What kind of Christians have you been talking to? If they think that you are a "Hitler worshipper" they probably are delusional. Christianity is not about blowing up people who don't believe what we do. Religion should be a choice for everyone, we're not robots. But, I do agree with you that only one is the right one. You need to decide that for yourself and honestly dude, is it worth being wrong?
@hinzahyuna Thanks for watching. Atheism as a stand point is on the rise in the world, and it's never too late to step up and say what you think out loud. Speak your mind and defend your opinions with strong arguments and others will respect you. For those who don't, well, screw 'em.
i think it will be more of atheist world much less than 200 years i think less then 3 years to 5 years
if it were an atheist world then, there would be not much of a point of a NWO from what been said up to now, by people just fighting and killing over religious beliefs
These guys get told that "evil" is "where God is not".
So by that thinking, all Atheists are Godless so are therefore evil.
And the fundies never question that so feel justified in their hatred.
One criticism, science doesnt "prove" anything. It just tries to explain natural phenomena. We dont have proof, but we have vast amounts of evidence to support Evolution.
By contrast, creationists have nothing but an ancient book written when people didnt know how stuff worked.
Simply escape from your own parochialism and examine Sweden closely. Your answers are there. Sweden is 87% atheist at the last survey and the numbers are growing fast.
Scandinavia as a whole is a good example.
The evidence of atheism's benefits are already presented for your approval.
Scandinavia also includes Norway and I can assure you Norway isnt as secular as many are led to believe.Until 2005 Norway`s head of state was a Lutheran Pastor.(Kjell Magne Bondevik) Norway is one the most heavily regulated countries in Europe.Much of it due to the influence of conservative religious organizations. If anything there is a religious renaissance happening in Norway and a revival of youth attending churches all across Norway. Norway secular? No way.
Read my words again. I said that "Scandinavia as a whole ..."
Not once did I mention Norway as a specific.
Read before you leap.
I don't have the demographics for Norway to hand but I seem to recall that it is one of those Western European countries that sits at the head of the list of the most atheistic globally.
If, as you claim, Norway is returning to the Dark Ages, then I'm sorry for you.
And Sweden has among the fastest growing Muslim population in Europe.The traditional christian religions there have dwindled but as the population ages there,its understandable. Most swedes hold a lukewarm belief in "something",but Swedish people on a whole have a neutral way of thinking towards issues like this. They wont make a fuss over something and will generally try to avoid being opinionated too much.
"Sweden has among the fastest growing Muslim population in Europe."
And that's going to be one of their major problems before too long. Just like the Netherlands. As I understand it, the major demographic concerning crime in Sweden shows clearly that is that committed by immigrant muslims.
Be very aware of the potential of allowing religion to escalate, particularly islam, the most dangerous virus currently affecting humanity.
Religion is a poison, especially to the young mind.
I think your on the right track! But I believe that most religious leaders are atheists and are there only for the power of being able to have war or to take control of territory or anything we actually go to war for. I believe that if we all were you world we would still have war but maybe for a more honest reason or at least the reason would be more truthful than a lie about reasoning. But that step is one i would take!
lets be honest, in real life there is no such thing as a religious war, there are always government or economical reasons behind it. and also, when was the last time a religeous leader,(real religeous leader) like the pope said "i dont like you now, everyone kill him." was it like 600-700 years ago, give or take 100 years. in fact most religeous leaders are very peaceful now, did a christian declare war on islam when that guy shot pope JP the 2nd, no he forgave him & we mover on. BUT i dont know
meh. you still watched it. if you want vids where I dont even appear on cam then go to the RationalSkepticsSoc youtube account. I have a few there with other people.
I don't think the world would be such a utopia if religion didn't exist. We have to remember that religion is man-made, so all the "bad" bits that exist in it, and that you seem to think influence people to do bad things, came from humanity itself. Believe me, I'm not trying to defend religion, but we would not suddenly become perfect beings without religion. Also, you seem to overgeneralize on a LOT of things in this video.
Your point is fair torres but the idea is that we are moving towards a more perfect society/world. Things like slavery, genecide, torture(?) are things we have mostly left in the past despite having once embraced them.
well one argument i would make is that atheism is on the rise much more so then media or mainstream would let on its growing because the flow of ideas information can no longer be stopped censored as well they can try but all the does is make them yell and yell louder and louder till the idea is herd and a study was done the more educated a person is the least likely they are to believe in god we are moving away from myths and beliefs which is good for all mankind
Well, comparing when you were born to when your life expectancy is... there will be a major difference I believe. Atheists need not live in fear of persecution anymore. Polls taken on percentages of individuals belonging to religions these days are majorly wrong because some still fear revealing their atheism.
