Lisbon treaty, Facts V Coir

[pspman2000]

love the video, thats how i like to operate. I debated for 30 minutes with 4 different no campaigners on the street so 2 hours in all. I managed to get them to run out of things to try and counter me with. They all started saying we were recreating the soviet union and when i shot that down , they started bringing up the destruction of the christian world by the eu. All Coir people by the way. I guess we can thank them for being so over the top to actually help the yes side.

[EuropesHope]

NO vote = we are still in the EU, like we are now, and the EU must be more accountable to the people of Europe. It stops the runaway power of the EU parliament and its gravy train expenses.

YES vote = no way back, we can't undo mistakes made in the treaty or the EU, our say in EU is halved. Some countries say is doubled.

The mature thing is to stand up and tell EU to correct the problems, not to give in to the accusing tut-tutting of EU politicians trying to tell us we should be embarrassed.

[tippboi1987]

Im a NO voter but Coir are COWBOYS... do they think people are that stupid?? did anyone get there leaflet in the post?? not one sentence was based on FACT except for the part of irelands voting power will decrease and germany's will increase.. thats the only peice of FACT they have.. Still VOTE NO PEOPLE.. do we really want all that power going 2 the EU????

[RCIRL]

The Gael poll that was accurate to within 0.5% in 2008 puts the No vote at 59%, contradicting the result of the less extensive Red C poll.

NO IS IN THE LEAD 59%

NO TO LISBON.

[RCIRL]

What are you at you moron, if this goes ahead, anything can happen. These guys can do anything they want if its accepted can you not make sense of that????

At least Choir can give examples of how things could possibly happen.

Their is another posting the same, some guy rang up FF office asking why is the economy on the posters, is their anything in the treaty that says Ireland's will benefit from it?

FF response to the question is unbelievable and its worth finding the posting on it.

NO

[lisbonvote2008]

You will be glad to hear i am not a moron! If Lisbon is passed plenty of things can happen plenty more cannot ( alter our local taxs, make us go to war,etc.. the ref commission agree on all those )

[knmurphy1]

Thanks for posting this. The lack of knowledge and ignorance displayed by Coir's receptionist proves the truly moronic organisation they are. Whether you are for or against the Lisbon Treaty,any right minded person must agree that there is no place for these far right nut cases in any democracy.

[lisbonvote2008]

Thank you, your the only person so far to get the whole point of my video.

[xardoxify]

Half truths.

[lisbonvote2008]

me or them or both?

[xardoxify]

The people of Ireland voted twice in referenda for allowing abortion in limited cases. The government is afraid of up setting the looney right wing. Twice the Irish people have been denied to proper laws after voting YES.

[nixxifocal]

The Triple Lock isn't the Seanad, Dáil, and President you gobshite.

[lisbonvote2008]

my mistake of course its the UN sec. concil - sorry about that. But do we really need name calling? ( also guy on the phone didnt seem to know either! )

[nixxifocal]

Apologies for the name calling. You're right, we do not need it.

The guy on the phone didn't know much, bit like yourself. Sorry if that sounds smart but it's true.

Do you really think it's okay that we're voting on the same treaty a second time just because the establishment didn't like the the answer they got the first time?

[lisbonvote2008]

your right also that neither me or guy on phone did not know much - i was very angry at the time i got their leaflet in the door just reacted by making this video. But since then i would like to think i have learned a bit more.

Actually i have no problem with a second vote. In vote I we said no - research was conducted as to the reasons - they were mainly commissioner, abortion,neutrality and lack of understanding. Since then we have a sorted these matter to my statisfaction anyway......

[lisbonvote2008]

.and is it not fair to allow people to vote again after the majority of issues seem to have been sorted out?. Another reason is this, i think we all agree that things need to move foward, just because we voted no does that mean we scrap everything stop right now and start all over again - just because we did not like one or two things in the treaty? The alternative would be around 10years of more talks while the EU sits doing nothing with climate change/Energy/etc.. i would not feel comfortable.

[nixxifocal]

"Since then we have a sorted these matter to my statisfaction anyway"

Not so much as a full stop in the treaty has changed.

[lisbonvote2008]

I know that the treaty is exactly the same as last time, but things are different, for example a commissioner will be kept for each state - yes i know its not law yet. But that is only because each state must say yes to this amendment and i personally don't see the EU promising an amendment then taking it away again - its simple logistics we cant be having votes and referendums for each and every small detail - thats why we elect people in the first place

[aiyic]

If you want to keep Bunreacht na héireann, I have no problem in voting little details. If we give our right to vote on changing little details in our constitution, isn't it the case that we give it up for bigger details? If we give up the protection that our constitution affords us, we're in very murky waters.

