tax dollars pay for HIS health care and ALL the health care for ALL the politicians, but we the people suffer while they sit and laugh at us. Think about that the next time you get a bill from your insurance company. Greed is awful, and we are the victims. STOP THE REPUBLIACNS and TRUMP FROM REPEALING THE PUBLIC OPTION!
whats really funny to me is that this new health care bill was written by the same companies that ran regular insurance for years. you people are so dumb.this is the scam of all scams. and if you dont know what a ponzi scheme is, maybe you should look it up and learn something.
LMAO! Look at these comments! Americans must be the only people on Earth whose response to getting buttfucked by corporate interests is to descend upon their capital and protest angrily for their right to continued buttfuckings.
How are we getting "buttfucked by corporate interests" ?
I pay $220 a month for health insurance, and in turn they paid for my gallbladder to be taken out 2 years ago. If I didn't have health insurance it would have cost me 45 grand. It's people like Peggy Robertson who go off their health insurance and drive up the cost for everybody else. You're an idiot. Nice language by the way. Real progressive.
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I got an idea, let's destroy our healthcare system because Peggy Robertson didn't keep her health insurance like she should have and then was denied by "golden rule insurance"
More government tactics, sick of this bullcrap. I GUARANTEE THIS LADY CAN GET HEALTH INSURANCE!!! she's prancing all over youtube saying my child can't get health insurance, i can't get health insurance... BOGUS... look elsewhere other than "Golden Rule"... give me your data and I'll get you health insurance, just because it's not affordable is the problem. there needs to be regulation but not infiltration. Hey SEIU/Obama quit trying to rape free markets, you'll screw it up you jerks
I only have one question for Peggy - after filing a 50 million dollar lawsuit against them (you DID sue them, right???) How many millions were you awarded? I would award you AT LEAST 50 million if what you're saying really happened.
...Golden Rule,sells insurance in 30 states, said it would insure a woman who had had a C-section only if it could exclude paying for another one for 3 years. In Colorado, such exclusions are considered discriminatory and are forbidden, so Golden Rule simply rejects Colorado women who have had the surgery, unless they have been sterilized or meet the company's age requirements, the problem here is is over-regulation.
"the problem here is over-regulation" - srsly!? So women who've had the VERY common procedure of a c-section should be prohibited by their insurance companies from having a child for another three years!? How can that be legal?! (If you want to argue w/ my use of the word "prohibited" go ahead, but out-of-pocket costs for a pregnancy are exceedingly PROHIBITIVE for any ordinary person.)
Yes - srsly! Women who have had a C-section are not prohibited by Golden Rule from having a child, they just wont cover the expenses. You get what you pay for. There ARE other insurance companies available for Peggy to use. This story is propaganda.
So who will be collecting all the union dues from the new federal bureaucracy and hospital staff this legislation will create? SEIU obviously. Why is the only choice we have either large insurance companies that jack us around or SEIU getting flushed with cash. Lame.
Why do you need the SEIU tag on the video? They are like the insurance company. They could care less about you. What matters to the people that run it is your membership=dues=power for the ones running it and not you. Do you really think that you are the real reason for there existance?
Workers throughout America need to unite and take the profit motive out of health care. The insurance companies should not be in the position of power to be deciding that the rich should live and the working-class should die.
One more thing, why don't we start talking about "corporate responsibility" for a change, as that's what the real issue is. It's just the propaganda machine doesn't want you thinking that way. Make sense?
Good point, makes you wonder what they're doing in the health-care industry in the first place. They provide to dollars for health-care. Problem is they can legally decide not to provide the dollars, even if you have a policy with them. Again, look at the legal makeup of a corporation.
If, and I mean, IF an insurance company does not pay the benefits it is legally required to pay, then they should be prosecuted by the government. So far, I have not seen any evidence that this happens on any significant scale. If you lie on your application, that is your fault, not theirs.
Again, the insurance company has the upper hand. Does the fact that you had acne when you were 18 have any relevance when your 50? No, would that be considered lying? If the insurance company decides it is, yes. You probably won't see any legal prosecution, as it's up to the insurance company to decide. Going public with an outrageous denial of a claim probably will get the claim paid. It shouldn't have to come down to that.
Again, I don't think insurance companies are doing that. They make money by having customers. If they cheated their customers on a regular basis, they would be in real trouble.
However, we can change the law if need be to make it work better. It does not require a government takeover.
Here's an example that happens all the time. Let's say you're in you middle 30's, at sometime you develop a heart condition. You company "downsizes", you get laid off. Within a year, you find another job, maybe even paying better than the last one. You enroll in their insurance plan, and get rejected because you have a "pre-existing" condition.
Or you develop a medical problem as a result of your job and your employer lets you go. Same deal.
One of the problems with health insurance is that it's tied to your employer. It should be tied to you as in individual. Your home insurance is, as is your car insurance.
This is one of the reasons we in the situation we're in today.
Workers comp only provides insurance for a specified time. Usually a worker that cannot work as a result of a sickness or injury, eventually loses his job, and his insurance. I saw that happen to an individual last year.
Yes, but the President is working to bring that back to. However that is how it got started. The problem is that Medicare and Medicaid have skewed the whole system.
Never thought of that. Insurance companies deny claims all the time and lawyers have gotten rich suing them for "bad faith." But I've never heard of anyone ever being prosecuted.
Now, insurance fraud by a customer - people who file fraudulent claims - they're prosecuted all the time.
Lets talk about responsibility all around. When some states mandate pregnancy coverage for MEN in the policies what do you think that does to costs? There are all sorts of arcane crap from state to state that need to be eliminated before you start to blame the "Big Bad Insurance Companies" for the mess that was created by government. The statists have been causing these things to happen so they can "fix" them. It's a ploy to create new crisis to pry more of your freedoms from your hands.
The lets get that changed. When an insurance company has the option to drop or refuse to cover an individual, that "entity" needs to be out of health-care. I'm aware of "stupid" regulations, but no regulation is like giving a thief the keys to your house. The legal makeup of any corporation puts it's own self interest ahead of everything else. Not by any means good for society in any way shape of function regardless of it's product or service. It wasn't always that way.
My mom didn't have insurance for her first child. That didn't stop her from having seven. Get some responsibility for your own life. Stop being wards of the state.
I wonder just how long it's going to take before this story is proved false. These libtards just sling as much mud as they can as often as they can to achieve their goals. The ends justify the means to them. Disgusting.
You actually think insurance companies are nice people who never deny coverage for healthy people, only to save a little bit of money? You don't think insurance companies are greedy monsters who profit off of letting sick people die? You won't side with better health care because "liberals" want it? You're blind to the fact that the major players AGAINST better health care are lobbyists payed by the insurance companies and the people FOR it are the majority of Americans?
right... its not as if conservatives ever lie to further there agenda *cough fox news *cough. and wtf are you talking about "then ends justify the means" what ends? WHAT MEANS?
I'm not naive enough to think that the SEIU isn't a propagandist organization with ulterior motives. And what makes you think it's the taxpayers who should foot the childcare bill for people who aren't financially capable of raising children on their own? What happened to personal responsibility to your own family? When did you start thinking that your family should be supported by anyone but you?
I thought the argument was about the Insurance Company dropping her. Being responsible is having insurance to cover expenses that cannot be planned for. The fact that an insurance company can drop you for any or no reason, is the issue. So where is the point you're trying to make?
Try to follow the thread. It's about trying to convince people to have the Government take over health insurance. You know that and so does everyone else. Stop with the circular reasoning.
To simplify, lets say you buy a car. It eventually gets paid for, then the car company comes and just takes it from you. Insurance companies do exactly that. So where does "personal responsibility" come into play? You did your "personal responsibility" thing, a their just came and ripped you off.