I'm for a secular world. I wouldn't recommend atheism for absolutely everyone. There are people out there who absolutely need faith for our crude modern age.
An atheistic world would be boring like Sweden or Norway, some of the most atheist nations in the world. Isn't it more interesting to see competing religions around the world fight? ;]
Sure it's interesting to watch a fight of sorts. But there's a fine line between entertainment fighting such as a boxing match, and the type of fighting where one side wants the other dead. In the case of religion, it teaches hate and fear where there should be love and compassion.
Some will argue that's not the purpose of religion. Originally maybe that was not religions true intentions but let it fall into the hands of corrupt humans who have blind followers... now we have a problem.
You know, maybe I'd like to make up my own religion one day like Joseph Smith. I mean if the majority of human beings will be dumb anyways, shouldn't we rake the advantages of that? Hell, maybe one day I'll even have my own Mitt Romney.
Religion is often, accepted by the common people as true, refuted by wise men as false, and useful to politicians and kings alike. Since people like us are too smart for religion anyways, I say we use it. :]
very few religions actually teach hate, and guess what? even religions that do teach hate (like say islam), people who follow it that live throughout the world, they dont hate people like jews. my sister is jewish, and her best friend and her boyfriend are muslim. no one takes somthing like that to heart unless they are somehow forced to. people who enforce those things with laws and stuff, those people are obviously mentally ill, its just that they somehow got a following. not religions fault.
I agree and disagree with your first sentence. See, here's how I see it. Religions may not directly teach hate, or to hate someone/thing. However, religious teaching... the stew of thoughts propagated by them has a side reaction in which hate is but unavoidable.
Hate is a by-product of this way of thinking. Now, since this is a foreseeable occurrence, and it does happen. I'd say it's also on purpose.
i think here your less prone to use big words, so ill do it here for a while.
now hate being a side reaction of religion, if we are going with that point, is not exclusive. there are people who hate other people because they like the video game "guitar hero" and not "rock band" i know ive been on the reciving end.
money, are you saying that doesent generate hate. do you thing a gangster shakes hand with bill gate. no he is at home "mother fucka got all the money." in happens in everything.
Yes, I have always felt that all life is equal even when I was a Christian and all my other Christian friends didn't think the same. I have never liked killing life because I always had this thought in my mind (who the hell am I to take this life and put it through this unnecessary pain?).
In my opinion, I think that they are too many ignorant, closed minded, conceited, self-centric people in this world to have a functional atheistic world yet.
Hmm. This may be true. However, I feel this is partially do to the number of closeted Atheists. 3 generations from now should show great improvements.
"The same way an 'amoral' person doesn't concern himself with what is moral or immoral."
They would care if they were about to be punished because they broke someone elses moral code.
Religion has a track record of screwing things up for people within and outwith it's own circles. So, unfortunately, because some atheistic people take a proactive stance - you define that they can't possibly be atheistic, because they have to be apathetic to their surroundings too?
I personally don't care about the details of religion or piety in general, except where they make things difficult for me and/or others. Am I allowed to harbour altruistic tendancies, or would that not be apathetic enough? Should I not care about free-speech, or even freedom of others to do as they please (but always with the caveat that those free actions are not used to limit the free actions of others)? Should I be unconcerned when a someone is killed for violating a religious moral code?
Should I be unconcerned that my own endeavours are open to free criticism (which I readily accept when it bears the hallmarks of intelligence) but when it comes to criticising religious, or more generally: any irrational but strongly held world-view such as that mediums really can speak to the dead, that I should just leave it alone and not hurt peoples feelings? Yet, these are sometimes the same people who revel in their freedom to be critical, often negatively so, of science and technology...
Again, you're using a worldview held by a MINORITY of religious people to judge everyone who believes in god. Atheists do NOT have a monopoly on rational thought. You have to get that through your head, otherwise you're just another philosophical bully. There are plenty of people who believe in god and are perfectly rational human beings with no desire to slaughter infidels or bomb abortion clinics.
"I'd say he [Ken Miller] was a scientist first and foremost. "
Miller would actually disagree with you on that. In his many TV interviews (as well as his books,) he makes it perfectly clear that he is the same person in church as he is in the Laboratory.
"Should I not care about free-speech, or even freedom of others to do as they please."
You've mis-interpreted my use of the word 'apathy.' Let me elaborate..
