Dawkins has claimed, “As for religion … nobody wields a sharper bayonet than Sam Harris.” Harris debated Craig on 7th April. In his opening statement in that debate, Harris declared that Dr Craig is “the one Christian apologist who seems to have put the fear of God into many of my fellow atheists.” After that debate, the atheist website Debunking Christianity reported: “Bill (Craig) has once again showed himself as the best debater of this generation.” ROFL
The most shocking evidence of the effects Darwinian philosophy were laid out in plain English by the men who preach it... it wasn't some facts or figures that could be manipulated. Evolution, and the Darwinian Theory are not identical in Nature. Complete belief in randomness DOES do away with God, meaning, purpose, and ethics. And I suppose that is why the community at large has no problem commiting the systematic war acts it has on the freedom of inquiry.
The most shocking evidence of the effects Darwinian philosophy were laid out in plain English by the men who preach it... it wasn't some facts or figures that could be manipulated. Evolution, and the Darwinian Theory are not identical in Nature. Complete belief in randomness DOES do away with God, meaning, purpose, and ethics. And I suppose that is why the community at large has no problem commiting the systematic war acts it has on the freedom of inquiry.
This review was pathetic. You are twisting the whole point and message of the film. It was NEVER about TEACHING Intelligent Design in the class room, it was about freedom of inquiry. To at least be able to talk about it, mention it, discuss it without fear of losing your job, being black listed, and attacked systematically by the overarching power structure in the education system.
@yourboydano2 give a single reason, why ID should be even talked about. A claim, that has never conveyed a single research or produced any evidence, should not only be avoided in an intellectual discussion, but ridiculed and attacked on a regular basis. Why? Because ID is a religious claim with no basis in reality. If you want to adhere to nonsense, be my guest, but dont expect any respect from others if you do!
I am sorry, but I strongly disagree with you view of the movie. I also am a Christian, and the movie is exactly what you said it isn't. The reason the movie was made because scientists were getting black listed because their studies in science led them to a belief in intelligent design or God. The movie was made to combat philosphers posing as scientists.
Wow, a theist who doesn't piss me off. I wonder if you were just so indoctrinated from birth that you can't see the absurdity of having a god. Because you are smart. I wonder how smart people end up believing in religions. This is not a personal attack, merely an observation. This video was informative, and I agree, even If i was religious, i would think to myself "this film is not a force of good for us." As it stands now, the movie seems to have pissed off atheists as well as theists.
'....that Intelligent Design should be taught in the science classroom...it's making the claim that this theory is science" (chrispalasz)
I don't think the movie supports that notion at all. The movie focuses on academic freedom - and the freedom for scientists to hold a worldview that may be contrary to the prevailing ethos of other scientists (Darwinian evolutionary theory). When the scientists dared to honestly question evolution - they were either smeared or lost their jobs.
First of all Expelled is shown from the point of view of Intelligent Design, I have seen it and in no way does it claim to support the Christian world view. Ben Stein is a Jew, not a Christian. There are many arguments in this movie that are valid and made by very intelligent people. I have watched this whole video and I see no valid reason why anyone should not watch it. If you know why you believe what you believe, you cannot be swayed by any falsehoods.
@thkaal1 Yes, should've typed "thermodynamics", but was thinking "law of entropy." The primary definition is very technical, but the secondary and more relevant (here), broader jist of it in layman's terms is the breakdown of matter and energy in the universe to an ultimate state of inert uniformity, or better yet a process from order to disorder. So basically, nature doesn't, in and of itself, "build complexity" - it does the opposite.
I'm pleasantly surprised by this video to be honest, not what I was expecting
"Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed" is a film everyone should be embarrassed by, no matter their beliefs. Ignoring the subject matter aside, it is underhanded, it misrepresents and it outright lies.
And... did you watch the video? Because I'm not sure where the confusion is. I believe that encouraging Christians who are ignorant or enraged to abandon fruitless battles and approach holiness in a more loving and honest way - with an open mind - is well glorifying to God.
@chrispalaszainst Yes i understand your point and i agree with it, but sir those who are not against you are for you. You are exposing other christians in this process, and are perhaps potentially discrediting their future projects and future arguments for belief in an intelligent design. Their postulations are a little far fetched yet they are right about their beliefs. No one will ever be able to destroy science its backed by its own laws The film was made using science to back it's theory.
@chrispalasz Yes i understand your point and i agree with it, but sir those who are not against you are for you. You are exposing other christians in this process, and are perhaps potentially discrediting their future projects and future arguments for belief in an intelligent design. Their postulations are a little far fetched yet they are right about their beliefs. No one will ever be able to destroy science its backed by its own laws The film was made using science to back it's theory
You know that whole video is made with voice overs and cut offs. And Ben Stiens producers snuck in a doc. about the topic he talked about with the scientist right? Its OK to be a christian, but PLEASE don't relate to that video at all. It makes creationist look awful and deceitful.
You just described every evolutionist I've ever heard speak in the first 70 seconds.
Why do you lie and claim you're a Christian? Why do you claim the lies of evolutionists is science? You know what science is, so why do you lie and claim evolution is science? You're just a liar like all the evolutionists.
??? I'm lying because... you say I am? This statement: "Evolution is a scientific theory" is a proven one. If you don't want to accept cold hard facts, that's you're problem. But calling me a liar with nothing to back that up is just childish slander.
@chrispalasz How stupid. You're lying because that's what liars DO. If you've got enough sense to make and post a video, then you have enough sense to know what science is and therefore you know that evolution has not one shred of science to it and even if it were true (which is completely ludicrous) it couldn't be scientifically demonstrated. Now, playing me for a fool only makes you look like one.
Slander? Look up the definition of "science" and feel the red in your face.
@chrispalasz John 1:1-4 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.He was with God in the beginning.Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. In Geneis1 you keep hearing;God SAID..let there be light, God SAID.. If Jesus was the Word and He was with God in the beginning then John 1 backs up Gen.1. The father SPOKE and the Son CREATED.
You say that "evolution has not one shred of science to it" and that it cannot be "scientifically demonstrated". Those are two claims which you have given zero support for - because they are unsupportable.
You then tell me to go look up the definition of science when, if there were any substance or credibility to what you are saying, you could have just provided a definition right here for everyone to see - and exposed me. However, you cannot do that, either.
@911dispatcher Stay strong and don't let those who pretend to be Christians tear you down. I pray that the Lord keep you strong and that no one turn you against Him. And remember that its not a war against the flesh but one which we fight with the unseen
@911dispatcher Stay strong and don't let those who pose to be Christians tear you down. I pray that the Lord keep you strong and that no one turn you against Him. And remember that its not a war against the flesh but one that we fight with the unseen
@911dispatcher Stay strong and don't let those who pretend to be Christians tear you down. I pray that the Lord keep you strong and that no one turn you against Him. And remember that its not a war against the flesh but one which we fight with the unseen
@lynna0527 Thanks! I hate lies and it's appalling to watch someone so blatantly lie and I speak up to protect the simple and the naive and the uneducated from the deceit of the enemy perpetrated through liars and deceivers.
BTW, you can go to the 'down' arrow besides "Reply" and delete the accidental duplicates.
Evolution is completely irreconcilable with the christiany of the Bible.If I mention the theology behind this statement, you will only smirk at it because its theology.As you rightly said,evolution is concerned with a small part of the natural sciences.Despite this evolution is a subject of profound moral and ethical consequence- it lets us think of humans as some sort of accident of creation,and this lends itself to the idea that we purely socioeconomic entities. which btw is an old Nazi trick
@fashklash Actually it isn't because of you accept that Noah's flood occured (I assume you do as you are a literalist) then you have to accept that superevolution must have occured subsequently in order for all of the species to have developed from the 'kinds' that existed Ark in just 4000 years. Such is the foolery of creation 'science'.
@ignatz1106 There are only 30000 species of birds, reptiles and mammals alive today. Invertebrates, a few reptiles and water-dwelling mammals etc account for the rest of the organisms on earth, all of which could have survived during the flood.If there were 15000 antecedent species on the ark, it stands to reason that those could have given rise to further 15000 subspecies. There is a myriad of examples: Look at the canid and felis families, the ability of grizzlies and polar bears to mate etc
@ignatz1106 or the rapid speciation we observe in birds and reptiles like the Ensatina salamanders.We really haven't arrived on a decisive definition of species,but if inability to interbreed is one criterion,then those salamanders are a pime example of how"speciation"can happen rapidly.And I find all of this far,far more likely than the notion that all complex specified genetic information somehow came into existence through NS and Random mutation.many good mathemticians are completely baffled
@chrispalasz Get off the wall and decide if you're an atheist or a christian. The present universal definition of science is governed by atheistic doctrine. So PLEASE decide what the hell you are.
@ignatz1106 If chrispalasz wants to believe in the atheist model of science, then he should just go for it and be an atheist. And what's the "Rhynemaiden" thread? Is it supposed to be famous or something? Am I supposed to jump back in awe-stricken amazement on hearing its name? Oh,so if don't pay any heed to it, I don't have the necessary guts.. talk about bigotry. Who are you? Someone I should know about? Einstein's grandson or something? ( all due respect to Einstein of course)
@fashklash There is no "atheist" model of science - science does not take a position on whether or not there is or is not a God. There is also, it may surprise you to learn, no Christian concensus on literal truth in the Bible - many accept that the oldest Genesis stories where based on myths rather than literal truth, albeit with a strong moral component. The current obsession among some fundamentalists for literal truth is bourne out of their obsession for dogma rather than principles.