Bullshit. That's not what insurance companies do. In the first place you aren't "buying" anything. You are joining a continuing coverage program.There is no final point in insurance policies unless it's a term policy. And they only write term policies for life insurance. Health insurance has to be a continuous thing. There is no "interest " paid just a premium for coverage. You really need to learn something instaed of just mouthing talking points.
I'm a "liberal," pro-life woman and Christian. First, Joe, Jesus WAS the original "liberal." And Nevermor77, being a biblical scholar, you should remember the passage (paraphrasing) "I knew you before I formed you in the womb." Clearly, the fetus is a person before it can survive on its own.
This vid is about the insurance companies and their fleecing of the American public. Some people care only for what's good for them and don't give a rip about what others have to go through.
She never said she wants to have another baby and have them pay for it. The insurance company never said they would cover her and not child birth. They said they would not cover her because she MIGHT want to have another child, then she MIGHT have to have a c-section. Stupid person.
The c-section would be more affordable if the health insurance companies didn't drive the price up of every procedure so that people are forced to have to have health insurance that won't cover the procedure they can't afford because of them in the first place.
Even if you decide to have more kids, that should be your choice. A greedy corporation should not have the ability to choose for you, force you to be sterilized and punish you by denying you health insurance if you don't comply with their demands.
There is just too much risk involved. She wants to have another baby. It has to be c-section. Gonna cost a lot of money. Who should pay for it, The new insurance company? Why? They measured the risk and decided it was too great. Pass on this one. They are not saying she cannot have another baby. They are saying, she can pay for it herself. Simple choice. I do not have a problem with that decision.
I'm actually conflicted over this one. I don't think that the CURRENT private system should obligated to pay for as many children as someone wishes to have due to cost considerations.
BUT, I'm in favor of a public option where it would not be a problem. Currently, she wants into a policy that makes no financial sense to the PRIVATE company she seeks business with.
Voila! The whole problem with private insurance in a nutshell.
I think this is actually illegal. The Pregnancy Discrimination Act applies to health insurance coverage. Insurers cannot deny coverage due to pregnancy-related conditions. The past C-section is a pregnancy-related condition. Denying any form of coverage to this person, when that coverage is offered to a person without a history of a C-section is discrimination. I'm not making this up, and am also not surprised that an insurer tries to pull this crap. Happens all the time.
OOPS!...my bad, this is illegal only for employer-sponsored plans with more than 15 enrollees. Amazing that the insurance companies can deny coverage for this.
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just another video from obama's propaganda machine telling lies to america but we're not buying it because we know about the death panels and other stuff hidden in their agenda ! ask yourself would jesus accept this ?
Not another idiot promulgating ridiculous propaganda in the name of God. There are no death panels and if Jesus was of man at this moment I am confident he would be very discontent with what you and others like you believe. The abuse of Christianity in this country is absolutely heartbreaking.
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sorry but jesus values freedom above all and wouldn't support socialist healthcare any more than respected religious politicians like palin and romney do because the fact is people like this woman don't necessarily deserve health care and you and i shouldn't have to pay for their mistakes
Equating socialized medicine to subjugation is just wrong. I find your disposition extremely ironic. Jesus would advocate equalizing the distribution of wealth so that the poor can eat, sleep and be healthy. Sometimes this is called charity. Other times it is a forced redistribution of wealth via taxes. Either way, the poor in this country are aided as Jesus would have liked. So long as the money is put to good use, Jesus would (IMO) be happy. This is a terrible argument.
The lies are from whores of the Health Insurance propaganda machine like yourself. The same ones that lobby vehemently to oppose public health care cause they know as soon as that's available they can't rob people with ridiculous private insurance rates and unethical coverage behavior. That is if you could call bailing out on a victim when they need insurance support the most, real "coverage".
We already know Jesus doesn't accept you padding your wallet at the expense of those in need.
If Jesus came back I'm sure he would want every one of his flock to have health care, not just the people who can afford it. I don't recall the Bible mentioning Jesus charging anyone for miracles. Take a look outside the US...every other first world country has basic government coverage
No, you really don't. Liberals always think they understand Jesus and what he stood for. Trust me on this. He would never have stood for the murdering of over 30 million unborn children simply for a woman's convenience.
Only idiots deal in black and whites. It's not murdering if it's not developed enough to have a working brain. And it's for the benefit of 30 million unborn children who wouldn't have got the care they needed, 60 million parents that can't or won't deal with it, and the rest of society that doesn't have to deal with the burden of keeping them alive. You're saving people a lot of suffering.
Jesus couldn't have understood, most of the kids that were born in his age died.
Come over, you have to do better than that old slogan, "Every child - a wanted child". We still have neglected and abused children today even after the wholesale murder of the unborn. You draw an arbitrary line and say, "oh, they are not really living until they have a working brain!" Tell that to a woman who wanted the child she was carrying. Jesus would have understood and reject liberalism on this issue alone. You cannot have selective compassion.
What old slogan? What? No. Where do you live? Do people get forced to get abortions there? Many women go through trauma regardless of whether or not they wanted it, anyway. That's not the point.
It's not arbitrary, IT'S A NON-WORKING BRAIN. What can't you understand?
And who cares what Jesus would've done? It was 2,000 years ago, before anything that's relevant was even invented. There are many things involved here that the giant brush of "WWJD" can't fucking solve.
Joe, ever researched cannon law? You sound pretty smart, so you should know Jesus said NOTHING about abortion- the idea that a FETUS (different name, now...) is a living human was put into place by MAN, not God- read your history, blind one... and understand you've been duped your whole life.
No, I understand the Bible and the Bible makes it perfectly clear. An unborn child is a person, a life. To kill an unborn child is murdered. No, I have not been duped. Facts are facts.
Based on the Bible. After Able died, Cain had kids. If Adam and Eve were the only people, where did Cain's wife come from. Do you approve of incestuous marriages?
This is the reason I keep telling everybody that the Bible isn't about the age of the earth. Just the age of the Hebrew people. Genesis was handed down by word of mouth through the ages until it was finally written down. Garbled through many generations. I'd bet a lot on it being distorted by personal need by many of the people involved in the hand down through the generations.
Yes, it is arbitrary. Life is life at every stage. We are talking about KILLING an unborn child. It is just that simple. You cannot use terminology to cleanse your conscience.
It's not an unborn "Child". It's cells developing a process that doesn't mean a human conscience until the cells even reach that point in development, because there IS NO BRAIN. There aren't any connections that allow the developing tissue any activity at all.
Life is indeed life at every stage. However, brain activity determines life to us people dealing with reason and knowledge. Again, only idiots deal in black and whites.
Why don't you grab a biology textbook. No where is life defined by when a brain is present. It is an arbitrary distinction you are poorly trying to use to justify murdering an unborn child.
Tell me, would you favor a complete band on abortions once brain activity begins in an unborn child?
That's because life is an abstract idea. You don't find that in science books. It's not an unborn child if it's never been conscious.
And I would, after that, it's a living being. But then, you also have to take into account the mother's health, risks, and other considerations. Again, shades of grey.
No, life is not an abstract idea. We have always known when life begins. Roe vs. Wade was not about when life began, but when does life have rights. You need to come to terms with the fact that you support murdering an unborn child for nothing more than a woman's convenience.
Again with a single woman's convenience thing? You don't learn.
Well, I guess there's something to be said about your nickname, as advanced cognitive functions seem to be just out of your religious ballpark.
Enjoy being sad about the state of the world forever. Abortion is here to stay. Learn it, love it, because you're sure as fuck not going to change the course of progress. Progress always wins at the end, religion always has to be dragged kicking and screaming.
