what a sincere human being - giving up his English 'Title' to live a life of Truth! - here was an aristocrat with wealth and fortune who gave it all - an example to us all
@pianoplayeruk I disagree, just because Ron Paul is anti war and supports some Libertarian views (which i think is good) lets not confuse Paul's love of Free Market Capitalism with full control without being accountable to the masses and he's insane believe of life at conception, which is dangerous. Benn supported the working class struggle against Capitalism!
Basically your response, apart from being wrong is also trash and I don't have the energy, will power or interest to counter it and on that note we should agree to disagree
Look, whatever their backgrounds matters not. Both men have more to offer in their little fingers than every other politician in the US and the UK combined. To that end, they are two of a kind, and sadly two of a kind too in the age department.
Mr Ben, well he's getting very old, but he leaves a legacy which will be remembered for a long time.
And Ron Paul - well he's running for the job of president at the age of 76 which kind says it all.
@pianoplayeruk Yes i agree background doesn't matter too much and even social class background doesn't matter its what your political class politics is based on. Politics for the bankers and millionaire's (capitalists) or for the working people who build up countries through hard work (working class)
I don't know enough about Paul but he seems to be a capitalist? Maybe i have got it wrong but after all he is in a Neo Liberal party.
John Mcdonnell MP now represents Socialism, check him out :)
@pianoplayeruk Ron Paul is about as politically opposed to Tony Benn as can be: the one's a neoliberal, the other's a socialist. I quote from Wikipedia, "One scoring method published in the American Journal of Political Science[187] found Paul the most conservative of all 3,320 members of Congress from 1937 to 2002."
They share foreign policy. When it comes to economic policy they are polar opposites, but the countries are different so it's a poor comparison.
The US federal government has shown how woefully inadequate it is at micro-managing all 50 states and how it now thinks it can do as it pleases bypassing congress entirely while the country is running up the wall with debt. While I understand in the UK people aren't quite so hot on their govt either, apples & oranges really
What insight Benn had and a well spoken and up to date information. He could not have been more right and just in his looking forward in time to tell of the disaster all this would bring. Way ahead of his time in thinking into the future.
look how the politicians just don't give a shit. It's amazing he is discussing a possible war and half the house are asleep! They don't care they are just there for their own interests.
if only he had been prime minister... Oh why! Why can't we find a man or woman like this as our prime minister! It's infuriating in a country of such decent people that we are governed by these members of parliament; untrustworthy, spend happy, destructive of public services and with each moment a layer of our souls is lost to the blender of Westminster until we turn to our friends echoing the idea that living somewhere else in the world would be a good notion to notch in our futures.
Say what you want about the iraq war in 2003, but at the end of the day Saddam Hussain had invaded a nation for no reason other than imperialism, and threatened the most important thing in the world which all nations depend upon - oil. If there is anything worth fighting for, it is oil, especially when iraq, kuwait and saudi contain 3/4 of the worlds oil... ur niave if your gonna put a few thousands soldiers lives above that, since the knock consequences of no oil would be worse!
@easyable I think Saddam set fire to those oil fields as a direct response to allied intervention, so we not only lost lives, but the oil as well... Don't get me wrong, Saddam Hussein was a complete tool, but he was backed by (and allegedly armed by) America..In the Eighties, he was seen by America as a stabilising force in the region... He was keeping terrorists out of Iraq (by killing them), and stopping Kurds (who have since incurred themselves into Turkey more than once).
The first gulf war was far different than current Iraq war. And what did Benn say to the Kuwaitis who were being murdered by Saddam? The UN never could have saved them.
@jimmbo13 Kuwait was and is nothing more than a US vassal state like Saudi Arabia. The US supported Iraqi attacks against Iran paid by Kuwaiti oil profits. It's all part of American foreign policy and has proved divisive in the Arab world. The UN could have saved them if it banned arms trading and the like then America never would have tried to influence either of the countries.
In his opening sentence here, did he say Iran or Iraq? All I heard was his "Iraa" - In either case, it is earie just how acurate his predictions: "I fear that the United States has already decided that when it is ready, it will create a pretext for a war against Iraa" and "I am opposed to actions outside the United Nations, I believe it would divide the security council."
Tell me again that we didn't have all the correct information before invading Iraq!!!
@mynameis677 They also didn't realise that Benn and his family fought incredibly bravely during the second world war. His brother was killed by the Germans.
What a great man, I wish we had a politician like him in our country. Holding his seat for 51years proves how much respect and admiration he had from people in his electorate (not sure what they call it in the U.K, constituency???). Definitely a man of great forsight.
The reason this great man never got elected to prime minister, was because a) He was a decent human being b) He was highly intelligent c) He cared about what the people wanted d) He knew his history and e) He told the truth
Benn speaks with great passion and sincerity, which many politicians today lack!
But honestly, how does he think that Iraq would put up any serious fight!? Iraq got mopped up in 1991, got run over in 2003, they couldn't hold the collective jock of the Western powers in a war!
And the idiot who said, you go out and die then.. bet he never fought a battle in his life.. tony benn fought in the spitfire during ww2.. so what ignorance to shout at this true honourable man who speakin truth with such rubbish !
he puts too much faith in the un.... they allowed a genocide to happen in rwanda because of its diplomacy efforts they had the power to stop it and they didnt.
Nothing he said turned out to be true. He said it would divide the security council, it did not they united in authorising force which in this video he also said wouldn't happen. He said that sanctions would be effective and we know they were not.
His opposition to the 2003 Iraq war he said it would be illegal because there was no UN approval. Well there was no UN approval for the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait in 1990 which this is in response to. The only person with a double standard here is him.
@MrLuvlyJubly Pick up the red flag and carry it onward. Which I'm sure is what he would want.
I don't share most of Mr. Benn's politics, but by God he can put together a compelling argument. I had the honour, and it was an honour, of hearing Mr. benn speak at Glastonbury this year and he is still, at the age of 85, speaking with more passion about what he believes in than most of our current politicians ever have.
The world needs more Socialists, real Socialists, like Tony Benn.
"it might not unite the arab world, but might bring many arab countries together against us". It amazes me how spot on this mans predictions and amazes me more still that they we never heeded.
This man was right about a lot of things ,An honest and true statesman---too bad we don't have very many like him in this country -run by crass politicians,out for their own political gain !
