"Kinds", "Information" I often hear these terms rather vaguely used by young earth creationists. Does kind=baramins? Baramin is not a scientificallly accepted term. It is commonly used by creationists to reduce the number of animals Noah would have to put on the Ark. I so often hear that there is no mechanism for additional information to cause speciation. I assume that they are referring to genetic information? If so, why would there need to be an increase in the sum total of genetic material?
He seemed to fail to mention that if any other these "kinds" interbred, their offspring would be infertile (or would at least become less and less fertile over time)
@kut77less well they COULD, actully, for example the Liger (Lion and Tiger) , and the Cama (Camel and Llama), but these hybrids are born infertile. But you're right, they can't interbreed, that would wouldn't propagate DNA or anything. At any rate, I wac actually SAYING that "kinds" (I'm assuming you mean species) can't interbreed.¬¬
@kut77less So a "kind" is even genetically closer then a species? Or do you mean more of a genus, so less genetically close than a species? Could you be more specific?
@thatguywhodoesvidoes A kind (barmin) is much bigger then a family. Many species constitute a barmin. I'm not sure what you mean by your second question. I mean that a kind is approximately equal to a family, so it is even less genetically close to even a genus. God created lots of diversity within the kinds!
The only things that are consistent with observed facts are the descriptions of variation, adaptation & selection. These are perfectly consistent with evolution. The things that are unverified, like created kinds and Noah's Ark, are only found in creationist literature. Occam's razor can dispense with them easily enough.
What's amazing is how two kangaroos made it thousands of miles to Australia from Turkey. Weird how you find proof of kangaroos only in Australia. Wouldn't you think there would be proof (fossils) in other places since they migrated from the ark? hmmm...
You can't make potato/pepper hybrids. He must have it confused with tomato/pepper hybrids. But all the hybrids mentioned are from similar organisms(except potatoes and peppers) and are infertile. The results of these hybrids are exactly what the theory of evolution would expect. This video is aimed at completely ignorant idiots.
This is a tragic waste of psuedo-intellectualism which is easily falsified without resorting to psuedo scientific semantical wordplay. Religious alchemy is so tragic when it is so easily falsified by Darwinist theory and proponents of secularist scientific thought.
Worthy of our all knowing, all powerful wise creator with low self esteem that constantly demands our praise....This video is a disservice to who created it and those that believe the misinformation in it. It is a shame as the amount of time you took to come up with all this nonsense could have been applied to actually educating yourself on the scientific proof of evolution.
Hohoho - this is funny ... until you realise some people take it seriously.
They've changed their story though - whereas last time they moaned that there wasn't long enough for evolution to take place, now they say it can be done in a measly 5000 years.
I'm glad they brought up dogs though - the first wolf was domesticated at LEAST 30000 years ago.
@jazzx251 Just some bullshit, man. Nowhere it showed me documented trace of wolves being domesticated and thus breeding......a dog. Said it "could be linked", but that's about it, nowhere near "a lengthy page all about the evidence". I'm sorry, I urge you to help me out in my learning. Maybe some more links.
Well - I saw plenty of evidence there myself. Read it again - and read the references (the little numbers by some of the words). You'll be led to pages and pages of DNA evidence, other articles, geological evidence, archeological evidence. There are minor disagreements within science about the origins and age of the first domestic dogs - but all agree it's on a timescale of well over 10 000 years rendering the Young Earth Creationist account complete and utter nonsense.
the more I watch videos like this one, the more I'm convinced that Humanity is fucked.
After we all die out from aggravated stupidity, and if some alien species comes to Earth, I really hope that they don't discover our remains, and thus our history. I'd be fucking ashamed.
Ignorance on parade. Lies and half truths. What is the definition of 'kind', conveniently skipped because it's not a term of science. Dogma dressed up as rationalism, pathetic.
More creationist lies. This doesn't stump biologists at all. In every single case where such hybridization is possible, the two species have kept the same number of chromosomes. Where very closely related species (like humans and chimps) have different number of chromosomes, no interbreeding is possible. In addition, most hybrids are infertile, further squashing the claim that they are of a "kind", whatever that is. Try harder.
This is not a mystery to biologists, what this travesty of a video is saying is complete and utter Bollox. Apart from the fact it's actually trying to use speciation, i.e. evolution to prove the bronze age fiction of the bible correct (lol) it's intellectual dishonesty is quite appalling. It's one thing to disagree, it's another thing entirely to deliberately mislead
Not a mystery? Let's see some of this biology then. I want observable, testable
and repeatable scientific rebuttle please.
No more conjecture and speculation.
No more ad hom's and insults...which is all you offered here(like all any of you evo-devos ever do offer BTW)..but never once have I seen science from you proponents of evolutionary nonsense. Oh and "google it' dont count either....since google can't help you either.
and repeatable" about this is the fact that all religious interventions into science are a practice in an infinitely expanding tautology. You want evidence ? cool here ya go Look for "observed instances of speciation", if you don't like google use any search engine. There are plenty of scientific papers written on it, Joseph Boxhorn's paper is my favourite. I didn't need luck, just a mind that doesn't accept the ol' "god dun it" bull.
Make up your minds evo-devos! did it take millions of years or was it rapid? Amazing.
Again you completely ignore the video, hear what you want in the video and offer only insults and ad hom's as a way to defend the indefensible nonsense of evolution.
In 1943, a 15 year old liger was successfully bred with a lion at the Munich Hellabrunn Zoo. The female cub was of delicate health (to be expected after millenia of speciation) but was able to be raised to adulthood.
You find that my statement (of FACT mind you) messes with your argument, but because you are too ignorant, primitive and/or immature to actually come up with a valid response, you resort to shameless name calling - the basest of diversionary tactics. If what I am saying is wrong, please tell me. Unlike you, I do not get offended by being [respectfully] corrected. I take it with dignity and walk away happy that I'm no longer ignorant. You sir/madame, should learn to do the same.