What-the-fuck-ever. I'm not impressed by "THE GUILT OF THE BLOOODDD". Get serious.
I guess the "guilt of their blood" blood will have to take a step back to the benefits (Personal AND social) that a well-thought-out abortion legislation would bring. The reasons for abortions, and jesus doesn't get to say every one of them is bad.
You're just a bump in the system that will soon stop being relevant: Science prevails.
Science is on your side? What, the emotional, religious side of the argument? The one who says "Jesus would have rejected liberalism on this issue alone"? The one who CARES on what side of the political spectrum his fake book character is on?
Semantics, rationale, call it what you will.
Going against Abortion will get you the same thing you're getting today from the War on Drugs. Billions in wasted money, people will still do it (albeit more dangerously), and people nobody wants to take care of.
Nice move...insult the man's religion and then change the subject because you know you are wrong and losing the debate.
so your position is we need more drug addicts and more killing of unborn children because it says money! Is there any doubt why people worry about death panels?
No, I'm saying that no matter how hard you try, science is NOT on your side, because you're not looking at anything but "child murder", when there are more things involved here than your religious sensibilities. Learn to read between the lines, there's a reason people insult your religion.
No, I'm saying that when the PUBLIC wants something that is readily available, even through dangerous means, they will go get it there, risking their lives in the process.
Also, I'm glad you mentioned death panels. That proves my point. You know what they meant by "death panels"? "End of life counseling". That's just adivising you on what you wish be done in case of emergency, only now people can get it before they're terminally-ill. It was even OPTIONAL.
Oh, and the GOP Supported End-of-Life Counseling in 2003 Medicare Bill. I know all of this, and I don't even live in the US. You're a joke.
If you're worried about death panels, it's because you're an idiot.
I worried about death panels because you cannot even admit you are killing an unborn child in an abortion. If people like you can justify abortion so we won't have "Billions in wasted money", what is to stop you from saving that money on backside of life as well.
Counseling is fine, but not when it is done by a doctor who works for the government and thinks like you. Oh, you are old and your brain is not working right. Well, proper brain activity is how we define life now, so take this pill!
If it doesn't think, it's not alive. If it's not alive, it's not killing. The fact that it's tissue following a predetermined process doesn't make it have an inherent value, because it doesn't DO anything yet.
You're worried about death panels because you cannot tell the difference between abortion and euthanasia. This is not how these things are dealt with in the real world.
Doctors don't work for anyone but you. Treatment doesn't change, just who pays them.
Interesting that you have declared and protected yourself as "alive" by YOUR definition. What if my definition of "alive" and "thinking" differs from yours? What if I reduced you down to parts & pieces, flesh and bones? Would that grant me the right to take your life and be justified in doing so because my personal beliefs, realities, and concepts describe you as worthless? And if you are thinking I'm christian or etc... think again. I am 100% agnostic and believe anything is possible. Good day
Your definition of life is skewed by "everything is possible". It's great to think so, but when there is a physical manifestation of our PRESENCE in the brain, we're alive, until that manifestation disappears.
I'm not my liver, or my bones. If you separate every piece of someone, then you kill the brain, then you're killing the person.
Hey, here's a challenge for ya, find a definition of "alive" and "thinking" that DOESN'T include the person who's saying it. Hint: Dictionary.
My definition of life does not exist because I haven't one. I simply posed a hypothetical question which you chose to understand as a belief of mine. You have irrefutably demonstrated yourself to be a closed minded person looking only to argue and prove what you cannot rather than to "think", the very act of which you claim justifies and defines life. Now is this as deep as your thought process goes? Are you going to answer my question or dance around it some more? Who decides what life is? You?
I answered why my belief is backed up by reality. I'm saying the "other" belief doesn't.
The fact that I attributed this "religion" ideology to you doesn't make me close-minded, it makes me prejudiced; dumbass. Learn, THEN use your words.
This abortion issue relies on the VERY definition of "life". I'm saying science and provable facts will eventually BE the definition, not some glorified idea. Law is secular, for the most part.
There is no life if there is no one up there. Remember Schiavo?
"Backed up by reality"? What reality? The ideas that you and some other people might believe at a given moment in time which could change altogether in a matter of minutes? That reality? Or are you referring to the supposed physical laws of this planet that consequently and very much ignored render everything to be impossible? Reality is not universal or constant. Why did you feel like you had to be childish and call me a dumbass? Is it because I'm threatening the foundation to your being?
I understand where you're coming from, really, I do. You feel smarter and better than everybody else "conforming" to regular, old, probably-will-be-changed ideas such as gravity, or relativity, even.
Considering that everything in your reality is up in the air, I bid you goodbye.
Do you seriously consider your way of thinking to be somehow revolutionary?
You're not shaking anyone's beliefs. You're preaching to the choir, even. But your way ouf thinking isn't going to solve anything.
They aren't babies, they are mucus with a potential future. We don't need any more mouths to feed, we can't even take care of our own. And stop acting like you personally know Jesus. Silly Christians.
Real problem with your mind set. You are telling another person you can read their mind. Also, belief that an embryois a person is a religious belief of a sould created and implanted. If we follow science, a human being would be a being with conscious processes. This needs the support of a nervous system. Biggest problem is refusing to believe when someone tells yoiu. That is how you people tortured for conversion and burned witches.
You people? I don't think anybody alive today ever tortured anybody to convert to Christianity. You need to stop it with straw arguments and vitriol. I'll bet that your ancestors have been guilty of as many atrocities as anybody elses. Don't throw stones from a glass house.
Yes I do, I once on the path of becoming a pastor. Funny how you cry about the "unborn" yet you have no problem executing people here in this country, or murdering women the children in Iraq. Yeah. Hypocrisy at it's finest. And then we have real live money changers in the temple, and you pharisees applaud it.
They are unborn for a reason. As I said, we already have enough problems. Just because you believe in some historical fantasy/fiction of how we are created and the morals set therein, doesn't mean I should have to put up with it.
Just accept that your countries health care is borked and get sterilized. It is inhumane to get sterilized against your own will, but would you rather have no insurance if something like cancer pops up or you get into an accident?
If the health care industry mandates that people must be sterilized to receive health care, then people must be sterilized. It's as simple as that.
I have the good sense to not live in the United States. The only thing a baby would cost me is my time, but even maternity leave is common place here for career workers, so I guess it doesn't even cost me that :P
Lol. United States, freedom isn't free, but in my "socialist country" we feel more free than you can even imagine.
They didn't force her to get sterilized. they said THEY wouldn't cover her if she didn't. She can go to another insurance company in any case. You people make it sound like she had no other option. It's just one insurance company. If you don't like their policies then boycott them. That's the problem with people like you. If you don't like something you always point the big gun of government in somebody's face and force them to give you what you want. If you don't like force then don't use it.
I agree in a way - either accept it and get sterilized, or get off your ass and quit working for, and supporting, companies that do this kind of thing - and ESPECIALLY quit expecting politicians to fix it for you.
I don't want "single-payer" so much as I want to not give any of my medical money to the utterly corrupt insurance industry, or anyone else claiming a "right" to "profit" from my relationship with my medical providers.
Or simply get a policy that doesn't cover pregnancy. Save up your own money if you want children. Whether it be your first or fifth, if you can't demonstrate the ability to support children, you shouldn't be having them.
Peggi Robertson, if you can go to Europe and there for a fraction of what you will pay here you can have a child. Take six months off enjoy yourself in Europe and have a child there. In America, insurance companies are concerned with raising profit above human life. If I had an ability to change that, I would make those barbarians pay dearly with their lives. When doctors tell them that patients have above 60% chance and have a good life, they still deny them that. Its absurd how this is going
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My grandad fell and broke his nose in the UK and got free healthcare. When he came back to the US he had to get it re-broken and then re-set because they'd done such a bad job. America has the greatest quality, but I don't think a 2 trillion dollar socialization is the best way to go about fixing an obviously broken healthcare system. We could always start with tort reform....
