European Parliament debate on homophobia in Poland

[muiebozgorilor]

@EnolaGay82

nope...

[muiebozgorilor]

@EnolaGay82

I'm an atheist, and my country has suffered greatly because of the nazis...

go figure... I don't like nazis, gypsies, and religious nuts... I'm fine with homos and religious people as long as they mind their fucking bussiness.

[0masakra0]

@mymovie3 The problem is our government - they love EU. Majority of people in Poland (according to the recent pools) are against of Poland being in the EU, of course our government don't give a crap about people's opinions. We have a parliamentary "democracy"... which basically means rule by the elite for the elite. We really don't want EU to force laws on our way of life and our customs, values.

[muiebozgorilor]

homosexuals and gypsies, EU parliament seems to love them...

[erosk07]

I can understand and accept two homosexuals sit at home. But I'll never accept homosexuals walking on the streets, and showing to everyone what orientation they are. It's not how the normal world should looks like. It's not how the nature make us. We should ACCEPT IT, BUT NOT PROMOTE IT!

[camilooo666]

some of previous "speakers" had said "we have our law" or "Poland don't accept perverts". well law is law, if you break rules, you will be punished. Some people in Poland can not understand that, a proudness to be intolerant is embaressing, it is not understandable. They want to earn, live or study in EU but they don't want to accept this value, the value of liberty. pathetic...

[FightingforTRUE]

@camilooo666

You are pathetic.

Youd better read something about democratic tradition of liverty in Poland since late medival time.

Elected king by whole society, rights for Jews, freedom of religion, when you in Europe where burning protestants, Jews and other non-European thinking.

Camilooo it is you who is pathetic. Ich bin polnishe schalchte und ich bin stolz damit, GOLDEN FREEDOM rules!

FUCK YOU all pathetic IGNORANTS who does knot know any facts about Poland but are saying opinions!

[0masakra0]

Hands off from Poland. We don't want pervertions here. Stay away from our country, you have your laws we have ours.

[345nin]

Im from Poland and im proud that Poland doesnt accepted perverts ! (sorry for my english :P)

[RaphaelVaughan]

@345nin Yeah, someone like you should never speak up. Can you even point your country on the map of Europe? Move to Russia. You'll be happy there ;-).

[Simaz12345]

In Holland there is a paedophilia's party.

Paedophiles rights are human rights?

The modern society like western society have no respect for religion or traditions. It is only question when the people will have sex with animals, children, corpses or what so ever. By western standard if a human loves somebody or something he can have sex with that thing. This is a human right to love and have sex. This is a human right that other humans do not discriminate him because he is different.

[Homoholic]

Poland is extremely homophobic. The amount of hateful homophobic comments (in Polish) on YouTube alone is staggering. It's not just uneducated working class thugs & racist skinheads but also catholic fanatics who feel deep hatred towards homosexuals. A lot of Polish victims of homophobic violence do not report it for fear of further discrimination. A lot of Polish people have the same attitude towards the gay rights as the Nazis or the Taliban.

[ignaciojd3]

why the fuck is supercatholic-underdeveloped poland in the EU..?, in the first place

[lundholmproduction]

So if there were no gay people what would the catolic church do witout them. Who would they blame then for the issues in the world.

[ilieklolcatz]

Since when does the Catholic church blame gays for "the issues in the world?"

[lundholmproduction]

What planet are you living on. Read all the things catlic people say about gay people and what there point of view is.

[lundholmproduction]

It´s ok to have a point of view of your own. But there are rules of state that the church also must follow. One of them are human rights It´s not allowed to discriminate people of rase, gender or sexual preferenses or handicap etc. There to sexual preferenses gay or straight or both. If hte church don´t follow state rules there also make the choice to stand outside the state or nation.

[lanthasmj]

There is a difference between Free Speech and Hate Speech!

[AG0525]

Hmmm, what ifff ... i dont give a shit who my neighbour have love/sex with. I dont like parades after 22:00. And i am not a big suporter of "naked" parades and nudity in publics places (i am OK with naked girls everywhere thou :) And i am against gay people touching me, when i am in bad mood :D.

Does it make me straight, bisexual, or homofobic? Or maybe gay? Becouse my girfriend called me FAG yesterday and hang up the phone :) (Basketball, beer and girls is a bad mix).

