PCB using toner transfer method and photo laser paper

[art23ist]

Can you do this with canvas as well?

[rishikeshsharma1]

CRAP METHOD, NO NEED TO GET PCB SOAKED IN BOILED WATER,

ONLY WASTE OF TIME, GET BETTER RESULT WITH SAME PROCESS EXCLUDING SOAKING IN BOILED WATER IN MUCH LESS TIME

[milkmygoat]

@rishikeshsharma1 How then? No point in saying you can get a better result without soaking in boiled water, in much less time without saying how. Otherwise, it's just flaming.

[KazKylheku]

Forget photo paper. GLOSSY MAGAZINE PAPER rocks! Transfers perfectly in less than one minute of ironing, and super easy to remove! The whole transfer can be done in less than five minutes.

Also: sponge method to etch. Instead of dipping the board in a big tub of etchant, I load etchant into a small sponge and wipe away the copper. This also takes five minutes, using only a small quantity of fresh FeCl.

From laser printing to the first hole being drilled in a pad in less than 10 min!

[banzie74]

@KazKylheku , that sounds great. Why not make a video and post. Also, what do you mean by Glossy Magazine Paper ? Are these available as standard consumables in stores selling printer paper ?

[KazKylheku]

@banzie74 glossy magazine paper is torn from the pages of a glossy magazine. I could make a video but I'm not planning to make any new boards in the near future. Anyway, what I wrote really says it all. Almost. You still use water to remove the glossy magazine paper. But it's very thin so it dissolves without a lot of difficulty. You don't need the heavy scrubbing.

[apache3601]

god bless u :D

[MiShO10O0O]

@6:20 ,, the part i hate the most

[lionangel87]

hi, great vid. i read on the web that different glossy papers give different results, which one do u use?

[shady965]

god I hate studying , why I'm here ? <.<

[tsusec]

i never use mirror printed pcb project......

[kaosmonkeyBG]

Great vid... nicely done. Only comment, responding to some earlier ones. I've been using PNP paper for a while and have NEVER been pleased with the results. The PNP backer is all plastic and has a tendency to curl or smear when exposed to the heat. The thick paper substrate on the glossy inkjet paper eliminates that problem entirely. Starts flat, stays flat. I have about a 95% success rate with this method as opposed to about 15% with PNP.

[TheBlacksabbathfan9]

Pcb= printed circuit board

[MEGASOCKGODS]

whats a pcb

[bedofrazorsqwerty]

BOOOORRING. I think I'd just stick that board under slowly running hot water and go take a freakin dump or make a sandwich or something.

[Joeshitsu]

cant you just order these from china?

[Macka007]

@Joeshitsu sure, but if you do that you wait a week or more, if you fabricate it yourself you're looking at an hour's work

[foman111]

wtf was n tht water it looked dirty

[DanFrederiksen]

nice but how do you get the toner off the tracks after etching?

[hirumapass01]

how hot was the hot water? he didnt seem to feel it! hahahah

[bogdanF132]

Hello! How glossy does the paper have to be? Mirror-like gloss? Thank you!

[alfredpauly]

i am having every thing else pnp.

from where i can buy press n peel paper.in India -kerala

or is there is any substitute for this paper.

can anyone help me

please reply me to alfredpauly@ymail.com

[Macka007]

@alfredpauly press 'n' peel is expensive and the results are reported to not always be as good as glossy paper.

[alfredpauly]

i am having every thing else pnp.

from where i can buy press n peel paper.in India -kerala

or is there is any substitute for this paper.

can anyone help me

please reply me to alfredpauly@ymail.com

[mts0628]

@alfredpauly Any glossy photo paper that you can find. I use an American stationary supply store brand, Staples and it works as good as the HP glossy photo paper. And it's cheaper too. The keys are using a laser printer to print the circuit, and a lot of heat to melt the printed circuit from the paper to the CLEANED PCB. Good luck.

[bombthesystemsnl]

hey!!!my paper does not stick on the board when i leave it on it!!what is wrong?



[pikachuthesquirtle]

at first i thought it said PCP using toner transfer method and photo laser paper. lol

[cumesoftware]

Wives don't like this method. I can guess why. :P

Anyway, it seems to be a good method, but its success depends on a lot of factors like the type of paper, etc. I think the photo-resist method can be done with better results.

[Weatherproof26]

LOL you need more window cleaner!

Nice vid.

[xato909]

works with a inkjet printer? my can print photos but it not laser, does it work? :(

[Macka007]

@xato909 no. You MUST use a laser printer

[RSole52]

ANY toner will work right?

[arg13415]

this can only be a 10 minute toner transfer method if you can work in 2x in real life...

Excellent video though.

[eacf11]

Where can I buy the copper plate from

[eacf11]

where can I get the copper plated board

[YoruHime10105]

Thank you. This video is exactly what I needed!

[kmdo86]

does this need to be printed from a laser printer or can i just use laser photo paper and print from an inkjet printer? just a little curious thanks

[cumesoftware]

@kmdo86 You must print it on a laser printer. The toner melts and adheres to the board and it is not soluble in water.