How right he was and all he said here has come true. Totally agree that we need more polticians like this and they need to be calling the shots so we can live in a fair and just society, where people are respected and valued.
Saddam must have had a good reason to attack Kuwait,, =) maybe bcz Bush Sr. was drilling Iraq oil from Kuwait side...too bad Saddam fell into Bush Sr. Trap..
What other traps have been set..maybe there's one right outside your door...=)
The reason why people like him will never become presidents or PM even though People are behind them is because there is no democracy! We never chose our leaders, we were presented with 2 prearranged choices who work for the same fascist and we had a choice to choose between those 2 evils..
Did we choose Tony Benn? No..he was selected by his local party, and presented as one option, and the Tories in the area did the same? I do agree with you though...we do not live in a Democracy!
What a corageous, honest, honourable and dignified man. If only there were more just and intelligent people in the world- it wouldn't be such a sick place.
tont never had ant intention of becoming PM .He despised power and he despised those that sought power.Tony was for the people and the structure that put people in controlDEMOCRACY.
Why was this man not PM? I would vote for him in a heart beat! Now we are left with incompetence and 2 main parties who are pretty much the same. At least you knew what you were voting for back then. Such a shame! Im going to be incredibly sad when this man passes away into history.
tony benn...old labour the last of his kind, a man of passion who tells the truth, the last decent british politician (galloway is too much of a nut for me). hes a guy who cared and cares about the have nots. bless you mr benn
u never hear this kind of passionj, eloquence and honesty from anyone in British politics currently. Where was this sort of opposition to the 2003 war? People resigned, but i never heard this kind of damning argument from anybody.
I am in awe of this, whether you agree with him or not, there is no denying that he has put his point across in such a way that if you agree with him, you feel the need to stand up an do something about it! we have lost this impulse in modern society.
Tony Benn is brilliant and I agree with him on the current war in iraq. But here he was wrong and completly out of order. Iraq had invaded another sovereign nation and her soldiers were running through kuwait like animals. The war was supported by syria, saudi arabia and the gulf states. Its very easy for tony benn to stand up and say what he did and then retire to his rather large cosey house afterwards.
The fact Iraq's neighbours dictators supported the war doesn't make it legitimate; there was a peaceful withdrawal possibility. Eventually Saddam withdrew but Bush sr. wouldn't have it so as the Iraqi troops withdrew up the highways out of Kuwait the famous 'turkey shoot' occurred. Gulf War 1 was a war of aggression straight out.
Because Saddam did withdraw from Kuwait. But Bush sr. wanted a war so he claimed Saddam was planning to attack Saudi Arabia, citing satellite imagery. Which didn't show any new movements along the Iraqi-Saudi border. So he ordered the attack anyway, US forces ambushed Iraqis moving north to Baghdad INSIDE Iraq. That's the famous 'turkey shoot'. Gulf War 1 was unnecessary as Saddam withdrew eventually.
Tony Benn... they still make ppl like ya ... God bless ya for stating the truth. Many few poodles like blair didnt have the testicular fortitude to call spades a spade.
I think it was another Labour MP, as it was the same voice that was saying 'hear hear' earlier. I imagine he said it in response to Conservative MPs disagreeing with Benn's speech.
Oh the irony! Why is it that idiots run the show and the voice of reason falls on deaf ears? May you live to a ripe old age, Tony Benn, you magnificent bastard! I
If all politicians were as honest and transparent as Tony Benn, this would be a much better place. 1950 to now, this chap has set a very good example.
It's "well you go out there and die then", a rather infantile MP (probably Tory, but let's not make assumptions) goading Tony Benn. And I have no intention of putting you down for mishearing something, I do it enough myself to know better :)
He is implying that Mr Benn doesn't know what war is like, and that going to war (and dying, put crudely) may change his opinion. Unnecessary, since Tony is a WW2 veteran. Any clearer?
You see Crank, Europe is inundated with a colossal guilt complex. Colonialism, 2 world wars & the most horrific genocide in human history (to name a few). The moral burden is so intense & blinding that Europe refuses to acknowledge Muslims killing Muslims as a crime against humanity(apart from a belated Sudanese indictment). Preaching to others is always easier than a well overdue hardcore & honest introspection...
Im not sure I have heard such a magnificent pre and post analysis of the outcomes of the Iraq war and its implications ever... and everything he said came to past... everything!!!.. and did you hear how he was heckled and laughed at and ridiculed by other members of parliament.. as if they knew better than he. that heckling is the typical voice of a racist uncaring self effacing Britain
I've just watched this clip for a second time, superb. Is this not what we want from our elected representatives?? Standing up for the truth and looking out for the weakest and pointing out the hypocrisy of the strong.
"pointing out the hypocrisy of the strong- really? Hypocrisy is ignoring 100,000 Muslim Chechens by Russia, 250,000 East Timoreans by Indonesia etc. Where was self righteous Tony when Europe stood idle to Serb atrocities in the Balkans? Selective sympathy & political expediency anyone?
shocking this only has 6,275 views, this is what is wrong with the world, people like tony benn in a world full of liars,corrupt, greedy indivuals and politicans-tony benn is a rarity an HONEST politician!!
Were was Tony when Russia butchered 100,000 Muslim Chechens in Grozny? or when Europe stood idle while Serbs butchered Muslim Bosnians? Selective Sympathy anyone? Nah...Self righteousness/? Nah... not Tony, no way...
Tony the self righteous king of selective sympathy for political expediency. Where was he when Russia butchered 100,000 Muslim Chechens or when Europe stood idle while Serbs butchered Muslim Bosnians? Hypocrisy? Double moral standards perhaps? Preach what you practice at home first
Sod your muslim Chechen terrorists who took over a Russian school and proceeded to kill the children and teachers. thenewsfarm, you play the typical muslim victim; actually, Nato did intervene against the Serbs. And what brought the Yugoslavian civil war about? Bastard Albanian muslims in Kosovo, that's what. Yugoslavia was good enough to let them move into Kosovo from Albania and to cultivate it, but then they were so grateful, they demanded independence! That's muslim graitude for you.
