The NWT Fraud (Jehovahs Witnesses Issue)

[tommotian]

To all JWs: Harsh realities [1]

We all want to claim that Scripture is our highest authority. But we simply cannot make our words mean something new simply to avoid being in an awkward position, the one cnreason is in now.

Consequently:

Either the best established Greek text is the highest authority! or something else is [such as the "emendations"]. But no translator can claim that he is using the Greek text as his highest authority when he does not follow the meaning found in that text.

[tommotian]

To all JWs: Harsh realities [2]

Scripture is not our highest authority if we allow our translators to change its words to satisfy our own theological bias.

1) This is true when the translators of the New World Translation change the Greek word “kyrios” to "Jehovah." See their Interlinear!

2) It is just as true that the translators of Protestant/Catholic Old Testaments have appealed to a higher authority than Scripture itself when they translate the word יהוה [the tetragrammation] as LORD.

[tommotian]

To all JWs: Harsh realities [3]

In both cases, the original writers have been prevented from communicating to the English readers their intended message. The anonymous translators of the NT part of the NWT are in a special sense very reprehensible: the Society refuses to divulge their identity. Probably because of their lack of higher education and professional skills!

I think this is a very fair and legitimate position. Now I've had my say about it.

[Gideon6640man]

"old man"? lol he was the greatest living Greek scholar and his Manual of the Greek NT is still used today, google him and the letter he wrote the WTBTS. mistrasnlation? ok in 1960 the NWT of the Christian Greek Scriptures at John 8:58 they have it "I have been".In the footnotes they explain the Greek here is rendered in the "perfect indefinite tense" One little problem. There is NO SUCH TENSE in the Greek. This is honest scholarship? Colossians 1:16-17 they insert the other. want more?

[Alhambrattp]

the bible is mis quoted and mistranslated from the latin, greek and hebrew texts too.

[Gideon6640man]

@Alhambrattp Prove it.

[Alhambrattp]

@Gideon6640man

I don't need to try to prove what it already proven jackass, don't be so lazy look it up yourself. Latin Vulgate is a good starting point. It's all there for you to research.

[Gideon6640man]

@Alhambrattp No have proven nothing. I read Latin and Greek and since you do too tell me what verses.

[Alhambrattp]

@Gideon6640man

For fuck sake, learn english properly before stating you can read latin and greek. Read the latin vulgate then compare it to the KJV which was translated from the Vulgate and behold. It's readily available for anyone to read. But again don't be so lazy Im not doing all the work for you. For someone who says they can read latin & greek and obviously believes the bible how come you have not read the vulgates?!?!

[Gideon6640man]

@Alhambrattp No, I am aksing for a specific chapter,verse etc....Why are you so angry? lol

[Alhambrattp]

@Gideon6640man

Im not angry, I know what you asking and as I said just said look it up yourself, there are many if you can actually read it.

[Gideon6640man]

@Alhambrattp "Many"...just your top 5. You have read them right? Love your page. Well if your too busy I understand since you seem to like to play Warlock...oooh you are scary. Besides insults you are shallow indeed.

[Alhambrattp]

@Gideon6640man

Read my new response dickhead as your pathetic, childish, predictability proceeded you. Time to put up or shut up. Prove to me you can read latin and greek when you have only two posts in proper english and have to ask for differences.

[Gideon6640man]

@Alhambrattp Ok Aricoh if want to learn Greek get yourself Dana/Mantey Grammar of the Greek New Testament. I bet you play Dungeons and Dragons right? you wear T-Shirts with skulls too?.Mid 20's to 50's living at home with your mom who is overbearing or you just a 16 y/o angry kid downloading goth porn. You are a waste of time and have been shut down. You hesitated to give me a verse then you misrepresent it because your knowledge of Greek is ZERO bye Marduk Von Loki.

[Alhambrattp]

@Gideon6640man John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son. (KJV)

1Jn 2:22 τις εστιν ο ψευστης ει μη ο αρνουμενος οτι ιησους ουκ εστιν ο χριστος ουτος εστιν ο αντιχριστος ο αρνουμενος τον πατερα και τον υιον (Greek-TR)

1Jn 2:22 quis est mendax nisi is qui negat quoniam Iesus non est Christus hic est antichristus qui negat Patrem et Filium (Vulgate)

[Alhambrattp]

@Gideon6640man

1Jn 2:22 τις εστιν ο ψευστης

Who is the liar

ει μη ο αρνουμενος οτι

if not the one who denies that

ιησους ουκ εστιν ο χριστος

Jesus is not the Christ

AKA Jesus is not the christ and he who denies that he is not the christ is a liar.. How's that. When the translated to he KJV they took out the word "OUK" to make that passage sound better to christians. "OUK" means NOT. As I say don't trust me look it up yourself Im not going to spoon feed you.

[Gideon6640man]

@Alhambrattp Sound better? are you serious? Where did you learn Greek kid? You in translations rules are followed to convey messages from one language to another.Even the the Jesus Seminar scholars who are anti-Christian as you can find in academia would laugh at you.There is no conspiracy here as you emply. The Epitles of John are the ones first year greek students learn first to translate how is it that your professor did not give you an F for this? Kid,stick to Metal and impress 16y/o girls.