@fashklash Additionally may I jog your memory about that thread it was "Creation Science" 101: Hydroplate "Theory". Maybe you cancelled the memory of the time that your butt got handed to you on a plate (and not just by me).
@ignatz1106 Yes, science has to be athiestic. Anything else is considered religious, because it leaves open the possibility of a designer, and a designer is automatically considered religious, and instead of regarding it as one hypothetical possibility,we throw it out the window.So this is how we end up with a situation where people like judge jones can read 90%of an"Atheist communist lawyers union"letter that says that ID is religious not PC,and therefore not worthy of scientific investigation
@fashklash What nonsense. I don't think you even understand (or want to understand) what science is. The vast majority of scientific investigation has little to do with evolution-it's just that for people like you, the tiny part that does, SEEMS to conflict with your faith - so therefore you see a conflict - means that somehow the rest of the scientific community (the majority of which consists of all different faiths) must be atheistic. ID lost because most of the DI didn't show up in Dover.
@ignatz1106 And you sure do have a big head don't you?suppose I decide to inject some reason into that debate?Unfortunately I do work and I don't have the 1000s of hours necessary to debate the hundreds of atheists who spend their lives perpetually debating about things they strongly feel are too stupid and inane to even adress (where's the logic in that?)The arrogance is almost nauseating. There's plenty of good material on ID. Try reading a book by David Berlinski some time- not even religious
@fashklash " haha. you're the typical atheist bigot. You think I don't know what a geologist is. You probably think that creationists don't believe in sex theory. Poor you. Poor pitiful you. haha!!" That was the level of your "reason" on that thread. And you call me arrogant. Three words for you "pot", "kettle" and "black" - that and Matthew 7:5."
I'm sure someone else has already pointed this out, the scientific method itself proves evolution is a theory. No one observed or has duplicated the origin of the universe or the earth (step 1). It is also not testable (see last sentence.) (step 4) You must have FAITH to believe the universe, the earth, the human body, and all living things constructed from a pool of matter and big bang. 2nd law of entropy - all matter breaks down by natural processes, does not become more complex.
If you can't believe the Bible is completely historically true, you have no right to call yourself a Christian. Without Genesis 1-12, there is no need of Salvation. You are putting the authority of the science of fallen Mankind above the authority of the Bible. Just because some Christian Creationists have attempted to include I.D. in their ideas does not make I.D. a form of Christian apologetics. I.D. makes no claims as to the source of the intelligence.
SETI is based on theoretical research to recognise hallmarks of intellegence. I.D. is attempting to use similar principles on a billionth of the budget. Evolution theory is pseudo-science, false information, frauds and 1/2 truths. You can see it was a deliberate conspiracy from the start, if you investigate its history. Earlier than verifiably dated recorded history, it is impossible to prove anything about the past without making un-provable assumptions.
liberal christians like this guy should burn their bibles and convert to atheism. You can't believe the bible without special creation. Call yourself something else, just don't call yourself christian.
@ReligionIsMisery These are my questions to you sir :) Again I hope this doesn't turn into any bad blood between us, it isn't my intent at all. When I said it isn't objective in the first post, is because we have no bones of Jesus, no proven death date or whatever. Jesus's ministry was a short 3 years, and in an illiterat part of the world. For it to have such humble backgrounds to transition to it's growth today also speaks of a truth not founded totally by history. My thoughts aside.....
@jesuriah Not according to the early Church, people and their beliefs truly went crazy after Jesus Death, read 1st Corinthians 15:3-8. Also I am not sure what you are trying to say with that either.
@LinkMaster1711 "For it to have such humble backgrounds to transition to it's growth today also speaks of a truth not founded totally by history. My thoughts aside....."
That was what my comment was referring to, apologies probably should have cleared that up. Christianity may have started humble, but spread by the sword.
"Not according to the early Church,"
Maybe not, but according to history my statement stands true.
@LinkMaster1711 Nope, you're right, Paul didn't. It was Constantine, my bad! My earlier statement was wrong. Constantine funded and supported the religion, while talking about equality for all.
@jesuriah yeah that we can both agree on... I really wasn't sure about how to deal with the problem of Paul killing for Christ haha. All of that aside, the early Roman Church was Persecuted, Peter died by being burned alive upside down while crucified, yet he still proclaimed the name of Christ even in his death. Paul was locked away in jail and died there writing the letters the Christian Theology now refers to as the bible. Anyway, I wouldn't go around saying Paul killed people lol
@ReligionIsMisery Which may prove that Luke was indeed traveling amongst Paul, because he was accurately writing down the names of cities, goverment elected officials, certain cultural schemes, even to the way the world was working in the areas they traveled, all while including miracles that he recorded while traveling with Paul. Paul being another anomoly, he penned half the New Testament, why would a man like Saul of Tarsus convert at all? He admits he was bad in his own letters.
@ReligionIsMisery The earliest written manuscripts, let me clarify. There is ancient non christian writings of a man named Jesus who died and was seen 3 days later. Moreso, his half brother James (a pillar of the early church in Acts) was in fact a leader of the church at the time, and claimed to have seen the risen Christ himself. You get in the last half of Acts 84 historically proven statements, which scholars can agree, Luke the writer was no simple man in his diligent writings.....
@ReligionIsMisery 2nd question I must ask, is why the conncordance of manuscripts so abundant, they literally make all other ancient works bow before them in sheer amount, and accuracy to the fact that only 1 in every 237 verses will you possibly get a mistranslated word. And the sheer amounts of manuscripts of New Testament manuscrpt are in the proven 1000's and written as early as roughly 20 years after his death
@ReligionIsMisery Well it isn't objective, but if your the jury and you have to point the finger at which side fits the reasoning than I think the conclusion of a man named Jesus that lived 2010 years ago is absolutely provable. I gotta start with the early church of the Romans, why would anyone follow a belief like Christianity to the brink of death via persecution if the very man who walked the earth, that formed the early church, a few weeks/months/years didn't exsist?
Do you understand the difference between natural selection and macro evolution? They are not the same. In order for "goo-to-you" evolution, you must show that information has increased over time. It has not. Dogs stay dogs. And most examples people turn to like the tste fly or some bacteria is simply mutations, which is actually the loss of information. Darwinian evolution is a hoax and effective tool of atheists to try and bury the idea of a creator God.
by the scientific community as a whole. That is the reason that evolution should be taught, and not intelligent design. Intelligent design isn't science because they have absolutely no evidence at all, it's religion masquerading as science, at the minimal it's pseudoscience. Other than that though I enjoyed your video very much, you seem to be a very intelligent individual, and you made a lot of very valid points. well done.
Just because something can not be proven, does not mean it isn't science. There are things that will pretty much always stay in the theory state, for instance the formation of the universe, or the way that gravity works. There are plenty of things that we will never be able to actually prove, but they still remain scientific. However, I think I may have misjudged your statement. Now the fact that Intelligent Design has little to no evidence in its favor, and is not accepted...
Everything that he says about the movie is absolutely false. Go and see the movie for yourself, and see what it is actually about. You will see that this video is not accurate.
What is a REAL threat to science, is when you fire a legitimate scientist for not believing in a supposedly legitimate theory. If Evolution were true, then why are Evolutionists so afraid of having anyone question it?
You also say "This is not a Christian film." Ben Stein is a Jew.
@GreenSlugg Amen! This stuff happens all the time to people who don't agree with Evilution. It isn't proven, it barely makes any sense, and saddest part is it gets praised like the bible as being the best theory out there! I can't buy this crap! My great ancestor wasn't a fish! If anyone wants to prove it was I am all ears, but believing that over saying God did it, I am gonna go with God. And NO FOSSILS. I can prove Jesus walked the earth, but you can't give me any bones for either case!
@GreenSlugg Nobody who accepts evolution is afraid of it being questioned. Scientists test the theory daily. We're tired of people who don't understand it lying about it, then trying to pass off their strawman arguments as science. Cheers.
@jesuriah I am not going to waste my time throwing my pearls to you.
I know plenty of scientists who do not believe in Evolution. The reason that Evolutionists do not want people to see Expelled is because it shows the truth.
@DJSTYLEZ7 The fact is and its true still today you have scientists only believing in evolution speaking on the wildlife channels..Thats what he is getting at..
the movie was about intelligent design and how athiest activist such as dawkins claim to be fact based but go out of their ways into the realm of fairy tales to claim intelligent design does not exist. then proceed to make absolutely no sense and say aliens might have created humans.
@elitesack So you don't think that his statements were taken out of context? I you do I would recommend you watch him on you tube. Where you would quickly see he would never make an of the cuff remark. In contrast I can easily find Stein making completely baseless remarks, but since he is only collecting his paycheck from a select audience... I really don't think he cares is he is way way off the mark.
I recommend reading "I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist" by Norman L Geisler and Frank Turek. It applies logical reasoning toward the premises of Christianity.