We already have a population problem. Maybe insurance shouldn't just cover 100% of the cost of a hospital birth after child number two. If you can even afford basic private insurance, (which most of us can't afford!) I don't see why you can't just save some money for a midwife, and have the child at home. Or, if you want this 3rd so bad, save some money and go to an affordable birthing clinic.
it isn't about not being able to afford to raise another child, but the american healthcare and insurance system taking away her right to choose. That is actually taking away her basic human rights.
Americans are like people in zombie films who's loved ones have been bitten. Capitalism has been bitten and turned into a monster, but you guys still see it as some cute mom 'n pop store doing things it's own way - the rest of us are screaming "shoot it in the head. It's not the capitalism you you know!"
Get rid of the insitutionalised sociopathic evil that is your healthcare and go public!
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The health insurance I purchase for my family specifically excludes maternity expenses. This is fine with me because we don't plan to have more children and it keeps the cost of the policy down. Is this not an option in your state?
isn't this what those crazy pro-private health insurance people keep saying socialized health care would do? this is insanity and highly ironic. seems we get better and more humane service with public health care than you americans get. unbelievable...
No you moron, they (Golden Rule) denied coverage to her because she previously had a c-section and they will only cover her if she sterilizes herself. Where are you getting this "other people to pay" claim from? It's the role of insurance companies to provide affordable means to pay for coverage.
No, lafetin, she's had two children and now can't get insurance coverage for a third pregnancy, as she had for the first two on her previous insurer and wants the laws to be changed so that an insurance company can't deny people coverage for rediculous reasons.
She's not having a third child without insurance (rather than just counting on the ER to cover it- that's tax money), and cannot have one with insurance since the company wants to sterylize her.
They have people here burying your reasonable comments so nobody will be able to read them. Typical Neolibtard tactics. They don't seem to realize that they don't own all the presses anymore.
I'VE GOT BALLS OF STEEL
Anakin8th 7 months ago
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I wonder if Dick Cheney would have gotten all of his heart surgeries if he was a private citizen? With his pre-existing condition he would have been DENIED! But nope my tax dollars pay for HIS health care and ALL the health care for ALL the politicians, but we the people suffer while they sit and laugh at us. Think about that the next time you get a bill from your insurance company. Greed is awful, and we are the victims. STOP THE REPUBLIACNS and TRUMP FROM REPEALING THE PUBLIC OPTION!
NowThePeople 9 months ago
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Women: Do you want to have your legs in the stirrups with United Healthcare and Golden Rule as your managed care health insurance company??????
drnone88 2 years ago
whats really funny to me is that this new health care bill was written by the same companies that ran regular insurance for years. you people are so dumb.this is the scam of all scams. and if you dont know what a ponzi scheme is, maybe you should look it up and learn something.
2skullscrushing 2 years ago
I'd advise you have a VBAC water birth at home, but
Who the hell needs more than two kids? There are WAY too many of us. Get sterilized. I did.
Having more than one child already is the ONLY pre-existing condition I think all health plans should be entitled to use.
TLCTugger 2 years ago
Sounds like someone is getting roughed up in one of the nearby rooms.
qstendious 2 years ago
LMAO! Look at these comments! Americans must be the only people on Earth whose response to getting buttfucked by corporate interests is to descend upon their capital and protest angrily for their right to continued buttfuckings.
SAGEBOT500 2 years ago 2
How are we getting "buttfucked by corporate interests" ?
I pay $220 a month for health insurance, and in turn they paid for my gallbladder to be taken out 2 years ago. If I didn't have health insurance it would have cost me 45 grand. It's people like Peggy Robertson who go off their health insurance and drive up the cost for everybody else. You're an idiot. Nice language by the way. Real progressive.
mec554 2 years ago
U mad?
SAGEBOT500 2 years ago
bet your dad makes 150K a year, eh?
Personally if we just lynched every CEO of every healthcare company that'd be a good start
TurboSpaghettiRobot 2 years ago
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mec554 2 years ago
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I got an idea, let's destroy our healthcare system because Peggy Robertson didn't keep her health insurance like she should have and then was denied by "golden rule insurance"
mec554 2 years ago
If people who need health insurance are denied it, then the system is broken.
EvanCWaters 2 years ago
More government tactics, sick of this bullcrap. I GUARANTEE THIS LADY CAN GET HEALTH INSURANCE!!! she's prancing all over youtube saying my child can't get health insurance, i can't get health insurance... BOGUS... look elsewhere other than "Golden Rule"... give me your data and I'll get you health insurance, just because it's not affordable is the problem. there needs to be regulation but not infiltration. Hey SEIU/Obama quit trying to rape free markets, you'll screw it up you jerks
mec554 2 years ago
your guranatee isn't worth the paper it hasn't been printed on. Consider the luxurious curves of a shotgun, and also the merits of fellatio.
howisbabbyformed 2 years ago
Love that "culture of life" you folks have down there in the USA.
crumbinator 2 years ago
I only have one question for Peggy - after filing a 50 million dollar lawsuit against them (you DID sue them, right???) How many millions were you awarded? I would award you AT LEAST 50 million if what you're saying really happened.
LODGE4444 2 years ago
Not the full story being told..
...Golden Rule,sells insurance in 30 states, said it would insure a woman who had had a C-section only if it could exclude paying for another one for 3 years. In Colorado, such exclusions are considered discriminatory and are forbidden, so Golden Rule simply rejects Colorado women who have had the surgery, unless they have been sterilized or meet the company's age requirements, the problem here is is over-regulation.
But you dont get that from this SEIU video!?
Hroethbert 2 years ago
"the problem here is over-regulation" - srsly!? So women who've had the VERY common procedure of a c-section should be prohibited by their insurance companies from having a child for another three years!? How can that be legal?! (If you want to argue w/ my use of the word "prohibited" go ahead, but out-of-pocket costs for a pregnancy are exceedingly PROHIBITIVE for any ordinary person.)
escapetochengdu 2 years ago
Having a child after having a C-section poses risks the insurance company is unwilling to take.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Yes - srsly! Women who have had a C-section are not prohibited by Golden Rule from having a child, they just wont cover the expenses. You get what you pay for. There ARE other insurance companies available for Peggy to use. This story is propaganda.
Hroethbert 2 years ago
capitalism
Ed76638 2 years ago
she... she does know there are OTHER insurance companies, right?
fire2box 2 years ago
So who will be collecting all the union dues from the new federal bureaucracy and hospital staff this legislation will create? SEIU obviously. Why is the only choice we have either large insurance companies that jack us around or SEIU getting flushed with cash. Lame.
noiwudnttrip 2 years ago
Why do you need the SEIU tag on the video? They are like the insurance company. They could care less about you. What matters to the people that run it is your membership=dues=power for the ones running it and not you. Do you really think that you are the real reason for there existance?
billeybop 2 years ago 5
Workers throughout America need to unite and take the profit motive out of health care. The insurance companies should not be in the position of power to be deciding that the rich should live and the working-class should die.
JayPhilosopher 2 years ago
When you pay your cash, the insurance company is only too happy to take your money.
But when you make a claim it's often like pulling hen's teeth.
Been there, done that!
DillonX 2 years ago
Why are not the Private Insurance CEO's prosecuted under Federal RICO statutes for running a racket and killing people?
They need to receive either the death penalty or life without parole for crimes against humanity.