[Alhambrattp]

@Gideon6640man

You still cannot type an English sentence properly or arrange English words yet you accuse me of not learning greek? You ask for verses, I provide them and you resort to petty childish insults, while still providing nothing of value......typical. If your so cool being a 52 year old with the mentality and intellect of a 10 year old, prove me wrong or troll someone else. Again sad to see a 52 year old person that is still as stupid as he was when he was 10.

[Gideon6640man]

@Alhambrattp Say good night Asteroth, back to your metal head life. You gave me examples of how you do not understand Koine Greek idioms and translation. You are just angry at me an pick at silly things like misspelling.Just so you know the computer I am borrowing has a jacked up keyboard and I type fast. You are not only rude you are the childish one.I have no further need to exchange words with you.You are a waste of time so you may go now. Zimabu Eter Adramelech.

[Alhambrattp]

@Gideon6640man

You challenged me, I gave examples, you gave nothing only childish insults. Now your backing down, typical holy troll. When you learn to write english I may listen to your greek ramblings. I also have nothing further to say to you and do not need to waste anymore time on you either.

[Gideon6640man]

@Alhambrattp Flawed examples.

[Alhambrattp]

@Gideon6640man

You proved that with childish name calling and poor writing?  Though we were done here.

[Gideon6640man]

@Alhambrattp ZZZZZZZZZZZZ

[Gideon6640man]

@Alhambrattp I see accuse with no specifics...well I read both Greek and Latin and since you do too show me.

[Alhambrattp]

@Gideon6640man

I doubt you read them both as you can barely type a sentence in english. If you read both you wouldn't need to ask me to prove anything and say something so stupid as "I see accuse with no specifics" ??. I gave you a reference to see it for yourself, but Im not doing the foot work for a lazy, illiterate christian.

[Gideon6640man]

@Alhambrattp Well thank you for your scholarship.It would seem not only religious people are fanatics but cultist,atheist and whoever has an opinion. You spew your vile like some JW's I know with no substance and anger.Your pathetic.

[9906197439]

"Its a biased and deceptive, they change words in passage of scriptures to make it fit into their doctorines" blah blah blah . . . Can you prove it to me (from original Hebrew/Greek/Aramaic scriptures as well as your version of Bible as well as NWT) where is it "MISTRANSLATED" ???

The old man can only 'say' it but can't prove it at all. This is because he and you hate JWs just as Jesus already said in Matthew 10:22.

I can prove to you MILLIONS of false teachings in your Christendom.

[21crosscheck21]

@9906197439 The Watchtower misquoted this man to make it seem as though he approved of the NWT when clearly he did not. In other words they lied to your face my friend.

As for mistranslating yes,,,see my video "Myth number 5" were I expose the faulty Greek arguments they use.

I suggest you repent and trust in Jesus instead of a group of men from New York City.

[Gideon6640man]

@9906197439 Millions?  oh my well show us a few for now ok?

[Gideon6640man]

@9906197439 The Old Man can't prove it? He did'nt have to the watchtower had to and they could not. They even sang is praises in their notes on the NWT until he wrote them a letter telling them to stop misquoting him. Who are the scholars for the WTBTS?

[AbramSailor79]

@9906197439 plenty of different types of "New Testament followers" are "hated for Jesus' name sake". JWs do not have the monopoly on that.

[bj616]

JW Organization is based on lies. Typical of any any nonchristian cult.

[BleedBNG]

2001translation(dot)com(slash)­index(dot)html

"We arent trying to start some new religion or promote someones established doctrines; we are just searching for the truth and trying to find out what Bible writers actually wrote. There have been numerous contributors (more than 50) since we started this project in the late 1990s, and we have never asked their qualifications or religious backgrounds."

[Gideon6640man]

@BleedBNGIf I translated a Bible like they have and still do I would not want my name on it either. Google "Julius Mantey letter to Watchtower".

[BleedBNG]

thoughts(dot)com(slash)letusre­ason(slash)blog(slash)julius-m­antey-and-the-new-world-transl­ation-241716

[trikker01]

has any jw's ever commented on the way the WT misrepresents people?

- Like, have they proven that the WT did not misrepresent someone. this someone being said to suport the WT claims, but in reality not suport them.

[trikker01]

I am quite sure they have not, I am just asking if someone knows if it have happened at all.

[brewerbb]

I actually have that video.

[IDH77]

Me too! (VHS)

[brewerbb]

Ya vhs, WITNESSES OF JEHOVAH.

[trikker01]

have the watchtower pulled back the KIT?

[21crosscheck21]

Hi Trikker. I don't know if they have stopped producing the KIT altogether, bu I do know that it is extremely difficult to get one.

[floodtube1]

I did see Amazon wanted £75 for one!!

[floodtube1]

..for a KIT I mean.

[BlueEdition25]

Yeah, and every day we hear politicians complain they were quoted "out of context".

Give me a break.

The quote from Mantey in the KIT is accurate.

Pull out his book.

Pull the KIT.

Notice the quote is accurate.

Nothing was said that Mantey was a NWT proponent.

[beardfreak1969]

"Seriously, your eyes are crossed, you slur your speech and your illogical in your reasoning.

Do you have a mental impediment? "

What a load of Ad Hominin nonsense.

I notice your account has been open for about 5 minutes, wonder how long it will be before you close it again and open another?

Open account, insult users. Close account. Open another account, insult users. Close account. Repeat until bored. Hope you aren't counting time as well ;-)