I applaud you for making this video. You put it very correctly, Ben Stein's movie is full of psedo science, conspiracy theory, false information and half truths. Human knowledge has become so vast that we need to depend on other people to complete our knowledge. As a layman, who will I depend on for information about evolution? Overwhelming majority of scientific community has a consensus on evolution. Or would you believe people like Ben Stein who has no scientific backing?
The Stein flick is about education. Its about the educational system itself and how it operates etc. And about showing exactly what science means and what it doesn't mean.
Evolution is not objectively true. For instance,you cannot name a single 'scientific' law for which you have proof there are no excepts to.
The point being is we really don't know what we think we know. And Ben Stein doesn't want to stop teaching the theory of evolution just be honest about its limits.
I agree. Why should we boycott the movie? Berlinski brings up the points that Evolution is NOT a Theory in the sense that Newton has a theory. And it can be tested mathematically. Like Einstein models. Evolution is more of a looks like theory. It have many good evidences, but cannot be quantified to legitmacy like most theories.
@brockelHero Because Stein stole from multiple people when making the movie. It's one giant collage of plagarization. On top of that it's full of outright lies and personal attacks.
@StarringEverett "Evolution is not objectively true. For instance,you cannot name a single 'scientific' law for which you have proof there are no excepts to." Super cool story bro.
Dude it is so obvious you did not understand a thing about this movie,as a christian I believe that this film PROVES the existence of our creation from a higher power.
The intelligent designer the movie is talking about is what christians call god.Your obviously not to insightful.
What difference does it make? It all hapenned the way God intended it to happen anyway. Whether it took 15 billion years or 6,000.
2 Timothy 2:23-24 "Don't have anything to do with stupid and foolish arguements because they produce quarrels. And the Lord's servant must not quarrel; instead he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful."
Repent (that is, to turn away from sin) and accept Jesus as your personal Lord and savior and you too will have eternal life.
What difference does it make? It all hapenned the way God intended it to happen anyway. Whether it took 15 billion years or 6,000.
2 Timothy 2:23-24 "Don't have anything to do with stupid and foolish arguements because they produce quarrels. And the Lord's servant must not quarrel; instead he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful."
Repent (that is, to turn away from sin) and accept Jesus as your personal Lord and savior and you too will have eternal life.
Has it been positively Disproved? I think not saying something and proving it wrong are two different things. Btw i dont believe as he does but he should have the right to Express his views, And you have the right to buy the movie ticket. And say hes wrong just like you all have been doing
@Bmedina11211 So if i say that raptor jesus went extinct for your sins, and if you don't eat children, you will be devoured by dinosaurs, you can't prove it or disprove it, so i have the right to make a fucking movie of it?
sounds liek a fucking zeitgeist rip-off. never heard of the movie, but i think it's sad that atheists feel the need to lie to dismiss god. It's pissing me off, since it's not that damn hard!
But by definition you Believe in intelligent design as a religious person you said your self "the creator", the people in the video are not creationists they arent trying to disprove Evolution but the theories of the first cell
Thumbs up from an atheist. Might be a little late, but I just only watched the movie. It sucks horribly bad. Even if you're for ID, you should be embarassed to be represented by people THAT stupid.
5:40 to 5:45 you mention that scientist question evolution. You must realize that they DON'T question evolutions as a whole. They question bits and pieces of very specific evolutionary processes. I'm studying comp eng., so as an example I'll use a processor:
Everyone knows how it works, we don't question it, but they are looking and question on make the processor from another material (instead of silicon). However this doesn't imply that the processor is wrong. Nor is evolution as a whole.
Damn. There should be more people like you. For a moment I was really shocked into thinking, "is science really suppressing I.D.?", but I realized that there would be some explanation to it. And here we are!
You make some interesting points. Its been quite some time since I watched this documentary. I have watched it 3 times before. I am also a Christian and have been for 11 years.
So you are against having creationism taught in schools in general or just in school science classes? I don't exactly remember what Ben's take on this was in the documentary. I'll have to watch it again and check out your links and repost my thoughts on your views.
Are you now or were you a science major? Just wonderin
I don't mind creationism being taught in philosophy or in comparative mythology. It's important to understand what we used to believe and why we used to believe it in order to understand the references of our cultural literature.
ChrisPalasz - thank you for posting such an intellectually honest video. It's reassuring to see that there are people who can have their faith and still, rigorously defend the necessity to be honest and forthright upholding it.
While I don't share your spiritual beliefs I applaud your methods.
Well done! I have new hope that their are some theists that still have some functional brain cells. I would say "God bless you" but that would be against my religion. Seriously, well done!
I'm a biologist and an atheist and I have to applaud you for making such an unambiguous and well-formulated statement to oppose the perverse travesty that 'Expelled' represents.
We'll have to disagree on religion, but I'm relieved we can stand united in our defense of science, the endeavor that has given us so much.
As a non-theist who lives in Oklahoma(most of my friends, naturally, are of the non-hellbound variety), I just have have to say: thank you! Well done.
And by the way your not a christian... Do you want to know why? Because being a christian means that you believe that god created the heavens and the earth and all living things. Which you apparently don't believe that. God said that you are either for me or against me. But if your are lukewarm I will spit you out of my mouth...
Bram, now you're making judgments that aren't for you to make. Yes, God created everything - but you're putting God in a box if you think he has to have done things the way you want to believe. You may have watched this movie, but I don't think you did your homework on it.
If believing in the bible is being fundamentalist than yes I am. And I'm pretty sure that its a requirement for all christians. The thing that I hate is when someone like yourself says,:" I'm a christian don't listen to ID because of how it can explain that god has a design for all living things." I find that to be appalling. Now if you just said don't don't watch Expelled because I'm an evoltionists. I wouldn't have a problem. And by the way its not judgement its you vs what god says?
What makes you seem like a fundamentalist to me is not your believing in the Bible, but because you seem to believe that when you read God's word - your very personal, very literal, and very narrow interpretation is the right one. You also seem to feel equipped to judge others' faith based on that.
Did you even watch the video? I never said don't listen to ID, I said don't listen to the movie, and I also said ID isn't science. The former is a recommendation, the latter is a fact.
What you don't seem to understand is that the bible is not a buffet. You can't pick and choose what parts of the bible fit your lifestyle and what parts don't. When people like you want to believe in something like evolution but don't want to give up your christian belief then you twist it to fit what you want. And people like you will never admit to that, because you cannot admit your faults. I don't go by anyone else's word but god's, I don't change it to fit my lifestyle.
What matters is the heart and faith of a Christian. God looks to the heart (like King David). You DO treat the Bible like a buffet, you're just not willing to admit it; and I do too, because everybody does. Some things we won't follow, some things we can't follow, and some things we don't understand to follow - but all of that is sin - and all of that is INCLUDED in why Jesus had to die. I go by what I understand in the Bible - I don't change it to fit my lifestyle.
You say I'm not a Christian, but you're accusing me of being a sinner, and condemning my faith for it. That's at the heart of what you're saying. And I AM a sinner. You don't go by anyone's word but God's? That's just a flat out lie and you know it, unless you're perfect; so give me a break. People who place their own words in the Bible to make it rule out the most scientifically evidenced Theory simply because they can't conceive of BOTH being true are just conservative to a fault.
There are plenty of christians that both believe in god and want to follow god. But I as I said before don't want to believe what the bible says because it conflicts with their lifestyle. So what you have said right now is that you have theories that you want to believe in much more than what god has written? You want to defend and believe in evolution much more than when god said that he created all living things. He never mentioned evolving his creations ever...
If you don't believe god's word than you don't believe that god mean't what he said. I would call that a selfish sort of christianity. You can go on all day about how your a christian but you pick and choose what you believe in. And for the record, I am far from perfect but I don't disguise my problems and make excuses. I admit to my sins and move on like a christian should. Anymore meaningless arguements about how its ok to skew the word of god?
Ok, I just want you to understand something. The problem here is not with me picking-and-choosing what I want to believe, and it's not with me believing something over God's word. On the contrary, I believe God is beyond us, and that he can do things in ways that we can barely begin to see or understand. The Bible doesn't talk about a LOT of things, and that doesn't mean those things aren't true, it just means they aren't relevant to salvation! The Bible tells us what we NEED to know - continued
Evolution is SCIENCE and it does NOT conflict with the Bible! When you go around heralding that it DOES - you put Christianity in a BAD and LOSING position, one that was never against God's words until you chose a MAN-MADE interpretation! I've said this ENTIRE time, hear me, that God created everything - and it's possible that he used our understanding of Evolution to progress life! You're just opposed to that because you're putting God in a box with your literal interpretation! (continued)
You know, Bramsmoker, a long time ago, Christian churches believed the Bible indicated that the earth was at the center of the Universe - something that has been proven FALSE. But those Christians were blinded by unreasoning and unquestioning devotion, similar to what you're displaying. Now - we accept that the Bible does NOT indicate an earth-centered-universe! Why? Because it's NOT true, so we must change our interpretation of the Bible! Don't wait that long! The Bible doesn't teach us science
I have a question for you? What was so bad a the pharisees? I mean they believed in god, the prayed everyday, went to church and worshipped. According to what your saying jesus should have been more than happy with their lifestyle. But they changed everything to fit their means, they worshiped out loud in the streets to be heard. The collected unreasonable and they acted high and mighty. And jesus rebuked him for it.