Crank----Chechen freedom fighters took over a school after Russia killed 100,000 independence seeking Muslim Chechens in Grozny. Russian troops looted, raped and tortured endless innocent victims. Get the facts before launching a baseless tirade. You risk self-embarrassment. Not good...
thenewsfarm, I know what Russians can be like (eg. to the German women in WW2), but whether Russia did that or not, you don't take it out on innocent people, especially kids, who won't know anything about it anyway. If the Chechens don't want to be killed they should behave themselves. It's well known the CIA have been involved in stirring them up with the idea of gaining a new ally with which to surround Russia, just as they have done with Georgia.
Chechens want independence over Chechnya just as the Kurds over Kurdistan. Chechens were willing to compromise. Russia wasn't, raped looted & killed 100,000 Chechen civilians in Grozny alone. No home left standing. No wonder Chechens are angry as hell. Wouldn't you?
France decimated the Ivory Coast's air port just a few years ago. What was France doing there in the first place?(oil off course). Isn't that terror? Colonialism any one? Where was Tony when the self righteous world needed a prophet of selective morality the most?
Crank--I'm not a Muslim. I'm an Israeli. No fondness for terrorists any time soon. Trust me. Simply demand Europe to quit preaching morals to Israel which she doesn't practice at home. No more double standards, that's all....
thenewsfarm, Tony Benn does not, and never has spoken on behalf of European governments. He's usually in opposition to British government policy, whether Labour or Tory, and he has consistently criticised Israel for being the USA's agent of terror in the Middle East.. For that reason, he can not be accused of double standards.
If Israel's actions are considered "terroristic" than how would Tony describe Russia or Indonesia or China's. After all China invaded Tibet for no good reason. Any idea of the atrocities? I'm sure Tony read the Dalai Lama's autobiography. How come he isn't leading a European campaign to ban China? Selective morality=Hypocrisy of the ugliest kind !
Crank---Hamas intent on Israel's destruction (read their charter), revoked Oslo Accords, got Gaza & launched 6000 missiles. Under what moral pretense does self righteous Tony have the audacity to teach me how to save myself from harm's way? Not easy to hear the rockets from the country side, trust me.
Where is Tony when 4 million Congolese find themselves dead for no reason? Tony should have speared his moral brigades to the rescue of aching half charred Congolese infants. Instead he sips tea with cucumber sandwiches at one of his many mansions preaching shell shocked Israelis morals.
Crank---How come Tony never expressed vehement moral indignation at Nato pilots for indiscriminate bombing of 10,000 Muslim Bosnians to death? After all he is quick to accuse Israel for every crime known to humanity... What gives? Practicing selective morality is far worse than not practicing morality at all. What's good for the goose is good for the gender !
Exactly Crank, don't waste your energy on him mate. He's just another indoctrinated American-Israeli who will never accept anyone else's viewpoint without spouting an absurdly overblown counter-statement that bears no relevance to the original debate. It's a typical reaction- a person such as Benn makes a good point, farm's reaction is to create a smoke-screen of bullshit saying "well if he commented on morality in this case he must therefore do it for every single case in the world ever."
No C0mman, Tony doesn't (and can't) export his morality on all human catastrophe. But he can surely espouse an objective, factually corroborated and non biased indignation to add credibility to his prolific self righteousness. You see Comann, where I come from each coin has 2 sides...
C0mman------Please tell us all where have I "spouted absurdly overblown & irrelevant statements". Accusing me was the easy part. Now substantiate your accusatory stance. Expose my "overblown" self deceit...
Well, using examples such as the Chechens and Congolese, Benn is commenting on the Iraq war because he is a British politician and the topic they are currently discussing directly affects Britain. Hence what I said about that in your eyes he has to comment about all moral issues in the world ever in order to remain credible. For all you know Benn may well have talked about the other issues at other times but just because there aren't videos of it on youtube doesn't mean it didn't happen.
C0mman--British pilots participated in indiscriminate bombing of Bosnians to death in Tony's back yard. If the Palestinian conflict is dear to his British heart than why are 100,000 butchered Chechens slaughtered in his (vast...) back yard escaping his aching British heart? Muslims are Muslims and suffering is color blind. Blame Israel some & the Arabs some or risk selective sympathy & hypocrisy
True morality is immune from political expediency. It can only survive as a fully independent & pure form. Tony claims to possesses a one sided ethical coin. I say that no such coin exists. True ethical purity relies on truth & unrelenting objectivity. Tony fails this test time & again, hence his moral indignation renders his vitriol as hypocritical, self righteous & politically motivated.
Crank--True morality is immune from political opportunism. Chines atrocities in Tibet renders China as evil. Where is the moral indignation? This is not about China as much as it is about selective sympathy and ethical double standards. Pure and simple !
Crank--Ignoring the Chechen holocaust is Moral hypocrisy redefined. Affording obsessive compassion to morally attractive & convenient ports of call while "erasing" much heftier (yet equal) human suffering is cynical & revolting.
Rendering judgment based on a politically expedient prism is equally repugnant. Such prisms produce deceit in its ugliest form.
Crank--I'm an Israeli who support a 2 state solution. I still fight for my existence. Iran vows to nuke me & Hamas intent on my destruction. I gave Gaza & got 6000 rockets in return. I will defend my 2 little daughters despite Tony & his selective moral brigades. What other options do I have? Please advice !
Crank--My opponent broadcasts "Kill the Jews" Mickey Mouse like cartoons. Breeding new generations of religiously indoctrinated & brain washed mongers who are guided to celebrate death in anticipation for 73 spiritually horny virgins. This renders negotiations as obsolete. The "Age of Reason" non existent. How would you resolve my ethical enigma Crank? Please guide me !
Irony is everything Benn said there has come true, the americans did bring down Saddam Hussein, and people who criticise Benn for saying that in some way, we shouldnt get involved, are missing the point, hes simply asking, if we´re getting involved in Iraq, why not get involved in a plethora of other dictatorships, and the simple reason is that, the dictatorships who trade with us, or who fight a "common" enemy are ok, regardless of the terrible conditions they force upon their citizens
islam is pure evil and the west is rapidly seeing it for what it is and muslims know it. the tide is turning against islam and now the battle is joined. the freedom enjoyed in the west opposed to the oppresion fostered in the east. for the sake of mankind islam has to die and soon
what a sincere human being - giving up his English 'Title' to live a life of Truth! - here was an aristocrat with wealth and fortune who gave it all - an example to us all
stevenslava 2 weeks ago
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Please please go to FB page Bring Back Tony and click 'like' We need this man to lead our peaceful revolution. Africa had Mandela, we need Benn.
minxmenaminx 2 months ago
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minxmenaminx 2 months ago
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minxmenaminx 2 months ago
2:59
JaguarEarlobe 3 months ago
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JaguarEarlobe 3 months ago
There's a huge similarity between Wedgewood-Ben and Congressman Dr Ron Paul..