I'll correct you then, given the subject of this joke of a video: the interbreeding of species forms new species who in turn only breed with themselves after that. Doesn't it bother you that ~99.99% of Ligers are sterile ? In fact, all male Ligers are infertile and only one female wasn't. Just like horses and donkeys produce sterile Mules. Your point does not constitute a coherent argument I'm afraid, just a single exception. A good try, but more work needed.
This only proves that the 2 species lack something that their common descendent had. Making them less compatible. The cousins that they would have been both completely compatible with died out. Look up Salamanders of the San Joaquin Valley. I know this is an evolutionary theory. But its micro not macro. You might say common descent of kinds and how variation sometimes leads to so called speciation.
If this shit was true, oh so many more species and genera would be able to interbreed. Only a small handfull of hybrids can be made, and yet the are estimated to be as many as 100000000 species. Nice try, psuedoscientist.
do you have some sources of some kind? Dinosaur bones are not dated as the original material has been replaced by minerals....so. I do know of one creationist trying to date it anyways, and he actually ended up dating preservative fluids. But anyways, sources pls for your 'C14 in dinosaur bones' claims?
@kut77less I accept Cabon 14 the same way I accept argon, Urianuim, and 12 other isotope dating, also where is your proof, so far you make assumptions, "this must be recent" why what is your driving mechanism for this?
Evolution has a mechanism Natural Selection and it works, it makes sense, and it produce working products like antibiotics, Vaccine, Fibers, GM plants and animals. What working products can you hope to make from your assumptions other then human Zombies.
Now thats the problem...what you state there is nowhere to be found among reputable sites and sources. So a little help perhaps?
//NOTE: argument from assertion//
How so? Lotus is absolutely correct in stating that the evidence from all major sciences involved speaks AGAINST a global flood or a 6000 year old earth. Though it may seem as assertion, the information is readily available, and can only lead to one conclusion: the flood didnt happen...Or bring some proof..
epic fail. haha "Biologists wonder" "Biologists do not know why" Haha and the video glossed over the fact that most if all interbred animals are sterile. I love how religion likes dupe the foolish. Jeez people stop being so lazy and learn about how the world works. Do not listen to these snake oil salesmen.
"Becuase Jumping genes were only active for maybe 800 years "
care to share any proof of such a ridiculous claim? This again is a nice example of starting with the conclusion (flood), and trying to fit the evidence to it. And your not even doing a good job since your statements are completely imaginary and unproven. For a fact, transposons are still active everywhere. Think up something better, dont state bogus shit like transposons were active for only 800 years. Again...Phail
"they don't know any process that can create the biological information necessary for such changes"
Actually we do. It is called DNA. DNA is a nucleic acid that contains the genetic information for all known organisms. When an organism reproduces, its DNA is copied, but due to the massive amounts of information stored in the DNA strand, some parts are falsely copied creating mutations.
//so you believe that the fossil record and the earth was formed by the flood and its results, and post flood the "kinds" diverged into their present state.//
Yes but those kinds post flood kinds are like the same thing. There may be some animals in the fossil record that are variation from the created kind(that weren't in the ark) and do not exist today. Like birds with teeth. This would explain why Chicken have genetic information for making teeth. (this explanation is written very choppy)
//actually evolution has nothing to do with getting better or worse, only the natural selection part of it, but that varies, so evolution could very well be bad as well.//
What I meant by that is over time things should get more complex. This is how we supposedly got from bacteria to humans
I have read a recent Article that showed that the locus of animals showed that there was low variability. This is exactly what we should expect if their was a recent bottleneck after the flood
that is bullshit and you know it. First, without sourcing it this claim is baseless. Secondly, the amount of variation differs from species to species: the cheetah for exampel has apparently suffered from a huge bottle neck, while other species have much more variation, like humans...No single variation number or something can be appointed, and the numbers DO NOT agree with a global flood bottle neck.
//and those kinds evolved into the animals we see today?//
Yes but I would not say that it does not even come close to evolution at all.
1. when the Kinds were created they had great variability and a lot of information available and now there is general low variability (the cheetah for example).
2. There was also many Non-coding DNA that was active like Jumping genes. (but at times these do get activated back again.)
there is also many variation and kinds that have gone extinct
1. This is an unproven statement. Although correct for the cheetah, you absolutely CANNOT stretch that fact to cover all animal species.
2. What is the point of mentioning transposons? The arc would have presented ALL species aboard with a huge population bottleneck, which would be fatal to the species in many cases. Transposons, although a bit helpful, would NOT lead to the variation we see today. Your arguments fail.
//ue? I know that donkeys bred with horses produce mules, but musles are sterile and cannot produce more mules.//
First thing you have to realise is that all mules are NOT sterile
The second point I want to make is that we are not observing that some animals have low vairbilty. This comirms the creation account that animals started to rapidly change. The mechinsim for this is Jumping genes Like i said before
No it does nothing of the sort. It basically sais that the flood couldnt have happened, since one pair of animals of a species, let alone a kind, would have a VERY SMALL gene pool to select upon. To state that one catkind could evolve over 4000 years into the hundreds of different species today, requires SUPER EVOLUTION, from insane mutation rates!!
There simply is no way to store all that information in an animal, unless it somehow magically dissapeared, which is meaningless speculation..
But all creatures in the seas or streams that do not have fins and scales—whether among all the swarming things or among all the other living creatures in the water—you are to detest. And since you are to detest them, you must not eat their meat and you must detest their carcasses. Anything living in the water that does not have fins and scales is to be detestable to you.
That is Right, Jesus doesn't eat at Red Lobster, and neither should you!
These are the birds you are to detest and not eat because they are detestable: the eagle, the vulture, the black vulture, the red kite, any kind of black kite, any kind of raven, the horned owl, the screech owl, the gull, any kind of hawk, the little owl, the cormorant, the great owl, the white owl, the desert owl, the osprey, the stork, any kind of heron, the hoopoe and the Bat.
