ALSO, if you read the book you would know that its more than just an allergy, its also the craving, lots of people can drink a beer or two or pop a pill when they get there wisdom teeth out and never think about that beer or that pill again. the craving leads us to the drink or drug, the allergy is why once that drink or drug is in our system, we just cant seem to stop. PS. I HATE AA, because of the people in the room with 10 years who are miserable. BUT AA and the BIGBOOK seem to be diff now
@ejg722 Aside from the allergy nonsense, you accurately described the conditions which render responsible drinking an impossibility for me. I have another shocker for you-AA was full of miserable people in 1981 when I first rolled in. Mike BD
Well, being in AA as long as you have been you would think you would have read a bit of the book while being there. Although I must admit that i am not surprised at all by the fact that not one of your reply post hits on the book at all. The problem is the EGO driving people in AA put there own personal opinion into the program and it taints it. the truth of the matter is.. if you follow the first 164 pages of the book, exactly the way it is written, you dont have to sit in a meeting and bitch
@ejg722 Adherence to page 135 has killed more alcoholics than AA has ever saved. The chapter "To Wives" was written by Wilson posing as a wife. "To Employers" was written by a man who relapsed over business and personal disputes with Wilson. "We Agnostics" is a blatant attempt to religiously convert. Beyond all that, it is very self-contradicting. Mike BD
@bigrobtheactor...sober 21 yrs. in A.A. I just can't take the crap and b/s anymore. I haven't had a sponsor in years, nor worked a step in 7 or 8, my life has not fallen apart. And I KNOW I am no longer a sick woman ! BUT, as I type this I can stillhear the dogma trying to sneak into my ear. There is a part of me that still cares what everyone will think....she's gonna drink or die. Should I call my sponsor? (THAT IS A JOKE) Thanks for posting doll...Benee'
this is how being powerless works. If a person has an allergy to peanuts, as many people do, they are powerless over that. They can not change that fact. There is no cure to that. Well, that is what being powerless over alcohol means. We have an allergy to it. The effect of alcohol is very different on an alcoholic then on anyone else. We are not powerless over the decision to drink. Attending AA is a way to take power back. Mike here thinks we are being weak, but we are just living sober
@lukatme2 People who are allergic to peanuts don't eat peanuts. If they choose to eat peanuts with that knowledge, it isn't powerlessness, just a poor choice. Mike BD
@blamethenile Exactly, and when they eat the peanuts, they suffer the consequences of there actions. Just like an alcoholic when they drink alcohol. They have the power to continue to eat peanuts until they die of it. Life is full of choices. I made mine, I like AA, inspite of the the controle freaks, and religious nuts that wonder in to change the world. Screw them, I'm in it for me...
No disrespect, as I'm nor much of a "big-book thumper" myself, but you make no raitonal argument in your video for the theme upon which it is titled. Few of the subtitles provided are either AA approved literature or even frequently used phrases around AA. The illustrations that you use are indifferent to the topic altogether. I admit that the philosophy of AA may not be for everyone, but if you intend to publicly challenge the purpose, validity or success of the group, be more convincing.
@bhf4621 AA doesn't like being publicly challenged does it?Will AA put forward representatives to debate those who contend AA is a corrupt,hypocritical,dangerous cult?"We avoid controversy:how convenient.
Why would they? It is not a profit-making corporation who is destroying the world, a banking cartel enslaving the populations of the world with debt, or one of the many corrupt governments - but small groups of ordinary people who get together to help each other
People can attend if it works for them & not attend if it doesn't. Take anything that is of use & leave the rest. Simple
Anyone who thinks that is dangerous & corrupt should perhaps get out more & look a bit wider
In comparison to the real corruption & damage going on in the world, in our own countries, that we should be very concerned about, I find it odd for anyone to attack the likes of AA members who get together to create a better way of life for themselves
No-one is forced to attend or to take any notice of what is said
If one doesn't like what they have on offer - you stay away. Very simple & straightforward
Personally I struggle to see what is corrupt about that
@explorer2101 I'm not attacking AA members.I was in AA for about six years,and I went to a meeting on Monday because I happened to be with a friend who is an AA member.I'm glad I went because it showed me how guilt inducing AA can be for certain people.Some people are the beneficiaries of AA,and others are there to serve AA.I regard AA as a folk religion which has good parts and bad parts.One thing I observed while in AA,and since I've left,is that AA doesn't tolerate any criticism.
Unlike much else these days, AA is not an organisation out to make a profit from people's illnesses & disturbances but a group of individual people who come together to help each other
It's not perfect, as the world is not perfect, but one can pick & choose who you mix with, who you befriend. Peraps overly guilt producing for some; an overdue sense of humility to others
Despite its imperfections, it does bring peace, balance & sobriety to many for whom nothing else has worked
@MrGrapeApe ...OK, you're right I was only at the debating society because of the free cookies and coffee but I guess my gig is up. After researching this blametheorange stuff I realize that it really only helps aa and further research of aa's history tells of tougher challenges not the least of which was it's birth in the first place. I encourage "Mike" and "blame" to take all of this hard work to the 4th column already before they've cashed in totally. Bye
Whoo! ...OK. these are terrible videos. You and your buddy(s) simply cut and paste "AA" stuff against the back drop of your own cantankerous nature. Anyone wherein true wisdom passes sees that you have no clothes. Peace be yours.