Shame they aren't 50 years younger as they would have made a great keystone of a new political party.
pianoplayeruk 4 months ago
@pianoplayeruk I disagree, just because Ron Paul is anti war and supports some Libertarian views (which i think is good) lets not confuse Paul's love of Free Market Capitalism with full control without being accountable to the masses and he's insane believe of life at conception, which is dangerous. Benn supported the working class struggle against Capitalism!
MrLovethelife 3 months ago
@MrLovethelife
Basically your response, apart from being wrong is also trash and I don't have the energy, will power or interest to counter it and on that note we should agree to disagree
pianoplayeruk 3 months ago
@pianoplayeruk Ok fair, I'm not trying to trash Paul but i do make the point the similarities to Benn are so minute!
It would be nice if there was at least one working class candidate
MrLovethelife 3 months ago
@MrLovethelife
Look, whatever their backgrounds matters not. Both men have more to offer in their little fingers than every other politician in the US and the UK combined. To that end, they are two of a kind, and sadly two of a kind too in the age department.
Mr Ben, well he's getting very old, but he leaves a legacy which will be remembered for a long time.
And Ron Paul - well he's running for the job of president at the age of 76 which kind says it all.
Long live them both!
pianoplayeruk 3 months ago
@pianoplayeruk Yes i agree background doesn't matter too much and even social class background doesn't matter its what your political class politics is based on. Politics for the bankers and millionaire's (capitalists) or for the working people who build up countries through hard work (working class)
I don't know enough about Paul but he seems to be a capitalist? Maybe i have got it wrong but after all he is in a Neo Liberal party.
John Mcdonnell MP now represents Socialism, check him out :)
MrLovethelife 3 months ago
@pianoplayeruk Ron Paul is about as politically opposed to Tony Benn as can be: the one's a neoliberal, the other's a socialist. I quote from Wikipedia, "One scoring method published in the American Journal of Political Science[187] found Paul the most conservative of all 3,320 members of Congress from 1937 to 2002."
jismith1989 2 months ago
@jismith1989
They share foreign policy. When it comes to economic policy they are polar opposites, but the countries are different so it's a poor comparison.
The US federal government has shown how woefully inadequate it is at micro-managing all 50 states and how it now thinks it can do as it pleases bypassing congress entirely while the country is running up the wall with debt. While I understand in the UK people aren't quite so hot on their govt either, apples & oranges really
InnuendoXP 4 weeks ago
What insight Benn had and a well spoken and up to date information. He could not have been more right and just in his looking forward in time to tell of the disaster all this would bring. Way ahead of his time in thinking into the future.
rolgib 5 months ago
look how the politicians just don't give a shit. It's amazing he is discussing a possible war and half the house are asleep! They don't care they are just there for their own interests.
olddouchebag 7 months ago
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FatBearMan 7 months ago
Now here is a politician whose synapses fire correctly.
LordofBarons 7 months ago
6:15 (about) voice...."yea-you go out there and die then!" LOL
Fizzypop1211 7 months ago
Haig looks completely uninterested lol
arranle 8 months ago
@arranle Which one's Haig?
MegaLotusEater 5 months ago
if only he had been prime minister... Oh why! Why can't we find a man or woman like this as our prime minister! It's infuriating in a country of such decent people that we are governed by these members of parliament; untrustworthy, spend happy, destructive of public services and with each moment a layer of our souls is lost to the blender of Westminster until we turn to our friends echoing the idea that living somewhere else in the world would be a good notion to notch in our futures.
Talixir 8 months ago
Say what you want about the iraq war in 2003, but at the end of the day Saddam Hussain had invaded a nation for no reason other than imperialism, and threatened the most important thing in the world which all nations depend upon - oil. If there is anything worth fighting for, it is oil, especially when iraq, kuwait and saudi contain 3/4 of the worlds oil... ur niave if your gonna put a few thousands soldiers lives above that, since the knock consequences of no oil would be worse!
easyable 8 months ago
@easyable I think Saddam set fire to those oil fields as a direct response to allied intervention, so we not only lost lives, but the oil as well... Don't get me wrong, Saddam Hussein was a complete tool, but he was backed by (and allegedly armed by) America..In the Eighties, he was seen by America as a stabilising force in the region... He was keeping terrorists out of Iraq (by killing them), and stopping Kurds (who have since incurred themselves into Turkey more than once).
benspruce 8 months ago
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@easyable I suggest you listen to that video again. It seems you missed quite a few of the facts.
olddouchebag 7 months ago
The first gulf war was far different than current Iraq war. And what did Benn say to the Kuwaitis who were being murdered by Saddam? The UN never could have saved them.
jimmbo13 10 months ago
@jimmbo13 Kuwait was and is nothing more than a US vassal state like Saudi Arabia. The US supported Iraqi attacks against Iran paid by Kuwaiti oil profits. It's all part of American foreign policy and has proved divisive in the Arab world. The UN could have saved them if it banned arms trading and the like then America never would have tried to influence either of the countries.
chcikenpencil 7 months ago
In his opening sentence here, did he say Iran or Iraq? All I heard was his "Iraa" - In either case, it is earie just how acurate his predictions: "I fear that the United States has already decided that when it is ready, it will create a pretext for a war against Iraa" and "I am opposed to actions outside the United Nations, I believe it would divide the security council."
Tell me again that we didn't have all the correct information before invading Iraq!!!
rampantscotsman 11 months ago
And look...he was right.
bringingking 11 months ago
Some dumbass was saying "you go anf fight, then" Dumbass didn't realise that Sir Tony Benn was arguing against war.
mynameis677 1 year ago
@mynameis677 yeah, it was some war-mongerer of the Conservative Party
leizuoer 10 months ago
@mynameis677 They also didn't realise that Benn and his family fought incredibly bravely during the second world war. His brother was killed by the Germans.
smezec 9 months ago
superb speaker
TheLuigi69 1 year ago
he hits the nail right on the head about the USA
vidscroungerxD 1 year ago 2
What a great man, I wish we had a politician like him in our country. Holding his seat for 51years proves how much respect and admiration he had from people in his electorate (not sure what they call it in the U.K, constituency???). Definitely a man of great forsight.
htownstizzow 1 year ago 3
The reason this great man never got elected to prime minister, was because a) He was a decent human being b) He was highly intelligent c) He cared about what the people wanted d) He knew his history and e) He told the truth
itsabomberscope 1 year ago 20
Benn speaks with great passion and sincerity, which many politicians today lack!