The Hebrew word for bird is actually owph which means fowl/winged creature. The word owph simply means to fly or has a wing. So, the word includes birds, bats, and even flying insects. The alleged problem appears due to translation of owph as bird. Birds are included in the word owph, but owph is not limited to birds. This shows that translators aren't always perfect when handling the inerrant Word of God.
Then Noah built an altar to the LORD and, taking some of all the clean animals and clean birds, he sacrificed burnt offerings on it. The LORD smelled the pleasing aroma ....
Yes, according to the bible the almighty god LOVES the smell of dead burnt animals.
Blessings on your Bar-B-Cues! That is why we only have them on Sunday becasue the Lord loves the smell of a charcoal briquette.
"Two Cats could produde all the speices seen today"
/facepalm
Ok, seriously there are 40 known species of felids (the Biological family of Cats for you Uneducated). And New World Wild cats CAN not mate with Old world cats.
Why? I am Glad you asked! See New world Felines have a haploid of 18 While old world Felines have a haploid of 19.
In layman's terms (For all you Fundies) Old World Cats have MORE Genes and Chromosomes that old World Felines.
We should study junk DNA to find all of the possible common ancestors each 'kind' has.
That seems reasonable to me. That way, we should be able to find the original, 'god approved' cat.
Oops, when we study junk DNA we find fins, tails, extra nipples, gills, and hair in places where it shouldn't be. What we don't find is one neat little path back to one 'kind.'
"Most Modern Dogs came from just a handful of breeds in the 1600's"
Wrong. Silly Fundie, Science is For Adults.
Humans and Domesticated Dogs have been together for the past 12,000 years. there are currently 85 Breeds in 4 clusters. By 1870 documentation of Pedigree's had been established in England.
Again all this has been previously debunked. Nothing new here.
lol. lmao. as if my non-religious standing has anything to do with empirical science. Do yourself a favor. Go read 'A short history of nearly everything.'
Go learn something about genetic mutation while you're at it. In this case Darwin isn't your target. Mendel is who you are about to hate.
Did you know that it takes a stable population of about 30 to maintain a healthy species? And Noah did it with two huh?
Go read more than a carpenter. Go read the case for a creator. Go read mere christianity. Go read antony flews new book.
According to the Bible, Adam and Eve were created perfectly, and there was no such thing as disease or mutations. The fall had recently happened, and the genetic code was still fairly healthy. It wasnt until after the flood that God made marrying your relatives wrong. Before the flood, you could marry a relative and you wouldnt get mutated kids. Now, we obviously cant.
"Unknown Wifey) Hey! You killed our brother! But I guess it is ok to have sex with you and give you a kid."
Really stupid comment. It wasn't wrong back then as it is know. There would be no mutated kids produced and there would be no one else to have kids. His wife was one of his sisters.
It takes more than your invisible guy saying 'okay it's allowed now.' That's unfair because we're supposed to be arguing in reality. The same rules need to apply or you're full of...
I've read more of those books than I'd like to admit.
And remember, the creator who sends people to the flaming torture chamber of his love gave all the animals in eden immune systems.
Why? If you made a lego paradise, why would you stack it with defenses, and give all the people weapons? [claws, fangs, venom]
not enough genetic diversity? You think we all came from organic soup...hows that for a genetic bottleneck!
I think the reason you dont get it is because these orginal kinds were more complex then the kinds we see today. For example, a wolf kind may be able to produce all the dogs we have today. This is because this involves a loss of genetic information. You cant go from a poodle to a wolf, because thats an INCREASE in genetic information.
The organic soup, as you describe it so nicely, does not present evolution with a genetic bottleneck. There is no known process in genetic that could store all the information of all dogs in one ancestor, you would end up with too many alleles per locus. Mutation and selection is the only process which is able to diversify an ancestor into all the dogkinds.
And from wolf to poodle is NOT a decrease in information, only in variation. Grab a book...
You are to bring into the ark two of all living creatures, male and female, to keep them alive with you.
Gen 7:2
Take with you seven of every kind of clean animal, a male and its mate, and two of every kind of unclean animal, a male and its mate, and also seven of every kind of bird
Omnipotant GOD ...er...um...ah... changed his Mind in the next chapter
7:2 by sevens. The clean kinds of beasts and birds were those suitable for domestication and a form of fellowship with man, as well as for sacrificial offerings. Apparently three pairs of each of these were preserved in order to allow for wider variation in breeding after the Flood. The seventh was offered by Noah in sacrifice when they left the ark (Genesis 8:20).
What mechanism have you invented to stop all the horrible skinless baby mutants from crawling out of their sick parents after the second generation of inbreeding screaming in a pathetic gasping way, and dying off?
You don't understand there would be no genetic mistakes because the genome was clean and free from error. linkage disequilibrium shows that the human linage has a low vairibilty this is exactly what we would expect to see if creation is true
The thing with mutation is that it is random, and uncontrollable. And only the positive mutations survive. With such a small population, the odds of the positive mutation expressing itself perfectly for every pair of animals is just astronomical and totally redonkulous.
You just cannot fit that much mutation, without a stable population, in such a short period of time. It would be like a bad tromavill movie.
and I am considering LD when I talk about variability.
Making every animal on the ark 'perfect' as you put it would only compound mutations super fast. And your only hope is that those mutations are somehow beneficial, because your population is going to be experiencing alot of them in two generations.
I guess god stepped in again and prevented the freakish mutations, and kept all the holy ones for the first thousand years huh?
though genetic recombination can indeed act as a source of variation, the recombination can only recombine existing alleles/genes present in the parents. Therefore, this in no way solves the genetic bottleneck problem Noahs myth presents. You need mutations and selection to arrive at the genetic diversities we see in many species today....
This is nonsence...creationist are the ones who are advocating rapid evolution not the rest of the scientific world. Baraminology is silly.
