Last I checked it was a big country, we already put countless species on the endanered list and shoot the rest when it comes in OUR yard. Its not the GOPs world, its the animals and future generations as well. Your greed shows when your T party card is whipped out, your a piece of worthelss shit who has no concept of what it means to me selfless and charish the planet. Dont assume Liberal means weak, we will crush you like the maggots you are
My China comments are not far off for each time I listen to the GOP debates or shows like the Kevin Trudeau show I am learning that more and more of the United States government is indebted to countries like China... If Mitt Romney is to be believed, I hear that programs like PBS are subsidized by foreign countries like China because the incompetent assess in Congress don't have a clue how to manage money and have to beg Asia for loan after loan after loan. This country is a disgrace!
I saw an article in the paper today with a picture of Obama standing with some smug head EPA female stooge praising the work of the EPA! Disgusting! That is why I can't stand liberal Democrats, they are big on nanny government statism!
This is all part of Agenda 21 and the aim of agenda 21 is abolition of private property rights. That's one of the best ways to bring about Communism. There is no such thing as private property in communism. This has nothing to do with the environment. That is just the smokescreen that is used to dupe people into going along with it as if it's a good thing. If the EPA was around 200 years ago this country would not exist.
I am for property rights but something dos not jive with this case:
#1 getting .63 acres on the lake for 23,000 dollars??????????????????????
should be worth a lot more then that.
the "developer" that set up the lots and got them "approved" with the town?????????
the contractor that put in the water and sewer system must have had to get a permit and they always get environmental study's when doing underground utility's???????
some thing should have came up at that time. [more]
The fines are discretionary--not guaranteed, the compliance order has no legal authority until EPA brings the enforcement action, and the Sacketts are subject to the Clean Water Act. The Sacketts WILL get their day in court, and they'll have to comply with the law, just like everyone else. EPA did the right thing by protecting wetlands from people who think they can just defile nature whenever they want, however they want. EPA's enforcement authority must not be undermined by this law firm.
@wasp9 the U.S. was also built on people stealing land from whoever they chose, and by polluting the land however they saw fit. This is still going on, in the form of banks stealing from homeowners, and big businesses and people like the Sacketts running roughshod over the land.
@order2khaos You must be really stupid. As far as any lands go, the federal government has jurisdiction only on PUBLIC property, not PRIVATE property, except in a very limited manner. If somehow it is determined that MY property is a wetland the federal government still has NO RIGHT to tell me what I can do or not do with MY property.
@billyboi57 What are those "very limited manner" exceptions you speak of? Oh, wait--it's when your use of you "private" land becomes a public concern, like polluting wetlands, streams, and lakes. It's because of agencies like the EPA that you can breathe clean air and drink clean water, otherwise you'd probably have a third eye coming out your neck from toxic sludge like in Love Canal. EPA's not saying "you can't be FREE!!," it's saying, "you can't pollute common resources."
@order2khaos Actually I shouldn't have even said "very limited manner". The constitution doesn't allow for this kind of misconduct from a government agency. And, just how is a properly built and maintained home going to pollute? Pollution isn't even the issue here. Go find yourself some precious wetland somewhere and soak your head in it.
@billyboi57 Pollution, as defined by the Clean Water Act and attendant regulations, includes fill dirt and gravel--exactly the stuff the Sacketts used to fill in the wetland. And yes, the Constitution *does* allow the government to regulate this sort of activity. (We'll see, however, how the majority of backward, conservative, activist justices on the SCOTUS twist this issue to their money-soaked agenda.)
@order2khaos You are missing the point that they CHECKED with the EPA before building and the EPA said it wasn't a wet land the EPA is a bully here and I hope they go down and make sure you pay more attention next time.
@JBau3rCTU I've paid attention well enough. I've read all the court records of the case, the district court opinion from Idaho, and the Court of Appelas opinion from the 9th Circuit. The Sacketts asked informally if they needed a permit--not the same as applying for a permit and then being told it wasn't necessary. They didn't follow the rules, and they should fix their mess. I agree that EPA didn't try to coddle and and hand-hold the Sacketts through the process, but that's not EPA's job.
