This video left out a pretty key word there at the end. My copy of the Tractatus anyway, says, "MY (the missing key word in this video) MY propositions are elucidatory in this way: he who understands me finally recognizes them as senseless, when he has climbed out through them, on them, over them."
I think that's a pretty worthwhile distinction.
It's not that ALL propositions are senseless. Contingent propositions are the ONLY ones left that have a sense--truth derivation--of the world; truth
I guess Wittgenstein in Tractatus was slightly closer to Truth than in Investigations. Of course, this difference can be nullified by the fact that both are infinitely apart from Truth.
@RalphColmar Truth cannot be a tautology if it is to say anything at all; that is, if "truth" has any value at all.
In logic, there are THREE types of statements; Contingent statements, Tautologies, and Contradictions. The tautology and contradiction are equal in that they say Nothing.
"Truth" ONLY refers to the value of "T" in a contingent statement; meaning, whether or not the proposition is in argreement with the atomic facts. If it isn't in agreement, we say false; if it is; TRUTH
@McTheaven No no no... In the Investigations, he is critiquing the Tractatus! He abondons the Picture analogy and opts instead for the Tool Analogy-- words acquire their meaning through USE, rather than Standing For Objects.
The Tractatus is regarded as not as important as his posthumously published work, Philosophical Investigations. Ol' Ludwig eventually abandons his Picture Theory of Language, and instead calls language a "Form of Life"; a language-game-- THIS was his biggest accomplishment
Did i say anything about you having to accept them?
Did i even make an argument?
I'm simply saying, Wittgenstein's greatest contribution to philosophy and a meaning theory of language isn't said to be found in the Tractatus, but rather the PI. You seemed to imply that the the former was closer to the "Truth" than was the latter.
I AM here to point the fact that that is not the case for the great majority of philosophers. Only the logical positivists wouldve agree with on that
@Wittgensteinism Well, I was absolutely serious when I said the previous comment. In fact , I've recently come to discover the real value of PI, and I did believe what you'd said is quite correct. I am quite disappointed that the philosophical intuitions in PI are not fairly appreciated by many contemporary philosophers in metaphysics. They seem to regard PI only as an objection to the possibility of metaphysics, which I do not think is the integral message of Witt.
Starkes Licht!
PhilosophusMansisses 1 year ago
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This video left out a pretty key word there at the end. My copy of the Tractatus anyway, says, "MY (the missing key word in this video) MY propositions are elucidatory in this way: he who understands me finally recognizes them as senseless, when he has climbed out through them, on them, over them."
I think that's a pretty worthwhile distinction.
It's not that ALL propositions are senseless. Contingent propositions are the ONLY ones left that have a sense--truth derivation--of the world; truth
Wittgensteinism 2 years ago
Comment removed
Wittgensteinism 2 years ago
I guess Wittgenstein in Tractatus was slightly closer to Truth than in Investigations. Of course, this difference can be nullified by the fact that both are infinitely apart from Truth.
McTheaven 2 years ago
Truth can only be a tautology or contradiction.
The mystery of the world is that it is regardless of what is true or false.
RalphColmar 2 years ago
@RalphColmar Truth cannot be a tautology if it is to say anything at all; that is, if "truth" has any value at all.
In logic, there are THREE types of statements; Contingent statements, Tautologies, and Contradictions. The tautology and contradiction are equal in that they say Nothing.
"Truth" ONLY refers to the value of "T" in a contingent statement; meaning, whether or not the proposition is in argreement with the atomic facts. If it isn't in agreement, we say false; if it is; TRUTH
Wittgensteinism 2 years ago
I guess that is a just unfounded theory.
tautology and contradiction do not guide us to anywhere.
Truths are not either tautology or contradiction, but some normal proposition which fits the world.
McTheaven 2 years ago
@McTheaven No no no... In the Investigations, he is critiquing the Tractatus! He abondons the Picture analogy and opts instead for the Tool Analogy-- words acquire their meaning through USE, rather than Standing For Objects.
The Tractatus is regarded as not as important as his posthumously published work, Philosophical Investigations. Ol' Ludwig eventually abandons his Picture Theory of Language, and instead calls language a "Form of Life"; a language-game-- THIS was his biggest accomplishment
Wittgensteinism 2 years ago
I may personally agree to your conclusion.
But your argument is too weak.
You are saying that..
1) Wittgenstein THOUGHT that Investigations is a greater achievement that Tractatus.
2) Many philosophers THINK the same thing.
Now, why do I have to accept these evaluations from Wittgenstein himself and from other philosophers?
McTheaven 2 years ago
@McTheaven
Did i say anything about you having to accept them?
Did i even make an argument?
I'm simply saying, Wittgenstein's greatest contribution to philosophy and a meaning theory of language isn't said to be found in the Tractatus, but rather the PI. You seemed to imply that the the former was closer to the "Truth" than was the latter.
I AM here to point the fact that that is not the case for the great majority of philosophers. Only the logical positivists wouldve agree with on that
Wittgensteinism 2 years ago
@Wittgen
I see your point and I think I was wrong.
Your last comment is too perfect to be criticized.
McTheaven 2 years ago
@McTheaven I'm not sure if that was sarcasm (because of my grammatical errors) or whether you were being serious.
If it was sarcasm (and god help me if it was....) it went below my radar.
Wittgensteinism 2 years ago
@Wittgensteinism Well, I was absolutely serious when I said the previous comment. In fact , I've recently come to discover the real value of PI, and I did believe what you'd said is quite correct. I am quite disappointed that the philosophical intuitions in PI are not fairly appreciated by many contemporary philosophers in metaphysics. They seem to regard PI only as an objection to the possibility of metaphysics, which I do not think is the integral message of Witt.
McTheaven 1 year ago
The Object of philosophy is the clarrification of thought :-)
Hope your insanity is only temporary :-)
Thanks for you comment and favouriting :-)
Seasons Greetings & Best Wishes
RalphColmar 3 years ago 2
beautiful, now my insanity just deepens
swingdocta 3 years ago
thanks.
erhanezer 3 years ago