If you re-read it carefully, you'll see that I was not talking about ignoring religious groups and letting them do whatever they want. That would be social apathy and yes, very dangerous. I was talking about a personal apathy towards the QUESTION: "Does god exist?" Being vigilant of special interest groups has nothing to do with a belief in god. Protesting sexual inequality has nothing to do with a belief in god. So why should it matter whether god exists when you protest these things?
i agree, either we will be wiped out by religious fanatics, wiped out by a disease or virus, or we will prosper and teach ourselves tolerance of one another in all respects.
Chimp colonys have little wars all the time over territory and resources. They don't need a God or even a philosophy to do that. This belief in an atheist utopia is just as absurd as belief in a Christian one. People will still have disagreements and people will still fight over them. The disagreements may be a tad bit more rational, but they can still lead to war.
People with a belief in God are capable of blaming their actions upon his will. Anything to them is justifiyable. Sure, Atheists and Rationalists will disagree from time to time, and wars aren't out of the question. But if someone invades you your going to defend and fight back no matter your presubpositions.
War is always a possibility, just less likey because we don't have 'God'.
"War is always a possibility, just less likey because we don't have 'God'."
Then clarify it! This is why people think Atheism is a religion. Because even atheists act like it is. Extremely generalized statements like: "The war in Iraq probably would have never happened if we were an atheistic world because atheists are very kind people." is the exact same bullshit argument that religious fanatics use. "If everyone were Muslim, then there would be peace."
My true optimism is derived from the apparent trend in society today. That is the sudden boom in atheist numbers in the past decade. Maybe some were in hiding for fear of persecution and ridicule, however, the number of Atheists/ Rationalists is rising fast.
Also I believe with the next few generations of children being highly educated with respect to our parents and their parents... (That is a highschool level education in general.) ...the number of religious people shall decline.
There seems to be a direct correlation b/w population education (higher education) and number of rationalists. So, since a huge number of careers require an university level education these days, I believe the average pop'n IQ will increase and hence people will be more inclined to make intelligent observations about the world.
Shaman and Buddhists may be atheists. So are Taoists and Nihilists, including totalitarians. But what I think you're talking about are empiricists and/or rationalists. You may want to look into that and clarify your distinction.
I can't remember if I said this or not in the vid, it's been a few hours. If not, I'll just say it here. Atheist by means that one doesn't believe/worship in a supreme deity/creator.
If I've got you pegged right, I would bet that you're a rationalist like myself. I think its a better title than merely 'atheist' because there are many belief systems which don't include gods. Rationalism explains WHY you are atheist, and it removes you from the other categories of spirit-worshippers and totalitarians.
Yes, you're right. I tend to label myself as a rationalist. However, when dealing with people of 'faith', they don't care WHAT you call yourself if you don't believe in God.
My reason for being against the term Atheist is because by definition it is a person who denies the existence of God. As to say that God really does exist we just don't care awknowlegde it.
But since God doesn't exist, neither can Atheists, becauseyou can't be in denial of the existence of something wich doesnt exist.
Theists coined the term atheist for the soul purpose of calling them people who deny the obvious existence of God. However, because his existence is anything but obvious.
I'm not denying the existence of anything obvious, if I did I'd be delusional.
Therefore I am against said terminology and prefer to be labeled a Rationalist.
Anyway, this is all very ironic. From your video, it seems you had no problem talking about atheism as this great belief system that could do no wrong.
I'd rather think of it as the contrast. The likelihood of doing less wrong.
There is no confusion, because that's what the definition says. Simple.
Point is, God (not an actual being, but the idea of one) corrupts peoples minds and leads them to do immoral things more frequently in his name.
ME? Now I can't go out murdering people that don't follow my beliefs and say that God told me to do so. I don't have that luxury. I don't want, nor need, nor care for it.
Atheism is not a miracle cure for societal ills - people disagree on much more than religion. However, traits of the religious tend to allow them to be taken advantage of more easily by powerful speakers, or religion is simply an especially effective means to control and exert the wielders power over those easily swayed.
Either way, you have a relatively unthinking mass of people, and power over people is ultimate. What ultimate power can lead to is rather well documented.
The thing is, something does exist, the definition of god has been given by theists, thus we have something to reject. We reject the definition of god by theists - that is what we reject (well, that's what I reject - suppose I shouldn't speak for anyone else ;)
We also explain why we reject it - which has been well trodden by more articulate feet than mine, we have no reason or desire to subject ourselves to mental slavery on no other basis than what some guy expounds.
On the otherhand, you are generally free to listen to or ignore science (though it's often to your direct detriment to remain unknowledgable about the world around you).
Would you decide that fitting a carbon monoxide sensor alarm would not be a good action if you have a gas boiler in your home and that to anyone's best knowledge, carbon monoxide is rather detrimental to ones health, and is also known to be one of the by-products of gas combustion in air?