1911arthur 2 years ago
Because they are not doing anything wrong.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
One more thing, why don't we start talking about "corporate responsibility" for a change, as that's what the real issue is. It's just the propaganda machine doesn't want you thinking that way. Make sense?
sonygvf 2 years ago
The responsibility of the corporation is to make money and pay their investors.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
My point exactly. Customers or "policyholders" are second to profit. Health-care is a need, not a "product" sold to the public for profit.
Most civilized countries had this argument 30 years ago.
sonygvf 2 years ago
Insurance companies do not provide healthcare. They provide health insurance. It is a "service" sold on the free market. You can buy it or not.
Why is the President NOT having that argument?
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Good point, makes you wonder what they're doing in the health-care industry in the first place. They provide to dollars for health-care. Problem is they can legally decide not to provide the dollars, even if you have a policy with them. Again, look at the legal makeup of a corporation.
Not the dollar provider you want if you need it.
sonygvf 2 years ago
If, and I mean, IF an insurance company does not pay the benefits it is legally required to pay, then they should be prosecuted by the government. So far, I have not seen any evidence that this happens on any significant scale. If you lie on your application, that is your fault, not theirs.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Again, the insurance company has the upper hand. Does the fact that you had acne when you were 18 have any relevance when your 50? No, would that be considered lying? If the insurance company decides it is, yes. You probably won't see any legal prosecution, as it's up to the insurance company to decide. Going public with an outrageous denial of a claim probably will get the claim paid. It shouldn't have to come down to that.
sonygvf 2 years ago
Again, I don't think insurance companies are doing that. They make money by having customers. If they cheated their customers on a regular basis, they would be in real trouble.
However, we can change the law if need be to make it work better. It does not require a government takeover.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Here's an example that happens all the time. Let's say you're in you middle 30's, at sometime you develop a heart condition. You company "downsizes", you get laid off. Within a year, you find another job, maybe even paying better than the last one. You enroll in their insurance plan, and get rejected because you have a "pre-existing" condition.
Or you develop a medical problem as a result of your job and your employer lets you go. Same deal.
sonygvf 2 years ago
I do not think that happens much at all. Group insurance provided by employers have to take everyone regardless of pre-existing conditions.
If you develop a medical problem related to your job, that is a worker's compensation claim.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
One of the problems with health insurance is that it's tied to your employer. It should be tied to you as in individual. Your home insurance is, as is your car insurance.
This is one of the reasons we in the situation we're in today.
Workers comp only provides insurance for a specified time. Usually a worker that cannot work as a result of a sickness or injury, eventually loses his job, and his insurance. I saw that happen to an individual last year.
sonygvf 2 years ago
Health insurance was started as a benefit given to get around wage control imposed by the government.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Isn't wage control long gone? If I recall it was wage and price control.
sonygvf 2 years ago
Yes, but the President is working to bring that back to. However that is how it got started. The problem is that Medicare and Medicaid have skewed the whole system.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Never thought of that. Insurance companies deny claims all the time and lawyers have gotten rich suing them for "bad faith." But I've never heard of anyone ever being prosecuted.
Now, insurance fraud by a customer - people who file fraudulent claims - they're prosecuted all the time.
jx14aby 2 years ago
Lets talk about responsibility all around. When some states mandate pregnancy coverage for MEN in the policies what do you think that does to costs? There are all sorts of arcane crap from state to state that need to be eliminated before you start to blame the "Big Bad Insurance Companies" for the mess that was created by government. The statists have been causing these things to happen so they can "fix" them. It's a ploy to create new crisis to pry more of your freedoms from your hands.
theunbubba 2 years ago
The lets get that changed. When an insurance company has the option to drop or refuse to cover an individual, that "entity" needs to be out of health-care. I'm aware of "stupid" regulations, but no regulation is like giving a thief the keys to your house. The legal makeup of any corporation puts it's own self interest ahead of everything else. Not by any means good for society in any way shape of function regardless of it's product or service. It wasn't always that way.
sonygvf 2 years ago
"I need more options"....and I want everyone else to pay for it.
Nickelodeon2002 2 years ago
We DEFINITELY, ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY must have the Public Option.
DillonX 2 years ago 4
SEIU=CORRUPTION
elnegroid 2 years ago
My mom didn't have insurance for her first child. That didn't stop her from having seven. Get some responsibility for your own life. Stop being wards of the state.
theunbubba 2 years ago
Wards of the state? WTF are you talking about? This about a health insurance company. They are private companies.
smasher7devourer 2 years ago
No this is about you wanting the government to take money from my pocket for a government option. Don't try to smokescreen me!
theunbubba 2 years ago
I wonder just how long it's going to take before this story is proved false. These libtards just sling as much mud as they can as often as they can to achieve their goals. The ends justify the means to them. Disgusting.
theunbubba 2 years ago
You actually think insurance companies are nice people who never deny coverage for healthy people, only to save a little bit of money? You don't think insurance companies are greedy monsters who profit off of letting sick people die? You won't side with better health care because "liberals" want it? You're blind to the fact that the major players AGAINST better health care are lobbyists payed by the insurance companies and the people FOR it are the majority of Americans?
P.S. I'm not a liberal.
smasher7devourer 2 years ago
right... its not as if conservatives ever lie to further there agenda *cough fox news *cough. and wtf are you talking about "then ends justify the means" what ends? WHAT MEANS?
pigmonkey1 2 years ago
What makes you think this story is false? Are you naive enough to think this stuff doesn't happen?
sonygvf 2 years ago
I'm not naive enough to think that the SEIU isn't a propagandist organization with ulterior motives. And what makes you think it's the taxpayers who should foot the childcare bill for people who aren't financially capable of raising children on their own? What happened to personal responsibility to your own family? When did you start thinking that your family should be supported by anyone but you?
theunbubba 2 years ago
I thought the argument was about the Insurance Company dropping her. Being responsible is having insurance to cover expenses that cannot be planned for. The fact that an insurance company can drop you for any or no reason, is the issue. So where is the point you're trying to make?
sonygvf 2 years ago
The insurance company NEVER issued her a policy in the first place.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Kind of makes you wonder why they call themselves insurance companies doesn't it?
sonygvf 2 years ago
Try to follow the thread. It's about trying to convince people to have the Government take over health insurance. You know that and so does everyone else. Stop with the circular reasoning.
theunbubba 2 years ago
To simplify, lets say you buy a car. It eventually gets paid for, then the car company comes and just takes it from you. Insurance companies do exactly that. So where does "personal responsibility" come into play? You did your "personal responsibility" thing, a their just came and ripped you off.
sonygvf 2 years ago
The word "their" should read "thief". Sorry for the typo.
sonygvf 2 years ago
You pay for coverage for a specific length of time. Insurance companies have a contract with you for their services.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
And when they decide to drop you because you're too much of a "risk" what's that? "Breech of contract?
sonygvf 2 years ago
Bullshit. That's not what insurance companies do. In the first place you aren't "buying" anything. You are joining a continuing coverage program.There is no final point in insurance policies unless it's a term policy. And they only write term policies for life insurance. Health insurance has to be a continuous thing. There is no "interest " paid just a premium for coverage. You really need to learn something instaed of just mouthing talking points.
theunbubba 2 years ago
crazy. I was just watching John Q so... lol
barkerbob5 2 years ago
I'm a "liberal," pro-life woman and Christian. First, Joe, Jesus WAS the original "liberal." And Nevermor77, being a biblical scholar, you should remember the passage (paraphrasing) "I knew you before I formed you in the womb." Clearly, the fetus is a person before it can survive on its own.