But honestly, how does he think that Iraq would put up any serious fight!? Iraq got mopped up in 1991, got run over in 2003, they couldn't hold the collective jock of the Western powers in a war!
pimpmasterdac 1 year ago
wake up america why does this guy in brittain see whats happening so far aahead while we pretend its not when happening right now...
arlichar11 1 year ago
And the idiot who said, you go out and die then.. bet he never fought a battle in his life.. tony benn fought in the spitfire during ww2.. so what ignorance to shout at this true honourable man who speakin truth with such rubbish !
fzaone77 1 year ago
@fzaone77 But that's the voice of a Labour MP shouting at a Tory. You can hear the same voice supporting Benn a little earlier (2:28).
cvb777 1 year ago
if hes really an "idiot" then how comes half the things hes spoken about come real
twinsofsparda 1 year ago
i hate politicians in general, but tony benn is probably about as honest and decent as they get
ChairmanBlimp 1 year ago 2
Tony Benn should've been our PM. He tells the truth that the media do not!
piran75 1 year ago
Tony Benn is missed opportunity because of the greed of the World today.
benisajamin 1 year ago
What a missed opportunity that man is and was. The greatest leader Britain never had because of nonsense.
MrHarrylime79 1 year ago
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"i think the sanctions can be effective"
Yeh, effective in killing over 1 million people, over half of which were children under the age of 5!.
HuxleyWasRight 1 year ago
he puts too much faith in the un.... they allowed a genocide to happen in rwanda because of its diplomacy efforts they had the power to stop it and they didnt.
johnnyd101 1 year ago
Nothing he said turned out to be true. He said it would divide the security council, it did not they united in authorising force which in this video he also said wouldn't happen. He said that sanctions would be effective and we know they were not.
His opposition to the 2003 Iraq war he said it would be illegal because there was no UN approval. Well there was no UN approval for the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait in 1990 which this is in response to. The only person with a double standard here is him.
bobsilby 1 year ago
@bobsilby ... shut up and go home ... every thing he says here came true ... you half wit bigot ...
Critic224 1 year ago 2
Years ahead of his time. So people what do we do when he is gone?
MrLuvlyJubly 1 year ago
@MrLuvlyJubly Pick up the red flag and carry it onward. Which I'm sure is what he would want.
I don't share most of Mr. Benn's politics, but by God he can put together a compelling argument. I had the honour, and it was an honour, of hearing Mr. benn speak at Glastonbury this year and he is still, at the age of 85, speaking with more passion about what he believes in than most of our current politicians ever have.
The world needs more Socialists, real Socialists, like Tony Benn.
pgl0897 1 year ago 2
@pgl0897 Well can I carry the red flag with you? Shall we carry?
MrLuvlyJubly 1 year ago
@MrLuvlyJubly After you, Comrade :o)
pgl0897 1 year ago
6:16 "yeah yeah, you go out there and die then" LEGEND
SovietGuy101 1 year ago
THIS GUY IS THE DOGS BOLLOCKS, WHAT A LEGEND
niknakpower 1 year ago 2
GREAT MAN !! What he said is absolutely correct !!!!
biryanikebab 1 year ago 3
5min 55 someone says "he's an idiot". Is he talking about Tony Benn ? Nothing idiotic about what he was saying from where I'm sitting
lionkillingnebbish 1 year ago 9
if only we had more leaders like Tony Benn the world would be a better place.
all the best
shahsheik 1 year ago
the last human being, on the attack,very honest man.
babyfacemonk1968 1 year ago
They dont like the truth. and Tony Benn was telling it!
Richie979 1 year ago
Fuck me, when Tony Benn speaks, I get a semi.
This man is a legend.
randomjrr1422 1 year ago 3
"it might not unite the arab world, but might bring many arab countries together against us". It amazes me how spot on this mans predictions and amazes me more still that they we never heeded.
elkrobber 1 year ago
Fuck Tony Blair and all those who bend over and take it from the establishment.
musarman 1 year ago
This man was right about a lot of things ,An honest and true statesman---too bad we don't have very many like him in this country -run by crass politicians,out for their own political gain !
Charles61218 1 year ago
What a great man
Nimairoony 1 year ago
He wasn't half right
televisewhatyouwant 1 year ago
A good example to the people, unlike the Zionist Neo-con bastards who rule this country!
Truegeeza 1 year ago
I Love Tony Ben, a real Politician
theworldofjon 1 year ago 4
holy crap.... this guy knew back then...that usa was out of control and had plans for middl east!
arlichar11 1 year ago 2
How right he was and all he said here has come true. Totally agree that we need more polticians like this and they need to be calling the shots so we can live in a fair and just society, where people are respected and valued.
sinwow33 1 year ago 2
Benns integrity and honest conviction stands him head and shoulders above the likes of the current batch of politicians
tys1818 1 year ago 2
Britain today: Labour's lax morality has helped standards crash through the floor. Just look around you.
But people are truly waking up, not with just a little help from the Web.
Click my username or paste title into bar: THINGS CAN ONLY GET LABOUR - WHY THE 'PC' QUISLINGS WILL LOSE THE NEXT ELECTION (SPEECH)
TheDustpile 1 year ago
wow, all this came true.
the dude is either really smart or a fortune teller.
ilovetopickmynose 1 year ago
@ilovetopickmynose - hes very smart. hes the man
Porterjoh 1 year ago
Saddam must have had a good reason to attack Kuwait,, =) maybe bcz Bush Sr. was drilling Iraq oil from Kuwait side...too bad Saddam fell into Bush Sr. Trap..
What other traps have been set..maybe there's one right outside your door...=)
pifou111 1 year ago
Political boner activated
TheMrNamefag 1 year ago
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The mans brain is in cuckoo land, hes like george galloway. nobody wants socialism any more.
semieden 1 year ago
Brilliant stuff by Tony Benn.