Greets from LiThuania

[IustitiaPax]

The European Union has been hijacked by Cultural Revolutionaries from the post-Marxist scene and by Freemasonry. A dangerous combination which in the past already facilitated the largest genocides of the world: e.g. by the Republican reds in Spain, and especially in the Soviet Union and the East Block. Homosexuality is a psychological disorder, which - if practiced - reduces the average male life expectancy to 44 yrs, instead of 76 yrs. Enough reason to block homo-ideology. Viva Europa LIBRE!

[CalifaJohn]

The people who committed those genocides were people like you. The fascist Falange killed Spain's greatest literary figure of the 20th century, Federico Garcia Lorca because he was an open gay man who spoke for freedom. And you are confused. The Spanish Republicans and the "Reds" (I assume you mean Communists) were differing ideologies and both were included in the killings by Falange.

[IustitiaPax]

Mr Lorca simply died in a prison and was nót "killed"; another martyr myth of the leftists and gay ideologues refuted. The Spanish Republicans were a mixed bunch of Marxists, Liberals, Anarchists and Basque/Catalan separatists, but the Marxists and anarchists were the genocide masters, while the "liberal democrats" and the separatists silently consented. I am not a member of the Falange, or a supporter, nor do I support murder or genocide, or the arrest of Lorca. Please think differentiatedly.

[CalifaJohn]

Happy that you do not support Falange.

Your statement about blocking "homo-ideology" conflicts with your hope for a free Europe. How can you promote freedom while blocking people from making their own life choices?

The study regarding reduced life expectancy for gay men had seriously flawed methodology. Besides, how does personal risk factor allow you to determine someone else's choice. Choosing a career as a sea fisherman reduces life expectancy, but do you advocate blocking it as a choice?

[IustitiaPax]

Destructive life styles and auto-destruction should not be allowed by a just state of European cooperation. Freedom does not mean the right to parasitism or destruction of public morality and solidarity. The family is the corner stone of society. It is counterproductive, anti-natural and not stable, as none of the homosexual relationships are final and stable in their essence. Ms Buitenweg is a Radical liberal revolutionary, successor of the Jacobines of France.

[CalifaJohn]

The research showing dramatically reduced life expectancy for gay men is invalid due to faulty methods of data collection. Even if this research were valid, and all destructive or auto-destructive should not be allowed, then your ideal totalitarian government would have to ban all of the following from the European continent: cigarettes, alcoholic beverages, automobiles, meat consumption, saturated fat consumption, skydiving, and anything else that has the potential to shorten life expectancy.

[IustitiaPax]

Just deny the obvious. And not even the modern States protect the "rights" of smokers and alcoholics. Homosexuality in itself in every act is dangerous, moderate enjoying the things you mentioned is not.

Mrs Buitenweg is the proof for the death and decadence and perversion which is modern parliamentarism.

[sickliberal]

go kathelijne! very principled.

[IustitiaPax]

Moral and economic liberalism are a pest inside the European Union. A cancer.

[czarus88]

idiots debate about faggots when so much shit goes on in the world...

[akomor1]

dziecko idź sobie do kościółka

[ndwale]

homophobia ....just someone's creation- no one is born gay- it is a learned behaivour..thus homophobia doesnt not exist..

[codownni]

"homophobia does not exist" wise up

[Drenishi]

Yeah, it is a creation -- the creation of homophobes. And so is all the propaganda like "no one is born gay" and "it's a learned behavior." Like the learned behavior of an a-hole like you. :)

[rayrayisgod]

you cant learn to be gay, ur born it.

[maugustyniak]

No, it's a lifestyle choice.

[rayrayisgod]

its not a lifestyle choice like being straight isnt a lifestyle choice

infact they have found out now that homosexuality is from birth for 2 reasons:

1) some children prefer to play as the opposite sex e.g a little girl playing with toy guns like little boy does. this is one factor in what we call "gender non-conformists" and they found that most gender non conformists end up gay/bi

2) gay males have a similar brain pattern to straight women and the same for lesbian women and straight men

[lundholmproduction]

So how is the brain like if you are bisexual then and is this scientifical findings good or bad and how do we learn from it.

I have read this Swedish sience and it´s not taking any point of view why they are made this and that is a big problem . I very strange that they have this published beacause of that. i don´t understand beacause science must have a point a view why it´s made.

[millos71]

Catholicism is a learned behavoir. Then religious persecution does not exist either!

You're probably gay yourself... shut up.

[HannoSterrenburg]

My goodness, never knew Buitenweg is such an amazing debater! You don't wanna meet her that angry...

[tigerbaiter]

How dare these people presume to force their perversion down our throats. How absurd to compare practising homosexuality to a human rights issue.