This vid is about the insurance companies and their fleecing of the American public. Some people care only for what's good for them and don't give a rip about what others have to go through.
crzdmd 2 years ago
I guess miscarriages are ok then, eh Joe?
Antiks72 2 years ago
Can't afford to have a C-Section for your 3rd child? Sounds like you can't afford a 3rd child you stupid bitch.
Bswainemoreliketpain 2 years ago
yes, exactly. Boo hoo, I want to pay $10.00 a month for insurance so they can pay the $30,000 for my c-section. I cannot afford it myself.
Stupid people
mbspencer 2 years ago
She never said she wants to have another baby and have them pay for it. The insurance company never said they would cover her and not child birth. They said they would not cover her because she MIGHT want to have another child, then she MIGHT have to have a c-section. Stupid person.
smasher7devourer 2 years ago
The c-section would be more affordable if the health insurance companies didn't drive the price up of every procedure so that people are forced to have to have health insurance that won't cover the procedure they can't afford because of them in the first place.
smasher7devourer 2 years ago
Oh shit. i have golden rule too!
aek82 2 years ago
I completely think this insurance situation is wrong.
But...I also don't think you should be popping out kids left and right. Two is enough.
clorenger 2 years ago
ya but she most likely either has two boys and has to go again for the girl or two girls and has to go again for the bouy.
misomercy 2 years ago
Even if you decide to have more kids, that should be your choice. A greedy corporation should not have the ability to choose for you, force you to be sterilized and punish you by denying you health insurance if you don't comply with their demands.
MudkipRex 2 years ago 3
There were no demands. They simply would not cover her for because of the RISK involved.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
There is just too much risk involved. She wants to have another baby. It has to be c-section. Gonna cost a lot of money. Who should pay for it, The new insurance company? Why? They measured the risk and decided it was too great. Pass on this one. They are not saying she cannot have another baby. They are saying, she can pay for it herself. Simple choice. I do not have a problem with that decision.
mbspencer 2 years ago
I'm actually conflicted over this one. I don't think that the CURRENT private system should obligated to pay for as many children as someone wishes to have due to cost considerations.
BUT, I'm in favor of a public option where it would not be a problem. Currently, she wants into a policy that makes no financial sense to the PRIVATE company she seeks business with.
Voila! The whole problem with private insurance in a nutshell.
YoureMistakenSir 2 years ago
It is nothing but sheer barbarism. The woman had a C-section,
so what?
The cure this woman needs is single-payer health care.
wowthungsten 2 years ago
I think this is actually illegal. The Pregnancy Discrimination Act applies to health insurance coverage. Insurers cannot deny coverage due to pregnancy-related conditions. The past C-section is a pregnancy-related condition. Denying any form of coverage to this person, when that coverage is offered to a person without a history of a C-section is discrimination. I'm not making this up, and am also not surprised that an insurer tries to pull this crap. Happens all the time.
dawillardo 2 years ago
OOPS!...my bad, this is illegal only for employer-sponsored plans with more than 15 enrollees. Amazing that the insurance companies can deny coverage for this.
dawillardo 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
just another video from obama's propaganda machine telling lies to america but we're not buying it because we know about the death panels and other stuff hidden in their agenda ! ask yourself would jesus accept this ?
j4pan 2 years ago
No, Jesus wouldn't accept this, because invented nonexistant entities are incapable of accepting anything.
FoolsErrand 2 years ago 3
Not another idiot promulgating ridiculous propaganda in the name of God. There are no death panels and if Jesus was of man at this moment I am confident he would be very discontent with what you and others like you believe. The abuse of Christianity in this country is absolutely heartbreaking.
jjt35 2 years ago 3
This comment has received too many negative votes show
sorry but jesus values freedom above all and wouldn't support socialist healthcare any more than respected religious politicians like palin and romney do because the fact is people like this woman don't necessarily deserve health care and you and i shouldn't have to pay for their mistakes
j4pan 2 years ago
Oh hai, troll!
stereomind23 2 years ago 2
EXCUSE ME!? How the hell is this compassionate? Did your Jesus ever deny anybody a cure who came to him? What the hell is wrong with you...
r3ndrag 2 years ago 2
Lol, at the Jesus defense.
Allboys45 2 years ago
"respected religious politicians like palin"
respected religious palin
respected palin
what?
and then you go on to say that some people "don't deserve health care." what a compassionate christian you must be.
randomwittyname 2 years ago 2
What makes her not deserve it? Why does she not deserve to get covered if she gets shot as much as a religious nutjob like you?
zaidal8 2 years ago
Equating socialized medicine to subjugation is just wrong. I find your disposition extremely ironic. Jesus would advocate equalizing the distribution of wealth so that the poor can eat, sleep and be healthy. Sometimes this is called charity. Other times it is a forced redistribution of wealth via taxes. Either way, the poor in this country are aided as Jesus would have liked. So long as the money is put to good use, Jesus would (IMO) be happy. This is a terrible argument.
jjt35 2 years ago
The lies are from whores of the Health Insurance propaganda machine like yourself. The same ones that lobby vehemently to oppose public health care cause they know as soon as that's available they can't rob people with ridiculous private insurance rates and unethical coverage behavior. That is if you could call bailing out on a victim when they need insurance support the most, real "coverage".
We already know Jesus doesn't accept you padding your wallet at the expense of those in need.
schwegburt 2 years ago 3
If Jesus came back I'm sure he would want every one of his flock to have health care, not just the people who can afford it. I don't recall the Bible mentioning Jesus charging anyone for miracles. Take a look outside the US...every other first world country has basic government coverage
tombrom1 2 years ago 3
Who is Jesus?
Meades17 2 years ago
you are so lucky to not know, to not have the lies force feed through your ears.
sirdownloadsalot 2 years ago
Jesus was quite the opposite of what his right-wing followers claim he is today.
Antiks72 2 years ago 3
You have no idea what Jesus stood for.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Yeah I do.
Antiks72 2 years ago
No, you really don't. Liberals always think they understand Jesus and what he stood for. Trust me on this. He would never have stood for the murdering of over 30 million unborn children simply for a woman's convenience.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Only idiots deal in black and whites. It's not murdering if it's not developed enough to have a working brain. And it's for the benefit of 30 million unborn children who wouldn't have got the care they needed, 60 million parents that can't or won't deal with it, and the rest of society that doesn't have to deal with the burden of keeping them alive. You're saving people a lot of suffering.
Jesus couldn't have understood, most of the kids that were born in his age died.
BadilloKat 2 years ago
Come over, you have to do better than that old slogan, "Every child - a wanted child". We still have neglected and abused children today even after the wholesale murder of the unborn. You draw an arbitrary line and say, "oh, they are not really living until they have a working brain!" Tell that to a woman who wanted the child she was carrying. Jesus would have understood and reject liberalism on this issue alone. You cannot have selective compassion.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
What old slogan? What? No. Where do you live? Do people get forced to get abortions there? Many women go through trauma regardless of whether or not they wanted it, anyway. That's not the point.
It's not arbitrary, IT'S A NON-WORKING BRAIN. What can't you understand?
And who cares what Jesus would've done? It was 2,000 years ago, before anything that's relevant was even invented. There are many things involved here that the giant brush of "WWJD" can't fucking solve.
BadilloKat 2 years ago
Joe, ever researched cannon law? You sound pretty smart, so you should know Jesus said NOTHING about abortion- the idea that a FETUS (different name, now...) is a living human was put into place by MAN, not God- read your history, blind one... and understand you've been duped your whole life.