[rockwizclown]

why dont u just boil water in a pan and place the board in there while it boiling?

[sirloon75]

@rockwizclown I think it can melt or unstick plastic from toner, and damages tracks. Have you tried ?

[mouldeck]

@sirloon75 i saw videos in which people boiled the water in a pan and it seemed to work fine! i didn't try it but as long as the board doesn't touch the bottom of the pan, it can't be damaged. the hotter the water is, the faster paper can be soaked. it can be worth giving a try i think!

[arg13415]

@rockwizclown yeah, please try it!! :) This method is getting improved all the time. Let us know if it works

[charliexrtube]

Great. I will try it.

Thanks.

[Moyo2k]

Does toner transfer work for Inkjets or is it just Lasers

[Macka007]

@Moyo2k inkjets use ink, not toner. It only works with laser printers

[96bikerider96]

mine do not fully transfer, i always get little holes, and have to use a sharpie pen over every trace, what am i doing wrong?

[GmodSkylines]

@96bikerider96 Your doing nothing wrong.. it's just your printer being stupid and having bad quality... it's fine..

[amando96]

@GmodSkylines yeah it's really old, only 600DPI, my results are much better with gloss photo paper :)

[danofpedro]

if you dont mind a bit more cost you could use a transparency paper and don't have to worry about paper sticking. I like this one too though, it looks like it'd save some money. I'll try it.

[ollyk22]

I can't imagine ohp film working but would be interested in results! Cheaper than p&p! How about baking paper, you know, the stuff used for cooking?

My laser tends to burn magazine paper,

[96bikerider96]

wont transparent paper melt in the laser printer though?

[GmodSkylines]

@96bikerider96 No?

[carlnathan]

i have a question. doesn't photo paper have plastic? doesnt it melt on the board when you iron it.. just a question... im planning on printing my circuit on kodak centers, is it okay? thanks

[vjstudio]

do you use a normal piece of copper

[sirloon75]

Yes, normal piece of copperbut a quality copper board. I observed low quality copper boards don't give good results, tracks are blur

[carlnathan]

i know its true but i dont get it. how does the toner protect the copper from being etched?

[sirloon75]

toner from laser printers contains plastic, when you iron the paper, toner (and plastic) melt on the copper board, it gets transfered. Since it's plastic, etchant doesn't remove, you got your PCB at the end... The main issue here to get some paper where toner won't get "integrated" into the paper's structure. That's why glossy papers are better, toner less sticks on it, you can more easily melt it with your iron.

[arg13415]

@sirloon75 Umm, this is absolutely not a normal copper board. This is a copper clad PCB board. It needs to be copper covered plastic or it won't work. A pure copper board would just disintegrate in the ferric chloride.

[ShootingAugust]

@sirloon75 NO, this is NOT a normal piece of copper. It is a copper clad PCB board. Plastic bonded with a thin layer of copper. Otherwise the whole board would be conductive and useless for creating a circuit...

[GmodSkylines]

@vjstudio Dude, what else would you use?

[tubed7]

the quality of the result depends on:

- surface of the copper (well prepared .. free of grease etc.)

- the toner itself (some toners are easier to use than others)

- the temperature of the iron

- the pressure you apply to the iron (and duration perhaps).

-----

This is why I don't use an iron but a modified laminator...... the basics are the same.

[AlexMegaSound]

гы-гы )

[CmdrTobs]

I tried this serval times all failures.

I used photo glossy paper with the ink on full. From iron temperatures starting at hot to paper browning hot. All failures.

Have I missed something in treating the copper or is this a hoaks?

[captinsnot]

can not use a ink jet printer only

Laser-Jet Printers will work the paper you used will work but wax paper works good and is cheep

[rockymountainradio]

@CmdrTobs I have also tried glossy photo paper, you can have some success with it, I made a more simple board than this chap has done and it was 90%ok, had to touch some parts in with a etch resistant pen. I have found that you don;t nead to iron as much as he does but one cannot empahsise enough on the hot water, let it soak the paper compleatly off, and make sure that you do not pull it off at all! I think a better way is to buy sheets of toner transfer at electronics store

[rockymountainradio]

@CmdrTobs I have also found that because photopaper is now waterproof, one cannot rub it off with fingures like he did at the end. one just has to literly let it soak off with time. maybe he has used old stock photopaper? I would still get the transfers from an electronics shop online for an intricate project

[raindogred]

search youtube for "Building a super spy bug transmitter" guy called dazaro3 uses plain old used magazine paper. only heats it for 45 secs. search google "Make PCBs at home with magazine paper and your laser printer" - will be listed first.its all there in black and white:)

[CmdrTobs]

Its ok, I was being a fool with an inkjet.

[gweeto052]

Ink???

You should be using a laser printer not ink-jet

[Hayden3430]

Would of been much quicker to just draw it on with a black pen.

[Macka007]

@Hayden3430 I highly doubt it given the complexity. This comes out cleaner than an average person can draw and is less time consuming if you have more than a few tracks or if you have components with 8 or more pins.

[abasiyire]

hello thanks for your video ,can't I use lexmark X11800 printer for the .. can i known you by your email....