Which theists? There are a great many different definitions.
"we have no reason or desire to subject ourselves to mental slavery"
Would you call Ken Miller a mental slave? What about donexodus2?
You seem to be lumping ANY belif in god with a fundamentalist belief in god. That sort of generalization makes you antitheist, not atheist. That's fine, but don't confuse the two...
An atheist is someone who has no opinion on the existence of god. One way or another. To them, it's a non-issue. They have better things to worry about so they just don't concern themselves with the question. The same way an 'amoral' person doesn't concern himself with what is moral or immoral.
Gnothi seauton. Know thyself. Are you REALLY apathetic about whether or not there is a god, or are you morally opposed to the belief in god?
Any and all, unless there are some religions which actually have evidence for the pre-supposed super natural?
"Would you call Ken Miller a mental slave?"
No, and I would not really say he was a theist - I'd say he was a scientist first and foremost. And that is how I applied the term theist - to those primarily so in their dealings.
The general consensus seems to not merely equate to "apathy".
"To them, it's a non-issue."
I heartily disagree, I think the atmosphere in America is one good reason why it definitely is an issue. Perhaps you agree with the religious grounds of the oppression of women? That abortion is anti-life? What about the parent's life? What about the life of both if they cannot provide sufficiently? What about rape victims being denied abortion on religious grounds?
I can be morally opposed to what some people do in the name of god or whatever analogue exists in a particular belief system. If there is a god, it's not one that's been documented by any religion thus far. For _practical_ purposes I conclude that no god exists, to do otherwise is irrational as it serves no purpose. Should there be practical reasons/benefits to doing so, then that is a different ballgame. To date I've never seen a practical benefit that wasn't related to power over people.
Hey BlueFalcon,
What kind of Christians have you been talking to? If they think that you are a "Hitler worshipper" they probably are delusional. Christianity is not about blowing up people who don't believe what we do. Religion should be a choice for everyone, we're not robots. But, I do agree with you that only one is the right one. You need to decide that for yourself and honestly dude, is it worth being wrong?
purplepanda12 5 months ago in playlist More videos from TheBlueFalconX
im just really happy that there are other people out there who feel the same way
and to know that im not the only one who thinks there is no god gives me some strength to keep on trying to tell my family. im an ATHEIST!!!!!
hinzahyuna 1 year ago
@hinzahyuna Thanks for watching. Atheism as a stand point is on the rise in the world, and it's never too late to step up and say what you think out loud. Speak your mind and defend your opinions with strong arguments and others will respect you. For those who don't, well, screw 'em.
TheBlueFalconX 1 year ago
Its justa theory (A guess!)
m3anmik3y 1 year ago
well spoken It's crazy when people say we're a threat
YKantLaurenRead88 1 year ago
i think it will be more of atheist world much less than 200 years i think less then 3 years to 5 years
if it were an atheist world then, there would be not much of a point of a NWO from what been said up to now, by people just fighting and killing over religious beliefs
RealityGameWorld 2 years ago
Damn vote bots.....
TheDarkKnight987 2 years ago
Yeah, tell me about it. Fuckers.
TheBlueFalconX 2 years ago
These guys get told that "evil" is "where God is not".
So by that thinking, all Atheists are Godless so are therefore evil.
And the fundies never question that so feel justified in their hatred.
One criticism, science doesnt "prove" anything. It just tries to explain natural phenomena. We dont have proof, but we have vast amounts of evidence to support Evolution.
By contrast, creationists have nothing but an ancient book written when people didnt know how stuff worked.
manchester26m 2 years ago 4
@manchester26m
And that's kinda funny, because, they will flip on a coin and turn on their own statements, because, according to them, god is everywhere ...
tdjdk 2 years ago
Simply escape from your own parochialism and examine Sweden closely. Your answers are there. Sweden is 87% atheist at the last survey and the numbers are growing fast.
Scandinavia as a whole is a good example.
The evidence of atheism's benefits are already presented for your approval.
draagon66 2 years ago
Scandinavia also includes Norway and I can assure you Norway isnt as secular as many are led to believe.Until 2005 Norway`s head of state was a Lutheran Pastor.(Kjell Magne Bondevik) Norway is one the most heavily regulated countries in Europe.Much of it due to the influence of conservative religious organizations. If anything there is a religious renaissance happening in Norway and a revival of youth attending churches all across Norway. Norway secular? No way.
philster61 2 years ago
philster61
Read my words again. I said that "Scandinavia as a whole ..."
Not once did I mention Norway as a specific.
Read before you leap.
I don't have the demographics for Norway to hand but I seem to recall that it is one of those Western European countries that sits at the head of the list of the most atheistic globally.