Do you know who will be in power in other more powerful EU States in five years? I don't. Who knows what they could do?!

It's immoral that the 'yes' side gets a second bite at cherry.

[lisbonvote2008]

My point about the little details is this, we already give away the right to vote on little details - thats called politics - it would be a logistic nightmare to actually have the public vote on things like planning rights/waste collection/etc..

[aiyic]

A 'no' vote can be a move forward too. There is this myth that we need to be positive, and show EU that we're with the big boys. If we're asked over and over to vote on shit-sandwiches for Fridays, and we say 'no' every time, are we being negative?!

The 'people' of Europe are counting on us to vote no. Businesses want us to vote 'yes'. Isn't there a correlation there?! Of course business want us to vote 'yes'.

The env'ment isn't dependent on passing of The Lisbon Treachery. We can do that now.

[lisbonvote2008]

The environment may not explicitly depend on Lisbon but Lisbon will help. International diplomacy works by making treaties/laws and meetings. This may not be perfect but its the system that has evolved over time and it does give results. I think that having climate change actually written in text for the first time is a very important thing - it changes mindsets and formalizes the problem.

[aiyic]

We are well capable of harmonizing green policies across Europe, but LT doesn't account for regional differences. We give up being Irish citizens, and become what we've been groomed to be for years - EU citizens.

If we say 'no', (which we already did) things stay the same.

[lisbonvote2008]

Unfortunately things we not be the same at all, if Ireland votes no, voting rights, number of commissioners, the English policy towards the EU will all change. A no vote is not as simple as keep what we have, things in life such as EU inevitably move froward we must adapt the rules to meet these changes - Nothing ever stays the same - it is a very dangerous short sighted view point to think we can just hit the pause button for as long as we like.

[aiyic]

You know that democracy will just whither and die if we vote yes. We will be 'represented' (yeah right! We can sing for that), by unelected officials who will be even more beholden to big business than they already are.

Do you think it's fair and just, that the 'Yes' side get a second bite? If they are capable of pissing all over democracy in full view, what are they capable of behind closed doors? Why do are you so trusting of such a corrupt bunch of baby-kissers?

[lisbonvote2008]

Well I don't "know" that democracy will die if i vote yes. Being represented by unelected officials is a tricky one to argue. I never voted for civil servants who make economic policy, UN climate goals- but yet these are all vital to running the world. Its not that i am trusting of "baby-kissers" whatever they are, but rather i dont see the EU as us V them rather a collection of people working for country&common interests - generally that leads to good things.60 years peace good

[aiyic]

Politicians kiss babies when they want to seem they have the common touch. When I say 'they', I don't mean the citizens of Europe, I mean the shadowy elite who are bought and paid for by the multi-nationals.

It's well known that the reason other states didn't get a vote is because the outcome is known in advance - Nein. 60 years peace 'cause the people have had a belly full. USA has barely been out of war in that 60 years, because it's very profitable. If the EU becomes big - count the wars.

[NoLisbon]

Only a 'gangster' will record calls without informing the person that they are being recorded. Vote NO to gangsters.

[lisbonvote2008]

Well i am not a gangster, and i didnt use any names. Also he was manning the phone for an information campaign.

By the way people are not voting on me - so "vote no to gangsters" whats that mean?

[NoLisbon]

Only gangsters record calls without telling the person on the other end that they are recording with the purpose of putting it on the web. It would be a far better thing to inform the person what you intend to do and see what happens. This is called honesty.

[jaymaccool]

"vote yes for increased powers for the EU"

eh im voting NO because of that. The european parliament seem to want to take complete control over all member states at some time in the distant future. seems like lisbon is just a stepping stone for them to do that.

I think europe has enough control over our country right now. recession or no recession.

[lisbonvote2008]

Well its not really increased powers to the EU in my opinion, since if Lisbon goes ahead the member states now actually ( for the first time ) get to start the process of new laws/rules/etc.. and we also have the chance to "red flag" them from the start before they get a chance to snowball. So i actually would prefer that method than the current - were the last the see the new law method.

[shayno125]

coir are a pack of gangsters

[shayno125]

lad get a life

[lisbonvote2008]

I have and i like it.

[PAD1OH]

vote yes for increased fundamental rights, increased powers for the EU and national parliaments, better powers to tackle climate change, better rights for workers, better cross border cooperation on human trafficking and organised crime.

vote yes to allow the EU to offer help and opportunity to new countries in need such as Bosnia.

don't vote the way the fascist, homophobics, conservative nationalists and far right such as Coir, UKIP and the BNP want you to vote.

vote yes for a better future.