[sirloon75]

toner contains plastic, and cover the copper so etchant can't access it.

[aktechfreak]

etchant needs password? :)

[happyguy82]

sorry for this amateur question but how does the toner prevent the acid from etching off the tracks underneath the print itself? is it because toner isn't water permeable? thanks.

[aktechfreak]

toner is mostly made of plastic, and you know the type of etchant tank u use? yes plastic

[sirloon75]

FYI, the temperature from my iron (the one on the video) is about 180°C. Not toot much I guess, even it is the max. I don't know what would be the optimal temperature, but this is working perfectly for me.

[Lokivoid]

go to your local goodwill, Look for a junked or old laser printer, Remove the Fusing roller asmbley and use that for your iron. It heats up to 200c and it heats bothsides aswell as compresses between the rollers. The other option is just modifying the printer it self to print directly onto the board (the paper is not required to bind the toner just heat). Another option is do it with a inkjet useing resist ink's avoiding toner and heat all togather. But all require some degree of printer moding

[billkab]

This is one of the better vids on here, Way to go.

[thiagocoracini]

Hi there! Really nice video...Very helpful!

Do you, or anybody, knows how to transfer the silkscreen part (top, without copper)?

Thanks!!!

[n4mwd]

6. Now if someone could find an easy way to make the holes.

[n4mwd]

3. The paper is special paper. Thin photo paper works good. I have had good luck with using junk mail catalog covers. The paper needs to be glossy. Glossy paper has a gel coating that makes it glossy and prevents toner penetration into the paper. The toner releases from the paper when the gel is wet.

4. Some laser printers use high temp toner and this kind won't work for making PCB's.

5. The printed image must be pure black and pure white - no gray lines.

6. more

[n4mwd]

Great video!

To answer some of the questions above.

1. Yes, you need a mirror image.

2. You cannot use an ink jet printer. You MUST use a laser printer. Ink jet is dye based and toner is a plastic resin. The resin sticks to copper when heat is applied. If you don't care about fine details, you can first print with an ink jet and then use a toner based photocopier to make a toner based image. This is how you have to do it when you are making PCB's from magazine articles.

3. more..

[simonbaker4]

1. What temp is iron set to?

2. Not really mirror-printed -- should use top-view print of circuit. It will mirror when you apply it.

Good video, shows how much time and pressure needed.

[sirloon75]

My iron is set to max temp, but that's an old one, not heating much. Next time I'll build a PCB, I'll measure the exact temp.

[aktus777]

next time you should use chalk paper. i'm ironing at 2 dots till tracks will be gray and they will be visible in 3D. just after ironing i'm putting hot pcb into water abd then i'm removing paper after about 10-15 secs. chalk on toner is not a violence.

[XXXXXXXXXZZXXXXXXXXX]

Ive tried this a hundred times. The paper WILL NOT stick to the copperclad! WTF?!?!

I'm using Staples Photo Basic Gloss and a very hot iron (turns paper brown)

[adrianmur]

I've seen where he first cleaned the board to remove the oxidation layer with a final stripping pad, and then used "isopropanol 99%" after that it just like this process.

look for "DIY Printed circuit board"

[JustMakingComments]

Instead of pressing down on the iron, put another sheet of paper on top of the printout and slide the iron back and forth.

[mika00969]

If you want to go as cheep as you can then let someone do the etching for you. By the time you get all the materials and know-how, you will destroy a dozens of PCBs (or hundreds in your case :). There is a "PCB Etching Service" on ebay that makes PCBs quite cheap so don`t have to bother

[BlackCow99]

I had sucess of my first try and got it down perfect on my second, I don't know what you are doing wrong. Are you sure you are using a laserjet print? And also make sure you trace the lines really hard with the tip of the iron, that's really important.

[fronkenpoop]

You are using a laser printer aren't you? It may be the toner in the printer that's a problem. Try another printer or print out your design and use a photocopy of it. Turn up the copy contrast as high as possible without compromising the image.

Toner type was (and still is) an issue for me, however, I got some "proper" thermal transfer paper (press n peel blue) and this was much better. This is expensive, so I cut out pieces and tape to a piece of A4 and print on that.

Good luck.

[29125me]

isn't it pain when u put your hand in hot water??? Dont mind if i was wrong... is that really HOT?

[sirloon75]

No, it's not that hot, just medium hot. You can use cold water, it'll take longer. Don't use too hot water as I've observed it may damage tracks.

[29125me]

Ok.. Thanks.. can i use jet printer and not laser?? sorry for disturbing..

[Z1A2K3485]

is there a way to make pcb's with inkjet or just laser/toner

?????????

[sirloon75]

I don't think it would work with inkjet, I've searched for this, found nothing. This is because laser toner contains plastic, which actually results in PCB tracks.

[rboghdady]

Good work and nice video ...

What is the type of glossy used?

[sirloon75]

Thanks. Not necessarily "freshly" printed. The iron will melt down the ink on the paper.

[popscs]

Very nice video!

I wonder if the paper with toner on has to be "freshly" printed or will it work with a premade print too?

[bilygiat]

nice video.... thakns for it!