If, as you claim, Norway is returning to the Dark Ages, then I'm sorry for you.
draagon66 2 years ago
And Sweden has among the fastest growing Muslim population in Europe.The traditional christian religions there have dwindled but as the population ages there,its understandable. Most swedes hold a lukewarm belief in "something",but Swedish people on a whole have a neutral way of thinking towards issues like this. They wont make a fuss over something and will generally try to avoid being opinionated too much.
philster61 2 years ago
philster61
"Sweden has among the fastest growing Muslim population in Europe."
And that's going to be one of their major problems before too long. Just like the Netherlands. As I understand it, the major demographic concerning crime in Sweden shows clearly that is that committed by immigrant muslims.
Be very aware of the potential of allowing religion to escalate, particularly islam, the most dangerous virus currently affecting humanity.
Religion is a poison, especially to the young mind.
draagon66 2 years ago 2
I think your on the right track! But I believe that most religious leaders are atheists and are there only for the power of being able to have war or to take control of territory or anything we actually go to war for. I believe that if we all were you world we would still have war but maybe for a more honest reason or at least the reason would be more truthful than a lie about reasoning. But that step is one i would take!
Chaz7201 3 years ago
lets be honest, in real life there is no such thing as a religious war, there are always government or economical reasons behind it. and also, when was the last time a religeous leader,(real religeous leader) like the pope said "i dont like you now, everyone kill him." was it like 600-700 years ago, give or take 100 years. in fact most religeous leaders are very peaceful now, did a christian declare war on islam when that guy shot pope JP the 2nd, no he forgave him & we mover on. BUT i dont know
guitarheroguy12 2 years ago
nice vid, next time wear a shirt
idolmany2k 3 years ago
meh. you still watched it. if you want vids where I dont even appear on cam then go to the RationalSkepticsSoc youtube account. I have a few there with other people.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
Well we mustn't make the mistake, the atheists like Feuerbach and company did i.e make Man or Humanity the new god.
Mig440 3 years ago
I'm pretty sure HUMAN atheists would know better know to not elect a god to be in place of something that is pointless.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
Well I wasn't talking about electing or anything of that sort, but about having fixed ideas or ideals for how humans should interact with each other.
And it doesn't matter whether we call the ideal Man or Humanity, since these thing are only
qualities not ideals. So in that respect I am against morality
Mig440 3 years ago
I don't think the world would be such a utopia if religion didn't exist. We have to remember that religion is man-made, so all the "bad" bits that exist in it, and that you seem to think influence people to do bad things, came from humanity itself. Believe me, I'm not trying to defend religion, but we would not suddenly become perfect beings without religion. Also, you seem to overgeneralize on a LOT of things in this video.
torresmatt 3 years ago
I never said we'd be perfect beings.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
Your point is fair torres but the idea is that we are moving towards a more perfect society/world. Things like slavery, genecide, torture(?) are things we have mostly left in the past despite having once embraced them.
We can get better...we have the technology :)
Hopeful71 3 years ago
what the fuck is this new trend, "youtubing shirtless"
UltraBibendum 3 years ago 5
3:22 star of david haha you mean pentagram
nocab1984 3 years ago 2
Well, many Muslims don't see a difference...
kaikosuke 3 years ago
well one argument i would make is that atheism is on the rise much more so then media or mainstream would let on its growing because the flow of ideas information can no longer be stopped censored as well they can try but all the does is make them yell and yell louder and louder till the idea is herd and a study was done the more educated a person is the least likely they are to believe in god we are moving away from myths and beliefs which is good for all mankind
laxguy22655 3 years ago 2
Well, comparing when you were born to when your life expectancy is... there will be a major difference I believe. Atheists need not live in fear of persecution anymore. Polls taken on percentages of individuals belonging to religions these days are majorly wrong because some still fear revealing their atheism.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
Seems like 'religionism' is the new racism.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
religion is the cause of racism, hatred, war and well everything negative with mankind or the human race
laxguy22655 3 years ago
Not all racism is caused by religion alone.
LordMalice6d9 3 years ago
no just 99.9999999 % of it
laxguy22655 3 years ago
hmmm, I wouldn't go that far, at least 90%, thats more realistic.
LordMalice6d9 3 years ago
well when you think about it thats where the idea came from for racism
laxguy22655 3 years ago
not christianity silly. God wanted the Gospel to be spread throughout all the land.
jizzy009 3 years ago
your an idiot if you honestly think that.
guitarheroguy12 2 years ago
I'm for a secular world. I wouldn't recommend atheism for absolutely everyone. There are people out there who absolutely need faith for our crude modern age.
