Coulter vs Carville on Health Care (Supposedly)

[TheArmy19D]

I love how now people don't need to have any responsibility for their own lives. Smoke all you want, eat all you want, drink all you want, do as many drugs as you want. The government will take care of you. Do you want to weigh 500 pounds? You dont ever feel like finding a job? Go right ahead, the people that pay taxes and have jobs will pay for all your meds and life saving surgery! This country is fucked.

[herbs814]

@aceflashheart

"Universal" healthcare is a tyrannical means to limit and control the people. "universal" healthcare is EVIL. America is far better for not being subjected to the TYRANNY of "universal" healthcare.

[aceflashheart]

Are you stupid?

Offering healthcare to the poorest people in society = evil?

[herbs814]

@aceflashheart

Where does the government get the resources to "offer" healthcare to others? It STEALS it from those who have actually earned it.

Stealing is evil. Government healthcare is stealing. Government healthcare is evil. It's obvious.

Private healthcare alone is moral.

Government healthcare is evil.

[aceflashheart]

Taxes are not stealing. They are your responsiblity to the goverment that protects you and enforces the law - laws made by democratically elected politicians.

If you don't like that - you have the power to vote against it, but stop your whining about 'stealing'.

[TylerNull]

"Taxes are not stealing."

Killing is not murdering -- see, I can do it too.

Instead of proselytizing your rancid political theology, try thinking.

Taxing (and killing) are sometimes stealing (and murdering). THOUGHT is required to DISCRIMINATE between the two.

There are but SEVENTEEN ENUMERATED POWERS under which the federal government has any shred of legitimacy to either tax or spend.

Most of what they do so for isn't any of the 17. Thus it's theft, and worse, and all are High Crimes.

[aceflashheart]

"THOUGHT is required to DISCRIMINATE between the two."

And it's very easy to do the thinking. If a goverment is legitimatly elected by the people, when it enacts taxation it is not stealing.

"

There are but SEVENTEEN ENUMERATED POWERS under which the federal government has any shred of legitimacy to either tax or spend."

Urban myth, like the 16th amendment never being verified. The laws are massivly complicated and not easy for a layman to understand without study (as you've demonstrated).

[TylerNull]

No, the US Constitution isn't a "myth", urban or otherwise. Nor is it "complicated", contrary to the claims of socialists and other enemies of America. Article 1 Section 8. (It's written in English.)

"if ... legitimately elected" -- your notion of government infallibility is the seed to all the worst horrors recorded in history.

Leaning on your fascist notion for a second time, as you just did, to proselytize the same debunked lie, as you just did, is certainly "easy", but lacks thought.

[aceflashheart]

You're the enemy of America, the ones who will reject the authority of those legimitatly elected by the majority because they don't agree with the policies, and propagate these myths that the U.S. Goverment is using powers it doesn't have the legal right to.

I don't say this because i'm a particular fan of authority - only because I think it's important that we live in reality, and not propagate these lies.

[TylerNull]

Your politics are divorced from reality.

Again, it is the US CONSTITUTION, not individuals who "don't agree", that prohibits your federal deities from taxing & spending on the bulk for which they currently tax & spend. Thus, they are racketeering.

For several posts now you've demonstrated the rejection of reason REQUIRED of your politics. And your doctrine of gov't infallibility continues to impress ...

"... reject the authority of ..."

Once elected, your politician/diety can do no wrong?

[aceflashheart]

There are more laws in the united states than just the constitution. There are also many other documents signed around that time, almost as important, that set precident for law making. Not to mention hundreds of individuals bills - all of which must be painstakingly sifted through when making news laws.

This massive complexity is part of why we need a small army of lawyers and beurocrats in Washington to make sure what the goverment does is legal.

[aceflashheart]

When you say: "it is the US CONSTITUTION, not individuals who "don't agree", that prohibits your federal deities from taxing & spending on the bulk for which they currently tax & spend"

This isn't true, it's just that - while you may have read the U.S. constitution in it's entireity (doubtful) you're never touched on the mountains of other legal documents.