@catherinepcs You're correct! It's the rights of all people to have clean water and fresh air vs. the few greedy people who think they can pave over wetlands whenever they want.
@catherinepcs The money leads right to the law firm that is taking it upon themselves to use the Sacketts as a test case to lessen the effectiveness of EPA to protect our nation's water/air/land. This case is not about private property or freedom or patriotism or any other jingoistic b.s. the people on this comment stream are going on about. It's about powerful special interests undoing 40 years of a healthier environment because they don't want to pay to pollute. Everyone here has been duped.
The biggest challenge is SG. Sacketts need to get the SG on their side. Roberts, Alito, and Kagen all have ties to SG office and there will be HUGE bias by the Court to rubber stamp the SG determination after oral argument. The SG is a de facto tenth justice.
If the SG sides with the EPA, Sacketts need to get Damien to get as many amicus briefs as humanly possible to counter the SG!
PLF cert petition is among the top ten best written I have read! I
I believe in the work of the EPA, as they aren't a bunch of easily misled rednecks like, ahem, most of the people posting here. If they viewed the project as potentially endangering the environment(WHICH WE ONLY HAVE ONE CHANCE TO KEEP HEALTHY), then it is just. If you believe we're better without the EPA, then you have obviously never lived near industry. It's sad what you people believe...so very sad.
@ZatDudeOnline Sounds like a dirt worshiper. "My government, right or wrong!" Sorry ZatDude, but this earth that you worship so much is not as fragile as you want to believe. Our republic, however, is in far more danger with people like you willing to surrender your liberty to the State for the least little reason.
@edgwyn84 Not as fragile? Are you kidding me? Wow, it's people like you that will damn the next generation to suffer, and the one after to die in childbirth. I guess you don't have any children, for if you did, you would understand that being a good parent is looking out for their futures. If you do have one, then you're basically holding a gun to their head. Be a good boy and pull the trigger please.(-=
@ZatDudeOnline It's not just. They have no Constitutional jurisdiction over any citizen's private property rights. What's sad is that you believe the State has greater rights than the People. Your kind will be first in line in the revolution.
@ZatDudeOnline Why do you have so much faith in the this EPA? I mean I would support environmental protection but not like this, not this bully tactics, fine of $30,000 a day treatment. If indeed they were endangering the environment, it should have been brought out right from the beginning, not come out all of a sudden to bully people into paying these huge fines.
@ZatDudeOnline "If you believe we're better without the EPA"
No one is saying don't have environmental regulation. The problem is not like this. The EPA ignores pollution near industries but go after individuals who want to build a home, tell me how does that protect the environment? We should have a better and more sensible EPA that is accountable and not a rogue institution that makes its own laws.
@ZatDudeOnline It's really sad what you environuts believe. That the earth should be elevated above human life. People like you would rather see people starving to death, homeless and freezing to death as long as it saves a tree!
@rhcrest The trees were here long before us, and will be here long after you republicans screw us out of life. The EPA is a beneficial entity and your argument against it is absolute lunacy. NUFF SAID
The big question is, do you really want to live in a country like this?,,, where you have to ask everyone for their permission, to do something that only affects you and wait on them for an answer. People love big gov't until it gets in THEIR way. Any government that can have the power to keep you safe also has the power to keep and make you venerable.
This is only part of the whole story of the systematic loss of our National Sovereignty! We have anti-American bureaucratic in office fighting against the American Citizens and against our Natural Rights! They call themselves Progressives, or Democrats and even Republicans but we all know that they are just criminals! Just look at immigration, foreign wars, taxes, regulations, laws, schools...etc...
@MrWatchdawg77 You're absolutely right. These scumbags who call themselves the federal govt. nowadays are outright criminals. They're no different than a burglar who breaks into somebody's house in the middle of the night to steal somebody's TV. Only, they're even worse than the small time burglar because they have expensive lawyers on their side.