What was so bad about the Pharisees? For them, God was not reality - their practices were nothing more than culture, and they exploited it. Jesus rebuked them because they did not give their hearts to God.
Do you honestly think that if Jesus saw what you were saying, that he would come over and pat you on the back and say you were right? Really? As far as the bible saying that the earth is the center of the universe, I don't know whether it says that or not. I'm guessing not. But we are god's chosen and if he says that we are than we are. One way or another.. Again anymore meaningless arguements about unproven theories and skewing the bible?
I'll tell you what I DO honestly think - that Jesus would definitely NOT say to me what YOU are saying to me. So who exactly are you speaking for and why? Yourself?
Evolution is as proven a science as the most important and relevant discoveries known to man. And it has some problems just like the rest of science does; it is the cornerstone of Biology - something you can't even begin to understand or study without learning a most basic and sound principle: evolution.
And what makes evolution science? Its unproven and unproven theory that is constantly more and more unproven everyday. The ONLY and I MEAN ONLY, reason that evolution came about is because of the relation of animals within the species. And scientist could only explain it away by saying that they're all related despite the animals that don't fit into any category at all.
Evolution is unproven? My friend, it is proven, and it is a known fact. Microscopic forms of life evolve in University labs across the world. Those categories that you say some animals don't fit into are man made. We fabricated those categories, and that is actually, ironically supporting the theory of evolution. Species are always in transitional form.
Nothing has shown Evolution to be false. It is the best fit theory to scientifically explain life, a way of seeing God's work.
Evidence. Loads and loads of evidence. Massive amounts of it. Avalanches of facts and observations from various scientific disciplines, which all support the fact that evolution happens and that all life forms on earth share a common ancestor. That, my friend, is what makes it science.
@BramSmoker I finally find a christian video that is reasonable and intelligent. It made me feel good to see a thoughtful religious person, until I read your comment. It amazes me how someone as ignorant as you would feel comfortable revealing your lack of knowledge outside of your own bible class. Please do yourself and other christians a favor, by reading something other than the bible, so you can debate your position from an informed perspective. Or you can continue to make a fool of yourself
Hey dude, I think you know yourself that the bible is not a book that you should read from front to back and then literally accept every individual phrase in there. In fact, I KNOW you don't do this, as there ARE verses in there about stoning people who work on the resting day and beating your children with a rod daily and bla bla bla... The bible needs interpreting. If you read everything literally, you don't get the core of the stories, AND you do draw wrong conclusions...
Wow this is guy is the worst christian I have ever seen. Did you even see the movie? All accredited scientists all given the fair chance to explain what they're take on science is. What kind of christian are you that you would say that Evolution should completely shut out Intelligent design which closes god out of science. You should keep your horrible sort of chistianity to yourself...
To address the poster, my faith is solid enough that I can read Dawkins (The God Delusion), watch the Ben Stein movie, etc. and it does not affect my faith. I like to understand what others believe, and what "messages" are floating around out there. I wouldn't recommend it to everyone, but in the same token our faith should not be based on fear of the unknown.
Actually everyone keeps missing the entire point here. We keep arguing that creation is not science. The evolutionists state that it's not a theory. The fact is, the big bang is no more a theory than creation, neither can be proved or disproved and BOTH are faith-based. The problem is that when you are teaching science, the ultimate question always emer
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Dawkins has claimed, “As for religion … nobody wields a sharper bayonet than Sam Harris.” Harris debated Craig on 7th April. In his opening statement in that debate, Harris declared that Dr Craig is “the one Christian apologist who seems to have put the fear of God into many of my fellow atheists.” After that debate, the atheist website Debunking Christianity reported: “Bill (Craig) has once again showed himself as the best debater of this generation.” ROFL
RosesOfTimes 4 days ago
Your honesty runs along the same lines as Ken Millers' view - ID is religion. Thank you
Lennon4ever1 1 month ago
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The most shocking evidence of the effects Darwinian philosophy were laid out in plain English by the men who preach it... it wasn't some facts or figures that could be manipulated. Evolution, and the Darwinian Theory are not identical in Nature. Complete belief in randomness DOES do away with God, meaning, purpose, and ethics. And I suppose that is why the community at large has no problem commiting the systematic war acts it has on the freedom of inquiry.
yourboydano2 2 months ago
The most shocking evidence of the effects Darwinian philosophy were laid out in plain English by the men who preach it... it wasn't some facts or figures that could be manipulated. Evolution, and the Darwinian Theory are not identical in Nature. Complete belief in randomness DOES do away with God, meaning, purpose, and ethics. And I suppose that is why the community at large has no problem commiting the systematic war acts it has on the freedom of inquiry.
yourboydano2 2 months ago
This review was pathetic. You are twisting the whole point and message of the film. It was NEVER about TEACHING Intelligent Design in the class room, it was about freedom of inquiry. To at least be able to talk about it, mention it, discuss it without fear of losing your job, being black listed, and attacked systematically by the overarching power structure in the education system.
yourboydano2 2 months ago
@yourboydano2 give a single reason, why ID should be even talked about. A claim, that has never conveyed a single research or produced any evidence, should not only be avoided in an intellectual discussion, but ridiculed and attacked on a regular basis. Why? Because ID is a religious claim with no basis in reality. If you want to adhere to nonsense, be my guest, but dont expect any respect from others if you do!
eleminatus 3 weeks ago
I am sorry, but I strongly disagree with you view of the movie. I also am a Christian, and the movie is exactly what you said it isn't. The reason the movie was made because scientists were getting black listed because their studies in science led them to a belief in intelligent design or God. The movie was made to combat philosphers posing as scientists.
darint07 4 months ago
I think your review of this documentary was spot on.
TheManMostMysterious 6 months ago
Wow, a theist who doesn't piss me off. I wonder if you were just so indoctrinated from birth that you can't see the absurdity of having a god. Because you are smart. I wonder how smart people end up believing in religions. This is not a personal attack, merely an observation. This video was informative, and I agree, even If i was religious, i would think to myself "this film is not a force of good for us." As it stands now, the movie seems to have pissed off atheists as well as theists.
iSmkoeBluntsToMyFace 8 months ago
chump
fashklash 10 months ago
'....that Intelligent Design should be taught in the science classroom...it's making the claim that this theory is science" (chrispalasz)
I don't think the movie supports that notion at all. The movie focuses on academic freedom - and the freedom for scientists to hold a worldview that may be contrary to the prevailing ethos of other scientists (Darwinian evolutionary theory). When the scientists dared to honestly question evolution - they were either smeared or lost their jobs.
johnlorican 11 months ago
First of all Expelled is shown from the point of view of Intelligent Design, I have seen it and in no way does it claim to support the Christian world view. Ben Stein is a Jew, not a Christian. There are many arguments in this movie that are valid and made by very intelligent people. I have watched this whole video and I see no valid reason why anyone should not watch it. If you know why you believe what you believe, you cannot be swayed by any falsehoods.
Beccaalladin 11 months ago
I respect you for making this video! I am glad Stein's "documentary" doesn't actually represent all Christians/Religious people.
You have great standards for evidence, science, and education, and I wish more people were like you :)
Thank you!
sinofalchemy 1 year ago
I wish the world had more rational christians like you. (Actually that goes for more rational members of all religions... but my point stands)
rjc34 1 year ago
@thkaal1 Yes, should've typed "thermodynamics", but was thinking "law of entropy." The primary definition is very technical, but the secondary and more relevant (here), broader jist of it in layman's terms is the breakdown of matter and energy in the universe to an ultimate state of inert uniformity, or better yet a process from order to disorder. So basically, nature doesn't, in and of itself, "build complexity" - it does the opposite.
phojes10 1 year ago
I'm pleasantly surprised by this video to be honest, not what I was expecting
"Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed" is a film everyone should be embarrassed by, no matter their beliefs. Ignoring the subject matter aside, it is underhanded, it misrepresents and it outright lies.
Dahvood 1 year ago
How are you glorifying, or substantiating God through this message ???
Blowme95 1 year ago
@Blowme95
What do you mean by "substantiating God"?
And... did you watch the video? Because I'm not sure where the confusion is. I believe that encouraging Christians who are ignorant or enraged to abandon fruitless battles and approach holiness in a more loving and honest way - with an open mind - is well glorifying to God.
chrispalasz 1 year ago 4
@chrispalaszainst Yes i understand your point and i agree with it, but sir those who are not against you are for you. You are exposing other christians in this process, and are perhaps potentially discrediting their future projects and future arguments for belief in an intelligent design. Their postulations are a little far fetched yet they are right about their beliefs. No one will ever be able to destroy science its backed by its own laws The film was made using science to back it's theory.
Blowme95 1 year ago 2
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@chrispalasz Yes i understand your point and i agree with it, but sir those who are not against you are for you. You are exposing other christians in this process, and are perhaps potentially discrediting their future projects and future arguments for belief in an intelligent design. Their postulations are a little far fetched yet they are right about their beliefs. No one will ever be able to destroy science its backed by its own laws The film was made using science to back it's theory
Blowme95 1 year ago
You know that whole video is made with voice overs and cut offs. And Ben Stiens producers snuck in a doc. about the topic he talked about with the scientist right? Its OK to be a christian, but PLEASE don't relate to that video at all. It makes creationist look awful and deceitful.