[TylerNull]

"There are more laws ...than just the constitution" -- none of which have a shred of legitimacy unless they lie within the scope of the US Constitution.

Your politics reject the structure of our republic, AND that it has one. Consequently, your politics forbid acknowledging systemic corruption. Creepier still is your recurring notion REQUIRING a pack of unbounded federal deities lording over us all to mandate ANYTHING they whim ... Fannie Mayhem, Gov't Controlled Weather, ...

Liberal Fascism

[aceflashheart]

No, you're just deliberatly trying to fail to understand my point so you can point the finger and shout "fascist!".

You're claiming the goverment is acting illegally, and you are wrong. Not wrong "we disagree", wrong - incorrect wrong.

My politics aren't the ones rejecting the laws of the rebublic, you're the one who lives in a world where laws only matter when they agree with your position (a better description of a fascist).

For a 'patriot' you seem to have little regard for democracy.

[TylerNull]

The US Constitution isn't a "claim".

And by the US Constitution, your politics ARE "the ones rejecting the laws of the republic".

Worse yet, you reject that from which all other laws derive their legitimacy, as I just explained to you.

Again you bitterly cling to your exposed ignorance, as if your mindlessly recitals of Democrat mythology could somehow change what they are -- they don't.

This isn't about patriotism. It's about lucidity.

[aceflashheart]

At this point we continue to go about in circles because there is nothing more I can say.

If you think i'm wrong and you're right - go find a lawyer and prosecute the goverment. Or write to your congressman and tell him that you're spotted a breach of the constitution that every constitutional lawyer in America has missed.

See how well you do...

[TylerNull]

Now we can add "systemic corruption" to the growing list of concepts you fail to grasp.

As an aside, your latest attempt to prevent reality from seeping into your politics included the specious claim that "every constitutional lawyer in America" agrees with your lunacy.

They don't.

[aceflashheart]

"Now we can add "systemic corruption" to the growing list of concepts you fail to grasp."

Yes, a goverment so corrupt that the legistlation that it tried to pass on corporate free speach was overturned by the supreme court.

So corrupt that the bill it's trying to pass has been constantly delayed by the second elected body (with fairly underhanded tactics may i add), and now looks like it may not pass.

If this is a dictatorship it's a pretty shitty one.

[TylerNull]

Mocking your own "dictatorship" straw-man wasn't much of a rebuttal.

From the ponzi-type scheme of so-called Social Security, to the fascist institutions at the epicenter of this Fannie Meltdown, to the bastard breeding programs that ensnare countless millions into endless generations of poverty and violence, there isn't a shred of legitimacy to any of them.

Thus, it's federal racketeering.

The fact that not every event evidences systemic corruption isn't much of an argument for your denials.

[aceflashheart]

It wasn't mocking. Just pointing out what any idiot should be able to comprehend - how can you accuse the goverment of being able to bypass the law while -at the very same time- you're making that accusation, the laws of the constitution are acting to prevent their policies. Pretty weak (and stupid) position to hold, no?

[TylerNull]

The reasoning mind can only comprehend what is intelligible. Your last post, especially, isn't.

[aceflashheart]

"Liberals abhor liberty because it has commensurate & inseparable responsibilities."

No. What we understand, that rich conservatives and those that they manipulate don't, is that the there are more reasons that people are poor than simply "being lazy".

A free society has to not limit peoples oppertunities just because they were not born with rich parents. The goverment can be a tool to bring this about, and help level the playing field.

[aceflashheart]

But hell - you complain about strawmen when you're such a slavering devotee of Ann Coulter, the queen of misrepresenting people arguments, and being, in general, fairly dishonest and inaccurate.

You should check out "a conversation between Al Franken and Ann Coulter" for just one (of many) examples of how Ann Coulter distorts the truth to demonise her opponants.

I get the feeling though, that you're more intrested on blaming Liberals for everything that actually educating yourself however.