OK, but not so fast. First, I'd like you to put forth the main principles of your premise, and how you came to formulate such premises. ...don't worry, I will have the requested items at the appropriate scheduled time.
Whimsical?? Just think "evolution" and we should be fine. OK?
I can respect that you have an opinion that probably differs from mine But in all fairness, and not to be condescending at all... your assertions are theoretical, unsubstantiated and without a supportable premise. I'm sorry if that hurts a little, but you do provide your viewers with an option to respond, so here it is.
Can't say that I know thousands but I will agree the subsequent worsening of an alcoholic's situation is almost guaranteed upon abandoning any course of recovery or treatment. This is not aa's fault. On the other hand, you did not mention "alcoholic" in your response for "thousands" which implies cases that are/would be irrelevant even if relevance is not a primary issue for ones attending aa meetings. I appreciate your response.
Anything other than possible treatment for those who want to stop their destructive drinking. In this light... how is it the place of anyone's to criticize or try to invalidate another's own understanding and beliefs about their own recovery process?? Aa doesn't push its self on alcoholics... it's simply there if one chooses to go. So again, one could give validation to some of op's assertions but that doesn't negate the fact that aa is also good.
@ogaextreme2035 AA is not "treatment", but religious faith healing mixed with some quack psychology, to which the majority of its attendees are mandated. This, in our opinion does negate the assertion that AA is also good. Mike
I don't like or dislike aa but I'm happy to have witnessed the turn around in this persons life and happy to have them as a friend who's character is much more whole ...shall we say... than seemed possible many years ago. Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think aa really even exists as an organized entity in the traditional sense, so it seems strange that anyone would go to such dramatic measures as making "anti" AA movies given that the meetings don't promote themselves as ....tbc
@ogaextreme2035 AA does exist as an organized entity, with a CEO, treasure, board of directors, and articles of incorporation. What, precisely makes you so certain that AA had anything to do with the one anecdotal "success" you are referring to. He could just as easily quit drinking sometime after staying at a Holiday Inn Express, or a trip to Lourdes. You cannot establish a causal relationship between AA attendance and abstinence. Mike
And leads a fairly decent life with ups and downs like most trying to live a good life. The troubles that use to plage them seemed once again right around the corner durring The times that they had relapsed and thankfully they did not have to reek any serious havoc on themselves or the public before they again got back to AA and picked up were left off in recovery. Albeit the op makes some points worth handing over, their premise is confusing unless one doesn't like aa. Tbc...
I know someone who went to AA 25 years ago and this person was heading steadfastly towards prison ...not for any malicious deeds or heinous acts of assault to the public, just a general stacking up of drunk in publics, beer fights, possession of weed, shoplifting, etc arrest after arrest ....bench warrant after bench warrant. They did relapse a couple of times since but hasn't been arrested or in any kind of trouble since, has an outstanding driving record, has traveled all over the world, ..tbc
",... here's a Step I'd like to ad: Made a decision to turn my will and my life back over to the care of myself - who I have learned to trust and respect." thanks humyepright! You said it!
That's right, AA does is not a religious program. The point is to grow along spiritual lines. I'm sorry you've had a bad experience and believe what you believe, I respect your opinion. AA does work for some people and I am one of those people. I have my own opinions, my own thoughts, and my own live. I don't feel like it's a "cult" or that I have given my life away. My life is tremendously better than it was before, thanks to the people and program of AA.
@mc20071 Why do true believers automatically assume that our criticisms are based upon bad experiences? Mine aren't, and I don't believe the site founder's are, either. We criticise the 12-step movement based upon objective investigations and observations. If anything we assert can be objectively shown to be inaccurate, we will correct with apologies. Mike BD
@mc20071 "AA does is not a religious program"??? That's demonstrably false even in your own statement. "grow along spiritual lines"??? What does that even mean?
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
The mere fact that you were coherent enough to produce this garbage tells me that you truly have not suffered enough pain, nor have attained enough willingness, to see the value of AA. In order for it to work you have to have the desperation of a drowning man. You have to feel like there is no other way. I and countless others who go to AA understand this. You may think you're helping people, but you're not.
locust, a rather typical remark from the average aa comedian. a 'drowning man', yes. To be so desparate that you will accept just about anything. That is aa in a nutshell. Thanks.
It took me about twenty-five years to wake up and get out - if there were spom eone to sue - believe me - I would. Resentment? well, yes, I guess you could say that - and now I use it to fuel my quest to make up for lost time. But before I go, here's a Step I'd like to ad: Made a decision to turn my will and my life back over to the care of myself - who I have learned to trust and respect.
It puzzles me greatly when people speak about AA as encouraging people to be irresponsible - when it is completely the opposite.