MrFlyestNerd 1 year ago
You just described every evolutionist I've ever heard speak in the first 70 seconds.
Why do you lie and claim you're a Christian? Why do you claim the lies of evolutionists is science? You know what science is, so why do you lie and claim evolution is science? You're just a liar like all the evolutionists.
YOU are what's biased -- biased for the devil.
911dispatcher 1 year ago
@911dispatcher
??? I'm lying because... you say I am? This statement: "Evolution is a scientific theory" is a proven one. If you don't want to accept cold hard facts, that's you're problem. But calling me a liar with nothing to back that up is just childish slander.
chrispalasz 1 year ago
@chrispalasz How stupid. You're lying because that's what liars DO. If you've got enough sense to make and post a video, then you have enough sense to know what science is and therefore you know that evolution has not one shred of science to it and even if it were true (which is completely ludicrous) it couldn't be scientifically demonstrated. Now, playing me for a fool only makes you look like one.
Slander? Look up the definition of "science" and feel the red in your face.
911dispatcher 1 year ago
@911dispatcher
If I have told a lie in this video, I'm happy to say that God will be my Judge - not you.
Have you ever told a lie? If you have, that makes YOU a liar. Let he who has no sin cast the first stone.
chrispalasz 1 year ago
@chrispalasz John 1:1-4 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.He was with God in the beginning.Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. In Geneis1 you keep hearing;God SAID..let there be light, God SAID.. If Jesus was the Word and He was with God in the beginning then John 1 backs up Gen.1. The father SPOKE and the Son CREATED.
lynna0527 11 months ago
@lynna0527
I don't get it. Why is this message to me? Of course, as a Christian, I believe God, Father Son and Holy Spirit, were together at Creation...
So... ?
chrispalasz 11 months ago
@911dispatcher
You say that "evolution has not one shred of science to it" and that it cannot be "scientifically demonstrated". Those are two claims which you have given zero support for - because they are unsupportable.
You then tell me to go look up the definition of science when, if there were any substance or credibility to what you are saying, you could have just provided a definition right here for everyone to see - and exposed me. However, you cannot do that, either.
You are exposed.
chrispalasz 1 year ago
@chrispalasz It's useless to debate creationists such as 911dispatcher. I do appreciate your video and I fully agree.
ThisIsMinistry 1 year ago
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@911dispatcher Stay strong and don't let those who pretend to be Christians tear you down. I pray that the Lord keep you strong and that no one turn you against Him. And remember that its not a war against the flesh but one which we fight with the unseen
lynna0527 11 months ago
@chrispalasz
There needs to be more Christians like you. I'm an Atheist, but I see so many Christians take the stance of anti-evolution.
verzen 1 year ago
@911dispatcher Stay strong and don't let those who pose to be Christians tear you down. I pray that the Lord keep you strong and that no one turn you against Him. And remember that its not a war against the flesh but one that we fight with the unseen
lynna0527 11 months ago
@911dispatcher Stay strong and don't let those who pretend to be Christians tear you down. I pray that the Lord keep you strong and that no one turn you against Him. And remember that its not a war against the flesh but one which we fight with the unseen
lynna0527 11 months ago
@lynna0527 Thanks! I hate lies and it's appalling to watch someone so blatantly lie and I speak up to protect the simple and the naive and the uneducated from the deceit of the enemy perpetrated through liars and deceivers.
BTW, you can go to the 'down' arrow besides "Reply" and delete the accidental duplicates.
Blessings to you.
BludBaut 11 months ago
You can watch the "Expelled" movie on YouTube and not support it's creators.
watch?v=Fj8xyMsbkO4
swilson3d 1 year ago
I find it encouraging that american christians like you exist.
Poltionorch 1 year ago
@Poltionorch Because you love believing lies? Don't be encouraged. He's a complete phony and doesn't know what the Bible says or believe it.
911dispatcher 1 year ago
@911dispatcher
do you even know what a bible looks like you dumb fuck?
sykeo123 1 year ago 4
@911dispatcher If you want to discredit him, substantiate it. Otherwise, take your slander and go away
Dahvood 1 year ago
at that idea
fashklash 1 year ago
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fashklash 1 year ago
Evolution is completely irreconcilable with the christiany of the Bible.If I mention the theology behind this statement, you will only smirk at it because its theology.As you rightly said,evolution is concerned with a small part of the natural sciences.Despite this evolution is a subject of profound moral and ethical consequence- it lets us think of humans as some sort of accident of creation,and this lends itself to the idea that we purely socioeconomic entities. which btw is an old Nazi trick
fashklash 1 year ago
@fashklash Actually it isn't because of you accept that Noah's flood occured (I assume you do as you are a literalist) then you have to accept that superevolution must have occured subsequently in order for all of the species to have developed from the 'kinds' that existed Ark in just 4000 years. Such is the foolery of creation 'science'.
ignatz1106 1 year ago
@ignatz1106 There are only 30000 species of birds, reptiles and mammals alive today. Invertebrates, a few reptiles and water-dwelling mammals etc account for the rest of the organisms on earth, all of which could have survived during the flood.If there were 15000 antecedent species on the ark, it stands to reason that those could have given rise to further 15000 subspecies. There is a myriad of examples: Look at the canid and felis families, the ability of grizzlies and polar bears to mate etc
fashklash 1 year ago
@fashklash "The Flood Myth: No Intelligence Required"
It didn't happen dude, get over it.
ignatz1106 1 year ago
@ignatz1106 or the rapid speciation we observe in birds and reptiles like the Ensatina salamanders.We really haven't arrived on a decisive definition of species,but if inability to interbreed is one criterion,then those salamanders are a pime example of how"speciation"can happen rapidly.And I find all of this far,far more likely than the notion that all complex specified genetic information somehow came into existence through NS and Random mutation.many good mathemticians are completely baffled
fashklash 1 year ago
@chrispalasz Get off the wall and decide if you're an atheist or a christian. The present universal definition of science is governed by atheistic doctrine. So PLEASE decide what the hell you are.
fashklash 1 year ago
@fashklash Thankfully he's not an evangelical bigot like you. Now kindly have the guts to respond to the points I raised on the Rhynemaiden thread.
ignatz1106 1 year ago
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fashklash 1 year ago
@ignatz1106 If chrispalasz wants to believe in the atheist model of science, then he should just go for it and be an atheist. And what's the "Rhynemaiden" thread? Is it supposed to be famous or something? Am I supposed to jump back in awe-stricken amazement on hearing its name? Oh,so if don't pay any heed to it, I don't have the necessary guts.. talk about bigotry. Who are you? Someone I should know about? Einstein's grandson or something? ( all due respect to Einstein of course)
fashklash 1 year ago
@fashklash There is no "atheist" model of science - science does not take a position on whether or not there is or is not a God. There is also, it may surprise you to learn, no Christian concensus on literal truth in the Bible - many accept that the oldest Genesis stories where based on myths rather than literal truth, albeit with a strong moral component. The current obsession among some fundamentalists for literal truth is bourne out of their obsession for dogma rather than principles.
ignatz1106 1 year ago
@fashklash Additionally may I jog your memory about that thread it was "Creation Science" 101: Hydroplate "Theory". Maybe you cancelled the memory of the time that your butt got handed to you on a plate (and not just by me).
ignatz1106 1 year ago
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fashklash 1 year ago
@ignatz1106 Yes, science has to be athiestic. Anything else is considered religious, because it leaves open the possibility of a designer, and a designer is automatically considered religious, and instead of regarding it as one hypothetical possibility,we throw it out the window.So this is how we end up with a situation where people like judge jones can read 90%of an"Atheist communist lawyers union"letter that says that ID is religious not PC,and therefore not worthy of scientific investigation
fashklash 1 year ago
@fashklash What nonsense. I don't think you even understand (or want to understand) what science is. The vast majority of scientific investigation has little to do with evolution-it's just that for people like you, the tiny part that does, SEEMS to conflict with your faith - so therefore you see a conflict - means that somehow the rest of the scientific community (the majority of which consists of all different faiths) must be atheistic. ID lost because most of the DI didn't show up in Dover.
ignatz1106 1 year ago
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fashklash 1 year ago
@ignatz1106 And you sure do have a big head don't you?suppose I decide to inject some reason into that debate?Unfortunately I do work and I don't have the 1000s of hours necessary to debate the hundreds of atheists who spend their lives perpetually debating about things they strongly feel are too stupid and inane to even adress (where's the logic in that?)The arrogance is almost nauseating. There's plenty of good material on ID. Try reading a book by David Berlinski some time- not even religious
fashklash 1 year ago
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ignatz1106 1 year ago
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@fashklash " haha. you're the typical atheist bigot. You think I don't know what a geologist is. You probably think that creationists don't believe in sex theory. Poor you. Poor pitiful you. haha!!" That was the level of your "reason" on that thread. And you call me arrogant. Three words for you "pot", "kettle" and "black" - that and Matthew 7:5."