Last I checked it was a big country, we already put countless species on the endanered list and shoot the rest when it comes in OUR yard. Its not the GOPs world, its the animals and future generations as well. Your greed shows when your T party card is whipped out, your a piece of worthelss shit who has no concept of what it means to me selfless and charish the planet. Dont assume Liberal means weak, we will crush you like the maggots you are
guitargold77 2 weeks ago
My China comments are not far off for each time I listen to the GOP debates or shows like the Kevin Trudeau show I am learning that more and more of the United States government is indebted to countries like China... If Mitt Romney is to be believed, I hear that programs like PBS are subsidized by foreign countries like China because the incompetent assess in Congress don't have a clue how to manage money and have to beg Asia for loan after loan after loan. This country is a disgrace!
Zakariah1971 3 weeks ago
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I saw an article in the paper today with a picture of Obama standing with some smug head EPA female stooge praising the work of the EPA! Disgusting! That is why I can't stand liberal Democrats, they are big on nanny government statism!
newalm 1 month ago
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newalm 1 month ago
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newalm 1 month ago
Democrats/Lawyers/Unions/EPA... no difference.
thatisso80s 1 month ago
EPA, IRS, ATF, DEA....all bully agencies.
newalm 1 month ago
This is all part of Agenda 21 and the aim of agenda 21 is abolition of private property rights. That's one of the best ways to bring about Communism. There is no such thing as private property in communism. This has nothing to do with the environment. That is just the smokescreen that is used to dupe people into going along with it as if it's a good thing. If the EPA was around 200 years ago this country would not exist.
rhcrest 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
I am for property rights but something dos not jive with this case:
#1 getting .63 acres on the lake for 23,000 dollars??????????????????????
should be worth a lot more then that.
the "developer" that set up the lots and got them "approved" with the town?????????
the contractor that put in the water and sewer system must have had to get a permit and they always get environmental study's when doing underground utility's???????
some thing should have came up at that time. [more]
force311999 2 months ago
do the Sacketts run a business the government hates?????????
in my town there is 2 "planed developments" that were approved in the 1980s
they are still building houses in them 30 years later,
there is a new code that all homes must now have 5 acres of land????
If you buy a plot can they refuse a permit even if the plots are grandfathered,
the structures are not and it says in the code "you can not add to an existing violation"?????
can they stop pools and sheds from being added??????
force311999 2 months ago
Comment removed
force311999 2 months ago
The fines are discretionary--not guaranteed, the compliance order has no legal authority until EPA brings the enforcement action, and the Sacketts are subject to the Clean Water Act. The Sacketts WILL get their day in court, and they'll have to comply with the law, just like everyone else. EPA did the right thing by protecting wetlands from people who think they can just defile nature whenever they want, however they want. EPA's enforcement authority must not be undermined by this law firm.
order2khaos 2 months ago in playlist Sackett v. EPA
@order2khaos Hey, dude. The U.S. was built on people setting up houses on a piece of land they acquired.
wasp9 1 month ago 3
@wasp9 the U.S. was also built on people stealing land from whoever they chose, and by polluting the land however they saw fit. This is still going on, in the form of banks stealing from homeowners, and big businesses and people like the Sacketts running roughshod over the land.
order2khaos 1 month ago
@order2khaos EVERY country has been built on that same manner. It's how the world works, fucko.
wasp9 1 month ago
@order2khaos You must be really stupid. As far as any lands go, the federal government has jurisdiction only on PUBLIC property, not PRIVATE property, except in a very limited manner. If somehow it is determined that MY property is a wetland the federal government still has NO RIGHT to tell me what I can do or not do with MY property.
billyboi57 1 month ago
@billyboi57 What are those "very limited manner" exceptions you speak of? Oh, wait--it's when your use of you "private" land becomes a public concern, like polluting wetlands, streams, and lakes. It's because of agencies like the EPA that you can breathe clean air and drink clean water, otherwise you'd probably have a third eye coming out your neck from toxic sludge like in Love Canal. EPA's not saying "you can't be FREE!!," it's saying, "you can't pollute common resources."
order2khaos 1 month ago
@order2khaos Actually I shouldn't have even said "very limited manner". The constitution doesn't allow for this kind of misconduct from a government agency. And, just how is a properly built and maintained home going to pollute? Pollution isn't even the issue here. Go find yourself some precious wetland somewhere and soak your head in it.