[nixxifocal]

"better rights for workers"

Riiiiight.... I guess that's why Michael O'Leary - that champion of working people - is one the Yes side!

[dugges]

Memories of the X Case come flooding back

[lisbonvote2008]

Well i don't leave the country because i work here, should i be " hanged" thats your opinion.

And since the IRA are no longer around your second point is not only illegal, immoral, undemocratic its also a little creepy!. Anyway thanks for insight and viewing the video - just remember to vote, either NO or YES.

[lisbonvote2008]

Actually just after thinking about your comment, " if i vote yes i am a traitor" , but since i never pledged allegiance to any group/organization or nation ( the fact that i am Irish is just the luck of draw in terms of my location at time of birth ) how can i be a traitor to them?

[lisbonvote2008]

If you notice my video doesn't tell you to vote either way, please don't reduce the comments section to emotional rubbish like " ....your a  traitor"

[wutru]

lisbonvote2008, please watch this youtube video. It's a really good debate on the current EU status and treaty. It's debated by Daniel Cohn Bendit(from the Greens and Centre- Right) and Alain Lamassoure(former French minister).

/watch?v=BYh-zjqafbg

or

search for "Agora - EU Treaty"

[wutru]

"The Bishops' Conference welcomes this opportunity to comment, by way of a pastoral reflection, on the Treaty of Lisbon. Our pastoral reflection is called Fostering a Community of Values.

"Support" is nowhere to be found in their statement, but i did find: "inform ourselves about the Lisbon Treaty and to vote".

What they did support though, was the "reflection", and voting, on the Treaty.

[lisbonvote2008]

People need to calm down,this treaty would not have had any effect on abortion in the country - exactly the lies this video was trying to stop. If Lisbon had been passed things would have gone as follows: The commission has an idea, EACH government in the EU looks at the idea if they like it ok if not they yellow flag it for reconsideration in the commission. Finnally then it goes to the parliament if passed there its then Eu Law.

[lisbonvote2008]

..Also the charter of fundamental rights does not superceed the law of a local land - both YES and most ( including Libertas ) NO groups agree.

[NoLisbon]

The Lisbon Treaty gives the EU State a Constitution that is superior to the national constitutions or member states. Arts.1 and 47 TEU.

[lisbonvote2008]

But at least anything in the constitution must be added by agreement of all member, and under Lisbon the nation states actually start the process rather than the current situation where the nations have the last say in the matter

[wutru]

God Bless the Irish. Abortion, properly called Murder, is NOT a fundamental right.

[donegal2]

Well done to Ireland voting against Lisbon Treaty, Do not sign all you rights and laws to the eurocrats.

[ormelling]

I left a reasonable comment on the Coir "Funny Vote No" video today, directing people to RTE Sean Whelan's commentaries on the Lisbon Treaty if they needed more information. I stated that I was undecided up to today, but viewing the facts will vote for a stronger Europe to help balance an off-kilter world. The comment is gone! Poof! "No" groups apparently do not support free speech or democracy. I note that you are not censoring your opponents.

[lisbonvote2008]

Finally a fair voice, thank you :) ( i did remove one reply comment due to bad language and libel of the Catholic church from user"francieszetecs")

[ormelling]

But you know, I am genuinely concerned that we are the only people who have a voice at this crucial moment in Europe's history. Shouldn't the other countries be holding referendums, too? I want to vote YES, but there is a part of me that wonders if I may be morally obliged to vote NO on behalf of my fellow Europeans who are not being allowed to vote at all. Dilemma. Dilemma.

[francieszetecs]

If we accept this Treaty we will also be accepting the UN Charter of Fundamental right..... which will bring in Abortion. homosexual marriages etc...... which are totally against my Catholic beliefs. VOTE NO to protect our future generations!!!

[lisbonvote2008]

The Catholic Church has come out in support of the treaty.

[wutru]

This isn't entirely correct. Please read this:

catholiccommunications[.]ie/li­sbon08/lisbon08-pressrelease[.­]htm

Just take out the brackets in the link.

[GiveMeMyLisbonTreaty]

Haha, you should promote this video more online. This is hilarious!

[trapd0r]

I'm relieved that I have the opportunity to vote on the treaty. Its ironic that our constitution affords us that right but if we vote yes, we won't have that right in future as European law will override our own and the treaty can be ammended after it's past.Therefore our law that says we can vote will be superceeded and changes can be made without our say. We'd be voting away our right to vote.

We deserve better.If ur unsure, please vote no. Only a fool would agree to sumthing their unsure of.

[macker33]

Sign your name to a contract that you dont understand if you want,,,but i wont..

Vote no..