ignatz1106 1 year ago
Bright mind, hope you come over to the dark side mwahahaha
mackles 1 year ago
I'm sure someone else has already pointed this out, the scientific method itself proves evolution is a theory. No one observed or has duplicated the origin of the universe or the earth (step 1). It is also not testable (see last sentence.) (step 4) You must have FAITH to believe the universe, the earth, the human body, and all living things constructed from a pool of matter and big bang. 2nd law of entropy - all matter breaks down by natural processes, does not become more complex.
phojes10 1 year ago
If you can't believe the Bible is completely historically true, you have no right to call yourself a Christian. Without Genesis 1-12, there is no need of Salvation. You are putting the authority of the science of fallen Mankind above the authority of the Bible. Just because some Christian Creationists have attempted to include I.D. in their ideas does not make I.D. a form of Christian apologetics. I.D. makes no claims as to the source of the intelligence.
dontyoumonkeyaround 1 year ago
SETI is based on theoretical research to recognise hallmarks of intellegence. I.D. is attempting to use similar principles on a billionth of the budget. Evolution theory is pseudo-science, false information, frauds and 1/2 truths. You can see it was a deliberate conspiracy from the start, if you investigate its history. Earlier than verifiably dated recorded history, it is impossible to prove anything about the past without making un-provable assumptions.
dontyoumonkeyaround 1 year ago
liberal christians like this guy should burn their bibles and convert to atheism. You can't believe the bible without special creation. Call yourself something else, just don't call yourself christian.
fashklash 1 year ago
You should get a new bookshelf.
madmax5588 1 year ago
@ReligionIsMisery These are my questions to you sir :) Again I hope this doesn't turn into any bad blood between us, it isn't my intent at all. When I said it isn't objective in the first post, is because we have no bones of Jesus, no proven death date or whatever. Jesus's ministry was a short 3 years, and in an illiterat part of the world. For it to have such humble backgrounds to transition to it's growth today also speaks of a truth not founded totally by history. My thoughts aside.....
LinkMaster1711 1 year ago
@LinkMaster1711 You do realize Christianity did not flourish until Paul and Constantine started killing people who disagreed with it, right?
jesuriah 1 year ago
@jesuriah Not according to the early Church, people and their beliefs truly went crazy after Jesus Death, read 1st Corinthians 15:3-8. Also I am not sure what you are trying to say with that either.
LinkMaster1711 1 year ago
@LinkMaster1711 "For it to have such humble backgrounds to transition to it's growth today also speaks of a truth not founded totally by history. My thoughts aside....."
That was what my comment was referring to, apologies probably should have cleared that up. Christianity may have started humble, but spread by the sword.
"Not according to the early Church,"
Maybe not, but according to history my statement stands true.
jesuriah 1 year ago
@jesuriah lol what are you talking about. Paul NEVER did that. What History are you referring to? The Crusades I'm guessing
LinkMaster1711 1 year ago
@LinkMaster1711 Nope, you're right, Paul didn't. It was Constantine, my bad! My earlier statement was wrong. Constantine funded and supported the religion, while talking about equality for all.
jesuriah 1 year ago
@jesuriah yeah that we can both agree on... I really wasn't sure about how to deal with the problem of Paul killing for Christ haha. All of that aside, the early Roman Church was Persecuted, Peter died by being burned alive upside down while crucified, yet he still proclaimed the name of Christ even in his death. Paul was locked away in jail and died there writing the letters the Christian Theology now refers to as the bible. Anyway, I wouldn't go around saying Paul killed people lol
LinkMaster1711 1 year ago
@LinkMaster1711 "Anyway, I wouldn't go around saying Paul killed people lol"
Neither will I anymore, lol. Stupid mistake by me.
jesuriah 1 year ago
@ReligionIsMisery Which may prove that Luke was indeed traveling amongst Paul, because he was accurately writing down the names of cities, goverment elected officials, certain cultural schemes, even to the way the world was working in the areas they traveled, all while including miracles that he recorded while traveling with Paul. Paul being another anomoly, he penned half the New Testament, why would a man like Saul of Tarsus convert at all? He admits he was bad in his own letters.
LinkMaster1711 1 year ago
@ReligionIsMisery The earliest written manuscripts, let me clarify. There is ancient non christian writings of a man named Jesus who died and was seen 3 days later. Moreso, his half brother James (a pillar of the early church in Acts) was in fact a leader of the church at the time, and claimed to have seen the risen Christ himself. You get in the last half of Acts 84 historically proven statements, which scholars can agree, Luke the writer was no simple man in his diligent writings.....
LinkMaster1711 1 year ago
@ReligionIsMisery 2nd question I must ask, is why the conncordance of manuscripts so abundant, they literally make all other ancient works bow before them in sheer amount, and accuracy to the fact that only 1 in every 237 verses will you possibly get a mistranslated word. And the sheer amounts of manuscripts of New Testament manuscrpt are in the proven 1000's and written as early as roughly 20 years after his death
LinkMaster1711 1 year ago
@ReligionIsMisery Well it isn't objective, but if your the jury and you have to point the finger at which side fits the reasoning than I think the conclusion of a man named Jesus that lived 2010 years ago is absolutely provable. I gotta start with the early church of the Romans, why would anyone follow a belief like Christianity to the brink of death via persecution if the very man who walked the earth, that formed the early church, a few weeks/months/years didn't exsist?
LinkMaster1711 1 year ago
@ReligionIsMisery there you go, no point in trying to convince you that the sky isn't green
LinkMaster1711 1 year ago
@ReligionIsMisery hmm I must first ask you how open is your mind?
LinkMaster1711 1 year ago
Good for you Chris. I wish more believers would have your outlook. It would make me more optimistic about the species.
chantervz 1 year ago
Do you understand the difference between natural selection and macro evolution? They are not the same. In order for "goo-to-you" evolution, you must show that information has increased over time. It has not. Dogs stay dogs. And most examples people turn to like the tste fly or some bacteria is simply mutations, which is actually the loss of information. Darwinian evolution is a hoax and effective tool of atheists to try and bury the idea of a creator God.
Quattro46 1 year ago
@Quattro46
speciation ("macro evolution") has been observed in lab conditions and in the wild.
pyr666 1 year ago
by the scientific community as a whole. That is the reason that evolution should be taught, and not intelligent design. Intelligent design isn't science because they have absolutely no evidence at all, it's religion masquerading as science, at the minimal it's pseudoscience. Other than that though I enjoyed your video very much, you seem to be a very intelligent individual, and you made a lot of very valid points. well done.
Johnxrox 1 year ago
Just because something can not be proven, does not mean it isn't science. There are things that will pretty much always stay in the theory state, for instance the formation of the universe, or the way that gravity works. There are plenty of things that we will never be able to actually prove, but they still remain scientific. However, I think I may have misjudged your statement. Now the fact that Intelligent Design has little to no evidence in its favor, and is not accepted...
Johnxrox 1 year ago
google astrotheology and jesus
sagitarian000028 1 year ago
Quit lying about Expelled!
Everything that he says about the movie is absolutely false. Go and see the movie for yourself, and see what it is actually about. You will see that this video is not accurate.
What is a REAL threat to science, is when you fire a legitimate scientist for not believing in a supposedly legitimate theory. If Evolution were true, then why are Evolutionists so afraid of having anyone question it?
You also say "This is not a Christian film." Ben Stein is a Jew.
GreenSlugg 1 year ago
@GreenSlugg Amen! This stuff happens all the time to people who don't agree with Evilution. It isn't proven, it barely makes any sense, and saddest part is it gets praised like the bible as being the best theory out there! I can't buy this crap! My great ancestor wasn't a fish! If anyone wants to prove it was I am all ears, but believing that over saying God did it, I am gonna go with God. And NO FOSSILS. I can prove Jesus walked the earth, but you can't give me any bones for either case!
LinkMaster1711 1 year ago
@GreenSlugg Nobody who accepts evolution is afraid of it being questioned. Scientists test the theory daily. We're tired of people who don't understand it lying about it, then trying to pass off their strawman arguments as science. Cheers.
jesuriah 1 year ago
@jesuriah I am not going to waste my time throwing my pearls to you.
I know plenty of scientists who do not believe in Evolution. The reason that Evolutionists do not want people to see Expelled is because it shows the truth.
GreenSlugg 1 year ago
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@GreenSlugg Matthew 5:22.
"I know plenty of scientists who do not believe in Evolution."
Name one, please.
Expelled has been debunked. You lose.
Oh look I can post things without giving reasons too!
I would bet money that you don't even know the definition of speciation, macro evolution, and punctuated equilibrium.
jesuriah 1 year ago
no conspiracy theories friend, people said they were fired because of their faith in God or questions..
DJSTYLEZ7 1 year ago
@DJSTYLEZ7 People say a lot of things. Example: Dr. Caroline Crocker wasn't even fired. Read up on it.
tilldawn2430 1 year ago
@DJSTYLEZ7 The fact is and its true still today you have scientists only believing in evolution speaking on the wildlife channels..Thats what he is getting at..