billyboi57 1 month ago
@billyboi57 Pollution, as defined by the Clean Water Act and attendant regulations, includes fill dirt and gravel--exactly the stuff the Sacketts used to fill in the wetland. And yes, the Constitution *does* allow the government to regulate this sort of activity. (We'll see, however, how the majority of backward, conservative, activist justices on the SCOTUS twist this issue to their money-soaked agenda.)
order2khaos 3 weeks ago
@order2khaos You are missing the point that they CHECKED with the EPA before building and the EPA said it wasn't a wet land the EPA is a bully here and I hope they go down and make sure you pay more attention next time.
JBau3rCTU 1 month ago
@JBau3rCTU I've paid attention well enough. I've read all the court records of the case, the district court opinion from Idaho, and the Court of Appelas opinion from the 9th Circuit. The Sacketts asked informally if they needed a permit--not the same as applying for a permit and then being told it wasn't necessary. They didn't follow the rules, and they should fix their mess. I agree that EPA didn't try to coddle and and hand-hold the Sacketts through the process, but that's not EPA's job.
order2khaos 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Time to wake up and do something about it. Protest. Object. It's our country. And there are more of us then there are of them
yellowchelo 3 months ago
Just another example of rights lost in this country run by a few greedy people. We truly can't call this the "land of the free" anymore!
catherinepcs 5 months ago 2
@catherinepcs You're correct! It's the rights of all people to have clean water and fresh air vs. the few greedy people who think they can pave over wetlands whenever they want.
order2khaos 1 month ago
@order2khaos Think outside the box, Order, and while you're at it, follow the money trail.
catherinepcs 1 month ago
@catherinepcs The money leads right to the law firm that is taking it upon themselves to use the Sacketts as a test case to lessen the effectiveness of EPA to protect our nation's water/air/land. This case is not about private property or freedom or patriotism or any other jingoistic b.s. the people on this comment stream are going on about. It's about powerful special interests undoing 40 years of a healthier environment because they don't want to pay to pollute. Everyone here has been duped.
order2khaos 1 month ago
The EPA needs to be disbanded and everyone who's made any decision trampling on private property rights needs to be prosecuted.
mjt1517 5 months ago
Everyday I am saddened by our govt.
ikantspeell 5 months ago
No notice + no evidentiary hearing prior to fines and penalties = massive due process violation!
What is this communist China????
Sacketts need to contact 60 Minutes...
Zakariah1971 5 months ago
@Zakariah1971 "What is this communist China?"
Hey, don't insult China. A case like this will not happen in China.
bochap21 4 months ago
Awesome that cert was granted! Rarified air!
The biggest challenge is SG. Sacketts need to get the SG on their side. Roberts, Alito, and Kagen all have ties to SG office and there will be HUGE bias by the Court to rubber stamp the SG determination after oral argument. The SG is a de facto tenth justice.
If the SG sides with the EPA, Sacketts need to get Damien to get as many amicus briefs as humanly possible to counter the SG!
PLF cert petition is among the top ten best written I have read! I
Zakariah1971 5 months ago
I believe in the work of the EPA, as they aren't a bunch of easily misled rednecks like, ahem, most of the people posting here. If they viewed the project as potentially endangering the environment(WHICH WE ONLY HAVE ONE CHANCE TO KEEP HEALTHY), then it is just. If you believe we're better without the EPA, then you have obviously never lived near industry. It's sad what you people believe...so very sad.
ZatDudeOnline 5 months ago
@ZatDudeOnline Sounds like a dirt worshiper. "My government, right or wrong!" Sorry ZatDude, but this earth that you worship so much is not as fragile as you want to believe. Our republic, however, is in far more danger with people like you willing to surrender your liberty to the State for the least little reason.
edgwyn84 5 months ago
@edgwyn84 Not as fragile? Are you kidding me? Wow, it's people like you that will damn the next generation to suffer, and the one after to die in childbirth. I guess you don't have any children, for if you did, you would understand that being a good parent is looking out for their futures. If you do have one, then you're basically holding a gun to their head. Be a good boy and pull the trigger please.(-=
ZatDudeOnline 5 months ago
@ZatDudeOnline You are clearly a useful idiot. look up the term
rhcrest 1 month ago
@rhcrest You don't know how to formulate an argument that can be won, I do. Give up already.