To think that the Sun and the right-wing press dubbed this man as part of the 'loony left'.
It shows that if you are compassionate and honourable in this country you get derided by press barons like Murdoch and the Barclay brothers.
mofi500 1 year ago 5
This has been flagged as spam show
Check out ( JOHN MCCULLAGH "ILL DANCE ON YOUR GRAVE MRS THATCHER"........on youtube or myspace,well worth a listen!
LARRSON77 2 years ago
The reason why people like him will never become presidents or PM even though People are behind them is because there is no democracy! We never chose our leaders, we were presented with 2 prearranged choices who work for the same fascist and we had a choice to choose between those 2 evils..
SerbianAdonis 2 years ago 5
Did we choose Tony Benn? No..he was selected by his local party, and presented as one option, and the Tories in the area did the same? I do agree with you though...we do not live in a Democracy!
LairdKincavle 2 years ago
Dictatorship of the bourgoisie. Benn was merely the left wing of capital anyway.
ButherLi55ett 1 year ago
20 years ago!! . change the names , he could have said it yesterday and it's the same....
150tries 2 years ago 17
@150tries I totally agree with you!
Summerbkh 2 years ago
i like this dude
sgnx 2 years ago 8
What a corageous, honest, honourable and dignified man. If only there were more just and intelligent people in the world- it wouldn't be such a sick place.
Summerbkh 2 years ago 8
tont never had ant intention of becoming PM .He despised power and he despised those that sought power.Tony was for the people and the structure that put people in controlDEMOCRACY.
eatmypies 2 years ago 4
Why was this man not PM? I would vote for him in a heart beat! Now we are left with incompetence and 2 main parties who are pretty much the same. At least you knew what you were voting for back then. Such a shame! Im going to be incredibly sad when this man passes away into history.
TheChadley1000 2 years ago 6
Wouldn't it be nice to have a man like this for president in America? Instead we have had a peace of shit with no brains '
But we can't can't blaim bush for all the evil he did
It's America ' the country that forced black people in savory for 300 years ! Yet it calls itself a Christian nation '
I guess that's what Christians do !
It's the reason why I took a shit on the bible '
I took my bible in the bath room and took a steaming shit on it ! My wife didn't like it ' but hey shit happeneds !
Autobodyrepairman 2 years ago
What the hell, God and the Bible isn't the problem its the satanic elitist establishment.
ladylusciouz 2 years ago
Admittedly it was the English who kept black slavery going for 300 years but i do agree with you...
Having Tony Benn as President / PM would be a sight for sore eyes ;)
Zidane234 2 years ago 4
tony benn...old labour the last of his kind, a man of passion who tells the truth, the last decent british politician (galloway is too much of a nut for me). hes a guy who cared and cares about the have nots. bless you mr benn
BSFBOPE 2 years ago 7
what a man!
u never hear this kind of passionj, eloquence and honesty from anyone in British politics currently. Where was this sort of opposition to the 2003 war? People resigned, but i never heard this kind of damning argument from anybody.
I am in awe of this, whether you agree with him or not, there is no denying that he has put his point across in such a way that if you agree with him, you feel the need to stand up an do something about it! we have lost this impulse in modern society.
matjonesey 2 years ago 6
B1gBassa, are you American?
What is it that you find agreeable about the House of Commons?
TheFugazi39 2 years ago
Tony Benn is brilliant and I agree with him on the current war in iraq. But here he was wrong and completly out of order. Iraq had invaded another sovereign nation and her soldiers were running through kuwait like animals. The war was supported by syria, saudi arabia and the gulf states. Its very easy for tony benn to stand up and say what he did and then retire to his rather large cosey house afterwards.
scottype689 2 years ago
The fact Iraq's neighbours dictators supported the war doesn't make it legitimate; there was a peaceful withdrawal possibility. Eventually Saddam withdrew but Bush sr. wouldn't have it so as the Iraqi troops withdrew up the highways out of Kuwait the famous 'turkey shoot' occurred. Gulf War 1 was a war of aggression straight out.
Redcarpet01 1 year ago
How was it a war of aggression?
DorianGrayism 1 year ago
Because Saddam did withdraw from Kuwait. But Bush sr. wanted a war so he claimed Saddam was planning to attack Saudi Arabia, citing satellite imagery. Which didn't show any new movements along the Iraqi-Saudi border. So he ordered the attack anyway, US forces ambushed Iraqis moving north to Baghdad INSIDE Iraq. That's the famous 'turkey shoot'. Gulf War 1 was unnecessary as Saddam withdrew eventually.
Redcarpet01 1 year ago
Tony Benn... they still make ppl like ya ... God bless ya for stating the truth. Many few poodles like blair didnt have the testicular fortitude to call spades a spade.
sneakycobra 2 years ago 8
Those who don't know history, are doomed to repeat it
leydenjohn 2 years ago 3
Who the hell shouted out "You get out there and die, then!"
Christ, politicians really are children. If only more of them had the same apparent clarity that Tony Benn has.
tartantarget 2 years ago 9
I think it was another Labour MP, as it was the same voice that was saying 'hear hear' earlier. I imagine he said it in response to Conservative MPs disagreeing with Benn's speech.
NathanZackery 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Tony Benn = Vile Hypocritical Man
..
Soloman1001 2 years ago
Sigh
StrayGator 2 years ago
God Bless Tony Benn!!!!!
Photoplayme 2 years ago 8
Whether you agree with him or not, one thing is absolutely indisputable: British parliament is fucking badass.
lurdanhelhart 2 years ago 8
indeed,this is what america lacks
B1gBassa 2 years ago
You've got Dennis Kusinich and Ron paul, so not too bad.
Redcarpet01 1 year ago
this was taken on my birthday!! September 6, 1990!! Go Tony Benn!!
animeeclipse 2 years ago
How can people call him an idiot when he says:
"It is not the hardware of military weapons that fightens me, it is the hatred that makes people want to use them. THAT is the fuel of war"
Possibly an immortal line Tony spoke right then. What a gloriously wise human being.
rabmcnab1 2 years ago 5
Long live this english man,... I respect him as a human being,...