Skepticktok 1 week ago
No. biologists were not surprised because they know the animals all share a common ancestor.
gregrutz 1 month ago
"Kinds", "Information" I often hear these terms rather vaguely used by young earth creationists. Does kind=baramins? Baramin is not a scientificallly accepted term. It is commonly used by creationists to reduce the number of animals Noah would have to put on the Ark. I so often hear that there is no mechanism for additional information to cause speciation. I assume that they are referring to genetic information? If so, why would there need to be an increase in the sum total of genetic material?
BorgMX5 5 months ago
He seemed to fail to mention that if any other these "kinds" interbred, their offspring would be infertile (or would at least become less and less fertile over time)
thatguywhodoesvidoes 8 months ago
@thatguywhodoesvidoes Kinds can't interbred.
kut77less 8 months ago
@kut77less well they COULD, actully, for example the Liger (Lion and Tiger) , and the Cama (Camel and Llama), but these hybrids are born infertile. But you're right, they can't interbreed, that would wouldn't propagate DNA or anything. At any rate, I wac actually SAYING that "kinds" (I'm assuming you mean species) can't interbreed.¬¬
thatguywhodoesvidoes 8 months ago
@thatguywhodoesvidoes Kinds don't =species. Kinds are approximately equal to the family.
kut77less 7 months ago
@kut77less So a "kind" is even genetically closer then a species? Or do you mean more of a genus, so less genetically close than a species? Could you be more specific?
thatguywhodoesvidoes 7 months ago
@thatguywhodoesvidoes A kind (barmin) is much bigger then a family. Many species constitute a barmin. I'm not sure what you mean by your second question. I mean that a kind is approximately equal to a family, so it is even less genetically close to even a genus. God created lots of diversity within the kinds!
kut77less 7 months ago
@kut77less What KIND is a dinosaur with feathers? A bird without a beak and with teeth?
gregrutz 1 month ago
The only things that are consistent with observed facts are the descriptions of variation, adaptation & selection. These are perfectly consistent with evolution. The things that are unverified, like created kinds and Noah's Ark, are only found in creationist literature. Occam's razor can dispense with them easily enough.
prschuster 1 year ago
What's amazing is how two kangaroos made it thousands of miles to Australia from Turkey. Weird how you find proof of kangaroos only in Australia. Wouldn't you think there would be proof (fossils) in other places since they migrated from the ark? hmmm...
FortheLuIz 1 year ago
You can't make potato/pepper hybrids. He must have it confused with tomato/pepper hybrids. But all the hybrids mentioned are from similar organisms(except potatoes and peppers) and are infertile. The results of these hybrids are exactly what the theory of evolution would expect. This video is aimed at completely ignorant idiots.
urantivirus 1 year ago
This is a tragic waste of psuedo-intellectualism which is easily falsified without resorting to psuedo scientific semantical wordplay. Religious alchemy is so tragic when it is so easily falsified by Darwinist theory and proponents of secularist scientific thought.
timbtufuga 1 year ago
oh, wow. This is a load of crock.
jgordon707 1 year ago
this make me kinda horny; might wanna get f*** a lama...
Orical001 1 year ago
Worthy of our all knowing, all powerful wise creator with low self esteem that constantly demands our praise....This video is a disservice to who created it and those that believe the misinformation in it. It is a shame as the amount of time you took to come up with all this nonsense could have been applied to actually educating yourself on the scientific proof of evolution.
cmsalvagio 1 year ago
We now have science, no need for bronzed age myths written down by a bunch of dessert goat fuckers.
No need for god. Science is so much more awesome. The poor delusional brain dead born agains, they miss out on life's true wonders.
itsasin1969 1 year ago
Hohoho - this is funny ... until you realise some people take it seriously.
They've changed their story though - whereas last time they moaned that there wasn't long enough for evolution to take place, now they say it can be done in a measly 5000 years.
I'm glad they brought up dogs though - the first wolf was domesticated at LEAST 30000 years ago.
jazzx251 1 year ago
@jazzx251 Regions and circumstances of wolf domestication, please. Genius.
SmokiSounds 1 year ago
@SmokiSounds
I may be no genius, but at least I would check the wikipedia entry before making myself look like a dickhead.
Type "wolf domestication" into google and click on the wikipedia entry. You will get a lengthy page all about the evidence for this taking place.
It's a good place to start - then you can follow the references and read all the scientific papers on the subject.
Go away and learn something for once.
jazzx251 1 year ago
@jazzx251 Just some bullshit, man. Nowhere it showed me documented trace of wolves being domesticated and thus breeding......a dog. Said it "could be linked", but that's about it, nowhere near "a lengthy page all about the evidence". I'm sorry, I urge you to help me out in my learning. Maybe some more links.
SmokiSounds 1 year ago
@SmokiSounds
Well - I saw plenty of evidence there myself. Read it again - and read the references (the little numbers by some of the words). You'll be led to pages and pages of DNA evidence, other articles, geological evidence, archeological evidence. There are minor disagreements within science about the origins and age of the first domestic dogs - but all agree it's on a timescale of well over 10 000 years rendering the Young Earth Creationist account complete and utter nonsense.
jazzx251 1 year ago
2:04 LMFAO, two baby dinosaurs getting off the Ark? Guess god didn't think they were worth keeping around.
IlovemyGlock21 1 year ago
the more I watch videos like this one, the more I'm convinced that Humanity is fucked.
After we all die out from aggravated stupidity, and if some alien species comes to Earth, I really hope that they don't discover our remains, and thus our history. I'd be fucking ashamed.
LuigiPeach 1 year ago
@LuigiPeach Tell it brother!!!