ZatDudeOnline 5 days ago
@ZatDudeOnline It's not just. They have no Constitutional jurisdiction over any citizen's private property rights. What's sad is that you believe the State has greater rights than the People. Your kind will be first in line in the revolution.
mjt1517 5 months ago
@mjt1517 First in line to shoot every conservative that breathes air. I will see the day when conservatives go extinct. I SWEAR ON IT!
ZatDudeOnline 5 days ago
@ZatDudeOnline Why do you have so much faith in the this EPA? I mean I would support environmental protection but not like this, not this bully tactics, fine of $30,000 a day treatment. If indeed they were endangering the environment, it should have been brought out right from the beginning, not come out all of a sudden to bully people into paying these huge fines.
bochap21 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@ZatDudeOnline "If you believe we're better without the EPA"
No one is saying don't have environmental regulation. The problem is not like this. The EPA ignores pollution near industries but go after individuals who want to build a home, tell me how does that protect the environment? We should have a better and more sensible EPA that is accountable and not a rogue institution that makes its own laws.
bochap21 4 months ago
@ZatDudeOnline It's really sad what you environuts believe. That the earth should be elevated above human life. People like you would rather see people starving to death, homeless and freezing to death as long as it saves a tree!
rhcrest 1 month ago
@rhcrest The trees were here long before us, and will be here long after you republicans screw us out of life. The EPA is a beneficial entity and your argument against it is absolute lunacy. NUFF SAID
ZatDudeOnline 5 days ago
Keep up the good work. This is why I support Ron Paul. Limited government and the re-establishment of personal property rights.
mbear14 5 months ago 3
Unbelievable. PRIVATE PROPERTY RIGHTS ARE THE BEDROCK OF A DEMOCRATIC SOCIETY. IF WE DON'T HAVE THAT, WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING.
tigerhop 5 months ago
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@tigerhop exactly! That's why they are working hard to take it away from us.
yt20093 5 months ago
When will We The People rise up and HANG every single unconstitutional moonbat in America? When?
1Snooper1 5 months ago 5
Abolish the EPA!
JustinHEMI05 5 months ago 5
EPA gone wild. Like the obama administration
wheetypeedy 5 months ago 13
@wheetypeedy Like? It is.
0HippyHunter0 4 months ago
The big question is, do you really want to live in a country like this?,,, where you have to ask everyone for their permission, to do something that only affects you and wait on them for an answer. People love big gov't until it gets in THEIR way. Any government that can have the power to keep you safe also has the power to keep and make you venerable.
scalp340 5 months ago 4
What would the forefathers do!
RemoteSwitch 5 months ago 4
@RemoteSwitch The Founding Fathers would have shot these intruders! End of story. They wouldn't have put up with this for a minute!
rhcrest 1 month ago 2
@RemoteSwitch Probably end their sentences with a question mark?
order2khaos 1 month ago
Google: Agenda 21
Agenda 21 is a UN Resolution passed in the early 1990s.....
leer4962 5 months ago
We are also in North Idaho, and We are pulling for you!!
It could happen to all of us!!
NanaForAmerica 5 months ago
Thank you, for posting.
Lipsnx4u 5 months ago
This is only part of the whole story of the systematic loss of our National Sovereignty! We have anti-American bureaucratic in office fighting against the American Citizens and against our Natural Rights! They call themselves Progressives, or Democrats and even Republicans but we all know that they are just criminals! Just look at immigration, foreign wars, taxes, regulations, laws, schools...etc...
MrWatchdawg77 5 months ago 4
@MrWatchdawg77 You're absolutely right. These scumbags who call themselves the federal govt. nowadays are outright criminals. They're no different than a burglar who breaks into somebody's house in the middle of the night to steal somebody's TV. Only, they're even worse than the small time burglar because they have expensive lawyers on their side.
ridgerunner721601 5 months ago 13