If only more people in society worked a program and took responsibility every day for their actions, the world would be a far better place to live in.
Billions of people live productively without anti-depressants but it doesn't cause me to go around calling doctors & psychiatrists drug whores or self-serving pushers who care not a jot for their patients
If AA works for people & enriches the lives of many beyond recognition, without the use of drugs or harming others, by encouraging responsibility & coming together - then good luck to them
Seems preferable to many of the shamelessly profiteering & often ineffective alternatives
@explorer2101 So, you give the drug whores and self-serving pushers who masquerade as compassionate helpers a pass? If AA worked for more than a handful and harmlessly enriched countless lives beyond recognition, we would not be having this dialogue. Much shameless profiteering and ineffectiveness occurs under the 12-step flag. Mike BD
@bigrobtheactor Good for you. Some people do recover from alcoholism, if your okay, you don't need AA. As for me, I am so sick of the crap in AA, that I don't want to go any more. All those condecending know it alls, that have been sober for decades, many of them just come to be part of something. They get to controle the lives of others, and man do the get drunk on that power.
I am glad you are enjoying it - but before I indulge you any further, where do you get the authority to accuse me of 'getting crazier and crazier?' No need to add it to your tenth step - I am merely curious. Does it feel good thinking you can diagnose people as being crazier? Amazing, truly amazing! Thanks for the comment nonetheless... B l A m E
One fine day. One fine day, It all will be revealed. We will just have to wait for God to reveal exactly why he sent AA to the poor long suffering alcoholic. It may be because God has a sense of humor.
I"ve known a number of people who wanted to leave AA but were too scared do to the dogma and fear based brain washing.I am so glad to be free of that cult and those needy people.
I know countless people who feel AA destroyed their marriage.AA members often have affairs with other members even though they are married.I think gossip and sex keeps a lot of them going to meetings.
Because of the indoctrination of powerlessness when AA members have other issues come up they join yet another 12 step group.If they have a relationship issue they run to alanaon or code If they gain weight they run to overeaters.Meetings and 12 step groups become their addiction.
many marriage has ended due to AA members getting addicted to meetings and neglecting their real family and real obligations.The courts have no right to force people into this damaging cult.
I knew of a couple of women who gave their children up and didn't raise them so they could attend meetings.The sad thing is that they got support from AA to do this.The dogma is that sobriety comes first over everyone and everything.One does not need to go to these extremes to stay sober.
So true.I went to AA in my 20's and was brain washed into believing I owed AA my sobriety.I was expected to give my time and energy,in fact my life to AA.I was encouraged to neglect my loved ones and my own needs to do free service work for the cult and the crazy cult members.I finally wised up and moved on and am so glad to see these warnings for people looking for help with an alcohol problem.If you can't do it alone,go to a professional who does not shove AA on you.You are not powerless.
Good video.AA is a religion that teaches powerlessness and that only by attending group meetings for life can you be saved.AA talks about getting rid of your old ideas,well AA is an old idea-1935 with no changes.Truth evolves ,AA and religion don't allow for any of that.AA does more harm than good.If you need help with an addiction problem.,go to a professional who does not shove AA down your throat,get sober and then get on with your life.
AA is like the shell game AAs have to repeat variations on the theme "that's an exception, & is not representative of AA" it's not in the meetings it's in the book, no, it's sponsorship, no the "real" AA problems are in the basic program itself, It does not work, it was never meant to work, it's just a cult religion, coupled with the jargon of junk science by calling alcoholism a disease which it is not.
89 - you're an indoctrinated imbecile willing to excuse anything to preserve your precious (3x strong!) AA delusion.
let me know where you go your 4th time for treatment & i'll send a card. on my deathbed, i'll ask to meet bill w. in the afterlife so i can kick his stupid, sardonic ass.
then i'll let the worms go to work & be free of idiots like you. you are such an enormous dick. serene, perhaps. but still a dick.
89 - mike q & his midtown cronies were just following directly in bill w's serial-philandering, womanizing, 13th-stepping footsteps. they were hardly an 'anomaly'.
as for your 3-for-3 comment, you don't have to direct a hamster once it's discovered the wheel.
I wonder how many thousands of times AAs have to repeat variations on the theme "that's an exception, and is not representative of AA" before it begins to dawn on them that maybe it really isn't an exception.
spiritual, religious, cult ... none of that means a damn thing in the long run. the bottom line is that by any means of judging effectiveness, AA fails at its stated primary purpose ('staying sober & helping others achieve sobriety').
for the vast majority who turn to it, it doesn't work - whether you 'work' it or not (another absurdly opaque notion). it doesn't deserve public recognition nor its widely institionalized (taxpayer funded) place in health care.
78 - i've read the bible, the BB, & the 12X12. i agree that some of the vid's correlations are strained, but if you're trying to deny a distinctly christian (religious) relation to the birth, development, & continued practice of AA, then you'd better go back & do your own research (particularly dick b's site & just about any conf. approved lit).
btw, i wouldn't be too bent out of shape: carlin was about as un-anonymous an AA guy in his final days as one could get.