Nevermor77 2 years ago
No, I understand the Bible and the Bible makes it perfectly clear. An unborn child is a person, a life. To kill an unborn child is murdered. No, I have not been duped. Facts are facts.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Based on the Bible. After Able died, Cain had kids. If Adam and Eve were the only people, where did Cain's wife come from. Do you approve of incestuous marriages?
julian7650 2 years ago
This is the reason I keep telling everybody that the Bible isn't about the age of the earth. Just the age of the Hebrew people. Genesis was handed down by word of mouth through the ages until it was finally written down. Garbled through many generations. I'd bet a lot on it being distorted by personal need by many of the people involved in the hand down through the generations.
theunbubba 2 years ago
Do you really want to argue the Bible here?
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Yes, it is arbitrary. Life is life at every stage. We are talking about KILLING an unborn child. It is just that simple. You cannot use terminology to cleanse your conscience.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
It's not an unborn "Child". It's cells developing a process that doesn't mean a human conscience until the cells even reach that point in development, because there IS NO BRAIN. There aren't any connections that allow the developing tissue any activity at all.
Life is indeed life at every stage. However, brain activity determines life to us people dealing with reason and knowledge. Again, only idiots deal in black and whites.
Drop the bible. Grab a biology textbook.
BadilloKat 2 years ago
Why don't you grab a biology textbook. No where is life defined by when a brain is present. It is an arbitrary distinction you are poorly trying to use to justify murdering an unborn child.
Tell me, would you favor a complete band on abortions once brain activity begins in an unborn child?
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
That's because life is an abstract idea. You don't find that in science books. It's not an unborn child if it's never been conscious.
And I would, after that, it's a living being. But then, you also have to take into account the mother's health, risks, and other considerations. Again, shades of grey.
BadilloKat 2 years ago
No, life is not an abstract idea. We have always known when life begins. Roe vs. Wade was not about when life began, but when does life have rights. You need to come to terms with the fact that you support murdering an unborn child for nothing more than a woman's convenience.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Yes, yes it is.
Again with a single woman's convenience thing? You don't learn.
Well, I guess there's something to be said about your nickname, as advanced cognitive functions seem to be just out of your religious ballpark.
Enjoy being sad about the state of the world forever. Abortion is here to stay. Learn it, love it, because you're sure as fuck not going to change the course of progress. Progress always wins at the end, religion always has to be dragged kicking and screaming.
BadilloKat 2 years ago
Like I said. You have to live with the guilt of their blood, not me.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
What-the-fuck-ever. I'm not impressed by "THE GUILT OF THE BLOOODDD". Get serious.
I guess the "guilt of their blood" blood will have to take a step back to the benefits (Personal AND social) that a well-thought-out abortion legislation would bring. The reasons for abortions, and jesus doesn't get to say every one of them is bad.
You're just a bump in the system that will soon stop being relevant: Science prevails.
BadilloKat 2 years ago
The science is on my side, not yours. At best, you have semantics on your side. How is that soothing your conscience these days?
Benefits, what benefits?
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Science is on your side? What, the emotional, religious side of the argument? The one who says "Jesus would have rejected liberalism on this issue alone"? The one who CARES on what side of the political spectrum his fake book character is on?
Semantics, rationale, call it what you will.
Going against Abortion will get you the same thing you're getting today from the War on Drugs. Billions in wasted money, people will still do it (albeit more dangerously), and people nobody wants to take care of.
BadilloKat 2 years ago
Nice move...insult the man's religion and then change the subject because you know you are wrong and losing the debate.
so your position is we need more drug addicts and more killing of unborn children because it says money! Is there any doubt why people worry about death panels?
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
here's some common sense: shut up
howisbabbyformed 2 years ago
There's intelligence for you.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
No, I'm saying that no matter how hard you try, science is NOT on your side, because you're not looking at anything but "child murder", when there are more things involved here than your religious sensibilities. Learn to read between the lines, there's a reason people insult your religion.
No, I'm saying that when the PUBLIC wants something that is readily available, even through dangerous means, they will go get it there, risking their lives in the process.
BadilloKat 2 years ago
Also, I'm glad you mentioned death panels. That proves my point. You know what they meant by "death panels"? "End of life counseling". That's just adivising you on what you wish be done in case of emergency, only now people can get it before they're terminally-ill. It was even OPTIONAL.
Oh, and the GOP Supported End-of-Life Counseling in 2003 Medicare Bill. I know all of this, and I don't even live in the US. You're a joke.
If you're worried about death panels, it's because you're an idiot.
BadilloKat 2 years ago
I worried about death panels because you cannot even admit you are killing an unborn child in an abortion. If people like you can justify abortion so we won't have "Billions in wasted money", what is to stop you from saving that money on backside of life as well.
Counseling is fine, but not when it is done by a doctor who works for the government and thinks like you. Oh, you are old and your brain is not working right. Well, proper brain activity is how we define life now, so take this pill!
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
If it doesn't think, it's not alive. If it's not alive, it's not killing. The fact that it's tissue following a predetermined process doesn't make it have an inherent value, because it doesn't DO anything yet.
You're worried about death panels because you cannot tell the difference between abortion and euthanasia. This is not how these things are dealt with in the real world.
Doctors don't work for anyone but you. Treatment doesn't change, just who pays them.
I'm bored. You're still an idiot.
BadilloKat 2 years ago
Interesting that you have declared and protected yourself as "alive" by YOUR definition. What if my definition of "alive" and "thinking" differs from yours? What if I reduced you down to parts & pieces, flesh and bones? Would that grant me the right to take your life and be justified in doing so because my personal beliefs, realities, and concepts describe you as worthless? And if you are thinking I'm christian or etc... think again. I am 100% agnostic and believe anything is possible. Good day
qstendious 2 years ago
Your definition of life is skewed by "everything is possible". It's great to think so, but when there is a physical manifestation of our PRESENCE in the brain, we're alive, until that manifestation disappears.
I'm not my liver, or my bones. If you separate every piece of someone, then you kill the brain, then you're killing the person.
Hey, here's a challenge for ya, find a definition of "alive" and "thinking" that DOESN'T include the person who's saying it. Hint: Dictionary.
BadilloKat 2 years ago
My definition of life does not exist because I haven't one. I simply posed a hypothetical question which you chose to understand as a belief of mine. You have irrefutably demonstrated yourself to be a closed minded person looking only to argue and prove what you cannot rather than to "think", the very act of which you claim justifies and defines life. Now is this as deep as your thought process goes? Are you going to answer my question or dance around it some more? Who decides what life is? You?
qstendious 2 years ago
I answered why my belief is backed up by reality. I'm saying the "other" belief doesn't.
The fact that I attributed this "religion" ideology to you doesn't make me close-minded, it makes me prejudiced; dumbass. Learn, THEN use your words.
This abortion issue relies on the VERY definition of "life". I'm saying science and provable facts will eventually BE the definition, not some glorified idea. Law is secular, for the most part.
There is no life if there is no one up there. Remember Schiavo?
BadilloKat 2 years ago
"Backed up by reality"? What reality? The ideas that you and some other people might believe at a given moment in time which could change altogether in a matter of minutes? That reality? Or are you referring to the supposed physical laws of this planet that consequently and very much ignored render everything to be impossible? Reality is not universal or constant. Why did you feel like you had to be childish and call me a dumbass? Is it because I'm threatening the foundation to your being?
qstendious 2 years ago
I understand where you're coming from, really, I do. You feel smarter and better than everybody else "conforming" to regular, old, probably-will-be-changed ideas such as gravity, or relativity, even.
Considering that everything in your reality is up in the air, I bid you goodbye.
Do you seriously consider your way of thinking to be somehow revolutionary?
You're not shaking anyone's beliefs. You're preaching to the choir, even. But your way ouf thinking isn't going to solve anything.
