Advanced Ving Tsun Chi Sao Practices w Sifu Tom Chi

[TobWorld]

im learning wing chun from argentina

i really like what you say and explain

it makes since :)

[CreasyE]

Your Chi Sao is very different to mine, I would like to know who your Sifu is please.

[heartslord]

I am a student of Master Robert Smith (Moy Hop Gee) and Grandmaster Moy Yat a very close disciple of Yip Man. Because I am the indoor student and close to Sifu Moy Yat I am 10G VT. Happy to hear from you.

[chiman1000]

Very Nice!!!

[awakenedstream]

i appreciate you showing us some of your training methods. i fear the terminology you use may over complicate, dumb down, and spread an arrogant attitude about this martial art i may be associated with. arbitrarily using the terms "lesser kung fu" or "bad wing chun" leads me to believe you have very limited knowledge of the system, especially after watching your video on elbow strikes. it is not that you are wrong, i think that there are more productive explanations though.

[heartslord]

Hahaaha.. I call it telling the truth the way I see it. My position is that "lesser kung fu" or "bad WC" is when the physics of the kung fu is violated.

Not everyone believes there is a physics. Those folks amazingly can learn VT/WC from watching actors pretend to do WT/WC. Your comment was mostly very constructive.

I do have limited knowledge of what others do but some things, you just don't want to know.

I hope I learn enough to please you though.

Hahaha

Thank You, Happy New Year!

[bronson1]

Hi, just a quick comment.

Do you do any "alive" training that is with an opponent who is non-complient and completly ramdom in their attacks.

If you do i would like to see how you apply your system.

I train Wong Shun Leung Ving Tsun.

Many thanks

JIm

[heartslord]

p.s. would love to workout with all the great VT practitioners in the UK. I get a lot of comments from there. You must have a number of strong VT communities!

[rsvingtsun]

If you see the way I chisao, you can tell that there is a blend of moy yat & ip chin,however your explanatioin is right on q. I use bong or fok sao to push, but the key point is bringing the horse to the strike, developing wrist technique. I noticed that you student rely on top sensitiviti (palm ) to fell your move. I would like to invite you to see some of my videos they are under rsvingtsun, perhaps you can see something that you can use, or better yet, add to what you know,

[moungfu]

thanks for demonstrating the Moy Yat system.

[heartslord]

It's important to understand that there is a penetration area that one must protect. This is the most basic VT. By not jutting immediately when the opponent is "walking in" and making the tan vertical one loses the advantage of VT physics and enters a more brawling response instead of complete control. There are a million inferior responses to the situation. This video shows how to use VT science to preclude unecessary raucous, poor responses.

[heartslord]

Re:using the bong to shove their force back at them.I prefer to allow their energy to disperse in a disabling direction.

The Tai Chi principle "1 oz moves a thousand lbs" works in Chi Sau too! If you present energy it gets used against you. If you don't present energy you collapse.

When you can easily open the petals & stand in the flower of the centerline it's more fun to dance there & allow them to test their understandings than to strike & "win". Of course, that's WAY beyond this video.

[mrjack001]

We're actually talking about the same thing :) I just prefer to use them low, and close to the person, "shunting". Or at least, I do at the moment!

"1 oz moves a thousand lbs" not gonna argue with that, leverage is always useful!

I understand what you mean, Chi Sau is used to explore, but Wing Chun isn't Tai Chi, the mindset is different; if Tai Chi is the art of neutralizing, Wing Chun is the art of attacking, no doubt you know this :)

[heartslord]

Enjoying the exchange.

I've done the Tai Chi form 10,000 times (a good start eh?) and played a lot of "pushing hands". You will see many similarities with VT/WC in combat too. In truly advanced pushing hands there are quite aggressive techniques. I find not many Tai Chi Chuan practitioners understand combat very well.

The main, huge difference is not just knowing where the centerline is but as you say, that constant chung chi, the forward energy that keeps both hands available and active.

[dhorse7]

you spot on with the wrists having to be applying equal pressure, this stops gaps, creates focus and allows transfer of full body weight. not sure if you you meaning for this demo but the bong sau should roll it seems you shunt. by rolling there force they have nothing to work against. tan can come through but it's not about hitting the opponnent in practice right.

[heartslord]

A "check" may be made on the bong tho no such thrust "check" with the tan. As the other commenter notes, the tan is always perceiving & advancing. For the tan to "attack" as tan dar, the other hand should be on top for a punch. A nice attack would turn the tan to a palm or bil sau and use the forearm near elbow to check his hand while striking. If he doesn't follow your arm and you lose control of his arm you'd need to flow to a different technique. Great comments, not much space to answer!

[mrjack001]

Thrusting with the bong sau, yeah! Bong sau should be used to smash through the person's attack/structure using the forearm/elbow with the hip to drive BANG! Putting their force back into them, which is why I don't understand why some people choose to have their bong sau above shoulder level, that's too high to make it work!

Peace

[heartslord]

This vid is the stage wherein one forges these tools in use.

Later, anything and nothing, become shreddable. ANY tightness, softness, hardness, focus, lack-of-focus, etc, all are for my delightful play. One may sing, & dance in chi sau as all opponent techniques are whack-a-mole. And who doesn't love that! After the A-B-C's, after sentence & structure.. then we just enjoy the language according to our personal abilities. With your opponent standing, sit in the boat and shake it and have fun!!

[mrjack001]

The way I see it is this: Both bong say and tan sau should be threading forward, constantly looking for gaps to strike though in Chi Sau. Simply maintaining rolling is just Poon Sau really.

The change over you execute at 3.55 wouldn't work if your opponents tan sau was "loaded" properly, as it would present a gap that the tan could shoot through! Try it!

The vertical tan can be delt with with jum sau, or even a jut sau, given enough body shifting to realign and attack

just my thoughts

peace.

[heartslord]

This is a step simpler for those using forward energy to check the bong, not to thrust forward w/the tan 2. The tan is def continuously shaping the play.

As to 3.55, I moved my arm to describe the flat tan position and then onto the vertical tan, wasn't intended to be "in play" but I see it could look that way.

Your method is more expert level to address the vertical tan. This vid is to teach students how not to have to razzle-dazzle out of a preventable situation.

Very appreciated! TY

[nel3000]

for the tan going forward like u were saying around 2:30...that is tan sau attack. if u move your feet with it. thats why elbow in right?