Enough of your nonsensical circles and insults. If Blame wants to unblock you and engage you some more, that is up to him. Till then, happy trails. Mike
Same question. Denials, opinions, and needlings aside, are you going to put anything of substance up? Calling us liars and posting nonsense isn't addressing anything. Mike
Like it or not, the parroted dogma and traditional wisdom, like the mindless rhetoric, is ALL AA. Deny it all you want, it is all repeated countless times every day in AA meetings everywhere. Own it, because it is yours. Mike
50/25/25 didn't appear in the doctor's opinion. It was a bald-faced lie when it was first asserted, and hasn't been true since. 90% of all who start AA leave within three months. 50% of the 10% are still there at the end of the first year. Again, AAA's own statistics. Mike
Those books are all purchased from AAWS, which makes a tidy profit on each copy. According to their latest available tax return, they go through about 18 million bucks a year. Mike
We have literally hundreds of AA quotes to draw upon to show its deceitfulness and dishonesty. It starts on the first page of the first edition with the bs 50/25/25 nonsense, and never stops. Mike
Jails, institutions, or death are stated all the time. Parroted wisdom, rhetoric, liturgy, ritual, and dogma all come together to form the religion of AA. You confuse your opinion for fact. Mike
So why doesn't AA sell literature at cost, and why do they sue members for giving away free bigbooks? Of course AA is a religon. It satisfies every requirement of the definition. Mike
if you want to be factully correct, you'll have to stop porporting things as "The Program" that are not. If its sumpin you heard at meetings, but its not in the book, it IS NOT a part of the 12 step program.
Unless each A.A. member follows to the best of his ability our suggested Twelve Steps to recovery, he almost certainly signs his own death warrant. His drunkenness and dissolution are not penalties inflicted by people in authority; they result from his personal disobedience to spiritual principles. Twelve Steps and Twelve Traditions, William G. Wilson, page 174.
I loveGC. Just love him. Its to bad he died, HE WAS GETTING TO HIS ANGRIEST I'VE EVER SEEN him, aqnd some of his best stuff was the last two years. The best.
Go ahead - I responded to your post earlier; everyone has their view and should you watch this, and disagree, that is great. Just don't make people think your way for your sake.. B l A m E.
ALSO, if you read the book you would know that its more than just an allergy, its also the craving, lots of people can drink a beer or two or pop a pill when they get there wisdom teeth out and never think about that beer or that pill again. the craving leads us to the drink or drug, the allergy is why once that drink or drug is in our system, we just cant seem to stop. PS. I HATE AA, because of the people in the room with 10 years who are miserable. BUT AA and the BIGBOOK seem to be diff now
ejg722 9 months ago
@ejg722 Aside from the allergy nonsense, you accurately described the conditions which render responsible drinking an impossibility for me. I have another shocker for you-AA was full of miserable people in 1981 when I first rolled in. Mike BD
blamethenile 9 months ago
Well, being in AA as long as you have been you would think you would have read a bit of the book while being there. Although I must admit that i am not surprised at all by the fact that not one of your reply post hits on the book at all. The problem is the EGO driving people in AA put there own personal opinion into the program and it taints it. the truth of the matter is.. if you follow the first 164 pages of the book, exactly the way it is written, you dont have to sit in a meeting and bitch
ejg722 9 months ago
@ejg722 Adherence to page 135 has killed more alcoholics than AA has ever saved. The chapter "To Wives" was written by Wilson posing as a wife. "To Employers" was written by a man who relapsed over business and personal disputes with Wilson. "We Agnostics" is a blatant attempt to religiously convert. Beyond all that, it is very self-contradicting. Mike BD
blamethenile 9 months ago
@bigrobtheactor...sober 21 yrs. in A.A. I just can't take the crap and b/s anymore. I haven't had a sponsor in years, nor worked a step in 7 or 8, my life has not fallen apart. And I KNOW I am no longer a sick woman ! BUT, as I type this I can stillhear the dogma trying to sneak into my ear. There is a part of me that still cares what everyone will think....she's gonna drink or die. Should I call my sponsor? (THAT IS A JOKE) Thanks for posting doll...Benee'
sumibj 9 months ago
this is how being powerless works. If a person has an allergy to peanuts, as many people do, they are powerless over that. They can not change that fact. There is no cure to that. Well, that is what being powerless over alcohol means. We have an allergy to it. The effect of alcohol is very different on an alcoholic then on anyone else. We are not powerless over the decision to drink. Attending AA is a way to take power back. Mike here thinks we are being weak, but we are just living sober
lukatme2 9 months ago
@lukatme2 People who are allergic to peanuts don't eat peanuts. If they choose to eat peanuts with that knowledge, it isn't powerlessness, just a poor choice. Mike BD
blamethenile 9 months ago
@blamethenile Exactly, and when they eat the peanuts, they suffer the consequences of there actions. Just like an alcoholic when they drink alcohol. They have the power to continue to eat peanuts until they die of it. Life is full of choices. I made mine, I like AA, inspite of the the controle freaks, and religious nuts that wonder in to change the world. Screw them, I'm in it for me...