[Drenishi]

When people are jailed, beaten and/or killed for no reason other than because they're gay, it is a human rights issue. You're the pervert, pervert.

[GeorgeM007]

Europe is doomed.

[cgdosborn]

Too right mate, I fuly agree, the EU is doomed because it is a complete waste of time.

[anishinaabe]

George, once again you open your hillbilly Tennessee bumpkin mouth, and give rednecks all over the world a bad name. The European Union is an excellent organization and does the world a lot of good.

[anishinaabe]

You think that "God is going to punnish the EU? You're one of thoes 700 club suckers aren't you? There is a cat 5 Hurricane flattening the most homophobic country in the world as I am typing this. How do you explain that one, oh great seeier of gods will?

[nnigra]

Like piotych!

[piotych]

What do you exactly mean nnigra? If you mean that I'm a homophobe defined (not exactly correct) by Vaebn, you're totally wrong. You - nnigra - in my opinion aren't better than homophobes. You use the same low-level stereotypes. Example?: I seem to you a homphobe-you have a right to have a privat opinion-may be everybody who don't agree with 100% of homosexuals demands is 4U a homophobe. But you call me also facsist without no basis to do that. Homophoby has nothing in common with facsism.

[Vaebn]

Liberty, is based on self-ownership. That a man owns his life (and therefore, not the lives of the other).

Homophobes, like murderers, like rapists, like thieves (who still property, and property are things that you create through use of your lifetime/ energy & talents) belong to an ideology that don't believe in that.

Homophobes, are control freaks, who want to control other lives.

[piotych]

If definition of homophobes wrote by Vaebn is correct, there's no basis to say that I'm homophobe & that even in Polish government are some homophobes.

[piotych]

Do you know that most of so-called homophobes use the same arguments. Most of them don't want to control lifes of others,they doesn't matter if sb is homo- or heterosexual. Only are affraid that just homosexuals would start to control their lifes. Of course most of their affraids aren't justified . There's no unlimited liberty for anybody. And there's no reason to give homosexuals such unlimited liberty. Now,in all EU countries homosexuals have more rights than polygamists.Why?

[Vaebn]

Homosexuals, want to aquire control of THEIR life. Any action against them, including a punch, is the action of someone proclaiming a higher ownership of their life than they do.

Homophobes on the other hand, is just a phobia. Something that either has to be controlled, or is a danger to other people. No right of them is reduced of cource, since they are always free to go on with their(straight) lives,

[piotych]

"Homosexuals, want to aquire control of THEIR life."-I never objected this & I accept it."Homophobes on the other hand, is just a phobia.(...)" I agree; "Something that either has to be controlled, or is a danger to other people."-this way also heterophobes, christianophobes, etc. should be "controlled" because it can be a danger. I worry only about where is the board (limit) of such a "controll"& if everything wouldn't become this way overcontrolled what would remain a bit totalitarism.

[lovergurlz10001]

I have no idea why people are homophobic it doesnt affect them so why do they care we are all human beings we should stop discriminating because ppl are different

[nnigra]

Richard Wouters: ok, but the European commission must press the Polish government, the expulsion is a threat.

sorry for my bad english!!

[piotych]

Everybody knows that it could be only threat, so nobody would think it's serious. Expulsion any country from EU is a complex process even more complex than accesion and I doubt if anybody would want to work on that without really serious reason. So it's better to seek the compromise.

[nnigra]

piotych is homophobe and fascist. Poland, out of European Union!!

[RichardWouters]

Nnigra, do you think Polish homosexuals would be better off if we threw Poland out of the EU?

[piotych]

Very clever question RichardW. Unfortunately some ppl think that ostracism, & creating&escalating some conflicts is better way. The funniest thing is that nnigra wants Poland out of EU because doesn't agree because my individual opinions. But he/she doesn't want use his/her brain to think&check that may be my opinion is in minority even in Poland. So because of opinion of ONE(1) Pole, Poland should be out of EU(?) ...no comment.

[piotych]

CORRECTION"because doesn't agree because my individual opinions"SHOULD BE"because doesn't agree with my individual opinions"-SORRY FOR THE MISTAKE:)

[piotych]

I am radical ANTIfacsist. I'm also not a homophobe. I'm just only able to understand some homophobe's arguments or at least reasons of their arguments. There's actually no meritoric discussion in EU. If sb doesn't obey "one right ideology" or even express' different opinion is ostracised instead of discussing. Is it the freedom of speach and opinion? No, such way like nnigra does, this freedom is limited. And there're too much EUpoliticians with similar mentality.