I feel precisely the same way - gives me the heebe-jeebees I tell ya.
steveb0503 1 year ago
Ignorance on parade. Lies and half truths. What is the definition of 'kind', conveniently skipped because it's not a term of science. Dogma dressed up as rationalism, pathetic.
disrxt 1 year ago
More creationist lies. This doesn't stump biologists at all. In every single case where such hybridization is possible, the two species have kept the same number of chromosomes. Where very closely related species (like humans and chimps) have different number of chromosomes, no interbreeding is possible. In addition, most hybrids are infertile, further squashing the claim that they are of a "kind", whatever that is. Try harder.
wearealltubes 1 year ago 7
oh boy.... here we go again.... sheep.
mathewod 2 years ago
This is not a mystery to biologists, what this travesty of a video is saying is complete and utter Bollox. Apart from the fact it's actually trying to use speciation, i.e. evolution to prove the bronze age fiction of the bible correct (lol) it's intellectual dishonesty is quite appalling. It's one thing to disagree, it's another thing entirely to deliberately mislead
Drweavil 2 years ago
DRW
Not a mystery? Let's see some of this biology then. I want observable, testable
and repeatable scientific rebuttle please.
No more conjecture and speculation.
No more ad hom's and insults...which is all you offered here(like all any of you evo-devos ever do offer BTW)..but never once have I seen science from you proponents of evolutionary nonsense. Oh and "google it' dont count either....since google can't help you either.
Good luck...you'll need it!
3gdosrsfs 2 years ago
The only thing that is "observable, testable
and repeatable" about this is the fact that all religious interventions into science are a practice in an infinitely expanding tautology. You want evidence ? cool here ya go Look for "observed instances of speciation", if you don't like google use any search engine. There are plenty of scientific papers written on it, Joseph Boxhorn's paper is my favourite. I didn't need luck, just a mind that doesn't accept the ol' "god dun it" bull.
Drweavil 2 years ago 4
So basically you're saying that these "two of each kind" EVOLVED....
lol....
damoos 2 years ago
Yeah and supposedly evolved rapidly...
Make up your minds evo-devos! did it take millions of years or was it rapid? Amazing.
Again you completely ignore the video, hear what you want in the video and offer only insults and ad hom's as a way to defend the indefensible nonsense of evolution.
3gdosrsfs 2 years ago
the bible? are these people for reals?
Frances3654 2 years ago
Jebus dunnit!
odinata 2 years ago
so many problems with the fucking ark story... so full of shit...
Rib64 2 years ago
wow. it only took 150 years but creationists are finally starting to accept evolution.
im not sure if creationists realise what they are admitting in this video
TheProf1988 2 years ago
They skipped over that fact. "Hybrid" animals are infertile. Just like evolution says it should be.
SlashIStheShit 3 years ago
Actually, we now know that is not entirely true.
In 1943, a 15 year old liger was successfully bred with a lion at the Munich Hellabrunn Zoo. The female cub was of delicate health (to be expected after millenia of speciation) but was able to be raised to adulthood.
Timelord42192 2 years ago 2
Actually, you are full of shit.
SlashIStheShit 2 years ago
Oh, how nice :
You find that my statement (of FACT mind you) messes with your argument, but because you are too ignorant, primitive and/or immature to actually come up with a valid response, you resort to shameless name calling - the basest of diversionary tactics. If what I am saying is wrong, please tell me. Unlike you, I do not get offended by being [respectfully] corrected. I take it with dignity and walk away happy that I'm no longer ignorant. You sir/madame, should learn to do the same.
Timelord42192 2 years ago 2
I'll correct you then, given the subject of this joke of a video: the interbreeding of species forms new species who in turn only breed with themselves after that. Doesn't it bother you that ~99.99% of Ligers are sterile ? In fact, all male Ligers are infertile and only one female wasn't. Just like horses and donkeys produce sterile Mules. Your point does not constitute a coherent argument I'm afraid, just a single exception. A good try, but more work needed.
Drweavil 2 years ago
Comment removed
aellypear 2 years ago
This only proves that the 2 species lack something that their common descendent had. Making them less compatible. The cousins that they would have been both completely compatible with died out. Look up Salamanders of the San Joaquin Valley. I know this is an evolutionary theory. But its micro not macro. You might say common descent of kinds and how variation sometimes leads to so called speciation.
CrownIdeas 2 years ago
Are the offspring of lions and tigers fertile?????
pwhittingham 3 years ago
no.
SlashIStheShit 3 years ago
If this shit was true, oh so many more species and genera would be able to interbreed. Only a small handfull of hybrids can be made, and yet the are estimated to be as many as 100000000 species. Nice try, psuedoscientist.
PhiloCentinel 3 years ago
//You can't date a dinosoar and the one's that sopposedly did were fradulant. Of course it co//
You did not answer my question.
kut77less 3 years ago
do you have some sources of some kind? Dinosaur bones are not dated as the original material has been replaced by minerals....so. I do know of one creationist trying to date it anyways, and he actually ended up dating preservative fluids. But anyways, sources pls for your 'C14 in dinosaur bones' claims?
jzuidema 3 years ago
//I assume you only accept carbon dating w//
And i assume that you only expect ages that don't miss with your interpretation
BTW; speaking about carbon dating. How do you explain carbon 14 found in fossils that are suppose to be millions of years old/
//Where does this rapid speciation exist in the fossil record//
Look at animals that are extinct. they were a production of AGEing.
kut77less 3 years ago
@kut77less I accept Cabon 14 the same way I accept argon, Urianuim, and 12 other isotope dating, also where is your proof, so far you make assumptions, "this must be recent" why what is your driving mechanism for this?
Evolution has a mechanism Natural Selection and it works, it makes sense, and it produce working products like antibiotics, Vaccine, Fibers, GM plants and animals. What working products can you hope to make from your assumptions other then human Zombies.
whydid666 1 year ago
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@kut77less "How do you explain carbon 14 found in fossils"
I can`t find one example of this. I can only find articals by creationists.
urantivirus 1 year ago
//Any reference for these "jumping genes" in a peer reviewed journal? And if these are true that warrants any "gaps" for the evolutionists to use.//
Plenty try any site or just google it.
//Furthermore, you have tons of evidence contradicting everything about a global flood and noahs ark. //
NOTE; argument from assertion.
kut77less 3 years ago
//plenty try ans site...//
Now thats the problem...what you state there is nowhere to be found among reputable sites and sources. So a little help perhaps?