pecosbill87 9 months ago
Every time I hear the word "spiritual" I reach for my pistol.
bigrobtheactor 1 year ago
No disrespect, as I'm nor much of a "big-book thumper" myself, but you make no raitonal argument in your video for the theme upon which it is titled. Few of the subtitles provided are either AA approved literature or even frequently used phrases around AA. The illustrations that you use are indifferent to the topic altogether. I admit that the philosophy of AA may not be for everyone, but if you intend to publicly challenge the purpose, validity or success of the group, be more convincing.
bhf4621 1 year ago
@bhf4621 AA doesn't like being publicly challenged does it?Will AA put forward representatives to debate those who contend AA is a corrupt,hypocritical,dangerous cult?"We avoid controversy:how convenient.
henryporter101 1 year ago
@henryporter101
Why would they? It is not a profit-making corporation who is destroying the world, a banking cartel enslaving the populations of the world with debt, or one of the many corrupt governments - but small groups of ordinary people who get together to help each other
People can attend if it works for them & not attend if it doesn't. Take anything that is of use & leave the rest. Simple
Anyone who thinks that is dangerous & corrupt should perhaps get out more & look a bit wider
explorer2101 11 months ago
@explorer2101 Interesting line of reasoning.There are other corrupt organizations therefore AA isn't corrupt.Your comment has proved my point.
henryporter101 11 months ago
@henryporter101
In comparison to the real corruption & damage going on in the world, in our own countries, that we should be very concerned about, I find it odd for anyone to attack the likes of AA members who get together to create a better way of life for themselves
No-one is forced to attend or to take any notice of what is said
If one doesn't like what they have on offer - you stay away. Very simple & straightforward
Personally I struggle to see what is corrupt about that
explorer2101 11 months ago
@explorer2101 I'm not attacking AA members.I was in AA for about six years,and I went to a meeting on Monday because I happened to be with a friend who is an AA member.I'm glad I went because it showed me how guilt inducing AA can be for certain people.Some people are the beneficiaries of AA,and others are there to serve AA.I regard AA as a folk religion which has good parts and bad parts.One thing I observed while in AA,and since I've left,is that AA doesn't tolerate any criticism.
henryporter101 11 months ago
@henryporter101
Unlike much else these days, AA is not an organisation out to make a profit from people's illnesses & disturbances but a group of individual people who come together to help each other
It's not perfect, as the world is not perfect, but one can pick & choose who you mix with, who you befriend. Peraps overly guilt producing for some; an overdue sense of humility to others
Despite its imperfections, it does bring peace, balance & sobriety to many for whom nothing else has worked
explorer2101 11 months ago 2
@MrGrapeApe ...OK, you're right I was only at the debating society because of the free cookies and coffee but I guess my gig is up. After researching this blametheorange stuff I realize that it really only helps aa and further research of aa's history tells of tougher challenges not the least of which was it's birth in the first place. I encourage "Mike" and "blame" to take all of this hard work to the 4th column already before they've cashed in totally. Bye
ogaextreme2035 1 year ago
@ogaextreme2035 Fourth estate, fifth column. Mike
blamethenile 1 year ago
Whoo! ...OK. these are terrible videos. You and your buddy(s) simply cut and paste "AA" stuff against the back drop of your own cantankerous nature. Anyone wherein true wisdom passes sees that you have no clothes. Peace be yours.
ogaextreme2035 1 year ago
@ogaextreme2035 See Mike?It doesent take a scientist to see through a edited opinion!
mamasboy815 1 year ago
OK, but not so fast. First, I'd like you to put forth the main principles of your premise, and how you came to formulate such premises. ...don't worry, I will have the requested items at the appropriate scheduled time.
Whimsical?? Just think "evolution" and we should be fine. OK?
ogaextreme2035 1 year ago
@ogaextreme2035 With over seventy vids up, pick a principle, any principle, and we can take it from there. Mike BD
blamethenile 1 year ago
@ogaextreme2035 resign from the debating society
MrApedrape 1 year ago
I can respect that you have an opinion that probably differs from mine But in all fairness, and not to be condescending at all... your assertions are theoretical, unsubstantiated and without a supportable premise. I'm sorry if that hurts a little, but you do provide your viewers with an option to respond, so here it is.
ogaextreme2035 1 year ago
@ogaextreme2035 Your responses are a bit whimsical, but OK. Which assertions would you like us to substantiate? Mike BD
blamethenile 1 year ago
Can't say that I know thousands but I will agree the subsequent worsening of an alcoholic's situation is almost guaranteed upon abandoning any course of recovery or treatment. This is not aa's fault. On the other hand, you did not mention "alcoholic" in your response for "thousands" which implies cases that are/would be irrelevant even if relevance is not a primary issue for ones attending aa meetings. I appreciate your response.
ogaextreme2035 1 year ago
Anything other than possible treatment for those who want to stop their destructive drinking. In this light... how is it the place of anyone's to criticize or try to invalidate another's own understanding and beliefs about their own recovery process?? Aa doesn't push its self on alcoholics... it's simply there if one chooses to go. So again, one could give validation to some of op's assertions but that doesn't negate the fact that aa is also good.
