Are Jehovahs Witnesses False Prophets? Response to Watchman

[SpeedCam1501]

This video is incorrect, yes there might be one PERSON that makes the false prophecy, however if another person or in this case organisation then back that prophecy up and take it upon themselves to spread word of it, they are then accepting this prophecy (false or not) as their own.

[dhamamy]

@SpeedCam1501

Huh?

[RealityDefenseLeague]

I believe there is a difference between "prophecy" and relating an understanding of scripture. Prophecy is a divinely related message. Based on my understanding, the WT society never claimed that they were divinely inspired. I would encourage you to gain an understanding of the words "Prophet" and "Prophecy". The operation of the Holy Spirit is something you might want to look into as well.

[dhamamy]

@RealityDefenseLeague

Thank for your comment, it is much appreciated.

I would encourage you to gain understanding of this video. It is a response to a major WT Apologist and EWatchman's admittance that the WT is a false prophet.

While we are on the subject though, yes WT is a False Prophet. They claim to be a Prophet. They claim to be the sole representative of Jehovah God on Earth. The SOLE channel of communication. That's quite a claim. A false claim as history shows. FALSE PROPHET.

[RealityDefenseLeague]

Yeah, it's nothing new that an organization would claim that they are the one true religion. Actually I have heard contradictory information on this subject. First off, I studied this group very closely and they never once stated that they were divinely inspired. Prophets are divinely inspired with a specific message. The operation of the Holy Spirit has to be taken into consideration here.

[dhamamy]

@RealityDefenseLeague

Most likely you are a JW trolling through YT and other forums, but I don't know for sure.

If not, then definetly you are lying when you claim you have studied this group closely.

Good Day

[RealityDefenseLeague]

@dhamamy Just an honest truth seeker. I am not affiliated with any man made religion. If your so smart, then why don't you tell me, what is the true group/organization/ church? Thanks for the insults by the way, very professional. Good day to you.

[dhamamy]

@RealityDefenseLeague

My comment is no more insulting then your assertion that you studied the JW Religion very closely.

Bullshit!

......and also I cannot answer your question because it based on false premises.

Cheers

[RealityDefenseLeague]

@dhamamy You don't know what your talking about. Keep reading your bible, you'll get there.

[dhamamy]

@RealityDefenseLeague

Do you agree with this scripture?

(Matthew 4:4) . . .“It is written, ‘Man must live, not on bread alone, but on every utterance coming forth through Jehovah’s mouth.’”

[dhamamy]

@RealityDefenseLeague

Too afraid huh? I get that from JW trolls all the time.

Regards

[RealityDefenseLeague]

Furthermore, the fact that they claim that they are the one and only channel is an assertion and not a divinely inspired utterance of Jehovah God. Where they go wrong is the fact that they tell people that their man made religion is the only way. The truth is the only way. Christ is the only way to the Father Jehovah God, not being a member of an organization. But who knows, maybe they know something we do not. My cup is still half full.

[bass109]

I was freed by demons by name of Jesus christ. I don't believe anyone uses false names like jehovah to rebuke demons. It won't work.

[RealityDefenseLeague]

@bass109 Woe there buddy..false name Jehovah. That is God's name and Christ taught his followers in the 1st century to use it. Doesn't matter how they or you pronounce it, it is a direct connection to the almighty and he wishes to be known by it. You just broke one of the top 10 commandments, say a 1000 hail Marys and 2000 our Fathers. Glad you were freed by them demons, they can be such pests.

[blepat]

You clearly point out that every associated person has an accountability towards Christ Jesus and Jehovah. The ugly point is that they know they have spoken falsly in Jehovah's name and are not able to humble down and ask for foregiveness for this sin to Jehovah and their brethren they hurt. This is a tradgedy and it seems that there is no hope for the WT society and the leadership. Too proud to handle. imo.

[Ribcagehacksaw]

(Jesse) This is a good video. I really do hate to admit it though but according to scripture Jeremiah 27: 15 does deserve Jehovah's Witnesses attention. That is one of the reasons I left, I told myself I am not going to be going door to door spreading falsehood, especially fragile falsehood that could be broken with a couple of informed questions. Rank and file members all have a borrowed faith.

[Frankgerretti]

Not to detract from the point of this video, I cringe when I hear the words rank and file...and as contrasted with "leadership". All JW's lurking here understand to some degree that distinction which does exist. However Jesus said all were to be brothers and he himself was their leader ....as your magazine say on the cover...AWAKE!