DJSTYLEZ7 1 year ago
the movie is biased, yes, but it does not advocate teaching intelligent design, it only advocates not firing people that say its a POSSIBILITY.
elitesack 1 year ago
the movie was about intelligent design and how athiest activist such as dawkins claim to be fact based but go out of their ways into the realm of fairy tales to claim intelligent design does not exist. then proceed to make absolutely no sense and say aliens might have created humans.
elitesack 1 year ago
@elitesack So you don't think that his statements were taken out of context? I you do I would recommend you watch him on you tube. Where you would quickly see he would never make an of the cuff remark. In contrast I can easily find Stein making completely baseless remarks, but since he is only collecting his paycheck from a select audience... I really don't think he cares is he is way way off the mark.
carlijensen 1 year ago
clown. everyone make your own decision. chris, dont fear god. he forgives.
johan420 1 year ago
I recommend reading "I Don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist" by Norman L Geisler and Frank Turek. It applies logical reasoning toward the premises of Christianity.
bitterroot 1 year ago
The reasons and logic you used to reject ID as a science can be used against the Primordial Soup Theory and the Big Bang Theory...
Yes Micro-evolution is proven to be fact, but I can't say the same for "common decent". Whats your take on that?
zelda0521 1 year ago
I applaud you for making this video. You put it very correctly, Ben Stein's movie is full of psedo science, conspiracy theory, false information and half truths. Human knowledge has become so vast that we need to depend on other people to complete our knowledge. As a layman, who will I depend on for information about evolution? Overwhelming majority of scientific community has a consensus on evolution. Or would you believe people like Ben Stein who has no scientific backing?
rpk58 1 year ago 5
The Stein flick is about education. Its about the educational system itself and how it operates etc. And about showing exactly what science means and what it doesn't mean.
Evolution is not objectively true. For instance,you cannot name a single 'scientific' law for which you have proof there are no excepts to.
The point being is we really don't know what we think we know. And Ben Stein doesn't want to stop teaching the theory of evolution just be honest about its limits.
StarringEverett 1 year ago
@StarringEverett
I agree. Why should we boycott the movie? Berlinski brings up the points that Evolution is NOT a Theory in the sense that Newton has a theory. And it can be tested mathematically. Like Einstein models. Evolution is more of a looks like theory. It have many good evidences, but cannot be quantified to legitmacy like most theories.
brockelHero 1 year ago
@brockelHero Because Stein stole from multiple people when making the movie. It's one giant collage of plagarization. On top of that it's full of outright lies and personal attacks.
CanadiaNecro1 1 year ago
@StarringEverett "Evolution is not objectively true. For instance,you cannot name a single 'scientific' law for which you have proof there are no excepts to." Super cool story bro.
TheGodAccount 1 year ago
@TheGodAccount Thanks
StarringEverett 1 year ago
I think Ben Stein's vid is good.
jamnatep 1 year ago
Dude it is so obvious you did not understand a thing about this movie,as a christian I believe that this film PROVES the existence of our creation from a higher power.
The intelligent designer the movie is talking about is what christians call god.Your obviously not to insightful.
local1578 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
What difference does it make? It all hapenned the way God intended it to happen anyway. Whether it took 15 billion years or 6,000.
2 Timothy 2:23-24 "Don't have anything to do with stupid and foolish arguements because they produce quarrels. And the Lord's servant must not quarrel; instead he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful."
Repent (that is, to turn away from sin) and accept Jesus as your personal Lord and savior and you too will have eternal life.
gerry4ta 1 year ago
What difference does it make? It all hapenned the way God intended it to happen anyway. Whether it took 15 billion years or 6,000.
2 Timothy 2:23-24 "Don't have anything to do with stupid and foolish arguements because they produce quarrels. And the Lord's servant must not quarrel; instead he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful."
Repent (that is, to turn away from sin) and accept Jesus as your personal Lord and savior and you too will have eternal life.
gerry4ta 1 year ago
Has it been positively Disproved? I think not saying something and proving it wrong are two different things. Btw i dont believe as he does but he should have the right to Express his views, And you have the right to buy the movie ticket. And say hes wrong just like you all have been doing
Bmedina11211 1 year ago
@thkaal1 No zeitgeist is an atheist movie. Expelled is like the christian version. All bullshit.
metalsaw666 1 year ago
even so whats the problem with the man expressing his views on how life started, if what he says cant be proved or disproved let the man have his say
Bmedina11211 1 year ago
@Bmedina11211 So if i say that raptor jesus went extinct for your sins, and if you don't eat children, you will be devoured by dinosaurs, you can't prove it or disprove it, so i have the right to make a fucking movie of it?
metalsaw666 1 year ago
You sure do, although i dont think anyone would spend the movie to see it. Have a nice day Mr. 666 (origional btw)
Bmedina11211 1 year ago
@metalsaw666
You can make a movie out of anything you want.
If it's as crappy as Expelled was, you'll make about as little money. I bet Raptor Jesus as a mockumentary of Expelled would be awesome.
rkyeun 1 year ago
@Bmedina11211
Let the man have his say anyways. Freedom of speech. Just don't grant his beliefs tax exempt status.
rkyeun 1 year ago
@rkyeun I totally agree
Bmedina11211 1 year ago
sounds liek a fucking zeitgeist rip-off. never heard of the movie, but i think it's sad that atheists feel the need to lie to dismiss god. It's pissing me off, since it's not that damn hard!
metalsaw666 1 year ago
But by definition you Believe in intelligent design as a religious person you said your self "the creator", the people in the video are not creationists they arent trying to disprove Evolution but the theories of the first cell
Bmedina11211 1 year ago
If only the majority of Christians shared this point of view! =)
SwooningWillow 1 year ago
Most of them do.
Intelligent design is really just an American thing.
Christians in other countries are just like this guy.
BlackRaptor31 1 year ago 10
oh, yes. I know, I was referring to American Christians. sorry about that!
SwooningWillow 1 year ago
WOW!!
I'm sorry that I can only give you 5 stars. Your intellectual honesty has earned this atheist's respect.
jefmaze 1 year ago
Thumbs up from an atheist. Might be a little late, but I just only watched the movie. It sucks horribly bad. Even if you're for ID, you should be embarassed to be represented by people THAT stupid.
pschierhorn 1 year ago
I am happy to be reminded that there are Christians out there who know the difference between science and faith. Kudos!
MikaylaStarstuff 1 year ago
5:40 to 5:45 you mention that scientist question evolution. You must realize that they DON'T question evolutions as a whole. They question bits and pieces of very specific evolutionary processes. I'm studying comp eng., so as an example I'll use a processor:
Everyone knows how it works, we don't question it, but they are looking and question on make the processor from another material (instead of silicon). However this doesn't imply that the processor is wrong. Nor is evolution as a whole.
pezus420 1 year ago
WRONG Christianity is a laughing matter to me. I find it's funny how people believe in a physics laws breaking invisible sky daddy.
jpdidit 2 years ago
Damn. There should be more people like you. For a moment I was really shocked into thinking, "is science really suppressing I.D.?", but I realized that there would be some explanation to it. And here we are!
SubstantialDisorder 2 years ago
You make some interesting points. Its been quite some time since I watched this documentary. I have watched it 3 times before. I am also a Christian and have been for 11 years.
So you are against having creationism taught in schools in general or just in school science classes? I don't exactly remember what Ben's take on this was in the documentary. I'll have to watch it again and check out your links and repost my thoughts on your views.
Are you now or were you a science major? Just wonderin
MYCONSERVATIVENATION 2 years ago
@MYCONSERVATIVENATION
I don't mind creationism being taught in philosophy or in comparative mythology. It's important to understand what we used to believe and why we used to believe it in order to understand the references of our cultural literature.
rkyeun 1 year ago
@MYCONSERVATIVENATION
I would of course want equal time covering a broad range of creation myths from many religions, including Islam, Zulu, Apache, Norse...
After all, we have to be fair.
It would be more of a literature class.
rkyeun 1 year ago
ChrisPalasz - thank you for posting such an intellectually honest video. It's reassuring to see that there are people who can have their faith and still, rigorously defend the necessity to be honest and forthright upholding it.
While I don't share your spiritual beliefs I applaud your methods.
Noisegator 2 years ago
All i can do is laugh. You are so missinformed.
pigeonseatmangoes 2 years ago
Well done! I have new hope that their are some theists that still have some functional brain cells. I would say "God bless you" but that would be against my religion. Seriously, well done!
sonvolt48 2 years ago
I'm a biologist and an atheist and I have to applaud you for making such an unambiguous and well-formulated statement to oppose the perverse travesty that 'Expelled' represents.
We'll have to disagree on religion, but I'm relieved we can stand united in our defense of science, the endeavor that has given us so much.
Bravo!
singring76 2 years ago 14
You remind me of a poor man's B.J. Novak. Not a relevant post, but i thought this wall needed some comical relief.
Squish888 2 years ago
As a non-theist who lives in Oklahoma(most of my friends, naturally, are of the non-hellbound variety), I just have have to say: thank you! Well done.
rubin10101 2 years ago
as an atheist, thank you for giving christians a good name. World needs more people who think like this.
birdiejoehoaks 2 years ago
And by the way your not a christian... Do you want to know why? Because being a christian means that you believe that god created the heavens and the earth and all living things. Which you apparently don't believe that. God said that you are either for me or against me. But if your are lukewarm I will spit you out of my mouth...
