Dogma - "The Walrus and the Carpenter"

[TheMultiGunMan]

★★★★★

[jerzeefranky3475]

DAMN,MAN...Matt Damon's Loki can sell ice 2 an Inuit/Eskimo...

[TheMsMorra]

Ben Afflecks expressions totaly make the scene.

[Adler36]

I'm atheist too and I love "Alice in Wonderland" and "Through the Looking Glass"- this is genius! <3

[ilovecloudythegiant]

he said nothing of jews hahaha

[KingAdonisDNA]

@ilovecloudythegiant There are thousands upon thousands of religions. He only mentioned a few, and out of the countless others he did not mention, you find it funny or incongruent that he did not mention judaism?

[ilovecloudythegiant]

@KingAdonisDNA yes. i also find it funny that you care

[KingAdonisDNA]

@ilovecloudythegiant I care because I want to know why, I'd like more than a yes or no answer please.

[lila21211]

@KingAdonisDNA well, jesus was jewish. he said "western religions" which i took to mean "the various divisions of christianity, as well as judaism."

[Mondbrunnen87]

AMEN

[StalkingAlucard]

So basically she changes her religious belief based on one persons interpretation of a poem.

[Patrickdraven]

If there's one thing Bible Bashers don't want people to do is think for themselves.

[Omegavegametal]

@Patrickdraven haha if thats not sarcasm your pretty fucking dumb

[ilovejourney1]

John Lennon liked this poem ,too.

[ScoutingTacos]

@captnemo131

It's not weird, just wildly hilarious.

[Tablekorner]

You know what I don't get, you know there is a god. lol so funny when Ben says that

[Elfinesmom]

The walrus and the carpenter is, to me, more about Carrol's struggle with pedophilia. Religion could easily be entwined with it, him having a longstanding relationship with the church and rejecting a position in it because he felt unworthy.

[druvirus]

@Elfinesmom While I don't believe that Dodgson was a pedophile (although this can be debated very well as all signs could potentially point to "yes") I don't quite understand how this poem deals with any sort of "struggle" he may have had with said beliefs. Explain? (Not being an ass, honest. Just am curious.)

[Elfinesmom]

@druvirus I'm not going to be one of those people that makes every single part of the poem symbolic. But the Walrus & the Carpenter are both authority figures who were entrusted the little oysters by their guardian and with that trust- the hopes that they will enrich their young lives and teach them (he was a professor)- they consume them.

As I do strongly believe he was a pedophile, I have also seen contributing evidence that he felt rotten about his attractions to little girls. Guilt.

[druvirus]

@Elfinesmom Ooh! Very true on both points. Never really saw it that way although it could definitely be interpreted as such. Then again, perhaps this is a cautionary tale for children more so than one of guilt.

But it is hard to identify if his attraction to little girls was sexual in nature or simply aesthetic (as he seemed to claim and many could argue.) .. But that's a discussion for another time!

[Elfinesmom]

@druvirus If so, he seemed to spend a LOT of time and energy into admiring the aesthetic of the nude child's body. He never had a real romantic relationship with a woman and said he didn't much like girls once they got too old.

[Elfinesmom]

@druvirus and you have to admit what an easy metaphor oysters are for. . . femininity

[yegorletoff]

One of my favorite movies - it's just great!

[KookiesMD3477]

actually loki said "get yourself a nice piece of ass, you deserve it"

[Soulsphere001]

I haven't seen this movie, but I want to see it at some point. I'm a Christian, like Kevin Smith is, and it'd be interesting to see the bad aspects relating to the dogma of religion.

[henshinman]

@Soulsphere001 actually kevin smith us a Catholic but it is all generally the same religion

[Soulsphere001]

@henshinman

There are some pretty major differences, but it's still reasonably close.

[Exoixx]

This movie made my religion lessons at school much more fun.

[wildhobby]

Yep, that is what is known colloquially as a verbal 'nutmeging'

[Popcultureguy3000]

I always thought the walrus was a politian or industrialist and carpenter was a representation of the laborer. I mean think about it Lewis Carol was either British or American and at the time both countries had terribly hazardous working conditions and terribly low pay. The story could very well have represented Czar-era Russia for all we know.