[TylerNull]

"... rich conservatives ... rich parents"

And there it is -- class warfare. And it doesn't matter how many tiimes, or in how many ways Democrat party lies are debunked. They own the largest, richest labor price-fixing cartel in human history, the teachers' unions, so they just proselytize their toxic political mysticism to new generations of everyone's children, and churn out endless batches of ignorant dupes, year after year.

George Soros much?

[aceflashheart]

The Democrats have done many stupid and bad things in their time. I'm no fan of NAFTA just to name one example.

However they also gave us the new deal, the civil rights act, and soon universal health care and civil unions for gay couples.

The Democrats in their own flawed way, work to make life better for a lot of people.

In your stupidy you'd want to return Americans to the crushing poverty and inequity of the 1920's.

[TylerNull]

The so-called "New Deal" was unconstitutional. Almost all its laws were repealed after that Democrat president-for-life died, which was the only way we were ever going to get our nation back from the fascist. The residual that is bankrupting our nation is that to which I referred earlier as perfect examples of lawless taxing and spending.

I.e., Fannie Fascism & Social Stupidity.

The Civil Rights Act passed by 80% Republican vote, but only 60% Democrat.

You keep proselytizing myths and lies.

[aceflashheart]

"The Civil Rights Act passed by 80% Republican vote, but only 60% Democrat."

This is a perfect example of how you don't live in reality. Yes the percentage of votes are correct: but at that time the Democrats controlled most of congress (especially the south). Those Democratic politicians that voted against the bll were mostly conservative, southern Democrats, those Republicans who voted for it were northern liberals.

Just for example, Barry goldwater called it a "communist plot."

[TylerNull]

@aceflashheart

Smearing Democrat party stink on the opposition by invoking the word "conservative" fails to change the historical record of which you attempted to rewrite.

Again, your politics are divorced from reality -- and now we see your mythology is purposeful. Even Democrats are aware of the toxicity of their policies.

What's more notable is that even when you are caught lying, all you do is spew a fresh wad of mythology.

Proselytize your depraved politics elsewhere.

[aceflashheart]

"As an aside, your latest attempt to prevent reality from seeping into your politics included the specious claim that "every constitutional lawyer in America" agrees with your lunacy."

Well there's always some crazies (Coulter actually studied law, though she lost the two most important cases in her life) -I don't think we'll see the supreme court overturning a health care bill passed by congress any time soon.

[TylerNull]

Spewing derision at those who prove you wrong doesn't change the fact that you're wrong.

[aceflashheart]

Just saying "you're wrong" doesn't make me wrong. That's why we have courts to put forward an argument that can be attacked or defended. If you think healthcare is unconstituional - defeat it in court. Don't just throw your hands up and go "Oh I would, but the court might not agree with my opinion - therefore it's not a valid court."

It's the same line of reasonaing that goes: unbiased news = stories that make Republicans look good and Democrats bad.

[TylerNull]

You claimed everyone agrees with you and then you named one who doesn't.

In other words, you are my proof that you are wrong. I thought such would be transparently obvious to you since you were the one to disprove yourself.

[aceflashheart]

You're changing the subject - the point I was making about Scott Brown was that: if the system doesn't work, why are Republicans cheering his election?

I never said everyone in the country agrees with Universal healthcare - only that your argument that it's unconstituional is wrong, and your arguments "those who disagree are currupt" is paranoia. A very selective paranoia since you're mistrust of goverment only seems to apply to Democrats.

[aceflashheart]

And i'd just like to add - for a guy that's so obviously a Republican voter, isn't a bit ironic to complain about "systemic corruption", and "undermining the constitution" when the president who supended habius corpus and underminded the 4th amendment to them point of redundency was Republican president George Bush, leading a Republican congress.

I couldn't find any videos on your channel complaining about that... once again, if one if us isn't living in reality it's not me.

[TylerNull]

Now we can add "warfare" to the growing list of concepts you fail to grasp. Oh, and what's the word you wrongly leaned on earlier -- oh, yeah -- PRECEDENT.

[aceflashheart]

Haha! Now there's a fascist concept: (an orwellian concept too) A war against a tactic that requires we surrender all of our freedoms to big brother goverment.