[audiotomic]

well i am not one to support the JW's but I have met and talked extensively with enough of them that i can safely say that they lead a life of no harm, believing in something and passing the message on "regardless" of the topic (not withstanding direct influence to procure harm on others), is what makes the world a better place. Indeed there may be an intervention in the future by a force we have either forgotten or never met. However when you quote "scripture" and it is in plain english, ask?Qs

[dhamamy]

@joepublisher1

Thanks,

Unfortunately Mr. Ewatchman's ego just couldn't take being proven wrong. I have had several online back and forth conversations with him and each time he runs and hides. The last conversation was last weekend and he decided he had to block me. He is a sore loser.

I appreciate your comment.

[S0ldier0fJah]

@dhamamy " The last conversation was last weekend and he decided he had to block me. He is a sore loser." sore loser ?  this is a bible debate not some hot dog eating contest . The watchmen make videos to educate not to waste time playing games.

[dhamamy]

@S0ldier0fJah

He only blocked me for a few hours. If it is a debate as you say, then the watchman lost. How does that relate to hot dogs?

His videos are not to educate but a means to render worship to his Brooklyn gods.

He admits The WT is a false prophet however continues to extol them as somehow being God's one and only representative on earth. Scripture shows that to be impossible.

The man lives on the edge of insanity.

Cheers

[JuanOz43]

Dissappointing video. Content was abyssmal. Presentation not much better. It was a mistake to show watchman in your video. It was dishonest to selectively read from the magazines you presented. You were using his arguement to boost your reasoning. Madness! Score w -1, d - 0.

[dhamamy]

@JuanOz43

You certainly are entitled to your opinion as to the production quality of my video. If it is production value you are seeking, go to the theater and drop $10 on a showing of "Avatar".

Your charge of dishonesty comes without any evidentiary support. Please provide your evidence and argumentation or are you just another mindless drone from the hive parroting your Brooklyn masters?

[JuanOz43]

Im not talking about the money you spent. Since you showed watchman before you came in I could not help but compare you to him. He seemed sincere. Do you think you gave the same impression?

As for evidence you presented it yourself. After the three sentences you underlined in the 1972 Watchtower. There was a sentence which I could not read in full. I did see the words have been joined. The sentence in full is:

[JuanOz43]

They are still proclaiming a warning, and have been joined and assisted in their commissioned work by hundreds of thousands of persons who have listened to their message with belief. The dishonesty was in not letting the watcher see it.

So it is just as the watchman say.  The leaders are the prophets and the rank and file or the drones are the ones who believe them. So if the prophets are wrong does it mean that their listener are also false prophets? From ex-drone.

[dhamamy]

@JuanOz43

The article quoted highlights that Jehovah's Witnesses accept the teachings of the Watchtower and thereby accept the label of Prophet.

However what should have impressed you is not the article from the Watchtower but the Bible itself which forcefully points out that not only is the False Prophet put to death but also those that listen to the False prophet. 3 scriptures are cited that clearly say this.

The dishonesty rests with the Watchman who is not ignorant of those Scriptures.

[JuanOz43]

From an online dictionary.

proph⋅et

1.a person who speaks for God or a deity, or by divine inspiration.

2.(in the Old Testament)a.a person chosen to speak for God and to guide the people of Israel: Moses was the greatest of Old Testament prophets.

b.(often initial capital letter ) one of the Major or Minor Prophets.

c.one of a band of ecstatic visionaries claiming divine inspiration and, according to popular belief, possessing magical powers.

d.a person who practices divination.

[JuanOz43]

3.one of a class of persons in the early church, next in order after the apostles, recognized as inspired to utter special revelations and predictions. 1 Cor. 12:28.

4.the Prophet, Muhammad, the founder of Islam.

5.a person regarded as, or claiming to be, an inspired teacher or leader.

6.a person who foretells or predicts what is to come: a weather prophet; prophets of doom.

7.a spokesperson of some doctrine, cause, or movement.

I don't see myself there. Do you?

[JuanOz43]

Just be clear I only believe in Jehovah, Jesus and the bible. So if I ever was a mindless drone, I no longer am.

As for being a prophet I never thought myself to be so.

[dhamamy]

@JuanOz43

You miss the point of the video. It was Watchman's judgment that the WT is a False Prophet. If so, then, his assertion that those who believe in, listen and follow the WT False Prophet are just innocent victims does not reflect scriptural reality.

You avoid this fact Juan. In light of this your claim to believe the Bible lacks any credibility.

[JuanOz43]

The point is that Watchman said the leadership claim to be prophets from that WT article you presented. No rank-and-file JW claim to be prophets. So they cannot be false prophets.

[dhamamy]

@JuanOz43

Maybe you have a problem with your attention span or powers of reasoning. Or maybe you are just playing games with me. Have you really watched the Video??

1. 1972 Awake teaches that ALL JW's are prophets

2. *** WT 1986 4/1 p. 31 Questions From Readers ***

Approved association with Jehovahs Witnesses requires accepting the entire range of the true TEACHINGS of the Bible, including those Scriptural beliefs that are UNIQUE to Jehovahs Witnesses.