BadilloKat 2 years ago
They aren't babies, they are mucus with a potential future. We don't need any more mouths to feed, we can't even take care of our own. And stop acting like you personally know Jesus. Silly Christians.
phadedlife 2 years ago
You can say it as many times as you like, but YOU know it is a lie. You KNOW the truth that abortion kills an unborn CHILD.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Real problem with your mind set. You are telling another person you can read their mind. Also, belief that an embryois a person is a religious belief of a sould created and implanted. If we follow science, a human being would be a being with conscious processes. This needs the support of a nervous system. Biggest problem is refusing to believe when someone tells yoiu. That is how you people tortured for conversion and burned witches.
julian7650 2 years ago
You people? I don't think anybody alive today ever tortured anybody to convert to Christianity. You need to stop it with straw arguments and vitriol. I'll bet that your ancestors have been guilty of as many atrocities as anybody elses. Don't throw stones from a glass house.
theunbubba 2 years ago
Yes I do, I once on the path of becoming a pastor. Funny how you cry about the "unborn" yet you have no problem executing people here in this country, or murdering women the children in Iraq. Yeah. Hypocrisy at it's finest. And then we have real live money changers in the temple, and you pharisees applaud it.
Antiks72 2 years ago
You cannot argue one with the other. Being on the road once does not mean you know anything. You probably know only enough to be confused.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
You're obviously devoid of common sense.
Antiks72 2 years ago
They are unborn for a reason. As I said, we already have enough problems. Just because you believe in some historical fantasy/fiction of how we are created and the morals set therein, doesn't mean I should have to put up with it.
phadedlife 2 years ago
Again with the word games! Murdering an innocent unborn child for mere convenience. You should have worked for Hitler.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Just accept that your countries health care is borked and get sterilized. It is inhumane to get sterilized against your own will, but would you rather have no insurance if something like cancer pops up or you get into an accident?
If the health care industry mandates that people must be sterilized to receive health care, then people must be sterilized. It's as simple as that.
JayKeaton 2 years ago
Get sterilized because some corporation says you have to. Is that freedom? I'd love to take some of your freedoms away.
unknownmaddness 2 years ago 3
I have the good sense to not live in the United States. The only thing a baby would cost me is my time, but even maternity leave is common place here for career workers, so I guess it doesn't even cost me that :P
Lol. United States, freedom isn't free, but in my "socialist country" we feel more free than you can even imagine.
JayKeaton 2 years ago
They didn't force her to get sterilized. they said THEY wouldn't cover her if she didn't. She can go to another insurance company in any case. You people make it sound like she had no other option. It's just one insurance company. If you don't like their policies then boycott them. That's the problem with people like you. If you don't like something you always point the big gun of government in somebody's face and force them to give you what you want. If you don't like force then don't use it.
theunbubba 2 years ago
I agree in a way - either accept it and get sterilized, or get off your ass and quit working for, and supporting, companies that do this kind of thing - and ESPECIALLY quit expecting politicians to fix it for you.
I don't want "single-payer" so much as I want to not give any of my medical money to the utterly corrupt insurance industry, or anyone else claiming a "right" to "profit" from my relationship with my medical providers.
msbfd 2 years ago
Or simply get a policy that doesn't cover pregnancy. Save up your own money if you want children. Whether it be your first or fifth, if you can't demonstrate the ability to support children, you shouldn't be having them.
theunbubba 2 years ago
Peggi Robertson, if you can go to Europe and there for a fraction of what you will pay here you can have a child. Take six months off enjoy yourself in Europe and have a child there. In America, insurance companies are concerned with raising profit above human life. If I had an ability to change that, I would make those barbarians pay dearly with their lives. When doctors tell them that patients have above 60% chance and have a good life, they still deny them that. Its absurd how this is going
PhotonicDoctor 2 years ago
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My grandad fell and broke his nose in the UK and got free healthcare. When he came back to the US he had to get it re-broken and then re-set because they'd done such a bad job. America has the greatest quality, but I don't think a 2 trillion dollar socialization is the best way to go about fixing an obviously broken healthcare system. We could always start with tort reform....
Cruxshadow97 2 years ago
I hope Americans know that in Canada for childbirth you only pay for parking.
The rest is free.
GenSoda 2 years ago 4
I think the problem is that she can't get ANY health insurance, even if she never intends to have another child.
floydsvoid 2 years ago 4
We already have a population problem. Maybe insurance shouldn't just cover 100% of the cost of a hospital birth after child number two. If you can even afford basic private insurance, (which most of us can't afford!) I don't see why you can't just save some money for a midwife, and have the child at home. Or, if you want this 3rd so bad, save some money and go to an affordable birthing clinic.
12384jamie 2 years ago
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you're a fucking idiot.
chadillac83 2 years ago
Your other option is adoption.
RPRussell 2 years ago
have the child the old fashioned way at home
someuser91 2 years ago
LOLOL @ someuser91
Vibez727727 2 years ago 2
get it right its not capitalism doing this its corporatism
noctu 2 years ago
And "corporatism" is capitalism without boundaries, rules, morals or ethics. In other words, the current American Capitalism.
npog99 2 years ago
you have been listening to michael moore to much he mistakes the two also to call it american capitalism is false if you know your history.
noctu 2 years ago
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your options are to stop having children you can't afford.
iammudkipz 2 years ago
it isn't about not being able to afford to raise another child, but the american healthcare and insurance system taking away her right to choose. That is actually taking away her basic human rights.
cybergothfairy 2 years ago 11
They are not taking away her right to choose. She can have a 3rd baby. She just has to pay for it herself.
mbspencer 2 years ago
So do you think it's reasonable that healthcare companies should no longer pay for giving birth?
thepsion5 2 years ago
My health care provider does not cover birth. Saved me a bunch of money on the premiums.
mbspencer 2 years ago
Americans are like people in zombie films who's loved ones have been bitten. Capitalism has been bitten and turned into a monster, but you guys still see it as some cute mom 'n pop store doing things it's own way - the rest of us are screaming "shoot it in the head. It's not the capitalism you you know!"
Get rid of the insitutionalised sociopathic evil that is your healthcare and go public!
mynewcat 2 years ago 22
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The health insurance I purchase for my family specifically excludes maternity expenses. This is fine with me because we don't plan to have more children and it keeps the cost of the policy down. Is this not an option in your state?
latemesozoic 2 years ago
isn't this what those crazy pro-private health insurance people keep saying socialized health care would do? this is insanity and highly ironic. seems we get better and more humane service with public health care than you americans get. unbelievable...
jellygraph 2 years ago 14
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Wait, so she's already had two children and because she can't afford to have a third she wants other people to pay?
That's what this comes down to. Why should other people pay for this woman to successfully procreate?
I don't care about this woman or her children, get your hand out of my pocket FFS!
lafetin 2 years ago
what the hell are you talking about?
radialmonster 2 years ago
No you moron, they (Golden Rule) denied coverage to her because she previously had a c-section and they will only cover her if she sterilizes herself. Where are you getting this "other people to pay" claim from? It's the role of insurance companies to provide affordable means to pay for coverage.
Mindripper2000 2 years ago 5
No, lafetin, she's had two children and now can't get insurance coverage for a third pregnancy, as she had for the first two on her previous insurer and wants the laws to be changed so that an insurance company can't deny people coverage for rediculous reasons.
She's not having a third child without insurance (rather than just counting on the ER to cover it- that's tax money), and cannot have one with insurance since the company wants to sterylize her.
selfunderstared 2 years ago 6
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ITT fat people mad they can't get insured.
lafetin 2 years ago
They have people here burying your reasonable comments so nobody will be able to read them. Typical Neolibtard tactics. They don't seem to realize that they don't own all the presses anymore.
theunbubba 2 years ago