//NOTE: argument from assertion//
How so? Lotus is absolutely correct in stating that the evidence from all major sciences involved speaks AGAINST a global flood or a 6000 year old earth. Though it may seem as assertion, the information is readily available, and can only lead to one conclusion: the flood didnt happen...Or bring some proof..
jzuidema 3 years ago
epic fail. haha "Biologists wonder" "Biologists do not know why" Haha and the video glossed over the fact that most if all interbred animals are sterile. I love how religion likes dupe the foolish. Jeez people stop being so lazy and learn about how the world works. Do not listen to these snake oil salesmen.
GabrielGrewal 3 years ago
2:04 lol! It's Noah's pet dinosaurs.
DistinctiveBlend 3 years ago
//Why does incest have such a devastating effect on people and animals? Why has this amazing theory evaded the entire scientific world?//
Its called Mutations.
kut77less 3 years ago
//Dog breeding is totally different than dog's diversifying naturally.//
right after the flood dogs my have been breed at first
//know what "jumping genes" are,//
read the more info section.
kut77less 3 years ago
///saying evolution between "kinds" is impossible?//
Becuase Jumping genes were only active for maybe 800 years
kut77less 3 years ago
"Becuase Jumping genes were only active for maybe 800 years "
care to share any proof of such a ridiculous claim? This again is a nice example of starting with the conclusion (flood), and trying to fit the evidence to it. And your not even doing a good job since your statements are completely imaginary and unproven. For a fact, transposons are still active everywhere. Think up something better, dont state bogus shit like transposons were active for only 800 years. Again...Phail
jzuidema 3 years ago
"they don't know any process that can create the biological information necessary for such changes"
Actually we do. It is called DNA. DNA is a nucleic acid that contains the genetic information for all known organisms. When an organism reproduces, its DNA is copied, but due to the massive amounts of information stored in the DNA strand, some parts are falsely copied creating mutations.
0HI0STATE18 3 years ago
//so you believe that the fossil record and the earth was formed by the flood and its results, and post flood the "kinds" diverged into their present state.//
Yes but those kinds post flood kinds are like the same thing. There may be some animals in the fossil record that are variation from the created kind(that weren't in the ark) and do not exist today. Like birds with teeth. This would explain why Chicken have genetic information for making teeth. (this explanation is written very choppy)
kut77less 3 years ago
//actually evolution has nothing to do with getting better or worse, only the natural selection part of it, but that varies, so evolution could very well be bad as well.//
What I meant by that is over time things should get more complex. This is how we supposedly got from bacteria to humans
kut77less 3 years ago
I have read a recent Article that showed that the locus of animals showed that there was low variability. This is exactly what we should expect if their was a recent bottleneck after the flood
kut77less 3 years ago
that is bullshit and you know it. First, without sourcing it this claim is baseless. Secondly, the amount of variation differs from species to species: the cheetah for exampel has apparently suffered from a huge bottle neck, while other species have much more variation, like humans...No single variation number or something can be appointed, and the numbers DO NOT agree with a global flood bottle neck.
And if you insist, please cite some sources...
jzuidema 3 years ago
//so, is it fair to say that you basically believe in evolution//
Evolution is when you get better things
I believe that Kinds were created very complex and are now getting less complex
//they were created a little further up the tree, like "fish kind" and "amphibian kind"//
Yes it is fair to say this, but there may have been more then one kind of fish
kut77less 3 years ago
//and those kinds evolved into the animals we see today?//
Yes but I would not say that it does not even come close to evolution at all.
1. when the Kinds were created they had great variability and a lot of information available and now there is general low variability (the cheetah for example).
2. There was also many Non-coding DNA that was active like Jumping genes. (but at times these do get activated back again.)
there is also many variation and kinds that have gone extinct
kut77less 3 years ago
1. This is an unproven statement. Although correct for the cheetah, you absolutely CANNOT stretch that fact to cover all animal species.
2. What is the point of mentioning transposons? The arc would have presented ALL species aboard with a huge population bottleneck, which would be fatal to the species in many cases. Transposons, although a bit helpful, would NOT lead to the variation we see today. Your arguments fail.
jzuidema 3 years ago
How much of this is true? I know that donkeys bred with horses produce mules, but musles are sterile and cannot produce more mules.
gloryboundkev 3 years ago
//ue? I know that donkeys bred with horses produce mules, but musles are sterile and cannot produce more mules.//
First thing you have to realise is that all mules are NOT sterile
The second point I want to make is that we are not observing that some animals have low vairbilty. This comirms the creation account that animals started to rapidly change. The mechinsim for this is Jumping genes Like i said before
kut77less 3 years ago
No it does nothing of the sort. It basically sais that the flood couldnt have happened, since one pair of animals of a species, let alone a kind, would have a VERY SMALL gene pool to select upon. To state that one catkind could evolve over 4000 years into the hundreds of different species today, requires SUPER EVOLUTION, from insane mutation rates!!
There simply is no way to store all that information in an animal, unless it somehow magically dissapeared, which is meaningless speculation..
jzuidema 3 years ago
"We are under the New convenate so this does not apply to us."
So then why are Cristians so outspoken about Gays? Surely that is all in Leviticus also, and no longer applies as you said?
GregQzag 3 years ago
//hen why are Cristians so outspoken about Gays? Surely that is all in Leviticus also, and no longer applies as you sa///
Because it says in the new testament that it is wrong.
kut77less 3 years ago
LEV 11:10
But all creatures in the seas or streams that do not have fins and scales—whether among all the swarming things or among all the other living creatures in the water—you are to detest. And since you are to detest them, you must not eat their meat and you must detest their carcasses. Anything living in the water that does not have fins and scales is to be detestable to you.
That is Right, Jesus doesn't eat at Red Lobster, and neither should you!
GregQzag 3 years ago
"That is Right, Jesus doesn't eat at Red Lobster, and neither should you!