Liberal: Give me liberty or give me death.

Conservative: Oh please take my liberties, just make sure I don't get hurt.

As for the rest: I concede that my spelling is as bad as your arguments.

[TylerNull]

Your first straw-man, above, was "dictatorship". Now you invent a wad of such contrivances for yourself to mock.

That, as they say, is "all you".

Also, you shamelessly smear the stink of Liberal Fascism on those who notice. Liberals want "big-brother" to subsidize and lord over everyone's life, from collecting their mother's vaginal exam info' to monitoring her carbon residue. Liberals abhor liberty because it has commensurate & inseparable responsibilities. Liberals are depraved, giggler.

[aceflashheart]

In what way were they invented? Why are you conservative types celebrating the Scott Brown win? Because that 41'st Senate vote actually represents something important. Because the goverment does not have the power, without those votes to enact it's will. In other words the system is working.

But you won't be satisfied until the system doesn't even allow the issue to be brought up by the goverment! Irregardless of the will of the people and how (and who) they voted for.

[TylerNull]

You began with an election-based idiocy where, upon election, a politician is deified by the magic wand of your political mysticism, making them infallible thereafter. Sort of returning there now, you claim the mere act of Conservatives having hope disproves the systemic corruption I detailed; magically legitimizes the tens of trillions of dollars in lawless taxing & spending over the decades. It's technically wrong to suggest your reasoning is flawed, only because you don't offered any.

NONE.

[aceflashheart]

No, you're just misrepresenting what i'm saying (the coulter). I never said "infallible" - only that their election gives them legitimate powers to make changes and levy taxation AS DEFINED BY THE CONSTITUTION!

No amount of hillbilly inacurracy about what powers the goverment doesn't have will change that.

I've offered plenty of reasoning, it's just that you live in Narnia, where the obviously apparent doesn't apply if you don't agree with it.

[TylerNull]

"... being elected gives them ..."

Again, for more times than I care to count, you regress back to you elected-idiocy to demonstrate your immaculate ignorance of our republic.

And again, in more ways than I care to count, I will explain it to you once more. Being elected does not grant authority to violate the constitutional limits of government.

Reciting your infallibility doctrine for your elected deities ad nauseam doesn't make it any less lunatic.

[aceflashheart]

"Being elected does not grant authority to violate the constitutional limits of government."

I'm not disputing that. But providing healthcare -is- within those constitutional powers. And falling back on the constitution is irrelevant if whenever the courts disagree with you, you just write them off as 'corrupt'.

It's a get out of jail free card where the constitution becomes only what you interpret it to be, and goverments are only legitimate if you voted for them.

[Birwapa]

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[herbs814]

@aceflashheart

Taxes ARE stealing. The government is responsible to the people, not the people to the government. The fact that government is levying taxes for UNCONSTITUTIONAL expenditures like healthcare or education proves that the government is illegitimate and it is the right of the people to "alter or abolish" the government.

[aceflashheart]

And here we have a terrorist -slash- arbortion clinic bomber in progress.

I wonder if you'll provide the court ruling that healthcare is unconstitutional before or after you find Barack Obama's Kenyan birth cirtificate?

As an aside, I think as a rule i'm going to start ignoring anyone who makes a point of mentioning that Barack Obama's sirname is 'Hussein' as if it proves something.

[herbs814]

The CONSTITUTION shows that it is unconstitutional for the federal government to intrude into healthcare. It is immoral and unconstitutional for the federal government to buy votes with other people's money using healthcare as a lame EXCUSE to justify their THEFT..

[wsbright100]

@aceflashheart

Germany Pop: 81,000,000

France Pop: 65,000,000

UK Pop: 61,000,000

Canada: 34,000,000

Israel Pop: 7,500,000

USA Pop: 309,000,000

The US has over 3.5 times the amount of people as the highest (Germany) number on your list. How does the gov't expect to pay for that? The US debt is rediculous. Adding a single payer health care system right now would only add to the fire. We need to get our debt under control - then start spending massive amounts.