[JuanOz43]

You have called me: Parrot; Mindless drone; with attention span problems;a player.

Im not. In the 1972 WT article I found this To Ezekiel, in his vision, and, symbolically to the modern-day prophet, the spirit-begotten, anointed ones who are the nucleus of Jehovahs witnesses today, In the 1986 WT what you say is true, but it doesnt say ALL Jehovah Witnesses are prophets does it? If you have proof from the Bible (or anywhere else) present it. There is no need to become desperate.

[dhamamy]

@JuanOz43

It really is not that difficult. You started this exchange by calling me dishonest. That charge is unproven, What have I falsely quoted from WT literature or the Bible.

The 1972 Awake article cited plainly refers to all Jehovah's Witnesses (men and women) as a prophet.

Desperate I am not, however I am baffled at your stupidity.

JW's prophet claims are deluded but clearly stated. I simply quoted THEM.

The WT Religion leaders to my knowledge have not withdrawn the claim.

[JuanOz43]

I thought you were an ex-JW, you seem to know a bit about JWs. I understand now that you are not. Among JWs some are spirit anointed to go to heaven to rule as kings with Jesus and act as priest with him. (Rev 1:6; Rev 5:10; Rev 14). Most have not received this call and hope to live forever on paradise earth (Ps 37:11, 29; Matt 5:5). In Matt 13:24-30 the Kingdom of the Heavens is sowed with wheat but over sown with weeds by the enemy. And they are left side by side until the harvest.

[JuanOz43]

So in Gods Temple (anointed son of God) 1 Cor 3:16, there are wheat (good slaves) and weeds (wicked slaves). The wicked slave have seated himself(themselves?) in Gods temple (2 Th 2:4). As far as I know some anointed sons of God have not taken on the title on the title of prophet. So if they are not prophets they cannot be false prophets. And certainly none of JWs with the earthly hope are prophets, which by the way that 1972 Watchtower article did NOT say.

[JuanOz43]

When there is a discrepancy between WT literature and the Bible some JWs have learned to stick the bible. So I'm not saying you are entirely incorrect. But you have not proved that ALL JWs are false prophets.

[dhamamy]

@JuanOz43

The point of the video was to highlight that the Watchman's assertion was false. I thoroughly proved this.

BTW there is no scriptural foundation for teaching two classes of Christians.

1972 Watchtower teaches that all JW's are prophets. It is clearly stated. If you wish to show God that you reject that teaching and reject the False Prophecy you must leave the WT.

Good Luck

[JuanOz43]

Its obvious your mind is made up. No matter what scriptures I present to you and no matter what reasoning you are presented with, they are wrong because you believe they are wrong from the beginning. I watched your video, completely read the article you presented, read the parts of the bible you cited. If you tell me to read the whole bible I have done that too. Not lately but about a couple of years ago.

[JuanOz43]

Anyway we will just have to agree to disagree since none of your proof has convinced me either. I believe that Jehovah will intervene in human affairs shortly to bring about the conditions described in Rev 21:3-4. The beginning of that intervention to the end will be no walk in the park. If we are righteous then blessings if not maledictions. Farewell. In the end we will get what we deserve. BTW whom (group/religion?) should I go to if I leave the JWs?

[dhamamy]

@JuanOz43

What basis do you have to believe that Jehovah will intervene shortly?

Whom? Jesus Christ is whom ......Jesus Christ

[Frankgerretti]

@JuanOz43 this is a common error by Witnesses with no disrespect, it has been "suggested" to them over their time in the WT..."even if we are wrong brothers, where else can we go as Peter said?...."

Read what John recorded, but more important read the whole chapter in context. Jesus CLEARLY said that failing to eat his flesh and drinking his blood, THEY would not get into the kingdom....(JW's do not partake generally)

Peter answered Jesus Q with "to WHOM else will go". Not WHERE, but to WHOM

[justice1954]

@JuanOz43 Douglas Walsh Trial - 1954, excerpt:

FREDERICK FRANZ (President 1977 - 1992)

Q. Can you tell me this; are these theological publications and semi- monthly periodicals used for discussion or statements of doctrine?

A. Yes.

Q. Are these statements held to be authoritative?

A. Yes.

Q. Is their acceptance a matter of choice,or is it obligatory on all those who wish to be and remain members of the Society?

A. It is obligatory.

[justice1954]

@JuanOz43

Douglas Walsh Trial - 1954, excerpt:

Q. ... a false prophecy was promulgated?

A. I agree to that.

Q. It had to be accepted by Jehovah's witnesses?

A. That is correct.

Q. If a member ... took the view himself that that prophecy was wrong, and said so, would he be disfellowshipped?

A. Yes, if he said so, and kept on persisting in creating trouble ... Our purpose is to have unity.

Q. A unity based on an enforced acceptance of false prophecy?

A. That is conceded to be true.

[dhamamy]

@JuanOz43

(Revelation 18:4) . . .Get out of her, my people, if YOU do not want to share with her in her sins, and if YOU do not want to receive part of her plagues. . .