[FightingforTRUE]

@nnigra OMG, you are idiots!

Come to Poland, see, and then say some fucking opinion.

STOP POLANDFOBIA!

[RichardWouters]

It's certainly true, Piotych, that the Warsaw police did a good job in protecting the Gay Pride participants last month. There's quite a contrast with the behaviour of the Moscow mayor and police last weekend. The Gay Pride was not allowed by the mayor. When the organizers tried to deliver a petition for freedom of assembly at city hall, they were attacked by homophobes. The police did not arrest the attackers but their victims...

[piotych]

The point is that also homophobes should be allowed to peacefully demonstrate their opinions, but they shouldn't be allowed to phycisly attack others. Because physical violence is a crime. If gays for example insult somebody's religion or feelings there should be only way to protect sb well-being by suing such a gay to civil court & this court should judge if such a gay with his behaviour cross the limit of the freedom to expression. And such a civilised way is aviable in Poland so.

[piotych]

and in general that what's happening in Russia nowadays is very similar to that what was happening in Germany in the 30's former century. This is a real danger for Europe.

[piotych]

Explain me why there's a policy i EU that people who only don't allow to be forced to afirmate homosexuality and don't agree with afirmation of homosexuality even if them TOLERATE homosexual people, are called "homophobes"? Isn't this word "homophobe" overused? I expercienced being in very rudely way invited by 2 stinky gays do have a sex, I -despite of their rudeness- politely rejected. I think I shoud be also rude for them,but I'd disagree with opinion if it'd be a "homophoby".

[Matthias1977]

Pictures of Gay Prides do give a wrong opinion of what is going on since media tend to show what's gross or unusual. Isn't it the same with Poland? In Western Europe people hear of weird Polish politicians if even most Polish politicians aren't weird at all, I suppose.

[piotych]

in Poland gays during GayPrides behave more carefull,and try to respect other rights. So respect. There are only some agressive gay"leaders". I think that even calling Kaczynski a "homophobe" is overusing. He made only one mistake, but he as tolerant as he can with his coalitiant There's only one real homophobic political party in Poland. It is unfortunately in government. But fortunately currently this homophobic party has in Poland only 3% support. So I agree with U.

[piotych]

I actually can't see any "discrimination" of homosexual in Poland. There are homophobes but they're everywhere. Why should we discriminate homophobes even if they don't discrimitate homosexuals. There's no agreement to promote homosexual instead of heterosexual. But for me it's a slogan speaking,'cause homosexuality isn't a disease. But lesbians are discriminated in Polish media. I notice that only gays are invited to TV programs. I want see more lesbians:D

[kegliis]

in some mass media they spread info disinforming society, calling gay people freaks and sick. we had some anti-gay protest already,but they didn't let any gay pride events in public and all tehy wantted to do is just to rise rainbow flag. the things is that lithuanian government or parliament didn't do anythign about that yet. hope we will egt some support from the eu commision and eu parliement, cause here seems to get any justice is impossible.

[kegliis]

same things happening in Lithuania now. all public pride events were banned here, even the arival of the"bus of tolerance" ofeuropean commission was canceled.local authorities explains that tehy r not against gays but tehy can not let prpogate homosexual life of style in this country.

[piotych]

If Lithuanian government don't want support homosexual style of life (what I understand, because I don't think such a style of life is good) should just support more heterosexual style of life but without discriminating other sexual preferences & without supporting them (only protecting from violence). Homosexual don't have a right to demand support from authorities if the majority of society doesn't wish it.

[kegliis]

the authorities are the ones who has to protect people cause they r elected by people and should represent peopl. as i as long as i pay taxes i should have eaqual rights with all people. and it is not the question only about protecting from violence, cause discrimination is not only violence.

[piotych]

Look, I understand your point of view. But show me only one example of country where everybody has equal rights. May be I'm an ignorant but I don't know any. Why for example in many countries lazy people pay percentually lower taxes than others? Why paliamentarist has immunity? Why rihgts poeple from newEU countries to work in some oldEU contries are limited? And what does mean "equal rights"? Democracy is an art of compromise, because people aren't clones, they're different.