ogaextreme2035 1 year ago
@ogaextreme2035 AA is not "treatment", but religious faith healing mixed with some quack psychology, to which the majority of its attendees are mandated. This, in our opinion does negate the assertion that AA is also good. Mike
blamethenile 1 year ago
I don't like or dislike aa but I'm happy to have witnessed the turn around in this persons life and happy to have them as a friend who's character is much more whole ...shall we say... than seemed possible many years ago. Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think aa really even exists as an organized entity in the traditional sense, so it seems strange that anyone would go to such dramatic measures as making "anti" AA movies given that the meetings don't promote themselves as ....tbc
ogaextreme2035 1 year ago
@ogaextreme2035 AA does exist as an organized entity, with a CEO, treasure, board of directors, and articles of incorporation. What, precisely makes you so certain that AA had anything to do with the one anecdotal "success" you are referring to. He could just as easily quit drinking sometime after staying at a Holiday Inn Express, or a trip to Lourdes. You cannot establish a causal relationship between AA attendance and abstinence. Mike
blamethenile 1 year ago
And leads a fairly decent life with ups and downs like most trying to live a good life. The troubles that use to plage them seemed once again right around the corner durring The times that they had relapsed and thankfully they did not have to reek any serious havoc on themselves or the public before they again got back to AA and picked up were left off in recovery. Albeit the op makes some points worth handing over, their premise is confusing unless one doesn't like aa. Tbc...
ogaextreme2035 1 year ago
@ogaextreme2035 AA manufactures its own critics. We have all spent considerable time there, and came to the conclusions rendered here. Mike
blamethenile 1 year ago
I know someone who went to AA 25 years ago and this person was heading steadfastly towards prison ...not for any malicious deeds or heinous acts of assault to the public, just a general stacking up of drunk in publics, beer fights, possession of weed, shoplifting, etc arrest after arrest ....bench warrant after bench warrant. They did relapse a couple of times since but hasn't been arrested or in any kind of trouble since, has an outstanding driving record, has traveled all over the world, ..tbc
ogaextreme2035 1 year ago
@ogaextreme2035 I know thousands who went to AA and subsequently left, often much worse for wear. Mike
blamethenile 1 year ago
Does "False Myth" translate as "True Fact?"
513986916 1 year ago
",... here's a Step I'd like to ad: Made a decision to turn my will and my life back over to the care of myself - who I have learned to trust and respect." thanks humyepright! You said it!
lighwave 1 year ago
That's right, AA does is not a religious program. The point is to grow along spiritual lines. I'm sorry you've had a bad experience and believe what you believe, I respect your opinion. AA does work for some people and I am one of those people. I have my own opinions, my own thoughts, and my own live. I don't feel like it's a "cult" or that I have given my life away. My life is tremendously better than it was before, thanks to the people and program of AA.
mc20071 1 year ago
@mc20071 Why do true believers automatically assume that our criticisms are based upon bad experiences? Mine aren't, and I don't believe the site founder's are, either. We criticise the 12-step movement based upon objective investigations and observations. If anything we assert can be objectively shown to be inaccurate, we will correct with apologies. Mike BD
blamethenile 1 year ago 2
@mc20071 "AA does is not a religious program"??? That's demonstrably false even in your own statement. "grow along spiritual lines"??? What does that even mean?
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@MrMZaccone since when were spirituallity and religion the same thing?
mc20071 1 year ago
@mc20071 Every time I've discussed it with anyone in any depth, I've found them to be identical in the long run.
MrMZaccone 1 year ago
@yam500 That is funny. Ranting raving old bleeding deacons are a staple at AA meetings.
prschuster 1 year ago
Where is sound?
DopeDrugs 1 year ago
@DopeDrugs Ask WMG, Mike
blamethenile 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
The mere fact that you were coherent enough to produce this garbage tells me that you truly have not suffered enough pain, nor have attained enough willingness, to see the value of AA. In order for it to work you have to have the desperation of a drowning man. You have to feel like there is no other way. I and countless others who go to AA understand this. You may think you're helping people, but you're not.
locust73 2 years ago
We may not have suffered enough pain, but we have certainly suffered enough fools, so you are outta here. Wiedersehn, Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
locust, a rather typical remark from the average aa comedian. a 'drowning man', yes. To be so desparate that you will accept just about anything. That is aa in a nutshell. Thanks.
dix345 2 years ago 2
This video has helped me. So that's one person.
tagliavini 2 years ago
It took me about twenty-five years to wake up and get out - if there were spom eone to sue - believe me - I would. Resentment? well, yes, I guess you could say that - and now I use it to fuel my quest to make up for lost time. But before I go, here's a Step I'd like to ad: Made a decision to turn my will and my life back over to the care of myself - who I have learned to trust and respect.
bigrobtheactor 2 years ago 11
Here here!!! Took me ten years' to get out. It isn't easy, but life isn't easy is it? But it's my life and I'M responsible.
tagliavini 2 years ago 5
@tagliavini
It puzzles me greatly when people speak about AA as encouraging people to be irresponsible - when it is completely the opposite.