"
Out of context quote. This is talking to the Israelites. We are under the New convenate so this does not apply to us.
kut77less 3 years ago
"Kinds"
LEV 11:13
These are the birds you are to detest and not eat because they are detestable: the eagle, the vulture, the black vulture, the red kite, any kind of black kite, any kind of raven, the horned owl, the screech owl, the gull, any kind of hawk, the little owl, the cormorant, the great owl, the white owl, the desert owl, the osprey, the stork, any kind of heron, the hoopoe and the Bat.
Becasue Bat is a kind of Bird right God?
No?
Ooooops.
GregQzag 3 years ago
The Hebrew word for bird is actually owph which means fowl/winged creature. The word owph simply means to fly or has a wing. So, the word includes birds, bats, and even flying insects. The alleged problem appears due to translation of owph as bird. Birds are included in the word owph, but owph is not limited to birds. This shows that translators aren't always perfect when handling the inerrant Word of God.
kut77less 3 years ago
"translators aren't always perfect when handling the inerrant Word of God"
Ah I see. So.. maybe they made a mistake translating the 6 "Day" literal genesis?
What other mistakes have they made? the Flood covered the "whole" earth? "All" the animals were placed in the ark?
Kudos Kut77less. You have started to realize the bible isn't perfect.
GregQzag 3 years ago
And the First thing that Noah did once he got off the Leaky Myth-boat?
GEN 8:20
Then Noah built an altar to the LORD and, taking some of all the clean animals and clean birds, he sacrificed burnt offerings on it. The LORD smelled the pleasing aroma ....
Yes, according to the bible the almighty god LOVES the smell of dead burnt animals.
Blessings on your Bar-B-Cues! That is why we only have them on Sunday becasue the Lord loves the smell of a charcoal briquette.
GregQzag 3 years ago
thanks for posting!! awesome!!
mattea19841984 3 years ago
"Two Cats could produde all the speices seen today"
/facepalm
Ok, seriously there are 40 known species of felids (the Biological family of Cats for you Uneducated). And New World Wild cats CAN not mate with Old world cats.
Why? I am Glad you asked! See New world Felines have a haploid of 18 While old world Felines have a haploid of 19.
In layman's terms (For all you Fundies) Old World Cats have MORE Genes and Chromosomes that old World Felines.
Cat Kinds? Wrong, Wrong, WRONG!
GregQzag 3 years ago
There were most likely two cat kinds but more research has to be done
kut77less 3 years ago
I have an idea.
We should study junk DNA to find all of the possible common ancestors each 'kind' has.
That seems reasonable to me. That way, we should be able to find the original, 'god approved' cat.
Oops, when we study junk DNA we find fins, tails, extra nipples, gills, and hair in places where it shouldn't be. What we don't find is one neat little path back to one 'kind.'
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
lol first you have to explain to them what haploids are.
If it doesn't involve fairy dust, they aren't biting.
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
"Most Modern Dogs came from just a handful of breeds in the 1600's"
Wrong. Silly Fundie, Science is For Adults.
Humans and Domesticated Dogs have been together for the past 12,000 years. there are currently 85 Breeds in 4 clusters. By 1870 documentation of Pedigree's had been established in England.
Again all this has been previously debunked. Nothing new here.
GregQzag 3 years ago
"en together for the past 12,000 "
based on evolutionary assumptions.
kut77less 3 years ago
wholy fcuk.
how much more vague can you get kut77less?
'evolutionary assumptions?'
Dude, I've said it before. Darwin is not who you dislike here. Mendel [the monk who killed god] developed the laws of heredity.
You know, I shouldn't even have to explain this. In fact, let me rephrase it all.... "Genetics. I WIN!!"
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
cool vid!
livingwaterrevivals 3 years ago
AWESOME!!! The antichristian people going to hate this.
Daniel71240 3 years ago
rofl!
so true.....but that's not saying very much. They pretty much hate everything that could promote the idea of a God.
Including us! yay!
livingwaterrevivals 3 years ago
anti-religious thanks a bunch. I have no qualms with which sector the stupid divide themselves into.
I hate that it is my country's ball and chain.
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
could this happen
7CoolKidKevin 3 years ago
"Simply put, this is impossible.
You are trying to cram something the size of a 747 into a VW bug.
No matter how you squirm, you cannot make it fit your time parameters. "
For fitting in animals in the ark please see this link
tinyurl(dot)com/6962jl
kut77less 3 years ago
Simply put, this is impossible.
You are trying to cram something the size of a 747 into a VW bug.
No matter how you squirm, you cannot make it fit your time parameters.
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
while the atheists are claiming they can cram the entire universe into something smaller then the head of the pin....
mattea19841984 3 years ago
lol. lmao. as if my non-religious standing has anything to do with empirical science. Do yourself a favor. Go read 'A short history of nearly everything.'
Go learn something about genetic mutation while you're at it. In this case Darwin isn't your target. Mendel is who you are about to hate.
Did you know that it takes a stable population of about 30 to maintain a healthy species? And Noah did it with two huh?
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
Go read more than a carpenter. Go read the case for a creator. Go read mere christianity. Go read antony flews new book.
According to the Bible, Adam and Eve were created perfectly, and there was no such thing as disease or mutations. The fall had recently happened, and the genetic code was still fairly healthy. It wasnt until after the flood that God made marrying your relatives wrong. Before the flood, you could marry a relative and you wouldnt get mutated kids. Now, we obviously cant.
mattea19841984 3 years ago
"Before the flood, you could marry a relative and you wouldnt get mutated kids. "
yeah. That is where Cain Got his kids from!
GEN 4:17
Cain lay with his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Enoch.
(Unknown Wifey) Hey! You killed our brother! But I guess it is ok to have sex with you and give you a kid.
GregQzag 3 years ago
"Unknown Wifey) Hey! You killed our brother! But I guess it is ok to have sex with you and give you a kid."
Really stupid comment. It wasn't wrong back then as it is know. There would be no mutated kids produced and there would be no one else to have kids. His wife was one of his sisters.
kut77less 3 years ago
explain why they didn't mutate.