[kegliis]

yea all people are differnt, but that doesn't mean that someone has right to hate others just because they r differnt ;)

[piotych]

kegliis you're right. But it is utopic thinking. It is impossible to forbide sb hating others, at least it's possible to bann some expressions of hateness. And also irreasonable hateness causes violence. that's why I agree that everybody should be protected from violence. But it is not a point to give "equal rights" for everybody, whatever such "equal rights" mean. Remember also, that "do not affirmate and saying such own opinion" doesn't equal "to hate something or somebody"

[piotych]

"the authorities are the ones who has to protect people cause they r elected by people" - so next time U should vote for another party or authorities & if they win, you'll have more influence & more rights. If there's no political party witch grant U rights U expect,boards of EUcountries are opened. In Poland there's sick medicine service system that discriminates economically doctors comparing them to other professions. So they move to other countries where their rights are respected better.

[kegliis]

don't explain me where to live and where not to live. i was born here so i am gonna live here. it is the easiest way to move somewhere and not to improve situation here.

[piotych]

I appreciate your courage,that you chose more complex way. My respect to you. I think you should be happy you aren't polygamyst, because polygamy is illegal in the whole Europe. It is worth to notice that polygamy appears in nature much more often than homosexuality. So what? Are European authorities & society polygamophobic? "Shame on Europe" or not?

[piotych]

And explain me please,what is real target of GayPrides if it isn't only an afirmation of homosexuality in public places? What do you expect from authorities in conservative countries? I agree that only permition for gays to demonstrate doesn't equal to promote their style of life, so I don't understand idea of banning such demonstrations, unless for example banning GayPride during some religious holiday, cause it'd be abuse of freedom.

[RichardWouters]

The right to a private life, freedom of expression, freedom of association, the freedom to hold peaceful demonstration, non-discrimination, isn't that what the Polish people fought for when they drove out the communists?

In a free society, you cannot reserve those freedoms for the people you like. You should also grant them to people whose lifestyle you happen tot dislike. That's the essence of freedom.

[piotych]

Poland is a democratic society. In democracy(classic democracy)the majority rules. So let's make a referendum about homsexual and heterosexual rights in Poland and other countries. Nobody in Poland discriminate homosexual more than heterosexual in such fields like: private life,freedom of expression & association,the freedom to hold peaceful demonstarion. There're some homophobes in Poland (also just one minister). But we have also Constitutional Court which stops creating bad law.

[RichardWouters]

Is the European Court of Human Rights telling lies as well? Yesterday, it condemned Poland for Lech Kazcynski's attempts to block the 2005 Equality Parade when he was mayor of Warsaw. The seven judges, including one from Poland, ruled that this constituted a violation of the freedom of association and of homosexuals' right not to be discriminated.

[piotych]

Lech Kaczynski made a mistake. But next time GayPride(ord FreedomPride) was allowed, and gays&lesbians&their supporters where protected by the police from agressive attacks of hidden-nationalsocialist organization, not like in Russia for example where gays were brutally arrested. Politicians make mistkates very often. Fortunately in Poland if U don't agree with decisions of Polish authorities U can appeal to ECHR. And Polish authorities must obey it. This is the feature of civilisation.

[missjj21]

plain lies!!!

[Kela08]

Well done! Shame on Poland!Down with homophobia

[piotych]

Why heterosexual are so discriminated in EU. Why heterosexual are not allowed to walk naked in hetero-parade like homosexuals in Berlin. Look I'm not an antyhomophobe, but in cannot accept these hypocrites. Why gays - who are allowed to demonstrate their sexuality (what I even tolerate), are'nt punished for demonstrating their hateness to Christians (?) what really hurts me.

[piotych]

"antyhomophobe" - sorry for keyborad mistake. I meant, I'm not homophobe (But I'm also tolerant tolerate for nonagressive homophobes, 'cause I partially understand them).

[Matthias1977]

This is simply not true. (A) On a parade such as the Love Parade in Berlin, you can also see lots of straight people who wear erotic stuff. (B) I've never seen completely naked persons on any Gay Pride I've been to. I don't believe that you can show your genitals in public, even not in Berlin, without being troubled. Could it be that you've seen neither a Love Parade nor a Gay Pride, piotych?

[piotych]

to mathias: about point(A)is it really good? or is it breaking the boards of freedom'cause it limits rights of other people to live in moral safety contidion?Not important if it's homo-, hetero-or bisexual event. "I've never seen completely naked persons on any Gay Pride"-I've seen photos&videos from GayParades with men wearing only"strings"in public place,so almost completely naked."don't believe that you can show your genitals in public"-right cause I'm not an exhibitionist.

[Matthias1977]

You're right: some people abuse the expression "homophobe." Still, someone who accepts "homosexual behavior but only in the closet" IS homophobe. -- And last: even in a classic democracy, the core idea is NOT that the majority rules. This is true for kindergarten, not for democracies. It's somewhat more complex. Things like habeas corpus or the protection of minorities and such stuff.