[aceflashheart]

Well... yeah the US has 3.5 times as many people as Germany. Ofc it will also collect at least 3.5 times as much tax - that's how you pay for it.

Part of the reason the US debt is so how is the stupid amount Americans spend on health care. About 16% of your GDP goes into health care, compared to about 8% of the UK.

Health care reforms should (in theory) reduce the deficit.

[curlybobz]

Lex Luther with southern accent.

[decisionview]

The only one frustrated in this video is James Carville. What a HYPOCRITE!!!

[return135]

James Carville: "the stimulus is working and every economist in the world agrees" ??!!? How can he say that with a straight face when its obviously not even close to being true? What a left wing nut.

[TylerNull]

How?

One of the perks of being baseless is shamelessness.

[KinglyNumbaOne]

I understand that most liberal pundits are moronic sophists, but Carville is a rank idiot. Carville has no analysis on any political issue, rather, he just spins the topic to something else of ZERO relevance. This guy is a dweeb, and it is unfathomable why he still invited to debate on prominent shows.

[mrscorie]

How does the party that wishes for medicare to go away make the argument that they care about rationing care.

[herbs814]

MediScare is a bludgeon the demoncrats use to SCARE seniors. Seniors would get MORE healthcare if MediScare was privatized. Anyone who cares about justice would say that MediScare should be privatized.

[mrscorie]

That's a good argument if that is the alternative. I can go for that.

[PrayingForDaylight]

OH MY GOD! I didn't know zombies could talk! Carville looks like a freak! Are we sure he didn't die and someone reanimated his corpse with black magic? LOL LOL

[gmaniac1]

Well without the insults, Coulter as usual won the argument over Carville, she always does.  The reason is real simple. She doesn't ever deflect the issue like Carville does. First of all, the stimulus is not working nor part of the discussion. Secondly, health care in regards to anything but trauma in this country is the best hands down.

[thedecider1984]

carville a fucking not

[josh3103]

James Carvile is spot on.

[DoctorMurky]

Goddamn. James Carville is fuckin crazy.

[MargaritasAntesPorco]

@2:58:

Carville: "...and the Washington Post, which she so elegantly cites,..."

Carville dood, you mean ELOQUENT. not ELEGANT, for crying out loud. There's a difference...

James Carville-- Not merely butt ugly...

[TylerNull]

Good catch. I didn't notice that one.

A few more dozen of those and he'll start to sound like Justice Sonia "La Raza" Sotomayor, who confuses "providence" with "province", "story of knowledge" with "store of knowledge", and "eminent" with "imminent".

[VivaChe0bama]

Carville reminds me of "Baghdad Bob"

[wildcardlx]

Wow Coulter CRUSHED him badly. I love Coulter, even if she isn't the most polite of Republicans.

[billyboy630]

Coulter has mnore brains her in her skinny boney finger then Carville has in his whole bald head.

Props to GMA and Cuomo for taking it too Carville a bit, highly unusual

[opchidexio]

Carville, a political strategist, is chanting the mantra that conservatives don't have a problem with socialized (crappy) medicine but , rather, they are just frustrated by constant defeats at the (rigged) elections. Huh? I think Carville is a lying bastard from Hell. How about you?

[Moragauth]

Haha this guy is an idiot. He's right, the person is frustrated because they are losing out.. to a scam.

[phillipgaley]

yeah, . . . Carville's kind of an old rummy, . . . I dunno, . . . I've always felt kind of sorry for him; but, Ann Coulter, . . . wow, what ! a woman--ay?

[bigbad169]

What amazes most people is that a host on a mainstream media outlet like GMA is not totally in the bag with Liberals. he actually let the debate take it's own course instead of steering it to Liberal talking points. Carville was there to try and say that republicans are mad because they lost the election while coulter was there to talk about healthcare. The host was great and even tried to get Carville to answer a question about healthcare. Coulter wasn't attacked by the host . WTF is with that!