Until you can I'm going to say you are creating an insane rationalization so you don't have to leave your comfy little paradigm.
When some parts of my world view don't make sense I am question it like everyone.
But at least mine doesn't make sense in the way that I don't believe in ghosts.
You have to invent a magical man who changes all of physical reality in order for your world view to fit properly.
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
It takes more than your invisible guy saying 'okay it's allowed now.' That's unfair because we're supposed to be arguing in reality. The same rules need to apply or you're full of...
I've read more of those books than I'd like to admit.
And remember, the creator who sends people to the flaming torture chamber of his love gave all the animals in eden immune systems.
Why? If you made a lego paradise, why would you stack it with defenses, and give all the people weapons? [claws, fangs, venom]
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
and where did you get the idea that Noah did it with two? Show me in the bible.
mattea19841984 3 years ago
Noah took two of every species onto the ark.
You're not a big fan of the king James version I guess?
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
but their were 8 people on the ark...thats what I thought you were reffering to. Your right tho, 2 of every animal (except for a few were 7).
mattea19841984 3 years ago
even with 7 'clean' animals there wasn't enough genetic diversity to create the stable species we see everywhere today.
Your only next move is to say that god watched over the uterus of every animal and made sure the genes all sequenced properly.
That totally seems unfair though because nowadays he just lets them suffer and die to test our faith in his loving goodness.
So choose, god is an irrational selective dick, or the flood and creation are bollocks.
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
not enough genetic diversity? You think we all came from organic soup...hows that for a genetic bottleneck!
I think the reason you dont get it is because these orginal kinds were more complex then the kinds we see today. For example, a wolf kind may be able to produce all the dogs we have today. This is because this involves a loss of genetic information. You cant go from a poodle to a wolf, because thats an INCREASE in genetic information.
mattea19841984 3 years ago
Ignorant comments for the win!!! w00t w00t
The organic soup, as you describe it so nicely, does not present evolution with a genetic bottleneck. There is no known process in genetic that could store all the information of all dogs in one ancestor, you would end up with too many alleles per locus. Mutation and selection is the only process which is able to diversify an ancestor into all the dogkinds.
And from wolf to poodle is NOT a decrease in information, only in variation. Grab a book...
jzuidema 3 years ago
"Noah took two of every species onto the ark. "
Straw man argument He took two of every kind
kut77less 3 years ago
"He took two of every kind "
You know you can't even get your biblical facts right, let alone real science.
Gen 6:19
You are to bring into the ark two of all living creatures, male and female, to keep them alive with you.
Gen 7:2
Take with you seven of every kind of clean animal, a male and its mate, and two of every kind of unclean animal, a male and its mate, and also seven of every kind of bird
Omnipotant GOD ...er...um...ah... changed his Mind in the next chapter
GregQzag 3 years ago
" two of every sort shalt"
This is referring to Kind
7:2 by sevens. The clean kinds of beasts and birds were those suitable for domestication and a form of fellowship with man, as well as for sacrificial offerings. Apparently three pairs of each of these were preserved in order to allow for wider variation in breeding after the Flood. The seventh was offered by Noah in sacrifice when they left the ark (Genesis 8:20).
kut77less 3 years ago
Okay, I can see you are going to go kicking. So these 'kinds' operated on the same system of nucleic acids that we do today correct?
I'm just making sure that you're not going to invent extra cell biology to help out god.
Yes or no?
Those 'kinds' used the same cell biology that we do. They had DNA, alleles, and were protein based, sexual organisms.
They even had the immune system that god gave them to fend off all the pathogenic flesh eating viruses he lovingly made for us.
Y/or/N
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
"Y/or/N"
Yes and i already gave you a mechanism for "rapid sepcation"
kut77less 3 years ago
What mechanism have you invented to stop all the horrible skinless baby mutants from crawling out of their sick parents after the second generation of inbreeding screaming in a pathetic gasping way, and dying off?
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
"What mechanism h"
You don't understand there would be no genetic mistakes because the genome was clean and free from error. linkage disequilibrium shows that the human linage has a low vairibilty this is exactly what we would expect to see if creation is true
kut77less 3 years ago
Wow, another rationalization.
The thing with mutation is that it is random, and uncontrollable. And only the positive mutations survive. With such a small population, the odds of the positive mutation expressing itself perfectly for every pair of animals is just astronomical and totally redonkulous.
You just cannot fit that much mutation, without a stable population, in such a short period of time. It would be like a bad tromavill movie.
and you still haven't explained away junk DNA.
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
"and you still haven't explained away junk DNA."
watch my videos on it and there will be videos coming in the future about shared mistakes etc.
"the positive mutation expressing itself perfectly for every pair of animals is just astronomical and totally redonkulous. "
Genetic recombination not mutation (some of it was mutation but most of it wasn't
kut77less 3 years ago
and I am considering LD when I talk about variability.
Making every animal on the ark 'perfect' as you put it would only compound mutations super fast. And your only hope is that those mutations are somehow beneficial, because your population is going to be experiencing alot of them in two generations.
I guess god stepped in again and prevented the freakish mutations, and kept all the holy ones for the first thousand years huh?
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
That doesnt even qualify as a straw man argument...
jzuidema 3 years ago
" Mendel"
Mendel helped out creationism because genetic recomanation is the mechanism and vairbility
kut77less 3 years ago
Yes, *recombination is the vehicle that makes sex so beneficial to a species.
But, if you recombine things too fast, in too small of a population you end up duplicating the mutations that are naturally in every chromosome.
For instance, baldness is carried on the 'X.'
If my dad was bald, and my grandfather on my mother's side was bald, and I married my sister...
every child we had from that point forward would be bald. And we both know that there are worse mutations than baldness...
awormyourhonor 3 years ago
though genetic recombination can indeed act as a source of variation, the recombination can only recombine existing alleles/genes present in the parents. Therefore, this in no way solves the genetic bottleneck problem Noahs myth presents. You need mutations and selection to arrive at the genetic diversities we see in many species today....
jzuidema 3 years ago