An atheistic world would be boring like Sweden or Norway, some of the most atheist nations in the world. Isn't it more interesting to see competing religions around the world fight? ;]
IcyNami 3 years ago
Sure it's interesting to watch a fight of sorts. But there's a fine line between entertainment fighting such as a boxing match, and the type of fighting where one side wants the other dead. In the case of religion, it teaches hate and fear where there should be love and compassion.
Some will argue that's not the purpose of religion. Originally maybe that was not religions true intentions but let it fall into the hands of corrupt humans who have blind followers... now we have a problem.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
You know, maybe I'd like to make up my own religion one day like Joseph Smith. I mean if the majority of human beings will be dumb anyways, shouldn't we rake the advantages of that? Hell, maybe one day I'll even have my own Mitt Romney.
Religion is often, accepted by the common people as true, refuted by wise men as false, and useful to politicians and kings alike. Since people like us are too smart for religion anyways, I say we use it. :]
IcyNami 3 years ago
very few religions actually teach hate, and guess what? even religions that do teach hate (like say islam), people who follow it that live throughout the world, they dont hate people like jews. my sister is jewish, and her best friend and her boyfriend are muslim. no one takes somthing like that to heart unless they are somehow forced to. people who enforce those things with laws and stuff, those people are obviously mentally ill, its just that they somehow got a following. not religions fault.
guitarheroguy12 2 years ago
I agree and disagree with your first sentence. See, here's how I see it. Religions may not directly teach hate, or to hate someone/thing. However, religious teaching... the stew of thoughts propagated by them has a side reaction in which hate is but unavoidable.
Hate is a by-product of this way of thinking. Now, since this is a foreseeable occurrence, and it does happen. I'd say it's also on purpose.
We can continue this at the forum is you'd like?
TheBlueFalconX 2 years ago
i think here your less prone to use big words, so ill do it here for a while.
now hate being a side reaction of religion, if we are going with that point, is not exclusive. there are people who hate other people because they like the video game "guitar hero" and not "rock band" i know ive been on the reciving end.
money, are you saying that doesent generate hate. do you thing a gangster shakes hand with bill gate. no he is at home "mother fucka got all the money." in happens in everything.
guitarheroguy12 2 years ago
well i just looked at the forum so nevermind, apparently you said yes for me.
guitarheroguy12 2 years ago
Great video! I enjoyed it!
Yes, I have always felt that all life is equal even when I was a Christian and all my other Christian friends didn't think the same. I have never liked killing life because I always had this thought in my mind (who the hell am I to take this life and put it through this unnecessary pain?).
-IGBY
ImaginaryGodBlessYou 3 years ago
Thanks a lot!
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
In my opinion, I think that they are too many ignorant, closed minded, conceited, self-centric people in this world to have a functional atheistic world yet.
pwnz1lla69 3 years ago
Hmm. This may be true. However, I feel this is partially do to the number of closeted Atheists. 3 generations from now should show great improvements.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
As long as we don't blow ourselves up, that is.
pwnz1lla69 3 years ago
Well ofcourse all things pending.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
"The same way an 'amoral' person doesn't concern himself with what is moral or immoral."
They would care if they were about to be punished because they broke someone elses moral code.
Religion has a track record of screwing things up for people within and outwith it's own circles. So, unfortunately, because some atheistic people take a proactive stance - you define that they can't possibly be atheistic, because they have to be apathetic to their surroundings too?
oilotnoM 3 years ago
I personally don't care about the details of religion or piety in general, except where they make things difficult for me and/or others. Am I allowed to harbour altruistic tendancies, or would that not be apathetic enough? Should I not care about free-speech, or even freedom of others to do as they please (but always with the caveat that those free actions are not used to limit the free actions of others)? Should I be unconcerned when a someone is killed for violating a religious moral code?
oilotnoM 3 years ago
Should I be unconcerned that my own endeavours are open to free criticism (which I readily accept when it bears the hallmarks of intelligence) but when it comes to criticising religious, or more generally: any irrational but strongly held world-view such as that mediums really can speak to the dead, that I should just leave it alone and not hurt peoples feelings? Yet, these are sometimes the same people who revel in their freedom to be critical, often negatively so, of science and technology...
oilotnoM 3 years ago
Again, you're using a worldview held by a MINORITY of religious people to judge everyone who believes in god. Atheists do NOT have a monopoly on rational thought. You have to get that through your head, otherwise you're just another philosophical bully. There are plenty of people who believe in god and are perfectly rational human beings with no desire to slaughter infidels or bomb abortion clinics.