If only more people in society worked a program and took responsibility every day for their actions, the world would be a far better place to live in.
explorer2101 11 months ago
@explorer2101 Billions of people world-wide lead moral, ethical and productive lives without the self-denying religion which is AA. Mike BD
blamethenile 11 months ago
@blamethenile
Billions of people live productively without anti-depressants but it doesn't cause me to go around calling doctors & psychiatrists drug whores or self-serving pushers who care not a jot for their patients
If AA works for people & enriches the lives of many beyond recognition, without the use of drugs or harming others, by encouraging responsibility & coming together - then good luck to them
Seems preferable to many of the shamelessly profiteering & often ineffective alternatives
explorer2101 11 months ago
@explorer2101 So, you give the drug whores and self-serving pushers who masquerade as compassionate helpers a pass? If AA worked for more than a handful and harmlessly enriched countless lives beyond recognition, we would not be having this dialogue. Much shameless profiteering and ineffectiveness occurs under the 12-step flag. Mike BD
blamethenile 11 months ago
@blamethenile
Doesn't mean that others cannot choose the route of AA. Each to their own surely?
explorer2101 11 months ago
@bigrobtheactor AMEN!
DJLunasf 1 year ago
@bigrobtheactor 25 years? What a retard.
2008goo 9 months ago
@2008goo I hear you - thanks for trying to make me feel even worse.
bigrobtheactor 9 months ago
@bigrobtheactor Good for you. Some people do recover from alcoholism, if your okay, you don't need AA. As for me, I am so sick of the crap in AA, that I don't want to go any more. All those condecending know it alls, that have been sober for decades, many of them just come to be part of something. They get to controle the lives of others, and man do the get drunk on that power.
pecosbill87 9 months ago
@pecosbill87 thanks man, I've never been better.
bigrobtheactor 9 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
You are getting crazier and crazier right in front of our eyes. An amazing thing to watch
weinerout 2 years ago
I am glad you are enjoying it - but before I indulge you any further, where do you get the authority to accuse me of 'getting crazier and crazier?' No need to add it to your tenth step - I am merely curious. Does it feel good thinking you can diagnose people as being crazier? Amazing, truly amazing! Thanks for the comment nonetheless... B l A m E
blamethenile 2 years ago 2
talk about a deep reflection!!!
Keep up the good work!
RhinoStompin 2 years ago
One fine day. One fine day, It all will be revealed. We will just have to wait for God to reveal exactly why he sent AA to the poor long suffering alcoholic. It may be because God has a sense of humor.
dix345 2 years ago
Yes,I too am glad that I was willing to move on from AA and deal with the changes that go with that choice.
sherwoode7 2 years ago 2
I"ve known a number of people who wanted to leave AA but were too scared do to the dogma and fear based brain washing.I am so glad to be free of that cult and those needy people.
sherwoode7 2 years ago
I know countless people who feel AA destroyed their marriage.AA members often have affairs with other members even though they are married.I think gossip and sex keeps a lot of them going to meetings.
sherwoode7 2 years ago
Because of the indoctrination of powerlessness when AA members have other issues come up they join yet another 12 step group.If they have a relationship issue they run to alanaon or code If they gain weight they run to overeaters.Meetings and 12 step groups become their addiction.
sherwoode7 2 years ago
many marriage has ended due to AA members getting addicted to meetings and neglecting their real family and real obligations.The courts have no right to force people into this damaging cult.
sherwoode7 2 years ago
I knew of a couple of women who gave their children up and didn't raise them so they could attend meetings.The sad thing is that they got support from AA to do this.The dogma is that sobriety comes first over everyone and everything.One does not need to go to these extremes to stay sober.
sherwoode7 2 years ago
So true.I went to AA in my 20's and was brain washed into believing I owed AA my sobriety.I was expected to give my time and energy,in fact my life to AA.I was encouraged to neglect my loved ones and my own needs to do free service work for the cult and the crazy cult members.I finally wised up and moved on and am so glad to see these warnings for people looking for help with an alcohol problem.If you can't do it alone,go to a professional who does not shove AA on you.You are not powerless.
sherwoode7 2 years ago
Good video.AA is a religion that teaches powerlessness and that only by attending group meetings for life can you be saved.AA talks about getting rid of your old ideas,well AA is an old idea-1935 with no changes.Truth evolves ,AA and religion don't allow for any of that.AA does more harm than good.If you need help with an addiction problem.,go to a professional who does not shove AA down your throat,get sober and then get on with your life.
sherwoode7 2 years ago
It is a cult religion that very few buy into. It is a revolving door. AA does not do very much of anything.
dix345 2 years ago
AA is like the shell game AAs have to repeat variations on the theme "that's an exception, & is not representative of AA" it's not in the meetings it's in the book, no, it's sponsorship, no the "real" AA problems are in the basic program itself, It does not work, it was never meant to work, it's just a cult religion, coupled with the jargon of junk science by calling alcoholism a disease which it is not.