[blepat]

@JuanOz43 Obviously you feel offended by these arguments jeopardizing your faith building. I personally believe that if its Christ´s will, I am ready to tear down everything I believe a dozen times in order to get closer to get closer to Jesus my saviour.

[dhamamy]

@JuanOz43

To clearly answer your question

.........So if the prophets are wrong does it mean that their listener are also false prophets?........

The Bible answers by saying that it doesn't really matter. The False Prophet and those that listen to the False Prophet are condemned.

I can email you the complete WT article and I think you will see for yourself that if anything what I did quote understates the Watchtower's and JW's claims as regards being a Prophet.

[JuanOz43]

Deu 18:20-22 "'However, the prophet who presumes to speak in my name a word that I have not commanded him to speak or who speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet must die.And in case you should say in your heart: "How shall we know the word that Jehovah has not spoken?"

when the prophet speaks in the name of Jehovah and the word does not occur or come true, that is the word that Jehovah did not speak. With presumptuousness the prophet spoke it. You must not get frightened at him.'

[JuanOz43]

The bible says? Where? Youre a big one evidence. Where is your evidence?

You may email me the complete WT article. I like to see what you are talking about.

[dhamamy]

@JuanOz43

Look up *ALL* the scriptures cited Juan.

[lchiddle]

Great critique Darryl

[Frankgerretti]

@lchiddle

Are you trying to OUT dhamamy? LOL

[Frankgerretti]

I posted this text to ewatchmans video but he may have deleted it

In addition to your excellent rebuttal

(Ezekiel 14:9-10)And as for the prophet, in case he gets fooled and actually speaks a word, I myself, Jehovah, have fooled that prophet; and I will stretch out my hand against him and annihilate him from the midst of my people Israel. 10 And they will have to bear their error. The error of the inquirer will prove to be just the same as the error of the prophet,

[Frankgerretti]

@Frankgerretti

Again all these bible texts show is a principle, and one that at some point and time the WT leaders have used to scold other religious groups with. So there is no basis for distancing themselves from the responsibility the bible places on the error of false prophesy OR simply acting as prophet in the sense of speaking on Gods behalf. Saying "We are led by Gods spirit..Not inspired by it" which is a distinction lacking a difference.

[dhamamy]

@Frankgerretti

Forgot about that scripture. Excellent! Thanks for quoting. Typically watchman does not censor however i do not see your post on that video.

I posted to this video as a response to his however so far watchman has not allowed it to be shown.

[beardfreak1969]

From one prison cell to another.

In my case, I just can't stomach these issues any more, I have an aversion to these individuals or organizations, telling me - "this is how it is" when it comes to speculative cosmogony & eschatology.

You do well to tackle these issues, that make this soul feel physically ill.

[dhamamy]

@beardfreak1969

It makes me ill as well, however to expose these charlatans is in a way my penance for being an adherent to this nonsense myself not too long ago.

Thanks for the comment.

Cheers

[beardfreak1969]

I understand.

We do "these things" for the sake of catharsis.

[propagandatechniques]

By the way, I 5 *ed and faved this because it clearly points out that JWs are parroting false prophecy "fed" to them by their handlers. Watchman shot himself in the foot by disregarding this simple fact. The dubyas will defend the false prophecies of the WTS (like 1914, 1919 - clear manipulations) until their deaths, unless they are prudent and escape. Korah followers were an excellent example making watchman look quite a bit silly in the first part of this video. Very good D. Excellent.

[dhamamy]

@propagandatechniques

On the bare surface watchman's assertions seem reasonable. however, when you take a closer look, what he says is ridiculous.

He is using Jedi Mind tricks, (these aren't the droids your looking for) to mesmerize people. Shameful actually.

Thanks for the 5*

Cheers

[Ribcagehacksaw]

(Mr.Rib) Very cool video. They can't separate themselves from the teaching's of the the watchtower, they are a part of it whether they like to admit it or not. Jerimiah 27: 15 makes this crystal clear.

[propagandatechniques]

D,

Have you ever seen Watchman admit where he's in error of his own dogmas?

This is why I try not to take on any scriptural debates with ANYBODY.  I don't want to receive the judgment the JWs and Watchman are bringing upon themselves. It appears like Watchman is attempting to hijack the JWs' already hijacked loyalty to Christ by the WTS in an attempt to get them to follow him by manipulating minds with placating phraseology. Get them out and then let them redevelop on their own.