Crit0 3 years ago
"I'd say he [Ken Miller] was a scientist first and foremost. "
Miller would actually disagree with you on that. In his many TV interviews (as well as his books,) he makes it perfectly clear that he is the same person in church as he is in the Laboratory.
"Should I not care about free-speech, or even freedom of others to do as they please."
You've mis-interpreted my use of the word 'apathy.' Let me elaborate..
Crit0 3 years ago
If you re-read it carefully, you'll see that I was not talking about ignoring religious groups and letting them do whatever they want. That would be social apathy and yes, very dangerous. I was talking about a personal apathy towards the QUESTION: "Does god exist?" Being vigilant of special interest groups has nothing to do with a belief in god. Protesting sexual inequality has nothing to do with a belief in god. So why should it matter whether god exists when you protest these things?
Crit0 3 years ago
yes, you certainly crushed his berries.
sypher113 3 years ago
i agree, either we will be wiped out by religious fanatics, wiped out by a disease or virus, or we will prosper and teach ourselves tolerance of one another in all respects.
Erech01 3 years ago
*SIGH*
Chimp colonys have little wars all the time over territory and resources. They don't need a God or even a philosophy to do that. This belief in an atheist utopia is just as absurd as belief in a Christian one. People will still have disagreements and people will still fight over them. The disagreements may be a tad bit more rational, but they can still lead to war.
Crit0 3 years ago
My point on war is this:
People with a belief in God are capable of blaming their actions upon his will. Anything to them is justifiyable. Sure, Atheists and Rationalists will disagree from time to time, and wars aren't out of the question. But if someone invades you your going to defend and fight back no matter your presubpositions.
War is always a possibility, just less likey because we don't have 'God'.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
"War is always a possibility, just less likey because we don't have 'God'."
Then clarify it! This is why people think Atheism is a religion. Because even atheists act like it is. Extremely generalized statements like: "The war in Iraq probably would have never happened if we were an atheistic world because atheists are very kind people." is the exact same bullshit argument that religious fanatics use. "If everyone were Muslim, then there would be peace."
Crit0 3 years ago
You tend to be quite optimistic. Unfortunately, science and religion don't seem to hold nearly as much sway as faith in people.
Stephen5000 3 years ago
My true optimism is derived from the apparent trend in society today. That is the sudden boom in atheist numbers in the past decade. Maybe some were in hiding for fear of persecution and ridicule, however, the number of Atheists/ Rationalists is rising fast.
Also I believe with the next few generations of children being highly educated with respect to our parents and their parents... (That is a highschool level education in general.) ...the number of religious people shall decline.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
CONTINUATION
==========
There seems to be a direct correlation b/w population education (higher education) and number of rationalists. So, since a huge number of careers require an university level education these days, I believe the average pop'n IQ will increase and hence people will be more inclined to make intelligent observations about the world.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
A "true" atheist?
Shaman and Buddhists may be atheists. So are Taoists and Nihilists, including totalitarians. But what I think you're talking about are empiricists and/or rationalists. You may want to look into that and clarify your distinction.
AronRa 3 years ago
I can't remember if I said this or not in the vid, it's been a few hours. If not, I'll just say it here. Atheist by means that one doesn't believe/worship in a supreme deity/creator.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
If I've got you pegged right, I would bet that you're a rationalist like myself. I think its a better title than merely 'atheist' because there are many belief systems which don't include gods. Rationalism explains WHY you are atheist, and it removes you from the other categories of spirit-worshippers and totalitarians.
AronRa 3 years ago
Yes, you're right. I tend to label myself as a rationalist. However, when dealing with people of 'faith', they don't care WHAT you call yourself if you don't believe in God.
My reason for being against the term Atheist is because by definition it is a person who denies the existence of God. As to say that God really does exist we just don't care awknowlegde it.
But since God doesn't exist, neither can Atheists, becauseyou can't be in denial of the existence of something wich doesnt exist.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
"My reason for being against the term Atheist is because by definition it is a person who denies the existence of God."
You're talking about Antitheism.
Theism - Belief in god.
Antitheism - Rejection of god.
Atheism - Neither belief, nor rejection.
You cannot reject what does not exist.
Crit0 3 years ago
Definitions of atheist:
noun: someone who denies the existence of god
adjective: related to or characterized by or given to atheism
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
Theists coined the term atheist for the soul purpose of calling them people who deny the obvious existence of God. However, because his existence is anything but obvious.
I'm not denying the existence of anything obvious, if I did I'd be delusional.
Therefore I am against said terminology and prefer to be labeled a Rationalist.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
Where's the confusion here?
Anti = Against
A = None, zero, nada, zip, absolutely nothing.