Yoganao 2 years ago
those that say AA saved there life are crazy AA does not want people to recover they don't want any one do get sober they want slaves
baileytom78 2 years ago
89 - you're an indoctrinated imbecile willing to excuse anything to preserve your precious (3x strong!) AA delusion.
let me know where you go your 4th time for treatment & i'll send a card. on my deathbed, i'll ask to meet bill w. in the afterlife so i can kick his stupid, sardonic ass.
then i'll let the worms go to work & be free of idiots like you. you are such an enormous dick. serene, perhaps. but still a dick.
see ya.
notspeedy0314 2 years ago
89 - mike q & his midtown cronies were just following directly in bill w's serial-philandering, womanizing, 13th-stepping footsteps. they were hardly an 'anomaly'.
as for your 3-for-3 comment, you don't have to direct a hamster once it's discovered the wheel.
keep comin' back!
notspeedy0314 2 years ago
I wonder how many thousands of times AAs have to repeat variations on the theme "that's an exception, and is not representative of AA" before it begins to dawn on them that maybe it really isn't an exception.
ilsitat 2 years ago 2
spiritual, religious, cult ... none of that means a damn thing in the long run. the bottom line is that by any means of judging effectiveness, AA fails at its stated primary purpose ('staying sober & helping others achieve sobriety').
for the vast majority who turn to it, it doesn't work - whether you 'work' it or not (another absurdly opaque notion). it doesn't deserve public recognition nor its widely institionalized (taxpayer funded) place in health care.
it's voodoo medicine.
notspeedy0314 2 years ago
78 - i've read the bible, the BB, & the 12X12. i agree that some of the vid's correlations are strained, but if you're trying to deny a distinctly christian (religious) relation to the birth, development, & continued practice of AA, then you'd better go back & do your own research (particularly dick b's site & just about any conf. approved lit).
btw, i wouldn't be too bent out of shape: carlin was about as un-anonymous an AA guy in his final days as one could get.
notspeedy0314 2 years ago
Enough of your nonsensical circles and insults. If Blame wants to unblock you and engage you some more, that is up to him. Till then, happy trails. Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
Great job, Mike. It takes a leap of brain material to grasp the intent of the video. Some lost much of that in the cult.
codyandmax 2 years ago
Thanks. This one was actually a solo effort by my partner here, but we appreciate the praise. Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
Same question. Denials, opinions, and needlings aside, are you going to put anything of substance up? Calling us liars and posting nonsense isn't addressing anything. Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
Like it or not, the parroted dogma and traditional wisdom, like the mindless rhetoric, is ALL AA. Deny it all you want, it is all repeated countless times every day in AA meetings everywhere. Own it, because it is yours. Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
50/25/25 didn't appear in the doctor's opinion. It was a bald-faced lie when it was first asserted, and hasn't been true since. 90% of all who start AA leave within three months. 50% of the 10% are still there at the end of the first year. Again, AAA's own statistics. Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
It's AA's interpretation of its own statistical data. On what statistical data do you base your disbelief? Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
What's your own name? Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
Because you don't say it, or believe it, does not make it "not AA". Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
Google Midtown Group AA and learn something. Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
Those books are all purchased from AAWS, which makes a tidy profit on each copy. According to their latest available tax return, they go through about 18 million bucks a year. Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
We have literally hundreds of AA quotes to draw upon to show its deceitfulness and dishonesty. It starts on the first page of the first edition with the bs 50/25/25 nonsense, and never stops. Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
Do the steps or die. I hear it all the time. Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
Are you going to put something of substance up any time soon? Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
Jails, institutions, or death are stated all the time. Parroted wisdom, rhetoric, liturgy, ritual, and dogma all come together to form the religion of AA. You confuse your opinion for fact. Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
Half the steps, then. Happy? Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
Or referred to. B l A m E
blamethenile 2 years ago
So why doesn't AA sell literature at cost, and why do they sue members for giving away free bigbooks? Of course AA is a religon. It satisfies every requirement of the definition. Mike
blamethenile 2 years ago
if you want to be factully correct, you'll have to stop porporting things as "The Program" that are not. If its sumpin you heard at meetings, but its not in the book, it IS NOT a part of the 12 step program.
albabes 2 years ago
Unless each A.A. member follows to the best of his ability our suggested Twelve Steps to recovery, he almost certainly signs his own death warrant. His drunkenness and dissolution are not penalties inflicted by people in authority; they result from his personal disobedience to spiritual principles. Twelve Steps and Twelve Traditions, William G. Wilson, page 174.
B l A m E ;)
blamethenile 2 years ago
why the strange caps B l A m E?
I loveGC. Just love him. Its to bad he died, HE WAS GETTING TO HIS ANGRIEST I'VE EVER SEEN him, aqnd some of his best stuff was the last two years. The best.
albabes 2 years ago
Go ahead - I responded to your post earlier; everyone has their view and should you watch this, and disagree, that is great. Just don't make people think your way for your sake.. B l A m E.
blamethenile 2 years ago