BramSmoker 2 years ago
Bram, now you're making judgments that aren't for you to make. Yes, God created everything - but you're putting God in a box if you think he has to have done things the way you want to believe. You may have watched this movie, but I don't think you did your homework on it.
chrispalasz 2 years ago
If believing in the bible is being fundamentalist than yes I am. And I'm pretty sure that its a requirement for all christians. The thing that I hate is when someone like yourself says,:" I'm a christian don't listen to ID because of how it can explain that god has a design for all living things." I find that to be appalling. Now if you just said don't don't watch Expelled because I'm an evoltionists. I wouldn't have a problem. And by the way its not judgement its you vs what god says?
BramSmoker 2 years ago
What makes you seem like a fundamentalist to me is not your believing in the Bible, but because you seem to believe that when you read God's word - your very personal, very literal, and very narrow interpretation is the right one. You also seem to feel equipped to judge others' faith based on that.
Did you even watch the video? I never said don't listen to ID, I said don't listen to the movie, and I also said ID isn't science. The former is a recommendation, the latter is a fact.
chrispalasz 2 years ago
What you don't seem to understand is that the bible is not a buffet. You can't pick and choose what parts of the bible fit your lifestyle and what parts don't. When people like you want to believe in something like evolution but don't want to give up your christian belief then you twist it to fit what you want. And people like you will never admit to that, because you cannot admit your faults. I don't go by anyone else's word but god's, I don't change it to fit my lifestyle.
BramSmoker 2 years ago
What matters is the heart and faith of a Christian. God looks to the heart (like King David). You DO treat the Bible like a buffet, you're just not willing to admit it; and I do too, because everybody does. Some things we won't follow, some things we can't follow, and some things we don't understand to follow - but all of that is sin - and all of that is INCLUDED in why Jesus had to die. I go by what I understand in the Bible - I don't change it to fit my lifestyle.
chrispalasz 2 years ago
You say I'm not a Christian, but you're accusing me of being a sinner, and condemning my faith for it. That's at the heart of what you're saying. And I AM a sinner. You don't go by anyone's word but God's? That's just a flat out lie and you know it, unless you're perfect; so give me a break. People who place their own words in the Bible to make it rule out the most scientifically evidenced Theory simply because they can't conceive of BOTH being true are just conservative to a fault.
chrispalasz 2 years ago
There are plenty of christians that both believe in god and want to follow god. But I as I said before don't want to believe what the bible says because it conflicts with their lifestyle. So what you have said right now is that you have theories that you want to believe in much more than what god has written? You want to defend and believe in evolution much more than when god said that he created all living things. He never mentioned evolving his creations ever...
BramSmoker 2 years ago
If you don't believe god's word than you don't believe that god mean't what he said. I would call that a selfish sort of christianity. You can go on all day about how your a christian but you pick and choose what you believe in. And for the record, I am far from perfect but I don't disguise my problems and make excuses. I admit to my sins and move on like a christian should. Anymore meaningless arguements about how its ok to skew the word of god?
BramSmoker 2 years ago
Ok, I just want you to understand something. The problem here is not with me picking-and-choosing what I want to believe, and it's not with me believing something over God's word. On the contrary, I believe God is beyond us, and that he can do things in ways that we can barely begin to see or understand. The Bible doesn't talk about a LOT of things, and that doesn't mean those things aren't true, it just means they aren't relevant to salvation! The Bible tells us what we NEED to know - continued
chrispalasz 2 years ago
Evolution is SCIENCE and it does NOT conflict with the Bible! When you go around heralding that it DOES - you put Christianity in a BAD and LOSING position, one that was never against God's words until you chose a MAN-MADE interpretation! I've said this ENTIRE time, hear me, that God created everything - and it's possible that he used our understanding of Evolution to progress life! You're just opposed to that because you're putting God in a box with your literal interpretation! (continued)
chrispalasz 2 years ago
You know, Bramsmoker, a long time ago, Christian churches believed the Bible indicated that the earth was at the center of the Universe - something that has been proven FALSE. But those Christians were blinded by unreasoning and unquestioning devotion, similar to what you're displaying. Now - we accept that the Bible does NOT indicate an earth-centered-universe! Why? Because it's NOT true, so we must change our interpretation of the Bible! Don't wait that long! The Bible doesn't teach us science
chrispalasz 2 years ago
I have a question for you? What was so bad a the pharisees? I mean they believed in god, the prayed everyday, went to church and worshipped. According to what your saying jesus should have been more than happy with their lifestyle. But they changed everything to fit their means, they worshiped out loud in the streets to be heard. The collected unreasonable and they acted high and mighty. And jesus rebuked him for it.
BramSmoker 2 years ago
What was so bad about the Pharisees? For them, God was not reality - their practices were nothing more than culture, and they exploited it. Jesus rebuked them because they did not give their hearts to God.
chrispalasz 2 years ago
Do you honestly think that if Jesus saw what you were saying, that he would come over and pat you on the back and say you were right? Really? As far as the bible saying that the earth is the center of the universe, I don't know whether it says that or not. I'm guessing not. But we are god's chosen and if he says that we are than we are. One way or another.. Again anymore meaningless arguements about unproven theories and skewing the bible?
BramSmoker 2 years ago
I'll tell you what I DO honestly think - that Jesus would definitely NOT say to me what YOU are saying to me. So who exactly are you speaking for and why? Yourself?
Evolution is as proven a science as the most important and relevant discoveries known to man. And it has some problems just like the rest of science does; it is the cornerstone of Biology - something you can't even begin to understand or study without learning a most basic and sound principle: evolution.
chrispalasz 2 years ago 4
And what makes evolution science? Its unproven and unproven theory that is constantly more and more unproven everyday. The ONLY and I MEAN ONLY, reason that evolution came about is because of the relation of animals within the species. And scientist could only explain it away by saying that they're all related despite the animals that don't fit into any category at all.
BramSmoker 2 years ago
Evolution is unproven? My friend, it is proven, and it is a known fact. Microscopic forms of life evolve in University labs across the world. Those categories that you say some animals don't fit into are man made. We fabricated those categories, and that is actually, ironically supporting the theory of evolution. Species are always in transitional form.
Nothing has shown Evolution to be false. It is the best fit theory to scientifically explain life, a way of seeing God's work.
chrispalasz 2 years ago 5
@you had me up until you mentioned god lol.
metalsaw666 1 year ago
@chrispalasz this is most certainly not a threat, this could build a bridge to an athiest's acceptance of Christianity.
bstovall001 1 year ago
@chrispalasz
so you believe in a one cell origin of species as well as God creating man? Help me make the distinction...
brockelHero 1 year ago
@chrispalasz what's proved evolutioni wrong is that they still haven't found the dynamite that blew up at the big bang
danmatt44 1 year ago
@BramSmoker
"And what makes evolution science?"
The fact that it is falsifiable and makes strong predictions that have never been wrong in the millions of trials and tests it has been put to.
You know, the definition of science - at least good science.
ApesAmongUs 2 years ago
@BramSmoker
"And what makes evolution science?"
Evidence. Loads and loads of evidence. Massive amounts of it. Avalanches of facts and observations from various scientific disciplines, which all support the fact that evolution happens and that all life forms on earth share a common ancestor. That, my friend, is what makes it science.
MomoTheBellyDancer 1 year ago
@BramSmoker I finally find a christian video that is reasonable and intelligent. It made me feel good to see a thoughtful religious person, until I read your comment. It amazes me how someone as ignorant as you would feel comfortable revealing your lack of knowledge outside of your own bible class. Please do yourself and other christians a favor, by reading something other than the bible, so you can debate your position from an informed perspective. Or you can continue to make a fool of yourself
darcyhouston 1 year ago
Hey dude, I think you know yourself that the bible is not a book that you should read from front to back and then literally accept every individual phrase in there. In fact, I KNOW you don't do this, as there ARE verses in there about stoning people who work on the resting day and beating your children with a rod daily and bla bla bla... The bible needs interpreting. If you read everything literally, you don't get the core of the stories, AND you do draw wrong conclusions...
TakesTwoToTango 2 years ago
shut up your a idiot
josueanthonylpz 2 years ago
Wow this is guy is the worst christian I have ever seen. Did you even see the movie? All accredited scientists all given the fair chance to explain what they're take on science is. What kind of christian are you that you would say that Evolution should completely shut out Intelligent design which closes god out of science. You should keep your horrible sort of chistianity to yourself...
BramSmoker 2 years ago
Thank you, fundamentalist christian. If I'm the worst you've ever seen - well that says a lot more about you than it ever will about me.
chrispalasz 2 years ago
To address the poster, my faith is solid enough that I can read Dawkins (The God Delusion), watch the Ben Stein movie, etc. and it does not affect my faith. I like to understand what others believe, and what "messages" are floating around out there. I wouldn't recommend it to everyone, but in the same token our faith should not be based on fear of the unknown.
dopeboo 2 years ago
@dopeboo solid faith= ignorance of others.
metalsaw666 1 year ago
Actually everyone keeps missing the entire point here. We keep arguing that creation is not science. The evolutionists state that it's not a theory. The fact is, the big bang is no more a theory than creation, neither can be proved or disproved and BOTH are faith-based. The problem is that when you are teaching science, the ultimate question always emer