[henshinman]

@Popcultureguy3000 but looking at it through the guise of religion it could be a decent argument against organized religion

[Popcultureguy3000]

@henshinman Of course it could also just reflect the dangers of joining large organizations as a whole and mean nothing else.

[henshinman]

@Popcultureguy3000 that to is a good way to look at it too

[ilovejourney1]

@Popcultureguy3000 The Walrus was John Lennon..

[Popcultureguy3000]

@ilovejourney1 In other words the Beatles ripped off Lewis Carol.

[ilovejourney1]

@Popcultureguy3000 yep, well, John Lennon anyway..

[x4xTheFourthx4x]

I always thought the walrus was representative of death, not eastern religions. Also there's definitely something behind the story.

[R3TU4NmyP13]

Well, it's true. Look ,we have people killing people because they don't believe the same ideals, and we have people killing others because of their ideals. And the ironic part, each religions "Holy Book" (The bible, the Quran, etc...) says it is a sin.

Isn't the hypocrisy of organized groups just astounding?

[gambitraven]

love talking about religion and war and the sin to kill always trips people up

[boredmuskoxen]

@R3TU4NmyP13 I dunno, I've read through a lot of history and I always found that economics had a much larger role in civil unrest than religion.

[henshinman]

@R3TU4NmyP13 yes while there "Holy books" say killing is a sin, but there are passages even in the same page that say it is perfectly acceptable to kill as long it is for there god or if kill a woman, offspring, others, or even a slave just for going against said individual(usually male mind you), and that is the tip of the ice burg when it comes to the atrocities these "holy books" are contradictory about

[krazykinkykat]

i agree with him. i doubt that's what carrol was saying, but it's a very good example, lol

i think i'm going to use this as my monologue in an acting class

[PeaceLoveandPeru]

Really love that. Well spoken Matt Damon. I actually believe the same thing. Organized religion holds back human as a race.

It makes us afraid and timid of the reality we should be seeking.

[darkservantofheaven]

I agree spirituality offers so much more freedom than religion itself, there is nothing wrong with the beleif anything really, yet when its orginized how ever, it kinda makes things difcicult

[klausweasley]

You do realize that this is the technical "bad guy" talking?

[ltgnerd]

Uh, just becasue he is trying to crap on "God" that makes him the bad guy? GO back and watch the whole thing again and think about every moment in the opposite way you would normally. That will serve a dual purpose: you might learn that everything you were taught and blinding accepted as fact about religion is crap (not that this was Smith's intent) and you will pay homage to George Costanza.

[ltgnerd]

try "well spoken Kevin Smith". I love Matt Damon but he had nothing to do with the authorship of said piece of classic moviedom.

[sarahscoots]

@PeaceLoveandPeru you don't believe, you have an idea!

hahahhaha

[HistoryLubber]

@PeaceLoveandPeru How does organized religious hold back the human race? Organized religion fomented the advancement of the human race during the Renaissance. If organized religion is holding the human race back, why aren't all the Churches murdering every freethinker or scientist on the planet? -- Yeah, probably because it doesn't.

[EpicBeard815]

@PeaceLoveandPeru you do realize that its a joke, right?

Not trying to argue with the principle of it, just saying

[franknfurterfan666]

@PeaceLoveandPeru im atheist, my girlfriend is catholic. if only it were this easy to deconvert someone our relationship wouldnt be failing right now.

[AkiraBrahe]

@franknfurterfan666 I was on almost the same situation a time ago, It can´t possibly work, is easier for you to self-lobotomize and embrace all the repressive dogma and mumbo-jumbo ceremonies than for a truly believer to leave a church, on women is even worse, the Catholic tenants are perfect to reduce the sex as its minimum expression, raise many kids and keep you on a marriage where you are a money provider and little more, three of the highest aspirations o a lot of women...so, good luck pal

[MourningStarLucifer]

That poor nun. She had no chance.

[Darkpaladin36]

@MourningStarLucifer lol no she didn't.

[omfgzhax]

^_^

[palitodepan123]

hahah i never thought it like that either xD

haha i think Carroll didnt want to make any sense in anything he wrote but i love how people see what they want to see in it :P

[GoodGamesrlikemovies]

oh trust me... if you look through the story he leaves meaning far from normal comprehention

[Zman737]

Lol, i show my mom who is a pastor this scene all the time.

[darrouken]

what does your mom say?

[NYbookworm17]

i love this scene!