HEAR!! HEAR!!
sushi81 2 years ago 65
when was this?
evenflow771 2 years ago
1990.
empire161 2 years ago
1990 it was filmed
SILKWORM777 2 years ago
Oh the irony! Why is it that idiots run the show and the voice of reason falls on deaf ears? May you live to a ripe old age, Tony Benn, you magnificent bastard! I
GaiaAdvocate 2 years ago 6
"I fear that the United States has already decided, when it is ready, that it will create a pretext for the invasion of Iraq"
If Bush had got four more years in 1992, it might have happened a lot earlier.
StrayGator 2 years ago 4
Look at the state of that Parliament there. No one gives a shit what he says. A tragic thing that Benn's words were unheeded.
johnnycon 2 years ago 15
If all politicians were as honest and transparent as Tony Benn, this would be a much better place. 1950 to now, this chap has set a very good example.
mcs1hr 2 years ago 63
Hear hear!
27062074 2 years ago 5
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Probably the biggest windbag, more so than Kinnock and thats saying something.
fantablum 2 years ago
The hard truth can be hard to hear
StrayGator 2 years ago 9
tony benn is a FABULOUS speaker
2NDCUMMING 2 years ago 6
my God. cant believe this is new to me.#
GroundskeeperRonnie 2 years ago 3
"Well you go out there and die then!" 6:16
Good to see the side opposite presenting thoughtful and mature counterpoint to WW2-veteran Tony Benn...dear dear.
27062074 2 years ago 9
Here here what kind of mature response was that???
That's the kind of morons that still run our government
psweep 2 years ago 5
A little ironic, isn't it?
Freshmanwave 2 years ago 2
But surely that was a Labour MP shouting at some Tory?
cvb777 2 years ago
"Well you go out there and then then!" What does that mean? I don't understand. don't put me down
solidysnake1 2 years ago
It's "well you go out there and die then", a rather infantile MP (probably Tory, but let's not make assumptions) goading Tony Benn. And I have no intention of putting you down for mishearing something, I do it enough myself to know better :)
27062074 2 years ago
I don't get how he is goading Benn? Sorry..
solidysnake1 2 years ago
He is implying that Mr Benn doesn't know what war is like, and that going to war (and dying, put crudely) may change his opinion. Unnecessary, since Tony is a WW2 veteran. Any clearer?
27062074 2 years ago 6
A rather implausible explanation.
cvb777 2 years ago
I believe we can hear the same voice agreeing with Benn at 2:28 so it can't be a Tory.
cvb777 2 years ago
foresight
ch1ral 2 years ago 6
You see Crank, Europe is inundated with a colossal guilt complex. Colonialism, 2 world wars & the most horrific genocide in human history (to name a few). The moral burden is so intense & blinding that Europe refuses to acknowledge Muslims killing Muslims as a crime against humanity(apart from a belated Sudanese indictment). Preaching to others is always easier than a well overdue hardcore & honest introspection...
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
Im not sure I have heard such a magnificent pre and post analysis of the outcomes of the Iraq war and its implications ever... and everything he said came to past... everything!!!.. and did you hear how he was heckled and laughed at and ridiculed by other members of parliament.. as if they knew better than he. that heckling is the typical voice of a racist uncaring self effacing Britain
What a Legend
Raybanmonster 2 years ago 2
Hey Tony, what are the Lottery Numbers for the Euro Millions this week?
densaner77 2 years ago
Thats right. America made Saddam do it. Sure.
OrthodoxSteel 2 years ago
Amazing speech. 18 years on and everything went exactly how he said. Its as if he could see the future.
bigglego 2 years ago
I've just watched this clip for a second time, superb. Is this not what we want from our elected representatives?? Standing up for the truth and looking out for the weakest and pointing out the hypocrisy of the strong.
alwayswilling1232000 2 years ago 4
"pointing out the hypocrisy of the strong- really? Hypocrisy is ignoring 100,000 Muslim Chechens by Russia, 250,000 East Timoreans by Indonesia etc. Where was self righteous Tony when Europe stood idle to Serb atrocities in the Balkans? Selective sympathy & political expediency anyone?
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
It is so depressing that you don't see this in the house of commons any more. Maybe sometimes from George Galloway but that would be it.
alwayswilling1232000 2 years ago 3
Wow! You'd never see this in the commons now. Everything he said is correct.
newsfarm: your starting to irritate me, ranting on every clip like this.
Noodlehorn 2 years ago
shocking this only has 6,275 views, this is what is wrong with the world, people like tony benn in a world full of liars,corrupt, greedy indivuals and politicans-tony benn is a rarity an HONEST politician!!
pritz29 3 years ago 2
Were was Tony when Russia butchered 100,000 Muslim Chechens in Grozny? or when Europe stood idle while Serbs butchered Muslim Bosnians? Selective Sympathy anyone? Nah...Self righteousness/? Nah... not Tony, no way...
thenewsfarm 3 years ago
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Tony the self righteous king of selective sympathy for political expediency. Where was he when Russia butchered 100,000 Muslim Chechens or when Europe stood idle while Serbs butchered Muslim Bosnians? Hypocrisy? Double moral standards perhaps? Preach what you practice at home first
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
Sod your muslim Chechen terrorists who took over a Russian school and proceeded to kill the children and teachers. thenewsfarm, you play the typical muslim victim; actually, Nato did intervene against the Serbs. And what brought the Yugoslavian civil war about? Bastard Albanian muslims in Kosovo, that's what. Yugoslavia was good enough to let them move into Kosovo from Albania and to cultivate it, but then they were so grateful, they demanded independence! That's muslim graitude for you.
CrankCase08 2 years ago
Crank----Chechen freedom fighters took over a school after Russia killed 100,000 independence seeking Muslim Chechens in Grozny. Russian troops looted, raped and tortured endless innocent victims. Get the facts before launching a baseless tirade. You risk self-embarrassment. Not good...
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
thenewsfarm, I know what Russians can be like (eg. to the German women in WW2), but whether Russia did that or not, you don't take it out on innocent people, especially kids, who won't know anything about it anyway. If the Chechens don't want to be killed they should behave themselves. It's well known the CIA have been involved in stirring them up with the idea of gaining a new ally with which to surround Russia, just as they have done with Georgia.
CrankCase08 2 years ago
Chechens want independence over Chechnya just as the Kurds over Kurdistan. Chechens were willing to compromise. Russia wasn't, raped looted & killed 100,000 Chechen civilians in Grozny alone. No home left standing. No wonder Chechens are angry as hell. Wouldn't you?