Anyway, this is all very ironic. From your video, it seems you had no problem talking about atheism as this great belief system that could do no wrong.
Crit0 3 years ago
I'd rather think of it as the contrast. The likelihood of doing less wrong.
There is no confusion, because that's what the definition says. Simple.
Point is, God (not an actual being, but the idea of one) corrupts peoples minds and leads them to do immoral things more frequently in his name.
ME? Now I can't go out murdering people that don't follow my beliefs and say that God told me to do so. I don't have that luxury. I don't want, nor need, nor care for it.
TheBlueFalconX 3 years ago
Atheism is not a miracle cure for societal ills - people disagree on much more than religion. However, traits of the religious tend to allow them to be taken advantage of more easily by powerful speakers, or religion is simply an especially effective means to control and exert the wielders power over those easily swayed.
Either way, you have a relatively unthinking mass of people, and power over people is ultimate. What ultimate power can lead to is rather well documented.
oilotnoM 3 years ago
"You cannot reject ..."
The thing is, something does exist, the definition of god has been given by theists, thus we have something to reject. We reject the definition of god by theists - that is what we reject (well, that's what I reject - suppose I shouldn't speak for anyone else ;)
We also explain why we reject it - which has been well trodden by more articulate feet than mine, we have no reason or desire to subject ourselves to mental slavery on no other basis than what some guy expounds.
oilotnoM 3 years ago
On the otherhand, you are generally free to listen to or ignore science (though it's often to your direct detriment to remain unknowledgable about the world around you).
Would you decide that fitting a carbon monoxide sensor alarm would not be a good action if you have a gas boiler in your home and that to anyone's best knowledge, carbon monoxide is rather detrimental to ones health, and is also known to be one of the by-products of gas combustion in air?
oilotnoM 3 years ago
"We reject the definition of god by theists."
Which theists? There are a great many different definitions.
"we have no reason or desire to subject ourselves to mental slavery"
Would you call Ken Miller a mental slave? What about donexodus2?
You seem to be lumping ANY belif in god with a fundamentalist belief in god. That sort of generalization makes you antitheist, not atheist. That's fine, but don't confuse the two...
Crit0 3 years ago
An atheist is someone who has no opinion on the existence of god. One way or another. To them, it's a non-issue. They have better things to worry about so they just don't concern themselves with the question. The same way an 'amoral' person doesn't concern himself with what is moral or immoral.
Gnothi seauton. Know thyself. Are you REALLY apathetic about whether or not there is a god, or are you morally opposed to the belief in god?
Crit0 3 years ago
"Which theists?"
Any and all, unless there are some religions which actually have evidence for the pre-supposed super natural?
"Would you call Ken Miller a mental slave?"
No, and I would not really say he was a theist - I'd say he was a scientist first and foremost. And that is how I applied the term theist - to those primarily so in their dealings.
(ctd)...
oilotnoM 3 years ago
"Atheism, as an explicit position, either affirms the nonexistence of gods[1] or rejects theism."
"Disbelief in or denial of the existence of God or gods."
"the belief that God does not exist."
"a: a disbelief in the existence of deity b: the doctrine that there is no deity"
"someone who believes that God or gods do not exist"
"Absence of belief in the existence of God or gods; The belief that a God does not exist"
"unbelief in God or deities: disbelief in the existence of God or deities"
oilotnoM 3 years ago
The general consensus seems to not merely equate to "apathy".
"To them, it's a non-issue."
I heartily disagree, I think the atmosphere in America is one good reason why it definitely is an issue. Perhaps you agree with the religious grounds of the oppression of women? That abortion is anti-life? What about the parent's life? What about the life of both if they cannot provide sufficiently? What about rape victims being denied abortion on religious grounds?
(ctd)
oilotnoM 3 years ago
I can be morally opposed to what some people do in the name of god or whatever analogue exists in a particular belief system. If there is a god, it's not one that's been documented by any religion thus far. For _practical_ purposes I conclude that no god exists, to do otherwise is irrational as it serves no purpose. Should there be practical reasons/benefits to doing so, then that is a different ballgame. To date I've never seen a practical benefit that wasn't related to power over people.
oilotnoM 3 years ago
But, don't get me wrong, that's a _real_ reason to _believe_ but only if you're the one reaping the power =)
You're right, we do have better things to worry about - but we prefer the roots to the leaves when weeding.
Maybe the keyword is "practicality".
A comedian (I forget exactly who, eddie murphy?) said during a sketch:
What have you done for me lately?
I don't really expect much of a contemporary answer to this question, but do try if you can show otherwise.
oilotnoM 3 years ago