[snorp73]

Tyley, you're such a hero. If Transparency was really a goal of this administration, then Carville at least lived up to it in this "debate."

He was the one with the crabby look on his face and everytime Coulter gave him a dose of facts and logic, he'd say "well, she's frustrated" while sceaming at the host why conservatives are frustrated and ends it with a phony laugh.

Could we get a liberal that will actually talk healthcare?

[snorp73]

Tyler* - Sorry for the typo.

[TylerNull]

Well noted snorp, Carville truly did "live up to it".

[pelepup]

If people don't start looking at issues instead of relying on racists comments to deflect their lack of intelligence. Why not use what we have to offer insurance to the underinsured. Medicare, medicaid and social security have been so well run that they always overrun their budget. Is ay use that money as vouchers for people to buy insurance. this will create more competition which will lead to lower prices. Free Markets...they work.

[JMcH]

These clowns cannot directly address Obamacare, can they? The Democratic game plan is to dodge the issue and smear everyone who opposes it even though people who voted for Obama are now opposing his health care plan.

[herbs814]

Only clowns would ever support something as foolish as socialized medicine. The only moral system is private healthcare. Which is why only private healthcare is effective, despite government's best efforts to sabotage the private sector.

[rrangel81]

If you believe in god, all us liberals are just trying to get you there a little faster. But, I think it's true you guys don't like a darky running the country. Don't forget this healthcare plan is public option, meaning you do not have to sign up for it.

[LizzyxDarcy]

If you believe that, rrangel81, it's time to drink the Kool-ade.

[rrangel81]

How am I wrong, tell me.

[TylerNull]

How are your right, tell me.

Deluding yourself that your baseless decree & mindless recital of a government slogan hold merit all by themselves is just silly.

And is it too much to ask that you refrain from race hustling and smearing your racist stink on others?

The Democrats' toxic party is the proud home of all racist hate groups, from the KKK to La Raza, and they always were.

All racist groups are sponsored by Democrat organizations, & fomented in Democrat-controlled universities.

[poopacaboose]

You are right on the fact that it is a public option, but when it comes to companies and unions are supplying health care, they also have the option to put their employees on obama care- forcing them to take it. As for the whole race thing, you can't escape racism- by that i mean, yes, there are racists in the Republican party; however, there are racists in all parties- especially the prominent one- the democrats. Why do you still think that if you disagree with him- YOU"RE RACIST!

[rrangel81]

it's not forcing when a majority of people will chooes this option due to ho much cheaper it is, when they don't have to pay quotas and bonus and advertising. And republicans carry more hate towards minorities never ageeing wiht them when racist shit happens. Thats why they will continue to lose elections.

[Moragauth]

ROFL It is forcing if it is financed by taxes, darling, whether the beneficiaries pay them directly or not. Why, let's nationalise everything to do away with advertising! So tedious...

This is just mindless regurgitation. Nothing original... or factual.

[TylerNull]

"...on the fact that it is a public option..."

It's creeping me out to watch so many people recite mindless slogans, and take them as holy writ, even after the political hustlers who generate them have already been caught in nested labyrinths of such lies.

"

It's Not An Option

... an "uh-oh" moment when reading the House's "health care for all Americans" bill. Right there on Page 16 is a provision making individual private medical insurance ILLEGAL.

"

-- ibd

[herbs814]

"public option" is a dishonest way for the government to steal from and sabotage the private sector. "private option" is a trojan horse to destroy the private health system that works to fund a government vote-buying scheme with other people's money.

[PrayingForTheSun]

the guy looks like one of those zombies in one of those cheap horror films.

[poopacaboose]

he looks more like skeletor from heman

[PrayingForTheSun]

LOL!! that is great!

[LiberalshateAmerica]

obama lied, Granny died!

[LizzyxDarcy]

I love Ann Coulter. LOL! "You sound a little frustrated yourself, Jim. He didn't like that.

Carville is such a slime ball.

[jimmymckay73]

i agree whole heartedly . the guy even looks creepy .

[LizzyxDarcy]

He sure does.