[piotych]

about democracy:I agree that it is more complex than I expressed in my former post. The main rule in parliamentar democracy is that politicians are afraid to decide against the majority,'cause they wanna be elected again. So in general minority can't rule. Unless the minority has money or is strong for other reason. Sometimes the majority agree to protect minorities,'cause they are EDUCATED that it may be better than discriminate minorities or protecting minorities can be useful for the majority

[piotych]

Need to add, that I agree that classic democracy rule(that majority rules) not always is good. Example: Classical Athen's democracy: the majority of votes judged that Socrates must be poisoned. This was classic democracy. Why it happened? Because one the most danger for democratic society can be the lack of education. But also so called political correctness can be a danger.

[davenjoel]

A perfect recent example to what you are saying is the more recent rise of Nazism though the use of plebiscites and propaganda. You seem intelligent and a good person at heart, however I don't think you understand diversity within human beings, you see some boys are born effeminate and act effeminate from a young age. You get some children who are born with both sexual organs. Read up a little on this and good luck in your legal career!

[piotych]

I agree in 100% at that what you say davenjoel, and also I appreciate you meritoric voice whithout abusing such words like "homophobe"or"facsist".

[piotych]

I've read about examples of diversity of human beings even more that you've mentioned. I'll be always agaist discrimination, cause there's no basis to discriminate for example homosexuals in ANY work. But I don't accept fact that often during Prides gays sent many insults adressed to religious people. I believe that there're also limits of tollerance. These limits are changing, of course. For example in UK homosexuality in UK was a crime in 1st half of XXcentury. It was very unfair.

[piotych]

I'll be also always agaist revolutionary changes, because many ppl aren't ready for them/4example 4adopting children by homosexuals;mainly'cause such children would be also marked as different&it's not funny to be different between collegues during the childhood/. I accept evolutionary changes. Revolution provokes this unready ppl to react, so revolutionists contr-react and in this condition we have riots or even homewar.

[piotych]

1 thing more, if we're so tollerant for people of different sexual orientation ppl, if we let for ppl to change phisical sex (look exmpl of effeminate boys or masculinate girls),we cannot ban researches on changing sexual orientation(from homo- to heterosexual OR INVERSELY),forbide ppl talkin' about such a need. If Church believes that homosexual sex in a sin,can always sponsor such a reserches. The point is that average ppl should'va the choice, motives aren't important:for fun,religious,etc.

[davenjoel]

I disagree with you, I feel that hormonally those who are born gay are not able to change and the pressure to put pressure on them is emotionally and psychologically damaging. The Church has the right to decide on what they believe, the State has to defend each of it's citizens as best as it can.

[piotych]

Your disagreement is caused by miunderstanding."born gay are not able to change"-you probably don't believe in science's progress. Agree that taking pressure of anybody to change sexual orientation should be banned. But changing this orientation - if scientists discover such a possibility - shouldn't be forbiden for those who want do it. They may want it because of religious motives or for fun. My view is pure liberal in that case. State shoulnd defend those ppl who don't want it.

[davenjoel]

If an applicable and real scientific option was there that allowed a person to amend their sexual orientation then I am sure a lot of people would choose it. There is no scientific method at present that allows someone to amend their sexual orientation. by all means, once it is discovered let us all hear more about it.  I do however remind you of the lobotomy procedure practiced by psychiatrists since 1890 to remove emotion and look at the mess that has created!

[piotych]

I agree with you davenjoel. About the lobotomy's example,connected with this your probably unnexpressed clearly affraids-in my opinion are partially justified. But I think a danger that ppl would abuse possibility of real amending the sexual orientation to force it on ppl against their wish in EU is low,'cause all members are obligated to respect Human Rights,so there are instruments to avoid such a danger.

[piotych]

Of course such an option isn't applicable yet. But it can be in the future&we shouldn't forbide ppl to think about it or tu use it when it'll became possible.

[piotych]

There's a risk that some scientific solutions will be wrong like lobotomy, but also- as I said- HR let us to avoid to harm ppl by using wrong solutions as massively as lobotomy was used.

[alex3dh]

Church is full of homosexuals, from Vatican down.

[piotych]

I would say that the Church is full of people: heterosexuals & homosexuals ;) like in other groups of the society.

[alex3dh]

Yes, of course - my response was in certain context, which probably was not obvious to you.