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
France decimated the Ivory Coast's air port just a few years ago. What was France doing there in the first place?(oil off course). Isn't that terror? Colonialism any one? Where was Tony when the self righteous world needed a prophet of selective morality the most?
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
Crank--I'm not a Muslim. I'm an Israeli. No fondness for terrorists any time soon. Trust me. Simply demand Europe to quit preaching morals to Israel which she doesn't practice at home. No more double standards, that's all....
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
thenewsfarm, Tony Benn does not, and never has spoken on behalf of European governments. He's usually in opposition to British government policy, whether Labour or Tory, and he has consistently criticised Israel for being the USA's agent of terror in the Middle East.. For that reason, he can not be accused of double standards.
CrankCase08 2 years ago
If Israel's actions are considered "terroristic" than how would Tony describe Russia or Indonesia or China's. After all China invaded Tibet for no good reason. Any idea of the atrocities? I'm sure Tony read the Dalai Lama's autobiography. How come he isn't leading a European campaign to ban China? Selective morality=Hypocrisy of the ugliest kind !
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
Crank---Hamas intent on Israel's destruction (read their charter), revoked Oslo Accords, got Gaza & launched 6000 missiles. Under what moral pretense does self righteous Tony have the audacity to teach me how to save myself from harm's way? Not easy to hear the rockets from the country side, trust me.
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
Where is Tony when 4 million Congolese find themselves dead for no reason? Tony should have speared his moral brigades to the rescue of aching half charred Congolese infants. Instead he sips tea with cucumber sandwiches at one of his many mansions preaching shell shocked Israelis morals.
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
Crank---How come Tony never expressed vehement moral indignation at Nato pilots for indiscriminate bombing of 10,000 Muslim Bosnians to death? After all he is quick to accuse Israel for every crime known to humanity... What gives? Practicing selective morality is far worse than not practicing morality at all. What's good for the goose is good for the gender !
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
thenewsfarm I'm not falling into this trap. First it was one isue, then you split it into two, now you've made six. Forget it.
CrankCase08 2 years ago
Exactly Crank, don't waste your energy on him mate. He's just another indoctrinated American-Israeli who will never accept anyone else's viewpoint without spouting an absurdly overblown counter-statement that bears no relevance to the original debate. It's a typical reaction- a person such as Benn makes a good point, farm's reaction is to create a smoke-screen of bullshit saying "well if he commented on morality in this case he must therefore do it for every single case in the world ever."
C0mmand02 2 years ago
No C0mman, Tony doesn't (and can't) export his morality on all human catastrophe. But he can surely espouse an objective, factually corroborated and non biased indignation to add credibility to his prolific self righteousness. You see Comann, where I come from each coin has 2 sides...
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
C0mman------Please tell us all where have I "spouted absurdly overblown & irrelevant statements". Accusing me was the easy part. Now substantiate your accusatory stance. Expose my "overblown" self deceit...
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
Well, using examples such as the Chechens and Congolese, Benn is commenting on the Iraq war because he is a British politician and the topic they are currently discussing directly affects Britain. Hence what I said about that in your eyes he has to comment about all moral issues in the world ever in order to remain credible. For all you know Benn may well have talked about the other issues at other times but just because there aren't videos of it on youtube doesn't mean it didn't happen.
C0mmand02 2 years ago
C0mman--British pilots participated in indiscriminate bombing of Bosnians to death in Tony's back yard. If the Palestinian conflict is dear to his British heart than why are 100,000 butchered Chechens slaughtered in his (vast...) back yard escaping his aching British heart? Muslims are Muslims and suffering is color blind. Blame Israel some & the Arabs some or risk selective sympathy & hypocrisy
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
C0mman----Kindly afford proof that Tony demanded fellow European Vladimir Putin to be prosecuted for crimes against humanity and war crimes
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
Crank---One issue & one only: Hypocrisy.
True morality is immune from political expediency. It can only survive as a fully independent & pure form. Tony claims to possesses a one sided ethical coin. I say that no such coin exists. True ethical purity relies on truth & unrelenting objectivity. Tony fails this test time & again, hence his moral indignation renders his vitriol as hypocritical, self righteous & politically motivated.
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
Crank--True morality is immune from political opportunism. Chines atrocities in Tibet renders China as evil. Where is the moral indignation? This is not about China as much as it is about selective sympathy and ethical double standards. Pure and simple !
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
Crank--Ignoring the Chechen holocaust is Moral hypocrisy redefined. Affording obsessive compassion to morally attractive & convenient ports of call while "erasing" much heftier (yet equal) human suffering is cynical & revolting.
Rendering judgment based on a politically expedient prism is equally repugnant. Such prisms produce deceit in its ugliest form.
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
Crank--I'm an Israeli who support a 2 state solution. I still fight for my existence. Iran vows to nuke me & Hamas intent on my destruction. I gave Gaza & got 6000 rockets in return. I will defend my 2 little daughters despite Tony & his selective moral brigades. What other options do I have? Please advice !
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
Crank--My opponent broadcasts "Kill the Jews" Mickey Mouse like cartoons. Breeding new generations of religiously indoctrinated & brain washed mongers who are guided to celebrate death in anticipation for 73 spiritually horny virgins. This renders negotiations as obsolete. The "Age of Reason" non existent. How would you resolve my ethical enigma Crank? Please guide me !
thenewsfarm 2 years ago
Benn was right.
itsabomberscope 3 years ago
Irony is everything Benn said there has come true, the americans did bring down Saddam Hussein, and people who criticise Benn for saying that in some way, we shouldnt get involved, are missing the point, hes simply asking, if we´re getting involved in Iraq, why not get involved in a plethora of other dictatorships, and the simple reason is that, the dictatorships who trade with us, or who fight a "common" enemy are ok, regardless of the terrible conditions they force upon their citizens
hypergreg 3 years ago 6
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islam is pure evil and the west is rapidly seeing it for what it is and muslims know it. the tide is turning against islam and now the battle is joined. the freedom enjoyed in the west opposed to the oppresion fostered in the east. for the sake of mankind islam has to die and soon
fuelairburst 3 years ago
Don't mention Galloway in the same breath as Benn. Galloway is an opportunist, an egoist and a bully.
Benn spoke the truth.
billydeeuk 3 years ago 6
HERE HERE billydee
leanfist 3 years ago